The Non-Desmodromic Ducati - Why it's a Big Deal
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 31 ม.ค. 2021
- For the 2021 Ducati Multistrada, Ducati has decided to run conventional valve springs for the closing of the valves instead of its iconic desmodromic system. I'm a bit late to learn this but here's my take on it.
--------VIDEO SOURCES-------
New 2021 Kawasaki Ninja ZX-10R and ZX-10RR | Unveil and Product Review
• New 2021 Kawasaki Ninj...
Superbike Ducati 1098 Commercial
• Superbike Ducati 1098 ...
Ducati Superbike 1199 Panigale Checkmate
• Ducati Superbike 1199 ...
Desmosedici Stradale - All the features
• Desmosedici Stradale -...
Ducati Panigale V2 review | MCN | Motorcyclenews.com
• Ducati Panigale V2 rev...
SOHC vs DOHC | Autotechlabs
• SOHC vs DOHC | Autotec...
V8 Engine Motion Animation ( 3ds max )
• V8 Engine Motion Anima...
Ducati Motorcycles - History
• Ducati Motorcycles - H...
collezione privata ducati Micozzi Lauro - Ducati 100 GS denominata "Marianna"
• collezione privata duc...
The 1952 Isle of Man Senior TT Race
• The 1952 Isle of Man S...
Overhead Cam at 14K RPM
• Overhead Cam at 14K RPM
Single Valvetrain Simulation
• Single Valvetrain Simu...
Honda cbr600 engine blows on dyno
• Honda cbr600 engine bl...
Ducati 125 GP Desmo, Ducati Museum, Borgo Panigale, Bologna, Italy, Europe
• Video
Ducati Desmo Valve System at Ducati Museum Bologna (Italy) [4K]
• Ducati Desmo Valve Sys...
Ducati Desmo Valve System
• Ducati Desmo Valve System
Ducati 350cc Mark.3 Desmo - 1968 " topolino amaranto "
• Ducati 350cc Mark.3 ...
2021 Ducati Multistrada V4 S First Ride Review
• 2021 Ducati Multistrad...
MotoBros - 2017 Yamaha R6 Gauge Cluster options and shift light / red line reset
• 2017 - 22 Yamaha R6 Ga...
Ducati 848/1098/1198 Valve Adjustment Walkthrough
• Ducati 848/1098/1198 V...
__________________________________
My social media!
Instagram - / theillestrator_nyc
Facebook - / the-illestrator-191640...
Twitter - / illestratornyc - ยานยนต์และพาหนะ
I really love these kind of videos thank you for blessing me today with this video
Glad you like them!
Yessss another video essay masterpiece 😆
Thanks man, glad you enjoyed!
Top quality production yet again!!!👏👏
and Thank you again!
Watching this while its snowing outside on my off day. Priceless.
Yeahhhhhh we're dealing with that too lol
Dude. You have come such a long way. U doing it all vlogging, video essays and wrenching, all in your own unique style. I love your videos and you always reignite my passion for bikes every time I watch your videos. Even though I already know about this subject your take on it is amazing.
Please keep spreading the love of bikes and stay awesome.
Looking forward to another wrechning Project maybe. Get an old monster or smt (perfect amount of bikes ist always +1 of what you currently have :D)
Ah yes while we are at it what do you think of the new monster ? u like or hate it ?
Thanks, The great thing is that I enjoy doing all those things so its win-win.
I was actually unironically looking for an old monster for i think my third bike? at some point I was. The good thing is that I still have a ratty CB550 if I ever get the project itch again. Right now i'm just riding it in turd mode.
The new monsters look fine...they look like smaller bikes than they actually are, like in terms of displacement. I definitely like the previous design better but only when paired with a traditional round headlight....not the flat Grom looking one.
@@Theillestrator1050 haha yeah I think we all have looked into a monster at some point. But a project cb would probably look amazing too. Have seen some really nice ones online.
And I think everyone notices that you like doing these videos that's why they are so good!
Thanks for your opinion on the monster
The air cooled 2 valve desmos are pretty easy to DIY the valve clearances and rarely need adjusting after the first 3 or 4 services, furthermore there is less valve train wear because of less friction ( you can turn the cams easily by hand) so things like valve guides, valve seats, rocker shafts and camshafts tend to last very well
illestrator : Willingness to adapt when they see fit, other brands that i wont mention.."
me: *cough cough* HARLEY *cough*
Lmao, someones definitely been paying attention
Just wait, Harley's ready to make Ill eat his words in a few weeks.
They didnt half ass the Livewire either.
Amazing video, yet again. Your historic type videos are by far my favorite collection out of anything on TH-cam. Good stuff
Glad you enjoy them
Great history lesson and engineering explained simply at the same time - much appreciated!
i love these vids! Keep em coming, they are your best!
Glad you like them!
Great video man. Gave me some history and some understanding of the engineering behind these awesome bikes. Cheers
really great video. i always knew desmos closed the valves manually but it’s cool to see exactly how they work. thank you 👍
for context:
I've been a happy owner of a 2012 Monster 1100 EVO for nearly 9 years now. So long as you're not constantly tracking the thing or ragging on it every time that you take it out, the valvetrain service intervals become more of a regular check than a required part replacement. The shims that are used in the SOHC air-cooled engines are far more robust than their high-strung racing counterparts, and are far more friendly to the DIY-er than one might initially think.
At this point I have conducted the last 3 vavletrain services of my own accord in my own garage, and have only replaced 1 shim so far. While the Desmo system can appear complex and convoluted at a glance; once you have a foundational understanding of how the system works and what you're actually looking for, it's by-and-far one of the easiest systems to work on with a simple, basic toolset. The most expensive part of valvetrain service is the timing belts, but even then, they're not really braking the bank, considering that they cost around $150 USD to replace. The main reason that they cost so much more than typical timing belts from most automotive applications is due to the requirement for high-heat resistance. Keep in mind that these are air-cooled engines, which require ambient airflow around the cylinder heads to keep them cool. Some of that hot air is going to surround the timing belt under normal operation at all times, and the belt cannot excessively stretch or wear out because of it. But once you put that little hiccup behind you, doing a simple teardown of the bike (removing the gas tank and the airbox), everything's right out in the open and easily accessible.
First time viewer - impressive video with great pace (!) Awesome!
Excellent video! Subscribed!
You truly are one of my favorite smaller channels man
I love these videos man! No doubt some of the best educational motorcycle videos out there!...
I appreciate that!
I just wanted to turn the sound on and do my work...but this is full of serious visuals so I had to fully concentrate on this video alone. Thanks for nice vids as always
You totally own this type of content, it's absolutely fantastic ♥️
Thanks man!
Great video, maybe the best on Ducati on youtube yet, excellent. One thing you might have missed though about Ducati history, and this is a nuance only hardcore Duc people know, is that originally Ducati did not intend for L twin road bikes to be Desmodromic. Dr. T wanted that from the beginning, but the change in company management in 1974 caused them to pursue the concept that base models would have standard springs, with Desmo as a high performance only option. After the failure of the mid seventies and the 860 series, Dr. T was given more control and he had the vision of Desmo across all engines. He also nixed the horrendous 500 twins. Since 1977, Desmo has been king.
I was hesitant to click on the 14 minute video but you packed like 8 hours of info in there. And it all made sense at the end. Bravo! 👌🏼🤣👍🏾 New sub.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Nicely done Sir.
It's been a long time old friend.
It's been good to catch up.
Great content!
The man with the magic voice drops another gem on us.
Thanks for watching!
Since Ducati built its legacy on being the first volume manufacturer to effectively utilize and mass produce an innovative (for its day) valve train I wish they’d transition to pneumatic valves ala F1 or Koeningsegg’s Freevalve system. I get that springs have come a long way but for Ducati to play it safe by doing what everyone else is doing is not what they built their reputation on. Motorcycling comes with inherent personal risks, Ducati as a company took risks. It was through the mutual understanding that risk equals reward that greatness was achieved.
I am so glad I came across this video! Hands down the best motorcycle video commentary I've ever heard. About your who had the "first" naked bike a lot of European magazines hailed the 1999 (2000 u.s.) Aprilia Tuono 1000 V-twin as the bike that started the true mass produced streetfighter. That was my dream bike and 17 years later I bought a new 2017 Aprilia Tuono RR. Dumped $1300 in performance mods and pretty much on par with today's superbikes regarding horsepower with 176whp on the dyno which is roughly 195 flywheel.
The Desmo system and the dry clutches (that sound like a broken engine!) that they stuck with for years are why I have solid respect for Ducati too. Fab vid 👍
Thanks man
The last days of proven technology are better than the first days of a new technology ha. (You can use that.)
We've been waiting for these!!!
Dang good video man, love this style!
Thanks for watching!
@@Theillestrator1050 Thanks for making the videos, all of your recent videos have been fire!
Perfectly explained!
Glad you liked it
Always love your vids, you should do one on why Ducati loves the dry clutch so much.
Thanks alot man, glad you enjoyed. I wonder if theres enough substance there
Well, it's summarized quite easily in one sentance: Ducati stands for performance bikes and dry clutches have less friction, so more power to the wheel, so more performance.
That was a really great video, I'm no mechanic and I'm not really sure why I clicked on this video in the first place 🤷♂️, but I couldn't stop watching it. 👍😎🇨🇦
Lmao, Glad I could make the topic enjoyable
everytime I see a Ducati I remember the revzilla video about the Ducati losing to a GSX from 2005 lol
the bike looks amazing tho
Many bikes would lose to a 1984 Magna 1100
#VivaLaDave
I remember that one...definitely not the outcome I expected. Still dont understand how!
Nice video dude, good research.
Thanks!
Wooo a great way to start another week at work.
Hope you enjoyed!
That was such a pleasure to watch
Well done bro 🤙🏾
Thanks 💯
15 👎(as of this posting 2-5-'21) ? Why ?
This guy ("The illestrator") is good. 👍👍
OMG he is alive and is back!!!
Yup! Good to see ya
Great video 👌🏻
Glad you enjoyed it
Awesome video!
Glad you enjoyed it
Man I miss these videos! 😎👍
More to come!
Fantastic video! Desmo was helping in racing when fuel quantity got limited for many recent years but kudos to them for not sticking with it on things not needing it. They typically build things in the most difficult way possible....just because they can, I guess. They stir my soul and heart but I bought an SV1000S in 03 due to dealership availability. Nearest Ducati dealership is 5 to 6 hour drive to me.
Well said. It's definitely often a matter of "because we can" and they definitely charge for the privilege lol
Had a 2007 1100 S Air Cooled Multistrada, best engine and gearbox setup I've even driver or owned (in 30+ years). Just smooth, linear, predictable and fun. Controlled power slides coming out of corners with the front end off the ground was fun. But as you stated, the 7K valve maintenance was a killer on a daily commuting bike. Switch to Yamaha 1200 SuperTen (2 of them, 2012 and 2016 ES) and never touched the valves adjustment for 35k+ miles. But no more power slides.......
I’m no professor, but if I assigned a research paper and you handed me this video instead, I’d give you an A for the semester and tell you don’t worry about coming in
Now........ if only a certain American motorcycle manufacturer could have made the transition out of signature technologies and adapted as well as Ducati has.....
HEY! He's back on an (somewhat) regular uploading schedule!... :P
Oh regular is so hard to keep lmao. I'll just stick with somewhat.
2019 my new wife and I visited the ducati factory in bologna for a factory tour,we got to see where our bikes were built and the people that built them,were both ducati fans ,my wife had a monster 821 at the time and me a 1200r then we decided due to covid to go for one ducati and our classic bikes, we chose the multistrada 1260 pikes peak,an epic bike pulls like a tractor instant torque and a top end like the r so not sure we will be looking at the new V4 ,I had a Aprillia tuono 1100r ,it was a weapon but the bottom was lacking compared to a Vtwin so we will test drive it but unless they have really made it like a Vtwin but still have the top end we will look elsewhere or just keep what we have .
Excellent
Better and better. Well done. You should get picked up by a publication.
Glad you enjoyed!
Why doesn’t this video have a million views ?
Lmao, I'm a little fish on TH-cam it's fine
Bravo 👍👍🤙
I own a 20 V4S. Great vid thanks. That said the bike "sings" to me. Meaning there is a resonance there, and you can hear it. Not sure what its due to but ive owned many diff brands and ive never heard that before this. I feel the bike does have a soul and i give him kisses all the time. Ha my dog gets jealous.
its the firing order, makes the engine sounds something in between an inline 4 and a v-twin. Aprilia's V4 gives a similar feeling. Im happy for your great choiche, have fun :D
Loves these boss ✊🏿✊🏿
Thanks for watching!
If Ducati is ready to ditch desmo to get an edge on the track you bet they're even ready to introduce e-bikes into the mix for the sake of sales in the newly introduced segment
Agree this is a big deal for Ducati and it’s wonderful to see Ducati show some real passion to make the best motorcycles in the world according to its design specifications. Ducati has also paved the way for another world first with the multistrada being blind spot monitoring and radar assisted cruise control on a bike.
I love my 899.
As you should 🔥
Droppin knowledge
Great content!!! 🔥🔥🔥🔥Do you have patreon ???
Thanks! I have one but I deactivated it for the time being. Once I find another cause worthy of it, I may reopen it. Thanks for asking
The 1098R was also 1200 cc, just for reference
WSBK bikes have nothing in common with road bikes...maybe only the frame. Kawasaki is the SBK winner not because its road bike is the best, but bc the package Rea+team works incredibly well together
37,000-mile service interval is a big deal.
They made great Radios
Get you facts right, the engineers calculated torque and horse power to power to weight ratio, Ducati 18 period!!!! and V4 is just another marvel.......
i just wish us normal people had more options for the V4 engine note
Zero dislikes!
Don't speak too soon about that lol
So Ducati has now invented the 1984 Yamaha VMax? These Italians are so clever.
Maybe now i can stop getting comments about reliability when other bikers talk about my Monster. Otherwise Top Notch production. I think you set standard for anyone who makes a mix of Vblog and history/info content.
Thanks man, thats very high praise.
Valve adjustments on v4 Ducatis have to be like Subaru blown headgaskets. It's a ~$2000 service that's just sort of looming. I guess the difference is if you have Panigale money floating around your bank account, $2000 is toilet paper.
You'd think...but you know theres people out there who buy a ducati but cant actually afford to lol
@@Theillestrator1050 yeah, we got em like that out here too, seems like newer riders too, as far as I can tell.
At least the modern bikes have TCS and ABS and all that now. When I was young and dumb we had the first gen zx10r, a bike that probably should have required health insurance to buy.
Yessirr
Salute!
I ride the sv1k, but I always wondered how two extra twin cylinders would feel.
Ah man, makes me sorta miss my old Ess Vee
You don’t know what you’re talking about! Heavy valve springs reduce valve float and close the valves faster! The way to go now is no cam engine with electric solenoid operated valves (Koenigsegg)
The comment for slow and hard actuation is specifically at low RPM, and the situation for float I used was meant to imply that the stronger springs could be pushed to higher RPM, but with a catastrophic risk of it.
I just cant deal with the idea of $2200 a pop service and that is only if everything is still A okay who knows how much some are paying if they have to tear off the tops of the motor....or worse. I have heard riders mentioning thier ducati buddy's bike "sucked a valve" but the actual rider themselves when you finally see em many weeks later? They dont seem interested in discussing. I think I'll just keep the Ducs out of my own life thank you....and Ferrari and Mazaratti too!
How "necessary" were they really back in the day, if only 2 Merc race cars ran them? I hear the metallurgy argument but really.. 2 race cars... that's it. I love the system, it has an Industrial Revolution clickity-clack contraption appeal to it, but $3000 in valve servicing after 13,000 miles? The system needs to address the harshness of how it works. One could say the problem is METALLURGY.
I didnt even know this :D thanks! Now just the question is.. why dont they go then even higher rpm? They should be able to do a 20.000 rpm 1200cc, no? :D that would be cool :D
Man, I feel like that would rattle fillings out of your head lol
This is what you do best. And better than anybody else. 👏
Now... Is it me or does that guy shown riding the Multi not know how to ride? He looked a little unstable. Or too small for the bike. Or something.
Check out the current controversy around the riding position of Motorcyclist Magazine's senior test rider Adam Child for the 2021 Triumph Trident First Ride Review. Eerily similar horrible body position.
SV650NYC - As if a novice rider. But some bikes just don't look right with a rider onboard.
The number one offender is a Harley V Rod. If it's your style it's not a bad looking bike when parked, but put a rider on it and he looks stupid with its low seat and forward foot pegs.
The V Rod makes people look stupid.
Thats definitely one of the biggest giveaways for a beginner rider. Its always somewhat funny, somewhat concerning when you see that horrid beginner form on a bike not meant for a novice. I always mutter to myself "dude what are you doing on that" XD
@@Theillestrator1050 Funny thing is that Adam Child is a multiple top 10 racer in the Isle of Man TT. So people are at a loss to understand his body position in that video. Maybe even fast riders can have bad form?
SV650NYC - I didn't know that about Adam Child. A top 10 IOMTT rider is no joke, let alone multiple times.
Okay, Pizano: Loving the moto = ya gotta also love la lingua. 'Gli in Italian is pronounced like the L-L-I in "millions". The G is so soft (never a hard "TAGG") it's almost entirely swallowed and becomes a phantom Y-sound. Try saying *TAHL-yee-OH-nee* .
Oh, and my fellow Mr. Brooklyn? That garbled cool burbling from our own borough is not strictly Italian ("capicola, prosciutto, capisce?"), it's Sicilian (GABAHGOOL! BRAHZHOOT! GAHBEESH!?) Italy wasn't even unified as a nation until around 1861 and there are massive cultural and dialectical divides between (for example) northern engineers (engines, banking, white sauce, blue-eyed blondes) who are neighbors to the Swiss, and, say, my own famiglia's native Calabria (dark hair, lemon trees, rocks, bullets). In other words, don't take formal pronunciation lessons from any Brooklynite. Ciao.
.
Ha! Thank you for the crash course d'italiano!
I dont think they will ditch the 90' v aprillia has gone to a 90 in their motogp bike
You know, I never thought they'd pull the last two paradigm shifts either so at thise point i'm just curious lol
They need to put this engine in a naked bike. 160 hp is more than plenty for anyone to have fun on the road.
There is actually a V4 streetfighter you know right?
@@Theillestrator1050 Not one with the non-desmo engine.
I’m sure this is a great clip with lots of useful info. I’m quite a good non-native English speaker, but this dear gentleman speaks a mileandahalf too fast for me.
For your next video, the following tip: breath occasionally.
Sorry to hear that, but I'm sure you can get this info elsewhere
Shit boy I been out the trade too long!
Well Harley aint halfassing it this time. That Livewire and the new RevoMAX is a full departure. if that 1250 PanAm really makes 145hp at the crank, Indian's about to get that ass slapped, because then their scout and FTR and PowerPlus engines are all outclassed by harley's new DOHC. Even better is that the revomax is a modular system unlike the scout, FTR, and PP.
The fact is Desmo valve train has been irrelevant tech for a while now
On the street maybe. On the race track... I don't know if you pay attention to MotoGP or WSBK but Ducati has had the most powerful bikes on those grids for a few years now and there are no springs or pneumatic valves to be found.
Lol Certainly "unnecessary" for a while now. I don't know, I kinda like the idea of taking something and making it your "thing". Its pretty impressive how far they've taken the concept.
Ducati also know how unreliable desmodromic is... The valve run dry for the first 10 second after engine started, always broke down due to mechanical movement fatigue, high desmo maintenance and so on, so on...harley stand their ground to used push rod, but people bash them for using old technology, but it is the same goes to the desmo valve, it is old technology and as just unreliable technology as push rod, people drooling "oooo, desmo is a good thing" smh
I'm not a harley guy, and more in love with ducati motorcycle .... but man, this fan boy bashing other motor brand, need to stop. Just enjoy it, if you don't like it, keep it to you self or in the forum for discussion
so there's that.... 🤣
Valve springs ?
Bye bye horsepower
Bye bye magic.
No desmo, no trellis frame no Ducati. It's a two wheeled Audi.
Ducati will always run desmodromic valve trains on their high-performance bikes because they generate more power compared to spring run valve trains and they always will regardless of the improvements in metallurgy. The reason they are running standard springs on the Multistrada is because it is not required for the speed regime specified but most of all the reduced maintenance allowed by the longer service Interval. It is a very mature decision by Ducati. They could have easily stuck with desmo valves on this new model but it would have been an unnecessary cost to their customers, ultimately hurting sales. Good engineering means doing what is required, nothing else, and in this situations desmo valves are simply not required.
One day I'll understand why they don't just add another two gears.
Like in the transmission?
@@Theillestrator1050 yap, Maybe my ignorance is showing but I bet its easier to keep the rpms in the powerband with more gears closer together. Shouldn't have to rev to the moon =)
May be they will ditch RED the next. May be they have started already. Subtly but evidently 😋
BROOKLYNNNNN
now, if they'd just put these in the monster... Desmo is what keeps me away from ducati..
"But we've always done it this way" is a common refrain of stubborn idiots. I always thought the H E R I T A G E thing (from a well know Heritage branD) was silly. Their bikes made massive tech improvements for 50+ years and then at some point they looked at their huge pile of boomer cash and decided, "yeah, this is it. From now on, this is tradition."
Once bikes hit a certain level of performance I think they just exceeded average rider ability. The same people praising those MOTORS are also likely to tout their experience/mileage over their actual riding proficiency.
LMAO, "Heritage branD" definitely killed me. Yeah, you picked up on the snide remark.
Sorry im late please forgive me 🥺
Better late than never cuhh
Oh btw bruv. My username before was MasterNishk but TH-cam is shit and to transfer my music I had to merge my accounts and now my name and pic changed. And the same fella on Instagram/patreon. Think all my comments with the old account on your other videos got deleted too :( anywho, got an idea for something passionate to talk about: 2021 marks the end of the supersports bike era. Why? All the well known 600cc pure breed sportsbikes have been dropped by their Japanese makers. Honda gave up the 600RR ages ago. Suzuki hasn't significantly updated the gsxr600 since like 2011 and now kawi and Yamaha straight dropped theirs. No more ninja 600/636 period and the new R6 is only for the track bcos euro5 won't allow it to be road legal. My poor absent minded friends said "but apprilia just released an rs660 and Honda's cbr650r is great!" Pfffft fuck off. The cbr650 is a detuned sports tourer pretending to look like it would do well on the track and the rs660 is a fucking parallel twin. Then my guy goes "well maybe the demand realises it's better value to go for a thousand cc 4 banger" and I almost slapped him. Yamaha R1 base is almost £13k while the kawi 636 last year base was 9k. The number of hobby racers are going to decline now bcos it's too big a leap from casual road biker to track day junkie now and I think it's sad. For the last 3 decades, if you wanted to start doing track days. You can get an relatively cheap 600cc brand new or used to take to the track and it won't get be as overwhelming as a litre class. And then increase your skills up until the bigger bike stage. But if they're not being made anymore and we have weak protégé replacement then it's gonna die out with less supply to the resale market and sportsbikes will be reserved for rich/talented 1000cc buyers leaving the rest of us to settle for comfortable road bikes (I love my speed triple but I always liked the idea of 600cc sportsbikers)
Oh yeah! MasterNishk I definitely remember ya. You've been commenting alot under Tin Man and I figured "This guy has to have been around a while but why don't I recognize the avatar?"
Thats actually a pretty good subject, I wrote it on my whiteboard just now as something to consider.
Ducati not winning wsbk has nothing to do with engine or valves. Rea would win in any bike.
Tell Scott Redding that Ducati not winning wsbk! LOL
Terrible reliability and prima donna servicing is hurting their sales.
I would personally never buy a ducati for those reasons.
First
First indeed
I’ll say it, Harley Davidson should be taking notes from Ducati on how to be a luxury brand with heritage, and from Triumph on how to be a heritage brand.
...and the dumbest quote of the day goes to