“Jason sent me this 5 page essay about what I make him feel like and you know what I told him chat? I told him Jason you’re crazy if you think I’m going to read all of that.” Mango 2020
M2K you are one of the most beloved people in a smash. You can't make everyone like you. I think you should try your best to look past it. There's a lot to still gain from being a voice in melee. TLDR: You will never be happy in life if you spend it worrying about what other people think
Definitely agree, although from watching his streams it sounds like his mentality is WAY BETTER recently, I hope he keeps it up, having a positive mindset is so important :) Hope the Melee is treating you well my gamer
M2K has always been my favorite commentator because he actually knows what he's talking about and he actually says what the player should be doing, which is what commentators should do.
Yeah for fighting games, most of us watching aren’t catching every little thing so I find him really informative and helps me understand the matches better
Not always, just watch Toph talking about Cpt Falcon TO A FALCON MAIN on Smash Commentary's Cringiest. People like an analytical commentator; no likes a backseat gamer.
I think mang0's default approach of encouraging everyone has always been what most people refer to as shitalking, which is of course the embodiment of old school melee and certainly does work for fueling certain people at doing better, and mang0 likely doesn't have bad intentions for doing so, but obviously not everyone operates that way or will get equally motivated by such things. I know for certain if I was a top level player, people talking bad about me would certainly fuel me to improve since I love proving people wrong and that's an aspect of my personality, but it's not how everyone operates.
@@EF0EWhich I think he did apologize for when Armada made that Twitlonger. He's stated before that he's hard on M2K and Armada cause they retired early and it wasn't over a huge issue like PP. He hated how half of the five gods simply gave-up when people like him and HBox are still going at it. It's why he spread the idea that Armada retired because of him and/or HBox, without comprehending how it affected Armada. HBox and Mang0 got along eventually due to a varying amount of factors. M2K and Armada had being radically opposing personalities different from HBox, lived further away (impacting time zones), and always felt that Mang0 didn't mean well with some of his isms. It's why he felt that HE couldn't fit in with the other Five Gods. But hey, Mang0 and M2K's business is not really ours to dictate.
Don’t forget the era where mang0 convinced everyone that m2k just plays lame and he’s nothing special and the community, who loves mango created an echo chamber of that. In a way, mango has always played with that priveledge. The priveledge of controlling the crowd in his favor while simultaneously undermining his competitors. Did mango mean to do it at the extent it happened…probabaly not. But mango did constantly say how m2k is just a lame player when he would take bad losses. It’s just the truth and I love mango.
@@1v1ed I think this is a valid criticism. I think Mang0 has also gotten better at being good to everyone and leaving it to just some shit talking. But nowadays I genuinely don’t think Mang0 would want to hurt m2k so it depends how much you wanna hold him for how he acted in the past.
Jason....come back and have this conversaton with Mang0 in person in private. I think we need to sit Hax, Leffen, Mang0, PP, Armada, Hbox, and you in a room and start fixing our community issues. This is how we move this community forward and grow it. All these names in vital to making this thing grow. Your stream and channel will also grow as a result which means more money for you. Stand up for yourself.
@@EF0EIt is a terrible idea, most these guys are online personalities. While I don't think they are 100% fake or even close, we all know where most of these guys priorities lie and that's, image/popularity/money. They'll say whatever so everyone's goldfish brains are satisfied for 3 days.
Hey Jason, been a long-term fan ever since when I entered the scene with smash 4 and saw you compete at apex 2015. I think this might be one of the best head spaces i've seen you in. I'm glad you seem to be enjoying yourself a little more. I appreciate that you speak so frankly and honestly about your experience in the community as well, keep doing you and i'll keep watching.
Can I just say how consistently creative and crazy moky is? He's been playing the same way but with improving execution each year. I know you beat him pre 2020 and even then he was crazy tough. Also I dont think mang0 hates you, I watch his analysis/streams sometimes and he talks good about you sometimes but he really cant control his own community and a small part of that just not a fan of you. Even an angel or a dead man cant please everyone, so keep your head up m2k
I'd love to see the return of M2K. You don't think there's a way to return to the game without engaging with the community in a public/social media fashion?
Sorry for being kinda weird and preachy but yeah healthy lifestyle hella underrated, there’s so much you can do to function super well for so long. A reasonably good diet, lots time in nature and natural elements. Read Mitochondriac Manifesto or The Primed Life when you have a chance for a detailed look into this kind of stuff, but the TL;DR is spend lots of time in nature, sunlight, cold showers if you’re up for it, and especially minimizing artificial light exposure after sunset, and you can have pristine health and energy for a really long time. But yeah even to just be like M2K being someone just living a pretty normal 21st life but just being sincerely himself and putting his heart into what he’s doing 100% of the time, he’s clearly not maintaining his mental sharpness.
Big difference between Mango's Fox and Falco compared to M2K's Sheik and Marth is that Mango plays almost all of the matchups with both other than Falco Puff. I remember when M2K was active he really always seemed to do best with just Marth. There were events here and there where he would do well with Sheik, like that one Pax where he pwned Leffen, but generally speaking it was always Marth vs the top guys, Sheik vs people worse than him or for people who played characters that got abused by Sheik. M2K's Fox honestly just felt like a pocket character for Puff. I do agree though that playing so many different games had to be extremely difficult especially because they are so similar but so different that it can completely throw you off.
Armada being “super retired” definitely tracks. he literally doesn’t even call himself a melee player anymore, hell he barely even calls himself a FORMER melee player anymore, and has said multiple times he will never come back. Like bro just iced the part of his life and acted like him even visiting majors was some overreach we wouldn’t expect him to do. He really is cold turkey, like Smashcon 2018 will very VERY likely be the last tournament he ever goes to before he’s dead.
i got 56 milliseconds on that reaction test, i connected my finger to my eyes directly or something because i was getting 200 before that. and no i never clicked when it was red.
@@EmeraldaKasimwether something is nice to listen to or not… has nothing to do with any of us trying commentary. Some people are better to listen to and other are hard to listen to. I don’t think I can do it better and I don’t care to commentate. I just care about having good commentary. We have this issue in rocket league esports too, a few great commentators and a lot of mid ones. Doesn’t mean I think I can do it better, I just have taste and opinions.
ngl seeing how terrible Zain played and how Mang0 pretty much only won because of that changed my opinion on the 10-0. At first I was like "why would you ever be happy about such a one sided set" but this gave me a different perspective. Zain honestly needed to set the record straight and take him down a peg cause this was heartbreaking, and clearly not indicative of his skill, and Mang0 could not be allowed to act like he's hot shit cause of it.
Jason having been around for a long time in this scene, I really think you are drastically kver estimating mang0s negative impact on your career and how much people respect you. If anything I think the smash doc was one of the most negative impacts on the perception of your game play. Everybody beginning to believe you played like a robot, when you very clearly don't, did not help.
can't make everyone like you man, it's not like mango tells the community to hate on you, he doesn't like you personally and he is entitled to that opinion, i personally like you very much m2k and i like mango too, if you have issues with him personally i don't think this "drama" that you're putting out there is the way to go about it.
....Didnt your phone read his number on stream out loud when you were drunk long time ago? I thought this was the reason he banned you and doesnt like you.
@@lotgxj9 having to change a 10+ year old number must be the top 10 most annoying things to do in life. M2k should know not to release that info, drunk or not. Not everyone has to like each other in real life.
@@MrIntoxicatedMonkey ok wether is annoying or not something small done as a mistake shouldn't be this big of a deal and having to change a number is a simple as going or calling your cellular telling them to change it and texting your contacts not that big of a deal
@@MrIntoxicatedMonkeyit’s not that he “didn’t know not to do that”, it was an unintentional accident. People have made far FAR worse damaging and unintentional accidents (ever heard of Chernobyl?) but how severe the consequences are doesn’t change the fact that they are accident.
M2k's reaction speed is 3 frames. Holy shit. There comes a point in smash where you realize in the middle of a scramble. "I can see everything that's happening" Where you instinctually know the "turn data" (frame data without looking at it) and I like to think M2k has this flow state on at all times
@@ayrtonpavot3096 Facts the average person is around 250-300 and if you train it you can reach the 170-200 range, but you need to remember that a visual reaction speed doesn't correlate to being able to input at those speeds as well.
@@caeluse The accursed "I can see the attack coming, and there's nothing I can do to stop it" At least now you get the hindsight of falling into the hit
damn wtf that is such petty silly reason to ban from chat, and from frigging nine years ago too agree that complaining about age is a silly john, it's about being or staying in playing shape man if Armada didn't win SmashCon2018 then that wouldn't have been a tourny victory high point for him to retire off of, feels bad man because Em Two Kay I always regarded as a triple main gatekeeper much in similar way to how HBox is a playstyle gatekeeper with Puff, and as much hate that he gets for his playstyle, the presence of his gatekeeping is important for the health of the meta if I were to really boil it down though, it's the ledge shenanigans and playing from the ledge that I feel is the real and proper aspect of Em Two Kay's gatekeeping playstyle, because his ledge play is unrivalled and seldom seen anywhere else, Em Two Kay can dominate and/or swing entire sets by abusing the ledge, he'll make your stocks just vanish and disappear out of nowhere, Leffen so much as even complained about it in the same breath he complains about HBox playstyle, and if Leffen is complaining about it, it means you're doing something right imo haha, I miss the days when we didn't have to care about being "e-sports friendly" when Mango used to say "press 1 if you hate Leffen" numerous different times when he was on commentary headset at events PAX Prime 2015 is a fondly remembered example that demonstrates both his sneaky ledge play and a 3-0 win over Leffen
MAngo is good in controlling narratives. He can be entertaining and a good storyteller but people give him too much power. I also think Mango is a big reason Cody gets a lot of hate.
Yup, I hope this changes one day, but the reason he gets away with it is because that side of the melee community is very cliquish. It's not that we enable it constantly, it's more like multiple people behave similarly to him. A good example is Leffen, who is so blatant with it, he actually fs around and finds out.
@@Sax20XX That's the mang0. I think overall mang0 will shit talk people since that's old school melee, most shouldn't take it personally, and he likely doesn't have bad intentions, but inevitably some people won't take it that way.
Nah Cody gets hate because he plays Fox with z jump and comes across as whiny on the internet. We don’t know the guy personally but his internet presence is overall wack
@@queuedjar4578 I agree there's not always bad intentions from mang0, but m2k is a clear example of someone who got the short end of the stick from shit mang0 does. He just needs to be the bigger man way more if he wants to talk shit
Thats actually not supposed to be a surprise to anyone thats been on Melee for the last 10 years. Its been multiple ocasions, but I remember when M2K won Canada Cup and Mango made an analysis saying that he wasnt playing well and it was a lot more on Leffen playing bad. Fanny story, cause thats actually what happened with a lot of Mangos tourney wins on recent years (Summit 11 was basically Zain throwing away). Armada has similar hate, maybe more cause he was a much more consistent player and has won more tournaments; but the thing is: Ive never seen Mango beating M2K when Jason was on a good moment and clearly the guy is upset about it. Since 90% of the Melee community is braindead regarding Mango, the kid simply has a freepass, só he can say whatever he wants, like hes Goat when hes not even close to Armada after 5 years of retirement.
i don't really like Mang0 but saying that he isn't even close to Armada on the goat debate seems a little bit abused imo, even tho the arguments from people who placed him as the goat past summit 11 are kinda weird
@@L3Louch__ Armada has been retired for 5 years and is still the biggest Genesis champion and we're not counting the fact that he has an Apex when it was a Super major. Mango is nowhere near that. Even though they bota have 2 EVO titles, Armada has 4 grands. Trust me, its not by any means close.
not saying mang0 isn't biased but he is a strong believer in the idea that melee is not being played well a lot of the time. its probably because he's a competitor and admitting that others are playing well might hinder is confidence which he relies on but i dont think its personal in the slightest.
@@123rtXd The part about his confidence is true, but you wouldnt see other players hating like that most of the time. Thats toxic af and you can see that on his fanbase.
Way to do exactly what you’re criticizing. “Could barely graduate from highschool” They guy is nearly 40, what does that even mean? High school means absolutely nothing. Also how is he so world class at smash if he’s so dumb? Clearly he’s got intelligence that you just don’t respect.
@krusher181 he brags about cheating to graduate high school. He is very talented at a video game, but has treated M2K and many others like shit. He gets away with it because he's funny. What I said is still correct
Mang0 is so hype people ignore the fac that he propagated so much toxicicity against not just the 5 Gods but anyone he'd play against. Especially Hungrybox
shit talk isn't against any rules, mango brings the hype and doesn't pull punches, i don't always like him, he's obviously an asshole sometimes, but its stupid to quit because you're getting shit talked in a non violent way
The age thing actually delves into some dark government secrets, but I imagine that's not where we wanted to take this narrative. It's true though: age hardly matters for your physical condition. A lot of the statistics we have been fed from the times we were born up to now are merely experiments with outside factors that deliberately aren't shown to the public. Our age of mortality is lower than it should be for more reasons than just pollution, but it's a big part. The biggest thing is that no one actually tunes in to their own Soul. If you could understand what your body is actually made of instead of focusing on the scientific aspects of our composition, you'd do so much more when trying to accomplish anything.
Always knew mango is a bully ... good player yes... he wants to be the best player in the world again and I respect that. But he is not a sensible guy that you could talk things out far from that.
Nah, it's a good reason, just not entirely elaborated on. The melee community operates like a lame high school clique with people like mang0 as the head of the spear. You can't expect a dude like m2k to stand up for himself successfully against that, so he just withdrew
@Cronalixz Yeah I mean he could have kept going, it's not like some pretty self explanatory health reason or something like ppmd that makes you go, "oh okay." But at the end of the day some people just don't have it in them to not be well liked in their community. Especially for something like Melee which doesn't make money for 99.9% of people and can easily be enjoyed at home so whatever.
Hard to be *too* cocky when you can back it up for almost 20 years straight Ronaldo is the exact same way in football/soccer. He’s not American at all.
Honestly I don't mind seeing competitors be cocky as long as they don't make things weirdly personal and know when to cool it. So many Smash players nowadays seem to be kinda afraid of hyping themselves up at all out of fear of them getting roasted if they don't back it up. If that's how they genuinely are then that's fine, I don't want this to be like the WWE where everyone is playing a character, but I'd be lying if I said that beef and drama between players didn't make me more invested to watch Smash events.
Anyone who dislikes you is a vocal minority. You are a treasure to the community, M2K.
Damn I didn't know that 159 people make up the majority
“Jason sent me this 5 page essay about what I make him feel like and you know what I told him chat? I told him Jason you’re crazy if you think I’m going to read all of that.” Mango 2020
Modern mango bikes 20 miles and is friends with Hbox
I think I remember this one. At the time, I just thought it was kind of funny... not so funny from the other perspective :(
respectfully id say the same thing.
_Proceeded by the patented Mang0 laugh_
M2K you are one of the most beloved people in a smash. You can't make everyone like you. I think you should try your best to look past it. There's a lot to still gain from being a voice in melee.
TLDR: You will never be happy in life if you spend it worrying about what other people think
Didn't expect to see you here WillyMac. Love your content. Still crazy that a commentator made Hasan into a lolcow LMAO
Willymac smash arc lets go
Definitely agree, although from watching his streams it sounds like his mentality is WAY BETTER recently, I hope he keeps it up, having a positive mindset is so important :)
Hope the Melee is treating you well my gamer
"2005 me would have killed that. If I was in the army, lost an arm, I still would have killed that" lmao
"I'm not a rapper"
@Mew2king the high energy agressive vibe is really good for you keep it up
M2K has always been my favorite commentator because he actually knows what he's talking about and he actually says what the player should be doing, which is what commentators should do.
Yeah for fighting games, most of us watching aren’t catching every little thing so I find him really informative and helps me understand the matches better
Not always, just watch Toph talking about Cpt Falcon TO A FALCON MAIN on Smash Commentary's Cringiest. People like an analytical commentator; no likes a backseat gamer.
same thing with PPMD
I've really only ever heard mango speak well about you on stream
I think mang0's default approach of encouraging everyone has always been what most people refer to as shitalking, which is of course the embodiment of old school melee and certainly does work for fueling certain people at doing better, and mang0 likely doesn't have bad intentions for doing so, but obviously not everyone operates that way or will get equally motivated by such things. I know for certain if I was a top level player, people talking bad about me would certainly fuel me to improve since I love proving people wrong and that's an aspect of my personality, but it's not how everyone operates.
@@EF0E “You don’t remember? Mew2king he’s the OG”. Mango 2024
@@EF0EWhich I think he did apologize for when Armada made that Twitlonger.
He's stated before that he's hard on M2K and Armada cause they retired early and it wasn't over a huge issue like PP. He hated how half of the five gods simply gave-up when people like him and HBox are still going at it. It's why he spread the idea that Armada retired because of him and/or HBox, without comprehending how it affected Armada.
HBox and Mang0 got along eventually due to a varying amount of factors. M2K and Armada had being radically opposing personalities different from HBox, lived further away (impacting time zones), and always felt that Mang0 didn't mean well with some of his isms. It's why he felt that HE couldn't fit in with the other Five Gods.
But hey, Mang0 and M2K's business is not really ours to dictate.
Don’t forget the era where mang0 convinced everyone that m2k just plays lame and he’s nothing special and the community, who loves mango created an echo chamber of that. In a way, mango has always played with that priveledge. The priveledge of controlling the crowd in his favor while simultaneously undermining his competitors. Did mango mean to do it at the extent it happened…probabaly not. But mango did constantly say how m2k is just a lame player when he would take bad losses. It’s just the truth and I love mango.
@@1v1ed
I think this is a valid criticism. I think Mang0 has also gotten better at being good to everyone and leaving it to just some shit talking. But nowadays I genuinely don’t think Mang0 would want to hurt m2k so it depends how much you wanna hold him for how he acted in the past.
Jason....come back and have this conversaton with Mang0 in person in private. I think we need to sit Hax, Leffen, Mang0, PP, Armada, Hbox, and you in a room and start fixing our community issues. This is how we move this community forward and grow it. All these names in vital to making this thing grow. Your stream and channel will also grow as a result which means more money for you.
Stand up for yourself.
@@EF0EI genuinely think Leffen could have a mature conversation about it, even if he's been really immature in the past
@@tetros5265 LMAO! While I don't think leffen is as big of a "villain" as most people. Bro thinks leffen can have a genuine and serious conversation.
@@EF0EIt is a terrible idea, most these guys are online personalities. While I don't think they are 100% fake or even close, we all know where most of these guys priorities lie and that's, image/popularity/money. They'll say whatever so everyone's goldfish brains are satisfied for 3 days.
The nonchalant trauma drop at the beginning 😢 i admire how you keep moving forward.
Cozying up for a rest while hbox lands a rest is peak melee
Hey Jason, been a long-term fan ever since when I entered the scene with smash 4 and saw you compete at apex 2015. I think this might be one of the best head spaces i've seen you in. I'm glad you seem to be enjoying yourself a little more. I appreciate that you speak so frankly and honestly about your experience in the community as well, keep doing you and i'll keep watching.
I’ve also been banned in mang0s twitch for joking about him playing CS and not practicing melee. It’s been like 15 years
Can I just say how consistently creative and crazy moky is? He's been playing the same way but with improving execution each year. I know you beat him pre 2020 and even then he was crazy tough. Also I dont think mang0 hates you, I watch his analysis/streams sometimes and he talks good about you sometimes but he really cant control his own community and a small part of that just not a fan of you. Even an angel or a dead man cant please everyone, so keep your head up m2k
ARMADA WAS COMMENTATING OMGGGGGGG
I'd love to see the return of M2K. You don't think there's a way to return to the game without engaging with the community in a public/social media fashion?
I hope he comes back too
unfortunately the melee community has been that way since the dawn of it's existence. I think any competitive thing would typically have that.
As someone who really fears aging this is pretty encouraging lol
It's only bad when you're like 75+. Live healthy & you will be fine.
Sorry for being kinda weird and preachy but yeah healthy lifestyle hella underrated, there’s so much you can do to function super well for so long. A reasonably good diet, lots time in nature and natural elements. Read Mitochondriac Manifesto or The Primed Life when you have a chance for a detailed look into this kind of stuff, but the TL;DR is spend lots of time in nature, sunlight, cold showers if you’re up for it, and especially minimizing artificial light exposure after sunset, and you can have pristine health and energy for a really long time.
But yeah even to just be like M2K being someone just living a pretty normal 21st life but just being sincerely himself and putting his heart into what he’s doing 100% of the time, he’s clearly not maintaining his mental sharpness.
Love the melee content and energy in this video. Great vid
account screen refresh rate for mouse click reaction time
"my 2006 fix just killed him twice! give me the controller!!" lmaooo, love u m2k
Big difference between Mango's Fox and Falco compared to M2K's Sheik and Marth is that Mango plays almost all of the matchups with both other than Falco Puff. I remember when M2K was active he really always seemed to do best with just Marth. There were events here and there where he would do well with Sheik, like that one Pax where he pwned Leffen, but generally speaking it was always Marth vs the top guys, Sheik vs people worse than him or for people who played characters that got abused by Sheik. M2K's Fox honestly just felt like a pocket character for Puff. I do agree though that playing so many different games had to be extremely difficult especially because they are so similar but so different that it can completely throw you off.
"If you don't like how much you suck, then work on not sucking" banger of a quote
He banned me for telling him to clean his controller as a joke
Armada being “super retired” definitely tracks. he literally doesn’t even call himself a melee player anymore, hell he barely even calls himself a FORMER melee player anymore, and has said multiple times he will never come back. Like bro just iced the part of his life and acted like him even visiting majors was some overreach we wouldn’t expect him to do. He really is cold turkey, like Smashcon 2018 will very VERY likely be the last tournament he ever goes to before he’s dead.
i got 56 milliseconds on that reaction test, i connected my finger to my eyes directly or something because i was getting 200 before that. and no i never clicked when it was red.
156 Ms is insane…. I’m like 200 if I’m lucky
He might have calibrated his monitor better for lag! But yes his reaction times are amazing.
213 for me... but I'm on a 60hz monitor so that might have something to do with it
ending the stream by going to sleep is something I wish more streamers did.
watching this made me realize walt overhyped as commentator
There's a handful of people that can do commentary well and everyone else is just utter dogshit
@@neobiblicalI’d like to see you try
He’s a great content creator but yeah I’ve never even noticed him when he commentates. He’s just there
@@EmeraldaKasimwether something is nice to listen to or not… has nothing to do with any of us trying commentary.
Some people are better to listen to and other are hard to listen to. I don’t think I can do it better and I don’t care to commentate. I just care about having good commentary.
We have this issue in rocket league esports too, a few great commentators and a lot of mid ones. Doesn’t mean I think I can do it better, I just have taste and opinions.
@@EmeraldaKasim I'd also be dogshit and scar and toph are still the absolute fucking best what's your point
What a banger tweet
Always been an M2K fan and love to see your content in any form
dayum it's interesting to hear this about mango dawggy, thanks for the insight!
hear about the stories form hugs and the people mang0 surrounds himself with
ngl seeing how terrible Zain played and how Mang0 pretty much only won because of that changed my opinion on the 10-0. At first I was like "why would you ever be happy about such a one sided set" but this gave me a different perspective. Zain honestly needed to set the record straight and take him down a peg cause this was heartbreaking, and clearly not indicative of his skill, and Mang0 could not be allowed to act like he's hot shit cause of it.
Jason having been around for a long time in this scene, I really think you are drastically kver estimating mang0s negative impact on your career and how much people respect you. If anything I think the smash doc was one of the most negative impacts on the perception of your game play. Everybody beginning to believe you played like a robot, when you very clearly don't, did not help.
What’s the website for the ms reaction
I don't even play melee anymore but please come back to tourneys.
can't make everyone like you man, it's not like mango tells the community to hate on you, he doesn't like you personally and he is entitled to that opinion, i personally like you very much m2k and i like mango too, if you have issues with him personally i don't think this "drama" that you're putting out there is the way to go about it.
It's childish as shit tbh
He tried to resolve it behind closed doors. Mango literally said too long didn’t read lol.
Mew2King the 🐐 🐐
ultimate poisoning
OMG your reaction time is INSANE
Mang0? I have never consumed his content despite being named after my favourite fruit.
King, you're the king for a reason
1:40 was a great ad lib
....Didnt your phone read his number on stream out loud when you were drunk long time ago? I thought this was the reason he banned you and doesnt like you.
Why would he be mad about that, that seems like a accident not a genuine reason for hate
@@lotgxj9 having to change a 10+ year old number must be the top 10 most annoying things to do in life. M2k should know not to release that info, drunk or not. Not everyone has to like each other in real life.
@@MrIntoxicatedMonkey ok wether is annoying or not something small done as a mistake shouldn't be this big of a deal and having to change a number is a simple as going or calling your cellular telling them to change it and texting your contacts not that big of a deal
@@MrIntoxicatedMonkey youre missing the point entirely of what hes trying to say
@@MrIntoxicatedMonkeyit’s not that he “didn’t know not to do that”, it was an unintentional accident. People have made far FAR worse damaging and unintentional accidents (ever heard of Chernobyl?) but how severe the consequences are doesn’t change the fact that they are accident.
Haters will hate M2K, keep doing you 👍🏽
So all 4 other gods had beef with Mango at some point?
4:37 The Armada Thumbnail!
M2K is forever a goat
WE LOVE M2K
Haha I loved that ending.
M2k's reaction speed is 3 frames. Holy shit. There comes a point in smash where you realize in the middle of a scramble. "I can see everything that's happening" Where you instinctually know the "turn data" (frame data without looking at it) and I like to think M2k has this flow state on at all times
161 is roughly 10 frames
@@mymyscellany original commenter is wrong but 10 frames is still darn impressive
@@ayrtonpavot3096 Facts the average person is around 250-300 and if you train it you can reach the 170-200 range, but you need to remember that a visual reaction speed doesn't correlate to being able to input at those speeds as well.
not true, not even close
@@caeluse The accursed "I can see the attack coming, and there's nothing I can do to stop it" At least now you get the hindsight of falling into the hit
I mean... being banned in chat for 9 years is pretty funny tho
M2K
damn wtf that is such petty silly reason to ban from chat, and from frigging nine years ago too
agree that complaining about age is a silly john, it's about being or staying in playing shape
man if Armada didn't win SmashCon2018 then that wouldn't have been a tourny victory high point for him to retire off of, feels bad man because Em Two Kay I always regarded as a triple main gatekeeper much in similar way to how HBox is a playstyle gatekeeper with Puff, and as much hate that he gets for his playstyle, the presence of his gatekeeping is important for the health of the meta
if I were to really boil it down though, it's the ledge shenanigans and playing from the ledge that I feel is the real and proper aspect of Em Two Kay's gatekeeping playstyle, because his ledge play is unrivalled and seldom seen anywhere else, Em Two Kay can dominate and/or swing entire sets by abusing the ledge, he'll make your stocks just vanish and disappear out of nowhere, Leffen so much as even complained about it in the same breath he complains about HBox playstyle, and if Leffen is complaining about it, it means you're doing something right imo haha, I miss the days when we didn't have to care about being "e-sports friendly" when Mango used to say "press 1 if you hate Leffen" numerous different times when he was on commentary headset at events
PAX Prime 2015 is a fondly remembered example that demonstrates both his sneaky ledge play and a 3-0 win over Leffen
I forgot he did this LMAO
The deep lore... lol. HBox has always had it in for Jason.
I remember Hbox has often said M2K is his favorite smash player ever. Back in the day M2K has been the most friendly with HBOX.
i cant find it, where?
@@Risky_Boots999 He mentioned it on his stream and blur mentioned Hbox told him this
MAngo is good in controlling narratives. He can be entertaining and a good storyteller but people give him too much power. I also think Mango is a big reason Cody gets a lot of hate.
Yup, I hope this changes one day, but the reason he gets away with it is because that side of the melee community is very cliquish. It's not that we enable it constantly, it's more like multiple people behave similarly to him. A good example is Leffen, who is so blatant with it, he actually fs around and finds out.
Nah Cody is just an obnoxious dork the hate comes naturally.
@@Sax20XX That's the mang0. I think overall mang0 will shit talk people since that's old school melee, most shouldn't take it personally, and he likely doesn't have bad intentions, but inevitably some people won't take it that way.
Nah Cody gets hate because he plays Fox with z jump and comes across as whiny on the internet. We don’t know the guy personally but his internet presence is overall wack
@@queuedjar4578 I agree there's not always bad intentions from mang0, but m2k is a clear example of someone who got the short end of the stick from shit mang0 does. He just needs to be the bigger man way more if he wants to talk shit
Get back into melee
dang is 160 ms good?
He’s in the 92nd percentile
love you m2k
Thats actually not supposed to be a surprise to anyone thats been on Melee for the last 10 years.
Its been multiple ocasions, but I remember when M2K won Canada Cup and Mango made an analysis saying that he wasnt playing well and it was a lot more on Leffen playing bad. Fanny story, cause thats actually what happened with a lot of Mangos tourney wins on recent years (Summit 11 was basically Zain throwing away).
Armada has similar hate, maybe more cause he was a much more consistent player and has won more tournaments; but the thing is: Ive never seen Mango beating M2K when Jason was on a good moment and clearly the guy is upset about it. Since 90% of the Melee community is braindead regarding Mango, the kid simply has a freepass, só he can say whatever he wants, like hes Goat when hes not even close to Armada after 5 years of retirement.
i don't really like Mang0 but saying that he isn't even close to Armada on the goat debate seems a little bit abused imo, even tho the arguments from people who placed him as the goat past summit 11 are kinda weird
@@L3Louch__ Armada has been retired for 5 years and is still the biggest Genesis champion and we're not counting the fact that he has an Apex when it was a Super major. Mango is nowhere near that. Even though they bota have 2 EVO titles, Armada has 4 grands. Trust me, its not by any means close.
not saying mang0 isn't biased but he is a strong believer in the idea that melee is not being played well a lot of the time. its probably because he's a competitor and admitting that others are playing well might hinder is confidence which he relies on but i dont think its personal in the slightest.
@@123rtXd The part about his confidence is true, but you wouldnt see other players hating like that most of the time. Thats toxic af and you can see that on his fanbase.
i swear m2k is the best streamer and personality now, if he just stopped wasting effort on ultimate he could dominate melee twitch imo
Mango is a childish bully that could barely graduate from high school and has made a career on maintaining this childish high-school bully persona.
Way to do exactly what you’re criticizing. “Could barely graduate from highschool”
They guy is nearly 40, what does that even mean? High school means absolutely nothing.
Also how is he so world class at smash if he’s so dumb? Clearly he’s got intelligence that you just don’t respect.
Hmmm
@krusher181 he brags about cheating to graduate high school. He is very talented at a video game, but has treated M2K and many others like shit. He gets away with it because he's funny. What I said is still correct
Nearly 40? He’s 32 😂
School doesn't really mean anything nowadays lol not for most men that is xD but yeah agree on the bully part.
Mang0 is so hype people ignore the fac that he propagated so much toxicicity against not just the 5 Gods but anyone he'd play against. Especially Hungrybox
I fell like nobody can scrap with mang and everyone is trying to instead of sticking to bread and butters and it cost them.
George Foreman
m2k is such a hater on that zain match its hilarious
M2k I ledgedash with falco 🥺
Bro you are goated for being fun. Bro's probably jealous.
leave zain alone bro 😭😭
shit talk isn't against any rules, mango brings the hype and doesn't pull punches, i don't always like him, he's obviously an asshole sometimes, but its stupid to quit because you're getting shit talked in a non violent way
lol the ending
The age thing actually delves into some dark government secrets, but I imagine that's not where we wanted to take this narrative. It's true though: age hardly matters for your physical condition. A lot of the statistics we have been fed from the times we were born up to now are merely experiments with outside factors that deliberately aren't shown to the public. Our age of mortality is lower than it should be for more reasons than just pollution, but it's a big part. The biggest thing is that no one actually tunes in to their own Soul. If you could understand what your body is actually made of instead of focusing on the scientific aspects of our composition, you'd do so much more when trying to accomplish anything.
m2k 1v1 zain
I like caffeine m2k
I ❤ you Jason
M2King
Always knew mango is a bully ... good player yes... he wants to be the best player in the world again and I respect that. But he is not a sensible guy that you could talk things out far from that.
Best Overall Smash Player ever : Mew2King
Best Melee Player ever : Mang0
Imo theres no debate on either one.
0:50 that's a pretty lame reason my guy
I kind of get it.
Nah, it's a good reason, just not entirely elaborated on. The melee community operates like a lame high school clique with people like mang0 as the head of the spear. You can't expect a dude like m2k to stand up for himself successfully against that, so he just withdrew
@Cronalixz Yeah I mean he could have kept going, it's not like some pretty self explanatory health reason or something like ppmd that makes you go, "oh okay." But at the end of the day some people just don't have it in them to not be well liked in their community. Especially for something like Melee which doesn't make money for 99.9% of people and can easily be enjoyed at home so whatever.
I always felt like mango is just too cocky, he's like, what i doesn't like about america, in fact.
Hard to be *too* cocky when you can back it up for almost 20 years straight
Ronaldo is the exact same way in football/soccer. He’s not American at all.
"If you don't like America, then u can GIIIT OUT.🦅" (joke)
@@b51a5h "dey took our jawbs!"
Honestly I don't mind seeing competitors be cocky as long as they don't make things weirdly personal and know when to cool it.
So many Smash players nowadays seem to be kinda afraid of hyping themselves up at all out of fear of them getting roasted if they don't back it up. If that's how they genuinely are then that's fine, I don't want this to be like the WWE where everyone is playing a character, but I'd be lying if I said that beef and drama between players didn't make me more invested to watch Smash events.
Why would anyone like M2King after he excessively complained about Peach being broken in the Final Smash Meter ruleset
Refund
I do not believe mango hates you, or anyone
That's kinda funny xD
ha