When you look closely you'll see two secondary shafts running in mesh with the input shaft instead of one. This alone makes the gearbox twice as strong as an normal gearbox. Then you'll notice the straight-cut gears which makes the gears itself stronger and more efficient.
Straight cut gears are NOT stronger. Infact all else being equal helicals are stronger simply because they have more teeth meshing at any one time. The real reason they use straight cut is to avoid the axial forces generated with helical gears.
If the axial forces is the weakest point then aren't straight cut gears with no axial forces stronger? That was my point exactly. Therefore not only race cars who prefers efficiency, also most heavy duty machinery who prefers strength uses straight cut gears.
The problem arises when you put alot of torque through helical gears you get big axial loads. Big axial loads require big thrust bearings and a stronger housing - both of which results in added weight. Added weight is obviously very detrimental to any racing application. The helical cogs are much stronger, both because of the aforementioned multiple meshed teeth, but also because the shearing plane(not sure what the english term would be) of the tooth is larger.
I never knew how these shifters worked. It always looked like a sequential to me but never pulled itself back to center so i knew there was something more to it. This was cool to finally figure out, lol.
I remember reading where Grumpy Jenkins would grind off every other tooth on the gears in the transmission. It made it easier to shift. Back then they had to use the clutch for every shift.
Way cool. Perfect video for showing the basics. Love the shifter. Reminds me of my old Mr. Gasket V-gate. Design was probably taken from it. Thanks for sharing.
My favorite NHRA class. A lot of work goes on in the cockpit of a Pro Stock car to turn on a win light, not to mention the driver has to have cat like reaction times! Love the class!
It's my favorite too. I honestly never cared at all for the funny cars or top fuel; only the stock cars. Back in the 80s for two or three years there was a class called Factory Modified. It was IHRA and was similar to pro stock but it was small blocks. Those were the best! Winding up those small blocks to insane RPMs and watching them tear down the track just like the big block stock cars was very satisfying.
Way cool Valvoline. Thanks for the quick overview. Love them stick shifts. What's the benefit over a Lenco, besides the extra gear? When the 5 spds came out in the mid to later 70s, I didn't think they were as favorable as the 4 spd Lencos.
I wonder what year the Pro Stockers went to Liberties? I'm thinking 1996 was still mostly all Lencos. By about 1999-2000, I think they were all Liberty. Not as much in-car camera back then to tell.
I love the liberty shifter. I have 2 small scale models of the liberty shifter. Both are metal, a 1/25 scale and a 1/16 scale. I'm buying another 1/16 scale shifter for my other hot rod I'm building. I built them to the realistic look
Greg Kom Nope I believe they should have stuck with the carburator set up instead of EFI , there would be more teams and a full field on race day . Those v-8 's are amazing up to 1300 + horsepower naturally asperated .
Let me get this right, the two cluster gears on the left and right take up the loads evenly, which makes this gear box twice as strong instead, of one in normal gearboxes, right.
That's the idea behind it yes. The correct terminology for those "cluster gears" is actually countershaft. Mack Trucks have a gearbox with 3 countershafts! It gets to a point where weight and space becomes an issue. The idea of spur gears is to remove the axial load when using helical cut gears, thus relieving the shafts, thrust bearings and gearbox casing of stress. However a spur gear is weaker than helical due to having less tooth contact and will generally have to be of larger construction to compensate. By using helical gears but with a shallow tooth angle you can increase the maximum torque limit but without as much thrust load or as much noise as a straight cut gear. But back to the original point it's just another way to go about increasing the strength of the gearbox... but there are other options out there depending on the application of the vehicle and or characteristics of the gearbox required by the driver.
I agree. Damn near looks like a harley transmission. Main shaft, countershaft, 5 gears, and a case. Not much more. Always wanted to check one of these out. Good video
Did he just say they pull the transmission, tear it down, change gears, fill it up with oil, put it back together, and reinstall it within 10 minutes???
Yes, they are easy to take out, and as you seen when he bolted it back together, the cases are easy to split, and the gears are easy to take out and change. A manual tranny is a lot easier to pull than an automatic.
Prostock engines start at about $100k and go up from there. The engine technology is state of the art and people argue that it's more advanced than formula 1 engines.
MCRmechanic there is no chance in hell its more advanced than F1 engines. F1 teams have so much more funding, meaning more access to batter materials, better trained engineers, more testing, etc. Unless the drag car costs $300M a year to maintain an average team, F1 is just levels higher.
Doesn't matter how much funding and research you have if the governing body restricts you heavily like they do in F1. The only part of F1 engines that are probably as advanced as high end drag engines are the KERS.
So is this considered a V gate(vertical gate) shifter or does a v gate operate the same as this shifter?? Cool vid overall & Thx for sharing the knowledge.
No, it isn't. This transmission uses an external gear shifter, sequential and motorcycle gearboxes use an internal sequential (i apologize for the redundancy here) shifter, usually forks mounted on a shaft, with a desmodromic drum that drives them up and down said shaft and they, in turn, drive sliding gears
NHRA should have never let Pro Stock go to a clutchless transmission...half the fun of watching the Pro "Stock" cars run was watching the drivers deal (read Speed Shift) with a clutch at the upper echelon of "stock" drag cars.
So, it is a fully synchronized transmission like a a bike, except it is not sequential? Is there a system where no clutch is depressed to go? Handicapped. Or...I can do an air clutch for starting at tree. I need a better system than what I am doing.
I have 2 models for my model cars of an aftermarket liberty shifter that actually works. 1 i have together and the other isn't quite finished yet. Both made from aluminum. They are kool. I wish i could afford a real liberty lol
he didnt even torque them. Lukas Langer, Im sure he knows exactly how much to put in just by eye. Im assuming he does it after every single run if he tears the trans down after every run.
Ian Thompson You can torque your bolts if you want but you won't last in this sport. If torqueing bolts to spec is your only concern you have no business inside a transmission or at the race track. The transmission Is disassembled after every run. The run is 6 seconds. This is not a daily driver that is subjected to extended periods of vibration. Use your fucking brain before you make your gay posts, there is no comparison between your Honda civic and a top sportsman car.
The only problem with this trans is there is NO down shift ability, it only goes from 1-5, there's now way to go 5-1, you have to come to a complete stop lift the first gear lock, and all the internal gears reset for their climb up to 5th again...not too cool for street.
@@coco__rnd I drive a1994NISSAN and I can shift w/out (stepping on the clutch) , this truck has 3 Hundred thou mi s. ,,,,,, BUT I am an automatic transmission Rebuilder and I know how to shift the Transmission without a clutch ,,, But you need a clutch to stop and GO ⚡
dirtrider88 I'm fairly sure he was referring to it as a sequential box, rather than a traditional one. You can make the linkages shift any way you want, for example an H pattern or 1 N 2 3 4 5 like on a motorcycle. This just has a back and forth so it's easy to do in a short amount of time.
Basically, the gears match rpm inside so the load doesn’t change. The dogs inside are cut to grab the gear. If you don’t pull the shift lever hard enough they skip and tear up parts.
@@valvoline I actually watched a video on how these transmissions are able to do this, and yes they get damaged over time and interestingly they do not use synchronizers at all and is really how these gears couple to each other under load. You can not shift a transmission under load that are equipped with synchros, at least I have never been able to do it and is the reason why I could not grasp the concept.
AlexCoronaPhotoThe gears are always meshed. Whether or not they are engaged onto the shafts is determined by synchronizers in a normal street transmission. And you can still shift without the clutch.
It's going to grind a bit no matter what you do. If you bang gears fast enough you can make it pretty smooth though, as seen. They drop the trans every run, they aren't too concerned with grinding a bit.
The metallic sounds as you shifted through those gears was incredibly satisfying to hear.
Wow I was surprised on how compact and light that transmission is considering the horsepower and torque running though it.
Me too, it looks like the size a Muncie/T10.
When you look closely you'll see two secondary shafts running in mesh with the input shaft instead of one. This alone makes the gearbox twice as strong as an normal gearbox. Then you'll notice the straight-cut gears which makes the gears itself stronger and more efficient.
Straight cut gears are NOT stronger. Infact all else being equal helicals are stronger simply because they have more teeth meshing at any one time.
The real reason they use straight cut is to avoid the axial forces generated with helical gears.
If the axial forces is the weakest point then aren't straight cut gears with no axial forces stronger? That was my point exactly. Therefore not only race cars who prefers efficiency, also most heavy duty machinery who prefers strength uses straight cut gears.
The problem arises when you put alot of torque through helical gears you get big axial loads. Big axial loads require big thrust bearings and a stronger housing - both of which results in added weight.
Added weight is obviously very detrimental to any racing application.
The helical cogs are much stronger, both because of the aforementioned multiple meshed teeth, but also because the shearing plane(not sure what the english term would be) of the tooth is larger.
“We do a tear down and gear change in about 10min.” My mechanic- “we’ll call you in a couple days... maybe.”
XD I know right
that looks so much easier to work on that the trans we have in our cars lmaoo
Quick change parts. Plus, they do not rebuild the entire transmission, just the gears basically.
Auto Dealership repairs want that comment removed 😂
thats gonna be ahh about 800 for labor and 500 to source parts we only do oem straight from the dealers so you know your in good hands
I never knew how these shifters worked. It always looked like a sequential to me but never pulled itself back to center so i knew there was something more to it. This was cool to finally figure out, lol.
Amazing how quick they row through those gears
i love the gear changing sound 😍😍😍
The shift mechanism is soo perfect. Mine needed an adjustment after every few dozen shifts.
I love the Liberty 5 speeds. Really brings it back to the driver.
NHRA Prostock with that 5 speed transmission is probably the best sound in dragracing...definately in my opinion it is!!!!!
I agree
I agree
+Zironi Miller I like the fuelers but Pro Stock and Pro Mods kick a$$!!
They used 4 speeds in the 60's and 70's prostock racing
I love Pro Stock. When you can qualify 16 cars within a 10th of a second of each other, let the fun begin!
I remember reading where Grumpy Jenkins would grind off every other tooth on the gears in the transmission. It made it easier to shift. Back then they had to use the clutch for every shift.
I think that was a synchronizer modification.
I figured the oil would be thin, but that stuff looked like water. Love those Liberties!
Way cool. Perfect video for showing the basics. Love the shifter. Reminds me of my old Mr. Gasket V-gate. Design was probably taken from it. Thanks for sharing.
0:25 Hank car chief (handkerchief?)
My favorite NHRA class. A lot of work goes on in the cockpit of a Pro Stock car to turn on a win light, not to mention the driver has to have cat like reaction times! Love the class!
It's my favorite too. I honestly never cared at all for the funny cars or top fuel; only the stock cars. Back in the 80s for two or three years there was a class called Factory Modified. It was IHRA and was similar to pro stock but it was small blocks. Those were the best! Winding up those small blocks to insane RPMs and watching them tear down the track just like the big block stock cars was very satisfying.
Best video I've seen in a while!!
Far out, I'm 70 years old I've never gotten to see the inside of a pro stock transmission fantastic
That is a serious setup. Thanks for sharing.
Way cool Valvoline. Thanks for the quick overview. Love them stick shifts. What's the benefit over a Lenco, besides the extra gear? When the 5 spds came out in the mid to later 70s, I didn't think they were as favorable as the 4 spd Lencos.
NHRA pro stock is #️⃣1️⃣🏆 I don’t feel it’s given the coverage it deserves
Wow. Awesome info. Never knew they changed the gears every run.
This man personifies every reason America is the greatest country in the world
Absolutely mesmerizing, just awesome
Great video!
That shifter reminded me of my Mr Gasket V gate shifter in a Mopar I had in the seventies.
I had one in my Nova, it was bolted to a Muncie, I had some people look at it & ask if it was a 4X4 cause of the other stick
I watched Dave Connelly @ US Nationals changing gears every round in 2008, he was very, very focused.
im watching from Dipolog city,Philippines...thank you Sharing your video
I wonder what year the Pro Stockers went to Liberties? I'm thinking 1996 was still mostly all Lencos. By about 1999-2000, I think they were all Liberty. Not as much in-car camera back then to tell.
I love the liberty shifter. I have 2 small scale models of the liberty shifter. Both are metal, a 1/25 scale and a 1/16 scale. I'm buying another 1/16 scale shifter for my other hot rod I'm building. I built them to the realistic look
this is an automotive piece of art.
These guys are mecanics, rare breed these days.
The closest competition most reliable running class in NHRA. Not given the coverage it deserves.🏁
Greg Kom Nope I believe they should have stuck with the carburator set up instead of EFI , there would be more teams and a full field on race day . Those v-8 's are amazing up to 1300 + horsepower naturally asperated .
Go for a revolving gear shift mechanism.
Space saving. Ease to operate.
Can be Hydra/electro/Pnuema/leveraged.
Damn that's a small ass transmission, I figured they would have to be bigger, very interesting video
Let me get this right, the two cluster gears on the left and right take up the loads evenly, which makes this gear box twice as strong instead, of one in normal gearboxes, right.
That's the idea behind it yes. The correct terminology for those "cluster gears" is actually countershaft. Mack Trucks have a gearbox with 3 countershafts! It gets to a point where weight and space becomes an issue. The idea of spur gears is to remove the axial load when using helical cut gears, thus relieving the shafts, thrust bearings and gearbox casing of stress. However a spur gear is weaker than helical due to having less tooth contact and will generally have to be of larger construction to compensate. By using helical gears but with a shallow tooth angle you can increase the maximum torque limit but without as much thrust load or as much noise as a straight cut gear. But back to the original point it's just another way to go about increasing the strength of the gearbox... but there are other options out there depending on the application of the vehicle and or characteristics of the gearbox required by the driver.
i think this is the most informative comment ive ever heard thanks
arado240dd yeah, i watched the video too
+Ham94 Great work mate, loved the reply
the size of the thing compared to the performance abuse it takes. is just amazing...
Sick, I wonder how one of these would go in a street car? Jerico's seem to work very well on the street from the NASCAR world
Liberty's work very well in NASCAR.
Using a Liberty's in a street driven application requires a specific technique when downshifting.
The things we create for a few seconds of woohooo ahh it’s chute time dang it freaking sweet dude
So, it's just a heavy duty motorcycle transmission? Cool.
I agree. Damn near looks like a harley transmission. Main shaft, countershaft, 5 gears, and a case. Not much more. Always wanted to check one of these out. Good video
This transmission is also an sequential trany !
no it's actually a mini Eaton Fuller
Springfieldm14 308winchester Both are true
@@CHEVYK10 mini eaton fuller without the auxiliary part of the transmission;)
Did he just say they pull the transmission, tear it down, change gears, fill it up with oil, put it back together, and reinstall it within 10 minutes???
Yes, they are easy to take out, and as you seen when he bolted it back together, the cases are easy to split, and the gears are easy to take out and change. A manual tranny is a lot easier to pull than an automatic.
I wish my T5 was that easy to open up.
It's sequential, small and light-er
Yep. Why can’t we build shit that lasts longer than that?
Meanwhile AAMCO still working on yo shit from 2 days ago 🤣🤣🤣🤣
Wow, must take some crazy skills to operate.
@00:54 can we stop for a second and answer wtf this man is wearing on his head?
It looks like an enlarged motorcycle transmission. Way cool
13 dislikes? = prius drivers!
Or cars that can downshift and make turns?
Hidhir Abdul Wahab except when you do that you lose speed and et!
Hidhir Abdul Wahab. dumb fuck. go back to your happy tree
Bryan Keith lol. A butthurt Big Mac lover here
13 Ferrari drivers
that trans alone is probably worth more than drag car..
+bigblock nova only
9k. engines alone are 3 or 4 times that much
Prostock engines start at about $100k and go up from there. The engine technology is state of the art and people argue that it's more advanced than formula 1 engines.
MCRmechanic there is no chance in hell its more advanced than F1 engines. F1 teams have so much more funding, meaning more access to batter materials, better trained engineers, more testing, etc. Unless the drag car costs $300M a year to maintain an average team, F1 is just levels higher.
Matthew Zhang I'm talking about the engine, not the entire car.
Doesn't matter how much funding and research you have if the governing body restricts you heavily like they do in F1. The only part of F1 engines that are probably as advanced as high end drag engines are the KERS.
Good info Very interesting Thanks for the vid
WoW ... this is AWESOME ;]
So is this considered a V gate(vertical gate) shifter or does a v gate operate the same as this shifter?? Cool vid overall & Thx for sharing the knowledge.
I want to study like you. you are great I really salute
Is it sequential, motocycle-like gear box?
Billy Bill yuh
No, it isn't. This transmission uses an external gear shifter, sequential and motorcycle gearboxes use an internal sequential (i apologize for the redundancy here) shifter, usually forks mounted on a shaft, with a desmodromic drum that drives them up and down said shaft and they, in turn, drive sliding gears
No. Straight cut gears like many motorcycles though...
Brutalidade pura!
OUTSTANDING 🐢🐢🐢
Nice vid !
Fukin awesome!!! 👍👍👍
Mudah dan pantas,tarik dan tolak jer gayezzz... Melompat² der...next
THANK YOU, Team Gray, for ending the monotonous, BORING cycle of Ander$on & Dive....l mean Line!
Hank-car-cheif lol
Lol!
Lol good one... took me a minute
That's exactly what I thought lmao
Looks like the SS/AH Hemi's use the same transmission .. or Lenco's ...?
Interesting transmission explanation. What is the difference between a car chief over a crew chief? Is this some PC culture?
I bet you could run that vertical gate shifter on the streets
Oh mighty valvoline, when in the waterbox, for the burnout, do the drivers use first gear or second?
3 to 4th
nhra gold thank you, a question I’ve had for a while now
Damn that trans is small, i wonder how this thing transfer a huge amount of horsepower and torque for such a size
Less is more
RustyCanadian Not exactly
Akasaka Verrian more than likely fully forged alloy
MyLonewolf25 Maybe
Look at a Holinger trans. They're less than a hundred pounds wet and take 650 lb-ft in a race car for months on end. They're tiny. And indestructible.
NHRA should have never let Pro Stock go to a clutchless transmission...half the fun of watching the Pro "Stock" cars run was watching the drivers deal (read Speed Shift) with a clutch at the upper echelon of "stock" drag cars.
Steve Fowler they should have stayed with the carburator as well in prostock . More teams and full field on race day
"Takes about a quart and a half..."
_Pours blind from a 5 gal pail_
There’s a full line inside the case he’s watching
so where can i get one of those for me 96 escort?
So, it is a fully synchronized transmission like a a bike, except it is not sequential? Is there a system where no clutch is depressed to go? Handicapped. Or...I can do an air clutch for starting at tree. I need a better system than what I am doing.
Gray cars knew how to fucking BURNOUT at Brainerd Nationals.
Wow..i am impressed.
Sir please explain the how to work gear hand
I have 2 models for my model cars of an aftermarket liberty shifter that actually works. 1 i have together and the other isn't quite finished yet. Both made from aluminum. They are kool. I wish i could afford a real liberty lol
Respect!!!!
You're right about that dude 👊
Real interesting!!! Definitely the incorrect bolt torque sequence though ;)
just the approach of the bolts, you won't apply the correct torque with an electric gun anyway (for this application)
Ian Thompson Much worse is that he just poures some oil in there and puts the cover on😂
he didnt even torque them.
Lukas Langer, Im sure he knows exactly how much to put in just by eye. Im assuming he does it after every single run if he tears the trans down after every run.
i would imagine being a crew chief he knows the transmission better than his relatives. lol
Ian Thompson You can torque your bolts if you want but you won't last in this sport. If torqueing bolts to spec is your only concern you have no business inside a transmission or at the race track. The transmission Is disassembled after every run. The run is 6 seconds. This is not a daily driver that is subjected to extended periods of vibration. Use your fucking brain before you make your gay posts, there is no comparison between your Honda civic and a top sportsman car.
Why doesnt the clutch need to be used after 1st gear? Surely there is a mismatch in speeds...
well i get that point. I'm talking technically speaking, how can the trans shift under power without breaking?
Synchronized gears, they all spin at different speeds but the sliders that engage every gear also work as a rpm synchronizer
Hank, could this Liberty possibly be used for a wild looking street car ?
The only problem with this trans is there is NO down shift ability, it only goes from 1-5, there's now way to go 5-1, you have to come to a complete stop lift the first gear lock, and all the internal gears reset for their climb up to 5th again...not too cool for street.
You're right, that does not sound like a fun night of cruising. Thanks for the info.
yep. time is everything we have
What could come close to this for the street ?
As far as transmission that could still downshift and corner
Hi Derek. Please contact our Product Support team at: productsupport@valvolineglobal.com.
Or try calling 800-832-6825.
looks and sounds like my old z-gate attached to a rockcrushers muncie 4-speed in my 67 camaro
A z gate on a manual? How does that work?
He looks handsome while he holding the gear box😬😁😁
So I’m guessing they don’t even use RTV to seal it?
How does the driver shift gears without using the clutch?
Sequential trany, like a motorbike trany !
@@coco__rnd thay all have a clutch
@@louisedwards6681 yes ! but you don't need to use it to shift. If u want u can only use it for stop and start
@@coco__rnd that's right 🕺
@@coco__rnd I drive a1994NISSAN and I can shift w/out (stepping on the clutch) , this truck has 3 Hundred thou mi s. ,,,,,, BUT I am an automatic transmission Rebuilder and I know how to shift the Transmission without a clutch ,,, But you need a clutch to stop and GO ⚡
wow now i'am up to date .
So it's like a motorcycle transmission? That's what I'm getting
not what Im getting. Im getting that its shifts similar to a normal manual trans except the linkage allows for back and forth action.
dirtrider88 I'm fairly sure he was referring to it as a sequential box, rather than a traditional one. You can make the linkages shift any way you want, for example an H pattern or 1 N 2 3 4 5 like on a motorcycle. This just has a back and forth so it's easy to do in a short amount of time.
So are they basically sequential shifters?
If it's a dog box, why don't you use a regular sequential shifter instead of the one you use ?
Complete guess, but i would assume a nostalgia type reasoning; "keep it the way it used to be"
It's faster that way, the shifter doesn't have to go back in the neutral position. Remember that they are looking for every millisecond they can get.
Impresionante,que precisión!!!!!
Dang, that transmission has to handle 3000 hp at the least, craziness
How do you not need the clutch after start? How does it change gears with that much load on the gears?
Basically, the gears match rpm inside so the load doesn’t change. The dogs inside are cut to grab the gear. If you don’t pull the shift lever hard enough they skip and tear up parts.
@@valvoline I actually watched a video on how these transmissions are able to do this, and yes they get damaged over time and interestingly they do not use synchronizers at all and is really how these gears couple to each other under load. You can not shift a transmission under load that are equipped with synchros, at least I have never been able to do it and is the reason why I could not grasp the concept.
What oil I know he said vavolene but which one exactly?
Where did the Lenco go?
Wonder if u can put this in a daily driver
Not practical. You have to go full throttle all the time and cant gear back. for drag racing only
And home boys will drive their Hondas like that
Sir what is mean by gray surface 🤔🤔
More technical details please
Are the 2 countershafts just for mainshaft support?
Load distribution for additional torque/power capacity.
how does it not eat itself? you'd think it would grind between gears with the throttle wide open like that.
krazi77 Some systems cut the ignition as you shift.
the gears are straight cut so they mesh right in, unlike street transmissions that are semi helical and need a clutch to change gears.
AlexCoronaPhotoThe gears are always meshed. Whether or not they are engaged onto the shafts is determined by synchronizers in a normal street transmission. And you can still shift without the clutch.
It's going to grind a bit no matter what you do. If you bang gears fast enough you can make it pretty smooth though, as seen. They drop the trans every run, they aren't too concerned with grinding a bit.
They are changing gears after every race.
Damn.. 10 minutes to tear down a transmission. .. now that’s service
Some of the comments 🤣🤣🤣 love it! Nothing like banging gears in a liberty;)
Twin countershaft like a 13 speed Eaton Fuller.
these is awesome
but... how to shift the gear back?
Can someone explain why there are two layshafts in this transmission
+Gio Alviz extra strength and support.