Arguing God from Being | Episode 807 | Closer To Truth
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 21 ส.ค. 2024
- I'm obsessed by raw existence, which science can never explain. Does this mean that there is a God? I wish it were that simple. Yet some claim that a 'Most Perfect Being' must exist. Featuring interviews with Peter van Inwagen, Alister McGrath, Seyyed Nasr, Michael Tooley, and Alvin Plantinga.
Season 8, Episode 7 - #CloserToTruth
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Closer To Truth host Robert Lawrence Kuhn takes viewers on an intriguing global journey into cutting-edge labs, magnificent libraries, hidden gardens, and revered sanctuaries in order to discover state-of-the-art ideas and make them real and relevant.
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Closer to Truth presents the world’s greatest thinkers exploring humanity’s deepest questions. Discover fundamental issues of existence. Engage new and diverse ways of thinking. Appreciate intense debates. Share your own opinions. Seek your own answers.
#God #Philosophy
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A great sage once said that one who seeks after God is like a man who, armed with a torch, goes in search of fire.
I also heard a great sage once say 'hey pass me that bong"
@@redpillpusherbong?
God is life....as you breath, you exist. When you consciousness reveal his existence, you find God. It's not a superpower, it's not a hierarchical finding. It's the capacity of love. Sadly, the humanity had lost all conexión, in a hámster jail, running in the wheel of apparence. We have, even forget our own existence to be a big compendium of stickers remainder of our passage on Earth before the eyes of others..
It seems to me you use god as a metaphor.
At this point I’m convinced that Kuhn will never engage the formal arguments of Feser, Kerr, Rasmussen, etc. Even if he interviews them (what’s the hold up?) he likely still won’t engage on an academic level. He repeats the usual cliched arguments without going deeper.
He did the same thing in his pursuit of afterlife arguments (eg his interview with Braude didn’t discuss a single case but kept the conversation very abstract despite Braude discussing many cases in detail in his published work).
Kuhn is a smart guy, but he usually fails to go very deep into arguments/evidence for certain positions, not because the arguments are obviously bad (they’re not), but because... well, I’m not sure. It’s a shame.
Isn't this a somewhat old episode? Kuhn mentions a book he's working on but I believe that book came out in 2013.
Hi John!
That just reinforces my concerns, because Kuhn *still* hasn’t taken the steps to go deeper. Have you read Feser’s review of Kuhn’s book?
Don’t get me wrong; Kuhn is very intelligent and curious, but he often presents himself as someone who’s looked at and dealt with all the relevant literature, and yet he still (to this day) raises objections and questions that he’d know the answers to if he were as knowledgeable as he insinuates.
Kuhn rightly mocks the anselmian onto argument, but he shows little awareness of Rasmussen and Pruss’s modal contingency arguments (no, I don’t mean Plantinga’s modal onto; the modal contingency arguments are different); or Feser’s version of the arguments from potential-actualization, abstract realism, or PSR (Feser’s PSR chapter in “Five Proofs” is probably the most persuasive discussion on the topic); etc.
Kuhn mocked Braude’s views without asking for the details on a single case. He came across as either smugly closed minded or afraid of the research. I would bet ten paychecks that Kuhn wouldn’t be able to comment on the kakie sittings, the GP sittings, the recent replicated (albeit way less impressive) triple blind studies, etc. Kuhn probably doesn’t even know the names Alan Gauld, Michael Sudduth, etc... although the Braude work alone is worth discussion in detail-the actual cases therein, and not merely in fuzzy abstract terms.
I like Kuhn. A lot. But he seems to deliberately shy away from the strongest arguments for certain positions he seems predisposed to rejecting.
@@TheProdigalMeowMeowMeowReturns Hi there... yes... you would think by now Mr Kuhn would have come to some decisions regarding beliefs, especially a belief in a god. He seems very intelligent and highly educated.
I myself am not familiar with those names you mention. I have to look up info on those names you mention. Have you read any of Kuhn's books? To be honest, I'm not sure now if I have a desire to read his books.
You'll have to give me a break because I know very little about those arguments that you mention. Are you in philosophy or academia? What books do you recommend?
You know, I kind of agree with you, there are topics that really need to be discussed moore indeptly for sure, but he kind of just shrugs them off for whatever reason. Sometimes I think he is not an agnostic at all, but a believer who loves to have conversation. There just is no way he can come so close to what seem like conclusions and them end, or move laterally in the discussion.
Consciousness is the ultimate reality , physicalism is baloney .
Lately I've been watching some TH-cam videos by Bernardo Kastrup. I don't understand it all but his views are quite interesting. He talks a lot about consciousness.
lol. Except there's no evidence for consciousness without the physical.
Consider that absolute ground of Being. That factual existential ground doesn't have to be called "God." In fact, man's conceptions of "God" are likely too limited. Yet, the mystics of all traditions and times speak of a profound personal presence with this Ground of Being. I have known that greatest human moment. After this, there can be no argument. It just Is.
Dear Robert Lawrence Kuhn ...I looked through, I think, all the video's and there's one question I'd like for you to do an episode on. And that is: Is Morality Moot If There Is A God From Which All Things Originate.
A video on the existence of morality and whether it is something that would/could exist without religion, and what that would look like, is a video I'd watch.
KY Mountain Man I think thats a somewhat separate question but would be another interesting angle.
The Creator is not created. We live in a creating universe; not a created one.
More we know about universe and physical reality, less we know about God. It's the same all around the universe, we just don't know it yet because distances are so impossible to cross and stuff is so different we might never find a common language and a way to coexist.
Speak for yourself. 🙂
@@jamessmith989 I always do, because i am who i am.
"When sophisticated theologians talk about god, one quickly finds oneself wandering around in a rhetorical fog in which god becomes a constantly shape-shifting entity described by metaphors whose meanings are always just beyond one’s grasp. One has to struggle to understand what they are talking about because what these sophisticated thinkers imagine to be god is so far removed from what any ordinary person thinks that I have long suspected that they are actually atheists struggling to find a way to salvage belief in something transcendental that would not be seen as manifestly anti-science or otherwise ridiculous in the circle of intellectuals amongst whom they move."
- Mano Singham
Spot on. The more they talk about god the more it becomes a metaphor like it is only metaphorically true but literally false.
This episode would have been properly served it it Robert interviewed some of the scholastic philosophers such as Ed Feser, Gaven Kerr etc
This is truly the very best channel on TH-cam, and that IS the truth. I think this may have been the best episode of this series. This fellow really makes you think, and expand your thought process. And challenge your beliefs. Great stuff!!!
The question of God's existence is a none question.
The real question of God is:
Why is he terrible?
There are many people who have nothing, who endured so much of life's hardship and tragedies, and yet they end up realizing the true meaning of their existence. Instead of bitterness, they are thankful; instead of sadness, they are happy; instead of desperation they are hopeful, instead of greed, they keep giving.
They become who they truly are--a light in this darkness. And they are spreading their light wherever they can, whatever hardship comes along there way. They realized their purest selves--like God. Light is only revealed in the darkness.
@@123pripri
Good prose.
Good message.
5starsfromme.
Hey robert, how about you interview som hindu philosophers. They can offer fresher perspective.
what a brilliant idea for a series. asking questions for which humans have an endless well of opinions, misconceptions, preconceptions based on bias, fallacious reasoning and at times just pure ignorance and ludicrousness based on superstition.
I get what Nassar was saying but, that leaves God wanting something to give being to God.
If, by being, given being by something else (observing) the being.
If God is eternal, who or what observed God into existence?
God is when you feel you are content... God is work... we name the unexplained with God as we think when we reach to the limit of thinking that it's God's miracle... actually we are limited in our 3 dimensions and have the limitations not to go beyond it to seek for answers...
Gary Jules summed up this video back in the 80s. "I think it's kind of funny, I think it's kind of sad... when people run in circles it's a very, very mad world".
reddit moment
Thank you for this completely serious, very helpful, and not at all ridiculous contribution to the conversation.
Hi Jamie,
It appears that you replied to me, but I cannot seem to view the reply.
No, I don’t think a pop song about something else entirely is an adequate reply to or description of the content of this channel.
And, I don’t think that is merely a result of my intellectual shortcomings (however prevalent they may be).
@@joshheter1517 anytime my man, but you know that you can't be serious when you're watching a circus act, right? Sic God on me if you think I'm wrong, I dare you 😘
@@joshheter1517 hey its your funeral my man. Tears for Fears would agree.
People have their reality distorted by all temporal objects and events that have been perfectly articulated outside of space and time sustaining linear time and the absolute
The problem with "greatest possible" and "all possible worlds" comes with people's assumptions that they know what is possible. If one relies on logic, then agnosticism is the only logical stance. Belief in God (as opposed to religious affiliation) stems from subjective experiences, not from words.
I like your observations. Very interesting. You said belief in God does not stem from words. How do you view our subjective experience of reading words, for example, from a book such as the Bible?
John, it depends. People can have peak experiences from all manner of stimuli - natural phenomena, patting animals, playing music, meditating, drugs, love, sport, whatever. People from all religions have reported having peak experiences after reading whatever text they consider holy.
IMO experience is what matters in this arena rather than the manner in which it has been induced.
@@AlmostEthical Thanks. I agree with your statements 100%. What makes me wonder though, can some types of objective things ( words ) induce subjective experiences ( a "peak experience" ) which leads one to awareness of other objective things? Or is it all "subjective" after that "peak experience" occurs?
@@johnbrzykcy3076 I don't know. During a peak experience one can have a sense of "dimensions" (not as per scientific definitions) of consciousness. It can seem as if our human and animal consciousnesses emanate from a larger, less particular consciousness, a bit like how our microbial communities are agents of us. How "true" that impression may be or not, I can't say.
Perfect life vision
Heart mind SOUL.
The universe doesn’t have to be here, therefore no creation. Because if the universe wasn’t created, if it’s “just here,” then what’s the point of asking about something from nothing? Things that are “just here” don’t need something and is meaningless. The universe was created. Time has a beginning. If so, the notion of purpose has meaning: Why did things begin? What is the point of there being anything and not just leaving nothing alone? We are the special human beings with many humanity's special questions yet to be discovered and resolving the fundamental issues of existence. The first question to be faced is whether there is such a thing as a specific problem of human existence. There are problems of survival, of security, of procreation and of power. These are challenges of living on Earth and as far as anyone knows, Earth is the only habitable planet in the universe. It could be the last habitable planet and we must be ready by then to escape effectively safe and sustain in novel space technology and environment. We should find some way to live away from this planet, to build space stations and deep understanding of how gravity could help us floating and travel or orbit effectively in space environment with safety and healthy livelihood. We have to create our own living into space and beyond within the universe as the intelligent creature ever existed? All the planets are not habitable any more as discovered recently by humanity through their research and exploration. However, by learning from the discovery of the other planets being inhabitable but billion of years ago were habitable. Likely our future to be the same, soon?
Theology... never have so many spent so much time thinking about so much... and achieved so little to show for it.
One of the lines in the opening comments validates a claim I have made my entire life, in regards to science "fiction" and "fantasy".
I say, "if it can be conceived, it is real on some level."
The world is just a barrel organ turned by the lord God himself...and whos tune we all have to dance to.
Why must there be “nonexistence”?
Muslim dude was brilliant!
Church separate u from GOd to idols,even God said don't pray to me in any idols.God is within all( the spirit)we create in his image.we have the power of his mind to bring fort anything we want.the argument here is that there is no God or there is.Even God himself doesn't want you to know he exist,he want to stand back. Outhere somewhere in this universe and watch how powerful u are if u act within or without him.
One name... ED FESER. Seriously, if you are going to keep talking about God's existence, invite Ed Feser... He has some sound arguments for God's existence. Aquinas 5 ways are still the strongest arguments for God.
@4:13 when philosophers lose their rational mind and "fake it till you make it"
This might not be an accurate summation of Van Inwagen’s point.
Embarrassing...
God the father is timeless.
Therefore he is neither old, nor young.
Jesus the son, however, is dated, and perhaps the old man.
The ancient of days.
Since beings experience, might help to argue God from being using experience.
A supremely perfect being would be a being who is absolute and perfect in power, wealth, fame, knowledge, beauty, and renunciation, so everything, all of reality, would just be an aspect of this supremely perfect being. So God is everything and simultaneously different from everything.
Existence certainly enables us to elicit truth.
I can conceive of a being greater than God, therefore that being must exist - according to the model ontological argument. (I don't see how these philosophical gymnastics are solving anything. They are just trying to justify what they want to believe)
you can't coherently concieve of something greater than that which there is no greater
The Set of all sets has no questions, no needs, no wants...ditto!
Any sub-set who has them, even if a demi-God, is imperfect and falls in the same fractal pattern that all minds smaller and larger fall upon, troubleshooting, problem solving, strive to revert entropy within their domain of computation.
Argument from being is nothing more than a sophisticated argument from ignorance, "We can't understand or explain it" therefore it must be a god.
I don’t hear atheists state how time and space started then, coming from nothing is bs including quantum particles, because you will always have the question what came before everything, only God can be the answer
Bertrand Russel came close to buying a version of the ontological argument once.
But it took too much humility.
Didn't Russell have a deathbed conversion?
Ants arguing about the existence of humans... oldest human negative trait: Hubris.
These arguments do nothing for me, what if god is perfectly evil and just giving us hope every now and then which makes it more excruciating for us. Maybe letting arseholes rule the world is part of his plan and us fighting against suffering and unfairness amuses God? It makes as much sense as the perfectly good argument and as stated if God is the perfect being then doesn't he have to be perfectly evil and good at the same time? You can twist and turn as much as you want but these arguments always come across as someone trying their hardest to prove an unprovable case because they want it to be true. Does my head in sometimes so it pays to not take any of it too seriously.
The god/s who made this Universe is/are not exactly good.
I agree this argument is meaningless
" a perfectly evil being" is contradictory because evil is a privation, a failure to fulfil some moral standard. But, perfection is the opposite; it is the fulfilment of some end to be more completed and actual. So, something that it perfect, cannot be evil.
Millions of people abuse and hate others in the name of God, therefore God exists. He is just crazy.
ontologocal probabilistic argument: if G is such that Prob(G)>0 then it must be that Prob(G)=1. What is G?
thank Gosh there was no Daniel Dennet. Finally a good show with thinking people.
Hhh 😂 does it hurt does well hearing the harsh reality kinda sucks for you
Why does anyone believe in God? Answer because they look at creation and do not know how anything came into being? The truth is "we do not know"? So what usually happens is that people choose to believe something. You can't know what you choose to believe is true because the reason you believe is because "you don't know". Also, believers rarely investigate all the different gods humans have. People usually believe what their societies believe. Look at all the people getting solace from something that is basically a fairy tale. Actually what has happened is this, in not knowing humans have invented explanations and not everyones explanation is the same so there is disagreement even wars over invented beliefs. Belief is a clear example of a delusional species. We are a species that has killed over a billion people in wars, where hundreds of millions have died from starvation, where we poison the air we breathe, where we destroy the environment that sustains us, for money. We lower ourselves pursuing money so we can feel important, important to people we think down on. This is the nonsense of morons. We are not a viable species and all this discussing is ignoring the simple truth that we are too arrogant to accept. We simply "do not know"! We have some talented people that have given us technologies that our stupidity has turned into weapons of destruction allowing us to kill each other or perhaps all of us for the simple reason of ignoring the basic truth of our existence, "We do not know"". Can anyone that is even partially sane think that the state of life on our planet is the outcome of intelligence? Yes there are people that are not caught up in this avalanche of ignorance, however they should be screaming "full stop" we don't know what we are doing. It is very unlikely that people will wake up and we will all go the way of the Billions people already killed, by virtue of stupidity. Remember what Einstein said. “Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe.” My god wake up!
God cannot be realized by arguments
We need to experience with practice. Meditation is a good option
Certainly not from illogical arguments. This whole show exposes how philosophy is a joke, not just religion
You mean if I sit quietly in a quiet place god will introduce itself.
@@andrebrown8969 Perhaps he meant if you seat very quietly and not think about anything, he might not notice you.
@@xspotbox4400 It is the thinking part ahhhh
@@andrebrown8969 yes the source of thoughts is God
You say, "either God exists because it must, or God does not exist because by necessity there can be no God". But like our friend Hossien says about Neoplatonism, God is beyond being. If we assume the latter conclusion, we are led quickly back to the necessity that something must have the quality of what we think of as ultimate reality in order for contingent reality to be. Like Robert I really don't buy that God can be personal, good, caring, just, etc.
Could we possibly be spared the usual internet debates on 'God' here and actually engage with the philosophical argument being presented here? If the ontological argument is to be refuted it has to be refuted on the basis of logic because it is a philosophical argument. Bertrand Russell was generous enough to engage with it and thought it credible enough to be engaged with as a philosophical argument and none of us approach his abilities.
@@Graewulfe Thanks
O would love to know true greatness in this mad universe, must be something ridiculously insane.
Gods always seem to be no-shows.
@Closer To Truth;
First of all, you should stop begging the question. Existence is not a choice. If "The Greatest Possible Being" must exist by Necessity in all possible worlds,... Does this means that the "Greatest Possible Being" (aka. God) *doesn't have a Choice* but to Exist? Therefore,_ *A Being which Can Not Choose* but to Exist, it is Not the Greatest Possible being, and therefore; Such a being Can Not Exists. AND FOR THE RECORD,... I AM NOT arguing against the existence of a/or God/s, I'm simply pointing out a flaw I find in this argument.
When the muslim philosopher was talking I could read in Robert's eyes the statement "What a nice word salad" lol
I thought that dude was excellent! And Kuhn looked very engaged.
The opening lines; "I'm obsessed by raw existence which science can never explain" smacks of the argument from ignorance (God of the gaps)
It’s more science of the gaps.
@@onestepaway3232 That's a nonsensical reply. I'm not sure if you thought about what you were replying. It seems you merely replied for the sake of replying
AndreH I think you need to educate yourself on what science of the gaps is.
Essentially, It is the limits of science, which is the study of physical reality.
To be or not to be is not a scientific question.
@@onestepaway3232 I understand it perfectly well. You have used it out of context of this video. The context is; since science can't explain it therefore God did it. Unless it's the personal incredulity fallacy. Oh, I don't know! therefore it must be some invisible deity
AndreH he never said that. He simply said science cannot answer the reality of existence, which is true.
Why, because it is not a scientific question. There are many questions to life science cannot answer. That is why we have philosophy to work through those questions with logic and reason which God has blessed us with
Anselm, still have the best formulation of the Ontological argument. If God just existed in the mind alone, and not, in reality, you would happen to be talking, not about God, but something different altogether. Existence is perfection, and a perfect being, could not fail to have it. This secondary, Cartesian version, is quite good too.
"Existence is perfection" - empty words.
Ale martinez Rojas: do you see or discern the distinction of these two premises 1_God exists 2_God is great....
so harmony. thank you for wisdom. iam that i am. i am whole. i am spirit havibg a human experience ✨ 🙏🙏🙏 love and joy to the world 🌎
There are questions you can ask that on the surface sound profound, but underneath are meaningless. Similar to asking the questions what is 0/0? It is just not a good question. This is the trap philosophers spend their careers inside of.
... You mean paradox.
Yeah yeah bro say that if you calms you down
Actually 0 is the only number that can be divided by 0, it's just not well defined problem, but not a nonsense either.
The problem of philosophy is that you can make up anything you want (as long as it is logically consistent with your premises) and there is no objective criteria to tell apart "good" philosophy from "bad" philosophy (other than personal taste).
@@ferdinandkraft857 there are sound arguments for God's existence. But there are not sound arguments against God's existence.
I think it's true that logically, SOMETHING must have always existed, which is compatible with every scientific cosmological model, including the view that OUR universe is the only one and it 'began' with the big bang, because if that view is correct and our universe is all that exists, then even if it's finite in age (say 13.7 billion years old as we measured time, whatever THAT is), there was literally NOTHING before it and there's NOTHING after it so it still ALWAYS existed.
missing words incomplete idea
I'm NOT catholic nor religious, atheist neither, I'm in the exact position of Dr Khun, but i can say that the first man is really "ignorant" repeating Descartes'quote of the existence of god, just saying that existence is a maximum good perfect value or similar..... It doesn't make sense, cause it is a pre-configured concept, a priori, wrong of course
Here's where ontological argument fails, if i can imagine a perfect being, there must be something greater than me. But if this is God, than there can be many more gods and God is no special.
You obviously are misunderstanding the argument. Moreover your own argument makes no sense
All those gods would have the exact same properties so due to the principle of indiscernibility of identicals they would be one being only, hence one God.
@@Jemoh66 Think again, argument doesn't need to apply to a single ideal.
@@astrol4b Yes, this is what i say, he is them.
@@xspotbox4400 no you said something completely different, you say that there could be many different things, I say that if two things have the exact same properties they are actually one thing only.
"It's ludicrous to try to prove that God exists with subtle definitions of perfection and necessity. It's not a matter of logic." I really like that statement. Those definitions may seem clever to some, but a waste of time to others.
@activelink activdisc atheism is not very common since 90% of people throughout history and even now are religious, most of them monotheists. Neither it is sense, since you can`t verify God`s non-existence with your senses.
But you`re right not every religion is right. Only one can be true.
@activelink activdisc Thanks for sharing your observations. I do think one possible pointer to the true God is a god who loves his creation and knows what love is because He lives in a relationship of love called "father, son and holy spirit." I do respect other religions and worldviews.
@@McRingil and which religion is that.
The one you are born into or the one you convert to
@@kootdirker2448 the one which is true
@@McRingil Atheism is very ancient (ancient indian and greek schools of thought) but unfortunately it has always been oppressed. Another important fact is that the majority of intellectuals (scientists, philosophers) are atheists. I wouldn't appeal to common people because common people believe all sorts of bs.
If you're interested in God and being, you should really talk to an onto-theologian like William Vallicella, or a Thomist like Edward Feser.
Fully just and fully merciful. Hmmm....
fully bullshit 🤣
How's that ???? PDG = Pretty Darn Good
God is beyond existence or not existence because ultimately there is no such a thing like existence. Existence is a dualistic idea related to nothingness . No nothingness no existence. No right no left, no above no below. Just concepts in the mind
Kudos -- 444 Gematria -- 🗽
Why would God want something from us, I can only come to the conclusion that if there is something that is god, we are just its plaything
There are many people who have nothing, who endured so much of life's hardship and tragedies, and yet they end up realizing the true meaning of their existence. Instead of bitterness, they are thankful; instead of sadness, they are happy; instead of desperation they are hopeful, instead of greed, they keep giving.
They become who they truly are--a light in this darkness. And they are spreading their light wherever they can, whatever hardship comes along there way. They realized their purest selves--like God. Light is only revealed in the darkness, and a candle may never know it's self if it is under the Sun.
One idea is that if God gave us free will, this creates a limitation for God. True omnipotence is to have such power that one can even limit unlimited power. A good example is with free will. God cannot do whatever God wants if we truly possess free will. God has to get permission from us to act, and even then, it has to coincide with every other variable, such ad another's will to do, which may desire an opposing force to the desire which was from the individual who willed for God to act in their life. This would make us incredibly valuable to God, as free willing agents would be one of the only vastly rewarding limiters to have. And if there were a goal such as desiring these free agents to willfully come into harmony with God, that would also be very rewarding.
@Closer to Truth - Not 'a' God but just God. God is ubiquitous essence. ISness simply IS. It requires no attribution or verification.
even the greeks and egyptians recognized that their pantheons were all different aspects of the same one being. all separation is illusion...
That's why theists often accuse other theists of adoring false gods....
🤦♀️
@@alexsclewis Agreed. It can be a scary thing, on a certain level, to more acutely experience the 'blended Oneness' without your ego.
God is but an idea formed from the mind .there is no such thing as an invisible entity that cares about anything as reality in all its ways has proven...there is imagination there is focused intention .the mind is like a mirror can only reflect back what is put in front of it being good bad negative positive..therefore what you entertain in mind sends out and receives back that which is in your thought. The saying I hope you are feeling well should be I hope your thinking well. Your mind follows the belief you entertain and it could not be any other way.
@@stephenpack2202 And where did your mind come from? God is a strange loop, an oxymoron. How do you know what is visible without the invisible? No, there are many feelings I have which are not thoughts. The connection to the presence is a feeling, not a thought. Belief? That's just ego talk.
Go for science and technology movies (with the issues discussed here) production as well
Must add another comment as a post deist. If we can imagine God, we should build him since it's such a good idea.
Ontological argument never took creation of an artificial divinity into account. If we can devise a perfect apparatus, than ontological reasoning is false, but it might hold true for artificial God since nothing better than him can be constructed. But he will know something better than him must exist or it would simply be dumb and therefore he could only create something worst than God.
That "because obviously ..." moment is hard for me to take at face value.
The almighty God CANNOT EXIST here NOW for a logical reason. It is generally accepted that God has a perfect knowledge of the future. However, this has as a consequence that He would know HIS OWN FUTURE too, "embedded" in the general future and would thus be OBLIGED to make that future true. This is not really a problem for important actions that have been decided by Him beforehand. The problem is that He would also BE OBLIGED to take EXACTLY any other IRRELEVANT action of his written future: this would kill his freedom. For instance, He knows that tomorrow at 15h23'33'' He will raise his left arm. Tomorrow at that time He will be obliged to raise his arm, without any delay, not even a second. Of course God cannot accept that. (God is in the past instead).
You ever heard that God is immaterial? That`s for a reason monotheists hold that. Immaterial, meaning has no parts, doesn`t depend on spacetime in modern jargon. If He is perfect, He must be an uncondtioned reality, can`t be dependent even on the flow of time or the spatial arrangement of his body. Bravo, you discovered that God is immaterial. Along with Aristotle, Plotinus and Aquinas. You`re in good company.
@@McRingil 1. Yes, of course He is immaterial, (almost anyone knows that): He created matter. I gave the example above just to easily give an immediate idea (He could maybe show Himself in an human form). But the same principle perfectly holds even when He is immaterial and He must take actions in our world, you can imagine your own example. (Of course He has no body, no spatial arrangements of it.)
2. He is not in our spacetime continuum, I never stated that. He is situated in a past BEFORE our spacetime continuum was created by Him, He never entered it.
3. Don't agree, He is dependent on time: HIS OWN TIME. There was a time when He needed to make decisions and AFTER that there was no need to do it anymore. No FLOW of time, but still a succession of events: AFTER making a decision, that work was not needed anymore. In other words things DID CHANGE in God's life.
@@claudiozanella256 you stumbled upon a very old line of reasoning which was a matter of discussion among philosophers. here`s Aquinas` take on it:
www.newadvent.org/summa/1009.htm
Requires some background in act and potency distinction, which is Aristotle`s analysis of how objects change
@@claudiozanella256 also the next question is very relevant
www.newadvent.org/summa/1010.htm#article4
and this:
www.newadvent.org/summa/1105.htm
basically it is possible to bring out certain effects (especially, create something ex nihilo) without changing
Space is the act of creator having infinite big bangs and infinite possibilities to give perfect self created power. Our eyes and memory warp events and time and space because no linear evolutionary recorded information is timeless existing always. All memory and recorded information is temporal
"space is the act of a creator..." well there's the claim now provide sufficient evidence.
I am God you are God we are....
When are these episodes filmed like What date?
Human beings have a fascinating imagination... I think its a loop, existence just exists. The only other way I could look at it is , a dimension that is not part of the observable universe? Well, WTF is that? 🙂
Epistemology & ontology is all you need to cure your indoctrination whatever it may be.
I would say metaphysics in general and epistemology, but yes I agree.
If I believe in a god eating penguin does mean it exists??? Just because u want a god eating penguin doesn’t show the reality of its existence
Schrodinger's cat
If you want to see more take psychedelics. Dont block yourself off from all that there is. Talk to someone about it..
The divine nature and character of humanity is in self-correction. Artificial intelligence is programming. Statutes and judgments program the public behavior to the CORPORATE will. CORPORATE artificial.
These Atheist vs. Fundamentalist arguments are becoming inane, It smacks of politics. Both have very limited credibility. Dr. Kuhn has on occasion taken very, very brief dives into eastern philosophy. I think Lao Tzu said it best when he said "The Dao is unfathomable". The only question should be, "Is there something we cannot yet understand"? The answer is obvious.
The word "something" itself can mean a thing that is unspecified or unknown. Until that "something" becomes specified or known, understanding is impossible.
@@johnbrzykcy3076 Why this insatiable need to know, when there is no data to base a decision on? Learning goes on forever.
@@paulweston2267 Well.. I think it's part of humanity although many people don't seem to have that "insatiable need to know." I agree with you 100% that "learning goes on forever." Well... at least during our earthly life.
@@johnbrzykcy3076 There is magic in the words "I do not know". It allows one to sit back and observe the cosmos as it goes by. Even Einstein believed in the God of Spinoza.
@@paulweston2267 I agree with you 100%. I think we need to be more open to the philosophical reality of "I do not know." Thanks for sharing.
Interesting clip.. anyone looking for a concrete view should read the book The Human Self and Allah by G A Parwez. Very revealing and life changing discussion.. its non religious.
Because the human mind has evolved to be as creative as it is, was as a consequence of our ability to survive in a very dangerous world of hunting and being hunted. If it didn't develop that ability I would not be here to discuss this. That we can mentally create many things from unrelated objects like a pedestrian sky bridge with linked ladders, doesn't mean that this imaginary bridge could ever be built or actually function as a pedestrian bridge, just like Dali's dissolving clock exists as a part of the painting "The Persistence of Memory", but it can never function as an actual clock.
We are dissatisfied with our lives cannot understand the physics of the cosmos and global climate patterns and so we look for reasons why we fail. Blame the Gods! Taraa!!!
And at the same time, make a business out of it! Refer to the history of world religions from Egyptian Pharaohs, Delphic Oracles, gold-clad Hindu temples, the Vatican City and American televangelists.
Complex arguments and propositions of existence are of no use when being charged by an African buffalo or infected with a CORONA virus. Nor will praying to whichever "god" is your choice du jour, save your life.
I like your observations. I am dissatisfied with my life ( for various reasons ) but I try to not blame God for my failures. I have to take some responsibility for my own behaviors.
@@johnbrzykcy3076
But why should a human-constructed concept of "god" even enter into the equation? There are many other highly intelligent animals in nature like octopi, dolphins and orangutans; when they are attacked or threatened by other predators, do they invent a "god" to blame for their misfortune or offer a way out of the situation?
Here's an old poem of mine that adresses it:
Tired and Retired Gods.
Is there some run-down terminus in a corner of the universe where old forgotten gods sit;
Nursing their cups of mead and goblets of ambrosia while wondering what happened to their fame?
Do they wait, midst rusting swords and unstrung bows, alert to any intrusion…
Perhaps a message from their agents in the solid world.
"Hey! Brush off your robes! Freshen your makeup! It looks like we may have a gig!”
Only to be let down once more.
Do Zeus, Ra, Mantis, Jupiter, Ishtar, Thor, Xmucane and Xpiacoc, slouched in a paint-flaking diner, dream of the old days as they disconsolately push their plates of half-eaten wild boar and peacock eggs around, to deep sighs and glances into the far distance,
Sifting through memories of ancient glories,
when they were called on from battlefields, hunts, thrones and death beds to intervene in destiny's unwavering passage.
Or have they dissolved into nano-particles of still vibrating energy drifting through the cosmos in iridescent misty clouds, eternally waiting for the achingly intense cry which, as it pierces the dreaming essence, magnetically coalesces it all once more into the blinding magnificence of former glory?
Oh God! Help me!
@@robertdevos7 Wow... you are talented with ideas and words. I used to write poems myself but they were pretty simple ones.
Anyhow... I still battle with the idea that all concepts of "god" are human constructed. You mention animals but, unlike humans, they don't seem to have any underlying concept of a god. So does that make humans special? Do our concepts of blame or guilt point to a thing that is yet unspecified?
@@johnbrzykcy3076 We like to think we are "special" ... it gives us an excuse to do whatever we want. Blame the Bible ... Genesis 1:26 "Then God said, “Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness; let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over the cattle, over all the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth.”
This is the "God" that people use as a reason to kill other people, cattle, chickens etc etc to keep the braindead in fast food.
@@robertdevos7 I sort of agree with some of your comments. But when you mention "This is the 'God' that people use...." it brings to mind the idea that "mankind is fallen." I think we were created as special humans but somehow we turned away from God and we wanted to do "our own thing."
Why u give these people the time of day is beyond reason!
This series goes round and round and gets nowhere
Then stop watching
The parts of the series that are about proving an invisible magical god-daddy-friend exists are doomed to run in circles forever. That's theology for you. Theology = fallacy spouting.
Kinda the point. The show must go on.
@@Ploskkky You can see a circular design in most if not all of creation. That's why the atheist keeps dividing 0. 🙂
A great deal of this series is very good and thought-provoking. When Dr Kuhn gets to the "woo" in religious philosophy, it indeed goes in circles.
We are told in The Bible that our wisdom is foolishness to God. Even from a Christian perspective, if we try to rationalize and justify God's existence with our own logic, we will fall short. It's like Jesus said, "if you don't believe in me for what I'm saying, believe for the works." Man has tried to say that Jesus is not historical; why do they spend so much time and why should it matter to them? It is simply to win a point? That puts the argument in the realm of a human construct. If they were truly searching for the truth they would have to look outside of their own ideas. But humans are stubborn and once the mind has decided it is correct, almost no persuasion is enough. Accepting That Jesus is The redeemer is a personal choice that each must make in their own heart.
@DOC TOR th-cam.com/video/OYHHIBIZF8o/w-d-xo.html
you don't dare to watch this whole vid..
'Nothing' would not have conceived of something. Without a mind behind it, there would be no reason for any existence.
being is inherently tripartite, as has been recognized around the world since ancient times. cmon guys.
iasos.com/metaphys/bashar/
Theological masturbation is so funny.
GOD is the ultimate reality . GOD is always there for us, I think ''GOD" had created a system for us in which he cannot intervene directly otherwise this system he created will collapse. Sometimes he wanted to intervene directly to help us but he can't but indirectly GOD always try to help through messenger's or other means sometimes which we won't able to understand that GOD is helping us. GOD feel upset when we are in trouble & very happy when we are happy. We all are conscious beings our material body is mortal but consciousness is immortal. We all have to understand this, we can't ignore this reality.
Hello! God here! I do exist.. Do you want to know the truth.. about everything.. I would tell you but like Jack Nicholson said..
"You can't handle the truth".
What if I told you that I am the only one who is not immortal, what would you think of that..
Do you bleed?
@@xspotbox4400 In my human form, yes..
😊🌎⏳🙏♥️
It's possible that a MGB (Maximally Great Being) exists.
If a MGB exists, then it exists in a PW (Possible World).
If it exists in a PW, then it exists in all PWs.
If it exists in all PWs, then it exists in an actual world.
Therefore, MGB exists.
Thus, if the existence of a MGB is even a logical possibility, then by definition, that implies its actuality, because if a MGB is logically possible, then it follows that it must exist.
Logical Possibility is defined here.home.sandiego.edu/~baber/logic/logicalpossibility.html
It's possible that a MPU (Maximally Pink Unicorn) exists.
If a MPU exists, it exists in a PW (Possible World).
If it exists in a PW, then it exists in all PWs.
If it exists in all PWs, then it exists in actual world.
Therefore, MPU exists.
Thus, if the existence of a MPU is even a logical possibility, then by definition, that implies its actuality, because if a MPU is logically possible, then it follows that it must exist.
@@ferdinandkraft857 Aha,... no, this parody does't work and I invite you to study the argument better as to not make a full of yourself.
@@les2997 I invite you to study logic, fool.
@@ferdinandkraft857 No, you are the fool who doesn't understand logic, not me. Kurt Godel, possibly the greatest logician in history, thought that argument is sound.
@@les2997 Your lame OP has no relation with Gödel's Ontological Proof. I invite you to study not only logic, but history of philosophy and orthography.
Longing for something does not make that something real.
The Goat
Apathy towards something does not make that something not real.
See? That game is easy.
Josh Heter I have apathy towards the god of christianity, islam and the multiple gods of hindism and greek mythology and every other religion purporting some kind of gods or goddesses. so tell me does my apathy towards all these "somethings" (i.e. religions) not make these somethings not real. so now how do you tell which is really the real one or are they all real?
yah you're right this "game" ...as you put it ...is easy. Your move.
the original comment regarding longing is a valid and sound argument your apathy argument however is fallacious and goes against basic rational logic and is disingenuous.
ian philip
You investigate the claims of each of the religions you mentioned for their inherent plausibility and their consistency with the available evidence and you use that to come to an informed conclusion.
The Goat ...you are absolutely correct 👍🏽
Josh Heter .."inhérent plausibility"???? no such thing. how can you automatically award plausibility to the very something you're trying to prove. plausibility also needs to be supported by evidence or at the least a valid and sound argument.
At any rate back to your apathy argument do you agree that it is a fallacious line of reasoning? you have not acknowledged my refutation.
Quite surely that even Santa Claus exist, so, for the first guy........ Cause babbo natale has the most perfect and good quality and heart too hahahaha. I repeat, I'm not atheist, nor religious, but the first good man says absolutely nothing relevant to anyone who has a SMALL bit of intelligent will to study for discovering what's true and what's not, and what's almost impossible to understand
1. JESUS IS REAL, JESUS IS GOD! THAT'S WHY GOD IS NOT OPTIONAL/PROBABILITY/POSSIBILITY! CHRISTIANITY/BIBLE IS TRUE, BECAUSE JESUS IS GOD IN REALITY!
2. IF YOU LIVE IN ISRAEL IN HIS TIME, YOU CANNOT DENY JESUS EXISTANCE & GOD POWERFUL BEING THAT REVEALED IN HIM!
GOD let His People WITNESSING HIM & His Miracles, written as BIBLE/EVIDENT OF GOD/JESUS! so everybody can feel Living with HIS PRESENCE, like you are really living around Him now, see/know Him with your own eyes!
3. conclution: GOD MUST BE EXIST, SINCE JESUS MUST BE GOD. JESUS HIMSELF SAID WHO HE IS. SO THERE'S NO DOUBT, & NO OTHER EXPLAINATION/POSSIBILITY ABOUT GOD EXISTANCE SINCE GOD/YHWH/JESUS REALLY CAME TO EARTH & REVEALED WHO HE IS & PROVE HIS EXISTANCE & POWER!
4. So ALL HUMAN are responsible to give ANSWER/EXPLAINATION ABOUT WHO IS JESUS!.. IF you deny JESUS THE TRUE GOD, you're ignorant rebellious SATAN'S CHILDREN From Hell!.. IF you admit that JESUS IS GOD, you're CHILDREN OF GOD & welcomed to live forever in HIS Blissful Heaven Amen! 😇🙏
..
BTW SO USELESS, WHEN ATHEIST TRY TO DENY WHAT&WHO ALREADY EXIST! GOD IS REAL & REALITY, HE IS NOT PROBABILITY.
3 FACTS THAT NEED GOD TO BE EXIST : DEATH/EVIL, ATHEISM/SATAN, & ISRAEL/BIBLE! ✌
..
WHEN YOU ARGUE ABOUT NECESSARY OF GOD-EXISTANCE, YOU EXACLTY ACT LIKE GOD! FROM HIS MIND/PERSPECTIVE/BIBLE:
1. YES, GOD EXIST IN HIS OWN MIND, BEING & DIMENSION/ETERNITY, BUT HE WANT TO DO/CREATE REASONING WHY SHOULD HE LET HUMAN & ALL CREATION BE EXIST, WHILE HE DOESN'T NEED ANYTHING?
2. GOD SATISFIED ONLY WITH HIMSELF! SO EASY TO DESTROY ANYTHING. SO HE GAVE HUMAN A MIND TO MAKE REASON FOR HIM. ATHEIST/SATAN CHALLENGE & MOCK GOD. IT GIVES REASON FOR GOD TO BE EXIST IN THIS WORLD, IT DRIVE HIM TO KILL SATAN & DEVIL HUMAN FOREVER IN HELL. BUT ALSO TO SAVE HIS PEOPLE WHO NEED HIM!
3. GOD IS NECESSARY FOR HIMSELF, & YOU ARE NOT NECESSARY TO HIM. YOU/HUMAN ARE PROBABILITIES, TO BE EXIST WITH HIM IN ETERNITY, OR TO BE DENIED/IGNORED/ABANDONED IN HELL, THE SAME WAY YOU DENY/REJECT HIS EXISTANCE! SURPRISED? 😅
4. SO BE CAREFUL. GOD HAS PUT HIS SWORD/SHARP MIND IN YOU, WHAT WILL YOU DO? TO KILL HIM OR TO SERVE HIM? LATER, HE WILL TAKE IT FROM YOU & USE THE SWORD LIKE YOU DID TO HIM! YOU SHOULD ASK, HOW BAD HAVE YOU BEEN TO HIM ALONG THIS TIME? HOW CAN YOU ESCAPE FROM HIS/YOUR OWN SWORD?! 😰
WHEN YOU ELIMINATE JESUS FROM BEING GOD/YHWH, YOU DON'T HAVE GOD AT ALL!.. SO FUNNY & IRONIC , ATHEIST & ISLM ARE LOOKING/BELIEVING IN GOD OF NOWHERE/NOTHING! BOTH HAVE SAME ROOT, FROM SATAN MIND/IDEA, TO REJECT JESUS=THE TRUE GOD WITH US, IAM IMMANUEL AMEN! 😇🙏
..
1. JESUS IS REAL, JESUS IS GOD! THAT'S WHY GOD IS NOT OPTIONAL/PROBABILITY/POSSIBILITY! CHRISTIANITY/BIBLE IS TRUE, BECAUSE JESUS IS GOD IN REALITY!
2. IF YOU LIVE IN ISRAEL IN HIS TIME, YOU CANNOT DENY JESUS EXISTANCE & GOD POWERFUL BEING THAT REVEALED IN HIM!
GOD let His People WITNESSING HIM & His Miracles, written as BIBLE/EVIDENT OF GOD/JESUS! so everybody can feel Living with HIS PRESENCE, like you are really living around Him now, see/know Him with your own eyes!
3. conclution: GOD MUST BE EXIST, SINCE JESUS MUST BE GOD. JESUS HIMSELF SAID WHO HE IS. SO THERE'S NO DOUBT, & NO OTHER EXPLAINATION/POSSIBILITY ABOUT GOD EXISTANCE SINCE GOD/YHWH/JESUS REALLY CAME TO EARTH & REVEALED WHO HE IS & PROVE HIS EXISTANCE & POWER!
4. So ALL HUMAN are responsible to give ANSWER/EXPLAINATION ABOUT WHO IS JESUS!.. IF you deny JESUS THE TRUE GOD, you're ignorant rebellious SATAN'S CHILDREN From Hell!.. IF you admit that JESUS IS GOD, you're CHILDREN OF GOD & welcomed to live forever in HIS Blissful Heaven Amen! 😇🙏
..
BTW SO USELESS, WHEN ATHEIST TRY TO DENY WHAT&WHO ALREADY EXIST! GOD IS REAL & REALITY, HE IS NOT PROBABILITY. 3 FACTS THAT NEED GOD TO BE EXIST : DEATH/EVIL, ATHEISM/SATAN, & ISRAEL/BIBLE! ✌
..
WHEN YOU ARGUE ABOUT NECESSARY OF GOD-EXISTANCE, YOU EXACLTY ACT LIKE GOD! FROM HIS MIND/PERSPECTIVE/BIBLE:
1. YES, GOD EXIST IN HIS OWN MIND, BEING & DIMENSION/ETERNITY, BUT HE WANT TO DO/CREATE REASONING WHY SHOULD HE LET HUMAN & ALL CREATION BE EXIST, WHILE HE DOESN'T NEED ANYTHING?
2. GOD SATISFIED ONLY WITH HIMSELF! SO EASY TO DESTROY ANYTHING. SO HE GAVE HUMAN A MIND TO MAKE REASON FOR HIM. ATHEIST/SATAN CHALLENGE & MOCK GOD. IT GIVES REASON FOR GOD TO BE EXIST IN THIS WORLD, IT DRIVE HIM TO KILL SATAN & DEVIL HUMAN FOREVER IN HELL. BUT ALSO TO SAVE HIS PEOPLE WHO NEED HIM!
3. GOD IS NECESSARY FOR HIMSELF, & YOU ARE NOT NECESSARY TO HIM. YOU/HUMAN ARE PROBABILITIES, TO BE EXIST WITH HIM IN ETERNITY, OR TO BE DENIED/IGNORED/ABANDONED IN HELL, THE SAME WAY YOU DENY/REJECT HIS EXISTANCE! SURPRISED? 😅
4. SO BE CAREFUL. GOD HAS PUT HIS SWORD/SHARP MIND IN YOU, WHAT WILL YOU DO? TO KILL HIM OR TO SERVE HIM? LATER, HE WILL TAKE IT FROM YOU & USE THE SWORD LIKE YOU DID TO HIM! YOU SHOULD ASK, HOW BAD HAVE YOU BEEN TO HIM ALONG THIS TIME? HOW CAN YOU ESCAPE FROM HIS/YOUR OWN SWORD?! 😰
We are in the world of "something", of existence.
So, the existence of God is reasonable.
So what or why can't we plurulise the concept of Deity (since nothing accountable their existence) including Gods..
@@suatustel746 It is reasonable there are Gods too.
@@bruceylwang I'm referring sky Gods, not a mythologic ones, let me explain to you'Abrahamic God we know, doesn't matter weather he is material immaterial spiritual or more esoteric albeit possess a structure, in other word he must be made of component parts since he's acting agent on the matter and execute plans therefore he exudes entity a being but nothing can create himself (including Gods) and the question begs if the composite parts unified a God like being why not same principle apply other occasions, therefore he must also be intrigue why not other God's made in the same fashion.. Do you get my drift???
@@suatustel746 Do you believe in Abrahamic God?
@@bruceylwang look Bruce, every one of us have a belief system, weather it lends us the absolute truth is questionable, Concept of God (yahweh, jehovah) must not rest upon the belief systems otherwise you'll have to accept the honesty of non_believers, perfectly legitimate claim he concept of where there come from? I'm asking you a simple question`if you were in God shoes (eternal) be satisfied and contend throughout the cycles of the universe only one occasion agent like us. Emerge . and respond their creator, and the creator deemed to concern their affairs, deeds and misdeeds, trials and tribulations, no he must be churn out numerous times involve subordinate beings like us in order to pique his interest how do we respond a supreme being if that's is the case if Your God necessarily exists then he necessarily bring about humans to gratify his self absortment.... Caprices, and vanity etc..
I love TMMs spin on The Ontological Argument. He said there must also be a Realicorn. What's a Realicorn? It's a unicorn except it's real. If you are only thinking of a unicorn you can't be thinking of a Realicorn because it's real by definition & it's greater to be exist than not exist therefore there MUST be Realicorns! L.O.L!
Paul Brocklehurst
That essential objection has been addressed for centuries. That’s what TMM does. He just ignores the already offered answers to his questions in order to make snarky atheistic content.
But, ya know... LOL!
@@joshheter1517 *That essential objection has been addressed for centuries.*
> Not well.
*That’s what TMM does.*
> His objections are perfectly justified.
*He just ignores the already offered answers to his questions in order to make snarky atheistic content.*
> What you claim is simply _snarky atheistic content_ is merely whining about anybody who reveals the flaws in the ontological arguement.
*But, ya know... LOL!*
> No I don't know - can _you_ defend the ontological arguement? It doesn't sound like it therefore you simply complain when people point out that it *is* indefensible.
Paul Brocklehurst
“>Not well”.
Oh? You know philosophers that address the objection in question? Please, by all means... which replies to TMM’s unicorn objection do you think fail to give an adequate reply? How do they fail?
Please be very specific.
@@joshheter1517 No I don't know any philosopher who can address TMMs objection to the ontological argument. Can you spot any shortcomings in it? I can't.
Paul Brocklehurst
So when you claimed that the historical replies to TMM’s unicorn objection, were all “not well”... you were just talking out of your ***? You were pretending to know what you were talking about?
Might as well have titled this arguing bullshit from being
haha ...👍🏽 I bet all these shysters were more than glad to spew their bullshit with no one to refute them.
this video had found part of #1 question, LOL. this involve the existence of time for every being, you can say this is part of creation.
just so any one have a curiosity, 'most perfect being' do exist. there is prove, Logically.
That muslim scholar is an ignorant
Blinded by his religion
He is not even an arab mixing up things
WHEN YOU ELIMINATE JESUS FROM BEING GOD/YHWH, YOU DON'T HAVE GOD AT ALL!
SO FUNNY & IRONIC , ATHEIST & ISLM ARE LOOKING/BELIEVING IN GOD OF NOWHERE/NOTHING! BOTH HAVE SAME ROOT, FROM SATAN MIND/IDEA, TO REJECT JESUS=THE TRUE GOD WITH US, IAM IMMANUEL AMEN! 😇🙏
1. JESUS IS REAL, JESUS IS GOD! THAT'S WHY GOD IS NOT OPTIONAL/PROBABILITY/POSSIBILITY! CHRISTIANITY/BIBLE IS TRUE, BECAUSE JESUS IS GOD IN REALITY!
2. IF YOU LIVE IN ISRAEL IN HIS TIME, YOU CANNOT DENY JESUS EXISTANCE & GOD POWERFUL BEING THAT REVEALED IN HIM!
GOD let His People WITNESSING HIM & His Miracles, written as BIBLE/EVIDENT OF GOD/JESUS! so everybody can feel Living with HIS PRESENCE, like you are really living around Him now, see/know Him with your own eyes!
3. conclution: GOD MUST BE EXIST, SINCE JESUS MUST BE GOD. JESUS HIMSELF SAID WHO HE IS. SO THERE'S NO DOUBT, & NO OTHER EXPLAINATION/POSSIBILITY ABOUT GOD EXISTANCE SINCE GOD/YHWH/JESUS REALLY CAME TO EARTH & REVEALED WHO HE IS & PROVE HIS EXISTANCE & POWER!
4. So ALL HUMAN are responsible to give ANSWER/EXPLAINATION ABOUT WHO IS JESUS!.. IF you deny JESUS THE TRUE GOD, you're ignorant rebellious SATAN'S CHILDREN From Hell!.. IF you admit that JESUS IS GOD, you're CHILDREN OF GOD & welcomed to live forever in HIS Blissful Heaven Amen! 😇🙏
..
BTW SO USELESS, WHEN ATHEIST TRY TO DENY WHAT&WHO ALREADY EXIST! GOD IS REAL & REALITY, HE IS NOT PROBABILITY. 3 FACTS THAT NEED GOD TO BE EXIST : DEATH/EVIL, ATHEISM/SATAN, & ISRAEL/BIBLE! ✌
..
WHEN YOU ARGUE ABOUT NECESSARY OF GOD-EXISTANCE, YOU EXACLTY ACT LIKE GOD! FROM HIS MIND/PERSPECTIVE/BIBLE:
1. YES, GOD EXIST IN HIS OWN MIND, BEING & DIMENSION/ETERNITY, BUT HE WANT TO DO/CREATE REASONING WHY SHOULD HE LET HUMAN & ALL CREATION BE EXIST, WHILE HE DOESN'T NEED ANYTHING?
2. GOD SATISFIED ONLY WITH HIMSELF! SO EASY TO DESTROY ANYTHING. SO HE GAVE HUMAN A MIND TO MAKE REASON FOR HIM. ATHEIST/SATAN CHALLENGE & MOCK GOD. IT GIVES REASON FOR GOD TO BE EXIST IN THIS WORLD, IT DRIVE HIM TO KILL SATAN & DEVIL HUMAN FOREVER IN HELL. BUT ALSO TO SAVE HIS PEOPLE WHO NEED HIM!
3. GOD IS NECESSARY FOR HIMSELF, & YOU ARE NOT NECESSARY TO HIM. YOU/HUMAN ARE PROBABILITIES, TO BE EXIST WITH HIM IN ETERNITY, OR TO BE DENIED/IGNORED/ABANDONED IN HELL, THE SAME WAY YOU DENY/REJECT HIS EXISTANCE! SURPRISED? 😅
4. SO BE CAREFUL. GOD HAS PUT HIS SWORD/SHARP MIND IN YOU, WHAT WILL YOU DO? TO KILL HIM OR TO SERVE HIM? LATER, HE WILL TAKE IT FROM YOU & USE THE SWORD LIKE YOU DID TO HIM! YOU SHOULD ASK, HOW BAD HAVE YOU BEEN TO HIM ALONG THIS TIME? HOW CAN YOU ESCAPE FROM HIS/YOUR OWN SWORD?! 😰