If only this ship had access to a short range hydro (3-4km), instead of the completely useless Defensive AA, then it would have so much more flexibility. In it's current state you simply sit back and farm, the end. Discord: discord.gg/Flamu Stream: www.twitch.tv/flamuu Insta: instagram.com/flamugram/ Twitter: twitter.com/flamuchz
@@xixi6253 The Elbing can melt cruisers who show broadside and 3-6k volleys against broadsing battleships every 5 seconds is pretty juicy as well so it can definitely bring the DPM. Just watch the LELBONK video from Yuro for more examples, that video is pretty entertaining as well
@@frisianmouve eeh really what doesn't melt cruisers showing broadside ? Also comparing to CL, Wooster and mino melt things way faster, without relying too much on the enemy being broadside. the premiums colbert and smolensk have a way scarier DPM and Austin has SAP and HE + main battery reload booster. Elbing is tankier because /10 BB AP damage and no citadel but at the same time the enemy gets a DD that has way more utility. 3-6k AP salvos on BB are funny but ultimately since you don't hit citadels, other DD can farm BB just as well, they just do it with smaller number but more often. Also they light fires. And if you get close enough to cit BB, you might just as well torp them.
"Elbing can't fulfill any DD roles" - well, I think that maybe the hint is in the description alone "reconnaissance cruiser"... WG tends to have some weird distinctions when it comes to ships... I won't even start how Battlecruisers should have their own separate class, instead of hogging slots for battleships or cruisers depending on how WG feels that particular day.
One of the most frustrating things for me in this game is when I play DDs with insanely bad concealment and my team starts shooting me and spamming me to go cap. This is especially frustrating against a team with many radars too. It's crazy how dumb people are and think you can just go suicide on the cap just because you're a DD. I'm glad you showed a game where you find yourself in that situation too because I was genuinely starting to feel worse and worse each time I find myself in a situation like that.
elbing has secret buff you know, if you are spotted by cruiser, the cruiser will show broadside instantly and you can try to citadel it if you are spotted by dd and you also spot that dd, the dd will angle instantly and you can deal 5k-ish dmg with AP lmao and when i open water gunboating, the whole navy is shooting at me idk why when i use elbing, the enemy iq get reduced lol
Elbing is not a destroyer. You may have been confused by the icon displayed for it. It's not supposed to be compared to a Z-52 nor should it fight one at close range. It shouldn't fight anything at close range for that matter. Elbing is a cruiser that can get deep crossfires and farm broadsides with very consistent and accurate, hard hitting AP.
@@SuperJadnik No confusion here and the icon places it in the destroyer class. As far as what it should do and what it winds up doing, which is fighting destroyers, since a destroyer is usually the first ship which will spot it, and I speak from the perspective of the Z-52 main having destroyed many of these things. It is still a destroyer, people still expect the Elbing player to try and contest caps, and if they don't I still look for them along with any other destroyer and this thing loses badly. Sorry for the long response, but WG tried to sell this as a cruiser fighter, and it REALLY gets destroyed by cruisers. It gets compared to Z-52 by Z-52 players who know we will be facing this thing, and It is no match. Been playing this game since the beginning, no confusion on my part. WG packed this ship with a large health pool to attract people to play it, and unfortunately a lot of inexperienced people are attracted to this ship.
@@SuperJadnik sadly it takes the destroyer spot so is expected to contest. I feel bad for my team when playing it since a contesting dd is far more valuable than raw damage dealer. At least in my harugumo i can support my dds.
@@CatedraVernik That is the point exactly, it takes the destroyer slot, and when the teams load in with one destroyer each, the Elbing player should head to the cap. Even when there are two destroyers each, the Elbings who try to play cruiser catch hell from their team mates for it to perform destroyer duties, and when it smokes up with no hydro to "farm damage" (such a stupid term) destroyers torp it in its smoke and most of the cruisers it meets tiers 8-10 have radar and hydro and it catches hell. I played it on the PTS to see if I could make it competitive, but I come to the same conclusion, why play it and loose access to tools I have access to by selecting Z-52. Same with Z-46, none of other the tier 9 German destroyers are worth playing over Z-46.
@@SuperJadnik Dude, I am a DD main who loves the German destroyers, and in particular the Z-52 and Z-46. These new German destroyers are supposed to be rebranded seized French destroyers so they are supposed to play like the large French destroyers minus the speed. I was glad to see WG was releasing more German destroyers, but when I saw the specs, I saw WG was just crapping on the Germans once again, because these things are dogs. When it comes time to select a German destroyer to play, I play Z-23, Z-46 and Z-52 over these things. Even Lebrecht Maass is a much better destroyer than Z-31 and there's no reason to play Gaede when you have T-61. No one is trying to change your mind to get you to not play Elbing, you do you.
So the Marceau player didn't want to contest the cap, but wanted you to do it in a slower, larger ship. Typical player. More worried about teammates than analyzing and making the proper decision making himself...
If you look up his stats, he clearly doesn't know how to play dds. I wonder what gives these players the confidence to tell other people how to play this game...
Better to turn off chat. Especially when playing DDs. Every arrogant arse wants to boss you around and essentially sacrifice you to get a few moments of farming.
Of course. This would've been a stomp without Flamu, but it still shows not even a unicum with 200k+ damage and multiple kills can save some teams. Cursed matchmaking.
Idk if theres a title describing a ship in this game that i wholeheartedly agree with more than this title. Elbing is literally a light cruiser with no citadel
Anyone else notice (around 13:45) that the friendly Shima was asking the enemy Grozovoi where to download cheats, and the Grozovoi shared the website and said (@ 15:45) "I don't know how to play"?
Wait. There are cheats for Warships? 🤔 I thought that was impossible, but then again, I've have experience seeing players using bot programs during Ranked matches.
@@Dcarp7 its not impossibel to cheat, but you cant have a mod spotting every ship for exampel as you game Client does not know that the positions of enemies are when they are unspottet.
@@fire-vk8dn Ok. That is what I was thinking since it would be very hard to create cheats for the game, especially since WG is constantly updating the game and changing things here and there. Thanks.
Yup, not the worst at DDin(heal khaba easily holds that title) but with 6.4km conceal, you can get away with DDish things from time to time. Im loving this line overall tho, just have to pretty strictly adhere to the sneaky-cruiser role. The guns are disgusting against bigger ships!
@@antoniohagopian213 thats....optimistic expectations typically. especially early game, the only way that works, is if the DD(s) running from the khaba arent supported at all. usually, khaba gets outspotted, cant shoot the DD spotting him, and he gets shot at by 4 other ships. thereby needing to run away himself, therefore not "clearing" any way for his BBs. early game anyway. with 6.5km conceal on the elbing, while not actively hunting DDs by any means in her, you can get away with far sneakier things(like taking/contesting a cap) where the khaba simply cant. is the khaba faaaar superior in a gunfight(against DDs)? 100%! All i was saying, is that the elbing(with the right build) can do DD things better than advertised.
Not the first time the JSDF tried to pass something off as different. Back when Japan had started building its own armored vehicles, they tried really hard not to call them as such.
Up close, the Elbing's capability vs other destroyers is poor, but as the range increases the favor slides to the Elbing. I've found the Elbing to be quite the DD killer once you're in a position where your ballistics and accuracy far outweigh their DPM. Against CV's, the damage is pretty poor, but I do find the Elbing to have an uncanny ability to hit planes with flak damage for some reason, which the Elbing does a lot of.
Why does that thing not have a heal or hydro? It shouldn't be in the game. Being a DD down at t10 from the start means it's just a huge drag on the team.
Heal and Hydro but then no smoke would be such a nice combi. Andit would make this ship more interesting and better. But its a german ship so wg wont buff it🤣
A fucking speed boost like almost any other dd would be nice, and get rid of the Def AA and add heal. Maneuvers are extra useless against cvs on such a clumsy dd, you are basically a bb with heavy cruiser speed in terms of maneuverability. I thinK Z52 does a great job already as hydro dd, Elbing doesn't need to fullfil similar role (not that it could with those atrocious stats)
That has to be the most pyrrhic victory I've ever seen in WoWS. Almost all of the enemy team scored higher than most of the winning team and two of the enemy scored higher than Flamu, the highest winning scorer.
WG really needs to make this line way more maneuverable, faster without losing speed while you're turning way quicker Rudder shift and way tighter turning Circle having a turning circle of a battleship it's pretty much ridiculous in these ships
the torpedos aren't for directly attacking. they've delayed action mines you lay down that go off when someone runs into them unexpectedly. I've had some pleasant surprises with them
I am an average player at best and just got the Elbing today and honestly I love it. Used free xp to get Schultz and had an absolute ball playing that, I seem to always get lucky with my torps and chunk everything I see XD
WG create DD and cruiser with good AP effective against BB and Cruiser alike but make questionable BB AP even cruiser sometimes can survive being hit broadside
With a stealth build it gets down to 6.5 km detection. Which is not amazing, but much better and more comfortable in a slower ship like this than a fast ship like Kleber. Elbing shines as a flanking DD, as its AP is brutal to BBs and especially Cruisers. If a DD even ever so slightly angles, its likely to eat a ton of damage from Elbing's guns. I really like this ship, and it is overtaking my number one spot from Kleber as my favorite DD.
Elbing is an interesting little ship. It is a small light cruiser without a citadel, and has better AA compared to other Destroyers, minus the Pan-European ones. In the hands of a good player, this ship is a beast. EDIT: The big main issue with this ship, and something that I forgot to add with my original comment is that this ship doesn't fit in either role. It is too big and clumsy to be an effective destroyer. I guess you could say that it is a special type of light cruiser, but it doesn't fit into that category either. But, I can make the argument that the DFAA should be replaced with Hydro or at least a Heal.
The aa is completely shit, and it cant counter dds, cant cap or contest a cap. Like flamu said as a dd it is completly trash. The only good thing on elbing are the guns which only work well when broadside or bit angles dds. It is a dd which cant do things that other dds can and that is a massive downgrade when its on your team. The enemies just need dds that are just a bit competent and elbing cant do shit
@@luanx1guri531 Yeah, if anything, it is more of a small cruiser than a destroyer. However, It doesn't fit into either role. It is like its own special class, but very reliant on other ships, which is not an ideal situation.
Elbing is a pretty good ship. The reason why some players hate it is because they try to play it like a typical DD. It's a support DD and a cruiser killer. I consistently have 150k+ damage games in it. A lot of other streamers love the ship as well. Don't think it's a poor ship at all. You need to adapt to the ship you're playing.
Ironically the best ship to accompany the Elbing is a CV, beause all it needs to do is to get in range, smoke up and let the CV do all the spotting so it can melt whatever ship is angled well enough for the autobounce check.
Wouldn't Fearless Brawler be better then BFT because your reload time drops by 10% while spotted? And since your going to shooting alot your gonna be spotted most of the time. Edit: also gives you one extra flak which is something i guess.
@@antoniohagopian213 Fair point, though id also talk it on US dds due to how their guns are better at short range, a bit of a OH SHIT FIRE EVERYTHING! Ya know when you run into another dd at about 5 clicks.
Pros: Good AP for citadeling lightly armored cruisers. Great health pool by DD standards. Acts like a cruiser but can't be citadeled. Cons: Slow, poor concealment, poor gun dpm (Daring has WAY better AP dpm for regular pens and against DDs), no hydro, no speed boost, cosmetic DFAA, huge and easy to hit, bad torps, no heal. And I imagine the same poor German smokes? I'd ask why Wargaming made such a situational good, but otherwise shit ship ... and then I saw it was German and that told me all I needed to know. This hurts because I had been for years looking forward to a 150mm variant of the Z-52 and instead got this. Not that Z-52 is that great a ship these days either since it's AP gimmick works SO much better on the Daring. And Daring has heals, so on long fights, it's health difference is not that big. Basically, just play Daring.
Range skill is tempting because damage, but mostly the worst choice for anything that is easily hit, not maneuverable, and not fast enough to dodge. You only invite everything in that increased range to spot you and shoot you. Concealment is a far better option. Especially since you complained about not being able to push in and spot. RPF is another good option because you want to know where those other DDs are. The torpedoes are slow, but they are stealthy. They are mostly good for zone denial. You can and will regularly catch people doing dumb things, which is what random is full of. Agree it's not the best DD for a lot of task, but the ship is fun to play and can do nasty things to ships that normal DDs can't because of its chunk damage. NA servers have a ton of DDs playing every match so when you are 1 of 5 DDs your extra flavor brings a lot to the table.
The feeling of despair you get when seeing your teammate dd get obliteraded by other dds while u cant do anything about it is real. As Flamu says, at least in a kava, haru or french u can support your dds. I feel bad for my team taking a DD place knowing how important the dd's role is in winnig matches
@ Flamu So the 4 pt skill to reduce reload by 10% is not worth it in your mind? a flat 10% when detected (due to limited smokes and mobility meaning you tend to be on the move alot) would be better than Adrenaline rush would it not? Curious for your counter to that. Looking for honesty not calling your opinion wrong wondering why I am not seeing the flaw in the 4pt. option?
The Def AA consumable is useless cause the DD Mafia succeded in nerfing CV so hard that there are almost no CV around... So no real point in complaining about "lack of AA"
The Marceau wasn't really in the wrong either, the Marceau can't contest caps either, I have one so I know that most of the time I contest the cap I get melted or I run with half my health gone. But this Marceau player doesn't seem to know the Elbing is just as bad at it as the Marceau, which is a bit understandable as the Elbing is still rather new. I would just shadow the cap, and when the other DD leaves I would go into it. Of course him harassing teammates is a no go though.
220k damage than there is not much to complain about a ship imo. The wurse in this ship is mostly your teammates reactions that you not can do the dd role because the bad concealment. It would be better when WG put this ship in a CA slot i guess then there would be less frustration in the team.
These guns already have 38mm pen. Having more doesn't make much sense, you won't pass any significant thresholds. Plus you can aim at superstructure or bow/stern with pin point accuracy. And investing points into HE with terrible DPM is a questionable idea in the first place
I really feel bad for light cruisers. I mean... whats the point of playing them? They do same DMG as heavy brothers, have similar team use, but they are bullied by everything and everyone. They really need a buff. But WG is more engaged with riping money from people then balancing game
Friesland gameplay is closer to the main german DD line. The elbing line would be closer to an AP harugumo line imo Also calling the elbing better than the friesland is rather questionable
ngl this new german light cruiser line seems sorta cool. would be nice if weegee realized that and fixed their dorito. not sure why they gave it a dd dorito
That Marceau was even below average stats wise, truely a special kind of an animal. I guess Elbing is ok, you get screwed anyway in a lot of match ups or by your teammates. f.e. you play a good old Gearing legmod but if nobody shoots the radars or dds that you spot... well gg. Problem is though, this ship needs a skillful captain to not become a burden to your team and here I have a lot of doubts as soon as I spot one in my MM...
Because if a certain streamer had his way every DD would be Kidd, Cossack, Harekaze 1, and Smaland. What do they all have in common? They can all contest caps at any point of any game even with no support. Harekaze 1 also has the bonus of being a direct counter to the stealthiest ships in the game, Kagero and it’s 4 other clones including Asahio (it has identical concealment so I’m lumping it fight me). The point is if every DD was equally capable of contesting caps solo both at early game and at late game then why would anybody play any other class or any other DD subclass?!
If the elbing was fast, which one can really hope for. Given the size of the ship you would think the engines would be powerful. You could have this as a CV killer.
If only this ship had access to a short range hydro (3-4km), instead of the completely useless Defensive AA, then it would have so much more flexibility. In it's current state you simply sit back and farm, the end.
Discord: discord.gg/Flamu
Stream: www.twitch.tv/flamuu
Insta: instagram.com/flamugram/
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Defensive AA feels usless on majority of ships. Doesnt do much against CV and doesnt do anything without CV.
I prefer German Long range hydro though
I think they'd better give it citadel and throw it into cruiser slot.
It will become challenging but fun ship, and won't harm team so much
German selling point is superior hydroacoustic search. And this ship is just like ordinary heavy cruiser without citadel
How about a radar?
Elbing is a -destroyer- Light cruiser without a citadel
hard disagree, light cruiser actually bring dpm and utility
I think it’s based on the Spähkreuzer design so yeah pretty much.
@@xixi6253 The Elbing can melt cruisers who show broadside and 3-6k volleys against broadsing battleships every 5 seconds is pretty juicy as well so it can definitely bring the DPM. Just watch the LELBONK video from Yuro for more examples, that video is pretty entertaining as well
@@frisianmouve eeh really what doesn't melt cruisers showing broadside ?
Also comparing to CL, Wooster and mino melt things way faster, without relying too much on the enemy being broadside. the premiums colbert and smolensk have a way scarier DPM and Austin has SAP and HE + main battery reload booster.
Elbing is tankier because /10 BB AP damage and no citadel but at the same time the enemy gets a DD that has way more utility.
3-6k AP salvos on BB are funny but ultimately since you don't hit citadels, other DD can farm BB just as well, they just do it with smaller number but more often. Also they light fires. And if you get close enough to cit BB, you might just as well torp them.
@@xixi6253
WG ADMIT it in their description.
This ship is a design for a "RECONNESAINCE CRUISER"
Taken directly from the description in game.
Flamu: Elbing is a terrible destroyer
The numpty in the stealthy more mobile marceau on your team: hold my wine.
If you have choose beween a great player in a terrrible ship or a terrible player in a same tier great ship, I'd always choose the great player. ;)
bro is that kako oh shit
Always amusing, Flamus deffinition of AA vs. WGs deffinition of AA.
Well yes, there has been plenty of shit AA ships that WG calls them "strong" and "adequate".
@@CesarinPillinGaming *cries in DM*
Only europe DD that can be AA destroyer. Other just good but not strong to be considered AA destroyer
This can go as an expectation (WG's) vs reality (Flamu's) meme
@@lofficieldufishe9823 yep, they massacred DM's AA. only to add a "new flavor" of AA ships (hallands and austins )
"Elbing can't fulfill any DD roles" - well, I think that maybe the hint is in the description alone "reconnaissance cruiser"...
WG tends to have some weird distinctions when it comes to ships... I won't even start how Battlecruisers should have their own separate class, instead of hogging slots for battleships or cruisers depending on how WG feels that particular day.
You mean the ships that were stated to be more like Cruisers than Destroyers play more like Cruisers than Destroyers? What nonsense!
that's the problem with the Elbing, it takes up a DD slot
@@PrintScreen. it can FIGHT DDs, but it can't DD.
Like... yes, cruisers are good against DDs, thats like their entire job description tbh
One of the most frustrating things for me in this game is when I play DDs with insanely bad concealment and my team starts shooting me and spamming me to go cap. This is especially frustrating against a team with many radars too. It's crazy how dumb people are and think you can just go suicide on the cap just because you're a DD. I'm glad you showed a game where you find yourself in that situation too because I was genuinely starting to feel worse and worse each time I find myself in a situation like that.
I agree, so that is why now I don't cap till I have support. I will sit outside a cap and wait for the chicken shits to move up.
Yep pretend to go cap but wait to know enemy ship disposition before committing to cap
I usually only play concealment DDs so this isn't an issue for me.
Yes thank you, I am tired of seeing DD just yolo in the cap and die in the first 5 mins into the game
thats the problem with the community. Most of them are uninformed about the pro and cons of the ships.
That Marceau was something else lmao
That Marceu player is so pathetic. Sad part is, he will never understand what he did wrong...
Wows player and a russian at that, not surprising
all potatos see is a ship icon, if its a DD icon, they must sit in a cap at the beginning of the game
France dd is not the best to contest cap. Probably every enemy ship overspot him. Its the same as Elbing both dd is useless to cap in early game.
I have never seen such a butt hurt player before, thank god you can't damage teammates anymore.
elbing has secret buff you know, if you are spotted by cruiser, the cruiser will show broadside instantly and you can try to citadel it
if you are spotted by dd and you also spot that dd, the dd will angle instantly and you can deal 5k-ish dmg with AP lmao
and when i open water gunboating, the whole navy is shooting at me
idk why when i use elbing, the enemy iq get reduced lol
A missed oppurtunity to note the enemy Elbing dying to shimakaze torps at 3:55
If Elbing had hydro it at least could try to hold its own against other destroyers. Right now it just fails hard against Z-52.
Elbing is not a destroyer. You may have been confused by the icon displayed for it. It's not supposed to be compared to a Z-52 nor should it fight one at close range. It shouldn't fight anything at close range for that matter. Elbing is a cruiser that can get deep crossfires and farm broadsides with very consistent and accurate, hard hitting AP.
@@SuperJadnik No confusion here and the icon places it in the destroyer class. As far as what it should do and what it winds up doing, which is fighting destroyers, since a destroyer is usually the first ship which will spot it, and I speak from the perspective of the Z-52 main having destroyed many of these things. It is still a destroyer, people still expect the Elbing player to try and contest caps, and if they don't I still look for them along with any other destroyer and this thing loses badly. Sorry for the long response, but WG tried to sell this as a cruiser fighter, and it REALLY gets destroyed by cruisers. It gets compared to Z-52 by Z-52 players who know we will be facing this thing, and It is no match. Been playing this game since the beginning, no confusion on my part. WG packed this ship with a large health pool to attract people to play it, and unfortunately a lot of inexperienced people are attracted to this ship.
@@SuperJadnik sadly it takes the destroyer spot so is expected to contest. I feel bad for my team when playing it since a contesting dd is far more valuable than raw damage dealer. At least in my harugumo i can support my dds.
@@CatedraVernik That is the point exactly, it takes the destroyer slot, and when the teams load in with one destroyer each, the Elbing player should head to the cap. Even when there are two destroyers each, the Elbings who try to play cruiser catch hell from their team mates for it to perform destroyer duties, and when it smokes up with no hydro to "farm damage" (such a stupid term) destroyers torp it in its smoke and most of the cruisers it meets tiers 8-10 have radar and hydro and it catches hell. I played it on the PTS to see if I could make it competitive, but I come to the same conclusion, why play it and loose access to tools I have access to by selecting Z-52. Same with Z-46, none of other the tier 9 German destroyers are worth playing over Z-46.
@@SuperJadnik Dude, I am a DD main who loves the German destroyers, and in particular the Z-52 and Z-46. These new German destroyers are supposed to be rebranded seized French destroyers so they are supposed to play like the large French destroyers minus the speed. I was glad to see WG was releasing more German destroyers, but when I saw the specs, I saw WG was just crapping on the Germans once again, because these things are dogs. When it comes time to select a German destroyer to play, I play Z-23, Z-46 and Z-52 over these things. Even Lebrecht Maass is a much better destroyer than Z-31 and there's no reason to play Gaede when you have T-61. No one is trying to change your mind to get you to not play Elbing, you do you.
"DD go cap!" -> "DD why you die in first 3 minutes?"
So the Marceau player didn't want to contest the cap, but wanted you to do it in a slower, larger ship. Typical player. More worried about teammates than analyzing and making the proper decision making himself...
If you look up his stats, he clearly doesn't know how to play dds. I wonder what gives these players the confidence to tell other people how to play this game...
@@7Lopi They nullify their own ineptitude by scrutinizing you rather than paying attention to what they are doing.
Better to turn off chat. Especially when playing DDs. Every arrogant arse wants to boss you around and essentially sacrifice you to get a few moments of farming.
Was cool to see a close game instead of stomps.
Was sweet to play as well, so bored of stomps but love close games
Of course. This would've been a stomp without Flamu, but it still shows not even a unicum with 200k+ damage and multiple kills can save some teams. Cursed matchmaking.
Idk if theres a title describing a ship in this game that i wholeheartedly agree with more than this title. Elbing is literally a light cruiser with no citadel
Anyone else notice (around 13:45) that the friendly Shima was asking the enemy Grozovoi where to download cheats, and the Grozovoi shared the website and said (@ 15:45) "I don't know how to play"?
Wait. There are cheats for Warships? 🤔 I thought that was impossible, but then again, I've have experience seeing players using bot programs during Ranked matches.
@@Dcarp7 its not impossibel to cheat, but you cant have a mod spotting every ship for exampel as you game Client does not know that the positions of enemies are when they are unspottet.
@@fire-vk8dn Ok. That is what I was thinking since it would be very hard to create cheats for the game, especially since WG is constantly updating the game and changing things here and there. Thanks.
Yup, not the worst at DDin(heal khaba easily holds that title) but with 6.4km conceal, you can get away with DDish things from time to time.
Im loving this line overall tho, just have to pretty strictly adhere to the sneaky-cruiser role. The guns are disgusting against bigger ships!
@@antoniohagopian213 thats....optimistic expectations typically. especially early game, the only way that works, is if the DD(s) running from the khaba arent supported at all. usually, khaba gets outspotted, cant shoot the DD spotting him, and he gets shot at by 4 other ships. thereby needing to run away himself, therefore not "clearing" any way for his BBs. early game anyway. with 6.5km conceal on the elbing, while not actively hunting DDs by any means in her, you can get away with far sneakier things(like taking/contesting a cap) where the khaba simply cant. is the khaba faaaar superior in a gunfight(against DDs)? 100%! All i was saying, is that the elbing(with the right build) can do DD things better than advertised.
Elbing: The terrible destroyer
JS-Izumo and JS-Kaga: The multi-purpose destroyer
Hard joke to understand but funny enough
Not the first time the JSDF tried to pass something off as different. Back when Japan had started building its own armored vehicles, they tried really hard not to call them as such.
Just like "Kuznetsov-class heavy aircraft-carrying cruiser"
The best part about this video was when that aggravating Marceau died after contributing nothing to your team.
Dunning Kruger Effect: Marceau edition
When you're so bad that you can't tell that you're bad
Up close, the Elbing's capability vs other destroyers is poor, but as the range increases the favor slides to the Elbing. I've found the Elbing to be quite the DD killer once you're in a position where your ballistics and accuracy far outweigh their DPM.
Against CV's, the damage is pretty poor, but I do find the Elbing to have an uncanny ability to hit planes with flak damage for some reason, which the Elbing does a lot of.
That's prolly the enemy CV being potato, it has 2 flak, there's no way a CV aware of flak eat thoses
also if an Elbing manages to kill a DD from range, that means they have done something very wrong or very stupid to be killed like that.
Why does that thing not have a heal or hydro? It shouldn't be in the game. Being a DD down at t10 from the start means it's just a huge drag on the team.
Heal and Hydro but then no smoke would be such a nice combi. Andit would make this ship more interesting and better. But its a german ship so wg wont buff it🤣
Well, it can help the team by creating a crossfire and do you know, forcing enemy to angle against you in a DD is very good.
A fucking speed boost like almost any other dd would be nice, and get rid of the Def AA and add heal. Maneuvers are extra useless against cvs on such a clumsy dd, you are basically a bb with heavy cruiser speed in terms of maneuverability. I thinK Z52 does a great job already as hydro dd, Elbing doesn't need to fullfil similar role (not that it could with those atrocious stats)
@@crimsonscarlet5482 that would be very nic3 too
@@PrintScreen. Of course, we'll see it in comp for sure lmao
That has to be the most pyrrhic victory I've ever seen in WoWS. Almost all of the enemy team scored higher than most of the winning team and two of the enemy scored higher than Flamu, the highest winning scorer.
WG really needs to make this line way more maneuverable, faster without losing speed while you're turning way quicker Rudder shift and way tighter turning Circle having a turning circle of a battleship it's pretty much ridiculous in these ships
This ins't a Light Cruiser, it's a DIET Cruiser.
the torpedos aren't for directly attacking. they've delayed action mines you lay down that go off when someone runs into them unexpectedly. I've had some pleasant surprises with them
Thanks Flamu!
I am an average player at best and just got the Elbing today and honestly I love it. Used free xp to get Schultz and had an absolute ball playing that, I seem to always get lucky with my torps and chunk everything I see XD
Yup, they could have solved it either by giving it a poor mans hydro or change the MM to take into account the DDs that aren't cap contesters.
WG create DD and cruiser with good AP effective against BB and Cruiser alike but make questionable BB AP even cruiser sometimes can survive being hit broadside
4:56 I can see some high mechanics from Marceau. Are you playing on NA?
NA usually has less Cyrillic in the chat.
So... This ship is basically a barely decent light cruiser without a citadel
With a stealth build it gets down to 6.5 km detection. Which is not amazing, but much better and more comfortable in a slower ship like this than a fast ship like Kleber.
Elbing shines as a flanking DD, as its AP is brutal to BBs and especially Cruisers. If a DD even ever so slightly angles, its likely to eat a ton of damage from Elbing's guns.
I really like this ship, and it is overtaking my number one spot from Kleber as my favorite DD.
And the word Each container spells it out..
RPF an absolute for me when the ship has no hydro.
Elbing is an interesting little ship. It is a small light cruiser without a citadel, and has better AA compared to other Destroyers, minus the Pan-European ones. In the hands of a good player, this ship is a beast.
EDIT: The big main issue with this ship, and something that I forgot to add with my original comment is that this ship doesn't fit in either role. It is too big and clumsy to be an effective destroyer. I guess you could say that it is a special type of light cruiser, but it doesn't fit into that category either.
But, I can make the argument that the DFAA should be replaced with Hydro or at least a Heal.
The aa is completely shit, and it cant counter dds, cant cap or contest a cap. Like flamu said as a dd it is completly trash. The only good thing on elbing are the guns which only work well when broadside or bit angles dds.
It is a dd which cant do things that other dds can and that is a massive downgrade when its on your team. The enemies just need dds that are just a bit competent and elbing cant do shit
@@luanx1guri531 Yeah, if anything, it is more of a small cruiser than a destroyer. However, It doesn't fit into either role. It is like its own special class, but very reliant on other ships, which is not an ideal situation.
@@Dcarp7 true
So I should have picked the other DD line?😂😂
Fuck me.....
Elbing is a DD as much as Alaska is a cruiser
Hydro + heal/reload booster = an interesting ship
Thanks for the warning !
Elbing is a pretty good ship. The reason why some players hate it is because they try to play it like a typical DD. It's a support DD and a cruiser killer. I consistently have 150k+ damage games in it. A lot of other streamers love the ship as well. Don't think it's a poor ship at all. You need to adapt to the ship you're playing.
Ironically the best ship to accompany the Elbing is a CV, beause all it needs to do is to get in range, smoke up and let the CV do all the spotting so it can melt whatever ship is angled well enough for the autobounce check.
My Bane in so many battles where i play my Colbert...
Wouldn't Fearless Brawler be better then BFT because your reload time drops by 10% while spotted? And since your going to shooting alot your gonna be spotted most of the time. Edit: also gives you one extra flak which is something i guess.
@@antoniohagopian213 Fair point, though id also talk it on US dds due to how their guns are better at short range, a bit of a OH SHIT FIRE EVERYTHING! Ya know when you run into another dd at about 5 clicks.
Pros: Good AP for citadeling lightly armored cruisers. Great health pool by DD standards. Acts like a cruiser but can't be citadeled.
Cons: Slow, poor concealment, poor gun dpm (Daring has WAY better AP dpm for regular pens and against DDs), no hydro, no speed boost, cosmetic DFAA, huge and easy to hit, bad torps, no heal. And I imagine the same poor German smokes?
I'd ask why Wargaming made such a situational good, but otherwise shit ship ... and then I saw it was German and that told me all I needed to know. This hurts because I had been for years looking forward to a 150mm variant of the Z-52 and instead got this. Not that Z-52 is that great a ship these days either since it's AP gimmick works SO much better on the Daring. And Daring has heals, so on long fights, it's health difference is not that big. Basically, just play Daring.
Range skill is tempting because damage, but mostly the worst choice for anything that is easily hit, not maneuverable, and not fast enough to dodge. You only invite everything in that increased range to spot you and shoot you. Concealment is a far better option. Especially since you complained about not being able to push in and spot. RPF is another good option because you want to know where those other DDs are. The torpedoes are slow, but they are stealthy. They are mostly good for zone denial. You can and will regularly catch people doing dumb things, which is what random is full of. Agree it's not the best DD for a lot of task, but the ship is fun to play and can do nasty things to ships that normal DDs can't because of its chunk damage. NA servers have a ton of DDs playing every match so when you are 1 of 5 DDs your extra flavor brings a lot to the table.
As you all know: "AA does nothing"!
So the "reconnaissance cruiser" doesn't get hydro? Makes sense.
The feeling of despair you get when seeing your teammate dd get obliteraded by other dds while u cant do anything about it is real. As Flamu says, at least in a kava, haru or french u can support your dds. I feel bad for my team taking a DD place knowing how important the dd's role is in winnig matches
Are you sure you don't want to use HE against DDs outside of that ideal angle? Do overpens still do more damage than the HE?
Just reclassify it as uncitadelable super light recon crusier. I mean it has only 4k less hp than a zao. Give it 2 heals and you are good to go.
it can land a citadel hit on a salem broadside from 16km range. Believe that.
@ Flamu So the 4 pt skill to reduce reload by 10% is not worth it in your mind? a flat 10% when detected (due to limited smokes and mobility meaning you tend to be on the move alot) would be better than Adrenaline rush would it not? Curious for your counter to that. Looking for honesty not calling your opinion wrong wondering why I am not seeing the flaw in the 4pt. option?
Simple, Elbing is a gigantic and clumsy target. You don't really open water to make use of the skill
Question; Would it have been better to have given these things a citadel, hydro and just made them an alternate light cruiser line?
Flamu be like… this is a terrible DD. 219k damage. 3 kills and high caliber.
This potato be like… WOW! Look at the incredible game I had!
Can’t agree more! See Elbing players not doing dd things which can be the deciding factor with few dds in MM
So it's a modern day destroyer
when you realise kleber is faster than those torps
I think the Elbing is a great ship. But you will get punished if you play bad or if you play it like a dd.
The Def AA consumable is useless cause the DD Mafia succeded in nerfing CV so hard that there are almost no CV around...
So no real point in complaining about "lack of AA"
Damn, you are a good player!
Been cool if elbing got sap or something. That would have solved its anti-dd problems.
The Marceau was clearly a noob, he should have known the Elbing is not an early cap DD
The Marceau wasn't really in the wrong either, the Marceau can't contest caps either, I have one so I know that most of the time I contest the cap I get melted or I run with half my health gone. But this Marceau player doesn't seem to know the Elbing is just as bad at it as the Marceau, which is a bit understandable as the Elbing is still rather new. I would just shadow the cap, and when the other DD leaves I would go into it.
Of course him harassing teammates is a no go though.
Would you consider "Fearless Brawler" instead of "Main Battery and AA Specialist"? Is it viable?
Great vid Flamu, well played! Now I know not to bother with this line, doesn't look worth it.
2 videos in ONE day oml
I totally agree, as a dd it sucks, it's OK as a small cruiser. But all of the radar/smoke/torp cruisers all do better
Play it like a light cruiser and dont focus the dds. I find thats the best way to play, thats my play-style so mileage may vary.
Look at it from the other side... Its light cruiser without citadel...
This ship is a good example of why people should stop losing their shit at pre-release stat pages.
Please what was you captain build I need help flamu!
The second German tech line should have been a light cruiser line.
Nice Leander commentary
Too bad your Marceau buddy wasn't around to help out in the end.
The one game on your stream I watch... you make a yt video about haha
hell i still play this like a dd just alittle less aggressive on the cap. working out so far.
I've found more success using the high pen HE with the 150s against DD's
That Marceau was extremely clueless and really toxic on top of that. The kind of player that I just hate the most in this game.
Yeah, he wasted that coal. I love my Marceau!
so, all needed to fix the ship is to classify it as a cruiser for the matchmaker
easy fix.
also known as:
never gonna happen, cause WG
Elbing, doing their own thing and throw the hot potato to other teammates...
Wait, isn't it just the average WoWS player base?
220k damage than there is not much to complain about a ship imo. The wurse in this ship is mostly your teammates reactions that you not can do the dd role because the bad concealment. It would be better when WG put this ship in a CA slot i guess then there would be less frustration in the team.
Khabarovsk is jealous ...
I was surprised it didn't have the IPHE for the commander. The chance of fire is so bad anyway, maybe try to get some penetration?
These guns already have 38mm pen. Having more doesn't make much sense, you won't pass any significant thresholds. Plus you can aim at superstructure or bow/stern with pin point accuracy. And investing points into HE with terrible DPM is a questionable idea in the first place
@@Artem_Shepelev TY.
you can still select the ifhe skill
I really feel bad for light cruisers. I mean... whats the point of playing them? They do same DMG as heavy brothers, have similar team use, but they are bullied by everything and everyone. They really need a buff. But WG is more engaged with riping money from people then balancing game
@ANUBHAV SHARMA I'm not speaking about elbing. I'm saying that light cruisers in general are kinda weak (Ok, not kinda. Very)
Nevsky is good. I know it's dubious to call it a light cruiser when it has more armor and HP than zao and more conseal than petro but here we are
@@drakeconsumerofsoulsandche4303 it also has comparable AP pen to venezia so middle of the pack for CA pen
you dont counter only light cruisers you counter all cruisers
Why are you focusing on DD? Hit the CA..
Cause killing DDs win game in his mind
*Me killing a dd with Montecuccoli torps
Crazy how the stupid grozovoi trys soooo hard to throw
Don't know what you mean about the AA. It's pretty reasonable. No Halland but better than half of the other tier X dd's.
He always whines about AA and DF, it's his gimmick centered towards CV hate
The only thing good about it is the range, nothing else. It's dps is at the range where CVs can just fly off, it has no flak soo
On a DD if you face this Elbing and is nose on to you, you can't really damage it. They are good at tanking against other DDs really.
And it can't damage you either so
@@danh7411 Yes, but you waste time and get spotted at the same time. Is like shooting at a rock :)
friesland is like the pyro version of the elbing? or is the elbing better?
Completely different ships.
Friesland gameplay is closer to the main german DD line.
The elbing line would be closer to an AP harugumo line imo
Also calling the elbing better than the friesland is rather questionable
was that an mino with the range mod?
ngl this new german light cruiser line seems sorta cool. would be nice if weegee realized that and fixed their dorito. not sure why they gave it a dd dorito
Oh no
That Marceau was even below average stats wise, truely a special kind of an animal. I guess Elbing is ok, you get screwed anyway in a lot of match ups or by your teammates. f.e. you play a good old Gearing legmod but if nobody shoots the radars or dds that you spot... well gg. Problem is though, this ship needs a skillful captain to not become a burden to your team and here I have a lot of doubts as soon as I spot one in my MM...
The Marcau is a good example of how dumb this playerbase is.
That marceau is rlly annoying
Why would anyone want to play this thing?
Because if a certain streamer had his way every DD would be Kidd, Cossack, Harekaze 1, and Smaland.
What do they all have in common? They can all contest caps at any point of any game even with no support. Harekaze 1 also has the bonus of being a direct counter to the stealthiest ships in the game, Kagero and it’s 4 other clones including Asahio (it has identical concealment so I’m lumping it fight me).
The point is if every DD was equally capable of contesting caps solo both at early game and at late game then why would anybody play any other class or any other DD subclass?!
If the elbing was fast, which one can really hope for. Given the size of the ship you would think the engines would be powerful. You could have this as a CV killer.