This was fantastic and masterful. Having recently returned to the hobby after a near decade long break, I've been consuming a number of painting guides. This was the single best guide I have seen. Well done, and thank you for taking the time to share it
YYYYEAAAH!! Vinny V is tagging into the diagram ring!! Edit:Thought on the implications of this some more and felt compelled to add more exclamation points.
Thank you for your Hobby Cheating, Vince! Super informative and clear. I do have a suggestion to consider for a future video: varnishing for the purpose of a “save point”. I keep hearing people do this, but then I don’t know how they strip the paint after the “save point” (and keep what remained underneath). I know this would help my confidence and willingness to experiment with different techniques, colors, and so on. Thanks for considering this suggestion and thanks again for what you share!
huh, it's crazy because I always struggle with this concept.. but here you are, yet again explaining it in a way that is easy for us nubs to understand. Thanks for the lesson bro, much appreciated! I am going to give this a go!
Thankyou for your videos. This one has helped me loads. I was experimenting with this without fully understanding it and have done a few chaos marine models with this split lighting but I was going for a different coloured "sun" light and wasn't sure why it didn't look right from the back. The reason was I was completely colouring the rear in a similar focused light rather than a diffuse light (the sun is much further away!) when instead I should actually be shrinking that upward colour down to a spotlight and letting it only influence the highlights on the rest of the rear side. It suddenly clicked last night after watching this. It has however taught me a lot about lighting and layering so I'm still happy with them but I'm hoping to nail this on the next few tries. That occlusion zone really helps sell it. So thanks once again my dude - paintbrush salute.
Yet more reasons why I need to get an airbrush! I know you could probably get the same effect with a hair-brush, but this seems especiallyl well-suited for that tool.
Vince I’ve had the Warcry Catacombs set for a while now and I’ve never touched it fearing the dreaded fire freak dudes. You have just inspired me to do them with this video. A million thanks for this!
Vince's videos are always little islands of inspiration and positivity... ... I suffer from advanced depression and they give me a small break from it. Sorry if that comes off as 'heavy' in any way.
That means a great deal to me. It's not heavy at all, not even a little. Mental Health is far too undervalued by our society and it's perhaps the most important thing. It's one of the reasons I always try to focus my channel and my videos on positivity, because there is enough challenge in the world and our daily lives, we should have somethings in our life that can be a light of positivity.
Awesome as always. I appreciate your sharing your skill and understanding with us! OSL has often been done poorly, and yet this mini with red at top and blue at bottom looks amazing and is dramatically OSL'd. (lite-d? Lit? I dunno.) But thanks for using an extreme case to help highlight (pun intended) the differences when painting OSL - clever teaching technique!
Hello mate hope your good haven’t had a iPad for a while just got new one so will b watching everything again painting is going ok spent last year learning all new things so didn’t paint much but learn a lot this year trying to learn speed painting a bit thank u very much 4 all your help really appreciate your videos mate 👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
Vince, you've spent too much time staring at movie posters given the color choice for this one XD That mini and paint job KICKS ASS. Thanks for the great video.
I really like things like OSL and this dramatic lighting. Less a fan of things like NMM (especially when you can do TMM!) as that just feels like adding complexity for the sake of it, but these styles give a bunch of drama and sense of life to a piece
In architecture I both used and learned quite a lot about lighting in 3D modeling and digital matte painting. The lighting is based on real world conditions and translates nicely to art work theory. Miniature painting lighting however is completely all over the place with inconsistent, weird and hyper real practices. Even at high level. It must be really frustrating for beginners.
Yes, it's all a mix of real principles and of course artistic interpretation. Sometimes you are doing things just to make it read better or look cooler. :)
So inspirational as usual this is inspiring me to get a couple of demons that I have waiting in the wings completed in this style, as always Friend Amazing Work.
Thank you so much for this tutorial, great work! What I am frequently struggling with ist not knowing where to place believable highlights. Do you have any guidance for understanding volumes? Also: I noticed you are using the So Flat line by Golden lately. How do you like these paints?
I liek the golden flats, review will be coming eventually. as to where the place the highlights, this is a complicated question, but my basic answer is the top of the volumes, think of the top of the whole shape (i.e. the whole miniature), then each individual volume (muscles, shoulders, etc). If we're talking about generic light, you are basically creating a soft light from above. This is one of those places where you can google lighting conditions and really get some good examples.
Hi Vince. Thanks again. Awesome content. And a nice timely video. I'll be doing some atmospheic lighting soon. The figure I have is wearing a black rubber gasmask. Lit on one side from a distant fire. The shadow side of the gasmask will be my blackest black ofc. But as I move round the head towards the illuminated side I'm not sure what direction to take it and wondering if sunny skin tone could be my answer. Go gradual from black > touch of dark sea blue> sunny skin tone perhaps? I realise rubber will be tricky as it is quite matt but can have bit of a sheen to it (use the sunny skin tone) and also doesn't really take on texture that I could simulate to sell the idea of rubber. It's a decent size head so have decent area to play with. It could be one of those ones where I just need to just sit and paint it til I find whats looking good. But if you have any ideas that would be fantastic buddy. If not, just say, that's cool too lol 11:21 And a lovely shirt it is!
@@VinceVenturella Of course. Gotcha. That's what's swirling round my head anyway. But I've been here before. It'll probably all change when I sit down at the palette 😄 Thanks! Much appreciated.
I think this proves that Vince knows witchcraft..... or has a supreme depth of miniature painting knowledge. I'm going with a little of column a), a little of column b). Also, unless I missed it and just cannot find it, where is the model from? Its very cool
Vince, when I build layers I have some combination of the following issues: *If I make thicker layers to achieve opacity and provide that striking contrast, they take FOREVER to glaze the transitions smooth *If I go with thinner layers, I’m wicking off the excess and applying but I feel like my pigment breaks down providing a “muddy/chaulky” look with little opacity (no matter how much I apply). I tend to go with other techniques that produce better results for me (like two brush wet blending) but that’s not possible in all cases. I really want to get layering and glazing down. I suspect it’s a factor of paint consistency. Long message (sorry for that). Can we deep dive into consistency for techniques? I use hobby paints (GW, AP, Pro Acryl, etc). Appreciate the help!
@@actualwafflesenjoyer ya know, I don’t feel like I am but I add some water then test the consistency on my nitrile glove for transparency of the paint. It always seems like by the time I achieve transparency, the paint breaks down and has a chaulky look to it…more of a residue. I like the idea of adding the glaze medium…I do on occasion but should I be adding glaze medium and some water or just glaze medium alone? I seem to have a bit better results with slight water addition and a drop of medium…that gives me the transparent look while holding the pigment. Thoughts?
So many options here, techniques like feathering can help blend those two better even with thicker paint. THis video here will explain paint consistency, but it could also be some level of the paint you're using. Higher pigment paints can go thinner without breaking down and getting chalky. Here is the video - th-cam.com/video/TbCtUYFwFWQ/w-d-xo.html
What about the Occlusion Zone? To hazard a guess - it would be areas like between the outer wings, in the crooks of the wings, and maybe behind the shield? Basically, the shadows where neither light touched. Should these be painted in sort of desaturated versions of their highlighted counterparts? i.e. the occluded red skin as more of a dull reddish brown
Yes, it's basically the dark area between the two areas I actually painted. So in this case, there is an area in the moddle that basically only got a single touch of paint that remains quite dark, a base coat at best.
I am looking at doing with with a mini that is a Black Dragon. Wanting to do a green acidic underglow and maybe moonlight from above. What would be your suggestion for this to keep that dark area in between like you are discussing here? Being a black dragon, it's already going to be dark. The green will be the warmer tone here and I am thinking a moonlight type of cold blue on the top. Thoughts?
Wow thanks for the tutorial! Big click sound in my head! I tried zenithal lighting before but was confused at the painting sand ended up painting over it! Haha! 🤦🏾♂️ I will try this out on a smaller scale for practice since I prefer only paint 1:6 scale. Is that how miniature painting techniques was developed? To emphasis scale and lighting detail at such a micro scale? 🤷🏽🤔
Two questions one where did you get the miniature and secondly at adepticon are you able to look at one of my miniatures and laugh at it hysterically 😂😂😂😂😂
I have a question. What should I do if the direction of light is the same, e.g. zenithal lighting and a brazier or torch on apex point of model. Like a character in moonlight holding torch above their head? Thanks for your great work!
Sure, so the answer is one wins. Walk outside and hold a lighter above your head on a sunny day and light it, there is zero effect. Now do the same thing in a dark room, there is a lot of effect. So one of those lights is going to win and set the overall lighting.
This is such a helpful video! I was wondering if you had plans to make or had already made a video concerning what to do when light sources overlap! Im using this video to help with a project but i cant wrap my head around two strong light points that are of different colours
The short answer is they don't :) - Light sources, if you have multiple hitting a subject from the same way, combine together. You don't have two light sources, you have one that is a mix of the two.
Hey Vince, late to the party, but great video! I'm trying to think of a bit of a lazy version of this for Skaventide, and was wondering if you think my process might work okay? Going for a diffuse light from above and a mid strength warpstone flow from below. 1. Prime with shadow colour 2. Whitish cone from above and below 3. Base coat with contrasts/other transparent paints 4. Lightly spray white from below again, followed by a transparent green 5. Highlight from above and below as normal. My thinking is that this way it sits somewhere between the true colours from the diffuse light and overwriting colours like the motivated light. And also it sounds pretty quick and easy, which is a plus when there's 50 ratmen to get through!
You would want to be really careful with the light from the two directions, it will be hard to keep the occulsion/terminator shadow between them. You wouldn't want to paint the whole thing, you need the shadow between and you need the OSL to be basically all green. I have another video where I do a skaven bust and show the lighting scheme you're describing, so check that out.
Thanks Vince! Yeah, I did watch that video and it looks good, but was just trying to figure out if a softer warpstone glow could still work. Only 3 weeks until I can test for myself!
How does the atmospheric or motivated lighting influence reflective coloured metals, like gold or copper? I’ve hit a block with my recent project using a red motivated light contrasting with an ambient blue, and have been unsure how to complete NMM gold surfaces, so any advice would be appreciated!!
It's tricky, when you have motivated light on gold/copper, they are base yellow or red, so they will interact accordingly based on the strength of the light. They are tough
Hey Vince, amazing model. In the closing photos, I don't really see where the dark boundary between the two light sources is that you showed in the diagram at the start, other than perhaps under the top of the wings. I'm sure it's me, not the model. What am I looking for with this on, say, the torso?
You want an area where the shadows are intense, so it's not about it being completely black (though it could be, this is just simplified), it's about having an area in deep shadow with all the highlights missing. Hope that helps.
Great stuff as always, Vince! My question is how you would go about this with TMM? For example, for one of my next projects I plan to paint a Dwarf Thane standing in a dark environment under a bright cold light from above (picture the mines of Moria from LOTR). I plan to use P3's Frostbite as my universal cold highlight (great stuff, similar to your Glacier Blue). So I would in general add some blue tones via Inks to the midtones of the metal paint. But what about the highlights? Can I dare to add some Frostbite into the high highlights? How would you approach this? Or would you go full NMM so you can use the same highlight everywhere without issues?
Yep, it's tough, because TMM is going to also interact with the light around the actual figure, so it's really a key of keeping your highlights mostly silver but just slightly tinted into that tones and having the colors in the mid-tones.
Hey Vince, another banger. Not sure if I got it fully. The mid part between both lights.. would you leave a line of black? Or mix the base colors and highlight them separately? And on a separate note - will you share full footage of you painting Minis on your Patreon too? Would love to see the real time material for reference (and dirty copying ;-) ). Missed the coachings but will be a review Patreon in the next days :-)
So the area between the two lights is a strong shadow, that could be very low shade colors, it's rarely going to be pure black, but it could be close, depends on the lighting situation. I won't post any of that kind of footage on Patreon for a few reasons, 1) I don't want anything behind a paywall and 2) I don't record everything. ;) - That all being said, very glad to have you along on the Patreon journey and I will look at opening additional 1-1 in the future.
Work your way around the miniture slowly with the deepest shade color (for example my dark red) and set the outer edge of your light (i.e. make the circle part of the cone around the miniature) and then pull up and in from there. Avoid putting that base coat on anything else, then just paint inside the line you created. It can certainly be done without an airbrush, but it will take longer.
@@VinceVenturella thanks!! yeah I know.. I'm crippling myself by not having an airbrush, but living conditions don't permit it, sadly! gotta make do with what I've got
Thank you very much for all these advices master Vince ! The more I paint the more I realize that light understanding is THE thing ; I try so hard to sketch the lights in a zenithal way, or even with a directed light source way, but at the end I lose myself and I don't have enough contrast or realistic result :-( I watched so many videos on light theory, on light sketching... on my space marines I tried to sketch arms, legs, helmets like cylinders and spheres, I tried to sketch with pure white, or with a lighter color, I tried to make short and large reflects, but I always do something wrong and it despares me... I think I understand theory now, but is there technical tips that I have to work on? Dilution? Brushstrokes direction? Brushstrokes size? Layer size? If you have any guidance for those points it would be nice, your videos are so didactical :-)
It's tough, many of those things are really intuitive and they come with time. If you understand the theory, then we are talking about just applying and failing and learning and repeating. :)
It wouldn't really be feasible (unless you were an absolute surgeon), because you need to draw the highlights in slowly and they have to be carefully placed, the bright light creates deep shadows - which is often a challenge with an airbrush which can overspray.
This was brilliant. I am on my way to buy a demon and copy this example!! I am excited to push myself in this area!!! Only confusion is the paper example showed a big black/shadow separation between the cones and you said the light expressed in colors do not touch. Are you saying I must have a black line/shadow of separation no matter what between colors? On the Demons right arm the colors “appear”to touch…ie blue hi light to dark red shadow? In the lower chest the same but I clearly saw a wider shadow separation. This I assume is due to the angel of the light and twist of the upper torso? Do I have this kind of right?? Thanks again!!!
Another knockout here, Vince. Question: How do you decide contrast/highlights are done, especially when working on a piece with multiple light sources? Every time you added a new layer of something on the cool side of this piece, I thought you would be done. Then the next layer cranked it up and I realized why you did it. I struggle with this a lot!
There is no simple rule, but let me give you a tip. However far you think you are supposed to go, go at least two steps higher. If you're still not sure after that, two more steps higher. The trick is, it doesn't matter if you go too high, because you are one quick glaze away from knocking it back down.
Hey, Vince - thanks as always for the video. Noticed the Golden So Flat line popping up a lot in your recent stuff. Any chance of a little product review?
Suppose the figure is standing over lava, so you have a fiery light from below. What skin tone would you use since the red probably won't be effective? Just reverse the colours (or another blue)?
I have a Demon I'm prepping right now. I would like to incorporate lave in the base. So should i prime with an orange for environmental and what for atmospheric? I know light would bounce off the cave walls and highlight parts of the top, but I imagine the highlights would less and muted.
Depends on the overall lighting, if he's outside a soft atmosphereic lighting in the blue spectrum (hence night). If you're laying down your base for lava, a deep orange is a good base.
Very interesting. Not sure I'm up to the level of trying these techniques at the moment but intriguing to watch. The only question I have, not being heavily into the miniature scene and not having seen this figure before, is what is the figure's "natural" skin colour? Black? It seems that all the tones are given by the light sources only rather than tinting the creature's own skin.
The natural skin tone is red. The light from above is mean to be weak/distant/diffuse, so it doesn't shift the color very much. So the skin stays red, the cloth purple, the steel gray, etc. just with a slightly warm tone to it from the light source. The secondary blue light is much closer/stronger, so it actually turns everything it lights up blue, rather than just a slight tint in the highlights.
@@spacedock873 You can also think of it in terms of what light is being reflected off of the surface. (Someone can correct me if I'm understanding this wrong) What you see as the color of a material is the light that is being reflected off of it. So the skin looks red because it is being hit by white -or in this case off-white - light, it absorbs most of it, and reflects red. Skin isn't perfectly matte, so it also reflects a small amount of light without absorbing, hence it's slightly tinted by the light color as well. The metal is very reflective, so it looks off-white, with more noticeable areas where it's reflecting the light color. For the underglow, the light itself is blue, so there's no wavelengths to be reflected. It doesn't look purple (which would be red+blue), because there is no red to mix with. If it was a soft pure-blue light, it might look black/very dark because of that. But again, since the skin is not perfectly matte, it will reflect some of the light as the same color, in this case blue. In this case the underglow light is very bright, so even though a small amount is being reflected, it still looks like a strong blue.
This is very helpful, I really want to start painting a briomdare idoneth army and part of that I want to capture is the gentle yellow green light of sun shining through the water and kelp leaves. I looks beautiful girl I really want to capture that on a mini, that said this is also more generic environmental lighting so would I use different tactics for that.
Love the painting scheme. How would you feel if a whole army would be done in this fashion? Especially rank and file, because realistically they would block light from each other and depending on what the sources are supposed to be and how far away they are, the light should get weaker the farther it travels. The light sources should hit the bases as well. So much to think about... Have you ever done a video on more of a concept army that this might be? Would definitely be interested to hear your thoughts on the subject.
In this case if you wanted to improve the suspension of disbelief I would say make sure the sources of the motivated lights are visible on either the bases or the minis? Would at least help on a per mini basis to explain why they are lit from that same angle even as they move around the battlefield. Ofc you would still have the problem that these lights should presumably shine upon the minis and terrain near them - but that's something that has always been broken by table top games and I think would be totally fine.
Off topic of the vid, but have you done a video of how best to paint on writing? Some of my titanicus models have scrollwork on the model and I wanted to write on the Titans name and such but don't want to mess it up, and also would like the script to be more interesting than a standard writing font! Couldn't see any but you do have a lot of vids!
Very useful explanation once again! How would you approach a miniature with lightsources that actually do overlap? Is it simply a matter of gradual mixing of colors?
Yep, it's a gradual mixing and it's a very complicated thing to paint, because the light level and color as well as the surface color, will all play into that.
I am entering a painting competition at my local store and we were all given the same stormcast vindictor to paint and I was wondering if anybody had any conversion or pose change ideas to help the model stand out? Thanks
Hey Vince, I have problems. As brief as possible - Priming>Air brush clogged>Full disassembly/cleaning/reassembly>Now the airbrush only backflows even though it's 100% clean. 2nd problem - "I have rattle cans">Do the shake for 5 hours/soak in warm water ritual>2 days later primer is still sticky and shiny>How do I get these minis to a point where they're paint-able?
So there may be a few items at play here. 1) You could have build up in the brass nozzle. This doesn't wash out, you have to get a needle cleaning tool to get that gunk out of there. It may seem like your airbrush is working, but there is a thin layer of gunk around the side and as soon as the new primer hits, it sticks and you get a clog. 2) You may have bad primer. If the primer froze at some point, it can have chunks that don't break back down. Those could be getting clogged in there. 3) You need to thin your primer, it shouldn't go straight through. I always use a drop of thinner for every drop of flow improver. 4) You are in an area where the humidity is casuing rapid tip dry and build up back in the nozzle. You would want to add some flow improver and/or drying retarder which could slow the effect of the tip dry. THose are my ideas, I hope some of that helps.
I want to take my painting to the next level by painting a piecewith highly directional lighting, I am imagining a miniature in a dungeon with the upper left quadrant of the mini being covered by warm torchlight. Unlike the demon in this video I am not imagining a cold light source from the bottom right, should I? Otherwise I'm not sure how to sell that the bottom right of the mini is not directly lit. Would I paint that part of of the mini with de saturated tones of my base color and add neutral and desaturated colors for the highlights?
So you can just reduce the highlights, keep the colors desaturated and infuse blue tones as they are shadow tones, you can see that in many display pieces from something like Richard Grey, but its tough as you are really only painting part of the mini fully.
It's much tougher, because you've already said a lot about the light with the base layer (color is only color in light) and you have to back into the shadows in a much more careful way. It can be done, but it's harder.
Everything is blue, dabba dee dabba die... sorry, that just popped into my head. Amazing video vince. Would this method work for the synthwave style fluro Magenta/Cyan style you've seen around? Same technique?
Hello Vince quick question, in the video you painted the legs blue due the OSL but on the finished model they do look metal (nmm), you painted over the lighting? Was it expected? I linda got the idea that the “real” colors were going to be painted around the OSL.
Newish line of artist acrylics Golden released last year I think. They are hyper matte high opacity colors that self level. They have a kinda high upfront cost but you get a big jar of em (100ml I think?) and very few mini painters would ever kill a whole jar. I have no details from VV but he teased a paint review video a few weeks back and I heavily suspect it is this range.
Why do demons wear skirts? They're comfy. You should try one Vince. The breeze is nice. One thing to consider on the cone vs not - you don't have to use a cone for directional lighting. If there is a center of light, yes, a radial lighting does it. But something like a line or plane of lights will create a linear path of light towards whatever is being illuminated. At a long distance away, radial and linear look the same (see sun to earth). But close up, they're different. :)
On camera, your shop appears to be very much on the cold side as far as lighting. Those ceiling lights look like kind of harsh fluorescent actually. My hobby space is frustratingly underlit though.
I have a mix of different lights in my office, some warm, some cold, some more "neutral" so I can move miniatures around and see how they are in different lights. :)
This was fantastic and masterful. Having recently returned to the hobby after a near decade long break, I've been consuming a number of painting guides. This was the single best guide I have seen. Well done, and thank you for taking the time to share it
Fantastic! Thank you, that is awesome to hear. :)
This is something I've been trying to understand for quite a while and this has helped me loads. Thanks Vince, you're a boss.
Awesome!
Completely demystified the process of object source lighting for me.
Thank you Mr. Vince you are a great teacher.
It seems like a much more tangible technique when you explain it. Thanks for another great video!
That's wonderful to hear
This is a great tutorial! I like the delivery and flow of information. Great teaching technique Vince. You are one of my go to people for sure!
Thanks!
Have given up painting figs for now due to space and time between other hobbies but still tune in for the videos.
I am grateful for that and I hope you find the time to come back in the future. :)
YYYYEAAAH!! Vinny V is tagging into the diagram ring!!
Edit:Thought on the implications of this some more and felt compelled to add more exclamation points.
Awesome:)
Not going to lie, I think this is probably my 2nd favorite pieces you've done. The first being the female you painted, in a similar fashion last year.
Thanks! I really like how this came out. :)
Thank you for your Hobby Cheating, Vince! Super informative and clear. I do have a suggestion to consider for a future video: varnishing for the purpose of a “save point”. I keep hearing people do this, but then I don’t know how they strip the paint after the “save point” (and keep what remained underneath). I know this would help my confidence and willingness to experiment with different techniques, colors, and so on. Thanks for considering this suggestion and thanks again for what you share!
I have that right here - th-cam.com/video/e6Ww5iAP250/w-d-xo.html
@@VinceVenturellaHuge thanks, Vince! You are too kind!
huh, it's crazy because I always struggle with this concept.. but here you are, yet again explaining it in a way that is easy for us nubs to understand. Thanks for the lesson bro, much appreciated! I am going to give this a go!
Glad it helped!
@@VinceVenturella I actually have this same exact model, sitting on the shelf of shame lol. Archvillian Games makes some beautiful sculps!
Thankyou for your videos. This one has helped me loads. I was experimenting with this without fully understanding it and have done a few chaos marine models with this split lighting but I was going for a different coloured "sun" light and wasn't sure why it didn't look right from the back. The reason was I was completely colouring the rear in a similar focused light rather than a diffuse light (the sun is much further away!) when instead I should actually be shrinking that upward colour down to a spotlight and letting it only influence the highlights on the rest of the rear side. It suddenly clicked last night after watching this. It has however taught me a lot about lighting and layering so I'm still happy with them but I'm hoping to nail this on the next few tries. That occlusion zone really helps sell it. So thanks once again my dude - paintbrush salute.
Always happy to help!
Yet more reasons why I need to get an airbrush! I know you could probably get the same effect with a hair-brush, but this seems especiallyl well-suited for that tool.
It really is
Vince I’ve had the Warcry Catacombs set for a while now and I’ve never touched it fearing the dreaded fire freak dudes. You have just inspired me to do them with this video.
A million thanks for this!
Awesome!
Amazing motivation! I'm going to try teal from above and purple from below on Be'lakor today.
You got this!
Invaluable information on lighting
Awesome!
I don't know. A tail and pants always seemed like a hassle to me so I get the skirt.
Excellent work and tutorial as always.
Thanks and good point on the skirt. :)
Vince's videos are always little islands of inspiration and positivity...
... I suffer from advanced depression and they give me a small break from it. Sorry if that comes off as 'heavy' in any way.
That means a great deal to me. It's not heavy at all, not even a little. Mental Health is far too undervalued by our society and it's perhaps the most important thing. It's one of the reasons I always try to focus my channel and my videos on positivity, because there is enough challenge in the world and our daily lives, we should have somethings in our life that can be a light of positivity.
Awesome as always. I appreciate your sharing your skill and understanding with us! OSL has often been done poorly, and yet this mini with red at top and blue at bottom looks amazing and is dramatically OSL'd. (lite-d? Lit? I dunno.) But thanks for using an extreme case to help highlight (pun intended) the differences when painting OSL - clever teaching technique!
Thanks!
Hello mate hope your good haven’t had a iPad for a while just got new one so will b watching everything again painting is going ok spent last year learning all new things so didn’t paint much but learn a lot this year trying to learn speed painting a bit thank u very much 4 all your help really appreciate your videos mate 👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
Always happy to help!
Very cool stuff dude. I'm trying to figure out how to apply this too my own minis
You can do it! :)
Superb tutorial, many thanks Vince 👍🏻😀
My pleasure!
I love this video so damn much. Incredibly inspiring.
Fantastic video and piece of knowledge. Thank you, Vince!
Thanks!
Looks absolutely awesome vince, and good luck at adepticon
Fingers crossed!
Vince, you've spent too much time staring at movie posters given the color choice for this one XD
That mini and paint job KICKS ASS. Thanks for the great video.
Thanks!
You truly are a techno mancer
Thanks!
Awesome video Vince! I think this had the most aha-moments for me in a long time. Thanks for sharing.
Glad you enjoyed it!
I really like things like OSL and this dramatic lighting. Less a fan of things like NMM (especially when you can do TMM!) as that just feels like adding complexity for the sake of it, but these styles give a bunch of drama and sense of life to a piece
It gives you a control of the light that is beneficial for lighting schemes like this. :)
Great info as always mr Technomancer sir! 🥰🐶
Thanks!
In architecture I both used and learned quite a lot about lighting in 3D modeling and digital matte painting. The lighting is based on real world conditions and translates nicely to art work theory. Miniature painting lighting however is completely all over the place with inconsistent, weird and hyper real practices. Even at high level. It must be really frustrating for beginners.
Yes, it's all a mix of real principles and of course artistic interpretation. Sometimes you are doing things just to make it read better or look cooler. :)
great one, thanks Vince!
Glad you liked it!
very cool, i will try this on my demon from tanares adventures ;)
Thank you!
So inspirational as usual this is inspiring me to get a couple of demons that I have waiting in the wings completed in this style, as always Friend Amazing Work.
Go for it!
Thank you so much for this tutorial, great work! What I am frequently struggling with ist not knowing where to place believable highlights. Do you have any guidance for understanding volumes? Also: I noticed you are using the So Flat line by Golden lately. How do you like these paints?
I liek the golden flats, review will be coming eventually. as to where the place the highlights, this is a complicated question, but my basic answer is the top of the volumes, think of the top of the whole shape (i.e. the whole miniature), then each individual volume (muscles, shoulders, etc). If we're talking about generic light, you are basically creating a soft light from above. This is one of those places where you can google lighting conditions and really get some good examples.
looks amazing vince
Thanks!
You are the goat, sir! Looks great!
Thank you kindly!
Hi Vince. Thanks again. Awesome content.
And a nice timely video. I'll be doing some atmospheic lighting soon.
The figure I have is wearing a black rubber gasmask. Lit on one side from a distant fire.
The shadow side of the gasmask will be my blackest black ofc. But as I move round the head towards the illuminated side I'm not sure what direction to take it and wondering if sunny skin tone could be my answer.
Go gradual from black > touch of dark sea blue> sunny skin tone perhaps?
I realise rubber will be tricky as it is quite matt but can have bit of a sheen to it (use the sunny skin tone) and also doesn't really take on texture that I could simulate to sell the idea of rubber.
It's a decent size head so have decent area to play with.
It could be one of those ones where I just need to just sit and paint it til I find whats looking good. But if you have any ideas that would be fantastic buddy. If not, just say, that's cool too lol
11:21 And a lovely shirt it is!
I would have some light on the other side, even if just a very soft blue-moonlight, but beyond that, the colors you're describing seem correct.
@@VinceVenturella Of course. Gotcha. That's what's swirling round my head anyway. But I've been here before. It'll probably all change when I sit down at the palette 😄 Thanks! Much appreciated.
Why aren't you at least at 500K subs with this quality of video tutorial. Amazing. Sorry for the second comment.
I welcome all the comments and thanks!
Really cool effect and nicely explained 👏😁
Thank you so much 😀
I think this proves that Vince knows witchcraft..... or has a supreme depth of miniature painting knowledge. I'm going with a little of column a), a little of column b).
Also, unless I missed it and just cannot find it, where is the model from? Its very cool
It's from Arch Villain, 3D print.
Amazing video. Thank you so much.
Glad you liked it!
Vince, when I build layers I have some combination of the following issues:
*If I make thicker layers to achieve opacity and provide that striking contrast, they take FOREVER to glaze the transitions smooth
*If I go with thinner layers, I’m wicking off the excess and applying but I feel like my pigment breaks down providing a “muddy/chaulky” look with little opacity (no matter how much I apply).
I tend to go with other techniques that produce better results for me (like two brush wet blending) but that’s not possible in all cases. I really want to get layering and glazing down. I suspect it’s a factor of paint consistency.
Long message (sorry for that). Can we deep dive into consistency for techniques? I use hobby paints (GW, AP, Pro Acryl, etc). Appreciate the help!
@@actualwafflesenjoyer ya know, I don’t feel like I am but I add some water then test the consistency on my nitrile glove for transparency of the paint. It always seems like by the time I achieve transparency, the paint breaks down and has a chaulky look to it…more of a residue. I like the idea of adding the glaze medium…I do on occasion but should I be adding glaze medium and some water or just glaze medium alone? I seem to have a bit better results with slight water addition and a drop of medium…that gives me the transparent look while holding the pigment.
Thoughts?
So many options here, techniques like feathering can help blend those two better even with thicker paint. THis video here will explain paint consistency, but it could also be some level of the paint you're using. Higher pigment paints can go thinner without breaking down and getting chalky.
Here is the video - th-cam.com/video/TbCtUYFwFWQ/w-d-xo.html
@@VinceVenturella thanks Vince!
Came just in time, I'm just about to start working on some shoulder pads, 40 of them should be decent practice.
Sounds awesome!
Obligatory comment: great content as usual, Vince!
Awesome Video Vince
Thanks!
What about the Occlusion Zone? To hazard a guess - it would be areas like between the outer wings, in the crooks of the wings, and maybe behind the shield? Basically, the shadows where neither light touched. Should these be painted in sort of desaturated versions of their highlighted counterparts? i.e. the occluded red skin as more of a dull reddish brown
Yes, it's basically the dark area between the two areas I actually painted. So in this case, there is an area in the moddle that basically only got a single touch of paint that remains quite dark, a base coat at best.
I am looking at doing with with a mini that is a Black Dragon. Wanting to do a green acidic underglow and maybe moonlight from above. What would be your suggestion for this to keep that dark area in between like you are discussing here? Being a black dragon, it's already going to be dark. The green will be the warmer tone here and I am thinking a moonlight type of cold blue on the top. Thoughts?
Wow thanks for the tutorial! Big click sound in my head! I tried zenithal lighting before but was confused at the painting sand ended up painting over it! Haha! 🤦🏾♂️ I will try this out on a smaller scale for practice since I prefer only paint 1:6 scale. Is that how miniature painting techniques was developed? To emphasis scale and lighting detail at such a micro scale? 🤷🏽🤔
Yep, that's exactly correct, glad this was helpful.
Two questions one where did you get the miniature and secondly at adepticon are you able to look at one of my miniatures and laugh at it hysterically 😂😂😂😂😂
Patreon ;-)
Both of these answers are correct. :) (And sure, happy to talk at Adepticon).
I have a question. What should I do if the direction of light is the same, e.g. zenithal lighting and a brazier or torch on apex point of model. Like a character in moonlight holding torch above their head? Thanks for your great work!
Sure, so the answer is one wins. Walk outside and hold a lighter above your head on a sunny day and light it, there is zero effect. Now do the same thing in a dark room, there is a lot of effect. So one of those lights is going to win and set the overall lighting.
Such a money video. Thanks V!
Thanks!
This is such a helpful video! I was wondering if you had plans to make or had already made a video concerning what to do when light sources overlap! Im using this video to help with a project but i cant wrap my head around two strong light points that are of different colours
The short answer is they don't :) - Light sources, if you have multiple hitting a subject from the same way, combine together. You don't have two light sources, you have one that is a mix of the two.
@@VinceVenturella ah that makes sense! Thank you:)
Hey Vince, late to the party, but great video!
I'm trying to think of a bit of a lazy version of this for Skaventide, and was wondering if you think my process might work okay? Going for a diffuse light from above and a mid strength warpstone flow from below. 1. Prime with shadow colour 2. Whitish cone from above and below 3. Base coat with contrasts/other transparent paints 4. Lightly spray white from below again, followed by a transparent green 5. Highlight from above and below as normal. My thinking is that this way it sits somewhere between the true colours from the diffuse light and overwriting colours like the motivated light. And also it sounds pretty quick and easy, which is a plus when there's 50 ratmen to get through!
You would want to be really careful with the light from the two directions, it will be hard to keep the occulsion/terminator shadow between them. You wouldn't want to paint the whole thing, you need the shadow between and you need the OSL to be basically all green. I have another video where I do a skaven bust and show the lighting scheme you're describing, so check that out.
Thanks Vince! Yeah, I did watch that video and it looks good, but was just trying to figure out if a softer warpstone glow could still work. Only 3 weeks until I can test for myself!
How does the atmospheric or motivated lighting influence reflective coloured metals, like gold or copper?
I’ve hit a block with my recent project using a red motivated light contrasting with an ambient blue, and have been unsure how to complete NMM gold surfaces, so any advice would be appreciated!!
Good question. +1
It's tricky, when you have motivated light on gold/copper, they are base yellow or red, so they will interact accordingly based on the strength of the light. They are tough
Hey Vince, amazing model. In the closing photos, I don't really see where the dark boundary between the two light sources is that you showed in the diagram at the start, other than perhaps under the top of the wings. I'm sure it's me, not the model. What am I looking for with this on, say, the torso?
You want an area where the shadows are intense, so it's not about it being completely black (though it could be, this is just simplified), it's about having an area in deep shadow with all the highlights missing. Hope that helps.
Great stuff as always, Vince!
My question is how you would go about this with TMM? For example, for one of my next projects I plan to paint a Dwarf Thane standing in a dark environment under a bright cold light from above (picture the mines of Moria from LOTR).
I plan to use P3's Frostbite as my universal cold highlight (great stuff, similar to your Glacier Blue). So I would in general add some blue tones via Inks to the midtones of the metal paint. But what about the highlights? Can I dare to add some Frostbite into the high highlights? How would you approach this? Or would you go full NMM so you can use the same highlight everywhere without issues?
Yep, it's tough, because TMM is going to also interact with the light around the actual figure, so it's really a key of keeping your highlights mostly silver but just slightly tinted into that tones and having the colors in the mid-tones.
Hey Vince, another banger. Not sure if I got it fully. The mid part between both lights.. would you leave a line of black? Or mix the base colors and highlight them separately? And on a separate note - will you share full footage of you painting Minis on your Patreon too? Would love to see the real time material for reference (and dirty copying ;-) ). Missed the coachings but will be a review Patreon in the next days :-)
So the area between the two lights is a strong shadow, that could be very low shade colors, it's rarely going to be pure black, but it could be close, depends on the lighting situation. I won't post any of that kind of footage on Patreon for a few reasons, 1) I don't want anything behind a paywall and 2) I don't record everything. ;) - That all being said, very glad to have you along on the Patreon journey and I will look at opening additional 1-1 in the future.
how would you go about creating these zones if you were a pleb without an airbrush, like some of us? just kinda imagine where the borders would be?
Work your way around the miniture slowly with the deepest shade color (for example my dark red) and set the outer edge of your light (i.e. make the circle part of the cone around the miniature) and then pull up and in from there. Avoid putting that base coat on anything else, then just paint inside the line you created. It can certainly be done without an airbrush, but it will take longer.
@@VinceVenturella thanks!! yeah I know.. I'm crippling myself by not having an airbrush, but living conditions don't permit it, sadly! gotta make do with what I've got
I wanted to use Turquoise somehow for my Khorne army, this seems like a good excuse as any to test on one at least.
Absolutely.
great video thanks 🙏
My pleasure!
Thank you very much for all these advices master Vince ! The more I paint the more I realize that light understanding is THE thing ; I try so hard to sketch the lights in a zenithal way, or even with a directed light source way, but at the end I lose myself and I don't have enough contrast or realistic result :-( I watched so many videos on light theory, on light sketching... on my space marines I tried to sketch arms, legs, helmets like cylinders and spheres, I tried to sketch with pure white, or with a lighter color, I tried to make short and large reflects, but I always do something wrong and it despares me... I think I understand theory now, but is there technical tips that I have to work on? Dilution? Brushstrokes direction? Brushstrokes size? Layer size? If you have any guidance for those points it would be nice, your videos are so didactical :-)
It's tough, many of those things are really intuitive and they come with time. If you understand the theory, then we are talking about just applying and failing and learning and repeating. :)
Would it be possible to add those highlights with an airbrush as well by reducing the area of coverage with each layer?
It wouldn't really be feasible (unless you were an absolute surgeon), because you need to draw the highlights in slowly and they have to be carefully placed, the bright light creates deep shadows - which is often a challenge with an airbrush which can overspray.
This was brilliant. I am on my way to buy a demon and copy this example!! I am excited to push myself in this area!!! Only confusion is the paper example showed a big black/shadow separation between the cones and you said the light expressed in colors do not touch. Are you saying I must have a black line/shadow of separation no matter what between colors? On the Demons right arm the colors “appear”to touch…ie blue hi light to dark red shadow? In the lower chest the same but I clearly saw a wider shadow separation. This I assume is due to the angel of the light and twist of the upper torso? Do I have this kind of right?? Thanks again!!!
You got it.
Another knockout here, Vince. Question: How do you decide contrast/highlights are done, especially when working on a piece with multiple light sources? Every time you added a new layer of something on the cool side of this piece, I thought you would be done. Then the next layer cranked it up and I realized why you did it. I struggle with this a lot!
There is no simple rule, but let me give you a tip. However far you think you are supposed to go, go at least two steps higher. If you're still not sure after that, two more steps higher. The trick is, it doesn't matter if you go too high, because you are one quick glaze away from knocking it back down.
Gotcha. Gotta keep pushing!
i feel like i fund the best videos on yt. OMG this is awesome, im learning so much. thank you! do you have a Patrion or something?
sorry i found your patreon!
Awesome! Yep, just started it last month. :)
Excellent timing, as I'm already doing this on my current model. Great information and much appreciated. What model is that?
It's a 3d print from Arch Villain games.
Great stuff friend 👏 👍
Thanks!
Hey, Vince - thanks as always for the video. Noticed the Golden So Flat line popping up a lot in your recent stuff. Any chance of a little product review?
Yep, I will have a full review.
Suppose the figure is standing over lava, so you have a fiery light from below. What skin tone would you use since the red probably won't be effective? Just reverse the colours (or another blue)?
Yep, and the blue from above would be softer and more atmosphereic, pushing the red skin cold.
I have a Demon I'm prepping right now. I would like to incorporate lave in the base. So should i prime with an orange for environmental and what for atmospheric? I know light would bounce off the cave walls and highlight parts of the top, but I imagine the highlights would less and muted.
Depends on the overall lighting, if he's outside a soft atmosphereic lighting in the blue spectrum (hence night). If you're laying down your base for lava, a deep orange is a good base.
Very interesting. Not sure I'm up to the level of trying these techniques at the moment but intriguing to watch. The only question I have, not being heavily into the miniature scene and not having seen this figure before, is what is the figure's "natural" skin colour? Black? It seems that all the tones are given by the light sources only rather than tinting the creature's own skin.
The natural skin tone is red. The light from above is mean to be weak/distant/diffuse, so it doesn't shift the color very much. So the skin stays red, the cloth purple, the steel gray, etc. just with a slightly warm tone to it from the light source. The secondary blue light is much closer/stronger, so it actually turns everything it lights up blue, rather than just a slight tint in the highlights.
@@cliffwood7386 Wouldn't blue light on red skin produce a purple hue?
Yep, exactly as said here.
@@spacedock873 You can also think of it in terms of what light is being reflected off of the surface. (Someone can correct me if I'm understanding this wrong) What you see as the color of a material is the light that is being reflected off of it. So the skin looks red because it is being hit by white -or in this case off-white - light, it absorbs most of it, and reflects red. Skin isn't perfectly matte, so it also reflects a small amount of light without absorbing, hence it's slightly tinted by the light color as well. The metal is very reflective, so it looks off-white, with more noticeable areas where it's reflecting the light color.
For the underglow, the light itself is blue, so there's no wavelengths to be reflected. It doesn't look purple (which would be red+blue), because there is no red to mix with. If it was a soft pure-blue light, it might look black/very dark because of that. But again, since the skin is not perfectly matte, it will reflect some of the light as the same color, in this case blue. In this case the underglow light is very bright, so even though a small amount is being reflected, it still looks like a strong blue.
This is very helpful, I really want to start painting a briomdare idoneth army and part of that I want to capture is the gentle yellow green light of sun shining through the water and kelp leaves. I looks beautiful girl I really want to capture that on a mini, that said this is also more generic environmental lighting so would I use different tactics for that.
great video
Glad you enjoyed it
Love the painting scheme. How would you feel if a whole army would be done in this fashion? Especially rank and file, because realistically they would block light from each other and depending on what the sources are supposed to be and how far away they are, the light should get weaker the farther it travels. The light sources should hit the bases as well. So much to think about...
Have you ever done a video on more of a concept army that this might be? Would definitely be interested to hear your thoughts on the subject.
I think you can do it, you know it's going to be somewhat unrealistic, but it could be very cool.
In this case if you wanted to improve the suspension of disbelief I would say make sure the sources of the motivated lights are visible on either the bases or the minis?
Would at least help on a per mini basis to explain why they are lit from that same angle even as they move around the battlefield.
Ofc you would still have the problem that these lights should presumably shine upon the minis and terrain near them - but that's something that has always been broken by table top games and I think would be totally fine.
Is it possible to lay down the basecoat with a a drybrush instead of an airbrush? I don't own an airbrush, but do want to try these techniques.
Absolutely!
Off topic of the vid, but have you done a video of how best to paint on writing? Some of my titanicus models have scrollwork on the model and I wanted to write on the Titans name and such but don't want to mess it up, and also would like the script to be more interesting than a standard writing font! Couldn't see any but you do have a lot of vids!
Yep, sure do - th-cam.com/video/1fSPpepYIiQ/w-d-xo.html
Very useful explanation once again! How would you approach a miniature with lightsources that actually do overlap? Is it simply a matter of gradual mixing of colors?
Yep, it's a gradual mixing and it's a very complicated thing to paint, because the light level and color as well as the surface color, will all play into that.
Wow really inspiring video Vince! Also, what model is that? It looks really great.
Thanks! It's a demon from Arch Villain games.
I am entering a painting competition at my local store and we were all given the same stormcast vindictor to paint and I was wondering if anybody had any conversion or pose change ideas to help the model stand out? Thanks
@@actualwafflesenjoyer thanks
Yeah, they are great figures as is honestly and quite dynamic, you might not need to change it much.
Hey Vince, I have problems. As brief as possible - Priming>Air brush clogged>Full disassembly/cleaning/reassembly>Now the airbrush only backflows even though it's 100% clean. 2nd problem - "I have rattle cans">Do the shake for 5 hours/soak in warm water ritual>2 days later primer is still sticky and shiny>How do I get these minis to a point where they're paint-able?
So there may be a few items at play here.
1) You could have build up in the brass nozzle. This doesn't wash out, you have to get a needle cleaning tool to get that gunk out of there. It may seem like your airbrush is working, but there is a thin layer of gunk around the side and as soon as the new primer hits, it sticks and you get a clog.
2) You may have bad primer. If the primer froze at some point, it can have chunks that don't break back down. Those could be getting clogged in there.
3) You need to thin your primer, it shouldn't go straight through. I always use a drop of thinner for every drop of flow improver.
4) You are in an area where the humidity is casuing rapid tip dry and build up back in the nozzle. You would want to add some flow improver and/or drying retarder which could slow the effect of the tip dry.
THose are my ideas, I hope some of that helps.
@@VinceVenturella 2 & 4 are very possible. Thanks, Vince 🤘
How are you enjoying the soflat paints?
I like them, I'll do a full review soon.
I want to take my painting to the next level by painting a piecewith highly directional lighting, I am imagining a miniature in a dungeon with the upper left quadrant of the mini being covered by warm torchlight. Unlike the demon in this video I am not imagining a cold light source from the bottom right, should I? Otherwise I'm not sure how to sell that the bottom right of the mini is not directly lit. Would I paint that part of of the mini with de saturated tones of my base color and add neutral and desaturated colors for the highlights?
So you can just reduce the highlights, keep the colors desaturated and infuse blue tones as they are shadow tones, you can see that in many display pieces from something like Richard Grey, but its tough as you are really only painting part of the mini fully.
Moody music for a moody style of miniature painting, thanks for another awesome upload!
Thanks!
Can you use the same idea when you've already applied your base layers?
It's much tougher, because you've already said a lot about the light with the base layer (color is only color in light) and you have to back into the shadows in a much more careful way. It can be done, but it's harder.
Everything is blue, dabba dee dabba die... sorry, that just popped into my head. Amazing video vince. Would this method work for the synthwave style fluro Magenta/Cyan style you've seen around? Same technique?
Oh, absolutely, same technique and that color scheme rocks. :)
Hello Vince quick question, in the video you painted the legs blue due the OSL but on the finished model they do look metal (nmm), you painted over the lighting? Was it expected? I linda got the idea that the “real” colors were going to be painted around the OSL.
Never mind, I just rewatched the end of the video and it is painted around the OSL. Leaving the messages to feed the algorithm.
All good, you got it. :)
Golden So Flat paint? What is that? Is there a video on a general test of them coming up?
Newish line of artist acrylics Golden released last year I think. They are hyper matte high opacity colors that self level. They have a kinda high upfront cost but you get a big jar of em (100ml I think?) and very few mini painters would ever kill a whole jar.
I have no details from VV but he teased a paint review video a few weeks back and I heavily suspect it is this range.
th-cam.com/video/iLkSQjG9oLg/w-d-xo.html
@@brkfstfd he replied to a question I asked on the elf video saying he'd be reviewing them at some point
Yep, a full review will be happening eventually, but I always like to put things through the paces first.
Why do demons wear skirts? They're comfy. You should try one Vince. The breeze is nice.
One thing to consider on the cone vs not - you don't have to use a cone for directional lighting. If there is a center of light, yes, a radial lighting does it. But something like a line or plane of lights will create a linear path of light towards whatever is being illuminated. At a long distance away, radial and linear look the same (see sun to earth). But close up, they're different. :)
It's a great point and maybe I need to reconsider my fashion choices! ;)
Any additives used? Like flow improver?
During the painting itself? Nope, just water.
@@VinceVenturella ok
What miniature is this, Vince? It's fantastic and I want it.
3D print from My Mini Factory from Arch Villain games.
what is that miniature?
He's a 3D print from Arch Villain games.
What is the name/manufacturer of the miniature that you are painting?
It's from Arch Villain, it's a 3D print.
@@VinceVenturella Thank you very much Mr V :-)
👍👍
:)
Demon Skirts: Because pants don't come with a hole for a tail.
It's a good point. :)
Remember to like and comment to appease the almighty algorithm 😁❤️👍🏼
All hail!
What mini is that?
Demon from Arch Villain games.
7:14 Am I the only one who hears Mufasa here?
Now that's a compliment. :)
Time to review golden so flat? =)
Yep, I will review it in the future. :)
On camera, your shop appears to be very much on the cold side as far as lighting. Those ceiling lights look like kind of harsh fluorescent actually. My hobby space is frustratingly underlit though.
I have a mix of different lights in my office, some warm, some cold, some more "neutral" so I can move miniatures around and see how they are in different lights. :)