How Rotation Immediately Changes Your Playing (featuring Bernstein, Durso, Roskell and Golandsky)
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 27 เม.ย. 2024
- tonebase gives you instant access to knowledge from the world's greatest classical musicians, performers, and educators. Learn more by visiting tonebase.co/piano?...
Rotation is one of the main principles of piano playing -- but what actually is it, and how can we practice it? Robert Fleitz investigates in this tutorial which includes many exercises you can try at home, with the help of Tonebase Artists Robert Durso, Penelope Roskell, Edna Golandsky, and Seymour Bernstein.
00:00 The Witchcraft of Rotation
01:49 History of Rotation
02:50 Anatomy and Tension Release
03:46 Exercise 1 - The Key Exercise
04:04 Exercise 2 - The Elbow
04:37 Why Rotation is Important
05:34 Exercise 3 - At the Piano
06:43 Rotation and Legato
07:28 The Musicality of Rotation
Tonebase Lessons:
Seymour Bernstein "Choreographing Scales"
Robert Durso "Principles of the Taubman Approach"
Robert Durso and Ben Laude "Taubman Masterclasses"
Edna Golandsky "The Taubman Approach to Musicality"
Penelope Roskell "The Pillars of Piano Technique"
Other Sources
Ivy Lu Wang "Applying the Rotation Principle to Avoid Injury in Piano Performance"
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tonebase gives you instant access to knowledge from the world's greatest classical musicians, performers, and educators. Learn more by visiting tonebase.co/piano?...
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Been studying with a Taubman teacher for three years now and the difference in my playing is incredible. These concepts are SO worth learning
They sort of destroy my brain, I fail to understand most of it.. I must be a peanut brain
Edna Golandsky and Bob Durso are such incredible musicians and teachers. Edna helped me recover from a debilitating injury and taught me the motions that allow me to play with tremendous ease and facility.
Seymour is the most gentle troll ever
❤ 😂 ❤
He is gold
But he’s a lovable troll, if you want to call him that. It’s this crazy thing we do - piano. You may hate someone’s playing, but you have to respect them if they’re accomplishing what they set out to do. With Seymour, the classic example is Glenn Gould. How can you say Gould is “bad?” He’s obviously a genius level performer. He’s put in the work. The time. The effort. The analysis, the… yadda yadda yadda. But he hears music wayyy differently than a lot of us do. I respect what he does, but even if I were practiced at his sound, I’d never play that way. Bernstein knows Gould is of a special kind of greatness, but one that’s irritating to listen to, because his conception of the music is practically opposite of what many of us hear. Thus… Seymour is a gentle troll.
😂😂😂
I absolutely adore him
Thank you very much for the beautiful lesson.
Looks like a great video series. Looking forward to the next ones
Thank you presenting this fundamental concept in such a simple and understandable way and also for showing how to incorporate it repertoire snippets. I highly recommend anyone who plays the piano to explore its application in more depth.
Great video! I hope to see more on this topic, particularly from Golandsky and Durso.
Great video! I’m a professional pianist for forty years and a university professor of jazz piano and a student of jazz piano legend Boston based teacher Charlie Banacos. Excellent!
Benjamin Zander talks about one-buttock and two-buttock players - he recommends the former. Shifting from buttock to buttock while playing the piano (or any instrument, really) ensures this rotation. It is also easy to remember!
Excellent tip. Thank you.
A great piece to train rotation, I found, is the Mendelssohn Concerto No.1 in g minor, particularly the 3rd Movement. He is almost forcing you to use this technique, and the piece suits the hands very nicely, making it an easier concerto, but still not the easiest😅.
Yesterday I happened to hear AC/DC Thunderstruck and tried it on the piano with one hand and noticed that it's kind of forearm rotation exercise :)
Fascinating, thank you.
I really like Graham Fitch's explanation and demonstration of forearm rotation on the Pianist Magazine youtube channel.
good demos on rotation.
Great video
I really REALLY appreciate Seymour's teachings because he just puts it in a way that's so easily relatable. Even someone who doesnt play could understand his teachings on mechanics
Thanks, good learnings for us pianists
I may try this hopefully it will help ❤
Thank you
Rotation definitely completely changed my playing for the better 3 years ago when I had a really bad case of RSI. (I couldn't even hold a cup of coffee with one hand). My teacher Susan Cohen taught me that.
thanks for all these tips. Would you have information about piano-technique for people who have fingers that don't fit between the black keys of the piano.
Wow unfortunately I never had piano lessons (I had organ lessons as a child) and my forearms tend to feel tired after a couple of hours of practice. This is an eye-opener for me. Thank you for this valuable lesson!
Taubman is ✨gold✨
I'm interested in the rotation approach to rapid scale passages in particular
It's amazing, if you play sports of any kind these , hand and arm gymnastics come naturally. Sports like proper TENNIS, GOLF, TABLE TENNIS, PICKLE BALL ETC.
A great exercise for rotation is chopins first etude in the opus 10 set
It's very helpful to practice in view of mirrors, so you can watch yourself playing from the perspective of a teacher.
How have i been playing for thirty years but never really considered this. Thank you!
Because it is unnecessary?
Thank you kindly🤍
Taubman is right on many things. But the true originator of rotation was Chopin. And yes he spoke about it to his students. But not in the somewhat faulty nonsensical way as taught in the Taubman approach. She got these concepts from Matthay who was also… missing something important. It’s really quite amazing to me how few people have bothered to really look into what Chopin was teaching. Mind blowing really.
Where can I read more about these Chopin's ideas?
@@rodnaskel2123 Study the etudes, opus 10 in particular. Look at the left hand in no 9 and no 10, for example.
I'm writing a book about exactly this as we speak!
So why dont you just stop being mystical about it and share those missing points?
Do you have a source for this assertion?
I can find no mentions of rotation in the Eigeldinger book or in Chopin's unpublished method sketches. As far as I'm aware, Matthay was the first person to discuss rotation as a teaching tool.
Thank you for the lesson. Please what is the name of the beautiful excerpt played at 07:31?
Nocturne in e minor op. 72 (post.)
@@bsmusicdThank you very much!
Curious, how does the smooth rotation occur when tucking the thumb up and down the scale? I find myself doing half a rotation then winding up for a full rotation, after the thumb is tucked, to finish the scale. If you could direct me to a resource that covers this specifically, that would be very helpful. Thank you.
@nigeldarrah4573 We’re working on a video about the thumb right now! Stay tuned!
I was very ready to get angry in the comments when Seymour started talking about rotation in the wrongest way possible, of course he was trolling
Lady in the fantastic funky red and blue dress - gorgeous sounding piano - what kind is it? Beautiful sounding room to play in.
I've tried rotation, but it has not helped my playing at all. All that happens is that I get more dizzy with each rotation as I spin on the bench.
Interesting. The moment I stopped rotating my playing improved dramatically. I guess this doesn't apply to everyone...
❤
Let me save you a lot of time and pain by sharing some of Claudio Arrau's principles: all you have to do is to completely loosen your arm and rotation comes by itself. Do not try to do it when you are tense...
Also, NEVER think of the wrist, forearm & fingers individually, otherwise you will have a harsh sound with less harmonics (which unfortunately is the case with the pianists in this video). Technique is not only for agility, but for a rich, pleasant tone color full of harmonics from ppp to fff. Listen to Arrau's sound and you'll notice the abrupt difference.
Hope this helps.
Arrau is really underrated in this channel, glad to finally find a comment like this
I’m really having a hard time listening to the so called forearm rotation, when it’s ridiculously better coming from the arm
My piano teacher learnt from Arrau directly in the 50s at his NYC school. She has reinforced me so many times how the Taubman principles can mess your hands up if you focus on their set of predetermined movements (such as rotation and the so-called “arm-wrist- hand” alignment) instead of solving first the underlying issue that as Rodrigo correctly pointed out is the tension throughout the hand.
Arrau left out there so many valuable knowledge on piano technique that has been almost forgotten. I hope that tonebase reaches out to some of his pupils so his principles can help more hurt and struggling pianists.
For anyone interested, I highly recommend Victoria Von Arx’s book on Arrau’s teachings.
Team Arrau here. I wrote my Master's paper on Arrau's Beethoven Sonatas fingerings. His entire technique is embedded in those bizarre fingerings.
side note: is Mr Seymour wearing an emerge watch with a button (to press in tgese cases)?
What is the name of the music here 7:29
Rotation is a helpful concept but is difficult to teach because if you don't understand it, you can't do it naturally. For me a higher-level concept is don't lock the wrists. Ever. Wrists can go up and down as needed, and side to side, and rotate as needed. And if you try to play with your forearms, you lose the connection to the fingers that the wrist provides. The slight amount of relaxed flexing in the wrists can alleviate the chain of tension that leads to the shoulders and back. What's tricky is learning how the forearm rotation creates the wrist motion, and recognizing the wrist motion is a byproduct of the forearm rotation. Probably martial artists have a better science for this.
You are right but without finger- hand- arm alignment I feel pain in my wrist after playing e.g a whole Mozart sonata !
After 20 years as a professional pianist trained only in the shoulder-arm-wrist "weight" method I've only recently discovered what my fingers and hands should have been doing all along. Moving the focus from the arms to the fingers and metacarpophalangeal joints has completely revolutionised my technique. I actually quit playing for a year through burn-out (and an incredibly well-timed pandemic) in order to discover this. Although I also discovered that *willed* forearm rotation is much less useful than I had been led to believe and that rotation should be seen as an epiphenomenon of active fingers supporting the weight of a relaxed arm.
Under normal playing conditions the wrist should be flat, or even a bit lower than the curve of the fingers, particularly in Mozart. It's a similar ergonomics to typing on a computer keyboard. If you type with your wrists much higher than your knuckles problems arise. @@heifie2540
I can find C's and D's but I have trouble with Ease.
7:33 whats that piece called
It seems that this rotation - just from a 60-second trial - will greatly help to play successive groups of thirds.
Please do a video on Rach 1 it is my first piani concerto im learning
Could you discuss shoulder rotation?
Does anyone know who the English pianist is?
1:39 hardy har har 🤣
Rotation reminds me of Mozart's Sonatas.
interesting... but don't u naturally rotate like this when playing? how does it look when ur not rotating..?
What is the song she plays at 737
Chopin nocturne op. 72 nr 1
Well........... what you are actually looking at is..........circumduction. The ability for the finger or wrist or whatever to circulate around the fixed point at its base.
Circumduction occurs in the shoulder, hip, wrist, metacarpophalangeal, and metatarsophalangeal joints.
This video deals with the forearm. The forearm pronates and supinates (rotation).
Thank you! I knew that rotation was not the accurate word. My PT concurred@@bsmusicd
I'd like to point out that the arm is too heavy to change direction with rotation as fast as needed for each note. Something else is going on with good playing. Calling it rotation is a simplification, but useful
Video really starts at th-cam.com/video/rsRGVik0HBM/w-d-xo.html
"The free forearm allows me to come in a way that would produce a sound."
My dude you need to feel the music
"일반"학습자가 로테이션이 있다가 아니라 저걸 따라한다? 소리가 어떨지 궁금하네요.....
This is more complicated than the golf swing! Just kidding.
Powerful facial hair on that chap.
Nothing new!
Already classical music is dying and you're going to leave a stupid comment like this on one of the only successful classical music channels?
This is really overthinking things, to be honest. If your body is relaxed, rotation is a natural byproduct, influenced by phrasing.
IF your body is relaxed, which it almost never is with beginners. That's exactly why you teach them rotation and correct movement. You are talking about putting the cart before the horse.
please remove Golannsky and Durso so that this advertisement is less cringey.