Why collect the minor nations?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 8 ก.ย. 2024
- In this video we turn our back on the British, French and Russians and look at the arguments for collecting one of the minor nations!
none of these pics are mine :( but if they are yours let me know for a credit!
0:30.
It was me. : D
Now I'm waiting for Perry to release the rest of the Kingdom of Saxony sets for 1806.
Very interesting. I always enjoy Your channel. About Swedish army I would recommend the book " Between the Imperial Eagles"by Fred Sandstedt. Much info there. Also have a look at irregular miniatures who makes some scruffy Swedes on campaign in captured gear.(28mm) Eagle miniatures Perrys and minifigs also make Swedes and Danish forces. Keep up the good work with Your channel/Mats
I’d love to take a look at a Tirolean Rebellion set. Mostly I see folks say use landwehr models and imagination, which certainly works but digging deeper into that would be interesting as someone collecting and painting up Bavarians and Austrians. Didn’t see anything on the website mentioned but will keep this in mind.
It will be a kickstarter. Facebook is tge best way to keep up with his plans I find!
To me getting into the Minor Nation Armies says you are a Napoleonic aficionado. You've stepped up from Amateur level in your expertise. I have done Swiss , Polish and Bavarian. I just finished a Light Regt of Victrix Bavarians last Night. Good thing for the Bavarians is they can be used with French or against the French in wargaming
highly enjoyable food for thought on the many minor armys In the universe of the Napoleonic wargaming well done
Thanks man!
A shout out for Eagle miniatures, I have msny of these which I feel are up there with Front Rank, they do a good range of countries.
I have some lovely Polish, Swedish and Danish figures.
I especially like their horses.
Good thing you didn't mention bavarians after the british 3rd division, or I'd feel really called out :p Glad to have you back, mate.
Haha
If I may say as a positive, as well as other manufacturers, it might make you look at other scales. One of the reasons (but not the only) I did Assaye in 6mm was it was easier to find the Sepoys than at 28mm.
A great point!
This may be a flaw in warlords epic figures. Taking us back 50 years using plastercine and banana oil. 😎
Loved this video. I'm glad to see I'm not the only one that first off loves the variety a game has with minor nations but also...imagi-nations! I mean come on these games aren't minute by minute reenactments of battles, just wargames in the Napoleonic Era that you can use historical events to build army lists and scenarios. So why not have fun with some imagi-nation
My Minifigs Napoleonic army in the 1970s was Baden, created by using Bavarian figures. (Both had similar "raupenhelm" headgear). I chose it because it was the smallest German (or any?) army that had a good balance of all combat arms - mounted and grenadier foot guards, hussars and light dragoons, line and light infantry, foot and horse artillery. Furthermore, the Baden Army was small enough for me to paint every unit of it. On top of this, the Baden Army had a good reputation. I also liked that their uniforms were mostly blue and not garish except in minor battalion distinctions. (In those days it was still under discussion whether the light dragoons had light or dark blue coats. I went for dark blue so that they looked like mounted infantry).
If you are going to play against an opponent, then find an army that actually fought and you can look at what brigade or division is built how you want to use in a wargame. If it’s only a small nation you can add a battalion or so from an allied nation. The same goes for cavalry. I built a regiment of Prussians (3 battalions) then added a reserve infantry regiment then a Silesian Landwehre Regiment.
This was like von Bulow’s IV Brigade at Waterloo some LW Ulhans and a regiment of hussars backed up by a full regiment of dragoons.
Not the best balanced army but it was fun to use. All regulars would have done much better and rules that allowed passage of lines and the use of light infantry as it should be used ie must have formed lose order support support with all the exceptions allowed where this didn’t occur.
I appreciate what you say about the big 6 and also about the Bavarians being 'like the French but not as good'. However, it should be remembered that the Bavarians and Wurttembergers did very well in the early stages of the 1809 war (the one where the Austrians, funded by Britain, broke their treaty with France and launched an undeclared war - it is funny how Napoleon has the reputation for being the war maker and starter...), when the French presence was minimal. The Saxons and Hessians also enjoyed very good reputations and at various times any of these would likely have given not just the Austrians but the Spanish and Prussians and Russians a good run. The Italians also fought with distinction at Maloyaslavorets in 1812 and the northern Italians, with little French support v Austria in 1814.
I would also be cautious about the 'German Wars of Liberation' narrative. Certainly, the Prussians never accepted the French dominance but the picture in the rest of Germany is more complex. For example, liberals (in the C19 sense of the word) tended to side with the French and this was especially pronounced amongst urban elites and merchants. Liberal nobility likewise - for example the Saxon monarch. Conscription was unpopular amongst the urban and rural proletariat and peasantry but in 1815 the Saxons mutinied against Prussian orders to join them against Napoleon and the Bavarians and Wurttembergers changed alliance only when it became clear the Coalition was likely to prevail in 1813. Saxons disliked Prussians and there remained a lot of very significant parochial divisions between north and south, Rhinelanders and, of course, Catholic and Protestant. This is not a criticism - the focus here is wargaming not a Napoleonic version of Diplomacy.
I enjoy your videos - thank you.
Having collected an Anglo-Portugese force in 15mm starting in the late 1970s I have always found there are plenty of figures or proxies. The Portugese didn't fight alone in the Peninsula war and neither did the British - they were totally integrated. Loads of information are available on both and the amount of miniatures has greatly increased over the years. I don't see the Portugese as a minor in this respect because of their fully integrated organisation alongside the British.
Just had a look at piano miniatures as you mentioned out of curiosity. WOW, they are probably the best looking 28mm miniatures I've ever seen!
Don't know how I missed the notification for your last few videos man. Still great to have ya back
I was kinda hoping there'd be mention of Murat's Neapolitan Army. The Austro-Neapolitan War and the whole attempt to unify Italy is just so fascinating. Also I've heard that the uniforms were quite lovely, but then again it's Murat so of course.
Simple they are not the French Old Guard which everyone wants to field. So I have Bavarians (2 Divisions), Saxons (2 Divisions), Polish (1 Division but working to build them out to 2), a Brigade of Wuttembergers and Swiss which could be used by either side and in Spain that did happen. I was thinking about painting up a Brigade of Kleve-Berg since just putting them on the table would be interesting with their Pink uniforms. Oh and I do have several Divisions of French as well.
Portuguese did fight for France (Portuguese legion), they were mauled at Wagram and Borodino. They were trained by British officers; at least those who fought against France. I do love the minor nations and will eventually have Bavaria, Wurtemburg, Saxony and Poland represented. It's also a nice change from painting French or Austrian. Notifications from your channel aren't showing up for some reason.
Yeah, I meant as a nation. The PL are cool though, I've a battalion myself!
Thanks fir the heads up!
You may already know Piano Wargames minis. If not...
@@NapoleonicWargaming I should have known you knew and simply thought a bit harder about what you meant. For a tiny country Portugal certainly equaled the Prussians in military esprit de corps.
The first invasion of Portugal the Portuguese army didn't even mobilze. Napoleon discharged the young and old soldiers and took the rest away for the Portuguese Leion. That left Marshall Beresford with pretty much a clean slate. He converted the cavalry into lights and started adding caracodore battalions to increase the light infantry.
Parkfield Miniatures do a range of 28mm Spanish and Duchy of Warsaw Napoleonic’s
I've not heard of them. I'll check them out!
the Piano Minis are great looking. Esp the Wurttembergers. Their Guard Grenadiers are a unit I never knew about
See Ridley Scott's film about Napoleon is highly rated.
The Swedes are tough to research- I did some in 15mm. Their appeal is they're so distinctive looking.
wish someone would do some in 28mm plastic..
not much hope I guess.
Weird I was sure I posted a comment earlier but it disappeared.
Thanks for the video it's a good subject for me. You helped me out a week ago when I asked on the Black Powder group about what Nations I could paint with French Infantry. I'm currently working on a unit of Polish Lancers before I go back to Infantry.
My orders arrived so now I have a kit each of Warlord 1807 - 1814 Infantry, Perry Elite Companies infantry that was ordered by mistake, Perry Heavy Cavalry, Perry Foot command pack and a Heavy cavalry command sprue.
My ideas for my Infantry will be either a unit of Swiss and 2 units of Italians, 1 Unit of Italians and 2 Units of Swiss, or paint the third unit another nation. I'm not fussy about being close to historical orders of battle I just want to see different nations to add colour to my French army. lol
Thanks for the videos and helping me get back to Napoleonic Plasticrack. :)
Oooh, the Swiss are super cool, I like the Italians too! the Perry flank company box you can always make as skirmishers, or even Italian guard! (if no one look too closely!) I'm glad that I've had some part in you rediscovering Naps!
@@NapoleonicWargaming Will definitely have one as Swiss. Will look into Italian Guards as well based on your suggestion.
@David Vilorio Baraja good call! I really like the white uniforms with thise blue facings. It's a very striking combo (similar to the red and yellow of the swiss)
@David Vilorio Baraja I've looked at them since I made the post and yeah they might be a candidate. Thanks
Elite Miniatures produce figures for many of the smaller nations.
Such a fantastic subject, a treasure for the Nap period!
This is a bit late but the idea of “Imagi-Nations” is super compelling. I wonder how often people would have an issue playing against a made up thing, how do you stat your troops?
I think it depends, for many people the appeal of historical wargaming is just that, because it's history and really happened. Doing Imagi-Nations defeats that purpose because it's all made up, which also limits what you can use them for. What I mean by that is if you paint your own Imagi-nation with its own uniform, it can no longer be used for "actual" historical games without, again, defeating the purpose. It's an idea that sounds interesting, but feels to me like it's ignoring the main appeal.
Another good video, plenty of thought provoking idea's. Keep them coming 👍
Thanks dude!
I love the minor nations, as a crazy low burn project I’m collecting all the allied contingents to the Grande Armee 1812 in Russia. Now that’s a lots of regiments lol
I started out collecting and painting French and Austrians in 1:72, but now I've got almost as many Bavarian allies (and one Swiss battalion) as I do French. Their uniforms are just too cool to pass up.
I like to do minors (Westphalia right now) because you can actually do a complete army in one go, get a corps, and still get elite units, guards and heavy cavalry.
I really enjoy watching your videos, particularly about the CotR units. Why don't you consider doing an extended video about the Saxon army as their role as an enemy-friend-enemy of Napoleon from 1806 to 1813. Also there are now excellent Perry figures which can be used to illustrate this turbulent era in Napoleonic history. Just a thought!
Definitely want to get Americans for my first army when I get a chance to finally start playing war games
As far as Imagi-Nations are concerned, the states of the Confederation of the Rhine give you ready made armies with exotic uniforms suitable also for historical gaming.
A great video would be how to make your own kingdom for wargaming the napoleonic period ;) also, turnip28 is a great idea for a video.
Well super easy: I am Bavarian and Bavaria was an important player during the Napoleonic Era. Also we are always and still are an important player in middle European history.
That's why I play Bavaria. Rex et Patria!
If you guys ever make it to Munich it'll be great if you'd let me be your tour guide through Napoleonic Bavaria
I'm always in the planning stage for a Polish army. Always.
Duchy of Warsaw 28mm - 6 battalions, 3 cav units and 2 artillery batteries completed but I too am still planning for a few more...
3 Regts of Vistula , 4 Duchy of Warsaw , 1 Uhlans, I Hussars , 3 Batteries all part of a Brigade under French Command. Napoleon took a huge Army contingent of Poles to Russia
@@gromit368 Excellent stuff!
@@Rusty_Gold85 Cool! Vistula Legion is one of my favourite units.
Livestreams sound very interesting
As an aside. What do you know about the Russian Jager's, particularly 1812? I can not find enough information in their organisation, how they actually performed and how effective where they. Where they used as the French Skirmish line? as a " light Infantry, or Line?
I live in Bulgaria and have limited recourses to draw upon. Hid they use rifles?
Hessen-Darmstadt men are damned nice
most of the popular press books on the Ottomans before the 1830s or so are not very good, especially military topics. not much has actually been done for traditional campaign history or military structures
Hat Industries did a massive service for 1:72 ‘minor nations’ gamers.
You should always start with French and Austrians. They fought the most against each other, and were even allied in 1812.
I have the 1809 Saxon army!
very nice, I had the whole Westphalian army that went to Russia in 1812 15mm AB, but sold them on ebay, massive mistake
Piano Wargames is doing a great work withe their minis for many of these armies...
Bavaria had Garde du Corps, Cuirassiers, Lancers and Hussars by 1815.
Osprey and Knotel. It's an investment.
Woop Woop Minor Nations ftw
Hello, I saw these mini figures a while back. And I have been thinking about collecting them, is there anything I should know before I get them? I heard I need to paint them.
Yeah they come unpainted, and some you'll have to glue together. I find it quite relaxing to be honest! If you check out my livestreams I'm often reviewing or painting minis on those.
Where do you get the bear hat heads from?
I trully want to do a bavarian contingent
that way i may represent the small bavarian force of 1798 on the rhin
And also use them for and against my austrians
I'm going one step farther with the imagi-Nations and building a few brigades based on Turnip28
Im working on a battalion of Isembourg to support the French troops
It’s hard to view Spain as a major nation in this or any context after the 18th Century
I love getting the minors. I just got a bunch of warlords belgians
Rice pudding and jam. What do you people eat?
Westphalia is not an option (Henning Wehn joke)
Is this the point where somebody from one of the minor states chimes in and accuses you of being Anglo-centric again? ;-)
Sweden is a mess, but once you have researched enough it starts being easy
I really really really want an Ottoman force
you should create an imagination and then you can do several videos and paint along with the journey of creating it
That's a fantastic idea!
Given half a chance, I would opt for Portuguese over the Spanish in the Peninsular every time - a much better & more reliable army.
Because 3D printer go brrr
Ohhhh yeas more Spanish. 😊
is holland kingdom a minor or major nation like the Dutch grens
I'd say minor, but it's not a scientific thing!
@@NapoleonicWargaming @impostor thats an interesting one. Holland was to all accounts a capable military in its own right before the creation of Kingdom of Holland in 1806, and indeed in 1810 when it was absorbed into France proper then the Guards and Lancers were joined into the Imperial Guard (the lancers became famous "red lancers). They are minor only in comparison to the big 5 (sorry I dont feel Spain is on the same level as the others - indeed if you want a 6th I'd argue the EIC or Ottomans over the Spanish)
I can spot Chasseurs Mikes' blog photos anywhere hehe. The guy is a machine and pumps out hundreds at a time (sort of) chasseuracheval.blogspot.com/p/napoleonic-troop-index.html