I have learned since i started modding and collecting watches "the second hand is not your friend" Obsessing over the second hand on a mechanical watch will drive you nuts LOL.🤪 life goes by way too quickly to worry about the seconds.
Mark, another very interesting and very relevant video. Thanks. Was very pleased to see much of what I have discovered myself with my own watches being shown in this video too. I do regulate my watches, once I have adjusted the beat error first. I was finding that it was taking about 3-4 adjustments, and wearing it for a day in between, to find the ideal set up for wearing on my wrist during the day, which you talked about in your video. (15 seconds gain face down, gave a 2-3 second a day gain on wrist! - Seems crazy but it works.) The other useful thing about knowing the gain/loss in various positions is that although I've set my NH36A movement to gain 2-3 seconds a day, I know that if I take it off and leave it in a certain position, it loses 2-3 seconds overnight! Very useful. As you also mentioned, I do like the watch to run a couple of seconds fast. It just means that when I come to re-set it, about every 3 weeks I just hack it, let the time catch up and push the crown in. No need to turn the hands/mechanics at all. Thanks again for the video.
Loved the video as always. I was wondering, do you write the description for all the watches you sell. Because I was shopping for a Traser to buy and came across the P68 Pathfinder and read this in the description. "The eyes first dive into the mystical midnight-blue dial, reminding one of the infinity of the universe." And this is why I buy from Marc.
I don't know about anyone else, but all the NH35/6's I've seen all came with un-centered hairsprings. Spent 2 days centering and flattening a hairspring in my Invicta Pro Diver. Max deviation came down to little over 2 seconds a day in the 5 positions, 5 seconds if you include the 6th, whereas it had positional variance of more than 15 seconds out of the box. On the wrist it does about plus a second in a little under a week.
When I owned a SKX013, I made daily deviation recordings for a period of about a month. For the price, the s726 movement is impressive. Day to day, there would be days when it would deviate plus-minus 0-1 second, however others would deviate as much as 8 seconds. Fast forward to a few years later, I performed the same experiment when I upgraded to a 2500D era Seamaster. In the same experiment the 2500D have a much narrower deviation, day on day of -1 second. Now, comparing these movements would be silly, but the takeaway I found was whilst most movements can be regulated to be accurate but whether their consistently so is something I found with higher end movements.
Interesting result. I'd be curious to see how they do after running for a couple months and at various temperatures. My SKX007 tends to vary pretty wildly. Some days it's fast... like +30 fast... and the next day it'll lose a whole minute out of nowhere. I tend to let it run down, which means I often have to set it before putting it on, so I'm not as concerned about accuracy with it anyway. But I don't expect it to be accurate to the second. I'm thinking it probably spends a lot of time with low power in the spring which doesn't help. My SARB033 on the other hand is a lot more consistent. If it's +5 one day, I can bet on it to be somewhere between +2 and +7 the next day. I can also pretty reliably regulate it by leaving it on the table overnight face up to speed it up or crown up to slow it down.
@@islandwatch Marc, I guess that I lucked-out. The SKX that I bought from you about two months ago regularly loses about 4 seconds per day. So I wait for four days and then back-hack (stall) for 15 seconds ... all while fretting that I am wearing out the the crown and choking (but not throttling) the internals. Such a great watch. I ordered it with the stainless bracelet. I also a Marathon Quartz Medium TSAR about a month earlier and it's gained about two seconds during that time. But I corrected it yesterday. It took an hour. Every time I engaged (unhooked) the second hand, the effen minute hand twitched 12 seconds of arc. I love them both. As well as the unassuming little Marathon GPQ that triggered this new interest ... sapphire and Tritium and ... the same Swiss ETA quartz movement that powers the much-pricier TSAR model.
Great video mate. As a fan and roulette player of vintage seiko I’m really looking forward to seeing what, I’m thirty or so years time, what folks will make of today’s seiko watches with three decades on them. Also, I find that it takes some wrist time out of the box before new 7SXX movements and their fancier cousins settle down.
The best movements will have a low delta ie difference between the slowest and fastest time. Rolex is -2 +2 seconds a day so a delta of 4 seconds. You can usually improve the delta on a modern movement by altering the hairspring and its position within the curb pins. On an ETA movement you would use an etachron tool to open and close the curb pins. I don't know about a seiko but it will be a similar process.
Marc, Really liked this comparison. Wouldn't a more real life accuracy test be watches in the worn condition for "X" amount of time compared to a known accurate time source? Obsession on accuracy once drove me wack. Keep up the great informative vids.
Hey! Could you do a test/info on different temperatures? The same movement running on body temperature should get a different rate to the one on room temperature. Would be interested in how much of a difference that acually is. Cheers!
Very informative video. I have a quick question Marc. I’ve watched many of your videos which helps me learn a lot about watches. I’m thinking of purchasing a real cheap watch which I can ‘play’ around with, perhaps try to regulate the movement if watch runs slow or fast, etc. Perhaps some day try to replace mineral crystal with a sapphire watch, etc. Can you recommend a watch from your inventory which I might consider purchasing? I hesitate opening my only automatic, recently purchased from you which is an Orient Blue Ray 11. Thanks for your consideration. Ed
Another excellent demonstration.. as you mention in caption past results do not indicate future deviations..I have 3 watches of 4r36 and 2 watches of 6r15.. the 6r15 started the best but after few months 4r36 stayed the way it started and both 6r15 ended up in 5 minutes to 8 minutes a day.. May be my bad luck with 6r15
Hello Marc, First of all, thank you for your videos, both those presenting the new watch models and those more technically oriented. Most of the time, I find the watches you present on your wrist at the beginning of the videos interesting. I would like to make a suggestion that may seem strange at first sight: would it be possible to voluntarily wear these watches upside down (just long enough to present them to the camera, of course) so that your audience can see them upside up from their point of view? Best regards from Europe. B²
Extremely interesting and informative video, beautiful presentation, but I am a bit of a head in the sand when it comes to this stuff, but still greatly appreciated.
Marc, quick question, I have thought for a while about getting a timegrapher to check and even regulate some of my watch collection's accuracy results. Would you specifically recommend this Otto Frei machine you're using here, or do you have other recommendations as well? Thanks!
My issue with the 7S movements is not with accuracy but primarily with what I have come to believe is a lack of QC on those calibers. The easiest ways for a watchmaker to bring a unit cost down are a) to ramp up production for those sweet, sweet economies of scale and b) skip the QC. They just seem more prone to faults in my admittedly limited experience. Another reason I believe the issue is QC is that, as I'm led to believe, the 7Ss and 4Rs share a common parts bin, yet 4R watches are typically marked up a good 30% over their 7S driven siblings. I'm just saying it's suggestive. Apropos of nothing, I wonder what happens when you put a spring drive on a timegrapher. Is that possible? How would you go about benchmarking a spring drive?
The more expensive movements have less positional variation (typically). They are also more resistant to magnetism. My SKX which generally keeps good time (like the 009 in the video) runs crazy fast if I make the mistake of setting it down next to the Amazon Echo on the nightstand (powerful magnet). Even earbuds have magnets, and if your watch with a cheaper movement is sitting next to those, it can run really fast. Better movements aren't as affected.
I recently bought Seiko SNK809 and noticed a slight rattle in it. I can hear it when I move the watch up and down gently making sure the rotor doesn't spin. The sound isn't loud but noticeable - as if something wobbles inside. The rotor doesn't seem to be loose and spins ok as far as I can tell. Also the crown is quite stiff and difficult to turn. It's my first automatic so I don't know if I should be worried. Is it normal for 7S26? Maybe you could do a video about how to notice most common problems, how to detect a defective watch?
There definitely shouldn't be any rattling and the stem should be able turn freely. You need to contact Seiko about repair if it's still under warranty.
Hey Marc, thanks for the informative video as always! I was wondering how temperature effects the accuracy and functionality of a watch. Would an automatic or quartz watch be better for extreme temperatures, and what temperatures would be too extreme for a watch?
Maybe it's a future video. But. . quartz will always be more accurate. Some autos are adjusted for temperature, but they are the higher end ones. Normal temps that 95% of us encounter are fine for autos.
Hi mr marc I just wanna ask you yesterday I got seiko baby tuna srp639 And I don’t know if this watch good and reliable please can you answer my question I would be appreciate you
Since I’ve started buying automatic watches, I’ve found my nitpicking for accuracy has dissipated a little. + or -30 seconds a day means nothing to me now. BTW, First!
My seiko after i modded it was about 40s fast per day, but as i only wear once or twice a week i don't mind plus I like setting my watches when i put them on, just a personal thing
Did you research the lift angle ? Or leave it "default" ? BTW, my little SARB035 is staggeringly accurate according to my timegrapher and my own observances. Almost giving my Grand Seiko's a run for their money.
I’m sending you a drawerful of watches. Please time-graph each of them and let me know which ones I should toss off the bridge. What’s the turnaround time for this service? Holding my breath for your reply.
Hmm, I've been running my own test over the last eight days. SKX007J which never leaves my wrist. Results so far. Day1 -3s Day2 -4s Day3 -4s Day5 -7s Day6 -3s Day7 -8s Day8 -5s. So far 34 seconds slow over 8 days.
Mark at first thanks for presenting the accuracy issue of 4 different movement, quite an effort deserve a lot of appreciation. But if you ask me Seiko watches sucks, I mean when they used to be 200-300 $ price point then this kind of accuracy could be fine with us. But now that they are increasing the price which are even more than some beginning level of Swiss watches then it really sucks. I mean My Tissot Quadrato powered by a 7750 Valjoux movement gives me average of 0.4 seconds + without regulations, my new Certina after regulation gives me the same deviation 0.4 + per day constantly, my Tissot PRS 516 runs 1 second + per day. And then my Presage which cost me $500 with a 4r35 movement have no consistency in the accuracy level even after finest regulation. Sometime +4, sometimes -5 seconds, absolutely horrible. Now I really regret my purchase and I have promised not to buy any more Seikos because they really suck when it comes to accuracy. Thanks anyway for bringing the subject on plate.
I understand, but in my opinion, if 5 seconds a day vs 1 second a day is that important to you, . . . I don't know where I'm going with that thought, LOL. Basically, though, what Seiko provides, looks, dependability, reliability, etc, is also important. Maybe for them accuracy is not paramount. I'm not saying they feel this way. But 5 seconds a day is 30 seconds a week. You wouldn't have to adjust it for 2 weeks.
Dear Mark since you a watch professional you tell me if any new movement introduced by Seiko apart from 7s26, 4r35/36 and 6r15 by Seiko and by making little refined in the case mat and polishing they are now starting with $500-1000 $. Where as if you only come to the ETA movement with regulation capability the Swiss pieces are giving you much longer duration of re-set the time. I am not a watch maker but isn't it suggested for lesser crown pulling and adjustment to keep the movement function properly? By the way the entry level Swiss pieces can be availed by spending 300-500 $ price point with very nice dial, leather strap or steel bracelet including a very nice hefty case?? Don't you agree with me that Seiko straps are horrible quality, so you have to add after market straps which should be added with the watch price? Can you deny this financial reality???
What Marc said. And the 6 positions are a good indicators on how a watch will run on your wrist. Depending on your activities and wearing behavior, a competent watchmaker will regulate your watch accordingly.
So the 7s26 is only outperformed by the 8l35 as far as regularity then having a deviation of only 3 seconds. I would have thought the 7s26 would have been all over the place. Cool vid interesting.
I have learned that my Sea - gull flying wheel retrograde day date watch has a triovis regulation system in it to help accuracy with positional variation. This watch of mine runs within +-2 seconds per day. My 7s26 runs +- 10 seconds per day. So for me the Sea-gull is Chronometer accurate. Sea-gull wins hands down straight from the factory.
That really depends on what each individual define as ,,awful lot of movement,, I can get pretty low PR from this movements with couple of days of only desk work, driving home for 25min, sitting and study at home and that’s about it. However, if a couple of days I go for a walk, ride the subway, and actually do some stuff home (cleaning up a bit for ex) I can easily max out the PR. So I would say if you mostly sit at a desk, table and drive on the highway, any automatic will run low PR.
Actually I am not surprised by the results at all. I have worn a rather cheap seagull dongfeng for the last two weeks. The average deviation of this beautiful watch is about 4 seconds a day. Hope it will perform this way for a long time to come. But a mechanical movement is not a quartz movement. There are so many factors which influences the accuracy of a mechanical watch that it makes not a lot of sense to go for an expensive one if accuracy is the only aspect you seek for.
Its not just accurate it is more precise, meaning it is less affected by positional variance. This is likely due to the higher beat rate of 28k compared to 21k of the other watches.
I'm shocked by how close those watches were. My standard deviation from Seiko to Seiko is far greater than your spread. That's why I got a timegrapher and started doing my own regulation. I generally find that the 4R and 6R have better positional accuracy than the 7S. And the Orient F6922 beats them all both out of the box and after regulation.
On your Seiko comment, what you are seeing is what is expected. My sample of one needs to be taken with a grain of salt. Orient seems to be killing it on accuracy lately.
Average really depends on the wearer. Really the 8L35 is the best as it is tuned to be a bit fast in all positions, with tight max deviation. But the 7S26 gives almost identical performance; difference being is I can take another 7S26 and likely won't get the same results.
People like measurable specs to agonize about. That’s all there is. All these people getting crazy over accuracy have no idea any smartphone can be sometimes off by up to two minutes (and of course it doesn’t display seconds at all. Yep, you heard that right, on any Android or iPhone, from time to time the clock on the screen fail to update, and sometimes it can take up until the next minute change to do it. That means you can look at your screen now and it will say for ex. 10:45 when actual time is 10:46 and 59 seconds, and when it will updates it will go straight from 10:45 to 10:47. That’s the worst case scenario I’ve seen, sometimes can be less, but still, even it it is updating perfectly, you still can be off by almost a minute from the simple fact it doesn’t display seconds. How’s that for you accuracy nuts ?
Solution: Buy expensive watch with 6r15 movement in it. Take out 6r15 movement. Smash 6r15 movement with hammer and throw in trash. Buy cheap watch with 7s26 movement in it. Put 7s26 movement in expensive watch B)
As always, Marc -- I really appreciate you taking the time to setup and perform this analysis!
Thanks!
I have learned since i started modding and collecting watches "the second hand is not your friend" Obsessing over the second hand on a mechanical watch will drive you nuts LOL.🤪
life goes by way too quickly to worry about the seconds.
😏! I need that second hand as a distraction from the everyday!
Yes I can agree lol
Who needs hacking anyway!?!?
Seconds can mean a $100 parking ticket
unless it is a spring drive :)
Mark, another very interesting and very relevant video. Thanks.
Was very pleased to see much of what I have discovered myself with my own watches being shown in this video too. I do regulate my watches, once I have adjusted the beat error first. I was finding that it was taking about 3-4 adjustments, and wearing it for a day in between, to find the ideal set up for wearing on my wrist during the day, which you talked about in your video. (15 seconds gain face down, gave a 2-3 second a day gain on wrist! - Seems crazy but it works.)
The other useful thing about knowing the gain/loss in various positions is that although I've set my NH36A movement to gain 2-3 seconds a day, I know that if I take it off and leave it in a certain position, it loses 2-3 seconds overnight! Very useful.
As you also mentioned, I do like the watch to run a couple of seconds fast. It just means that when I come to re-set it, about every 3 weeks I just hack it, let the time catch up and push the crown in. No need to turn the hands/mechanics at all. Thanks again for the video.
Great video, Marc! I can see the engineer at work! That's what I like about Long Island Watch! All the best, Rob in Switzerland
Thanks Rob. In a few days I'll be "Marc in Switzerland"
I have learned a lot over the last 5 months watching your videos. Thank you
Awesome, thank you.
Excellent eye opening knowledge gain about Seiko variety movements. Much Appreciate It.
Thank you!
Loved the video as always. I was wondering, do you write the description for all the watches you sell. Because I was shopping for a Traser to buy and came across the P68 Pathfinder and read this in the description. "The eyes first dive into the mystical midnight-blue dial, reminding one of the infinity of the universe." And this is why I buy from Marc.
Lol
Nope; I have a copy-writer for that stuff.
Deeply insightful as always Marc. I always get excited when a new watch and learn video comes out :)
Thanks!
I don't know about anyone else, but all the NH35/6's I've seen all came with un-centered hairsprings. Spent 2 days centering and flattening a hairspring in my Invicta Pro Diver. Max deviation came down to little over 2 seconds a day in the 5 positions, 5 seconds if you include the 6th, whereas it had positional variance of more than 15 seconds out of the box. On the wrist it does about plus a second in a little under a week.
Oooooo! That Marine Master is a good looking piece ⌚👀
Would you believe I'm not a fan!
Shame! Joking, lol, to each their own :)
@@islandwatch Really? Aesthetics or technically not appealing to you??
It would be great to see this done with a couple different ETA and Selita movements. Or different grades of ETA movements.
Thanks Jeremy. Great idea!
Great info........ I’ll take that skx009 all day long...... which I’m buying this week
I'll admit I was super impressed by it.
This should be a Watch & Learn
Thought about that!
My SNXS (7s26) is running minus 3 sec/day in regular daily wearing. I think it’s good!
Nice informative video Marc, Thank you. Interesting how the old movement that is used in the SKS models and some others are that stable.
Amazing considering people say they are garbage.
@@islandwatch Unfortunately there are watch snobs out there.
When I owned a SKX013, I made daily deviation recordings for a period of about a month. For the price, the s726 movement is impressive. Day to day, there would be days when it would deviate plus-minus 0-1 second, however others would deviate as much as 8 seconds. Fast forward to a few years later, I performed the same experiment when I upgraded to a 2500D era Seamaster. In the same experiment the 2500D have a much narrower deviation, day on day of -1 second. Now, comparing these movements would be silly, but the takeaway I found was whilst most movements can be regulated to be accurate but whether their consistently so is something I found with higher end movements.
Nice performance, thanks for sharing.
Interesting result. I'd be curious to see how they do after running for a couple months and at various temperatures.
My SKX007 tends to vary pretty wildly. Some days it's fast... like +30 fast... and the next day it'll lose a whole minute out of nowhere. I tend to let it run down, which means I often have to set it before putting it on, so I'm not as concerned about accuracy with it anyway. But I don't expect it to be accurate to the second. I'm thinking it probably spends a lot of time with low power in the spring which doesn't help.
My SARB033 on the other hand is a lot more consistent. If it's +5 one day, I can bet on it to be somewhere between +2 and +7 the next day. I can also pretty reliably regulate it by leaving it on the table overnight face up to speed it up or crown up to slow it down.
Thanks for sharing. I wouldn't expect this performance from all the skx of course. :)
@@islandwatch
Marc, I guess that I lucked-out. The SKX that I bought from you about two months ago regularly loses about 4 seconds per day. So I wait for four days and then back-hack (stall) for 15 seconds ... all while fretting that I am wearing out the the crown and choking (but not throttling) the internals. Such a great watch. I ordered it with the stainless bracelet.
I also a Marathon Quartz Medium TSAR about a month earlier and it's gained about two seconds during that time. But I corrected it yesterday. It took an hour. Every time I engaged (unhooked) the second hand, the effen minute hand twitched 12 seconds of arc. I love them both.
As well as the unassuming little Marathon GPQ that triggered this new interest ... sapphire and Tritium and ... the same Swiss ETA quartz movement that powers the much-pricier TSAR model.
Oops ... not 12 seconds of arc ... 1/2 a minute ...
Very good explanation, analysis and comparison...Thanks so much👍👍
You are welcome.
Possibly your most interesting video to date? Good stuff! Cheers.Len.
Thanks Len. I like to say "intriguing".
Fun video. Time to see the Squale 60 Atmos on the wrist again please?
It's on it today actually :)
You got the chronometer grade 7S26!
Great video mate. As a fan and roulette player of vintage seiko I’m really looking forward to seeing what, I’m thirty or so years time, what folks will make of today’s seiko watches with three decades on them. Also, I find that it takes some wrist time out of the box before new 7SXX movements and their fancier cousins settle down.
Thank you! I appreciate the comment.
Very interesting video. Please do Citizen/Miyota movements as well.
Very informative, excellent work! Thanks.
Thanks!
I'm really digging the Casio ga2100 and the loss of the second hand altogether. analog min/hr and digital everything else yup!
The best movements will have a low delta ie difference between the slowest and fastest time. Rolex is -2 +2 seconds a day so a delta of 4 seconds. You can usually improve the delta on a modern movement by altering the hairspring and its position within the curb pins. On an ETA movement you would use an etachron tool to open and close the curb pins. I don't know about a seiko but it will be a similar process.
I'm not sure you can get there with these lower end movements.
Very good information. I really like your channel.
Thank you.
Great video dude 👍
I recently wore my Seiko5 for a week and it was out only by about 2minutes given the each day has c.80,000 seconds
that is outstounding.
@Roger Dottin true but a great watch to get interested in watches. I really like the recessed crown.
When you look at it that way, it's truly amazing.
This is deep. Enjoyed it. I learnt something new.
Marc,
Really liked this comparison.
Wouldn't a more real life accuracy test be watches in the worn condition for "X" amount of time compared to a known accurate time source?
Obsession on accuracy once drove me wack.
Keep up the great informative vids.
It would, but, this is the way all watches are timed, so it makes the most sense.
Thank you for this it would be great if you did this for other brands as well thank you.
Thanks for the idea.
Hey! Could you do a test/info on different temperatures?
The same movement running on body temperature should get a different rate to the one on room temperature. Would be interested in how much of a difference that acually is.
Cheers!
The important takeaway here is that you got a straight flush with the 7s26
LOL
Very informative video. I have a quick question Marc. I’ve watched many of your videos which helps me learn a lot about watches. I’m thinking of purchasing a real cheap watch which I can ‘play’ around with, perhaps try to regulate the movement if watch runs slow or fast, etc. Perhaps some day try to replace mineral crystal with a sapphire watch, etc. Can you recommend a watch from your inventory which I might consider purchasing? I hesitate opening my only automatic, recently purchased from you which is an Orient Blue Ray 11. Thanks for your consideration. Ed
Ed F get yourself a Vostok Amphibia.
Seiko SNK watches.
Thanks Marc
Thanks Mike on your suggestion
Another excellent demonstration.. as you mention in caption past results do not indicate future deviations..I have 3 watches of 4r36 and 2 watches of 6r15.. the 6r15 started the best but after few months 4r36 stayed the way it started and both 6r15 ended up in 5 minutes to 8 minutes a day.. May be my bad luck with 6r15
If they are under warranty send them back, that sucks man
Sounds like something is amiss.
Hello Marc,
First of all, thank you for your videos, both those presenting the new watch models and those more technically oriented.
Most of the time, I find the watches you present on your wrist at the beginning of the videos interesting.
I would like to make a suggestion that may seem strange at first sight: would it be possible to voluntarily wear these watches upside down (just long enough to present them to the camera, of course) so that your audience can see them upside up from their point of view?
Best regards from Europe.
B²
Thanks for the idea!
Great video. This has taught me alot ty.
Thank you.
Nice effort with interesting results.
Indeed, thank you.
Surprising! Thanks Marc.
Very surprising!
@@islandwatch I would have put my money on the 6R... 😋
Extremely interesting and informative video, beautiful presentation, but I am a bit of a head in the sand when it comes to this stuff, but still greatly appreciated.
Glad you can enjoy it.
Very informative. Thanks Marc.
Thanks!
Marc, quick question, I have thought for a while about getting a timegrapher to check and even regulate some of my watch collection's accuracy results. Would you specifically recommend this Otto Frei machine you're using here, or do you have other recommendations as well? Thanks!
this machine is a ubiquitous chinese machine- get one on ebay or maybe marc sells them now.
It's fine for my purposes, I wouldn't hesitate to recommend it.
Interesting video Marc 👍🏻
Thank you.
My issue with the 7S movements is not with accuracy but primarily with what I have come to believe is a lack of QC on those calibers. The easiest ways for a watchmaker to bring a unit cost down are a) to ramp up production for those sweet, sweet economies of scale and b) skip the QC. They just seem more prone to faults in my admittedly limited experience. Another reason I believe the issue is QC is that, as I'm led to believe, the 7Ss and 4Rs share a common parts bin, yet 4R watches are typically marked up a good 30% over their 7S driven siblings. I'm just saying it's suggestive.
Apropos of nothing, I wonder what happens when you put a spring drive on a timegrapher. Is that possible? How would you go about benchmarking a spring drive?
Thanks Mark very helpful
Oops Marc not Mark sorry
No problem, you are welcome!
Nicely done & thanks for sharing 👍🍻
You are welcome.
The more expensive movements have less positional variation (typically). They are also more resistant to magnetism. My SKX which generally keeps good time (like the 009 in the video) runs crazy fast if I make the mistake of setting it down next to the Amazon Echo on the nightstand (powerful magnet). Even earbuds have magnets, and if your watch with a cheaper movement is sitting next to those, it can run really fast. Better movements aren't as affected.
Very true.
I’m starting to like my seiko skx and first gen monster more good info love ur stuff thanks
Thank you!!!!
I enjoy my SKX009J and it keeps time better than my my other automatic watches by seiko
Make sure to mention the "J" or your opinion is moot... 😉
Great to hear!
@@MrDoggerDog hehehe
Yes
I also have the seiko from Malaysia and it is not quite as accurate throughout the day
I recently bought Seiko SNK809 and noticed a slight rattle in it. I can hear it when I move the watch up and down gently making sure the rotor doesn't spin. The sound isn't loud but noticeable - as if something wobbles inside. The rotor doesn't seem to be loose and spins ok as far as I can tell. Also the crown is quite stiff and difficult to turn. It's my first automatic so I don't know if I should be worried. Is it normal for 7S26? Maybe you could do a video about how to notice most common problems, how to detect a defective watch?
Thanks for the idea. The crown on that watch is so small, it is difficult to get a grip on and turn.
There definitely shouldn't be any rattling and the stem should be able turn freely. You need to contact Seiko about repair if it's still under warranty.
Thank you very much for the great information.
You are welcome!
Hey Marc, thanks for the informative video as always!
I was wondering how temperature effects the accuracy and functionality of a watch. Would an automatic or quartz watch be better for extreme temperatures, and what temperatures would be too extreme for a watch?
Maybe it's a future video. But. . quartz will always be more accurate. Some autos are adjusted for temperature, but they are the higher end ones. Normal temps that 95% of us encounter are fine for autos.
Hi mr marc I just wanna ask you yesterday I got seiko baby tuna srp639
And I don’t know if this watch good and reliable please can you answer my question I would be appreciate you
Good watch indeed!
Great video!
Since I’ve started buying automatic watches, I’ve found my nitpicking for accuracy has dissipated a little. + or -30 seconds a day means nothing to me now.
BTW, First!
Me too, if my watches run too fast or too slow, I'll adjust the time back to normal. Plus, I like to interact with my watches.
@@ThanhLai5 I'm with you guys.
Wish more were like you!
Great video. Thumbs up !
Thanks!
My seiko after i modded it was about 40s fast per day, but as i only wear once or twice a week i don't mind plus I like setting my watches when i put them on, just a personal thing
Yup, I'm the same way.
Did you research the lift angle ? Or leave it "default" ?
BTW, my little SARB035 is staggeringly accurate according to my timegrapher and my own observances. Almost giving my Grand Seiko's a run for their money.
It didn't matter for this; lift angle is only necessary for the beat error.
He means amplitude mate, it is how long the pallet is in contact with the balance.
In some situation in life I sometimes need hand winding.Hacking and few seconds plus or minus is not so important to me.
Nice and interesting video. Thanks.
You are welcome.
Great video thank you
I’m sending you a drawerful of watches. Please time-graph each of them and let me know which ones I should toss off the bridge. What’s the turnaround time for this service? Holding my breath for your reply.
(don't hold your breath). LOL
Hmm, I've been running my own test over the last eight days. SKX007J which never leaves my wrist. Results so far.
Day1 -3s
Day2 -4s
Day3 -4s
Day5 -7s
Day6 -3s
Day7 -8s
Day8 -5s. So far 34 seconds slow over 8 days.
Not too bad
Very interesting video!
Thank you.
Mark at first thanks for presenting the accuracy issue of 4 different movement, quite an effort deserve a lot of appreciation. But if you ask me Seiko watches sucks, I mean when they used to be 200-300 $ price point then this kind of accuracy could be fine with us. But now that they are increasing the price which are even more than some beginning level of Swiss watches then it really sucks. I mean My Tissot Quadrato powered by a 7750 Valjoux movement gives me average of 0.4 seconds + without regulations, my new Certina after regulation gives me the same deviation 0.4 + per day constantly, my Tissot PRS 516 runs 1 second + per day. And then my Presage which cost me $500 with a 4r35 movement have no consistency in the accuracy level even after finest regulation. Sometime +4, sometimes -5 seconds, absolutely horrible. Now I really regret my purchase and I have promised not to buy any more Seikos because they really suck when it comes to accuracy. Thanks anyway for bringing the subject on plate.
I understand, but in my opinion, if 5 seconds a day vs 1 second a day is that important to you, . . . I don't know where I'm going with that thought, LOL. Basically, though, what Seiko provides, looks, dependability, reliability, etc, is also important. Maybe for them accuracy is not paramount. I'm not saying they feel this way. But 5 seconds a day is 30 seconds a week. You wouldn't have to adjust it for 2 weeks.
Dear Mark since you a watch professional you tell me if any new movement introduced by Seiko apart from 7s26, 4r35/36 and 6r15 by Seiko and by making little refined in the case mat and polishing they are now starting with $500-1000 $. Where as if you only come to the ETA movement with regulation capability the Swiss pieces are giving you much longer duration of re-set the time. I am not a watch maker but isn't it suggested for lesser crown pulling and adjustment to keep the movement function properly? By the way the entry level Swiss pieces can be availed by spending 300-500 $ price point with very nice dial, leather strap or steel bracelet including a very nice hefty case?? Don't you agree with me that Seiko straps are horrible quality, so you have to add after market straps which should be added with the watch price? Can you deny this financial reality???
There are infinite positions if you really think about it, so I just stopped even thinking about the accuracy.
Yes, there are, but these are the accepted 5 (6) positions.
What Marc said. And the 6 positions are a good indicators on how a watch will run on your wrist. Depending on your activities and wearing behavior, a competent watchmaker will regulate your watch accordingly.
So the 7s26 is only outperformed by the 8l35 as far as regularity then having a deviation of only 3 seconds. I would have thought the 7s26 would have been all over the place. Cool vid interesting.
This isn't typical but still surprising.
Great! I learned something new today :)
That's what I like to hear!
Very cool vid
Thank you.
Interesting experiment. Still I'd be careful not to draw any solid conclusions based on N=1 sample size measurements.
Of course not, and I make those disclaimers.
I have learned that my Sea - gull flying wheel retrograde day date watch has a triovis regulation system in it to help accuracy with positional variation. This watch of mine runs within +-2 seconds per day. My 7s26 runs +- 10 seconds per day. So for me the Sea-gull is Chronometer accurate.
Sea-gull wins hands down straight from the factory.
Wow, that's awesome! Thanks for sharing.
I love my SKX but it takes an awful lot of movement on the wrist to reach a decent power reserve. Is that normal for the 7s26?
That really depends on what each individual define as ,,awful lot of movement,, I can get pretty low PR from this movements with couple of days of only desk work, driving home for 25min, sitting and study at home and that’s about it. However, if a couple of days I go for a walk, ride the subway, and actually do some stuff home (cleaning up a bit for ex) I can easily max out the PR. So I would say if you mostly sit at a desk, table and drive on the highway, any automatic will run low PR.
Mihai Pascu I was actually hoping Marc would answer. Thanks.
Depends on the user, and how active you are. They are fairly efficient winding watches. Mihai Pascu summed it up perfectly.
Long Island Watch good to know. Still kinda new to automatics. Thanks guys!
Very interesting
:)
Actually I am not surprised by the results at all. I have worn a rather cheap seagull dongfeng for the last two weeks. The average deviation of this beautiful watch is about 4 seconds a day. Hope it will perform this way for a long time to come. But a mechanical movement is not a quartz movement. There are so many factors which influences the accuracy of a mechanical watch that it makes not a lot of sense to go for an expensive one if accuracy is the only aspect you seek for.
Sounds great, thanks for sharing.
one of the biggest questions i ever had was this!!!!
And now it's answered!
Great video. But, really an advertisement for buying a quartz watch!
Tom Faranda 😂😂😂
LOL; I would say every video I do is!
In my opinion 6r15 and 8l35 is best accuracy wise
Why would an 8L35 be inherently more accurate when they're not regulated?
Its not just accurate it is more precise, meaning it is less affected by positional variance. This is likely due to the higher beat rate of 28k compared to 21k of the other watches.
Higher beat rate, tighter tolerances, better materials, japanese built, “unfinished + unregulated grand seiko 9S55” apparently
Better construction will make it more accurate.
I'm shocked by how close those watches were. My standard deviation from Seiko to Seiko is far greater than your spread. That's why I got a timegrapher and started doing my own regulation. I generally find that the 4R and 6R have better positional accuracy than the 7S. And the Orient F6922 beats them all both out of the box and after regulation.
On your Seiko comment, what you are seeing is what is expected. My sample of one needs to be taken with a grain of salt.
Orient seems to be killing it on accuracy lately.
Watching you On my treadmill.
...
I guess you had nowhere good to go.
@@islandwatch on the contrary my friend you are in my top 5 youtube channel
1 Radiohead 2 JRE Clips 3 Powerful JRE 4 LIW and 5 MinitWatch ...
Iv found that my skx's have been consitently my most accurate automatics
You are one of the lucky ones.
The 7S26 in this test scenario is not as accurate as the 8L35 (by a small margin), but its precision is very comparable to the 8L.
Ah, good point, I've discussed accuracy and precision in the past, I'm glad you brought it up.
@@islandwatch This 7S26's precision is not representative for the movement in general though😆
My take away ... open up my SKX007s, & make an adjustment & it may run like a MM.
It might.
I'll take the 4r36. Rest it crown left at night, wherever it starts to run fast.
That's the way to read it.
Old school rules;)
It sure does.
@5:44 doctrine of *independent trials*
Of course, and I needed to make that clear. Being an engineer, I know what sample size I should be using. :)
by average 4R36 is the best isn’t it? daily up and down would set off themselves 🤣
Average really depends on the wearer. Really the 8L35 is the best as it is tuned to be a bit fast in all positions, with tight max deviation. But the 7S26 gives almost identical performance; difference being is I can take another 7S26 and likely won't get the same results.
it would be interesting to see a video comparing 5 7S26 movements
The Adolf-35 movement huh? ;)
People like measurable specs to agonize about. That’s all there is. All these people getting crazy over accuracy have no idea any smartphone can be sometimes off by up to two minutes (and of course it doesn’t display seconds at all. Yep, you heard that right, on any Android or iPhone, from time to time the clock on the screen fail to update, and sometimes it can take up until the next minute change to do it. That means you can look at your screen now and it will say for ex. 10:45 when actual time is 10:46 and 59 seconds, and when it will updates it will go straight from 10:45 to 10:47. That’s the worst case scenario I’ve seen, sometimes can be less, but still, even it it is updating perfectly, you still can be off by almost a minute from the simple fact it doesn’t display seconds. How’s that for you accuracy nuts ?
Haha, it'll drive some people crazy!
My smartphone is even worse. It can be off an hour a lot of days because it can't decide which time zone it is in.
Mine runs +7s / day
Interesting....hmmm...
:)
Solution: Buy expensive watch with 6r15 movement in it.
Take out 6r15 movement.
Smash 6r15 movement with hammer and throw in trash.
Buy cheap watch with 7s26 movement in it.
Put 7s26 movement in expensive watch B)
The most accurate is your mobile phone time.
You should have removed this 7s26, it is not an average 7s26.Average 7s26 is more +15 -27 +1 -87 +150
LOL. Like Theranos blood trials :)
Mmm? Velly Interlesting.
Always at least one Seiko with ADHD!
Great Study LIW.
Thanks Jono!
quartz
Yes.
My seiko 5 is as accurate as rolex datejust
One of the lucky ones!
:)
:)
Go 7S26. Hacking and hand winding is overrated.
I'm with you.
Yup. The best design is the simplest one that works.