It’s like everyone chooses to be ignorant. Advanced cheating is still CHEATING !! CHEATING has always resulted in over discipline. Over discipline leads to people stopping cheating
Please read the NCAA regulations, revised, and let us know exactly how Michigan "cheated". Do you know the exact allegations against Michigan? We certainly don't. Can you please enlighten us?
You can’t believe what you are actually saying. If over-discipline stopped cheating then there wouldn’t be anymore cheating. If drunk driving resulted in the death penalty people would still do it.
Just like you're choosing to be ignorant of the situation. No notice of investigation has been given to the university. Until then no one's been found to be cheating. Innocent until proven guilty, no? Unless you work for the NCAA and have knowledge the rest of us don't have? Sit down and shut up until all is resolved.
@koo-hip9406 yeah, ncaa us like the government. A bunch of talk with no actual evidence. But that's why there's laws about libel and slander. Hope everyone putting out false information gets sued. Then the ones talking about discipline might actually stfu
@@johnhaut3894 but thats just the thing about cheating, you dont know that for shure. if Michigan could win all the games themselfs , why did they cheat? the larger point is that the players who were cheated, didnt get to a chance to compete on a level field.
How so? You think Michigan loses to Rutgers if they didn't know their signs? In every Michigan game this season (so far) Michigan could have handed out copies of their playbook and it wouldn't have made a difference.
@@matthewdrews Oregon and other teams have had their entire seasons destroyed because they underestimate their opponents, its a big part of college football to have upsets, and cheating even for small teams like Central Michigan eliminates those chances. I mean literally Michigan has the biggest upset ever on their chest from App State.
Why are all of these coaches afraid to speak publicly? All of them have been questioned by local media and all of them pretend they don’t have an opinion, until they are in private with the commissioner or providing anonymous quotes to Pete Thamel.
What does there opinion do? All it does is throw them in the mix of the BS, you think Matt Rhule wants to be in the news as “Nebraska coach says he wants action taken immediately on the Michigan program” or does he want his program to stay focused on FOOTBALL. Like cmon man stop being ignorant.
It really isn't even an NCAA investigation it's a verification by information provided by an outside investigation firm and everyone knows who is responsible for hiring the said investigation team . And who's orchestrating and feeding the information to the media. When everything comes too light it'll be very destructive to people involved in this situation.
I strongly disagree with you. What the B10 fans want is for there to be an in depth, active investigation to start. For the NCAA and B10 commish to find their testosterone and step up. And you honestly believe their players didn't know. Hey, these kids aren't stupid. If this has been going on for sometime, many of them would have figured it out. At least sense that something was off. Plus, with so many coaches involved, there would have been talk. So many leaks there weren't enough buckets.
the complete lack of testosterone shown by the big 10 coaches is sad, embarrassing, and pathetic. makes cheater Jimmy H look like a fuckin stud. wa wa.. he stole my sign! thats why i lost!! it wasn't cause i suck.. wa wa wah.
I have to add that it stuns me that an ex-player (JD) would so easily dismiss the time required to install new signs. Why should teams have to waste valuable practice time doing that? Why? BECAUSE Michigan STOLE their signs through illegal means.
It's not illegal to steal signs during a game, and teams need to be doing this ANYWAY. Any team that is not actively and frequently changing their signs is setting themselves up for a loss.
@@matthewdrews - Matt Rhule at Nebraska has the right mindset on this. The NCAA is holding up progress by not allowing technology on game day. In a recent presser this season, Rhule said both High School football and NFL football has headsets and mics built into helmets for in-game coach/QB and coach/Defense interaction....but the NCAA forbids this in college. Change that 1 rule and sign-stealing goes away. You could also return to the old-school method of shuttling players in and out of a huddle with plays and allowing your QBs to think for themselves in getting an offense into the right play with intelligent audibles pre-snap. Instead, most college coaches want to have dumb QBs that can't read a defense and have to look to the sideline for the play call...
How can you say that? Osu had full investigation brmefore anything happened, if it happened they will get punished,so your comment is just a butt hurt fan wanting easy way to playoffs
I typically side with you on a lot of things but on this one you are way left field. At the end of the day cheating is cheating. Rather it’s a big or little advantage, it’s still an ADVANTAGE! I think the whole football program should be punished and ultimately those kids should be the ones blaming their coaches for putting them in this position.
I heard from an member of the coaching staff of a B1G school that osu has been drugging the away teams visiting the horseshoe. I mean I said it and it was from a unproven source so that means they need to be kicked out of the B1G and NCAA all together, right? Show us proof. Not speculation. Not he bought tickets. Not this guy in hat and glasses is white so it must be him. Not look he is making audibles when the other team changes the play. Show us proof, you know, PROOF? It is still somewhat important, at least I thought.
@@zerolb33 Spit balls.....possibly vacate wins, if its provable, SO up to today in this season you get your Ws wiped out for the season, that would basicly constitue a bowl ban on this season, maybe coaches get suspensions. ... all that needs good proof , though ,
@@zerolb33Maybe they have to play games were they must announce there plays to the other team for as many games as they cheated in , if they dont run the plays how the call says , its 10yd penalty unsportsmanlike.That might be fun , That my vote. I want to see how that goes
What a terrible take. They cheated! They have algae an advantage against the whole leave for multiple seasons based entirely on breaking the rules. So you do nothing because it would hurt JJ or the conference? What would hurt the conference would be for them to reach the playoffs and the whole narrative is how a cheater got in over other deserving schools that played on a level playing field.
Explain the huge advantage? You would have to prove that signs never changed when it is legal to steal sign just not attend games to pre-scout. Did they have playbooks to go with specific signs? Unlikely, plus physical dominance in football matters. Many times the opposition knew a run was coming but could they stop it?
But Michigan can embarrass opponents if they have that advantage. That can hurt their recruiting and help Michigan for years to come. We want scalps now.
this i agree with.. even though its such a minor infraction that its allowed in high school and pros and the difference in benefit from michigan's methods to anyone elses is not quantifiable.. sure they cheated. i say fine them 1$
You don't want the Michigan players to be punished? What about the players of other teams (especially Ohio State) who have been punished as a result of the cheating?
Usually love JD’s unbiased and straightforward takes on all other videos and other teams, but gotta disagree hard on this one. Michigan is obviously innocent until the NCAA makes their final decision on the investigation, but the idea of having no consequences for cheating does nothing to prevent it from happening in the future. I agree that the Big 10 shouldn’t rush and impose punishment before the facts of the investigation have come out, but should they be found guilty, something should happen. It does suck for the players, but those are the consequences. He also did not offer a single alternative/solution in the video, just said it was ridiculous coaches were asking for blood and downplayed the cheating, saying michigan winning by 35 shows something else is wrong. If the sign stealing wasn’t helping them, why are they potentially doing it?
Numerous teams have had their wins vacated and I don’t hear any boohoo wahwah about that. My team FSU had to vacate wins for GPA(not game related cheating), and if that vacates wins cheating on the field will vacate wins.
@@MRDdotRAR Sounds like boohoo wahwah right now for FSU. You say that's not game-related but it is. If a player is playing a game they shouldn't be playing, it's game related. I don't think JD or anyone is saying their shouldn't be a penalty, but we don't know exactly what proof the NCAA has. Let's say tomorrow the NCAA announces that Connor Stalions acted on his own ambition and told the coaches he was just really good at reading game-day signals. Let's say he confesses to that. What should the punishment for the team be?
You absolutely cannot let Michigan get away with this. Michigan did this to themselves, if they didn't want their kids to get punished, they shouldn't have cheated. SIMPLE AS THAT. an unprecedented crime requires an unprecedented punishment. L take JD
100% agreed. The parties who we should feel sorry for are all the programs who were at the receiving end of this cheating scandal. Imagine Vols fans plight - After almost 25 years they had a team in contention for a national title only to be denied because another program up north colluded with Vols opponent to derail their campaign. Tennessee should be furious and rightly so. At least Clemson has won natties in the recent past but the same thing applies for them too. Michigan should pay the price and all the Michigan homies defending and deflecting are aptly reflecting their UM education by condoning cheating.
@jlm6448 the pedo coach who got them caught trying to smash a 13yr old across state lines that is a federal crime which bring the FBI and the other coach who committed cyber crimes when he stole practice footage from OSU with a OSU administrator credentials. Do Fishigan fan’s follow their team?
Look if they are stealing signals by going to the oppents game and figuring out exactly what other teams are doing on any given play, it's cheating Michigan should be suspended from play outside of the regular season
Worst take in all this "just change your signals" How is that fair to other teams?? 1. It's just not that easy on offenses And 2 practices are worth gold to these teams and are limited. So now other teams have take time to change signals
In the three years that Stalions left a paper trail of purchasing tickets to games of Michigan opponents, the Wolverines have gone 33-3 overall and 22-1 in Big Ten play. In the prior three years, they were 21-11 overall and 16-8 in league play.
that has nothing to do with their dominant defensive tackles (ojabo and hutch in 2021) and their insane runningbacks and line last year? those players are all dominating in the NFL right now as well, but it was definitely just connor stallions... stealing signs doesn't make the linemen peform better, if anything it would have improved the qb reads but it's mostly a defensive tactic, and the michigan offense has been dominating teams for the past 2 years. in fact last year osu were up at halftime, and then michigan came back and destroyed them second half. if the sign stealing was that important i'd imagine that michigan would've had a much bigger advantage first half before OSU knew what was going on. In fact, michigan was the most dominant second half team in the country last year, and this year they're also performing much better in the second half. kinda weird considering I'd think that the advantage would be mostly in the first haf.
I am sure they had all the signs and playbooks to go along with the signs otherwise it is just pass or run… physical dominance had nothing to do with cryan gay and the oHiO softboys getting rolled. Still have to execute in football
They had been allegedly stealing them sense 2018 so why didn’t they win that year then? Because the teams weren’t that good until 2021. Cant just accept the fact michigan got better
The media and fans put CJ Stroud through the ringer for not beating Michigan 2 years in a row. If that was because of violations committed by UM they deserve to get punished asap. Only thinking about UM players is 1 dimensional with all due respect.
This. A ton of UM apologists are saying “we shouldn’t punish the kids”… well, what about the kids on the opposing teams? If UM wins a title and it gets vacated where does that leave the losing team?
@@DonniDixem short answer “YES”. IF YOU KNOW THE PLAY, you then run your play that will put you in the best position to succeed. It’s not that hard to understand.
I have a hard time believing that the players don’t know about this. Perhaps before it initially happened, but they had to know coaches had insider info. Video seems to show players helping coaches call out the new adjustment to the other team’s play call.
they did know and didn't give to shits. why would they its legal to steal signs especially from stupid ass schools who don't let their QB's and Linebackers make decisions.
Rutgers and UM were tied at 7 until late in the second quarter. 14-7 at the half! UM 17-0 in the second half and you claim the cheating would have had no affect. Come on man, it absolutely did.
If teamscheat in sports, there is a reason why. It's to give them an advantage. If Michigan is already a great team, then the obvious reason for cheating is to make them better. If only the benefits of knowing if a play was pass or run were to cure a player's anxiety, that's a benefit. You're giving a great team a cheat sheet, in essence making them more powerful and then saying it doesn't make a difference? To me that's talking out the both sides of your mouth. It is what it is... It gave them an unfair advantage.
I love watching your show, but your take on this is WRONG. Players, coaches and fans are affected by this scandal. It was bad when the Astros used camera equipment to steal signs . They had their World Series win vacated, coaches lost their jobs, players from many teams were affected as well. The only better outcome in that situation would’ve been if the Astros were caught during the season, kept out of the playoffs, coaches were fired and the organization was penalized. Tell me how this is different. Both teams were stealing signs with cameras. if Michigan players are hurt by being penalized now, the guilt lies on the head of Michigan, not on everyone else who has been victimized up to this point. integrity should matter.
@@DualThreat1 Looks like the guy did just that, was a staff member who went to opponents games....... so , also while some may argue you can get advance scouting from a 3rd party . I belive the rule says(but not in so many words) you cant employ someone to get you advance scouting , which is Also whats accused.The 3rd party is intended to be someone who recorded the game with out bias or focus on one aspect. and thus would be available to any party wanting to purchase the footage. the media just doesnt have room for the headline as big as my post here.
How do you punish Harbaugh without punishing the kids? There isn’t a way. In my opinion, they need to let the teams play but vacate the wins. Vacate the wins from 2021-22 and vacate the wins from earlier this season before the scandal broke. Then let the CFP committee and rankings committees do what they want. Let the games be played though. Let Ohio State play Michigan. Let Penn State play Michigan.
All these videos are just hot air. Can anyone tell me what rule Michigan is actually accused of breaking and can you prove that anyone beyond Stalions was aware of this alleged rule violation?
The NCAA has to punish both Harbough and the university of Michigan. A tree year bol ban and removal of last 3 years of wins. The NCAA has to make an example of the to prevent othe schools from taking this same path. Harbaugh needs a show cause as well. I feel bad for the players. I am ashamed that is h tarnishes the big 10 and thecreputation of all. UT should also file a complaint against Michigan.
@@eddihaskell they need to print out a random comment from a nobody posting his opinion on a team that was actively caught cheating? And i didn’t even say anything about Ohio State. Dude you are so out of touch with reality it’s incredible.
@@nicholastaiariol2631 so if everyone knows it’s going on, why do you need evidence? And if everyone knows it’s going on then there is evidence. Pick one buddy.
You know what, the coaches chose to put the players in that situation. What about CJ Stroud? He was robbed of 1 or 2 Heisman trophies and B1G chances because of this blatant cheating. Michigan has benefitted so greatly from this cheating, which by the way happened this year. You think those players would be there if Harbaugh didn't cheat and get those wins? That team deserves to be punished. The coaches knew what they were doing and chose to put the players in this situation. They shouldn't be eligible to finish this season in my opinion. Sure, it sucks for the players. But why would we let Michigan high jack the B1G and college football for a 3rd season in a row. You're way off base here.
Heck Conner Stallions was so connected he got a pair of those Meta rayban sunglasses a whole 26 days before they were released just to spy a Michigan State at the CMU game.
I’m so sick of this ignorant ass argument that the meaningful teams on Michigans schedule now know well in advance enough to change their signs. They still have to use valuable and LIMITED (capped by the NCAA) practice time to focus on implementing a new signaling system rather than focusing on getting better. Michigan should be penalized 50% of their practice time the week of any opponent they bought tickets for.
Yea, it's unfair that the masses get punished for and individual's mistake. The coaches can't claim the fifth, they were receiving intel and using it to win games. The whole department needs to be punished.
'intel' ok if you consider in the open juvenile stupid any idiot on the planet can steal them with little effort signs intel. thats like getting intel from some punk kid nextdoor .. oh wait. thats exactly what you think michigan did, why ? cause your desperate.
When Ohio state got banned in 2010 because of tattoos, all the innocent players didn't do anything but got punished. Michigan should be punished and lose their post season chance
The NCAA will do something this will happen after the season is over expect it to be harsh. Because Harbaugh having already one level 1 infraction for lying so I see a death penalty coming in play in this situation. Harbaugh may have a contract extension but with an out clause for Michigan for when the NCAA brings down the hammer right now everyone thinking Michigan is safe is a false sense of security
@Mike-sp7zv congratulations, you've been on social media lately. Why don't they just hire you to be judge jury and executioner. Probably because it actually has to be substantiated before an investigation can be launched, which none has, officially.
They gained a significant advantage. Gave up 50+ to TCU because they didn’t have their signs. 2-4 the last year they played fairly. Would they still be 8-0 this year? Yeah they probably would against their atrocious schedule. The point differential would not be nearly what it is. Can’t wait for Penn State to beat them in 2 weeks and Ohio State to beat them in 4 weeks, and then their recent run will really be more scrutinized than ever. Cheaters deserve punishment
@@KennethVerkest if TCU can beat Michigan anybody can. TCU was horrible and still is. But without those signs it was a four quarter slugfest. I don’t think Penn st has a chance but OSU if McCord don’t beat us himself we might be ok but I like to let the games play out. Michigan fans don’t act like we was at full strength when we played we didn’t have JSN or Trey Henderson. OSU has the better talent iF Michigan survive this year once jj and corum gone we gonna run another ten straight wins off
This is the best take on the internet on the subject and I applaud you for it. For the haters, come and beat them. If you can't then come up with a better excuse for why you're team sucks
A lot of things have happened over the last 3 years that have enabled your program to become relevant again, and most of them were even legal, but enjoy this season because just like Clemson, you will be slipping back into mediocrity starting next year.
You have this opinion, but the entire ohio state program was almost killed by some tattoos that have nothing to do with actual game play. Those players mattered at the time but nobody gave a shit.
Yeah there is . Vacate the last 2 season with 5 years probation . A huge fine and give the coaches involved half a season ban. The players get to finish their season Connor stallions isn’t on the sideline so there’s no cheating involved that we know. If they beat the remaining teams it’s fair a fair game
"Is the Indiana game any different with the sign stealing?" Dude that doesn't matter! Cheating is cheating no matter how you cut it. And no way the players don't know about it man get your head out of the sand. Still, let them play and get ran over again by an SEC team in the playoffs.
Sorry dont agree with this take. Players diffiently knew something. Its clear in the response from last years ohio state game. Also, you not mentioning the players who were injured during the cheating. Stop making excuses for cheaters its disgusting.
@@a_goblue2023 is video evidence, Venmo paper trails, ticket scans, and testimony from an agent hired by UM to scout in person and record sidelines of future opponents 'proof' that UM scouted in person, or hired an agent to scout in person on its behalf? No? What more would u need?
@@a_goblue2023 @a_goblue2023 Proof😂 Seriously stop the BS. Just own it and move on. Got caught with hand in the cookie jar it is what it is lol proof😂😂I 0:00
JD, it’s called integrity. Michigan used to have some. Harbaugh has shown his colors, and the university needs to address it. Not the Big Ten or NCAA, Michigan. Ultimately, this will be addressed by using headsets, and a violation will no longer apply.
Harlem Globe Trotters.... don't play in the NBA finals. I have no horse in this race BUT: Yes, you have to punish the players too, even as collateral damage. Their wins are void because they knew where to throw the ball or what the defense was going to do before it happened. That's not a game, that's the Harlem Globe Trotters.
Oh the Michigan players knew alright. There's a video where the OSU quarterback gets a different signal and the entire Michigan sideline points their hands upwards to indicate to their defense the play being called. They knew.
Punishing based on an allegation that's still under investigation? Give me a break. I agree that Michigan should be punished if they did something wrong but that decision should be made only after all of the facts are revealed from this investigation. There is a reason we have rules, process, and protocol.
@jlm6448 took money? It was tattoos for their signature on memorabilia. How many games did Terrell Pyors tattoo of god’s hand help him win? Stop the nonsensical comparison please again make it make sense . We know it hurts to lose 2 decades to your rival make you want to jump of a cliff I know but relax try to win far and square. Cheating ass losers!!!😂😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣🤣
Throw in individuals that bet on teams to beat the spread against michigan. This doesnt affect just the colleges. It is a waterfall effect that spans other players, bowl games, bettors, hell even michigan players that may have their games vacated. This is why when you do the wrong thing it affects in many negative ways.
the whining could be heard round the world.. there were tears, hugs, and even i heard they have provided social services to help those going through his 'hell' poor things. the big 10 coaches are a pitiful lot.
My father used to have a saying... "THOU DOTH PROTEST TOO MUCH". Common parlance... He that smelt it...dealt it. All this distraction is a feeble attempt to make excuses for performance. The OSU football fans wanted R.D. run out of Columbus after the beatdown in the show last year. Michigan must be"cheating" or the Buckeye coach doesn't have an excuse for the PANTS-ING that they're going to take in AA come the end of the month. It's just a bunch of Ryan Day sympathizers trying to save his job, because they have no answer for][V][ on the field.
Cheating is cheating! It doesn’t matter how much or how little you gained. Bottom line they cheated so there for, you don’t know how many games were affected by it. They should be stripped of all wins during the period of time that it has went on, and they shouldn’t be eligible for playoffs and bowl games. If the players didn’t know about it, it’s sad that somebody ruined things for them but cheating is cheating and has to be dealt with in extreme measures. Nothing should be taken more serious in sports than the integrity of the game.
Its simple, make it so Michigan cant win any sort of a Title this year, being national or conference. Letting a team that played fair the opportunity.whats hard to understand about that?
The players benefited from cheating, with extra NIL money, and because the players knew what players were being called… They looked better on the field, and it raised their draft stock. The players absolutely benefit from cheating, which is why you have to punish them. You can’t let Coach Harbaugh benefit… and win, another conference, title, and possibly a national title. Having them take a spot over a team that does it the right way, and doesn’t cheat is also affecting all the other teams in the conference, and the playoff.
So it would be better to punish future kids who have not benefitted from the cheating? No this team needs punished immediately. “The kids” who didn’t know the cheating was going on where pointed up just like the coches yelling pass… how innocent were they? Didn’t know? Right!
Vacate all wins from 2021and 22 and a bowl ban for a year or two starting in 2024. If they are cheating as much as they are accused of i think this is fair. Let the players transfer without affecting they're eligiblity or using their first transfer because this isn't their fault.
I don't care where or what conference u from or how big the school is if u cheat or something illegal u get some tipe of punishment for whoever is involved
I get only wanting to punish Harbaugh, but Michigan the football team benefited directly from their cheating to get wins, therefore the Michigan football team should be punished.
It's not the Big Ten, the NCAA, or the CFP that would be punishing JJ McCarthy. It's another member (coach) of his TEAM. Sometimes your actions affect those around you. Actually, scratch that, your actions ALWAYS affect those around you.
I agree with his stance on the players, but there’s video out there that STRONGLY suggest the players knew EXACTLY what was going on, so they knew! Still though, don’t punish the players
The problem with punishing just Harbaugh is that the entire team benefited from sign stealing. Would they have won all of the games without stealing signs??
They can't play in the B1G title game if the conference doesn't allow them. What are they going to do, show up and say we're playing? Let them play the season out... and then dole out punishment. If OSU cannot get away with Tatgate and ZackSmithgate then TTUN shouldn't get away with this.
Question is can Michigan go to the CFP4 if they don’t play in the BigTen Championship? Can an undefeated Michigan and one loss OSU BigTen champion both go to the CFP4?
i hope so.. because if Michigan is not in the CFP everyone'd will say 'but that's the year the best team was left out' it will always have an asterisk. its making my entire image of college football coaching toughness come crashing down. one guy cheats and its like the smallest possible thing and the coaches lose their minds? its eye opening how sad and weak they are.
As a coach or program, if you feel that you are not being able to win enough games, you are faced with a couple of actions to take: 1. Identify the areas where you are deficient and then do the hard work to get better OR, 2. Cheat. The problem with action #2 is that it is ILLEGAL!! Looks like michigan have chosen #2 as their path to winning. As a side note and possibly the worse result of cheating is the extremely bad example that it gives to young men who are looking to the coaches for , at least, some kind of guidance in how to me a good man that can succeed in life by playing by the rules. Really, really sad. If there are no immediate consequences, the absolute wrong lesson is taught.
ASU football program completely crumbled because of recruiting during COVID. Something somewhat mundane when most schools in the country were doing the same thing. The program is at an all time low in the past 50 years because of it. (Now a work in progress admittedly) Michigan cheated over multiple seasons by having an undercover staffer on other team sidelines and attending games in the stands. A true psyop. The argument that schools across the country do the same thing is probably somewhat correct, but I doubt it’s to this degree. I’m asking, are you arguing the program should be left alone simply because they are good this year? Also, should the allegations be dealt with after season?
What i dont get is that sign stealing is not illegal in the NFL but recording opposing teams practices like what the Patriots did is illegal which i understand so the NFL coaches knows its scouts at games watching their signs and plays so they put out dummy signs to confuse them but in College sign stealing is illegal but they can put out dummy signs the same way the NFL does, if sign stealing in football was so much of an advantage then Michigan wouldve won the last two Nattys instead of Georgia
sign stealing is a much bigger deal in college because the quarterbacks don’t have headsets. Signs are almost never used in the NFL, the quarterback is just told to play through his helmet and he repeats it to the team in the huddle.
IN game sign stealing is legal, You can also get recordings of games to scout, but I believe they must be independently made. Michigans problem is there staff member was attending and employing person to attend future opponents games for the purpose of advance scouting there signals. And that looks to be expressly illegal. this may have lead them to being able to differentiate the dummy signals from the true signals. Aparently TCU switched up there system after being tipped to what michagan had been doing. so no Natty
Here we are talking about all the players on Michigan’s team Benefiting from breaking rules of the game. You have to take away there playoff invitation or theirs no integrity. And no reason to play the game.
Do you want to punish a team that didn't cheat to give that play-off spot to Michigan, a team that did?
If it wasn’t probably an advantage they wouldn’t have done it. Bad take.
It’s like everyone chooses to be ignorant. Advanced cheating is still CHEATING !! CHEATING has always resulted in over discipline. Over discipline leads to people stopping cheating
Please read the NCAA regulations, revised, and let us know exactly how Michigan "cheated". Do you know the exact allegations against Michigan? We certainly don't. Can you please enlighten us?
You can’t believe what you are actually saying. If over-discipline stopped cheating then there wouldn’t be anymore cheating. If drunk driving resulted in the death penalty people would still do it.
Just like you're choosing to be ignorant of the situation. No notice of investigation has been given to the university. Until then no one's been found to be cheating. Innocent until proven guilty, no? Unless you work for the NCAA and have knowledge the rest of us don't have? Sit down and shut up until all is resolved.
@@koo-hip9406yup. This. I wish more people stopped buying into the media frenzy and thought logically like this
@koo-hip9406 yeah, ncaa us like the government. A bunch of talk with no actual evidence. But that's why there's laws about libel and slander. Hope everyone putting out false information gets sued. Then the ones talking about discipline might actually stfu
What about the players on teams that lost due to cheating that missed bowls or ended up in a lesser bowl.
They don’t matter apparently
Nobody lost due to cheating they lost bc they lost
I agree, they are no different and no less deserving ore more deserving of that punishment.
@@johnhaut3894 but thats just the thing about cheating, you dont know that for shure. if Michigan could win all the games themselfs , why did they cheat? the larger point is that the players who were cheated, didnt get to a chance to compete on a level field.
@@HiItsMe-uk7mq sign stealing isn't cheating.
Do I want to penalize a cheater...yes! This is a horrible take.
The players on all other B1G teams have suffered consequences from this cheating. Why should Michigan players be the only ones who don't get hurt?
How so? You think Michigan loses to Rutgers if they didn't know their signs? In every Michigan game this season (so far) Michigan could have handed out copies of their playbook and it wouldn't have made a difference.
Thank you!!!
Prove that Michigan has cheated. You can't because it's a witch hunt. Period!
@@matthewdrews Oregon and other teams have had their entire seasons destroyed because they underestimate their opponents, its a big part of college football to have upsets, and cheating even for small teams like Central Michigan eliminates those chances. I mean literally Michigan has the biggest upset ever on their chest from App State.
@@iheartcicadaI think Purdue blowing out OSU was worse. I wonder if they knew their signs 😂
Why are all of these coaches afraid to speak publicly? All of them have been questioned by local media and all of them pretend they don’t have an opinion, until they are in private with the commissioner or providing anonymous quotes to Pete Thamel.
Because they do the same thing
What does there opinion do? All it does is throw them in the mix of the BS, you think Matt Rhule wants to be in the news as “Nebraska coach says he wants action taken immediately on the Michigan program” or does he want his program to stay focused on FOOTBALL. Like cmon man stop being ignorant.
Because they are bitches !!! Michigan keeping receipts on every team in the Big Ten
Because they don’t want to get involved in an NCAA investigation during the season
It really isn't even an NCAA investigation it's a verification by information provided by an outside investigation firm and everyone knows who is responsible for hiring the said investigation team . And who's orchestrating and feeding the information to the media. When everything comes too light it'll be very destructive to people involved in this situation.
I strongly disagree with you. What the B10 fans want is for there to be an in depth, active investigation to start. For the NCAA and B10 commish to find their testosterone and step up. And you honestly believe their players didn't know. Hey, these kids aren't stupid. If this has been going on for sometime, many of them would have figured it out. At least sense that something was off. Plus, with so many coaches involved, there would have been talk. So many leaks there weren't enough buckets.
the complete lack of testosterone shown by the big 10 coaches is sad, embarrassing, and pathetic. makes cheater Jimmy H look like a fuckin stud. wa wa.. he stole my sign! thats why i lost!! it wasn't cause i suck.. wa wa wah.
Are you saying that punishment isn't warranted for a team that had more than 1 coach clearly involved? C'mon man.
Dude is so concerned about what this will do the UM players. What about all the other players that took a loss of the last couple years from cheating?
This is always the problem people face when they try to make the offender out to be the victim while ignoring the actual victims.
Well said
Oh no the mediocre big ten teams have one extra loss
So, I am assuming the kids that lost against Michigan haven't lost anything?
They would have got romped no matter what. Sign stealing isn't illegal.
just got their clocks cleaned..
@@chemnitzfan654delusional much..dumbest excuse of them all! Congrats nim wit
@@twistedneckOnly by being cheaters..so means nothing.😊
I have to add that it stuns me that an ex-player (JD) would so easily dismiss the time required to install new signs. Why should teams have to waste valuable practice time doing that? Why? BECAUSE Michigan STOLE their signs through illegal means.
It's not illegal to steal signs during a game, and teams need to be doing this ANYWAY. Any team that is not actively and frequently changing their signs is setting themselves up for a loss.
@@jamessanders2785where is the proof UofM done anything?
Right now it's on 1 person
Teams change signs all the time.
Why do you think teams go through such elaborate measures to call plays?
There are literally legal sign stealers on every major staff. Every team should be changing up signs all the time.
@@matthewdrews - Matt Rhule at Nebraska has the right mindset on this. The NCAA is holding up progress by not allowing technology on game day. In a recent presser this season, Rhule said both High School football and NFL football has headsets and mics built into helmets for in-game coach/QB and coach/Defense interaction....but the NCAA forbids this in college. Change that 1 rule and sign-stealing goes away. You could also return to the old-school method of shuttling players in and out of a huddle with plays and allowing your QBs to think for themselves in getting an offense into the right play with intelligent audibles pre-snap. Instead, most college coaches want to have dumb QBs that can't read a defense and have to look to the sideline for the play call...
The NCAA came down harder on Ohio State just for selling some stuff. This is incredibly worse.
How can you say that? Osu had full investigation brmefore anything happened, if it happened they will get punished,so your comment is just a butt hurt fan wanting easy way to playoffs
@@stevesalisbury3657 Lol oh no I fully expect to play you. That is kinda rich coming from a fan of a team that's had an extremely easy schedule.
@shannonw4577 really who your team beat penn st only?
@shannonw4577 so does georgia but here you are still blabbing at the mouth....
@@stevesalisbury3657 Hm seems like you are the one blabbing, but ok bud 👍 you never had to reply to me. I was simply stating the facts.
I typically side with you on a lot of things but on this one you are way left field. At the end of the day cheating is cheating. Rather it’s a big or little advantage, it’s still an ADVANTAGE!
I think the whole football program should be punished and ultimately those kids should be the ones blaming their coaches for putting them in this position.
I heard from an member of the coaching staff of a B1G school that osu has been drugging the away teams visiting the horseshoe. I mean I said it and it was from a unproven source so that means they need to be kicked out of the B1G and NCAA all together, right? Show us proof. Not speculation. Not he bought tickets. Not this guy in hat and glasses is white so it must be him. Not look he is making audibles when the other team changes the play. Show us proof, you know, PROOF? It is still somewhat important, at least I thought.
Absolutely.
So with that said and since your spit balling tell us what should the punishment be???
@@zerolb33 Spit balls.....possibly vacate wins, if its provable, SO up to today in this season you get your Ws wiped out for the season, that would basicly constitue a bowl ban on this season, maybe coaches get suspensions. ... all that needs good proof , though ,
@@zerolb33Maybe they have to play games were they must announce there plays to the other team for as many games as they cheated in , if they dont run the plays how the call says , its 10yd penalty unsportsmanlike.That might be fun , That my vote. I want to see how that goes
How do you know that players didn't know? They may not have participated but they knew something was going on
How do you know that they did???
What a terrible take. They cheated! They have algae an advantage against the whole leave for multiple seasons based entirely on breaking the rules. So you do nothing because it would hurt JJ or the conference? What would hurt the conference would be for them to reach the playoffs and the whole narrative is how a cheater got in over other deserving schools that played on a level playing field.
Scared
Explain the huge advantage? You would have to prove that signs never changed when it is legal to steal sign just not attend games to pre-scout. Did they have playbooks to go with specific signs? Unlikely, plus physical dominance in football matters. Many times the opposition knew a run was coming but could they stop it?
of cheating?
Ditto
what happened to innocent until proven guilty ?
Cheating is cheating someone needs to be held accountable it doesn’t matter the margin of victory
But Michigan can embarrass opponents if they have that advantage. That can hurt their recruiting and help Michigan for years to come. We want scalps now.
Yep Connor will probably be gone. As of now no evidence from the NCAA that Jim knew.
this i agree with.. even though its such a minor infraction that its allowed in high school and pros and the difference in benefit from michigan's methods to anyone elses is not quantifiable.. sure they cheated. i say fine them 1$
You don't want the Michigan players to be punished? What about the players of other teams (especially Ohio State) who have been punished as a result of the cheating?
Usually love JD’s unbiased and straightforward takes on all other videos and other teams, but gotta disagree hard on this one. Michigan is obviously innocent until the NCAA makes their final decision on the investigation, but the idea of having no consequences for cheating does nothing to prevent it from happening in the future. I agree that the Big 10 shouldn’t rush and impose punishment before the facts of the investigation have come out, but should they be found guilty, something should happen. It does suck for the players, but those are the consequences. He also did not offer a single alternative/solution in the video, just said it was ridiculous coaches were asking for blood and downplayed the cheating, saying michigan winning by 35 shows something else is wrong. If the sign stealing wasn’t helping them, why are they potentially doing it?
Numerous teams have had their wins vacated and I don’t hear any boohoo wahwah about that. My team FSU had to vacate wins for GPA(not game related cheating), and if that vacates wins cheating on the field will vacate wins.
@@MRDdotRAR Sounds like boohoo wahwah right now for FSU. You say that's not game-related but it is. If a player is playing a game they shouldn't be playing, it's game related. I don't think JD or anyone is saying their shouldn't be a penalty, but we don't know exactly what proof the NCAA has. Let's say tomorrow the NCAA announces that Connor Stalions acted on his own ambition and told the coaches he was just really good at reading game-day signals. Let's say he confesses to that. What should the punishment for the team be?
Ohio state was undefeated when they weren't allowed to play in big 10 title game in urban Myers first year because of much smaller offense
You absolutely cannot let Michigan get away with this. Michigan did this to themselves, if they didn't want their kids to get punished, they shouldn't have cheated. SIMPLE AS THAT. an unprecedented crime requires an unprecedented punishment. L take JD
Sounds like a losers mentality you got going on there. Enjoy clinging to your excuses while Michigan kicks your asses on the field this year.
100% agreed. The parties who we should feel sorry for are all the programs who were at the receiving end of this cheating scandal. Imagine Vols fans plight - After almost 25 years they had a team in contention for a national title only to be denied because another program up north colluded with Vols opponent to derail their campaign. Tennessee should be furious and rightly so. At least Clemson has won natties in the recent past but the same thing applies for them too.
Michigan should pay the price and all the Michigan homies defending and deflecting are aptly reflecting their UM education by condoning cheating.
Pulled the words from my mouth 👏🏼 👏🏼 👏🏼
@jlm6448 the pedo coach who got them caught trying to smash a 13yr old across state lines that is a federal crime which bring the FBI and the other coach who committed cyber crimes when he stole practice footage from OSU with a OSU administrator credentials. Do Fishigan fan’s follow their team?
@@Fed_Express what happened to innocent until proven guilty ?
JD they ALL cheated and should be punished these are still kids learning about life.
Look if they are stealing signals by going to the oppents game and figuring out exactly what other teams are doing on any given play, it's cheating Michigan should be suspended from play outside of the regular season
Worst take in all this "just change your signals" How is that fair to other teams??
1. It's just not that easy on offenses
And 2 practices are worth gold to these teams and are limited. So now other teams have take time to change signals
It's a slippery slope when you stop having consequences for cheating. I think there needs to be punishment to reset the standard.
Exactly
Yea wonder when Joe Biden gets his....LOL
Technology in helmets would reset the standard. Start there.
You need to prove that they cheated first though.
Or just change the rule, it’s a stupid rule, it’s allowed in the NFL. Or just put mics in the helmet and this isn’t an issue…
In the three years that Stalions left a paper trail of purchasing tickets to games of Michigan opponents, the Wolverines have gone 33-3 overall and 22-1 in Big Ten play. In the prior three years, they were 21-11 overall and 16-8 in league play.
Welp there you have it! Sherlock Holmes here cracked the case
that has nothing to do with their dominant defensive tackles (ojabo and hutch in 2021) and their insane runningbacks and line last year? those players are all dominating in the NFL right now as well, but it was definitely just connor stallions...
stealing signs doesn't make the linemen peform better, if anything it would have improved the qb reads but it's mostly a defensive tactic, and the michigan offense has been dominating teams for the past 2 years. in fact last year osu were up at halftime, and then michigan came back and destroyed them second half. if the sign stealing was that important i'd imagine that michigan would've had a much bigger advantage first half before OSU knew what was going on.
In fact, michigan was the most dominant second half team in the country last year, and this year they're also performing much better in the second half. kinda weird considering I'd think that the advantage would be mostly in the first haf.
or they just got better? don’t be ignorant. Watching games in person is not going to get you that jump that you’re for some reason wishing for.
I am sure they had all the signs and playbooks to go along with the signs otherwise it is just pass or run… physical dominance had nothing to do with cryan gay and the oHiO softboys getting rolled. Still have to execute in football
They had been allegedly stealing them sense 2018 so why didn’t they win that year then? Because the teams weren’t that good until 2021. Cant just accept the fact michigan got better
The media and fans put CJ Stroud through the ringer for not beating Michigan 2 years in a row. If that was because of violations committed by UM they deserve to get punished asap. Only thinking about UM players is 1 dimensional with all due respect.
So Edward's running 2 touchdowns on them and stroud throwing 2 ints had anything to do with sign stealing? Yea ok buddy lol😂
This.
A ton of UM apologists are saying “we shouldn’t punish the kids”… well, what about the kids on the opposing teams? If UM wins a title and it gets vacated where does that leave the losing team?
@@DonniDixem short answer “YES”. IF YOU KNOW THE PLAY, you then run your play that will put you in the best position to succeed. It’s not that hard to understand.
@Ryahn2893 It doesn't work that way. Your team could know the play but they still have to stop it.
Stop making excuses it was the dude Connor who meant shit to our program and nothing is going to happen
I have a hard time believing that the players don’t know about this. Perhaps before it initially happened, but they had to know coaches had insider info. Video seems to show players helping coaches call out the new adjustment to the other team’s play call.
100%
Players knew. Could've come clean too, but they kept quietly in line. Let them suffer the consequences.
they did know and didn't give to shits. why would they its legal to steal signs especially from stupid ass schools who don't let their QB's and Linebackers make decisions.
The players may not have known about it but they definitely benefited from it.
Is Michigan really the best team in the Big 10 the past two years? How do you know they are when they've been cheating the past two years.
Because everyone else steals signs and even trys to get people in transfer portal to steal playbook info.
@dubvideos Right, and everyone else is also under investigation for cheating. 🤡
Rutgers and UM were tied at 7 until late in the second quarter. 14-7 at the half! UM 17-0 in the second half and you claim the cheating would have had no affect. Come on man, it absolutely did.
Wake up only football go blue
If teamscheat in sports, there is a reason why. It's to give them an advantage. If Michigan is already a great team, then the obvious reason for cheating is to make them better. If only the benefits of knowing if a play was pass or run were to cure a player's anxiety, that's a benefit. You're giving a great team a cheat sheet, in essence making them more powerful and then saying it doesn't make a difference? To me that's talking out the both sides of your mouth. It is what it is... It gave them an unfair advantage.
I love watching your show, but your take on this is WRONG. Players, coaches and fans are affected by this scandal. It was bad when the Astros used camera equipment to steal signs . They had their World Series win vacated, coaches lost their jobs, players from many teams were affected as well. The only better outcome in that situation would’ve been if the Astros were caught during the season, kept out of the playoffs, coaches were fired and the organization was penalized. Tell me how this is different. Both teams were stealing signs with cameras. if Michigan players are hurt by being penalized now, the guilt lies on the head of Michigan, not on everyone else who has been victimized up to this point. integrity should matter.
Sign stealing isn’t illegal. It’s illegal if staff physically went to opponent games…
Yes! Finally someone who gets it! Why doesn't the media say this? (Cause it doesn't sell "clicks".)
@@DualThreat1 Looks like the guy did just that, was a staff member who went to opponents games....... so , also while some may argue you can get advance scouting from a 3rd party . I belive the rule says(but not in so many words) you cant employ someone to get you advance scouting , which is Also whats accused.The 3rd party is intended to be someone who recorded the game with out bias or focus on one aspect. and thus would be available to any party wanting to purchase the footage. the media just doesnt have room for the headline as big as my post here.
How do you punish Harbaugh without punishing the kids? There isn’t a way. In my opinion, they need to let the teams play but vacate the wins. Vacate the wins from 2021-22 and vacate the wins from earlier this season before the scandal broke. Then let the CFP committee and rankings committees do what they want. Let the games be played though. Let Ohio State play Michigan. Let Penn State play Michigan.
Cheater cheater booger eater
All these videos are just hot air. Can anyone tell me what rule Michigan is actually accused of breaking and can you prove that anyone beyond Stalions was aware of this alleged rule violation?
The NCAA has to punish both Harbough and the university of Michigan. A tree year bol ban and removal of last 3 years of wins. The NCAA has to make an example of the to prevent othe schools from taking this same path. Harbaugh needs a show cause as well. I feel bad for the players. I am ashamed that is h tarnishes the big 10 and thecreputation of all. UT should also file a complaint against Michigan.
Mich. knocked someone out of the playoff last year by cheating and stands to do it again this year
Dude the players absolutely knew what was going on. Everyone in that program knew what was happening.
The Michigan team and JJ need to print out this quote and put it up in huge letters in their locker room before the Ohio State game.
@@eddihaskell they need to print out a random comment from a nobody posting his opinion on a team that was actively caught cheating? And i didn’t even say anything about Ohio State. Dude you are so out of touch with reality it’s incredible.
@@jaredackley5039thinking everyone knew what was going on without any evidence at all is being out of touch with reality
@@nicholastaiariol2631 so if everyone knows it’s going on, why do you need evidence? And if everyone knows it’s going on then there is evidence. Pick one buddy.
You know what, the coaches chose to put the players in that situation. What about CJ Stroud? He was robbed of 1 or 2 Heisman trophies and B1G chances because of this blatant cheating.
Michigan has benefitted so greatly from this cheating, which by the way happened this year. You think those players would be there if Harbaugh didn't cheat and get those wins?
That team deserves to be punished. The coaches knew what they were doing and chose to put the players in this situation. They shouldn't be eligible to finish this season in my opinion. Sure, it sucks for the players. But why would we let Michigan high jack the B1G and college football for a 3rd season in a row.
You're way off base here.
Heck Conner Stallions was so connected he got a pair of those Meta rayban sunglasses a whole 26 days before they were released just to spy a Michigan State at the CMU game.
To be fair if you know the plays on offense and defense, the possibilities of points responsible could be huge.
I’m so sick of this ignorant ass argument that the meaningful teams on Michigans schedule now know well in advance enough to change their signs. They still have to use valuable and LIMITED (capped by the NCAA) practice time to focus on implementing a new signaling system rather than focusing on getting better. Michigan should be penalized 50% of their practice time the week of any opponent they bought tickets for.
Yea, it's unfair that the masses get punished for and individual's mistake. The coaches can't claim the fifth, they were receiving intel and using it to win games. The whole department needs to be punished.
'intel' ok if you consider in the open juvenile stupid any idiot on the planet can steal them with little effort signs intel. thats like getting intel from some punk kid nextdoor .. oh wait. thats exactly what you think michigan did, why ? cause your desperate.
This is the worst take on this issue that I have seen so far.
When Ohio state got banned in 2010 because of tattoos, all the innocent players didn't do anything but got punished. Michigan should be punished and lose their post season chance
Michigan is guilty in the court of public opinion but all that matters is what the NCAA finds/decides. Leakers and “anonymous” sources can kick rocks
Good thing there's multiple videos/pictures and ticket records
tin foil hatters can kick rocks
The NCAA will do something this will happen after the season is over expect it to be harsh. Because Harbaugh having already one level 1 infraction for lying so I see a death penalty coming in play in this situation. Harbaugh may have a contract extension but with an out clause for Michigan for when the NCAA brings down the hammer right now everyone thinking Michigan is safe is a false sense of security
@Mike-sp7zv congratulations, you've been on social media lately. Why don't they just hire you to be judge jury and executioner. Probably because it actually has to be substantiated before an investigation can be launched, which none has, officially.
@@Mike-sp7zvso you're telling yourself to kick rocks? Lol! Got it
They gained a significant advantage. Gave up 50+ to TCU because they didn’t have their signs. 2-4 the last year they played fairly. Would they still be 8-0 this year? Yeah they probably would against their atrocious schedule. The point differential would not be nearly what it is. Can’t wait for Penn State to beat them in 2 weeks and Ohio State to beat them in 4 weeks, and then their recent run will really be more scrutinized than ever. Cheaters deserve punishment
you are absolutely delusional I don't see either one of those two teams I bet $50 that Michigan wins
No, they just played like shit. Signs are not that significant.
@@KennethVerkest if TCU can beat Michigan anybody can. TCU was horrible and still is. But without those signs it was a four quarter slugfest. I don’t think Penn st has a chance but OSU if McCord don’t beat us himself we might be ok but I like to let the games play out. Michigan fans don’t act like we was at full strength when we played we didn’t have JSN or Trey Henderson. OSU has the better talent iF Michigan survive this year once jj and corum gone we gonna run another ten straight wins off
@@KennethVerkest what’s your Venmo bud?
Michigan is gonna dominate even more now, I guarantee all the players are pissed off
@@RB-fn3ltgo blue
Pissed that their coaches encouraged cheating? Pissed that they got caught?? Pissed that their fans also encourage cheating?
How do you not know that the Rutgers game wasn’t impacted from sign stealing the 2020 season before they started Rutgers and Indiana beat them
if you believe that life is going to be very difficult for you @SharkG93.. its a tough world out there.
@@twistedneck go look at the scores they went to 3 ot with rutgers
The players 1000% knew they were scouting signs
Source: “trust me bro”
@@Woodyruff you can watch them read osu signs on the opening drive. And signal to the defense immediately
@@Woodyruff source: having a brain
Michigan Fans could literally look at Michigan getting banned from CFP and they would say “Go Blue” 💀
True
Go blue! 😂
Go blue
Awww did baby get his feelings hurt? Go blue! 😂
GO FUCKING BLUE!!!
This is the best take on the internet on the subject and I applaud you for it.
For the haters, come and beat them. If you can't then come up with a better excuse for why you're team sucks
A lot of things have happened over the last 3 years that have enabled your program to become relevant again, and most of them were even legal, but enjoy this season because just like Clemson, you will be slipping back into mediocrity starting next year.
You have this opinion, but the entire ohio state program was almost killed by some tattoos that have nothing to do with actual game play. Those players mattered at the time but nobody gave a shit.
GREAT POINT!!!
I don't want them to punish the players, but there is no way to punish the administration without that collateral damage. It's just how it works.
Yeah there is . Vacate the last 2 season with 5 years probation . A huge fine and give the coaches involved half a season ban. The players get to finish their season Connor stallions isn’t on the sideline so there’s no cheating involved that we know. If they beat the remaining teams it’s fair a fair game
"Is the Indiana game any different with the sign stealing?" Dude that doesn't matter! Cheating is cheating no matter how you cut it. And no way the players don't know about it man get your head out of the sand. Still, let them play and get ran over again by an SEC team in the playoffs.
How fair is NOT punishing Mich. to the rest of college football? How fair is it to allow Mich. to capitalize due to cheating?
Sorry dont agree with this take. Players diffiently knew something. Its clear in the response from last years ohio state game. Also, you not mentioning the players who were injured during the cheating. Stop making excuses for cheaters its disgusting.
Where’s ur proof of that, or proof that Harbaugh knew, right there is non so keep the conspiracy’s out
@@a_goblue2023 is video evidence, Venmo paper trails, ticket scans, and testimony from an agent hired by UM to scout in person and record sidelines of future opponents 'proof' that UM scouted in person, or hired an agent to scout in person on its behalf? No? What more would u need?
@@a_goblue2023 @a_goblue2023 Proof😂 Seriously stop the BS. Just own it and move on. Got caught with hand in the cookie jar it is what it is lol proof😂😂I 0:00
It’s not just haurbough it’s the organization, more than one person but a organization
Cheating is Cheating, and deserve consequences. Period.
JD, it’s called integrity. Michigan used to have some. Harbaugh has shown his colors, and the university needs to address it. Not the Big Ten or NCAA, Michigan. Ultimately, this will be addressed by using headsets, and a violation will no longer apply.
Harlem Globe Trotters.... don't play in the NBA finals. I have no horse in this race BUT: Yes, you have to punish the players too, even as collateral damage. Their wins are void because they knew where to throw the ball or what the defense was going to do before it happened. That's not a game, that's the Harlem Globe Trotters.
“It doesn’t make that much of a difference” 🤨 like tf
Oh the Michigan players knew alright. There's a video where the OSU quarterback gets a different signal and the entire Michigan sideline points their hands upwards to indicate to their defense the play being called. They knew.
And Ohio scored a TD.. shut up 🤡
Punishing based on an allegation that's still under investigation? Give me a break.
I agree that Michigan should be punished if they did something wrong but that decision should be made only after all of the facts are revealed from this investigation. There is a reason we have rules, process, and protocol.
The Michigan players participated in the cheating last year against OSU among other games. The entire program is complicit and should be punished.
@jlm6448 took money? It was tattoos for their signature on memorabilia. How many games did Terrell Pyors tattoo of god’s hand help him win? Stop the nonsensical comparison please again make it make sense . We know it hurts to lose 2 decades to your rival make you want to jump of a cliff I know but relax try to win far and square. Cheating ass losers!!!😂😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣🤣
Throw in individuals that bet on teams to beat the spread against michigan. This doesnt affect just the colleges. It is a waterfall effect that spans other players, bowl games, bettors, hell even michigan players that may have their games vacated. This is why when you do the wrong thing it affects in many negative ways.
So don't gamble period
How would the Michigan On3 people know the sentiment if their guy wasn’t even in the room?
Cryin Ryan Day is leaking info as fast as he can.
Yeah that made me roll my eyes.
the whining could be heard round the world.. there were tears, hugs, and even i heard they have provided social services to help those going through his 'hell' poor things. the big 10 coaches are a pitiful lot.
My father used to have a saying...
"THOU DOTH PROTEST TOO MUCH".
Common parlance...
He that smelt it...dealt it. All this distraction is a feeble attempt to make excuses for performance. The OSU football fans wanted R.D. run out of Columbus after the beatdown in the show last year. Michigan must be"cheating" or the Buckeye coach doesn't have an excuse for the PANTS-ING that they're going to take in AA come the end of the month. It's just a bunch of Ryan Day sympathizers trying to save his job, because they have no answer for][V][ on the field.
Cheating is cheating! It doesn’t matter how much or how little you gained. Bottom line they cheated so there for, you don’t know how many games were affected by it. They should be stripped of all wins during the period of time that it has went on, and they shouldn’t be eligible for playoffs and bowl games. If the players didn’t know about it, it’s sad that somebody ruined things for them but cheating is cheating and has to be dealt with in extreme measures. Nothing should be taken more serious in sports than the integrity of the game.
Agreed 110 %
Cry harder 😂😂😂
The whole coaching staff had to know.
You can’t assume the players did not know. Watch the video where they are all pointing to the sky vs OSU.
You know you have a "progrum" when you're good with cheating
Its simple, make it so Michigan cant win any sort of a Title this year, being national or conference. Letting a team that played fair the opportunity.whats hard to understand about that?
The only thing that’s simple is you
how is Michigan cheating fair to all the other big 10 players
Forty seven out of fifty coaches said this
The players benefited from cheating, with extra NIL money, and because the players knew what players were being called… They looked better on the field, and it raised their draft stock. The players absolutely benefit from cheating, which is why you have to punish them. You can’t let Coach Harbaugh benefit… and win, another conference, title, and possibly a national title. Having them take a spot over a team that does it the right way, and doesn’t cheat is also affecting all the other teams in the conference, and the playoff.
So it would be better to punish future kids who have not benefitted from the cheating? No this team needs punished immediately. “The kids” who didn’t know the cheating was going on where pointed up just like the coches yelling pass… how innocent were they? Didn’t know? Right!
Vacate all wins from 2021and 22 and a bowl ban for a year or two starting in 2024. If they are cheating as much as they are accused of i think this is fair. Let the players transfer without affecting they're eligiblity or using their first transfer because this isn't their fault.
I don't care where or what conference u from or how big the school is if u cheat or something illegal u get some tipe of punishment for whoever is involved
If you don't punish CHEATERS, you will get more CHEATERS.
There is more than enough evidence showing that the players new. A lot of film shows players acting sporadically, but it just hasn't blown up yet.
The entire team needs punished, HOW DO YOU KNOW who else was in on it?
Called a investigation duhhhhhhhh
I get only wanting to punish Harbaugh, but Michigan the football team benefited directly from their cheating to get wins, therefore the Michigan football team should be punished.
It's not the Big Ten, the NCAA, or the CFP that would be punishing JJ McCarthy. It's another member (coach) of his TEAM. Sometimes your actions affect those around you. Actually, scratch that, your actions ALWAYS affect those around you.
I agree with his stance on the players, but there’s video out there that STRONGLY suggest the players knew EXACTLY what was going on, so they knew! Still though, don’t punish the players
How many kids missed out because M cheated? More than the number of the kid that play for M
The problem with punishing just Harbaugh is that the entire team benefited from sign stealing. Would they have won all of the games without stealing signs??
Yes
Signs stealing what joke people with agendas you can't beat on field tear down
They can't play in the B1G title game if the conference doesn't allow them. What are they going to do, show up and say we're playing? Let them play the season out... and then dole out punishment. If OSU cannot get away with Tatgate and ZackSmithgate then TTUN shouldn't get away with this.
don't worry as games will be vacated and sanctions many many sanctions coming Michigan way
Did Jim Harbaugh write this response? Pathetic.
It sure seems like you're a Michigan lover. The players benefited from the coaches cheating. Now they know how the game plans always work 🧐
Question is can Michigan go to the CFP4 if they don’t play in the BigTen Championship? Can an undefeated Michigan and one loss OSU BigTen champion both go to the CFP4?
i hope so.. because if Michigan is not in the CFP everyone'd will say 'but that's the year the best team was left out' it will always have an asterisk. its making my entire image of college football coaching toughness come crashing down. one guy cheats and its like the smallest possible thing and the coaches lose their minds? its eye opening how sad and weak they are.
If it doesn’t make a difference stealing signs then why do it ????!! Because it gives them a large advantage.
You don’t want to punish JJ but we would punish all the players who were cheated against.
As a coach or program, if you feel that you are not being able to win enough games, you are faced with a couple of actions to take:
1. Identify the areas where you are deficient and then do the hard work to get better OR, 2. Cheat. The problem with action #2 is that it is ILLEGAL!! Looks like michigan have chosen #2 as their path to winning. As a side note and possibly the worse result of cheating is the extremely bad example that it gives to young men who are looking to the coaches for , at least, some kind of guidance in how to me a good man that can succeed in life by playing by the rules. Really, really sad. If there are no immediate consequences, the absolute wrong lesson is taught.
Low information comments here.
Many Ohio State fans here. What do you expect, Rhodes Scholars?
ASU football program completely crumbled because of recruiting during COVID. Something somewhat mundane when most schools in the country were doing the same thing. The program is at an all time low in the past 50 years because of it. (Now a work in progress admittedly)
Michigan cheated over multiple seasons by having an undercover staffer on other team sidelines and attending games in the stands. A true psyop. The argument that schools across the country do the same thing is probably somewhat correct, but I doubt it’s to this degree.
I’m asking, are you arguing the program should be left alone simply because they are good this year? Also, should the allegations be dealt with after season?
What i dont get is that sign stealing is not illegal in the NFL but recording opposing teams practices like what the Patriots did is illegal which i understand so the NFL coaches knows its scouts at games watching their signs and plays so they put out dummy signs to confuse them but in College sign stealing is illegal but they can put out dummy signs the same way the NFL does, if sign stealing in football was so much of an advantage then Michigan wouldve won the last two Nattys instead of Georgia
sign stealing is a much bigger deal in college because the quarterbacks don’t have headsets. Signs are almost never used in the NFL, the quarterback is just told to play through his helmet and he repeats it to the team in the huddle.
IN game sign stealing is legal, You can also get recordings of games to scout, but I believe they must be independently made. Michigans problem is there staff member was attending and employing person to attend future opponents games for the purpose of advance scouting there signals. And that looks to be expressly illegal. this may have lead them to being able to differentiate the dummy signals from the true signals. Aparently TCU switched up there system after being tipped to what michagan had been doing. so no Natty
Here we are talking about all the players on Michigan’s team Benefiting from breaking rules of the game. You have to take away there playoff invitation or theirs no integrity. And no reason to play the game.