Ha, ha. Come on, some rankings have Harleys as being more reliable than Austrian and German bikes at this point (but yes, still behind the Japanese brands in this regard.) If they would just call me, I'm sure we could come up with something reliable : )
i just tried the standard version yesterday, and i was happily surprised of the qualities of that bike ! Premium Maxi-Trail indeed with Premium materials, i loved it ! thank you for your profssional and detailed review !! cheers from the Random French guy from Bali ;-)
For the entire first half you might as well have been reading their sales brochure. Specs and more specs. No actual review. Sorry, but this was kind of weak.
So....we should do a review....without listing the specs of the bike. Hmm. The next person would complain that we didn't list the specs of the bike, so......
Lol this is ridiculous HD. It's like calling a Porsche crossover SUV an off-road vehicle. Harley messed up the ONE segment of motorcycles that people can't get enough of. And they messed it up by an order of 3. Give us a truly off road worthy, lightweight 400 with none of those stupid gadgets. Stick to your styling and you'll kill it HD.
@Mike Fu thank you for that definitive answer. So glad you provided results, evidence, and a clear understanding how how bikes are designed. Keep on trucking squid
I love my Pan America. It is such a fun bike to ride. I rode it to Alaska (Deadhorse) and back from Southern California (9000 Miles) and it performed flawlessly. I just got back from a ride down the Baja Peninsula last week (1000 miles) and I had a couple problems. The chain stretched to where I couldn't adjust it anymore, and about 60 miles south of the Border, my stator failed, which caused the battery to drain. However, these problems could happen to any brand. Probably my main upgrade to the Pan America would be to switch to a shaft drive. I know the chain is better for off road, but the Pan America is never going to be a hard core off roader. It's more dirt roads and forest roads. Anyway, thought I would share my experience and 2 cents.
Glad to hear you're enjoying your PA. You're putting in some good miles. I have a KTM 1290 SA now and was thinking about replacing it within the next year. I've done a few test rides on the PA and must say that HD has done a nice job. Out of the gate, they seemed to have done a lot of homework to make a competitive bike. This is totally outside the box for them. They stepped on the competitors home field. They didn't hit a home run, but I think they slid into 3rd base. Way to swing HD. I've never been a big HD fan for the most part. Having a touring BMW and a KTM ADV bike, I Am pulling for HD in this segment. Hopefully they will stick with it and continue to improve the platform. Safe travels and many miles / adventures in the future.
You mentioned the ride to Deadhorse, what did you think of that experience? Been to the mid-west and west coast out of Pennsylvania. Heading to AZ and UT, again summer of 24. I have Alaska on my must do ride bucket list. That's going to be approximately 13000 mile trip from Pa. I even have a also retired ex-coworker that now lives in Delta Junction. That's southeast of Fairbanks. He's looking for me to stop in when I get to AK. Lots of planning, but it would be a epic ride.
@@curtissmith8789 Thanks Curtis. I recently sold the Pan American. It just so happens I was at a BMW motorcycle dealer , looking at their bikes. When I was ready to leave, my PA wouldn't start. The BMW dealership was so nice. They had their mechanic look at it (he used to be a Harley mechanic) and he couldn't get it started. They offered to take it as a trade-in, and I accepted. I now ride a 2023 GS 1250 Adventure. I plan to do a video soon a post it on my site.
What are you thinking about your 1250 GSA. My riding partner has one, he loves it. I think it's a very nice bike. I really like it too. If you're looking at a ADV bike, it's hard to dismiss a BMW. I will say everyone that rode a PA liked it.
Never been a fan of HD, but this one is certainly turning my head. Good job for HD to start expanding their horizons into the ADV industry. Also, your tiny hands B-roll is hilarious.
Probably one of the best unbiased reviews. I test rode one and it will be my next bike. I currently own a HD Street Glide touring model and will not get rid of it. Different bikes for different riding adventures. Main reason I would steer towards an HD PA is dealership network availability. For those who don't live near a huge city metro area, it makes a difference. I didn't get into the riding motorcycles to be a full time mechanic, I got into it to ride. I don't care if its an motorcycle, atv, boat, jet ski, whatever toy it is. Stuff does break.
I find your information about the Pan American to be accurate mostly from one who actually own one with 6 other motorcycles If you change out the stock HD tires to the more aggressive ones they have for the PA , you will find it to be a very capable bike . The only really bad thing I have found about the PA isn't with the bike .How HD put the bike out there with out really educating the dealers and their mechanics about them 1st . Also the backlog for getting accessories from them is ridiculous I find it kind of sad of all the haters out there , most of them who actually never ridden the PA or even a Harley . It's not about brand of bike you ride , it's about the ride . What ever bike works for you is good . I never rode or owned a motorcycle I didn't like and wish I would have kept them all . They all have different personalities
My black HD aluminum panniers are still on back order for my 2022 PA. Picking the bike up on the 11th of April come hell or high water. Will use a 20L dry pack on the tail if necessary until the HD accessories arrive. Very frustrating
I’m a little late to this party but agree with the dealer debut. That seems to be on par with how they (dealers) handled the Buell years. I’ve owned many bikes and finally an HD (FLSL) but my riding is very dirt (road) oriented. Pan am would fit the bill but I’ve had a GS that excelled in that. I’m fortunate to have a few bikes that can do their intended “jobs”. Good on Harley for this bike, but now get the bricks and mortar to back them up. Accessories, if the MoCo can’t supply there are others that will.. cheers
I rode my Yamaha FZ1 to the Pan America Demo. I expected the PA to feel slow... But in sport mode it was almost as much of a rocket as my FZ1. Incredible that a bike can handle the road at 136 Mph (Fastest my riding partner took it) and then ride dirt.
Please excuse my comment if history isn't your strong suit. Harley Davidson made it's name early in dirt track and flat track racing. Early HDs were made for all terrain as the road systems in America were developing. Harley and it's war bikes were made for all terrain and served our country long before the foreign manufacturers came to be. Triumph and BMW being an exception! Thank the "baby boomers" for HD getting stuck in the touring big bike market for so long. My 1965 Pan Head Electro Glide saw as much gravel with me leaving the family farm as most "off road" bikes due to circumstances. Electronic/computer driving aids weren't needed when riders maintained their own bikes. I believe we were better riders back then. Dependence on ABS and traction control sensors are the chief reason for riders incompetence. Poorly trained and limited experience riders speeding and taking risks while relying on the computer is in my opinion, the main reason for fatal accidents today. I grew up kick starting and controlling timing of my bikes. Modern riders can't even manually adjust timing on the fly or utilize a foot clutch or hand shifter, where is coordination? You all are in my prayers Hoka Hey
SO HD have a look at the Harley-Davidson XA 740 from WW2: Shaft drive maybe taller suspension with an Ealres fork idea up font and modern brakes .. If you keep the look of the old bike you will sell a ton of them . It is a bike HD made for the North African War . Great back story of sales :)
Overall great video. Only problem I had was with the comparison of the compression ratios to a completely different class of ADV bikes. The PanAm's 13:1 ratio is comparable to the BMW 1250 GS's 12.5:1 and the KTM 1290 Super Adventure's 13.1:1. I agree with the concerns over accessibility to higher octane fuels in remote locations though, and what that looks like over the lifetime of a yet to be tested engine.
I completely agree, HD should make a middle weight. Keep refining the Pan America as well. HD challenged the GS, but fell short. HD did an outstanding job though. Ride ADV, you guys always doing an outstanding job.
Comfortably, thanks! Hard to imagine how they could be cost-competitive with for example, the T7, but regardless, there are enough Harley enthusiasts out there that they could really grab some of that middleweight market. Hope so.
Side stand also is bolted directly to the engine case..by 3 bolts..could be a problem if stressed to much...i was surprised to hear that as I own a 23 special.. I love it so far..
Cars and motorcycles have recommended octane numbers. Manufacturers realize some countries do not offer 91 octane for maximum performance. Antiknock/dieseling are software covered with less performance noted with non optimal fuel numbers. Works the other way also. If you fueled 91 octane in a vehicle that requires only 87 no increase in performance as just wasting money. Multistrada V4, Super Adventure, Ducati Desert X all running higher compression for improved performance as engine designed from factory vs someone changing the compression from non factory specs by changing to different pistons to increase compression. VVT and forced induction could be seen more frequently in bikes similar to cars. Direct injection may not appear like cars because of the faster rpm’s bikes require.
I totally agree that they need a middle weight bike. I bought a Tiger 900 just for that reason. The 1200 and the GS were both WAY too tall and heavy. Pan America has definitely got me interested, but the current one is too heavy for me.
ARH needs to have the electronics to be able to turn it off in all modes totally. Try it with a tall seat and the side stand is almost impossible to use safely without pitching it too far to the right. At the moment, the only way of getting rid of the ARH is to create a custom mode but then one will have to return to that custom mode if one has been in a standard mode say enduro or rain before stopping. I have heard that maybe dealers can turn it off and if someone can tell me how to do that permanently, I would be grateful. Thank you.
So the cons are things that may go wrong but now almost two years in haven’t. And the ground clearance sure is your gonna use this bike 90% off road which why would anyone buy this for that ? Just saying.
I’d like to see this bike lose 40 pounds, get more ground clearance and a 21/18 wheel combo, and at least be as loud as a KTM/Triumph. The one that goes by my job every day is so quiet you’d think it was a GS or V Strom
thanks for the insight, i just brought one and looking forward to picking it up, sounds like its going to be great up here in the nothern teritory of Austrailai
A middleweight ADV with that self-lowering base? Might give it a second thought, as I am just too short for a T7...Harley should gain a bit of speed though, as the Honda Transalp seems to be joining the game, too...
The PANAMERICA 1250 special has arrived in the top class of adventure motorcycles. Since 26.06.2020 I own a PAN Special beside my BMW GS 1250 HPA. With my friends from K+M Harleyworld we got startet with the project 1-100.000 km. Our vision is to check the usability, the reliability and the sustainability of the new HD Motorcycle. Challenge 1 and 2 related to the usability and reliability was already completed end of October. We mounted a lot of useful stuff to make the Pan really usable for off-road adventures. Therefore a lot of innovations are mounted on my PAN „Elvis“ to make it fit for purpose. Then we crossed all high alp passes on gravel and asphalt in July. In August we went to the island of corse to cross also all high passes under high temperature conditions (40 degrees or hotter outside temp) At least my PAN has felt sand under its tyres for the first time. In September / October we got started with challenge 2. We moved to Morocco to the high Atlas region. We crossed all high Atlas passes including the Col de Ouano on gravel, we circled the big duna of Erg Chebbi on old rally Dakar tracks and we checked out heavy city traffic under high temperature conditions. Result: The PAN collected during 4 month almost 30577 km on its meter. Almost 15% of this driven kilometers where been carried out on unsaved roads, mud, gravel or sand. So unter the line the PAN made it on all playgrounds where the competitor brands usually run their shows. This without breakdown or other serious problems….. On 31st October, I have shipped my PAN to Chile. On 3rd of January 2022 I will start my adventure „all the way up“ riding the Panamericana highway from Argentina to Alaska. This last and long lasting test is mainly relayed to the point sustainability. Chapeau Harley at this point… If you are interested, check out Biker.Jo on TH-cam or Instagram …KR Jo
I bought the base model Pan Am as I didn't really need many of the features of the Special as I ride it mostly on ride for touring. At 6'2" I also don't need the ARH to touch the ground when stopped but if I were to do it over again I would buy the Special with the ARH and then put on the accessory high seat that HD sells. The reason being is that I find the leg room right at the limit of what I find comfortable, if I were to put the high seat on I would no longer be able to comfortably reach the ground. I also find the stock seat to be a little too soft for long trips but that is likely due to my size - 245lbs - and a Corbin seat is in my very near future. I puzzle to understand why the rectifier/regulator is where it is but haven't had any issues with it yet so what do I know? Overall I'm very happy with my Pan Am after trying a few different bikes to replace my beloved 2009 Buell Ulysses. Ride safe out there.
Thanks for sharing, and yea, maybe that Adaptive Ride Height could have been useful. Wonder what they are charging to add it? Congrats on your fun machine, and yea, Corbin makes great seats.
@@RIDEAdventures In Canada the base model is $20,999, the Special is $24,199. Of course the ARH is only offered as an option on the Special due to the Semi-Active Suspension (the base model has regular suspension and is very good), the ARH is $1200. After taxes it comes out to $5060 plus another $800 for the spoked wheels should you want them. A pretty big hit but given all the extras that come with the Special it is actually probably a pretty good value.
Bret did a review and showed that the side stand was attached to the engine, would make me pretty nervous to pivot the bike out of a tight spot using the stand.
Yea, we somehow missed mentioning that. Probably not the rugged type of adventure bike one would get into such situations anyway, but a good reminder why not to.
100% agree! I live in the metro Milwaukee area and have friends that worked for Harley. Definitely want to see a great American motorcycle company succeed! Hey Harley, listen to this man, produce a mid-size adventure bike, and make it affordable for the working man!
Kevin, let'em hear it! Thanks for the note. Probably a long-shot that they'd end up anywhere near the pricing of the Yamaha's and Hondas, but Harley is also the type of company that doesn't need to worry so much about being price-competitive. Hope they do it, and consult with me on the design of the middle-weight ADV bike. -- Eric
100% agree with review and that HD needs a midsize. I ride a rare Honda CL400.. only made for 2 years.. scrambler style. Harley could even use their 750cc engine. Tune it for low end.. that bike is already small. Make a new frame.. Honda is bringing back Transalp. And possibly a CL500 and maybe even Africa Twin back to a 650-750.. Harley will be left behind
Somehow Harley has not yet called their hometown homeboy (me) to consult on the development of that midsize bike. Their target is simple: Yamaha's T7. Just a few small, easy, and obvious changes to that bike, and they'll OWN the market. (Although I'm not sure how they'd compete on that price or reliability.) --- Thanks for watching.
Thank you for the review. I enjoyed several points you brought up, including the point about the compression ratio and less than premium gasoline. I have ridden one myself, though only on road and just loved the bike. I am 5'11" and if felt like it was build for me. Fantastic engine, felt lighter and more nimble than I expected, and handled great on the pavement. They wouldn't let me take it off road, of course. I look forward to a middle weight as well and hope Harley does a great job with it.
Richard, it'll be interesting to see how you like the bike off-pavement, and who knows, maybe after your Training Expedition next month, perhaps you'll make a point to find out : ) Thanks for watching.
It's so ugly only father could like it. Harley-Davidson should donate this bike to Ukrainian army. It would look good with side car and machine gun on it. It's only way to advertise this ugly thing. One more advise. Mad Max 3, make it as main character.
You are about my size.....and watching you ride.....your knees look like they are WAY out in front of you. It doesn't look comfortable. Did this bike have their "Tall Boy" seat on it and the 2 Inch risers installed? Just wondering.
This would be a great bike for US Forest service fire roads and back roads with rough asphalt. I don't think I'd take it where an Africa Twin or BMW GS could go
3 weeks ago, I went up on a pass that's been closed for 5 years, washed out, rock slides. some places were steep, I was even 2 up, on stock tires. Took my time, it did well. The only limitation was me, I admit, I need some practice off road.
Some joke that it's a toilet seat, but it's just a neck brace made by Alpinestars. Similar to what race car drivers use to prevent neck injuries. Hope we never "need" it : ) Thanks for watching.
With the popularity of the adventure bikes, it's wise of HD to jump into this. I'd like to see the Pan America with a shaft drive, but it looks like a capable, do everything bike.
@@RIDEAdventures their marketing team is incredibly conservative about their image and their image is tied to the V Twin and the cruiser aesthetic. They're in this hard place where they still have an aging demographic that wants that Peter Fonda Easy Rider thing to be the norm, and those folks have the funds for Harley's pricier offerings. Meanwhile that market is shrinking and with it, their established image. It's a tough balancing act to maintain that tradition while being open to change and revolution. They have literally 0 r&d into any other engine formats. This will mean a ton of investments, including new tooling and such, which is rough for a company that's been subsisting off of clothing sales and inflating their stock prices by buying up excess. It's risky to dump all those resources into unknown territory and it fail. But then again, I also never thought I'd see the day of a bar & shield ADV bike! So maybe I'll be wrong. I'd love to be wrong. As a die hard metric guy, I'm excited to see Harley's future. I'm hoping for a dedicated sports bike
@@RaijinTheThunder, we're cheering for them as well. Hopefully they are in-tune enough to change a bit, as noted, it seems necessary. Thanks for commenting.
Yea, we still haven't heard anyone comment negatively about altitude riding, so hopefully that means Harley nailed it with the mapping. Lest we be dieseling up there :) --- Thanks for watching and commenting.
The best review for a PanAm, it answered all my questions. Best part of it was, “Is the PanAm for you” damn you nailed it, many thanks to this great review.
This is not anymore off-road capable, than a super tenere, or a vstrom. But a hell of a lot more expensive. There is no common sense experienced rider will claim this bike to be as off road capable than a GS. But leave it to Harley to self proclaim it’s a competitor to the gs, and just put themselves ahead of the other adv bikes. Typical Harley bla bla bla.
A thought for you - high compression doesn’t automatically reduce engine life. Consider the average diesel runs 18:1 and they regularly run to half a million miles with proper servicing. Great video otherwise 👍👍
Right, not automatically, but a higher compression ratio "contributes to" degradation of the engine at a faster rate (stresses, temps, etc.) --- Thanks for watching and sharing.
@@RIDEAdventures well then you can say exactly the same thing about every modern sportbike. There isn’t one with what could normally be considered a “low” compression ratio. I’m just saying it’s an unfair poke at the RevMax engine when there are many other bikes out there with similar CR. Incidentally, the big-end & main bearings in the RevMax are huge, plus there are two piston cooling jets per cylinder and wrist pin is carbo-nitrided tool steel. Harley has done their homework on this unit.
Thanks, and we'll add it to the list : ) Slowing down on KTM purchases for a while though, until they have some reliability issues figured out. BMW not far behind with all the electrical issues.
I believe they need to work on this Dirt Glide first and fast, before adding another model..too many quirks like overheating, no quick shifter up and down, better windshield and refinement overall.
@@RIDEAdventures i just put money down on one lol, but the air box intake is right behind the radiator, tank has to come off, and there actually a small amount of water in there....thats all....enjoy the bike man, i can't wait to get mine!
The title should be "Harley Davidson PAN AMERICA Special (with options) REVIEW | Pros & Cons". I have yet to see a review for the stock, non-special, but the few people I know that bought the stock, non-Special, are trying to dump them, they want their money back, The Stock version has no upgrade path to a special, and all the selling features are on the Special, or, like laced wheels, are options.
Agree on middle weight bike. People on internet have pointed out odd part numbers in parts catalog that indicate this is a real possibility as the part number don't go to any current bike.
Thanks so much, Eric! Again, another awesome video filled with common sense. I'm a second season rider with about 30K km under my belt, a couple of mild-ish crashes and I've even hit a deer (in my case it sounds a lot worse than it actually was). The Pan America looks like an amazing first entry for Harley into the ADV category...but I don't think its the bike for me, personally. Can I put in a request? I know its not as simple as you just going out and riding one but I would love to see a review on a Triumph Scrambler 1200 XE with some Giant Loop or MoskoMoto bags from an ADV rider perspective. Again, thanks for the awesome content!
Hearing so many good things about that Scrambler, we'll add it to the list. With any luck, Triumph's will be sold here in our local market (Bend, Oregon) soon, and so that will be a natural addition to our operations. Thanks for sharing and watching!
My wife actually just picked up a scrambler 1200 and just traded in my street glide for a pan america. Unfortunately there is still snow on the ground here and it's a little chilly out still. I can't wait to get out on our new bikes
Lord, 😂 here's my 2 cents - suzuki RMZ 450 with a safari fuel tank. Task racing led headlight kits and rigid off road led. Now you got ground clearance. And you're still under 300 pounds. Nothing you can't climb and clear. Test road a friends 2022 GS 1250 in weat Texas. Highway was great. Going up hills the handlebars were to swept back. Didn't like that. Any mod sucked on rocks. I almost cracked a tooth from the front end bouncing like a basketball. Took a 2022 Pan-America into Alabama and ran it through some clay and rocks. Soaked up the roads with ease. Crossed a few creeks on both. I found the power band on the Pan-America Is compliant. Personally I think if you're going take a $25,000 bike off road like an idiot you need not bitch about scratching it. 😢! And also the manufacturers need to strip all these ride mods off for cross country enduro riding Fully adjustable ohlins shocks front and rear and set up your bike fully dressed out for sag. On all the adventure bikes I felt like a porpoise sea world. It's nice trying to throw your leg over a KTM and pretend your 6'5" tall. And easier to ride a Pan-America. At the end of the day you will ride what suits your habits and lifestyle. P.S. loud pipes save lives. I'm just saying riding n Houston traffic and now living in the retirement capital of the deaf world of Florida. Homer in the woods bird watching isn't going to like me. Nor do I care. Nice vid. What I'd like to see is a bunch of men on these expensive bikes, burying them up to the engine full of wet mud and getting nasty. Dragging them out. Camping and doing this for 30 days. Take all the manufacturers, including Triumph and Yamaha Honda and suzuki. Let's ee who comes out smelling like a rose. Not switching off rides. Blood sweat and tears ride. Then let's ee who lost plastics tires and parts. Just for kicks throw-in Triumph Scrambler. ND DONT PUT A 60-YEAR OLD ON A BIKE. 40 Year Olds max. I don't want to hear any crap about my bad back or arthritis kicking in and couldn't make it. That would be a great video. Start in the desert sand and then into the rocky mud and snow mud.
Mate brought that bike new.... Started rusting badly, front hub.... Disc areas. Battery not starting his bike through Winte even using regularly and on a Trickle Charger. Dealer had no answers. Gave him a jumper box. Front fender cut way too short, and debris, up onto headers.... Radiator. Build quality looks very cheap. Not worth the 35k NZ Dollars. Ugly as bike as well
I used to ride in my younger years and then stop because of raising a family. Then at age 68, in 2018, I bought a Harley Davidson Fat Bob. I ride that Fat Bob all over America. My riding buddies think I’m crazy. And now at age 71 they think I have lost my mind completely because I want to buy a Pan-American.
New starter clutch fixed the high compression on starts, all other issues have been fixed with software updates, aftermarket parts are plenty to make it perfect for selective riding positions, protection etc. including a quick shifter. Shorter riders must try the Special and the reach seat options.
I'm from Milwaukee too! Even worked in Grande Avenue Mall at the camera store (back when dinosaurs roamed freely). That 13:1 is a real issue. The PA that I demo'd has already blender'd its engine on someone else's demo ride. The dealer blamed the rider for revving up to 7k, but where's that rev limiter? They had to replace THE WHOLE ENGINE, it's not very modular. What if that happens when you are outside of your warranty? I'm guessing you might be looking at $5k or more. If the metric adv bikes aren't playing with compression ratios that high, how reliable can "The Motor Company" version be?
What's up my fellow Milwaukeean! Yea, it's going to be interesting to see when these PA's have some higher mileage, whether they're holding up or not. Fun bike in a lot of ways, so let's hope they hold up. Thanks for watching and commenting : )
@@ridingwithmarshall, yea, but they need to get away from that VTwin and basically just make a full-frame (not Stressed Member Chassis) version of the Tenere 700. In my opinion : )
@@RIDEAdventures I've said that for years, that Harley could show the world the power of American engineering again, if they would just let go of the same old heritage marketing. At least they finally discovered VVT, which I had on my 2008 Concours.
Absolutely agree! More than that I feel like this line could save the company. We all know Harley riders are getting older. And a lot of us started riding in the dirt. Shrink the pan am down in size and in price, and watch the stock price and the market grow. Smaller dirt bikes are perfect for the electric mkt. They are missing the target a bit with the live wire in my opinion.
Have you had any issues that you’ve noticed? It’s a great bike, but with any new model you’re going to have growing pains. From the starter issues to the radiator hose, to even the clock there are several things that need fixed. That said, I still love my PAS. I’m currently full time motorcycling so been putting a lot of miles on this new platform and still impressed with the way it rides and handles.
We didn’t actually buy the Pan America, as it just doesn’t fit so well with the rest of our Oregon-based rental fleet. But yea, hope they resolve a few issues.
Another cheer for the mid-sized ADV bike, Harley.........are you listening, watching, paying attention? Every mfg needs to get into the middle-weight adventure bike scene.
I think the kickstand on this bike was a complete fail, they should not have mounted it to the engine case...... Being 6' 6 I should easily be able to throw my leg over the bike but it's very difficult to do. So i mount it like a horse but the kickstand being on the engine case I'm worried I'll break it off over the years of riding it. In addition to that the hard bags are too high on the bike. They should go down at least an inch. Also the bike has nothing on the KTM 890 ADV R. This bike is probably one of Harley's best performance bikes they've ever made but as far as going off road I feel like this bike is kind of a fail, outside of fire roads it's not going to be able to do much.
Harley has the engineers to build anything. The pan America is their first bike to almost forget they make cruisers. I own a 2022 Bmw r1250gs and have finally found what may be the most competent and comfortable motorcycle for my needs. I didn’t get a chance to ride the Harley but my instincts tell me it’s equally impressive. What a great time to be riding these new creations.
I do not think Harley should spend time in the middle weight market. Their price point will always be higher and that market is already well served and doesn’t want to spend more. Keep improving the Pan Am. Love the suspension but concerned about the frame design. Also keep in mind that the Pan Am is the first generation of a water cooled engine for Harley. This is new territory for them
James, yea, we hope the Pan America works out well for folks. --- But actually, I tend to think the middle-weight market is still quite open and available to Harley, especially given that Suzuki, Honda, and Kawasaki have yet to respond to the Tenere 700 and KTM 790/890 Adventures. Yep, it'll be "Harley-priced" if they do it, but of course there are still plenty of us that will pay for it. Cause it's a Harley : ) ----- Thanks for watching and commenting. My Hometown Harley: Why haven't we discussed this yet?
Just wanted to add a comment. I am not in the market for ADV bikes I am too old and all that maybe if I had a 125 Honda and friends I could go with I would consider it. I would have liked to see you take it out in the mud and see how it handled. I know everybody is different but I saw another review about this bike and the guy had some real trouble with it. That guy was shorter and he was out in the dirt to see what it would do and like I said he had some real problems. I don't want to beat anybody up so I am only going to talk generally and I am sure folks can find those videos if they search on TH-cam. I think he really felt about the same as you did in most of his review but since you mentioned the kickstand he had the bike fall over because the dirt was soft and he got it stuck on the center stand later I think because the suspension lowered when he stopped on a hill. Anyhow great video be watching for more :)
Thanks, and more videos ahead. Wish we could have played in the mud, but mud just isn't an opion here in Central Oregon's High Desert in the summertime.
Little late to this video but that was the rear brake reservoir not the master cylinder. Also you run into detonation issues at lower elevations where there is more oxygen then at higher where there is less when using a lower octane or quality fuel.
Great review!! In the market for a Honda ATAS but also thinking a little bit on the PanAm, since I’m selling my 2019 Street Bob to finance my Adv bike. My cons are like yours. I feel that a lot of details like the rear brake cylinder feels misplaced, low quality feeling in the mirrors and plastics etc. and the small wheels. I have test rided it and it was a blast though, but only on road, haven’t tried it off road. But for a mix of on/off road maybe the Honda is a better choice?
This rider (Eric) would absolutely take an ATAS over the Pan America for dirt stuff. So, it depends on what "mix" you plan to do : ) Thanks for the note.
Going to be tough to fit that rear cylinder into a middleweight and keep the seat and bike sized properly to be considered a middle sized bike. Parallel Upright Twin or Bust! :)
The Revolution 750 from the discontinued street series. I actually like that motor, too bad it was put in the wrong bike. Had it been put in something that looked like the Sportster, it would've sold like hot cakes. Instead they out it into something that looked like it was designed by China.
I have a somewhat stupid question. Lean angle, how does a bike figure that out? When you are going round a bend and leaning over, the lean is balancing the centripetal force with gravity, in equal measure. So you are pulled directly down into the seat. So a G force sensor wouldn’t know you were leaning over. If you see what I mean. (There isn’t a force making you feel like you are flying off the seat towards the outside of the bend, like in a car. The “centrifugal” force. ) Sure you may get pulled down into your seat harder around a corner, but that’s also true if you ride into a rising road section. So it can’t be that. Are there optical sensors that read the distance of the road surface out from each side of the bike? (Like a drone crash avoidance sensor.) I maybe missing a obvious answer to this, let me know.
At my age, no hard hitting single tracks, so 50/50 street and dirt roads/fire breaks for me. My Pan America is perfect. Replaced my V-Rod.
Harley Davidson was listening to you about that middleweight bike right up until you said make it reliable. Then they left the chat.
Ha, ha. Come on, some rankings have Harleys as being more reliable than Austrian and German bikes at this point (but yes, still behind the Japanese brands in this regard.) If they would just call me, I'm sure we could come up with something reliable : )
i just tried the standard version yesterday, and i was happily surprised of the qualities of that bike ! Premium Maxi-Trail indeed with Premium materials, i loved it ! thank you for your profssional and detailed review !! cheers from the Random French guy from Bali ;-)
Thanks for saying so! Have fun if you buy the HD : )
Where are the GS pros and cons?
I am glad to see Harley using gas to make power now instead of just raw noise. Nice bike.
For the entire first half you might as well have been reading their sales brochure. Specs and more specs. No actual review. Sorry, but this was kind of weak.
So....we should do a review....without listing the specs of the bike. Hmm. The next person would complain that we didn't list the specs of the bike, so......
So some helpful reply is in order here.
Perhaps just link to the spec sheet and spend a brief moment talking about it?
Lol this is ridiculous HD. It's like calling a Porsche crossover SUV an off-road vehicle. Harley messed up the ONE segment of motorcycles that people can't get enough of. And they messed it up by an order of 3. Give us a truly off road worthy, lightweight 400 with none of those stupid gadgets. Stick to your styling and you'll kill it HD.
This bike is an oversized chunker. A rip off of the Buell XB12X without the good handling the Buell has.
you have ZERO clue what you're talking about
@Mike Fu thank you for that definitive answer. So glad you provided results, evidence, and a clear understanding how how bikes are designed. Keep on trucking squid
I love my Pan America. It is such a fun bike to ride. I rode it to Alaska (Deadhorse) and back from Southern California (9000 Miles) and it performed flawlessly. I just got back from a ride down the Baja Peninsula last week (1000 miles) and I had a couple problems. The chain stretched to where I couldn't adjust it anymore, and about 60 miles south of the Border, my stator failed, which caused the battery to drain. However, these problems could happen to any brand. Probably my main upgrade to the Pan America would be to switch to a shaft drive. I know the chain is better for off road, but the Pan America is never going to be a hard core off roader. It's more dirt roads and forest roads. Anyway, thought I would share my experience and 2 cents.
Glad to hear you're enjoying your PA. You're putting in some good miles. I have a KTM 1290 SA now and was thinking about replacing it within the next year. I've done a few test rides on the PA and must say that HD has done a nice job. Out of the gate, they seemed to have done a lot of homework to make a competitive bike. This is totally outside the box for them. They stepped on the competitors home field. They didn't hit a home run, but I think they slid into 3rd base. Way to swing HD. I've never been a big HD fan for the most part. Having a touring BMW and a KTM ADV bike, I Am pulling for HD in this segment. Hopefully they will stick with it and continue to improve the platform. Safe travels and many miles / adventures in the future.
You mentioned the ride to Deadhorse, what did you think of that experience? Been to the mid-west and west coast out of Pennsylvania. Heading to AZ and UT, again summer of 24. I have Alaska on my must do ride bucket list. That's going to be approximately 13000 mile trip from Pa. I even have a also retired ex-coworker that now lives in Delta Junction. That's southeast of Fairbanks. He's looking for me to stop in when I get to AK. Lots of planning, but it would be a epic ride.
@@curtissmith8789 Thanks Curtis. I recently sold the Pan American. It just so happens I was at a BMW motorcycle dealer , looking at their bikes. When I was ready to leave, my PA wouldn't start. The BMW dealership was so nice. They had their mechanic look at it (he used to be a Harley mechanic) and he couldn't get it started. They offered to take it as a trade-in, and I accepted. I now ride a 2023 GS 1250 Adventure. I plan to do a video soon a post it on my site.
@@curtissmith8789 It's probably the greatest riding experience I have ever had. I am doing it again in 2025. I will be riding with a friend this time.
What are you thinking about your 1250 GSA. My riding partner has one, he loves it. I think it's a very nice bike. I really like it too. If you're looking at a ADV bike, it's hard to dismiss a BMW. I will say everyone that rode a PA liked it.
Nice bike, but I will stick with my 1290 KTM SAS
Thank you! I learned a lot from this video. Your riding and scenic shots are also first class.
Thanks! Nice job on your videos. We're trying to catch up with you : )
And the tiny hands B-roll. Brilliant 🤣
Never been a fan of HD, but this one is certainly turning my head. Good job for HD to start expanding their horizons into the ADV industry. Also, your tiny hands B-roll is hilarious.
Ha, thanks for saying so. Garrett was so excited about the tiny hands.
Probably one of the best unbiased reviews. I test rode one and it will be my next bike. I currently own a HD Street Glide touring model and will not get rid of it. Different bikes for different riding adventures. Main reason I would steer towards an HD PA is dealership network availability. For those who don't live near a huge city metro area, it makes a difference. I didn't get into the riding motorcycles to be a full time mechanic, I got into it to ride. I don't care if its an motorcycle, atv, boat, jet ski, whatever toy it is. Stuff does break.
Thanks for saying so, and good point about the incredibly strong Harley dealer network. RIDE on!
I am seriously thinking and contemplating trading in my 2016 Street glide for a Pan America special
It'll open a bunch of new paths for you......so have fun : )
I find your information about the Pan American to be accurate mostly from one who actually own one with 6 other motorcycles
If you change out the stock HD tires to the more aggressive ones they have for the PA , you will find it to be a very capable bike . The only really bad thing I have found about the PA isn't with the bike .How HD put the bike out there with out really educating the dealers and their mechanics about them 1st . Also the backlog for getting accessories from them is ridiculous
I find it kind of sad of all the haters out there , most of them who actually never ridden the PA or even a Harley .
It's not about brand of bike you ride , it's about the ride . What ever bike works for you is good . I never rode or owned a motorcycle I didn't like and wish I would have kept them all . They all have different personalities
My black HD aluminum panniers are still on back order for my 2022 PA. Picking the bike up on the 11th of April come hell or high water. Will use a 20L dry pack on the tail if necessary until the HD accessories arrive. Very frustrating
I’m a little late to this party but agree with the dealer debut. That seems to be on par with how they (dealers) handled the Buell years. I’ve owned many bikes and finally an HD (FLSL) but my riding is very dirt (road) oriented. Pan am would fit the bill but I’ve had a GS that excelled in that. I’m fortunate to have a few bikes that can do their intended “jobs”. Good on Harley for this bike, but now get the bricks and mortar to back them up. Accessories, if the MoCo can’t supply there are others that will.. cheers
Let'em hate. you'll smoke on the street with the Pan Am.
I rode my Yamaha FZ1 to the Pan America Demo. I expected the PA to feel slow... But in sport mode it was almost as much of a rocket as my FZ1. Incredible that a bike can handle the road at 136 Mph (Fastest my riding partner took it) and then ride dirt.
welcome to KTM since 2005
Please excuse my comment if history isn't your strong suit. Harley Davidson made it's name early in dirt track and flat track racing. Early HDs were made for all terrain as the road systems in America were developing. Harley and it's war bikes were made for all terrain and served our country long before the foreign manufacturers came to be. Triumph and BMW being an exception! Thank the "baby boomers" for HD getting stuck in the touring big bike market for so long.
My 1965 Pan Head Electro Glide saw as much gravel with me leaving the family farm as most "off road" bikes due to circumstances. Electronic/computer driving aids weren't needed when riders maintained their own bikes. I believe we were better riders back then. Dependence on ABS and traction control sensors are the chief reason for riders incompetence. Poorly trained and limited experience riders speeding and taking risks while relying on the computer is in my opinion, the main reason for fatal accidents today.
I grew up kick starting and controlling timing of my bikes. Modern riders can't even manually adjust timing on the fly or utilize a foot clutch or hand shifter, where is coordination?
You all are in my prayers
Hoka Hey
This is my 4th Harley and is my favorite bike
Excellent review as usual, Eric. I think the PA is a cool bike for sure - bravo to Harley on their first generation ADV. bike.
Thanks, and let's coax them into making the middleweight!
SO HD have a look at the Harley-Davidson XA 740 from WW2: Shaft drive maybe taller suspension with an Ealres fork idea up font and modern brakes .. If you keep the look of the old bike you will sell a ton of them . It is a bike HD made for the North African War . Great back story of sales :)
Overall great video. Only problem I had was with the comparison of the compression ratios to a completely different class of ADV bikes. The PanAm's 13:1 ratio is comparable to the BMW 1250 GS's 12.5:1 and the KTM 1290 Super Adventure's 13.1:1. I agree with the concerns over accessibility to higher octane fuels in remote locations though, and what that looks like over the lifetime of a yet to be tested engine.
I completely agree, HD should make a middle weight.
Keep refining the Pan America as well. HD challenged the GS, but fell short. HD did an outstanding job though.
Ride ADV, you guys always doing an outstanding job.
Comfortably, thanks! Hard to imagine how they could be cost-competitive with for example, the T7, but regardless, there are enough Harley enthusiasts out there that they could really grab some of that middleweight market. Hope so.
Side stand also is bolted directly to the engine case..by 3 bolts..could be a problem if stressed to much...i was surprised to hear that as I own a 23 special.. I love it so far..
Cars and motorcycles have recommended octane numbers. Manufacturers realize some countries do not offer 91 octane for maximum performance. Antiknock/dieseling are software covered with less performance noted with non optimal fuel numbers. Works the other way also. If you fueled 91 octane in a vehicle that requires only 87 no increase in performance as just wasting money. Multistrada V4, Super Adventure, Ducati Desert X all running higher compression for improved performance as engine designed from factory vs someone changing the compression from non factory specs by changing to different pistons to increase compression. VVT and forced induction could be seen more frequently in bikes similar to cars. Direct injection may not appear like cars because of the faster rpm’s bikes require.
I totally agree that they need a middle weight bike. I bought a Tiger 900 just for that reason. The 1200 and the GS were both WAY too tall and heavy.
Pan America has definitely got me interested, but the current one is too heavy for me.
Who is your insurance company for renting motorcycles? Thanks
ARH needs to have the electronics to be able to turn it off in all modes totally. Try it with a tall seat and the side stand is almost impossible to use safely without pitching it too far to the right. At the moment, the only way of getting rid of the ARH is to create a custom mode but then one will have to return to that custom mode if one has been in a standard mode say enduro or rain before stopping. I have heard that maybe dealers can turn it off and if someone can tell me how to do that permanently, I would be grateful. Thank you.
So the cons are things that may go wrong but now almost two years in haven’t. And the ground clearance sure is your gonna use this bike 90% off road which why would anyone buy this for that ? Just saying.
I’d like to see this bike lose 40 pounds, get more ground clearance and a 21/18 wheel combo, and at least be as loud as a KTM/Triumph. The one that goes by my job every day is so quiet you’d think it was a GS or V Strom
Take the kickstand mount off the engine case!!! That's asking for trouble on adventure bikes!!
Please.. take another feel of that rear brake.. it's dead as a doorknob and somewhat abrupt... no ability to feel what's it's doing or finesse it!!
thanks for the insight, i just brought one and looking forward to picking it up, sounds like its going to be great up here in the nothern teritory of Austrailai
A middleweight ADV with that self-lowering base? Might give it a second thought, as I am just too short for a T7...Harley should gain a bit of speed though, as the Honda Transalp seems to be joining the game, too...
The PANAMERICA 1250 special has arrived in the top class of adventure motorcycles.
Since 26.06.2020 I own a PAN Special beside my BMW GS 1250 HPA.
With my friends from K+M Harleyworld we got startet with the project 1-100.000 km. Our
vision is to check the usability, the reliability and the sustainability of the new HD Motorcycle.
Challenge 1 and 2 related to the usability and reliability was already completed end of October. We mounted a lot of useful stuff to make the Pan really usable for off-road adventures. Therefore a lot of innovations are mounted on my PAN „Elvis“ to make it fit for purpose. Then we crossed all high alp passes on gravel and asphalt in July. In August we went to the island of corse to cross also all high passes under high temperature conditions (40 degrees or hotter outside temp) At least my PAN has felt sand under its tyres for the first time. In September / October we got started with challenge 2. We moved to Morocco to the high Atlas region. We crossed all high Atlas passes including the Col de Ouano on gravel, we circled the big duna of Erg Chebbi on old rally Dakar tracks and we checked out heavy city traffic under high temperature conditions. Result: The PAN collected during 4 month almost 30577 km on its meter. Almost 15% of this driven kilometers where been carried out on unsaved roads, mud, gravel or sand. So unter the line the PAN made it on all playgrounds where the competitor brands usually run their shows. This without breakdown or other serious problems…..
On 31st October, I have shipped my PAN to Chile. On 3rd of January 2022 I will start my adventure „all the way up“ riding the Panamericana highway from Argentina to Alaska. This last and long lasting test is mainly relayed to the point sustainability. Chapeau Harley at this point…
If you are interested, check out Biker.Jo on TH-cam or Instagram …KR Jo
I bought the base model Pan Am as I didn't really need many of the features of the Special as I ride it mostly on ride for touring. At 6'2" I also don't need the ARH to touch the ground when stopped but if I were to do it over again I would buy the Special with the ARH and then put on the accessory high seat that HD sells. The reason being is that I find the leg room right at the limit of what I find comfortable, if I were to put the high seat on I would no longer be able to comfortably reach the ground. I also find the stock seat to be a little too soft for long trips but that is likely due to my size - 245lbs - and a Corbin seat is in my very near future.
I puzzle to understand why the rectifier/regulator is where it is but haven't had any issues with it yet so what do I know?
Overall I'm very happy with my Pan Am after trying a few different bikes to replace my beloved 2009 Buell Ulysses. Ride safe out there.
Thanks for sharing, and yea, maybe that Adaptive Ride Height could have been useful. Wonder what they are charging to add it? Congrats on your fun machine, and yea, Corbin makes great seats.
@@RIDEAdventures In Canada the base model is $20,999, the Special is $24,199. Of course the ARH is only offered as an option on the Special due to the Semi-Active Suspension (the base model has regular suspension and is very good), the ARH is $1200. After taxes it comes out to $5060 plus another $800 for the spoked wheels should you want them. A pretty big hit but given all the extras that come with the Special it is actually probably a pretty good value.
Pros “exhaust note” aka nothing like a harley 🤣 😂 😂
Give me a BMW Adventure Bike with an as great Design as the Panamerica has.
You could be Vince Vaughn's brother.
Haha yeah we get that alot.
Bret did a review and showed that the side stand was attached to the engine, would make me pretty nervous to pivot the bike out of a tight spot using the stand.
Yea, we somehow missed mentioning that. Probably not the rugged type of adventure bike one would get into such situations anyway, but a good reminder why not to.
100% agree! I live in the metro Milwaukee area and have friends that worked for Harley. Definitely want to see a great American motorcycle company succeed! Hey Harley, listen to this man, produce a mid-size adventure bike, and make it affordable for the working man!
Kevin, let'em hear it! Thanks for the note. Probably a long-shot that they'd end up anywhere near the pricing of the Yamaha's and Hondas, but Harley is also the type of company that doesn't need to worry so much about being price-competitive. Hope they do it, and consult with me on the design of the middle-weight ADV bike. -- Eric
Nice review but Harley to take over this market... Lolz
100% agree with review and that HD needs a midsize. I ride a rare Honda CL400.. only made for 2 years.. scrambler style.
Harley could even use their 750cc engine. Tune it for low end.. that bike is already small. Make a new frame..
Honda is bringing back Transalp. And possibly a CL500 and maybe even Africa Twin back to a 650-750.. Harley will be left behind
Somehow Harley has not yet called their hometown homeboy (me) to consult on the development of that midsize bike. Their target is simple: Yamaha's T7. Just a few small, easy, and obvious changes to that bike, and they'll OWN the market. (Although I'm not sure how they'd compete on that price or reliability.) --- Thanks for watching.
The cooler is very low also and will get hammered with stones off-road.
Pros - Good first effort. Cons - it’s a HD😂
Thank you for the review. I enjoyed several points you brought up, including the point about the compression ratio and less than premium gasoline. I have ridden one myself, though only on road and just loved the bike. I am 5'11" and if felt like it was build for me. Fantastic engine, felt lighter and more nimble than I expected, and handled great on the pavement. They wouldn't let me take it off road, of course. I look forward to a middle weight as well and hope Harley does a great job with it.
Richard, it'll be interesting to see how you like the bike off-pavement, and who knows, maybe after your Training Expedition next month, perhaps you'll make a point to find out : ) Thanks for watching.
It's so ugly only father could like it. Harley-Davidson should donate this bike to Ukrainian army. It would look good with side car and machine gun on it. It's only way to advertise this ugly thing. One more advise. Mad Max 3, make it as main character.
Hah, even a momma couldn't like it. So Dad has to : )
You are about my size.....and watching you ride.....your knees look like they are WAY out in front of you. It doesn't look comfortable.
Did this bike have their "Tall Boy" seat on it and the 2 Inch risers installed? Just wondering.
It was all stock/original as it came from Harley, and yea, I could use a little more room, feels a little tight/squat in there. But not too bad.
This would be a great bike for US Forest service fire roads and back roads with rough asphalt. I don't think I'd take it where an Africa Twin or BMW GS could go
3 weeks ago, I went up on a pass that's been closed for 5 years, washed out, rock slides. some places were steep, I was even 2 up, on stock tires. Took my time, it did well. The only limitation was me, I admit, I need some practice off road.
What is that funny looking thing around your neck, that looks like where your "space" helmet connects?
Some joke that it's a toilet seat, but it's just a neck brace made by Alpinestars. Similar to what race car drivers use to prevent neck injuries. Hope we never "need" it : ) Thanks for watching.
Harley will never move away from the v-twin unfortunately. They have said it a number of times.
A lovable stubbornness, but precarious one.
With the popularity of the adventure bikes, it's wise of HD to jump into this. I'd like to see the Pan America with a shaft drive, but it looks like a capable, do everything bike.
Harley will never make a Parallel Twin. They'll make a V4 before they make a P-Twin, imo.
That being said, I loved the Pan Am when I demo'ed it.
Curious, why wouldn't they? (Aside from the general hesitation to do anything other than a VTwin.)
@@RIDEAdventures their marketing team is incredibly conservative about their image and their image is tied to the V Twin and the cruiser aesthetic.
They're in this hard place where they still have an aging demographic that wants that Peter Fonda Easy Rider thing to be the norm, and those folks have the funds for Harley's pricier offerings. Meanwhile that market is shrinking and with it, their established image. It's a tough balancing act to maintain that tradition while being open to change and revolution.
They have literally 0 r&d into any other engine formats. This will mean a ton of investments, including new tooling and such, which is rough for a company that's been subsisting off of clothing sales and inflating their stock prices by buying up excess. It's risky to dump all those resources into unknown territory and it fail.
But then again, I also never thought I'd see the day of a bar & shield ADV bike! So maybe I'll be wrong. I'd love to be wrong.
As a die hard metric guy, I'm excited to see Harley's future. I'm hoping for a dedicated sports bike
@@RaijinTheThunder, we're cheering for them as well. Hopefully they are in-tune enough to change a bit, as noted, it seems necessary. Thanks for commenting.
It’s almost like Buell never died.
14:00 maybe a fast paced Pikes peak test on 87 octane gas is in order?
Yea, we still haven't heard anyone comment negatively about altitude riding, so hopefully that means Harley nailed it with the mapping. Lest we be dieseling up there :) --- Thanks for watching and commenting.
Sounds like an awesome machine. But…..why did they make it so damn ugly?
Hah. It does take some getting used to.
That bike is a reason why you will never smell on my screen again!!!
lol, I feel there is a story behind this.
The best review for a PanAm, it answered all my questions. Best part of it was, “Is the PanAm for you” damn you nailed it, many thanks to this great review.
Thanks Louie for the kind feedback. We try our hardest to deliver.
Great review Eric! Now I know the bike is much better than we GS fanboys like it to be. Hope HD listens to you, you've got very valid points there.
Thanks for saying so, and yea, let's cheer-on 'ol Harley to do this.
This is not anymore off-road capable, than a super tenere, or a vstrom. But a hell of a lot more expensive. There is no common sense experienced rider will claim this bike to be as off road capable than a GS. But leave it to Harley to self proclaim it’s a competitor to the gs, and just put themselves ahead of the other adv bikes. Typical Harley bla bla bla.
A thought for you - high compression doesn’t automatically reduce engine life. Consider the average diesel runs 18:1 and they regularly run to half a million miles with proper servicing. Great video otherwise 👍👍
Right, not automatically, but a higher compression ratio "contributes to" degradation of the engine at a faster rate (stresses, temps, etc.) --- Thanks for watching and sharing.
@@RIDEAdventures well then you can say exactly the same thing about every modern sportbike. There isn’t one with what could normally be considered a “low” compression ratio. I’m just saying it’s an unfair poke at the RevMax engine when there are many other bikes out there with similar CR. Incidentally, the big-end & main bearings in the RevMax are huge, plus there are two piston cooling jets per cylinder and wrist pin is carbo-nitrided tool steel. Harley has done their homework on this unit.
Start to finish an honest and great review.
Mortal kombat guy
I would like your opinion on comparing the pan America with Ktm, BMW, and Honda, great video thanks greetings from Colombia 🇨🇴
Thanks, and we'll add it to the list : ) Slowing down on KTM purchases for a while though, until they have some reliability issues figured out. BMW not far behind with all the electrical issues.
thanks for your answer, I am thinking about taking the risk of buying a Pan America, what do you suggest to me? Greetings
I believe they need to work on this Dirt Glide first and fast, before adding another model..too many quirks like overheating, no quick shifter up and down, better windshield and refinement overall.
just found this video......what do you think of the airbox setup? that worries me more than the regulator...
Didn't notice, what in particular about it? We only had the bike a couple of days.
@@RIDEAdventures i just put money down on one lol, but the air box intake is right behind the radiator, tank has to come off, and there actually a small amount of water in there....thats all....enjoy the bike man, i can't wait to get mine!
The middle weight idea is right. I think a 700 or 750 Revolution Max would work out ok. But let’s see what happens.
The title should be "Harley Davidson PAN AMERICA Special (with options) REVIEW | Pros & Cons".
I have yet to see a review for the stock, non-special, but the few people I know that bought the stock, non-Special, are trying to dump them, they want their money back, The Stock version has no upgrade path to a special, and all the selling features are on the Special, or, like laced wheels, are options.
Agree on middle weight bike. People on internet have pointed out odd part numbers in parts catalog that indicate this is a real possibility as the part number don't go to any current bike.
toasty lol
Thanks so much, Eric! Again, another awesome video filled with common sense.
I'm a second season rider with about 30K km under my belt, a couple of mild-ish crashes and I've even hit a deer (in my case it sounds a lot worse than it actually was).
The Pan America looks like an amazing first entry for Harley into the ADV category...but I don't think its the bike for me, personally.
Can I put in a request?
I know its not as simple as you just going out and riding one but I would love to see a review on a Triumph Scrambler 1200 XE with some Giant Loop or MoskoMoto bags from an ADV rider perspective.
Again, thanks for the awesome content!
Hearing so many good things about that Scrambler, we'll add it to the list. With any luck, Triumph's will be sold here in our local market (Bend, Oregon) soon, and so that will be a natural addition to our operations. Thanks for sharing and watching!
My wife actually just picked up a scrambler 1200 and just traded in my street glide for a pan america. Unfortunately there is still snow on the ground here and it's a little chilly out still. I can't wait to get out on our new bikes
Lord,
😂 here's my 2 cents - suzuki RMZ 450 with a safari fuel tank. Task racing led headlight kits and rigid off road led. Now you got ground clearance. And you're still under 300 pounds. Nothing you can't climb and clear.
Test road a friends 2022 GS 1250 in weat Texas. Highway was great. Going up hills the handlebars were to swept back. Didn't like that. Any mod sucked on rocks. I almost cracked a tooth from the front end bouncing like a basketball. Took a 2022 Pan-America into Alabama and ran it through some clay and rocks. Soaked up the roads with ease. Crossed a few creeks on both. I found the power band on the Pan-America Is compliant.
Personally I think if you're going take a $25,000 bike off road like an idiot you need not bitch about scratching it. 😢! And also the manufacturers need to strip all these ride mods off for cross country enduro riding
Fully adjustable ohlins shocks front and rear and set up your bike fully dressed out for sag. On all the adventure bikes I felt like a porpoise sea world.
It's nice trying to throw your leg over a KTM and pretend your 6'5" tall. And easier to ride a Pan-America. At the end of the day you will ride what suits your habits and lifestyle.
P.S. loud pipes save lives. I'm just saying riding n Houston traffic and now living in the retirement capital of the deaf world of Florida. Homer in the woods bird watching isn't going to like me. Nor do I care.
Nice vid.
What I'd like to see is a bunch of men on these expensive bikes, burying them up to the engine full of wet mud and getting nasty. Dragging them out. Camping and doing this for 30 days. Take all the manufacturers, including Triumph and Yamaha Honda and suzuki. Let's ee who comes out smelling like a rose. Not switching off rides. Blood sweat and tears ride. Then let's ee who lost plastics tires and parts. Just for kicks throw-in Triumph Scrambler. ND DONT PUT A 60-YEAR OLD ON A BIKE. 40 Year Olds max. I don't want to hear any crap about my bad back or arthritis kicking in and couldn't make it.
That would be a great video. Start in the desert sand and then into the rocky mud and snow mud.
Better get the extended warenty or keep the checkbook out , thats a whole lota crap that the average Joe wont be abe to work on or fix .
Mate brought that bike new.... Started rusting badly, front hub.... Disc areas. Battery not starting his bike through Winte even using regularly and on a Trickle Charger. Dealer had no answers. Gave him a jumper box.
Front fender cut way too short, and debris, up onto headers.... Radiator.
Build quality looks very cheap.
Not worth the 35k NZ Dollars. Ugly as bike as well
the 'hand' easter-egg is priceless! 🤣🤣
I used to ride in my younger years and then stop because of raising a family. Then at age 68, in 2018, I bought a Harley Davidson Fat Bob. I ride that Fat Bob all over America. My riding buddies think I’m crazy. And now at age 71 they think I have lost my mind completely because I want to buy a Pan-American.
How is the engine heat in heavy traffic.
We didn't spend time in traffic out here in Central Oregon, but I think some other riders have reported this bike as getting a little hot down there.
Growing pains. This bike will be fine after a couple of years.
New starter clutch fixed the high compression on starts, all other issues have been fixed with software updates, aftermarket parts are plenty to make it perfect for selective riding positions, protection etc. including a quick shifter.
Shorter riders must try the Special and the reach seat options.
I'm from Milwaukee too! Even worked in Grande Avenue Mall at the camera store (back when dinosaurs roamed freely). That 13:1 is a real issue. The PA that I demo'd has already blender'd its engine on someone else's demo ride. The dealer blamed the rider for revving up to 7k, but where's that rev limiter? They had to replace THE WHOLE ENGINE, it's not very modular. What if that happens when you are outside of your warranty? I'm guessing you might be looking at $5k or more. If the metric adv bikes aren't playing with compression ratios that high, how reliable can "The Motor Company" version be?
What's up my fellow Milwaukeean! Yea, it's going to be interesting to see when these PA's have some higher mileage, whether they're holding up or not. Fun bike in a lot of ways, so let's hope they hold up. Thanks for watching and commenting : )
@@RIDEAdventures I also agree about needing a middleweight, like, how about a Sportster SCRAMBLER??
@@ridingwithmarshall, yea, but they need to get away from that VTwin and basically just make a full-frame (not Stressed Member Chassis) version of the Tenere 700. In my opinion : )
@@RIDEAdventures I've said that for years, that Harley could show the world the power of American engineering again, if they would just let go of the same old heritage marketing. At least they finally discovered VVT, which I had on my 2008 Concours.
All fixed with new started clutch
Absolutely agree! More than that I feel like this line could save the company. We all know Harley riders are getting older. And a lot of us started riding in the dirt. Shrink the pan am down in size and in price, and watch the stock price and the market grow. Smaller dirt bikes are perfect for the electric mkt. They are missing the target a bit with the live wire in my opinion.
Have you had any issues that you’ve noticed? It’s a great bike, but with any new model you’re going to have growing pains. From the starter issues to the radiator hose, to even the clock there are several things that need fixed.
That said, I still love my PAS. I’m currently full time motorcycling so been putting a lot of miles on this new platform and still impressed with the way it rides and handles.
We didn’t actually buy the Pan America, as it just doesn’t fit so well with the rest of our Oregon-based rental fleet. But yea, hope they resolve a few issues.
The clock!! I’m so short that there is a cable that hides the clock completely.
Piece of garbage! Just read around. A riding partner had one for 6 months and traded it in because of all sorts of finnigely crap. Pile of junk.
The wobbly windshield is not anything near "luxury"... the damn thing looks like it's gonna rattle off the bike!
@ crooked river S of Prineville?
You know your Oregon well, Sr. Hunter : )
I absolutely agree that H-D will have to also produce a middle weight bike. I don't think I'd ever get it as the Pan Am suites my needs perfectly.
Another cheer for the mid-sized ADV bike, Harley.........are you listening, watching, paying attention? Every mfg needs to get into the middle-weight adventure bike scene.
@@RIDEAdventures No need for it
I was really set on either the PA or the 850 GS. Realized both run 91. Not gonna happen.
Great Video! Listen H-D !
Hope they do. Thanks for watching : )
I think the kickstand on this bike was a complete fail, they should not have mounted it to the engine case...... Being 6' 6 I should easily be able to throw my leg over the bike but it's very difficult to do. So i mount it like a horse but the kickstand being on the engine case I'm worried I'll break it off over the years of riding it. In addition to that the hard bags are too high on the bike. They should go down at least an inch.
Also the bike has nothing on the KTM 890 ADV R. This bike is probably one of Harley's best performance bikes they've ever made but as far as going off road I feel like this bike is kind of a fail, outside of fire roads it's not going to be able to do much.
Funny you think that it would be just a fire road bike , there are a lot of videos showing them doing a hell of a lot more
Good review, but I thought your cons were pretty Lame . It sounds like a very solid adventure bike!
Harley has the engineers to build anything. The pan America is their first bike to almost forget they make cruisers. I own a 2022 Bmw r1250gs and have finally found what may be the most competent and comfortable motorcycle for my needs. I didn’t get a chance to ride the Harley but my instincts tell me it’s equally impressive. What a great time to be riding these new creations.
Lots of great options out there for sure, but that Beemer you're riding sure is highlight. Enjoy, thanks for watching, and RIDE on!
Great review Eric, well done!! And I totally agree with you regarding auto-blippers, they're really not needed!! 👍👍
Thank you! Let's perfect our movements and rhythms instead of depending on computers : )
Great job. Subscribed
Awesome, thank you!
I do not think Harley should spend time in the middle weight market. Their price point will always be higher and that market is already well served and doesn’t want to spend more. Keep improving the Pan Am. Love the suspension but concerned about the frame design. Also keep in mind that the Pan Am is the first generation of a water cooled engine for Harley. This is new territory for them
James, yea, we hope the Pan America works out well for folks. --- But actually, I tend to think the middle-weight market is still quite open and available to Harley, especially given that Suzuki, Honda, and Kawasaki have yet to respond to the Tenere 700 and KTM 790/890 Adventures. Yep, it'll be "Harley-priced" if they do it, but of course there are still plenty of us that will pay for it. Cause it's a Harley : ) ----- Thanks for watching and commenting. My Hometown Harley: Why haven't we discussed this yet?
Just try to use this monster off road and you realise the big cons. No matter that were a HD, simply it's ugly.
The tiny hand had me in stitches
Garrett's contribution, among many others : )
Just wanted to add a comment. I am not in the market for ADV bikes I am too old and all that maybe if I had a 125 Honda and friends I could go with I would consider it. I would have liked to see you take it out in the mud and see how it handled. I know everybody is different but I saw another review about this bike and the guy had some real trouble with it. That guy was shorter and he was out in the dirt to see what it would do and like I said he had some real problems. I don't want to beat anybody up so I am only going to talk generally and I am sure folks can find those videos if they search on TH-cam. I think he really felt about the same as you did in most of his review but since you mentioned the kickstand he had the bike fall over because the dirt was soft and he got it stuck on the center stand later I think because the suspension lowered when he stopped on a hill. Anyhow great video be watching for more :)
Thanks, and more videos ahead. Wish we could have played in the mud, but mud just isn't an opion here in Central Oregon's High Desert in the summertime.
Little late to this video but that was the rear brake reservoir not the master cylinder. Also you run into detonation issues at lower elevations where there is more oxygen then at higher where there is less when using a lower octane or quality fuel.
Great review!! In the market for a Honda ATAS but also thinking a little bit on the PanAm, since I’m selling my 2019 Street Bob to finance my Adv bike. My cons are like yours. I feel that a lot of details like the rear brake cylinder feels misplaced, low quality feeling in the mirrors and plastics etc. and the small wheels.
I have test rided it and it was a blast though, but only on road, haven’t tried it off road.
But for a mix of on/off road maybe the Honda is a better choice?
This rider (Eric) would absolutely take an ATAS over the Pan America for dirt stuff. So, it depends on what "mix" you plan to do : ) Thanks for the note.
Most likely they'll use a 975cc motor from the Bronx in order to compete in the middleweight ADV class!
Going to be tough to fit that rear cylinder into a middleweight and keep the seat and bike sized properly to be considered a middle sized bike. Parallel Upright Twin or Bust! :)
The Revolution 750 from the discontinued street series. I actually like that motor, too bad it was put in the wrong bike. Had it been put in something that looked like the Sportster, it would've sold like hot cakes. Instead they out it into something that looked like it was designed by China.
I have a somewhat stupid question.
Lean angle, how does a bike figure that out?
When you are going round a bend and leaning over, the lean is balancing the centripetal force with gravity, in equal measure.
So you are pulled directly down into the seat.
So a G force sensor wouldn’t know you were leaning over. If you see what I mean.
(There isn’t a force making you feel like you are flying off the seat towards the outside of the bend, like in a car. The “centrifugal” force. )
Sure you may get pulled down into your seat harder around a corner, but that’s also true if you ride into a rising road section.
So it can’t be that.
Are there optical sensors that read the distance of the road surface out from each side of the bike?
(Like a drone crash avoidance sensor.)
I maybe missing a obvious answer to this, let me know.