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Hey guys, SnapJelly here to talk to you about daggers and the discussion anout if you should hold them point up (in hammer grip or forward grip) or point down (in reverse or icepick grip)
Back in 1971, I was taught by the U.S. Army Infantry, that when in a knife fight, hold the blade down, with the thumb closest to the blade. This was for two reasons, first holding it the other way is easier to defend against, and secondly the blade is going against the much softer belly, rather then against the harder ribs. Hence, if I was going to use a knife against an opponent, I'd hold the blade DOWNWARD, unless my opponent is armored. In that case, I'd hold the blade upward (as in the ice pick, with the thumb farthest from the blade. That way I can use the blade against “soft” points in the armor such as the openings in the face, or against chain mail. That way, I can get that much force behind my hand by using not just two hands, but by putting my weight against the blade.
Nice
lets grab this one...it's a bit longer! ;)
SnapJelly,2017
Jelly´s Magic Dildo Collection
hey snap! I really liked this video! I think it really helps when you talk about stuff you want to because then you're more enthusiastic about it and the quality gets better
This is the best synopsis video on dagger use for fighting on YT, period.
Seriously, how have i never understood this?
This is how I see this,
Point up is better when you fight at "long range" meaning that you need to take a step forward to be able to hit your opponent. It has a slightly better reach and it gives you more options, more angles to stab your opponent in the chest the main target in that style of fight.
Point down is better when at "close range" meaning you are basically hugging each other. You don't need that reach and it is easier to stab with that limited space.
Since in middle ages were full of armor point up was not really useful since the places that it are easier to stab with point up are covered in armor. You needed to get really close to hit these in armor and more power to actually penetrate the chain mail.
Later on when there was less armor the point up became more useful since you don't start the fight hugging (usually) and there was nothing that would make stabbing into chest pointless.
I agree with your points. But just for the sake of bringing up something for a possible follow up. What about the dirk? A 16-18 hundreds parrying dagger used point up and with no guard. Generally used with a braudsword for duels, and a braudsword and targe for battle, though when used in conjunction with a targe it could be held point down, with the point protruding under the shield.
You should do a series where you talk to professional bladesmiths about weapon design and function, I'd watch it
it will depend on how you are carrying it and how quick you need to be able to draw it in reference to not only which hand is free, but how close is the opponent the moment you draw it. you might not have time to draw it the preferred way (best for stabbing), just the quicker way(quickest way hand to weapon)
It's better to hold a dagger point-down, because when your clumsy ass trips and falls, you won't accidentally put your eye out.
you will instead put out a vital organ...
I could see using a forward grip being useful when two people that don't know what they're doing are fighting.
Did you learn fighting from one of those oakley-wearing dudes on the Internet, yes?
The big reason for the knife/dagger discussion is for modern times. Like in a situation where two people find each other with knives in an alley way or in the instance of an urban scenario. Unless your on top of each other reverse grip doesnt really seem preferable.
Reverse grip on a knife is usually going to be better in grappling situations than forward grip. And forward grip is for when your trying to use reach to your advantage. That both have there place in real world situations.
This is pretty helpful doing a little research on daggers, bc interesting, and also because drawing stuff
Can't you just switch the grip in combat? If you have enough dexterity. If you can, the debate about "what grip is better" hace no sense.
you could but there are so many things you can do with either grip that you really don't need to
That's it.. flipping the knives is a key component to combat.. practice daily.. single and a pair
Although, you don't have to get as close if you throw a quick cut to the arm.
Against armor tip down is ok for downward strikes to the neck. Tip up to get under the helmet, armpits lower torso. Unarmored with a modern knife I would still go with point up for slashing and thrusting. With that the goal is to disembowel the opponent and cut and slash arteries. Yes with the tip down style your leverage with the downward stab is powerful it makes it a bit more awkward for slashing and some cutting motions for me. It's all based on how you're trained
I think reach matters with knive fights but I can still see why it only matters on the way you use it
Reverse grip does require more strength and conditioning of your triceps and lats rather then biceps and pecs for swinging a blade, also you use your wrist and forearm more on the opposite side. Bc of that it may be harder to get the technique down, the more strength you use, the more inaccurate you are but if you master the accuracy, strength and precision you get a powerful attack indeed
in my opinion it's more about where you are aiming.
If you want to stab the belly, hammer grip is pretty crap unless they are on their back.
Whereas trying to get the knife in side of someones neck, hammer grip is superior, more force.
I think you got them mixed up
yes i did, a little fried due to the heat lol
why are your weapons not battle ready?
Great explanation and very informal
Reverse grip is very very effective by the way. Some very selective knife instructors will tell you that it is a sign of an unskilled fighter. That's wrong, especially if your knife is large and your stance appropriate
Now a question. "Used to pierce armor". Swords wasn't able to, apearently, but did daggers was? I never saw it nowhere. (not even in VideoGames, but of course, it's just because they don't show those details)
eric Graccus A dagger goes into the gaps, if we are talking abuot plate. But you have to think, plate isn't an everyday outfit and the number of people who owned one wasn't the mayority.... So it's abuot context who use a dagger and when (battlefields or streetfights).
Some daggers had been designed without cuttingedges and a triangular or rectangular verry pointy shape, to bend gaps more open and increse the chance to split rings.
Not all armor was metal. As it turns out, gambeson and leather were pretty good at turning blows from something as big as a sword. And for much of history- metal armor wasn't solid plate. It was either lamellar with gaps, or scales that you could slide under. Eventually chain mail made its debut, and daggers had to be both pointier and more robust- so you started seeing bladeless metal barbs like the Rondel that could force their way through the gaps of chains. When platemail finally started coming around, they moved back to skinny daggers that could slip through eyeholes or through the heavy cloth around one's armpit. It always had to defeat the armor of the people they were fighting.
i think the range argument, is a more modern times thing.
think about knife fighting in real life. i get in a situation were i have a decent sized (kitchen?) knife or a small pointy machette or so and maybe i get robed on my way back from a kitchenstore. or i get surrounded by 3 thugs and i have my camping machette with me for some reason.
in such very specific situations, it doesnt really make sense to do it with reverse grip. cause all i want is to 'disarm' them, or in other terms, making them unable to attack.
for that i need range and speed i would say.
#speedFTW
First of all, once whether you decide to wield the dagger point up or reverse grip, you are committed because there is no smooth transition that can be safely made from one grip to another....it’s a personal choice.
Shifting from one to another is very easy, have you ever even tried
Reach 100% matters.
I'd go point up
reach doesn't matter if you're actually intending on hurting someone with it. Its not a distance weapon. Impale them or don't bother using it.
I was taught to use the tonfa, primarily in defense, to protect the inner upper arm. by extension, any weapon about the length of the forearm can be used in a defensive fashion with the reverse grip.
Hiw much advantage does a leftie have against a rightie when they fight?
th-cam.com/video/XortyfXv2uE/w-d-xo.html
You are AWESOME!!!
i love "how to stab u friend DIY"
In my experience if the fight is knife v unarmed, then reverse grip is better, but if the fight is knife v knife, then forward grip works better, at the very least the way I've learned to fight it's what has worked best for me
i paused the video when my mom came in. and you were in your cutest pose... i hope she doesn't think i'm gay or somethng
I think calling one of his poses cute makes you slightly gay
you got the point lol
but really tho mom looked at the screen 4 times it's fucking scary
WAIT A SEC SKIPPY!
Jelly here is literaly talking about Stabbing people with a DAGGER.
and you call it CUTE?
iam confussed
so what was the cute pose?
Janik Malkovich around 8,14
You bring up some very common sense points.
And I agree… this is not really one of those things.
A silly idea to insist on any particular grip
Blade down Because Your Using the Force of Gravity to your advantage and exert more Power
Don´t they normaly talk about this in street fighting not historical fighting?
Do a review bed stark Vs Jamie where Tory dies
YES ! WE WANT A CRYING VIDEO ! DO NOT LIKE ANY MORE Snapjelly VIDEOS !!! WE WANT TO SEE Snapjelly WINING LIKE A LITTLE BITCH !!! DRAGGING ON THE FLOOR etc. WE WANNA SEE THE WHOLE PACKAGE!
I disagree, forward grip is the way to go. Reach and thrusting with forward grip is a huge advantage. Slashing also becomes more effective especially if it is a one sided blade as the twist in the wrist is less exaggerated when slashing back and forth. If you want to thrust with reverse grip you will most likely only come down from the blade up high as demonstrated in the video and that is a huge tell where as the hold of a forward grip, a slash or thrust good come from the same position. Especially in grappling or up close reverse grip has the potential, depending on how the wrist is twisted, to see the blade pointed back at myself whereas forward grip most likely faces out. Grab a knife and check what I am saying, slash from every angle with both grips, thrust with both grips, check the reach and mobility of both, heck try throwing from reverse grip and you will see which is better.
don't cry buddy!
lindybeige had cooler poems for this.
Yeah, but Snap is about a thousand times more handsome, so it's OK.
Am I the only one who noticed that in his video two days ago, his hair was short and now it's long again?
It was just a ponytail mate
SnapJelly or dark magic
probably dark magic with a k like magick cuz lets be honest we're all nerds
first
heh heh heh I win
last
Last
what about using a sword with a reverse grip
Wasnt done historically for a good reason.
sean1 casswell not that useful mostly,it's a sword,not a lightsaber,you're gonna need at least some force behind your strike. You don't have that force. Also,your edge alignment is probably horrible
sean1 casswell was done historicaly in Japan to commit siucide....
IS that the most pretentious generic newbrand shirt I have ever seen in my life