HO Scale Sergent Train Couplers Product Review
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 30 มิ.ย. 2016
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Sergent makes very good-looking couplers for HO Scale trains. In this review, Dan not only shows how to assemble and install them, but also gives information to consider if you are thinking about using these couplers.
Will Dan decide to convert his entire fleet in this video? What do you think?
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I am now the proud owner of the "TSG Couplers" used in this review, and am keeping track of the cars they're used on :) They are a bit of a pain, some require slight modification so that they don't stick open or closed, while others work like a dream. Must be an outlier kind of thing. Still, I personally have a lot of fun with them (when they actually work!)
I wish one of these coupler makers would make a rotary coupler for rotary dump coal facilities.
Sergent actually made plastic dummy rotary couplers for a while. Sadly, the guy who picked up the patent hasn't made them yet.
Офигеть 👀 Прикольные игрушки. Макет прям точь в точь настоящий повторяет. У нас таких моделек днём с огнём не сыскать.
They are good for display use on a locomotive or car and look good but overkill on a running layout. Your standard Kadee 55's are what you want on a running layout.
You burnished the wrong hole. You should burnish the hole inside the knuckle where the ball goes not the hole in the shank. That allows the ball to move freely.
I use these couplers, never had the problem of them locking open. But I never filed the inner parts of the coupler. But I did have the problem of the pin not dropping and the knuckle staying open. To fix that just make the hole that the little ball gets sucked up into a little bigger with a small round file and your set. They are a great coupler if you like close to real operations, where a joint or coupling doesn't always make and you have to adjust the coupler. This coming from a conductor for Cp rail.
Can they do a review on Proto 87 wheelsets?
I've been using S.E. couplers for almost 10 years and have never had any issues with mine. They are compatible and will work just fine with the kadee 58's and 158's tried and true.
I use a few versions of their Sharon couplers for Hon3 and think they are fantastic. They will couple with Kadee 714s. I don't know about the Kadee Hon3 Scale Head couplers. These shame the Scale Head couplers as far as appearance goes.
If you actually plan on assembling these couplers you really need to buy the $8 assembly fixture. It makes the process a breeze. Without their fixture it's really difficult as your video demonstrates. Also, a very light touch with a soft brass rotary brush instantly cleans up any flash. Since I paint my couplers rail brown and rust I don't really worry about knocking off the finish. Also, a pair of sharp tweezers is essential for loading the ball bearings. Fingers are definitely the wrong tool for that.
If you are really looking for super realism, you can modify these to work with an actual lift pin which is crazy in HO scale.
Personally I love them but recognize that they're not for everyone. With the assembly fixture, building a pile of these quickly wouldn't take much time. I think they are well worth it.
If you do any model photography they make very noticable difference.
My experience with assembling these has been pretty good, I did purchase the assembly fixture, it makes a world of difference. Don't handle the locking balls with your fingers, as your skin oils (and whatever else you may put on your hands) can interfere with the free movement of the ball. I have also found that the thicker the super glue used, the better (my preference is Loctite gel), and keep it as far away from the knuckle as possible to avoid the problems shown in the video. Sergent's website has a bunch of tips for assembly and mounting on various engines and cars.
Thanks for watching!
And thanks very much for the information!
I was looking into these but was skeptical about the product, the magnet was my hang up, over time im pretty sure that metal ball will get magnetized over time and thus it will be coupling issues, Sergent is on the right track, I love the prototypical aspects! but they need to perfect this idea , then i will convert all my roiling stock. good review!!!
Very nice work Dan! I have found when the knuckles won't close, it is often just an outlying coupler. I have a few Sergents that are fidgety and won't close unless you hold the magnet over it, but most of them will work okay if properly lubricated (with graphite) and cleaned of flash. There are a few problems with reliability, but if one was to take time to work them and get used to operating them, they will make the detailed modeler very happy (I do suggest building the couplers rather than buying them assembled if anyone is seriously considering switching over). As you noted Dan, they are not the best choice for a modeler that prefers operation and has dozens or hundreds of cars, that can be a little much. Still, despite their flaws, they make the competition winning model that much more appealing and the crazies (such as myself) may actually find them fun to operate. I find this a very fair review, I am almost surprised they scored higher than a 7!
They definitely LOOK really good. I could see having these things along with some of the newer magna-lock hoses. It would look pretty amazing, but you wouldn't want to do much switching with these couplers on your trains.
John
Instead of using fingers, use tweezers and small vyces or pin chucks
Makes small part handling less troublesome.
Despite the Prototypical operation, I will stick to Kadees ( HO and On42)
You didnt use any graphite on knuckle, rubbing a pencil on the inside of the knuckle and where the ball sits then you want have any issues of them getting stuck open or closed. I switch all of mine out, over 300 cars and locos. I've had no issues pulling 70 cars up a grade
I wish these came assembled like they used to.
Indeed but of course that would make them cost a lot more.
It's the realism of the coupler is what I like the most. I just wish they came pre assembled
hey that's me, lol jk, I know those SGT couplers are really good. but I love my McHenry couplers for N scale Modeler like me, I really do enjoy the video and great review Dan.
STG couplers only go down to HO. they still do not make any for N scale.
+TheKoups well I know that, it's only for Ho what I'm trying to say is the these two couplers are almost similar expect for the scales of course.
MH the same look at STG... I must not have a good memory because I thought MH looked more like scaled down kaydee #58.I know at one stage there was a guy that tired to make STG style in N scale but gave up because it needed more RND. I have an idea on a similar looking but better functioning version but lack the ability to make them.
Good review. My only comment would be about the build difficulty: building them the way you did in the video is definitely very finnicky and difficult. The assembly jig that Sergent Engineering sells makes assembly much less of a pain though, and I would almost call it a requirement, not because it's impossible to assemble the couplers without it, but because for only $5 its cost-to-benefit ratio is awesome. As an aside, you said that you would not use them because of the associated cost and time of retrofitting your fleet, but would you consider using them if you were starting fresh and didn't have a whole fleet to retrofit? (I'm already using them for that exact reason, but I'm just curious to get someone else's opinion.)
Agreed! using the jig makes assembly very fast and easy. On the other hand there are a few coupler types offered that Sargent Engineering dose not have jigs for. In ant case, after you familiarize yourself with the parts, create an assembly system with a rhythm and install a few, like anything else it be comes less of a challenge and easy to do. You can crank out a bunch in minutes. I made the switch from #58 Kadees and I'm very happy I did. The look and the performance is great! You can always make a transition car with a #58 on one end and a Sargent on the other. I did that until everything was converted over. Also, you won't have any problems selling off your used weathered Kadee couplers at swap meets or Ebay. People are always willing to buy them up, even if you cut the glad-hands off like me.
Great review! Even if these things were easy to assemble, it would be quite expensive and take a lot of time to convert an entire fleet. Even then, your equipment wouldn't be interoperable with your club's or your friend's, unless they had done the complete conversion, too. Seems like 58/158 Kadees put things reasonably in scale, while maintaining full compatibility with No. 5 or other similar knuckle couplers.
I thought Dan was very generous with his rating for this product.
John
Agreed. It's a tough question. On the one hand, the product seems to do what it's supposed to do and it looks good, but on the other hand, it's just so darned impractical in so many ways.
Right? I don't think I would have rated it higher than 6 or maybe 7 so it's a good thing I don't do the review. People would have been mad at me probably.
I think if they begin to come assembled from the dealer, as well as a little more reliable, they will become more mainstream. Until then, Kadee 158's are a really close match and are my go to choice for rollingstock and locos
That's what I thought... but read my comments above to Dan about my experience with the pre-built ones from the factory. Basically was a no-go.
NOM
@TSG Multimedia, you improperly assembled the coupler. Had you followed the directions, you would not have had the issues you had in this video.
Are there premade couplers out there?
They are actually somewhat compatible with kadee 153s.
I prefer to have all my locomotives and rolling stock have the Kadee no. 5
It’s also great to consider the Kadee 148 and 158 whisker couplers, they’re not as tedious to install as the 5 as they don’t have the brass centering spring
CentralJerseyRailfan I use the 148 as well as it still has the same size coupler head and some of my rolling stock actually are made for the 148, on that same note some of them can’t take it or even my engines can’t all take the whisker couplers.
James Noecker for example, Scaletrains gearboxes are too small to fit the center spring for the 5 and 58. They’re intended to be fitted with the whisker couplers
You had trouble making the couplers work try dry graphite.
Wow Dan!!! You really got the can of worms open on THIS one! 😵
I perhaps, have as much modeling experience as you and one other nameless poster... give or take.
I have never in my travels, seen such product passion - except maybe the NCE vs. Digitrax permanent debate - or Harley Davidson vs. the World!
I HAVE tried them. I think they're great. Look good, scale sized, really prototypical operations! I do agree that a jig, or at least non-magnetic pliers would make assembly easier. But then you gotta ask, just how far do I want to get into this for?
I would have rated them like you did, but with the caveat that the proper (extra cost) tools would make assembly easier....
Would I switch?? NO! Same reason. I've acquired too many pieces of rolling stock over 48 years, and have already made the sizeable investment of switching everything to Kadee #58, 158, 154, and so on, but primarily scale sized, whisker couplers.
..... I might have considered Sergent couplers before all that. It would have given me the extra entertainment of the others bitching because they actually had to line up the couplers - just like a real Brakeman!!! 😜😜
Carmine 🚂
Founder, CEO and Chief Bottle Washer, the Pacific Belt RR. Est. 1975
I can't find these anywhere. Did they go out of business?
I searched google and found it right away. Are you spelling "Sergent" correctly in your search?
tsgmultimedia yes, I did spell it correctly, when I was looking for them I found their site but it gave me a funny 401 error page. I will look again later
where and how do I buy them
I would like to see a pull test till it breaks. That should have been in the video.
I keep telling Dan we need to light one of these things on fire and push it down a track with screams and sirens but for some reason he won't do that with his models.
Twizted Mowers There is a pull test on my Sergent coupler users group on Facebook.
where can I find those couplers?
Check on Google and let us know what you find!
hello good afternoon and where you buy
Try searching Google.
these would be really nice for upclose vids showing as realistic model views as you can possibly show but... for the average modeler who has already purchased his current couplers (mainly KADEE) to jump ship???... that's a TOUGH sell
Could you buy one that's already built
Just recounting my limited experience with testing a set of Sargent couplers. I bought a set of the pre-builts, 2-pair iirc, to give them a trial and see if I'd like to do further testing of them.
I had the same or more issues with them failing to have the "pin drop" and similar issues. They required more force than you could ever apply to a single standing freight car to get them to couple.
Yes, I've heard the stories about needing to do all the micro cleaning, etc to get them to work freely, but as a test I spent over 30 minutes playing with, lubricating with pencil graphite as recommended on the instructions, and tinkering with them to no avail. :/ I reached about the same conclusion as Dan, that while really cool... they're not going to work out well on an operational model railroad where gentile couplings, etc and operations with passenger diaphragms are required.
NOM
Always enjoy good reviews that are informative Dan.
NOM
I've been using these couplers for years. To build standard type E couplers you really need the jig. They are then not hard to build at all. Most of the problems you were having with them in the video are due to not following the instructions while building them.
Daniel Cortopassi I've built well over 100 Sergent couplers of all varieties including the investment cast ones. I've had four with problems, three were die cast type E where I screwed something up and one was an investment cast double shelf type E with a casting issue. The couplers also don't take that amount of force to couple. I still stand by my comment of an assembly problem.
Also, they aren't 100% compatible but you can couple them to scale sized Kadee and compatible couplers. It's ugly but sort of works.
I have a Sergent users group on Facebook where people post pictures and suggestions on how to build and use these couplers.
Daniel Cortopassi Ok, maybe I came across a little strong. In the instructions is says to NEVER touch the ball with your fingers. Oil gets on the ball and causes it to stick in the coupler. There is a bit more to the break in procedure than just opening and closing three or four times. Also the instructions mention lunging the coupler with graphite. I use a sharpened #2 pencil. One part of the instructions I don't agree with is using the toothpick. It's usually not strong enough to clean out any flash or chemical residue that may be in the hole. Someone on my Facebook group showed some small Dremel ball bit they use by hand. I use a thin cylindrical diamond grinding bit that I bought at Harbor Freight. It is slightly smaller than the hole and I twirl it by hand. I don't know why you had such trouble with the Sergent couplers. The blackened ones generally have worked better for me than the older ones that were rust colored using Cromium 6.
Also, my skill set us nothing to sneeze at either. I've been building and kit bashing models for over forty years. I also do a lot of DCC sound installations, even running a small business for a few years called Northstar DCC. One of my major projects was building a small DCC and signal equipped layout for Dakota County Technical College. I just finished adding sound and rewiring the lights in a Kato N scale GS-4 for my son.
Your comment was a bit strong. I suspected it came out the wrong way because your comments on other videos are not like that. It seems to me that the inherent difficulty due to the minuscule size of the parts in the assembly process for these things is a major drawback. The tips you have suggested requiring special tools and such in order to assemble and make them work better might be worth the trouble if someone is going to swap a large fleet of cars, but it also underscores the fussiness of the process. I think 9/10 was an exceptionally generous rating for something this inconvenient.
tsgmultimedia I am swapping out couplers on a large fleet so I did buy both of the jigs for the Type E couplers, plus a couple of non magnetic stainless steel tweezers.
If you want to try something really fussy, build some Type F or Type H. There are no assembly jigs for those. I'm considering making some type of jigs for those using my mini mill. I already did make a fixture out of aluminum using my mill so I could drill holes in the tops of Type F for a tiny lift ring. I built some Southern and BN power and those two railroads used Type F couplers on their locomotives.
Thanx, but no thanx, I'll keep my Kadee's. It looks like they hired a out of work BMW engineer to design them, and like a BMW, they only work some of the time and cost as much as a BMW.
If these look like a BMW your Kadee’s look like a hot wheels car...
Why would they not ship these assembled?
You can get them that way (or could at one point) but the price was a lot higher than the non-assembled ones.
because its a HOBBY.....I used to enjoy model railroading till all this RTR stuff hit the shelves
Just wait until you're 62 years-old, stud. This shit would make me blind.
im catching up to you!!! LOL!!!
and take a spike off also if you cant use them with other brands of couplers ,, to much work and like you said all or nothing ,,
The 58’s are all I need.
Considering you didn't read or follow the instructions and you chose to not use the tools offered by the manufacturer, it's easy to understand your difficulties and distaste for this product. That said, WHY would any manufacturer want you to do a review of their product??
I wouldnt use those if you gave them to me for free
I'll stick with my kadee's
No thank you I’ll stick to Kadee #58s
nice review with real facts. i suscribe to see goods review thank you...so dont defraud me and be corupted by some company... xD
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tsgmultimedia hahaha.... you know if ExactRail will make locomotive with highdetails?
Don't know. I know it has been suggested to them, but don't know if they will do it. Even just rolling stock is a huge project. I can only imagine how much more complex a locomotive is.
ok thank you.
Good review but no thanks, I'll stick with the KDs.
Kevin Durant?
...or you can just buy kadee couplers that require almost no assembly, work great, and look scale all since 1946.🙂
Too much trouble.
You burnished the wrong holel!
I guess you're right he did burnish out the wrong hole
KD is the best and all others are just incomplete copies...
What is it? You mean Kadee?
@@tsgmultimedia You knew what I meant...That's all that counts...