I mounted my valve on the tunnel in the console under the ash tray door. Today I went out in my 240Z and did several hard stops. I had turned the valve all the way out. Then I adjusted it in until the rears started to lock up, then I backed it out small amounts and retested it several times. I'll continue to fine tune for different pavement conditions and daytime temps. I'm glad my valve is accessible while driving. I also visited the Wilwood site for valve adjustment instructions and more tips on breaking in new discs and pads. Very nice video. Thank you
Factory setup is to limit rear brake lockup. Stock setup bias to strongly to the front which is fine for street driving but can cause fronts to lock on track or autocross use if you brake very hard. I have the Wilwood valve under that hood and fixed that issues.
Great video! Very informative! I've been curious if I should add one of these to my track Miata on my non-sport, non-ABS NB brakes. What's the best way to determine your rears are locking up first in straight line testing when setting the valve to the correct bias ratio?
How does the adjuster bias the pressure/ volume? . If it is restricting the flow, and the pressure is 100 psi, would it get to 100 psi, just slower? does it reduce the max pressure?
My thought as well. I guess it makes sense for short stops but for a longer stop I'd still worry about locking the rears. I guess for full force high speed braking, things like heat might matter more. I guess making sure your rear brakes are matched well to your fronts is step 1 to getting good brake bias.
Hi I really like your video it has a lot of good information and the reason that I find it is because I have a 1992 Toyota Camry wagon and I am trying to replace the rear break proportioning valve do you know or can you advise where can I find one and also I’ll like to install the pressure regulator thank you very much for your help
I was hoping you would talk about knee points, which is how the valve actually works, as far as I know. Can you address infinite adjustment knobs vs click adjustment levers?
@baribari600 Keith did another brake proportioning video a few years ago in which he does discuss knee points. The "infinite adjustment knobs" are basically adjusting spring tension. A click adjustment lever is the same thing, but it has detents so you can more reliably hit a specific setting.
Can I run the prop valve next to the master and an extension knob in the cabin like the ones for actual balance bars, brakeometer’s or allstar’s? Or it only works with Wilwood’s?
Wilwood doesn’t consider the knob removable on their proportioning valve. Balance bars are a fixed bias so they have to constantly be adjust for the right balance for given conditions, valves approximate a curve so they suit a wider range and thus don’t require as much adjustment.
Hey I got a Wheelwood proportion valve 5 ports adjustable I hope to breaks up and blend the backbreaks and started on the front winds and there's no fluid coming out to front one What's wrong
With modern EBD, is there anything that one would need to do when upgrading brake rotors/calipers/pads piecemeal on an ND for example. Surely biasing only begins to actively “adjust” from some default setting only AFTER slip is detected via the wheel speed sensors. This surely must have detrimental effect on limit handling when slip angles are affected by non optimal brake bias under trail braking.
This Wilwood Brake Proportioning valve will not work with the ND. The automatic system on the ND should adjust itself to a certain degree. Please feel free to reach out to our customer support team directly if you have more questions or need details. Call 970-464-5600 M-F 8-5 Mountain time or email us at support@flyinmiata.com.
😊 since I added my adjustable proportion valve when I apply the brakes it works fine. But when I release the brake pedal the rear brakes do not release
If adjust the valve to have the minimum pressure possible in the rear wheels, is there a chance of my front brake line to blow or fail (due to, all the pressure of the system going on the front lines) ?
Question if I want my rear breake to luck before the front for drifting where should I connect the valve to the rear side of the master cylinder or the front?
@@jeromeswaby5261 No, you would still be restricting the rears. The ideal proportioning changes with weight transfer, and the knee point in the valve gets you closer to the ideal curve.
@@FlyinMiataVideo ok I have a master cylinder with 4 breake lines coming from it 2 for the front and 2 for the back so how would that connect if i connect it to one of the breake rear line what about the next rear line i dont understand ?
@@jeromeswaby5261 It might be best if you contact our technical support department. It sounds like you have an NC or ND, which have electronic brake distribution as part of the ABS system.
looking to buy a 2021 miata. what's the best trim(package) i should get if i want to do some upgrades? say is the brembo package worth the money ? or i'd be better off upgrading them myown.
The ND is a very solid platform straight from the factory, so this really comes down to personal preference and how you plan to use the car. The Brembos are a good factory upgrade, but there are better systems out there. Our Wilwood big brake kits weigh less, are more compact, and can provide more options when upgrading. If you are only doing street driving, you might not even need the Brembos. Feel free to reach out to our customer support team directly if you'd like to discuss this more detail or need our specific recommendations for your use. Call 970-464-5600 M-F 8-5 Mountain time or email us at support@flyinmiata.com. Thanks!
@@FlyinMiataVideo You guys are leaders in the Miata world, please move on to something better than junky wildwood kits that rely on pressure limiting switches as a bandaid to their lack of system engineering.
@@Firebert79TA That's not really possible - unless you're only designing for maximum deceleration under a very specific situation, you always have to be able to adjust front/rear bias and the ideal bias changes depending on the rate of decel. Miatas have been able to do it electronically for 15 years, but older ones still rely on hardware. Some brake manufacturers claim they've come up with the perfect bias by selecting different parts, but it can't be done because there is no such thing as the perfect bias for all conditions or even all braking events under a specific set of conditions. Even F1 cars have adjustable brake bias.
@@FlyinMiataVideo Of course it's possible. Stock vehicles from before electronic brake distribution systems are the clear example of this. If the brake kit manufacturer keeps the total brake torque similar for a given amount of fluid pressure similar to stock, the aftermarket pressure limiting switch is not necessary. Yes, there are many things an owner might change that would affect ideal brake balance. If you want to fine-tune and optimize the balance reliably for all scenarios, go all-in and get a balance bar and dual master cylinders. These wilwood switches are the crudest available option. These are used as cheap band-aids for half-baked brake kits that needlessly ruin balance. Something more radical like an engine swap or aero mods should be the thing that causes a car to need different brake balance. If the weight distribution, wheel base, and center of gravity isn't that different from stock, it's silly that a brake kit alone would radically change the bias to the point of needing a pressure limiting switch.
@@Firebert79TA Stock vehicles include a proportioning valve - we have the charts for the NA and NB Miata ones on our website if you want to see them. The adjustable Wilwood one works exactly the same way as they do, only the knee point can be adjusted. The adjustable valve is not a band-aid, it's an upgrade. We feel it's an upgrade even on a stock braking system. A balance bar and dual masters is an example of a system that only works under very specific conditions, as the proportioning is fixed and not tied to pressure (and thus rate of deceleration). So it's only optimized for one scenario. The approximation of a curve from a "pressure limiting switch" gives you a much wider range of acceptable scenarios.
Mike touches on this briefly in the video. The front brakes retain full pressure, while the valve only adjusts rear pressure, to effect the balance between front and rear. The short answer is there is no need for both F&R adjustment since the purpose of the proportion valve is to adjust the balance, not the actual pressures. Feel free to give us a call or drop us an email if you have more questions or need more details!
If you're not seeing brake fluid reach the caliper, first check to ensure that your reservoir cap is off. Then, check to make sure that the fluid isn't leaking from a line before it gets to that caliper. Once you've checked those things, try using the gravity bleed method, or using a vacuum bleeder to pull brake fluid down to that caliper.
We're a Miata specialist shop that unfortunately doesn't have any experience with Silverado's. Your best bet is to find a forum or FB group for those where people can help you with the specifics. Sorry we can't be more help!
The proportioning valve? Keith has had one mounted in the transmission tunnel of his Targa Miata for 14 years, and it's shared that tunnel with the exhaust system for a V8 engine for more than a decade. We've also used them in relatively close proximity to turbos for a long time. The heat capacity of the proportioning valve should not be a concern.
I mounted my valve on the tunnel in the console under the ash tray door. Today I went out in my 240Z and did several hard stops. I had turned the valve all the way out. Then I adjusted it in until the rears started to lock up, then I backed it out small amounts and retested it several times. I'll continue to fine tune for different pavement conditions and daytime temps. I'm glad my valve is accessible while driving. I also visited the Wilwood site for valve adjustment instructions and more tips on breaking in new discs and pads. Very nice video. Thank you
Great video, helped me understand what the valve does and how to properly adjust it!
@Touge_camaro Thanks for watching and we're glad it was helpful!
Really interesting and informative, will help me on my build. 👍🏽😎
Factory setup is to limit rear brake lockup. Stock setup bias to strongly to the front which is fine for street driving but can cause fronts to lock on track or autocross use if you brake very hard. I have the Wilwood valve under that hood and fixed that issues.
Thanks, Mike!
I want to use one of these for a civic brake tuck but I still have rear drum brakes. Will this work or should I go disk before buying one
Excellent video
Great video! Very informative! I've been curious if I should add one of these to my track Miata on my non-sport, non-ABS NB brakes. What's the best way to determine your rears are locking up first in straight line testing when setting the valve to the correct bias ratio?
Have a friend watch you from the side while doing a panic stop in an empty parking lot
How does the adjuster bias the pressure/ volume? . If it is restricting the flow, and the pressure is 100 psi, would it get to 100 psi, just slower? does it reduce the max pressure?
My thought as well. I guess it makes sense for short stops but for a longer stop I'd still worry about locking the rears. I guess for full force high speed braking, things like heat might matter more. I guess making sure your rear brakes are matched well to your fronts is step 1 to getting good brake bias.
Hi I really like your video it has a lot of good information and the reason that I find it is because I have a 1992 Toyota Camry wagon and I am trying to replace the rear break proportioning valve do you know or can you advise where can I find one and also I’ll like to install the pressure regulator thank you very much for your help
Also I think instead of calling pressure regulator is adjustable regulator
We appreciate it! I'm afraid we don't have solid info to share here, though - much of our expertise is specific to the Miata chassis.
I was hoping you would talk about knee points, which is how the valve actually works, as far as I know. Can you address infinite adjustment knobs vs click adjustment levers?
@baribari600 Keith did another brake proportioning video a few years ago in which he does discuss knee points. The "infinite adjustment knobs" are basically adjusting spring tension. A click adjustment lever is the same thing, but it has detents so you can more reliably hit a specific setting.
Maybe add how to bleed rear brakes with a bias valve in place because thats a headache !
Can I run the prop valve next to the master and an extension knob in the cabin like the ones for actual balance bars, brakeometer’s or allstar’s? Or it only works with Wilwood’s?
Wilwood doesn’t consider the knob removable on their proportioning valve. Balance bars are a fixed bias so they have to constantly be adjust for the right balance for given conditions, valves approximate a curve so they suit a wider range and thus don’t require as much adjustment.
Hey I got a Wheelwood proportion valve 5 ports adjustable I hope to breaks up and blend the backbreaks and started on the front winds and there's no fluid coming out to front one What's wrong
Hi, if you have time, please reach out to our support team directly. Give them a call or an e-mail and they will be more than happy to help you out!
With modern EBD, is there anything that one would need to do when upgrading brake rotors/calipers/pads piecemeal on an ND for example.
Surely biasing only begins to actively “adjust” from some default setting only AFTER slip is detected via the wheel speed sensors. This surely must have detrimental effect on limit handling when slip angles are affected by non optimal brake bias under trail braking.
This Wilwood Brake Proportioning valve will not work with the ND. The automatic system on the ND should adjust itself to a certain degree. Please feel free to reach out to our customer support team directly if you have more questions or need details. Call 970-464-5600 M-F 8-5 Mountain time or email us at support@flyinmiata.com.
😊 since I added my adjustable proportion valve when I apply the brakes it works fine. But when I release the brake pedal the rear brakes do not release
Interesting. Please email our team of technicians (support@flyinmiata.com) and we'll try to come to a resolution.
If adjust the valve to have the minimum pressure possible in the rear wheels, is there a chance of my front brake line to blow or fail (due to, all the pressure of the system going on the front lines) ?
(mk1, stock brake system, no abs)
You won’t increase the front pressure, only limit the rear. There should be no chance of over-stressing your lines.
Question if I want my rear breake to luck before the front for drifting where should I connect the valve to the rear side of the master cylinder or the front?
The rear lines. Your car should be built with the ability to lock the rear brakes, then the proportioning valve allows you to dial them back.
@@FlyinMiataVideo ok thank so if I want mostly the front breakes to luck up where should the valve install at the front breake lines correct??
@@jeromeswaby5261 No, you would still be restricting the rears. The ideal proportioning changes with weight transfer, and the knee point in the valve gets you closer to the ideal curve.
@@FlyinMiataVideo ok I have a master cylinder with 4 breake lines coming from it 2 for the front and 2 for the back so how would that connect if i connect it to one of the breake rear line what about the next rear line i dont understand ?
@@jeromeswaby5261 It might be best if you contact our technical support department. It sounds like you have an NC or ND, which have electronic brake distribution as part of the ABS system.
looking to buy a 2021 miata. what's the best trim(package) i should get if i want to do some upgrades? say is the brembo package worth the money ? or i'd be better off upgrading them myown.
The ND is a very solid platform straight from the factory, so this really comes down to personal preference and how you plan to use the car. The Brembos are a good factory upgrade, but there are better systems out there. Our Wilwood big brake kits weigh less, are more compact, and can provide more options when upgrading. If you are only doing street driving, you might not even need the Brembos. Feel free to reach out to our customer support team directly if you'd like to discuss this more detail or need our specific recommendations for your use. Call 970-464-5600 M-F 8-5 Mountain time or email us at support@flyinmiata.com. Thanks!
@@FlyinMiataVideo You guys are leaders in the Miata world, please move on to something better than junky wildwood kits that rely on pressure limiting switches as a bandaid to their lack of system engineering.
@@Firebert79TA That's not really possible - unless you're only designing for maximum deceleration under a very specific situation, you always have to be able to adjust front/rear bias and the ideal bias changes depending on the rate of decel. Miatas have been able to do it electronically for 15 years, but older ones still rely on hardware. Some brake manufacturers claim they've come up with the perfect bias by selecting different parts, but it can't be done because there is no such thing as the perfect bias for all conditions or even all braking events under a specific set of conditions. Even F1 cars have adjustable brake bias.
@@FlyinMiataVideo Of course it's possible. Stock vehicles from before electronic brake distribution systems are the clear example of this. If the brake kit manufacturer keeps the total brake torque similar for a given amount of fluid pressure similar to stock, the aftermarket pressure limiting switch is not necessary. Yes, there are many things an owner might change that would affect ideal brake balance. If you want to fine-tune and optimize the balance reliably for all scenarios, go all-in and get a balance bar and dual master cylinders. These wilwood switches are the crudest available option. These are used as cheap band-aids for half-baked brake kits that needlessly ruin balance.
Something more radical like an engine swap or aero mods should be the thing that causes a car to need different brake balance. If the weight distribution, wheel base, and center of gravity isn't that different from stock, it's silly that a brake kit alone would radically change the bias to the point of needing a pressure limiting switch.
@@Firebert79TA Stock vehicles include a proportioning valve - we have the charts for the NA and NB Miata ones on our website if you want to see them. The adjustable Wilwood one works exactly the same way as they do, only the knee point can be adjusted. The adjustable valve is not a band-aid, it's an upgrade. We feel it's an upgrade even on a stock braking system.
A balance bar and dual masters is an example of a system that only works under very specific conditions, as the proportioning is fixed and not tied to pressure (and thus rate of deceleration). So it's only optimized for one scenario. The approximation of a curve from a "pressure limiting switch" gives you a much wider range of acceptable scenarios.
Why only 1 in & 1 out? Mine had 2 each to adjust front to rear.
Mike touches on this briefly in the video. The front brakes retain full pressure, while the valve only adjusts rear pressure, to effect the balance between front and rear. The short answer is there is no need for both F&R adjustment since the purpose of the proportion valve is to adjust the balance, not the actual pressures. Feel free to give us a call or drop us an email if you have more questions or need more details!
05 honda Civic front brakes cant get fluid to brake bleeder at all and brakes are locking up
If you're not seeing brake fluid reach the caliper, first check to ensure that your reservoir cap is off. Then, check to make sure that the fluid isn't leaking from a line before it gets to that caliper. Once you've checked those things, try using the gravity bleed method, or using a vacuum bleeder to pull brake fluid down to that caliper.
Ok done all that and broke the line above the prop valve got good flow line going out of prop valve has none
So Civic is a x pattern breaking so one side has good bleed other is shitty now
And why should I have to pull fluid with a machine being that the 05 Civic don't have ABS
I have no rear brakes where is my proportioning valve on a 2006 Silverado
We're a Miata specialist shop that unfortunately doesn't have any experience with Silverado's. Your best bet is to find a forum or FB group for those where people can help you with the specifics. Sorry we can't be more help!
@@FlyinMiataVideo Thanks anyway
How much heat can one handle before they fail?
The proportioning valve? Keith has had one mounted in the transmission tunnel of his Targa Miata for 14 years, and it's shared that tunnel with the exhaust system for a V8 engine for more than a decade. We've also used them in relatively close proximity to turbos for a long time. The heat capacity of the proportioning valve should not be a concern.
Judging from the comments miata drivers have no clue..lol