In this, the definitive review for Silent Hill 4, I put this game into the ground for good. TWITCH: / probablyjacoblive TWITTER: / probablyjacobio DISCORD: / discord
If you want to buy Silent Hill 4 (lmfao) at least waste your money with this link to support the channel: af.gog.com/en/game/silent_hill_4_the_room?as=1678711979
The reality is, you shouldn't have to know someone in order to help them or save them. Someone choking on food irl isn't worth your time of assistance b/c you don't know them lol
You don’t think that being bludgeoned to death by a swarm of homicidal wheelchairs is fun, scary, and a stunningly bold statement on the frailty of man?
It's not THAT weird. The cult knows that Silent Hill is essentially a location that is sort of alive, and the cult basically indoctrinated Walter as a child. Then they told him that his mother was still alive in that apartment complex...that's why the entire building looks like it's made of living tissue in his otherworld. Alright, so that does sound weird...but this is the series that manifested a coneheaded demon to punish a dude for wanting to bang his dead wife's doppleganger.
@@culturedonnanoko Well lets say if SH4 and SH4 were running at the same resouloution SH3 would easily look better. Not just art style wise (but it does play a huge role) Douglas and Heathers character models are extremely complex and the lighting is gorgeous it is easily the best looking game of 2003 without the shadow of a doubt. SH4 while great for 2004 isnt as good looking as SH3 so thats why people gvie SH4s graphics a hard time. I hope GOG port SH3 and SH2 (enhanced edition) to GOG.
@@SolidRaiden2655 Silent Hill 4 artistically looks better than 80% of horror games produced today. Yeah SH3 was the series’s peak I’d agree wholeheartedly, but at least agree SH4 looks better than SH2. SH4 is not a bad looking game! Atmosphere wise I think SH4 is hands-down the creepiest.
Umm well actually Jacob you see, the human and the gun are truly the most terrifything thing in the world because of the inherent evil of man and his dark desires with a tool designed only to kill Ah shit shouldn't have paused the video.
You miss a little about the plot, Walter was told by Dahlia Gillespie when he was a child that if he could complete the ritual he could meet his mother that is in the room but the ritual is actually another way to summon their god so he was not exatly crazy he was just used by Dahlia.
Let's be honest that makes him even more of a loser because I can see that works but they didn't let the game team do what they wanted and this was probably something that Konami didn't wanted to throw it away and said, put silent hill on it for sure it will sell, come on I can't believe that the silent team has made one thing of this game it's simply impossible.
Actually, the stock enemy sound effects are a very subtle reference to the psychological warfare used by the ATF against the branch davidians in waco texas
SH4 is my favorite of the series, so I can't agree with this vid. I will admit that I didn't like SH4 at first because of the controls and seemingly bad enemy AI, but after abandoning it for a few weeks and then forcing myself to play it again, I really got into it and everything about the game just clicked. I think it was a combination of it being different from SH1 and SH2, as well as my own impatience in learning the controls and play style. When I accepted the game for what it was, it became enjoyable and interesting. The graphics are fine. What you need to keep in mind is that Team Silent wanted to do something new with the series. They didn't want a repeat of the first three games. Removing the flashlight and radio were part of that, and this of course meant making the levels free of fog and darkness. Now the levels had greater visibility, and this meant the graphics would be lighter. Silent Hill graphics have always been pretty washed out, but the fog and darkness effects obscured this. Even so, SH4 still has rusty or bloody areas. The atmosphere was another thing the team changed. Rather than transitioning into the dark world or back again, the player finds out that Henry has been trapped in the fog world for as long as he's been locked in the apartment. This plays to the psychological horror aspect rather than the visual horror aspect. The world transition is more menacing in the moment, but the storyline revelation is unnerving. I think this is where SH4 chose to excel, in its story-based horror. This will only come across to players who read the notes and journal entries and piece the whole story together. Again, even this aside, there is still a transition of sorts with the apartment itself. It goes from a calm place where damage gradually heals, to a hostile environment that starts to reflect the nightmare at the beginning of the game. Another thing I have to point out is Henry as a blank slate protagonist. I think the developers were going for an every-man type of character that players could project their own ideas onto. This perhaps was not pulled off perfectly, but it was done well enough. In addition to this aspect, Henry was also intended to be the character that was mainly an observer to Walter's murders and story. Henry was a vehicle for storytelling for a plot that was not his own. There are subtle clues about Henry, but he's not the main focus. The main character in this is Walter. Similar to how the main character in SH1 is Cheryl/Alessa. Unless you're willing to delve deep into the storyline of the game by reading the texts, then you won't like this game. There's also the possibility of missing the point, or seeing things that aren't there. Like your fixation on the tissues next to the hole in the wall. Sometimes a tissue is just a tissue. Henry didn't know about the hole in the wall when he put the tissues there. So yeah, you're just seeing random things and piecing them together in your own way. SH4 has a lot of that too. The hole to Eileen's room could be seen in different ways. Some players might be voyeuristic while others might be protective. Some might ignore the hole completely and be dismissive of Eileen's well-being or take no interest in her. Some might desire her because she's the only human they can see. It all depends on the player. Also, there are quite a few callbacks to SH2. The Super is James' father. Henry has pictures of SH1 locations. The holes are a reference to a message in SH2 about how there was a hole here that is gone now. And of course Walter was referenced in a newspaper article that James can read in SH2. You didn't mention any of this in your video, so I'm guessing you didn't bother getting into the story. Your idea that the killings were 10 and 10 and somehow matched up with the number of levels was... incorrect to say the least. Most killings took place in various locations, so it wasn't about those particular levels. You're imagining things. So I think most of these criticisms are nitpicks, and I think you simply didn't get into the game in the first place. I will agree with a few things, like level repeats or lazy sound effects, but these are just a few flaws. The overall game is really good.
I think you may have missed the mark on silent hill enemy design bit. They don’t follow a set pattern save for all being representative of a character’s trauma and psyche. These enemies reflect Walter Sullivan and his traumatic childhood and troubled mind. In general, I don’t think you quite understand the purpose of the monsters. Pyramid Head equivalents didn’t become the status quo until Origins, much to Team Silent’s chagrin. Pyramid Head was special because he was the only thing like him in the series up until this point. I really can’t say I agree with you on the majority of what you’ve said in this video, but I still respect your differing opinion at the very least. Everyone’s entitled to one 🤷♀️
I played and beat this game in 2018---not like 2004, but 2018. The twist and some of the ideas plus the story itself made me love the game so much, I simply forgave the game for everything that might've annoyed me I mean, imagine: your safe room getting invaded!
It's obvious you didn't like the game, and that's cool. You certainly pointed out a few things that are beyond dispute bad. But I think you misunderstood the story and some elements to a large degree. I'll just point out some big things that I noticed. First, a quick one, you can cure Eileen's possession right before the boss fight to make getting the best ending easier - you just use one of the Candles right in front of her, and it will clear her possession. Second, the first person perspective shows more than you give it credit for. The handprints outside the front door show how many victims Walter has killed, and it increases every time Henry fails. As a side note, you claim that the fact Walter killed 10 people while alive was some evidence that the game was originally not a Silent Hill game (because you go through 5 levels 2 times, which equals 10) - but that has nothing to do with the actual story. Yes, he killed 10 while alive, but he has killed 15 (I believe, may be 16 - can't remember exactly - I know he needs 21 total) by the time the story starts. The 5 levels you go through are for the next 5 victims, and you go back through them to show that now the people Henry failed to save are Ghosts in those levels that are after you for failing to save them. Those are the Ghosts you're supposed to use the Swords on. And your apartment is now no longer a safe place because Walter is 1 sacrifice away from completing his ritual. Back to the First Person sections, you can also see the victims of each stage before you get to their stage (you can see the girl walk into the Subway before you meet her there in the Level for example). I also don't understand your hatred of the plot's concept. So what if it's about a normal guy trying to perform a ritual? The whole plot of the 3rd game was about someone trying to perform a ritual in Silent Hill! It's the same thing, just with different execution. You seem to be upset with the people defending this game (and I'll agree, the people saying it's intentionally bad are idiots), but I'd say it's just as stupid to try to comfort yourself by saying "this couldn't possibly been developed as a Silent Hill game, it had to be a separate game with the title just slapped on (even though it was developed by Team Silent, and there's no reason that team would have been working on a separate game while developing Silent Hill 3 at the same time)." The truth is, this was just Team Silent trying something different, while working with the same basic premise of Silent Hill. Again, I get not liking the game, most either love it or hate it. I liked it (although it's been 10 years since I've played it). But even with my fuzzy memory, I know there were some things in your review that are just wrong. And you seem to hate this game so much that you missed some obvious things either because you were rushing to finish the game or just didn't want to look further into certain things (like the plot, and what certain things in each level actually represented). Good video for the most part anyway, you did nail some failings in the game I didn't remember (Sound being a standout) :).
@Frank Marano He may have corrected it immediately after uploading the video. Gotta remember, this video is 50 minutes long - and I didn't want to comment until I'd seen all of it. But I started watching 9 minutes after he uploaded, and his comment wasn't there (and I didn't refresh the video before commenting since I started watching immediately after he uploaded it, and assumed anyone else commenting on his mistakes would watch it all the way through as well). So it's not like I missed or ignored his correction, and just put my correction in anyway to be a dick - his just wasn't there when I did it :).
He also missed the many callbacks to Silent Hill 2. He mistakenly says Cynthia leaves in the bathroom scene then shows up dead, but in fact she shows up in the train car. The overall point is still valid though, that we didn't get to experience enough of the story with Cynthia before finding her dying on the ground.
@@culturedonnanoko Subway was tough, and the return with Eileen was more difficult, especially if you forgot to unlock the other side the first time around. I made a main reply to the video up top. Check it out if you're interested.
@Rubedo Jr. Yea man, that was the most butthurt video about sh4 I ever saw, and the complain about ghosts concepts on the series was just too much for me. I really recommend u watch a 4 year old Thor high heels video on this game, very fun to watch and with really fair points on its flaws and strong points.
Fun fact about the bad, washed out graphics of this game; it's literally the MGS3 engine. I'm pretty sure they reused assets too, the industrial areas in Snake Eater look just like the levels in this game. The only difference is MGS3 wows you with its amazing lush jungles to form a first impression, then you're not really thinking about it by the time you get to the labs. And here's my hot take to go along with that - late PS2 games mostly looked like shit. MGS3 and Shadow of the Colossus look good in spite of those awful trends, not because of them.
I don't agree with your statement on the late ps2 graphics. The problem of SH4 is that is not as detailed as other games on the ps2, it's not about the engine, it's just uninspired and bland artistically. And SH4 has no excuses on the graphics department, because SH3 is the best looking game on the ps2 library, that game is absolutely gorgeous.
Rogue Galaxy, Final Fantasy XII, Ghosthunter and the God Of War games also look fantastic, to be honest. The fact is that the PS2 was weaker than the Gamecube and Xbox but it still had some neat tricks up its sleeve. Apparently it could render some really advanced effects with ease.
I die a bit inside every time someone spreads this bs about tank controls being there to "increase tension". I don't know why zombies keep repeating this without actually researching the topic. The rest of the video is ok.
Is that battle with Walter at the end really worse than that gunfight with Eddie in SH2? In fact, this entire series had absolutely shitty boss battles. The whole series struggles with bad gameplay, stilted dialogue, and weird coneheaded demons that punish you for wanting to bone your wife's doppleganger. People play these games for the atmosphere and how the games make you feel, and if so many people like SH4 that's only a sign that those feelings are subjective.
You can probably take it with a grain of salt when I say SH4 is my favorite in the franchise by a wide margin! I agreed with a most of your assessment on what didn't work mechanically, but I think this video highlighted more than anything else that, honestly... the "Cube World Defense" feels like a summary of my attempts to engage the ENTIRE Silent Hill franchise from an outsider's perspective? I don't think anyone in the history of the internet has been able to lodge a critique of Silent Hill 2's rigid tank controls or how fiddly any direct fight with the monsters are without being told that the game being unwieldy enhances the feelings of horror. I don't think anybody's ever talked about how stilted the writing or voice performance for most the supporting cast is without being told that it's in service to making them feel surreal and unfamiliar. I think you're right when you say none of the enemies in this game are very hard to beat to death with a stick, but pretty much anything that isn't a boss monster is a pushover in SH2, too. It feels weirdly dissonant to (rightfully!) talk about how games should feel mechanically engaging in a video mostly damning SH4 for it's failings relative to the other games in the series. I feel like there's something about the franchise as a whole that never clicked with me, which probably helps with not feeling passionate enough about the series to get angry about your opinions here over which ones aren't good. I'm not going to try to argue that SH4 is some masterpiece of ludonarrative genius, but that's largely because the entire series feels like a bunch of really good psychological horror games shackled to aggressively mediocre survival horror game mechanics, and I just happened to subjectively find the game's execution on its isolation/depression themes more engaging and its ghost/murder plot more interesting than the mindscape psyche-demon stuff the other games were going for. Don't get me wrong, I think Silent Hill 2 has the strongest emotional payoff of the franchise. I think if you didn't find the writing or atmosphere in SH4 effective then it definitely makes sense to hate it! This video just made me realize that I also don't find arguments trying to contrast ANY of the Silent Hill games with each other very compelling when they go beyond the psychological/atmospheric/immersive elements.
I haven't played SH4 but despite how incredibly shoddy it looks, I could see how someone who did like the game would think you simply didn't "get it" after this review. It's easy to mistake bad design and lack of polish as equivalent to unpleasant artistic choices. However, without even a cursory acknowledgement that some of the design could only be that way for effect, the video gains an air of anti-intellectualism. You don't "get" the soundtrack, you don't "get" the camera angles, you don't "get" why the villain isn't another Pyramid Head, - just like how you demonstrably don't "get" Pathologic. Just because a game is depressing, stressful, or even frustrating - doesn't mean it isn't engaging. It rather categorically means the exact opposite.
What's there to honestly "get" about awful camera angles that prevent you from seeing where you're going or where the enemies are located? What's there to "get" about a soundtrack that despite being actually pretty good, only 15% of it is actually used in the game itself? The idea that it can be considered intellectual to look at aspects of a videogame that are objectively terribly executed and try to pass it off as some sort of deliberately crafted postmodern artistic expression is beyond groan-worthy.
@@Housesider theres mechanical critiques to be made but this review literally gets the story and basic things that happen in the game wrong. Its what happens when you rush into something looking for flaws. SH4 has plenty of flaws on its own without intentionally misunderstanding it like this guy
A video gamer saying 'ludonarrative dissonance' makes me eye-roll harder than when a table top gamer says 'verisimilitude'. This was a fun watch. Glad I didn't buy it from GOG.
Just going to cover my ass down here in the comment section and make one small correction. I want to expand a little bit on the idea that this game was not originally a Silent Hill game. The original "Room 302" concept, according to the developers was always intended to be a silent hill "spinoff". If this is true, and it probably is, then the operating word here is spinoff, which could mean literally anything. Absolute best case scenario they were planning Room 302 to be something VERY different set in the Silent Hill universe before at some point changing their minds and going from "spinoff" to "main title release" and even if the game was on a TECHNICAL level always "silent hill" from the start, the end result is still two concepts trying to kill each other in a cage. Also SMALL correction: Apperantly you CAN reverse Eileen's possession with a candle. The rest of my points stand though. UPDATE: apparently healing Eileen with a candle is only temporary? honestly the fact this is so unclear is saying a lot
Finished the video and it's awesome. I dont even remember you having a negative review, much less a napalming like this lmao just saying as a fan, feel free to do bigger companies and more popular games because I enjoy the way you approach them mentally. You manage to make games I wasnt interested in very interesting, regardless of the content. I know you stick to the smaller stuff so you aren't retreading what everyone else has already done, but doing quickie videos here and there or reviewing things like Resident Evil or even Death Stranding, I'd be curious what your thoughts are. Keep up the great work. man, it's been awesome to see this channel explode from the 7k it was at when I found you!
There was one thing I disagreed with and it was the visuals for 3 looking better being a negative I mean dont get me wrong it looks way better but they get a slight pass because 3 and 4 started development AT THE SAME TIME which I've never actually heard of developers doing
You can't actually reverse Eileen's possession with a candle. Well, not usefully or permanently. If you heal her with a candle she will simply become possessed again because the healage is temporary.
The ghost elements would have totally been cool divorces from the SH franchise, always found the idea of using some spooky occult swords to pin ghosts a cool idea
The best of the series. The only SH game I even like. :). I like games that take chances, and tend to liked flawed things that do brave things. SH4 is that. Love it.
To me Silent Hill 4 is a great SH for the same reason Majora’s Mask is a great Zelda game. It may be rough around the edges but it eschews expectations and has the balls to try something totally new, all while having some legitimately creative art direction and atmosphere. The later western-developed SH games really point to what happens when you allow a series’ established tropes to dictate creative choices. If you wanna play a game like SH2 just play SH2
Congratulations, you've made possibly the bitchiest game review I've ever tried to sit through. You obviously can't jibe with the game, which I can understand for a lot of people. But holy shit dude, you missed a lot about what level this game is on by miles. And since you mentioned it was a goal of your's to get people to avoid this game, my goal has been the opposite, even before this port came about. You were upset it wasn't more of what the previous games had going on; it deviated in ways that made it way more distinct than the previous titles. And not only that, it seems you don't even get what makes the previous games in the series 'tick' either. You're exactly the kind of player the developers disregarded when they went through with making this project, focusing instead on experimenting rather than catering. I'm proud of them. This is the only video of your's I've ever seen (and that's going to remain the case.) I've sat through a negative review of this game before, but at least the other one knew why the game had a niche appeal and gave credit when it was due. I got about twenty-one minutes into your's while I was eating dinner and it just, Jesus, the complaining about everything. Whine, whine, whine. Anybody got any cheese? I ain't even here to defend the game. I know the game has flaws, but you couldn't even muster being fluent about them. But this video was just debilitating of itself. If anybody read this comment in it's totality (or just skimmed it or whatever) ignore this guy and go check the game out for yourself. I think they should've put out a demo like they used to have back in the days this game would've been new. I have a used copy of the old PC port on hand, but if I had the cash I'd love to check out the GOG version. Since he didn't have the courteously to include a link, I will: www.gog.com/game/silent_hill_4_the_room You didn't "put the game in the ground". In fact, I'd say this new port was a resurrection for when it was "in the ground". Your complaints were incredibly superficial. I don't wish you or your channel any ill will. You might be a fine person to talk to. But like, ugh, damn man. I was hoping to hear a new take on it, not more of the same complaints from the old Silent Hill fan forum days. People can't even give the game a chance properly, they expect so much out of it. Chill!
The game is probably horrendous by today's standards, but I remember being genuinely creeped out constantly while I played this back in the day. The claustrophobic nature of the room and how your only "safe space" turns against you towards the end of game was amazing. It was a fresh take on Silent Hill and conveyed the same unnerving atmosphere as all of the other titles.
This video misses the point. The game is fine and not "horrendous" by today’s standards. It’s very weird for sure. It’s full of backstory elements and the first game that encourages the player to observe subtle details in the environment.
Its safe since I played sh2 recently thinking it would be terrible by today's standards but I was wrong. It has actually aged very well in most regards. But Sh4 feels way more dated and just a pain.
You forgot to mention the most annoying thing about the ringing phone bit: the stereo panning on the sound is wrong. From the hallway it's on your right (roughly correct) but then when you're right in front of the phone, it switches not to balanced stereo but to *the left*. That is SO CLOSE to being a great idea.
Very valid critique, like it. Since I haven't seen any comment pointing it out, I'll be the one to say it : I think the reason behind the SH4 debacle is actually much more simple than you make it. Most key members of Team Silent were gone by that time... Toyama (gone after 1), Sato (gone after 2), Owaku and Ito (gone after 3) had left Konami or haven't played any significant role in the series thereafter. What can you expect from a team which lost its original director, its main story writer and two of its key artists ? Well, no offense to anyone remaining (Yamaoka, Murakoshi and Tsuboyama), but the answer is Silent Hill 4.
I respect your opinion But I just don't see most of the hate being warranted. I just think that people should judge this game by it's own merit instead of comparing it to the first three. Doing the same formula multiple times will feel regurgitated. It tried breathing new life on the series by taking risks. It's a shame that people hate it just because of that. It is different, sure. But I still warrants the title of being a Silent Hill game. The story and the horror has never been better. I was more enthralled unraveling the events than the games preceeding it. The monster designs and the hauntings scares the shit outta me to this day. The cast, while feeling weaker than 3, is still great. I can personally relate to Henry since I had a fair share of social anxiety for a majoriy of my high school. That's why he struck a chord with me like how James did. Eileen is robably one of my favorite side characters in a horror game. Her personality reminded me of someone that I cherished. I don't think that escorting her was awful. She can help you in combat, which is rare for that subgenre. You can just outrun her to make her stay in a safe area if you don't feeling like babysitting her. Walter reminds me of anti-heroes in fiction. I really feel him in a way. Since being frowned upon can really degrade a person. Loss even. I wouldn't say what he did was justifiable, but I totally understand where he was coming from. The other characters involved are solid too. They feel like people who you can't really trust. Making the theme of isolation feel more apparent. Their backstories really cemented that feeling of uncertainty (Crimson Tome). The songs in this game are some of the best in the series. I love Cradle of Forest so much that I put in on repeat frequently. Although, the sound design could've been a lot better. (I'd be willing to forgive it since Team Silent worked on SH3 and 4 simultaneously with both games being Yamaoka as the sound designer.) With all due respect, I think that this review is too belligerent on it. The game isn't free of criticism, sure (there are some decisions that makes me scratch my head). But to think that it's a huge decline compared to the first three games just undermines the game as a whole.
By pure chance I finished the game today and noticed this video was aired just a couple weeks ago. This is one of the most sincere and honest reviews I've found about it. The game is really bad and I really don't understand why it's so beloved by some players if not for nostalgia. And I don't mean that is bad only in comparison to the other entries in the series, but as a game in general. Such a pity because there are some very interesting ideas, but none of them are well implemented.
Is kind of ironic that the game about of a guy trap in trap in his room and head , introverted, and with social problems (and some depresion for sure, maybe projecting) is the game that passed unnoticed for the most part. Totaly agree with your inicial statement. For me 4 is the most scary , 2 and 3 are just more interesting from a psicological perspective and 1 is pure movie/book cliche goodness. (in the best sence)
Amazing vid as always !! There's a really small amount of TH-camrs that can make me sit through a one hour video and at the end feel like it ended too quickly ! Your writing and basing is smooth , informing and enjoyable ! Thank you for all your hard work it really is a treat to see you in my notifications ♥️♥️
Well, no, Pyramid head is a manifestation of masculine violence and an effigy of James' desire for Punishment, based on an image he'd seen in Silent Hill labeled 'The Executioner'. But yes, reflection and stuff. Just not 'human evil'.
For once there's no " if you haven't finished this game, go play it and come back" I can watch a incredible talented young man make an incredibly well made video, without remorse .
15:30 bruh, Pyramid Head and Walter Sullivan are polar opposites. Pyramid Head is a guide (guardian angel) meant to direct the protagonist in the right direction. Walter was a damaged individual who couldn't cope with the abuse he endured in his life (mother abandoning him in the apartment, the cult indoctrinating him at the orphanage, the torture and pain he endured in the water prison) and decided to selfishly and methodically murder 21 people in the ritual known as the "21 sacraments" I believe as a way to resurrect his mother. I suppose they both follow you around the map but contextually, the child version of Walter Sullivan seems like a better fit for pyramid head. Considering it's Walter's "Silent Hill" and not Henry's and how we see Walter's child (pure) self prevent Walter from killing Eileen, I think it would be safe to assume that Walter's child self is trying direct his future self in a better direction before it's too late.
I came here as a person who actually LOVED Silent Hill 4. And with every minute of this review my blood boiled a little bit more. Because you made me remember things that I don't want to remember. Ok, ok, ok. Fuck. I get it. It's bad. Oh my god. Those fucking hovering ghosts that can't be killed and are just ANNOYING. The Hospital. Eileen. "[Cynthia] Are you ok?". THE CAT NOISES. THE FINAL BOSS. At this point, I think that it's just a prime example of a game so bad that my brain just shut off, spiraled and then somehow persuaded itself into believing that I actually liked it. I remember some good moments it had. I still think that first-person sections were fun, especially in the second half. I wanted to replay it, now that it's on GOG, but I think I will just let it live in my memories, before I'm too traumatised. On the topic of music: you used a scene of and "endless" staircase where Henry is followed by two ghosts. I remember vividly that a song Wounded Warsong is played there. I played this game YEARS ago and I still remember that moment, because it was so weird to hear actual music (also I risked my life by just standing on the stairs and listening to it lol).
The game isn't that bad. Some things clearly haven't aged well, but the game clearly left a terrible impression on the reviewer which tainted the whole experience. Watch youtubers playing the game and most actually have a great time playing it, despite its flaws.
I'd this dude was dropped into the water world he would cry, panic , hyperventilate. These levels are more terrifying than the older nethers due to how realistic they are vs when everything is rust.
TLTW: Didn't like the game, thought the developers should have made something different, feels like there wasn't much research on the game (even if they say otherwise). Satire?
I like Silent Hill 4, even though it is deeply flawed. I won't even try to defend my opinion, I simply had fun playing it and liked the art-direction and to me, that is fine, just as your opinion is :) I liked the video tho, thanks for the extra length!
I’m shocked you liked Agony more than Silent Hill 4, and by that I mean genuinely defended Agony in an uploaded video on your channel. Also this really was always meant to be a Silent Hill title, spin-offs still count. Hell, Silent Hill 3 was going to be a shooter through a significant part of development. Anyway, Team Silent’s Silent Hill 5 was going to introduce online elements so I wonder how you would’ve taken that. Plus the Otherworld being so unlike the prior games makes sense since it’s Walter Sullivan in the role of the “magician” conducting a ritual that’s considered profane even amongst the cult he was raised in. Sound design is definitely the worst out of any Team Silent title. Love your vids even if I don’t always agree! screenrant.com/silent-hill-3-arcade-shooter-details/ www.gamasutra.com/view/news/258015/Classic_Postmortem_Silent_Hill_4_The_Room.php
I have fond memories of playing this game when I was younger, and really enjoying it. I don't remember frustrations so much, I just really enjoyed the atmosphere. Especially the room sections. I loved the claustrophobic feel of the game. Would I play it again now as an adult? Definitely not. Doesn't mean my incorrect memories of the game don't hold a special part in my brain. Also, just because ludonarrative hadn't been coined yet, doesn't mean that it couldn't be on the developer's minds. Just not that specific word. We know that tank controls and fixed cameras are bad design on purpose. Japanese already had the term "kusoge" by that time.
I personally don't believe that this game is some form of high art. But to say that a game can't strive to be high art or has to inherently always be entertaining or fun is pretty objectionable NGL. Especially with the Pathologic comparison.
The real nightmare is corporate politics. This game was developed during a recession so they likely took a game they were already working on, slapped the name of a popular IP on it, made some tweaks and released it to make whatever scratch cash they could that year.
This is why the very next thing he says is: "normally this kind of on the nose reference would be fine, but this game pissed me off so bad that this realization immediately triggered a primal aggression response in me" (6:25) Funny how you chose to ignore that.
@Rando Yep, one nitpick in a sea of very compelling arguments. Exactly the strawman to cling to out of desperation while trying to defend this shit game.
I think the biggest cause behind the state of this game is that it's rushed. A team slapping two concepts together, unfinished sound design, copy pasted enemies etc can all be attributed to some kind of outside pressure meaning they had to release the game early. If it had another 6 months or a year in the oven I'm sure it would have been up to the usual standard. I think people who defend the game are defending the potential game that doesn't exist. Or that only exists if you fill in the gaps with your imagination. Which makes them feel like they alone have discovered the true meaning of the game and will fight anyone who disagrees.
Idk about you guys but Probablyjacob is one of the reasons I open TH-cam. So when I see a 50min upload about an obscure game, best believe my mouth is watering.
@@culturedonnanoko I think because after SH3 alot of people thought that was the peak, also SH4 was a very different and strange game that for whatever reason people didn't vibe with. You'd think SH2 crowd would love it but nope.
@@neonrelmsproductions4224 I love how SH4 is a weird sequel to SH2, featuring Walter Sullivan, Jimmy Stone AKA “The Red Devil” and Jame’s father Frank Sutherland, all having connections to SH2
@@neonrelmsproductions4224 I’m over SH2 like Masahiro Ito is over Pyramid Head. It’s over praised to the moon and back. Can we all move past SH2 lol I was so excited for Silent Hills because P.T. Seemed to draw more inspiration from SH4 than the others... 😭
So honestly this is the first Silent Hill I've ever played and knowing very little about the Silent Hill series I really enjoyed my time playing the game. That being said I can understand exactly why someone would hate this game.
The only awful thing here is this review. SH4 is one of the best SH games, most of all the story is very good and disturbing. Everything after is a crap.
As bad as the game is, it will now stay forever in my mind because of *Wheelchair Enemies* ... Damn, just thinking about them sends shivers down my still-intact legs!
You are definitely wrong. This game isn't bad but different. If you like PT then this game can appeal to you. There vary similar. The fighting leaves alot to be desired but its a pretty good.
Well the tank controls were used not because its difficult and that increases anxiety but because of the numerous different camera angles used in the game.
My memories of this game were so much better than what I'm seeing on the screen right now :c. It was my first Silent Hill ever and now I'm like "Yikes. That looks pretty trashy"
I remember really enjoying this game when I was younger, to be fair that was about a decade ago, so that's probably rose tinted glasses and the fact that I wasn't ready to come to terms with the death of my favorite Survival Horror franchise.
This is the most aggressively negative review I've seen in a while...spinoff turned into silent Hill or not, its not like we get silent hill games anymore and I still remember this game as being somewhat decent.
Wait, didn't the creator of Tank Control already say they did not do it badly intentionally? I'm pretty sure I read an interview in which they explicitly say the controls were just plain bad and that people projected their ideas into it when the RE2 Remake was announced.
It wasn't intentionally bad. It was to keep forward movement the same direction on the analog stick between camera cuts. Downpour tried to make it relative to camera position instead of player rotation and it had trouble with some rooms where the camera cuts were too far apart so as soon as you walked into a room you would instantly turn around and walk out. To not worry about camera positions and whatnot, tank control will keep you moving forward no matter where the cameras are position. That said, tank controls suck.
The plot becomes clearer if you base your belief that the 21 Sacraments was the original plan to birth the Cult’s demon god. Alessa wasn’t meant to be the mother of god, it was in the 1st game during the stairwell cutscene, when Dahlia said, “ Why didn’t I see this before? There’s no reason to wait... Herein lies the mother’s womb, containing the power to create life. I could have done it all myself.” What was Dahlia waiting for? The writers of Silent Hill 4 gave us the answer. She was waiting for Walter to complete the 21 Sacraments.
I honestly think you got so annoyed by this game's mechanics and visuals that everything else was spoiled for you. SH4 actually has one of the best, more well rounded and fleshed out stories from the series, up there with SH2, even being a sort of spiritual sucessor to SH2 and SH1 in it's story and themes. And I think you didn't understand the majority of the plot presented in the game by this video. I do agree that it has a bunch of flaws specially in it's graphics, level design, enemy sounds and the escort mission, but you can't deny this game was ahead of it's time in a lot of ways. Compare it to P.T and see how much that little playable teaser that became such a huge fenomenon borrowed from SH4's idea and overall vibe. If SH4 was remade into today's standards and had it's flaws fixed, it would be a masterpiece Also, I believe SH4 is the most ludonarrative harmonious game in the series. Everything about it is oppressive, stressful and difficult to endure: just like it should be.
Well you see, this game is actually a mirrored hell world of what a "good game", one filled with reactionary controls that let you live out your violent gamer fantasies, would have been considered not just at the time but also in modern day. This game is designed to be so bad that it show you how horrible games and the games industry are.
If you want to buy Silent Hill 4 (lmfao) at least waste your money with this link to support the channel: af.gog.com/en/game/silent_hill_4_the_room?as=1678711979
Everyone thinks this game is bad, your opinion is unoriginal.
The reality is, you shouldn't have to know someone in order to help them or save them. Someone choking on food irl isn't worth your time of assistance b/c you don't know them lol
Yep.. as a Russian I can confirm that Pathalogic is just everything that's going on now in quarantine but with better trashcan loot
Couldn't say anything better
Is it also true that school children have the best narcotics?
@@colbyneblett8454 it’s probably kindergarten kids tho lol
@@che_sidim Is kindergarten not considered school in russia?
Edit: sincere question didn't intend for that to sound as snide as it did lol
@@colbyneblett8454 no worries I get it lol
Nah kindergarten here is optional, it’s like a preschool
You don’t think that being bludgeoned to death by a swarm of homicidal wheelchairs is fun, scary, and a stunningly bold statement on the frailty of man?
milf apartment is the best explanation of I've heard of this weird ass plot point
It's not THAT weird. The cult knows that Silent Hill is essentially a location that is sort of alive, and the cult basically indoctrinated Walter as a child. Then they told him that his mother was still alive in that apartment complex...that's why the entire building looks like it's made of living tissue in his otherworld.
Alright, so that does sound weird...but this is the series that manifested a coneheaded demon to punish a dude for wanting to bang his dead wife's doppleganger.
Yeah, more like a very dirty milf apartment... but it is the best explanation.
Huh, this is the first exclusively negative take on the game I've seen.
Look at avalanche reviews retrospective on this game
@@culturedonnanoko iiiiidk this game looks pretty shit. 🤣
@@culturedonnanoko SH4 looks worse than 3.
@@culturedonnanoko Well lets say if SH4 and SH4 were running at the same resouloution SH3 would easily look better. Not just art style wise (but it does play a huge role) Douglas and Heathers character models are extremely complex and the lighting is gorgeous it is easily the best looking game of 2003 without the shadow of a doubt. SH4 while great for 2004 isnt as good looking as SH3 so thats why people gvie SH4s graphics a hard time. I hope GOG port SH3 and SH2 (enhanced edition) to GOG.
@@SolidRaiden2655 Silent Hill 4 artistically looks better than 80% of horror games produced today. Yeah SH3 was the series’s peak I’d agree wholeheartedly, but at least agree SH4 looks better than SH2. SH4 is not a bad looking game! Atmosphere wise I think SH4 is hands-down the creepiest.
Umm well actually Jacob you see, the human and the gun are truly the most terrifything thing in the world because of the inherent evil of man and his dark desires with a tool designed only to kill
Ah shit shouldn't have paused the video.
You miss a little about the plot, Walter was told by Dahlia Gillespie when he was a child that if he could complete the ritual he could meet his mother that is in the room but the ritual is actually another way to summon their god so he was not exatly crazy he was just used by Dahlia.
Let's be honest that makes him even more of a loser because I can see that works but they didn't let the game team do what they wanted and this was probably something that Konami didn't wanted to throw it away and said, put silent hill on it for sure it will sell, come on I can't believe that the silent team has made one thing of this game it's simply impossible.
Silent Hill 2 and 4 are the peak for me. I LOVE The Room. The atmosphere is unmatched. But I understand people's issue with the game.
The scariest scene is definitely being trapped in a building with a phone ringing that's being ignored
Actually, the stock enemy sound effects are a very subtle reference to the psychological warfare used by the ATF against the branch davidians in waco texas
Damn never saw a video so agressive on this game before lmao
SH4 is my favorite of the series, so I can't agree with this vid. I will admit that I didn't like SH4 at first because of the controls and seemingly bad enemy AI, but after abandoning it for a few weeks and then forcing myself to play it again, I really got into it and everything about the game just clicked. I think it was a combination of it being different from SH1 and SH2, as well as my own impatience in learning the controls and play style. When I accepted the game for what it was, it became enjoyable and interesting.
The graphics are fine. What you need to keep in mind is that Team Silent wanted to do something new with the series. They didn't want a repeat of the first three games. Removing the flashlight and radio were part of that, and this of course meant making the levels free of fog and darkness. Now the levels had greater visibility, and this meant the graphics would be lighter. Silent Hill graphics have always been pretty washed out, but the fog and darkness effects obscured this. Even so, SH4 still has rusty or bloody areas.
The atmosphere was another thing the team changed. Rather than transitioning into the dark world or back again, the player finds out that Henry has been trapped in the fog world for as long as he's been locked in the apartment. This plays to the psychological horror aspect rather than the visual horror aspect. The world transition is more menacing in the moment, but the storyline revelation is unnerving. I think this is where SH4 chose to excel, in its story-based horror. This will only come across to players who read the notes and journal entries and piece the whole story together. Again, even this aside, there is still a transition of sorts with the apartment itself. It goes from a calm place where damage gradually heals, to a hostile environment that starts to reflect the nightmare at the beginning of the game.
Another thing I have to point out is Henry as a blank slate protagonist. I think the developers were going for an every-man type of character that players could project their own ideas onto. This perhaps was not pulled off perfectly, but it was done well enough. In addition to this aspect, Henry was also intended to be the character that was mainly an observer to Walter's murders and story. Henry was a vehicle for storytelling for a plot that was not his own. There are subtle clues about Henry, but he's not the main focus. The main character in this is Walter. Similar to how the main character in SH1 is Cheryl/Alessa.
Unless you're willing to delve deep into the storyline of the game by reading the texts, then you won't like this game. There's also the possibility of missing the point, or seeing things that aren't there. Like your fixation on the tissues next to the hole in the wall. Sometimes a tissue is just a tissue. Henry didn't know about the hole in the wall when he put the tissues there. So yeah, you're just seeing random things and piecing them together in your own way. SH4 has a lot of that too. The hole to Eileen's room could be seen in different ways. Some players might be voyeuristic while others might be protective. Some might ignore the hole completely and be dismissive of Eileen's well-being or take no interest in her. Some might desire her because she's the only human they can see. It all depends on the player.
Also, there are quite a few callbacks to SH2. The Super is James' father. Henry has pictures of SH1 locations. The holes are a reference to a message in SH2 about how there was a hole here that is gone now. And of course Walter was referenced in a newspaper article that James can read in SH2. You didn't mention any of this in your video, so I'm guessing you didn't bother getting into the story. Your idea that the killings were 10 and 10 and somehow matched up with the number of levels was... incorrect to say the least. Most killings took place in various locations, so it wasn't about those particular levels. You're imagining things.
So I think most of these criticisms are nitpicks, and I think you simply didn't get into the game in the first place. I will agree with a few things, like level repeats or lazy sound effects, but these are just a few flaws. The overall game is really good.
I think you may have missed the mark on silent hill enemy design bit. They don’t follow a set pattern save for all being representative of a character’s trauma and psyche. These enemies reflect Walter Sullivan and his traumatic childhood and troubled mind. In general, I don’t think you quite understand the purpose of the monsters. Pyramid Head equivalents didn’t become the status quo until Origins, much to Team Silent’s chagrin. Pyramid Head was special because he was the only thing like him in the series up until this point.
I really can’t say I agree with you on the majority of what you’ve said in this video, but I still respect your differing opinion at the very least. Everyone’s entitled to one 🤷♀️
How do apes with testicles for foreheads reflect Walter Sullivan's private torment?
I played and beat this game in 2018---not like 2004, but 2018. The twist and some of the ideas plus the story itself made me love the game so much, I simply forgave the game for everything that might've annoyed me
I mean, imagine: your safe room getting invaded!
I didnt expect someone missing the point so much could be entertaining, yet here we are.
It's obvious you didn't like the game, and that's cool. You certainly pointed out a few things that are beyond dispute bad. But I think you misunderstood the story and some elements to a large degree. I'll just point out some big things that I noticed. First, a quick one, you can cure Eileen's possession right before the boss fight to make getting the best ending easier - you just use one of the Candles right in front of her, and it will clear her possession. Second, the first person perspective shows more than you give it credit for. The handprints outside the front door show how many victims Walter has killed, and it increases every time Henry fails. As a side note, you claim that the fact Walter killed 10 people while alive was some evidence that the game was originally not a Silent Hill game (because you go through 5 levels 2 times, which equals 10) - but that has nothing to do with the actual story. Yes, he killed 10 while alive, but he has killed 15 (I believe, may be 16 - can't remember exactly - I know he needs 21 total) by the time the story starts. The 5 levels you go through are for the next 5 victims, and you go back through them to show that now the people Henry failed to save are Ghosts in those levels that are after you for failing to save them. Those are the Ghosts you're supposed to use the Swords on. And your apartment is now no longer a safe place because Walter is 1 sacrifice away from completing his ritual. Back to the First Person sections, you can also see the victims of each stage before you get to their stage (you can see the girl walk into the Subway before you meet her there in the Level for example).
I also don't understand your hatred of the plot's concept. So what if it's about a normal guy trying to perform a ritual? The whole plot of the 3rd game was about someone trying to perform a ritual in Silent Hill! It's the same thing, just with different execution. You seem to be upset with the people defending this game (and I'll agree, the people saying it's intentionally bad are idiots), but I'd say it's just as stupid to try to comfort yourself by saying "this couldn't possibly been developed as a Silent Hill game, it had to be a separate game with the title just slapped on (even though it was developed by Team Silent, and there's no reason that team would have been working on a separate game while developing Silent Hill 3 at the same time)." The truth is, this was just Team Silent trying something different, while working with the same basic premise of Silent Hill.
Again, I get not liking the game, most either love it or hate it. I liked it (although it's been 10 years since I've played it). But even with my fuzzy memory, I know there were some things in your review that are just wrong. And you seem to hate this game so much that you missed some obvious things either because you were rushing to finish the game or just didn't want to look further into certain things (like the plot, and what certain things in each level actually represented). Good video for the most part anyway, you did nail some failings in the game I didn't remember (Sound being a standout) :).
@Frank Marano He may have corrected it immediately after uploading the video. Gotta remember, this video is 50 minutes long - and I didn't want to comment until I'd seen all of it. But I started watching 9 minutes after he uploaded, and his comment wasn't there (and I didn't refresh the video before commenting since I started watching immediately after he uploaded it, and assumed anyone else commenting on his mistakes would watch it all the way through as well). So it's not like I missed or ignored his correction, and just put my correction in anyway to be a dick - his just wasn't there when I did it :).
He also missed the many callbacks to Silent Hill 2.
He mistakenly says Cynthia leaves in the bathroom scene then shows up dead, but in fact she shows up in the train car. The overall point is still valid though, that we didn't get to experience enough of the story with Cynthia before finding her dying on the ground.
@@culturedonnanoko Subway was tough, and the return with Eileen was more difficult, especially if you forgot to unlock the other side the first time around.
I made a main reply to the video up top. Check it out if you're interested.
@Rubedo Jr. Yea man, that was the most butthurt video about sh4 I ever saw, and the complain about ghosts concepts on the series was just too much for me.
I really recommend u watch a 4 year old Thor high heels video on this game, very fun to watch and with really fair points on its flaws and strong points.
You bring along a lot of valid points and I whole-heartedly agree with you
"Thinks his mom is a couch and dresses like a school shooter."
Damn, how you do my mans Walter like that? lmfao
Going back through your catalog for the spooky season gives me lots of laughs. Thanks friend ❤
You know you're meant to care about Eileen because she has a choker and you're a Silent Hill player, that's just how it goes
Henry looks like a composite post-grunge singer from the 90's.
Fun fact about the bad, washed out graphics of this game; it's literally the MGS3 engine. I'm pretty sure they reused assets too, the industrial areas in Snake Eater look just like the levels in this game. The only difference is MGS3 wows you with its amazing lush jungles to form a first impression, then you're not really thinking about it by the time you get to the labs.
And here's my hot take to go along with that - late PS2 games mostly looked like shit. MGS3 and Shadow of the Colossus look good in spite of those awful trends, not because of them.
I don't agree with your statement on the late ps2 graphics. The problem of SH4 is that is not as detailed as other games on the ps2, it's not about the engine, it's just uninspired and bland artistically. And SH4 has no excuses on the graphics department, because SH3 is the best looking game on the ps2 library, that game is absolutely gorgeous.
Rogue Galaxy, Final Fantasy XII, Ghosthunter and the God Of War games also look fantastic, to be honest.
The fact is that the PS2 was weaker than the Gamecube and Xbox but it still had some neat tricks up its sleeve. Apparently it could render some really advanced effects with ease.
Some PS2 have better art directions then current games. This guy just likes being a contrarian
@@culturedonnanoko uh oh, somebody got their feelings hurt by opinions on the internet
“Ps2 washed out Graphics.”
Okami: yeah keep telling yourself that Kid.
I die a bit inside every time someone spreads this bs about tank controls being there to "increase tension". I don't know why zombies keep repeating this without actually researching the topic. The rest of the video is ok.
I now have the deep lore on tank controls thanks to other comments, but I will maintain an increase in tension is an accidental side effect
@@ProbablyJacob That's fair.
You really ripped my favorite game to shreds! Great video!
Is that battle with Walter at the end really worse than that gunfight with Eddie in SH2? In fact, this entire series had absolutely shitty boss battles. The whole series struggles with bad gameplay, stilted dialogue, and weird coneheaded demons that punish you for wanting to bone your wife's doppleganger. People play these games for the atmosphere and how the games make you feel, and if so many people like SH4 that's only a sign that those feelings are subjective.
You can probably take it with a grain of salt when I say SH4 is my favorite in the franchise by a wide margin! I agreed with a most of your assessment on what didn't work mechanically, but I think this video highlighted more than anything else that, honestly... the "Cube World Defense" feels like a summary of my attempts to engage the ENTIRE Silent Hill franchise from an outsider's perspective?
I don't think anyone in the history of the internet has been able to lodge a critique of Silent Hill 2's rigid tank controls or how fiddly any direct fight with the monsters are without being told that the game being unwieldy enhances the feelings of horror. I don't think anybody's ever talked about how stilted the writing or voice performance for most the supporting cast is without being told that it's in service to making them feel surreal and unfamiliar. I think you're right when you say none of the enemies in this game are very hard to beat to death with a stick, but pretty much anything that isn't a boss monster is a pushover in SH2, too. It feels weirdly dissonant to (rightfully!) talk about how games should feel mechanically engaging in a video mostly damning SH4 for it's failings relative to the other games in the series.
I feel like there's something about the franchise as a whole that never clicked with me, which probably helps with not feeling passionate enough about the series to get angry about your opinions here over which ones aren't good. I'm not going to try to argue that SH4 is some masterpiece of ludonarrative genius, but that's largely because the entire series feels like a bunch of really good psychological horror games shackled to aggressively mediocre survival horror game mechanics, and I just happened to subjectively find the game's execution on its isolation/depression themes more engaging and its ghost/murder plot more interesting than the mindscape psyche-demon stuff the other games were going for.
Don't get me wrong, I think Silent Hill 2 has the strongest emotional payoff of the franchise. I think if you didn't find the writing or atmosphere in SH4 effective then it definitely makes sense to hate it! This video just made me realize that I also don't find arguments trying to contrast ANY of the Silent Hill games with each other very compelling when they go beyond the psychological/atmospheric/immersive elements.
SH4's writing: Henry finds a woman in the gory throes of death, and says "Are you OK?"
I haven't played SH4 but despite how incredibly shoddy it looks, I could see how someone who did like the game would think you simply didn't "get it" after this review. It's easy to mistake bad design and lack of polish as equivalent to unpleasant artistic choices. However, without even a cursory acknowledgement that some of the design could only be that way for effect, the video gains an air of anti-intellectualism.
You don't "get" the soundtrack, you don't "get" the camera angles, you don't "get" why the villain isn't another Pyramid Head, - just like how you demonstrably don't "get" Pathologic. Just because a game is depressing, stressful, or even frustrating - doesn't mean it isn't engaging. It rather categorically means the exact opposite.
Exactly this!
Hallelujah!! 😭
It's not that we don't "get" it. It's just manifestly not a good game.
What's there to honestly "get" about awful camera angles that prevent you from seeing where you're going or where the enemies are located? What's there to "get" about a soundtrack that despite being actually pretty good, only 15% of it is actually used in the game itself? The idea that it can be considered intellectual to look at aspects of a videogame that are objectively terribly executed and try to pass it off as some sort of deliberately crafted postmodern artistic expression is beyond groan-worthy.
@@Housesider theres mechanical critiques to be made but this review literally gets the story and basic things that happen in the game wrong. Its what happens when you rush into something looking for flaws. SH4 has plenty of flaws on its own without intentionally misunderstanding it like this guy
A video gamer saying 'ludonarrative dissonance' makes me eye-roll harder than when a table top gamer says 'verisimilitude'.
This was a fun watch. Glad I didn't buy it from GOG.
Just going to cover my ass down here in the comment section and make one small correction. I want to expand a little bit on the idea that this game was not originally a Silent Hill game. The original "Room 302" concept, according to the developers was always intended to be a silent hill "spinoff". If this is true, and it probably is, then the operating word here is spinoff, which could mean literally anything. Absolute best case scenario they were planning Room 302 to be something VERY different set in the Silent Hill universe before at some point changing their minds and going from "spinoff" to "main title release" and even if the game was on a TECHNICAL level always "silent hill" from the start, the end result is still two concepts trying to kill each other in a cage.
Also SMALL correction: Apperantly you CAN reverse Eileen's possession with a candle. The rest of my points stand though.
UPDATE: apparently healing Eileen with a candle is only temporary? honestly the fact this is so unclear is saying a lot
Interesting
If I had a penny for every time somebody said this to me, I’d be a rich man.
Finished the video and it's awesome. I dont even remember you having a negative review, much less a napalming like this lmao just saying as a fan, feel free to do bigger companies and more popular games because I enjoy the way you approach them mentally. You manage to make games I wasnt interested in very interesting, regardless of the content. I know you stick to the smaller stuff so you aren't retreading what everyone else has already done, but doing quickie videos here and there or reviewing things like Resident Evil or even Death Stranding, I'd be curious what your thoughts are. Keep up the great work. man, it's been awesome to see this channel explode from the 7k it was at when I found you!
There was one thing I disagreed with and it was the visuals for 3 looking better being a negative
I mean dont get me wrong it looks way better but they get a slight pass because 3 and 4 started development AT THE SAME TIME which I've never actually heard of developers doing
You can't actually reverse Eileen's possession with a candle. Well, not usefully or permanently. If you heal her with a candle she will simply become possessed again because the healage is temporary.
The ghost elements would have totally been cool divorces from the SH franchise, always found the idea of using some spooky occult swords to pin ghosts a cool idea
The best of the series. The only SH game I even like. :). I like games that take chances, and tend to liked flawed things that do brave things. SH4 is that. Love it.
To me Silent Hill 4 is a great SH for the same reason Majora’s Mask is a great Zelda game. It may be rough around the edges but it eschews expectations and has the balls to try something totally new, all while having some legitimately creative art direction and atmosphere. The later western-developed SH games really point to what happens when you allow a series’ established tropes to dictate creative choices. If you wanna play a game like SH2 just play SH2
@@culturedonnanoko holy fuck GO OUTSIDE
Even though this is my personal favorite silent hill game, when that enemy in the hospital burped I laughed so hard my family told me to shut up.
Congratulations, you've made possibly the bitchiest game review I've ever tried to sit through. You obviously can't jibe with the game, which I can understand for a lot of people. But holy shit dude, you missed a lot about what level this game is on by miles. And since you mentioned it was a goal of your's to get people to avoid this game, my goal has been the opposite, even before this port came about. You were upset it wasn't more of what the previous games had going on; it deviated in ways that made it way more distinct than the previous titles. And not only that, it seems you don't even get what makes the previous games in the series 'tick' either.
You're exactly the kind of player the developers disregarded when they went through with making this project, focusing instead on experimenting rather than catering. I'm proud of them. This is the only video of your's I've ever seen (and that's going to remain the case.) I've sat through a negative review of this game before, but at least the other one knew why the game had a niche appeal and gave credit when it was due. I got about twenty-one minutes into your's while I was eating dinner and it just, Jesus, the complaining about everything. Whine, whine, whine. Anybody got any cheese?
I ain't even here to defend the game. I know the game has flaws, but you couldn't even muster being fluent about them. But this video was just debilitating of itself.
If anybody read this comment in it's totality (or just skimmed it or whatever) ignore this guy and go check the game out for yourself. I think they should've put out
a demo like they used to have back in the days this game would've been new. I have a used copy of the old PC port on hand, but if I had the cash I'd love to check out the GOG version.
Since he didn't have the courteously to include a link, I will: www.gog.com/game/silent_hill_4_the_room
You didn't "put the game in the ground". In fact, I'd say this new port was a resurrection for when it was "in the ground". Your complaints were incredibly superficial.
I don't wish you or your channel any ill will. You might be a fine person to talk to. But like, ugh, damn man. I was hoping to hear a new take on it,
not more of the same complaints from the old Silent Hill fan forum days. People can't even give the game a chance properly, they expect so much out of it. Chill!
The game is probably horrendous by today's standards, but I remember being genuinely creeped out constantly while I played this back in the day. The claustrophobic nature of the room and how your only "safe space" turns against you towards the end of game was amazing. It was a fresh take on Silent Hill and conveyed the same unnerving atmosphere as all of the other titles.
This video misses the point. The game is fine and not "horrendous" by today’s standards. It’s very weird for sure. It’s full of backstory elements and the first game that encourages the player to observe subtle details in the environment.
Its safe since I played sh2 recently thinking it would be terrible by today's standards but I was wrong. It has actually aged very well in most regards. But Sh4 feels way more dated and just a pain.
@@SolidRaiden2655 yup. SH4 is a terrible game in the past, present and future.
You forgot to mention the most annoying thing about the ringing phone bit: the stereo panning on the sound is wrong.
From the hallway it's on your right (roughly correct) but then when you're right in front of the phone, it switches not to balanced stereo but to *the left*.
That is SO CLOSE to being a great idea.
Very valid critique, like it.
Since I haven't seen any comment pointing it out, I'll be the one to say it : I think the reason behind the SH4 debacle is actually much more simple than you make it. Most key members of Team Silent were gone by that time... Toyama (gone after 1), Sato (gone after 2), Owaku and Ito (gone after 3) had left Konami or haven't played any significant role in the series thereafter.
What can you expect from a team which lost its original director, its main story writer and two of its key artists ? Well, no offense to anyone remaining (Yamaoka, Murakoshi and Tsuboyama), but the answer is Silent Hill 4.
I have that burp sound on a sound CD I got with a computer magazine around 2000...
"...the character is willingly diving into the other world because he has no other choice."
Try to wrap your head around that one, folks. :D
I respect your opinion
But I just don't see most of the hate being warranted. I just think that people should judge this game by it's own merit instead of comparing it to the first three. Doing the same formula multiple times will feel regurgitated.
It tried breathing new life on the series by taking risks. It's a shame that people hate it just because of that.
It is different, sure. But I still warrants the title of being a Silent Hill game. The story and the horror has never been better. I was more enthralled unraveling the events than the games preceeding it. The monster designs and the hauntings scares the shit outta me to this day.
The cast, while feeling weaker than 3, is still great. I can personally relate to Henry since I had a fair share of social anxiety for a majoriy of my high school. That's why he struck a chord with me like how James did. Eileen is robably one of my favorite side characters in a horror game. Her personality reminded me of someone that I cherished.
I don't think that escorting her was awful. She can help you in combat, which is rare for that subgenre. You can just outrun her to make her stay in a safe area if you don't feeling like babysitting her.
Walter reminds me of anti-heroes in fiction. I really feel him in a way. Since being frowned upon can really degrade a person. Loss even. I wouldn't say what he did was justifiable, but I totally understand where he was coming from.
The other characters involved are solid too. They feel like people who you can't really trust. Making the theme of isolation feel more apparent. Their backstories really cemented that feeling of uncertainty (Crimson Tome).
The songs in this game are some of the best in the series. I love Cradle of Forest so much that I put in on repeat frequently.
Although, the sound design could've been a lot better. (I'd be willing to forgive it since Team Silent worked on SH3 and 4 simultaneously with both games being Yamaoka as the sound designer.)
With all due respect, I think that this review is too belligerent on it. The game isn't free of criticism, sure (there are some decisions that makes me scratch my head). But to think that it's a huge decline compared to the first three games just undermines the game as a whole.
Also, that part with Irene you can use the candles can't you?
Apparently you can, which is news to me, Eileen is now 99% annoying instead of 100%. Will add a correction.
Actually that's a myth uve tried it before and it doesnt work. When you get to the boss Eileen will be repossessed.
@@SolidRaiden2655 but she walks slower
By pure chance I finished the game today and noticed this video was aired just a couple weeks ago. This is one of the most sincere and honest reviews I've found about it. The game is really bad and I really don't understand why it's so beloved by some players if not for nostalgia. And I don't mean that is bad only in comparison to the other entries in the series, but as a game in general. Such a pity because there are some very interesting ideas, but none of them are well implemented.
Is kind of ironic that the game about of a guy trap in trap in his room and head , introverted, and with social problems (and some depresion for sure, maybe projecting) is the game that passed unnoticed for the most part. Totaly agree with your inicial statement. For me 4 is the most scary , 2 and 3 are just more interesting from a psicological perspective and 1 is pure movie/book cliche goodness. (in the best sence)
What do you mean with projecting in this sense?
Amazing vid as always !! There's a really small amount of TH-camrs that can make me sit through a one hour video and at the end feel like it ended too quickly ! Your writing and basing is smooth , informing and enjoyable ! Thank you for all your hard work it really is a treat to see you in my notifications ♥️♥️
Well, no, Pyramid head is a manifestation of masculine violence and an effigy of James' desire for Punishment, based on an image he'd seen in Silent Hill labeled 'The Executioner'. But yes, reflection and stuff. Just not 'human evil'.
For once there's no " if you haven't finished this game, go play it and come back"
I can watch a incredible talented young man make an incredibly well made video, without remorse .
15:30 bruh, Pyramid Head and Walter Sullivan are polar opposites. Pyramid Head is a guide (guardian angel) meant to direct the protagonist in the right direction. Walter was a damaged individual who couldn't cope with the abuse he endured in his life (mother abandoning him in the apartment, the cult indoctrinating him at the orphanage, the torture and pain he endured in the water prison) and decided to selfishly and methodically murder 21 people in the ritual known as the "21 sacraments" I believe as a way to resurrect his mother. I suppose they both follow you around the map but contextually, the child version of Walter Sullivan seems like a better fit for pyramid head. Considering it's Walter's "Silent Hill" and not Henry's and how we see Walter's child (pure) self prevent Walter from killing Eileen, I think it would be safe to assume that Walter's child self is trying direct his future self in a better direction before it's too late.
The main point they didnt need him to just be a dude with a gun
Hell yeah! Just when I was about to give up on youtube for today!
The bit with the phone ringing killed me lmfao- This made my day tho- I have no choice but to stan
The best part of silent hill 4 is room full of angels fight me
It is possible to revert Eileen possession, you have to light a candle near her and wait.
I came here as a person who actually LOVED Silent Hill 4. And with every minute of this review my blood boiled a little bit more. Because you made me remember things that I don't want to remember. Ok, ok, ok. Fuck. I get it. It's bad. Oh my god. Those fucking hovering ghosts that can't be killed and are just ANNOYING. The Hospital. Eileen. "[Cynthia] Are you ok?". THE CAT NOISES. THE FINAL BOSS. At this point, I think that it's just a prime example of a game so bad that my brain just shut off, spiraled and then somehow persuaded itself into believing that I actually liked it. I remember some good moments it had. I still think that first-person sections were fun, especially in the second half.
I wanted to replay it, now that it's on GOG, but I think I will just let it live in my memories, before I'm too traumatised.
On the topic of music: you used a scene of and "endless" staircase where Henry is followed by two ghosts. I remember vividly that a song Wounded Warsong is played there. I played this game YEARS ago and I still remember that moment, because it was so weird to hear actual music (also I risked my life by just standing on the stairs and listening to it lol).
The game isn't that bad. Some things clearly haven't aged well, but the game clearly left a terrible impression on the reviewer which tainted the whole experience. Watch youtubers playing the game and most actually have a great time playing it, despite its flaws.
I'd this dude was dropped into the water world he would cry, panic , hyperventilate. These levels are more terrifying than the older nethers due to how realistic they are vs when everything is rust.
Damn man is this the longest upload you’ve done yet? I’m pumped! Love your videos man
TLTW: Didn't like the game, thought the developers should have made something different, feels like there wasn't much research on the game (even if they say otherwise). Satire?
I honestly have such a soft spot for this game awesome video tho! Keep it up man! :D
I like Silent Hill 4, even though it is deeply flawed. I won't even try to defend my opinion, I simply had fun playing it and liked the art-direction and to me, that is fine, just as your opinion is :)
I liked the video tho, thanks for the extra length!
Nice intro, I was thinking of that kazoo kid clip right before it even played.
I’m shocked you liked Agony more than Silent Hill 4, and by that I mean genuinely defended Agony in an uploaded video on your channel. Also this really was always meant to be a Silent Hill title, spin-offs still count. Hell, Silent Hill 3 was going to be a shooter through a significant part of development. Anyway, Team Silent’s Silent Hill 5 was going to introduce online elements so I wonder how you would’ve taken that. Plus the Otherworld being so unlike the prior games makes sense since it’s Walter Sullivan in the role of the “magician” conducting a ritual that’s considered profane even amongst the cult he was raised in. Sound design is definitely the worst out of any Team Silent title. Love your vids even if I don’t always agree!
screenrant.com/silent-hill-3-arcade-shooter-details/
www.gamasutra.com/view/news/258015/Classic_Postmortem_Silent_Hill_4_The_Room.php
This game has Jacob spinning in his VampCo. transport coffin harder than those fucking wheelchairs are gyrating in the Otherworld Public Hospital.
I have fond memories of playing this game when I was younger, and really enjoying it. I don't remember frustrations so much, I just really enjoyed the atmosphere. Especially the room sections. I loved the claustrophobic feel of the game. Would I play it again now as an adult? Definitely not. Doesn't mean my incorrect memories of the game don't hold a special part in my brain.
Also, just because ludonarrative hadn't been coined yet, doesn't mean that it couldn't be on the developer's minds. Just not that specific word. We know that tank controls and fixed cameras are bad design on purpose. Japanese already had the term "kusoge" by that time.
Bruh, You can finish fallen enemies easily if you let go of the lock on button.
One of many basic gameplay mechanics and story misunderstandings in this video
I personally don't believe that this game is some form of high art. But to say that a game can't strive to be high art or has to inherently always be entertaining or fun is pretty objectionable NGL. Especially with the Pathologic comparison.
The real nightmare is corporate politics.
This game was developed during a recession so they likely took a game they were already working on, slapped the name of a popular IP on it, made some tweaks and released it to make whatever scratch cash they could that year.
The streets named after Horror authors has been a thing since SH2 friend.
SH2? Off the top of my head SH1 had Bradbury St and Bachman St (Richard Bachman is a Stephen King pen name).
@@clownhunter You are correct! I have a shitty memory about things related to SH1.
This is why the very next thing he says is: "normally this kind of on the nose reference would be fine, but this game pissed me off so bad that this realization immediately triggered a primal aggression response in me" (6:25)
Funny how you chose to ignore that.
Yeah I'm playing the original SH through right now - every single street is a literary reference. It's a bit silly but it fits I guess.
@Rando Yep, one nitpick in a sea of very compelling arguments. Exactly the strawman to cling to out of desperation while trying to defend this shit game.
I think the Russian defense against counter-arguments is probably this video's strongest armor.
Far from the best, but I quite liked 4 at the time, the whole dynamic with the room was neat and remains iconic still.
It's one thing to "feel" depressed because of the storytelling or atmosphere, another when the gameplay makes you depressed ....
Is my timeline off? I was under the impression that it wasn't Team Silent who made Silent Hill 4, thus a lot of the issues with it.
It was made by the B team.
I think the biggest cause behind the state of this game is that it's rushed. A team slapping two concepts together, unfinished sound design, copy pasted enemies etc can all be attributed to some kind of outside pressure meaning they had to release the game early. If it had another 6 months or a year in the oven I'm sure it would have been up to the usual standard. I think people who defend the game are defending the potential game that doesn't exist. Or that only exists if you fill in the gaps with your imagination. Which makes them feel like they alone have discovered the true meaning of the game and will fight anyone who disagrees.
The iconic silent hill hospital theme enemy...."the wheelchair"....lol.....🤣🤣
Idk about you guys but Probablyjacob is one of the reasons I open TH-cam. So when I see a 50min upload about an obscure game, best believe my mouth is watering.
SH4 is good! Fight me!
@@culturedonnanoko I think because after SH3 alot of people thought that was the peak, also SH4 was a very different and strange game that for whatever reason people didn't vibe with. You'd think SH2 crowd would love it but nope.
@@culturedonnanoko SH2 did less to further the overall plot of the series and everyone is obsessed with SH2 (me included).
@@neonrelmsproductions4224 I love how SH4 is a weird sequel to SH2, featuring Walter Sullivan, Jimmy Stone AKA “The Red Devil” and Jame’s father Frank Sutherland, all having connections to SH2
@@culturedonnanoko Which makes the hate from the SH2 crowd all the stranger.
@@neonrelmsproductions4224 I’m over SH2 like Masahiro Ito is over Pyramid Head. It’s over praised to the moon and back. Can we all move past SH2 lol I was so excited for Silent Hills because P.T. Seemed to draw more inspiration from SH4 than the others... 😭
So honestly this is the first Silent Hill I've ever played and knowing very little about the Silent Hill series I really enjoyed my time playing the game.
That being said I can understand exactly why someone would hate this game.
The only awful thing here is this review. SH4 is one of the best SH games, most of all the story is very good and disturbing. Everything after is a crap.
you are the best youtuber ever dude, fr my fav this year. i hope you get millions of subs soon. you really deserve more!😤👌
As bad as the game is, it will now stay forever in my mind because of *Wheelchair Enemies* ... Damn, just thinking about them sends shivers down my still-intact legs!
Building world? Apartment world? Is this the horror version of mario odyssy?
Different is not bad
You are definitely wrong.
This game isn't bad but different. If you like PT then this game can appeal to you. There vary similar.
The fighting leaves alot to be desired but its a pretty good.
Yep, you nailed it dude! God I wish we could get another SH game like one of the first three, or even a continuation on the Silent Hills prototype.
Well the tank controls were used not because its difficult and that increases anxiety but because of the numerous different camera angles used in the game.
For a 2004 game it really isnt that visually terrible
WHAT!? Talking about bad games is boring? YOU SERIOUS!??? Thats the best entertainment on fucking TH-cam 😂😂😂
My memories of this game were so much better than what I'm seeing on the screen right now :c. It was my first Silent Hill ever and now I'm like "Yikes. That looks pretty trashy"
This comment section in gold! Pure chaos! 😂
20m in and its also just painfully obvious this game just wasn’t done. So much “we’ll fix it later” and “that still needs the real effect”
It’s better than SH2 though 🤷♂️
I remember really enjoying this game when I was younger, to be fair that was about a decade ago, so that's probably rose tinted glasses and the fact that I wasn't ready to come to terms with the death of my favorite Survival Horror franchise.
This is the most aggressively negative review I've seen in a while...spinoff turned into silent Hill or not, its not like we get silent hill games anymore and I still remember this game as being somewhat decent.
Silent Hill 4 was always meant to be Silent Hill
Well there seems to be plenty of evidence that it sucks. I can corroborate all the points made here
@@Dunmerdog if anything, I thought the reviewer was overly generous to SH4.
Wait, didn't the creator of Tank Control already say they did not do it badly intentionally? I'm pretty sure I read an interview in which they explicitly say the controls were just plain bad and that people projected their ideas into it when the RE2 Remake was announced.
Well, if it wasn't intentional, the effect is the same either way
@@ProbablyJacob fair
It wasn't intentionally bad. It was to keep forward movement the same direction on the analog stick between camera cuts. Downpour tried to make it relative to camera position instead of player rotation and it had trouble with some rooms where the camera cuts were too far apart so as soon as you walked into a room you would instantly turn around and walk out. To not worry about camera positions and whatnot, tank control will keep you moving forward no matter where the cameras are position. That said, tank controls suck.
The plot becomes clearer if you base your belief that the 21 Sacraments was the original plan to birth the Cult’s demon god. Alessa wasn’t meant to be the mother of god, it was in the 1st game during the stairwell cutscene, when Dahlia said, “ Why didn’t I see this before? There’s no reason to wait...
Herein lies the mother’s womb, containing the power to create life. I could have done it all myself.”
What was Dahlia waiting for?
The writers of Silent Hill 4 gave us the answer. She was waiting for Walter to complete the 21 Sacraments.
I could have sworn I could put candles on the floor and regeneration was nerfed not gone. ... Are the hauntings blocking the regen?
I honestly think you got so annoyed by this game's mechanics and visuals that everything else was spoiled for you. SH4 actually has one of the best, more well rounded and fleshed out stories from the series, up there with SH2, even being a sort of spiritual sucessor to SH2 and SH1 in it's story and themes. And I think you didn't understand the majority of the plot presented in the game by this video.
I do agree that it has a bunch of flaws specially in it's graphics, level design, enemy sounds and the escort mission, but you can't deny this game was ahead of it's time in a lot of ways. Compare it to P.T and see how much that little playable teaser that became such a huge fenomenon borrowed from SH4's idea and overall vibe. If SH4 was remade into today's standards and had it's flaws fixed, it would be a masterpiece
Also, I believe SH4 is the most ludonarrative harmonious game in the series. Everything about it is oppressive, stressful and difficult to endure: just like it should be.
SH4 is just terrible, sorry. If it were made by today's standards, it would look better but still be terrible.
Silent hill 4 is my favorite silent hill game .
joke is on you for using reddit
My favorite TH-camr has uploaded again this is pog
Thought there were items in the game to reverse Eileen's possession. Yeah you can use a candle to completely reverse it
Finally a take that isnt "every silent hill game should just be silent hill 2 again"
Also some people would disagree with me, but i believe silent hill 4 started out as a different game that was turned into a silent hill game.
One of my favorite horror plots of all time.
You know you don't need to ready your weapon to do a stomp finisher, right?
Well you see, this game is actually a mirrored hell world of what a "good game", one filled with reactionary controls that let you live out your violent gamer fantasies, would have been considered not just at the time but also in modern day. This game is designed to be so bad that it show you how horrible games and the games industry are.
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