Its hard and expensive, the area is flat and low, so making a bridge tall enough to account for the major shipping traffic is difficult, but not impossible there’s been proposals however the Life Guard needs to sign off with the new designs which may include restructuring some old really tall boats.
This should have been a tunnel. The bridge either needs to be the same height as the 205 bridge or remain a draw bridge in order to accommodate navy/coast guard vessels. Personally, I think we need a 3rd bridge/tunnel option on the westside to divert traffic away from downtown.
I personally love suspension bridges, and i know we have a few of those already but I just find those so cool. And they don't take up too much of the view. And above all, the new bridge just needs to fix the traffic. I 5 north in north Portland after like 2 PM is so bad, and I'm glad I don't have to drive it as much as others but yeah, the bridge currently causes so many backups
@@BellaMirelli It can't be a suspension bridge. Pearson Airfield is historic and can't be moved, limiting the bridge's height. And the Coast Guard is asking for 178 feet of clearance, about 60 more the the current bridge, limiting how low it can be. It's going to be a narrow, boring slice.
i dont care what it looks like. i just want a safe, functional bridge that isnt 100+ years old that doesnt stop for boat traffic making your commute 2-3 hours
It includes pedestrian bike and rail to connect the citiies further. Vancouver developers were moronic to put their "Waterfront" right next to what was known to be a giant infrastructure project since the 90's. This wasn't exactly a shock that this was going to happen.
This is absolutely hideous…even as a concept. They are going to screw up the waterfronts on both sides. Either build a tunnel or revitalize the existing structures and add toll bridges east of the 205 and west of the 5 near Cornelius Pass.
Why are the interchanges so massive? I thought there were solutions that were cheaper to get rid of these massive interchanges like roundabout bridge interchanges. That’s peoples property. Seriously remove the whole historical library and Theator, also some of the massive buildings?
Almost 30 years of this crap and we still don't have a bridge. Millions wasted. Where is the light rail in the design? Why are Americans so ok with living in mediocracy? When I was living in Japan, they completed a tunnel connecting tohoku and hokkaido with a bullet train under the sea floor. What the hell is wrong with us? We're pathetic compared to other parts of the world.
Japan is also the size of 1.5 Oregons with 24 times the population. Even then the shinkansen costs almost as much as air travel. The MAX doesn't do a good job selling rail travel either, sooo slow.
@@zaurenstoates7306 yeah and they also have a luxury train that's like $10,000 per night, so what? what's so damn hard about building a bridge with a tram on it, across the river? A project like this for the Japanese would be a no brainer and done in a year.
@@singsongshow it's a no brainer for Japan as they have a ton more people to move and excellent light rail in the large cities. A few of those cities house the entirety of Oregons population. I'm personally for adding and improving light rail, but comparing our needs to Japan should have some context attached The price of the shinkansen is relevant context too, the tourist pass is a great deal but outside of that it's just about equivalent to flying. That's with their clock work schedules, high ridership and excellent connectivity. I'm skeptical that hsr can take off without first having robust light rail networks and the populations to support.
how long will it take them to build the new bridge, if it takes a long time, then we are stuck with just 205 bridge and that will be horrible with all the traffic
This project simply cannot move forward as currently proposed. It’s over budget, not climate friendly, and will completely destroy the booming Vancouver waterfront with noise and ugliness. The proposed alignment goes over the top of the new waterfront market building. I wish they would more thoroughly consider a tunnel option.
@@SamuelGere Nuh uh, I’ve done a lot of photography in the area, it is really beautiful but sadly it is WAY to old, and needs to go. But I wish they had better proposals
No one has even tried to develop a tunnel idea instead. It would satisfy the airspace restrictions of PDX and the Pearson airfield, the Coast Guard clearance issues, and would not look at all as ghastly as these bland and monstrous bridges. And don't say it can't be done. BC is currently building a tunnel across the Fraser River in the same soil conditions across a similarly sized river.
I like the cap by the MAX stop. Should help cut down on noise while you're waiting for the train. Waiting at the stops next to 84 and 205 sucks. Definitely looking forward to easier transit access to Vancouver. Hopefully the service is frequent and runs later into the night.
what stands out to me the most is how plain and ordinary these designs are. The drawbridge design is just plain ugly. There is an opportunity here to add some character to the area. A draw, something you would see on postcards and know exactly where it is. It can be functional and artistic as well. Why more 60's and 70's looking eyesores. Fire these people and get more creative ones.
Don't call that a draw bridge. It is a lift span bridge. A draw bridge is like the Broadway and Burnside and Morrison. Would like to see a design concept for a swing span bridge similar to the old railroad bridge
Word to the Wise: One of the reasons Seattle got rid of its Alaskan Way Viaduct was due to the way it blocked the view of the water with ugly concrete.
We do need to build a new bridge that is true. But can you at least make it not look so hideous. It looks like the kinda brutalist, lifeless concrete behemoth that destroyed many city skylines.
I don’t get why people call these ugly. They look in line with other modern bridges. The main issue isn’t the aesthetics. It’s going to be the cost overruns and the long timelines. Leave it to our governments to waste our hard earned money.
Why still consider a draw bridge? Because the Coast Guard has final say over access for river traffic, and to meet international treaties there is a minimum height the bridge must be. It's a hell of a lot more intrusive and expensive to build the entire bridge that high than it is to use a drawbridge. Besides, the existing bridge only opens about once per day, and they won't open it during rush hour. Yes, it's inconvenient when it does open, but it really isn't a major problem in the overall scheme of things. Lots of tough decisions to make here.
We need something in a traditional style and iconic, not brutalist and an eyesore. I'd love something like the St. Johns bridge or maybe even the Fremont. We do NOT need another Marquam.
The draw bridge is super ugly with the huge plain stones sticking out. Perhaps get a few local artists to add some appeal to your plans or perhaps clear pointed quartz that you can light up at night.
We don’t want max, we don’t want tolls, we don’t want Portland’s crime, and we don’t want your ugly bridge. Also if you don’t fix the Rose Quarter how is this going to alleviate traffic?
Show us downtown Portland's I5 new look, as IF they'll ever do anything about it. This is just one more screwover for SWWA, enabled by our own horrific local politicians. Horrible.
They should have kept the Figg design, but it was thrown out due to not having light rail, which Clark County, WA continues to vote against. It also did not interfere with commercial river traffic. Your tax dollars at work.
A drawbridge option on an interstate? Again? I'd think there's a better workaround. I know some of the largest engineering solves would be the on/off ramps on either side. Just get an earthquake ready bridge that can handle the traffic AND light rail and let's get 'er done. At this point I could kinda care less of the design (no drawbridge!) and let's just get an updated span to better server the people.
Thanks for showing this. These are extremely disappointing from a design and visual engineering standpoint. Has no one been to another modern city like, uh, Seattle... or San Francisco... or any modern European German city with beautiful bridges? Can we not spend some money to build something beautiful that doesn't look like every other highway onramp out there ? Very disappointing that these 2 designs look like every single I-10 swamp overpass traversing northern Florida. We can and should pressure government to do better.
This is nothing to be getting excited about. Can anyone remember something as long as 10 years ago? Millions and I mean millions were spent on this same project with no results. Now we need a new design? Are bridge designers and planners dumber than a box of rocks? No doubt.
People in Vancouver complained about the MAX bringing crime and now they're complaining about a FREEWAY bridge. To paraphrase Allen Iverson, "We're talking aboout a freeway bridge, not a street bridge, not a street bridge. A freeway bridge. Not a street bridge. Urbanists go out there to city hall to speak for us the people who are the forgotten working class who go out to work everyday wondering if some selfish person in a Ford F 150 is going to cut into a crosswalk or into a bike lane and run us over while people in Vancouver are complaining about not only what doesn't matter but also harming millions of Americans each day with their tired, tried, ineffective, harmful and bigoted NIMBY logic. The people of Europe and Asia figured out what works a long time ago while we're stuck in the 1950s. Look where that got us, while these people were being them whining about welfare queens we elected a nepo baby and an actual welfare king acting like a spoiled kid in a grocery store that didn't get any candy because he's never stepped foot in one throughout his lifetime. No black woman in history has came anywhere near a fraction of the debt this guy has accumulated yet these people are whining about bridges and calling the cops on people just for not looking like them while my siblings and I worry about if we'll survive and get by 2025. Don't talk to us about how we're less than you and Rene Gonzalez is working class when we're the ones on the ground doing actual work. Not speeding around Portland like they own us and have the right to harm us."
Can't hear you with that stupid mask , what are you a train robber? Also, black people are like 14 % of America ..not every goddamn thing is about YOU .Jesus christ you whine
Another draw bridge option??? Why??? Congestion again plus we have to pay a toll to wait... SMH
Its hard and expensive, the area is flat and low, so making a bridge tall enough to account for the major shipping traffic is difficult, but not impossible there’s been proposals however the Life Guard needs to sign off with the new designs which may include restructuring some old really tall boats.
We are going to spend insane amounts of money, make it iconic. Golden gate style. This region needs something like that.
This should have been a tunnel. The bridge either needs to be the same height as the 205 bridge or remain a draw bridge in order to accommodate navy/coast guard vessels. Personally, I think we need a 3rd bridge/tunnel option on the westside to divert traffic away from downtown.
We should go with a tunnel instead. Vancouver, BC is rebuilding one of their freeways to use a bridge under the Fraser River.
ChatGPT, draw me a picture of an expensive bridge
This city should worry about its stench and bad image not expensive vanity projects
They are continuing to put brand new buildings in where this bridge is going like come on figure it out people.
I've got to say, neither design is particularly attractive. How about a design people will want to look at for the next 100yrs.
I personally love suspension bridges, and i know we have a few of those already but I just find those so cool. And they don't take up too much of the view. And above all, the new bridge just needs to fix the traffic. I 5 north in north Portland after like 2 PM is so bad, and I'm glad I don't have to drive it as much as others but yeah, the bridge currently causes so many backups
How about we build a bridge for movement of vehicles and not "make it attractive". It is a freeway bridge and needs to avoid a draw bridge design.
@@BellaMirelli It can't be a suspension bridge. Pearson Airfield is historic and can't be moved, limiting the bridge's height. And the Coast Guard is asking for 178 feet of clearance, about 60 more the the current bridge, limiting how low it can be. It's going to be a narrow, boring slice.
i dont care what it looks like. i just want a safe, functional bridge that isnt 100+ years old that doesnt stop for boat traffic making your commute 2-3 hours
These hideous bridge images make an excellent justification for building a tunnel instead.
I like that things are FINALLY starting to look like what sci-fi movies of my youth said the 2000s would look like.
it amazes me how they want to further seperate the city by putting this massive freeway here.
It includes pedestrian bike and rail to connect the citiies further. Vancouver developers were moronic to put their "Waterfront" right next to what was known to be a giant infrastructure project since the 90's. This wasn't exactly a shock that this was going to happen.
Just make a tunnel and drop the spans.
This is absolutely hideous…even as a concept. They are going to screw up the waterfronts on both sides. Either build a tunnel or revitalize the existing structures and add toll bridges east of the 205 and west of the 5 near Cornelius Pass.
Man I've been saying that too two extra Bridges would make so much more sense...
Why are the interchanges so massive?
I thought there were solutions that were cheaper to get rid of these massive interchanges like roundabout bridge interchanges.
That’s peoples property.
Seriously remove the whole historical library and Theator, also some of the massive buildings?
Almost 30 years of this crap and we still don't have a bridge. Millions wasted. Where is the light rail in the design? Why are Americans so ok with living in mediocracy? When I was living in Japan, they completed a tunnel connecting tohoku and hokkaido with a bullet train under the sea floor. What the hell is wrong with us? We're pathetic compared to other parts of the world.
Japan is also the size of 1.5 Oregons with 24 times the population. Even then the shinkansen costs almost as much as air travel.
The MAX doesn't do a good job selling rail travel either, sooo slow.
@@zaurenstoates7306 yeah and they also have a luxury train that's like $10,000 per night, so what? what's so damn hard about building a bridge with a tram on it, across the river? A project like this for the Japanese would be a no brainer and done in a year.
@@singsongshow it's a no brainer for Japan as they have a ton more people to move and excellent light rail in the large cities. A few of those cities house the entirety of Oregons population.
I'm personally for adding and improving light rail, but comparing our needs to Japan should have some context attached
The price of the shinkansen is relevant context too, the tourist pass is a great deal but outside of that it's just about equivalent to flying. That's with their clock work schedules, high ridership and excellent connectivity. I'm skeptical that hsr can take off without first having robust light rail networks and the populations to support.
God that concrete thing is horrific. Could they at else try to give it SOME beauty? Leave stuff like this in the last century
Please address me as Your Highness.
please build it with the priority to move traffic and not a "beauty". Decorate it with a light system.
No draw bridge
how long will it take them to build the new bridge, if it takes a long time, then we are stuck with just 205 bridge and that will be horrible with all the traffic
This project simply cannot move forward as currently proposed. It’s over budget, not climate friendly, and will completely destroy the booming Vancouver waterfront with noise and ugliness. The proposed alignment goes over the top of the new waterfront market building. I wish they would more thoroughly consider a tunnel option.
Or build two other bridges one by Cornelius pass one by Camas.
I lived in sanfrancisco, and grew up here. Oregonians just dont get it, the 205 bridge is a prime example
@@MrWiseinheart indeed, by doing so it would ensure the city of Portland would not have 'any' say in it, now to get Tri-Met out of the picture...
Well it sure is ugly. They got ugly 100% covered.
The bridge that have now is ugly
@@SamuelGereThe bridge we have now is already built
@@SamuelGere Nuh uh, I’ve done a lot of photography in the area, it is really beautiful but sadly it is WAY to old, and needs to go.
But I wish they had better proposals
Is this going to displace the Hayden Is residents (floating home owners etc)?
No one has even tried to develop a tunnel idea instead. It would satisfy the airspace restrictions of PDX and the Pearson airfield, the Coast Guard clearance issues, and would not look at all as ghastly as these bland and monstrous bridges. And don't say it can't be done. BC is currently building a tunnel across the Fraser River in the same soil conditions across a similarly sized river.
I like the cap by the MAX stop. Should help cut down on noise while you're waiting for the train. Waiting at the stops next to 84 and 205 sucks. Definitely looking forward to easier transit access to Vancouver. Hopefully the service is frequent and runs later into the night.
what stands out to me the most is how plain and ordinary these designs are. The drawbridge design is just plain ugly. There is an opportunity here to add some character to the area. A draw, something you would see on postcards and know exactly where it is. It can be functional and artistic as well. Why more 60's and 70's looking eyesores. Fire these people and get more creative ones.
Meet the New Gen z designers... 🤣
Don't call that a draw bridge. It is a lift span bridge. A draw bridge is like the Broadway and Burnside and Morrison.
Would like to see a design concept for a swing span bridge similar to the old railroad bridge
These options are awful and will completely destroy the Vancouver waterfront. The IBR team needs to revisit the immersed tunnel idea.
How could we consider a draw bridge when there is a double decker option??!!
Yuck…as a Vancouverite, they could do better. Don’t ruin our beautiful waterfront and skyline.
The bridge would likely have been completed by now and at a fraction of the cost if the damn government officials agreed on the project 20 years ago.
They could move the hurtle building west on wheeles or jacks rather then demolish it
Went across that bridge many times.
How I. The hell did this make the news. These are terribly unfinished plans with abysmal accuracy
Word to the Wise: One of the reasons Seattle got rid of its Alaskan Way Viaduct was due to the way it blocked the view of the water with ugly concrete.
Viaduct? Vhy no a chicken ?
We do need to build a new bridge that is true. But can you at least make it not look so hideous. It looks like the kinda brutalist, lifeless concrete behemoth that destroyed many city skylines.
Drawbridge is my fav
I don’t get why people call these ugly. They look in line with other modern bridges. The main issue isn’t the aesthetics. It’s going to be the cost overruns and the long timelines. Leave it to our governments to waste our hard earned money.
all that cost and time, why still consider a draw bridge?
Why still consider a draw bridge? Because the Coast Guard has final say over access for river traffic, and to meet international treaties there is a minimum height the bridge must be. It's a hell of a lot more intrusive and expensive to build the entire bridge that high than it is to use a drawbridge. Besides, the existing bridge only opens about once per day, and they won't open it during rush hour. Yes, it's inconvenient when it does open, but it really isn't a major problem in the overall scheme of things. Lots of tough decisions to make here.
We need something in a traditional style and iconic, not brutalist and an eyesore. I'd love something like the St. Johns bridge or maybe even the Fremont. We do NOT need another Marquam.
The draw bridge is super ugly with the huge plain stones sticking out. Perhaps get a few local artists to add some appeal to your plans or perhaps clear pointed quartz that you can light up at night.
Can’t wait for light rail
I pick the first one cause we need to Eliminate the Draw Bridge
We don’t want max, we don’t want tolls, we don’t want Portland’s crime, and we don’t want your ugly bridge. Also if you don’t fix the Rose Quarter how is this going to alleviate traffic?
Show us downtown Portland's I5 new look, as IF they'll ever do anything about it. This is just one more screwover for SWWA, enabled by our own horrific local politicians. Horrible.
They should have kept the Figg design, but it was thrown out due to not having light rail, which Clark County, WA continues to vote against. It also did not interfere with commercial river traffic. Your tax dollars at work.
A drawbridge option on an interstate? Again? I'd think there's a better workaround. I know some of the largest engineering solves would be the on/off ramps on either side. Just get an earthquake ready bridge that can handle the traffic AND light rail and let's get 'er done. At this point I could kinda care less of the design (no drawbridge!) and let's just get an updated span to better server the people.
There aren't any " earthquake " ready bridges you dork
Thanks for showing this. These are extremely disappointing from a design and visual engineering standpoint. Has no one been to another modern city like, uh, Seattle... or San Francisco... or any modern European German city with beautiful bridges? Can we not spend some money to build something beautiful that doesn't look like every other highway onramp out there ? Very disappointing that these 2 designs look like every single I-10 swamp overpass traversing northern Florida. We can and should pressure government to do better.
Looks fine. Build it. Get it over with.
I'll believe it when I see it !
This is nothing to be getting excited about. Can anyone remember something as long as 10 years ago? Millions and I mean millions were spent on this same project with no results. Now we need a new design? Are bridge designers and planners dumber than a box of rocks? No doubt.
Miller Melissa Garcia Michael Jones Michael
those concrete designs are perfect for Oregon, UGLY as ever, and not inviting
Could we see a simulation of a ship striking a pillar?
Stop it
Lol get the fruit outta here you dorks
It sucks !
People in Vancouver complained about the MAX bringing crime and now they're complaining about a FREEWAY bridge. To paraphrase Allen Iverson, "We're talking aboout a freeway bridge, not a street bridge, not a street bridge. A freeway bridge. Not a street bridge. Urbanists go out there to city hall to speak for us the people who are the forgotten working class who go out to work everyday wondering if some selfish person in a Ford F 150 is going to cut into a crosswalk or into a bike lane and run us over while people in Vancouver are complaining about not only what doesn't matter but also harming millions of Americans each day with their tired, tried, ineffective, harmful and bigoted NIMBY logic. The people of Europe and Asia figured out what works a long time ago while we're stuck in the 1950s. Look where that got us, while these people were being them whining about welfare queens we elected a nepo baby and an actual welfare king acting like a spoiled kid in a grocery store that didn't get any candy because he's never stepped foot in one throughout his lifetime. No black woman in history has came anywhere near a fraction of the debt this guy has accumulated yet these people are whining about bridges and calling the cops on people just for not looking like them while my siblings and I worry about if we'll survive and get by 2025. Don't talk to us about how we're less than you and Rene Gonzalez is working class when we're the ones on the ground doing actual work. Not speeding around Portland like they own us and have the right to harm us."
Can't hear you with that stupid mask , what are you a train robber? Also, black people are like 14 % of America ..not every goddamn thing is about YOU .Jesus christ you whine
None of your crap made sense angry little activist
Still talking this crap new bridge to replace the old I-5 Bridge over the Columbia River. This is been going on 20 years
It took 40 years of talking before they built the Golden Gate bridge. Maybe we need more talking. Maybe we need a tunnel.