The Initiative • S04E07 • TPN's Buffy Guide
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 17 ก.ย. 2024
- Episode 7 gets all episode seven-y and I decided that being on break was boring,
Patreon: / passionofthenerd
Twitter: / iannitram
Facebook Page: / thepassionofthenerd
Facebook Forum: / 1395995467105368
Tumblr: / thepassionofthenerd
Subreddit: / thepassionofthenerd
Website: www.thepassiono...
Discord: / discord
Amazon: www.amazon.com...
Source:
Buffy the Vampire Slayer: Myth, Metaphor & Morality
Mark Field
amzn.to/2LHW1JK
The Bronze Forum Archive
www.cise.ufl.e...
Opening Titles by AM
Channel: / @amupdates
Twitter: @AM_Updates_
Music Credits:
"Favorite Secrets" by Waylon Thornton
/ waylonthornton
Other music by Wil Hughes
www.wilhughes.com/
The Passion of the Nerd
P.O. Box 20161
Boulder, CO
80308
Passion of the Nerd reviews The Initiative From Buffy the Vampire Slayer, Season 4, Episode 7. Directed by James A. Contner. Written by Douglas Petrie. Starring Sarah Michelle Gellar as Buffy Summers. Nicholas Brendon as Xander Harris. Alyson Hannigan as Willow Rosenberg. James Marsters as Spike. And Anthony Stewart Head as Rupert Giles. Guest Starring Marc Blucas as Riley Finn. And Mercedes McNab as Harmony Kendall.
James Marsters could have chemistry with a rock. How is he so likeable as a murderous monster lol
Same way he was in Smallville, Supernatural and Runaways, dude is charming
Actually, he did demonstrate that all the way back in Season two with Acathla's Big Rock monologue.
This is so accurate lol
New theory based on Willow telling Riley that Buffy likes Cheese: In Restless the Cheese man is a metaphor for Riley consistently trying to find his place within the group and never really succeeding.
Hmmmmm...I like it.
I like that😂
The Xander/Harmony fight: most epic of fight of all the fights in all the Buffyverse.
Spike has great chemistry with everyone.
The scene with Spike and Willow. I fucking love them.
Xander vs. Harmony is one of the best fights of the entire series. It ranks slightly above the invisible fight between Buffy and The Trio in season 6.
It’s topped only by Faith vs the Vulcan in S7.
I think Eliza is involved in some of the most exciting and creative fights of the whole verse. Her ones with Buffy always hit the mark, and the ones with Angel and co. in Five by Five are just stunning. But yeah as a good bit of goofy comedy in keeping with their characters the one in this episode is great fun!
Yes I'd forgotten that fight against "the most pacifist of races"
But I'd like to give honorable mention to Spike vs. Muppet Angel
Xander vs Harmony, hubby & I like to recreate that one and then laugh like idiots. My other favorite fight is Puppet Angel vs Spike. So hilarious!
Spike would have won. He was just laughing too hard.
I always thought it was interesting that Riley only admitted he liked Buffy after Walsh said that she liked her, thereby giving him implicit permission to do likewise. Very soldier boy! Great review, as always Ian.
I always thought Prof Walsh wanted to communicate to the students that there was a dangerous "animal" on the loose that could harm innocent people, but wanted to appear as clueless as possible.
my thoughts too.
I like it.
To be fair, it's not the first time this actress has played an outwardly professional, but underhanded villain. She portrayed a vengeful scorned therapist in a 1989 Columbo television movie.
To be fair 100lb Willow doesn't attack the Initiative guys; Spike throws her into them.
And 100 lbs of Willow with some velocity behind her absolutely could knock some people over.
Head-canon time: Willow used magic to make her body denser.
Why didnt Joss just add a scene with Maggie saying. "Hostile 17 escaped? Activate the behavioural modification chip!"
That's a really good idea.
I love Spike's reference to Willow's fluffy pink sweater from Lovers Walk.
I always thought that Spike was able to escape and beat people up was because the chip hadn't been activated yet. Once he escapes they activate the chip.
Good point. Looks like you had an idea that even Joss didn't have LOL
This is also what I tell myself to make the universe make sense again. :)
MrGeekFreek That’s the only thing I could come up with and even it doesn’t make sense. They were doing operate conditioning. Therefore they’d want the chip active in the facility. Plus why have them able to potentially attack and hurt/kill the men if they has a way of neutering them.
Yeah that’s a good point and makes sense for the fact that first off spike struggles to fight the doctors the other vampire is telling him to hurry up and he says just a minuet mate
That's what I thought as well.
Spike remembering an outfit Willow wore way back when is PERFECT I LOVE SPIKE FIGHT ME
This was the second time Spike was able to have a venting moment with Willow first one was in lovers walk and Spike even makes a call back saying in that episode he would have totally sired her.
That's a thing about Spike's character. He is evil, but he also seems just sort of happy to chat and hang. Like when he showed up at Buffy's house to drain Joyce and frame Angel... but first, he doesn't mind having a chat over a cuppa with someone's mum. It's classic Spike.
MichelleZB he did that with Dawn also
Yeah, but not really so much when he was actually *evil*. He made friends with Dawn in Season 5 when he was sort of only evilish.
MichelleZB I still count it he didn't have a soul yet and as season 6 showed Spike still Was evil
Oh, sure, sure, I won't quibble that point! Obviously there was some character development, some trajectory to his journey towards becoming a hero, and it's not really important what stage you feel he was at when. Our main point was that even when he was evil, he was still... well, chatty! He's a chatty guy.
Also telling, I suppose, in the way that both Riley and Spike approach her metaphorical "spirit."
Love this observation.
A new TPN's Buffy guide, YES!
I love Spike and Willow chemistry... i mean, i hate the things Spike does to Will in Lovers Walk and The Initiative but the conversations are SO funny
I actually find this is a thread throughout the series. Willow and Spike seem understand one another better than anyone else understands either of them (except Dru wrt Spike, but she's special--for a number of reasons).
I agree! And thats why is so weird, funny and interesting to watch the scenes between the two. Wish they had talked to each other a little more during the series
Aquiles Rodrigues ngl, back in the day, i shipped them and they were my only ship! even read fanfics of them. they just have really good chemistry.
:from this episode on James Marsters is added as a "series regular" and replaces Seth Green in the opening credits (he also came to fill the void left by Charisma Carpenter who split for "Angel") and this also places us firmly into season 4.
My two possible headcanons regarding Spike and the chip: either the chip was activated by the Initiative when Spike escaped or simply he wasn't intending to hurt the scientists/soldiers, just toss them out of the way.
I like the idea that the chip wasn't activated until after he escaped. When he's fighting the guys in the dorm you can hear him saying, "Ow, my head." I always wondered about his escape from the scientists and figured it was a huge booboo. Then in season 7 he mentions they used drugs on him when the pain got too bad, so I thought, "Ah! Maybe whatever they used was still in his system at the time of his escape and that's why he could hurt the scientists." But I knew I was reaching to explain a possible screw up in storyline. lol
Renzo García just literally commented the same thing then saw your comment. My thoughts exactly that the chip was not fully activated at that point and also was drugged so perhaps any pain was numbed. Once the drugs wear off and he is loose the chip is now fully "on" .. i assumed this was what happened so finding out whedon says there was a mistake is funny, i never caught he mistake at all haha
Renzo García yeah... Spike not intending to hurt people... that works.
Spike's E.D. metaphor was my favorite scene of the whole season.
I feel like the Initiative (the organization, not the episode title) is a case of "what could have been." On the surface, the idea of a secretive government organization that not only acknowledges the presence of monsters, but tries to study them is a fantastic one. But I think, in a lot of ways, the execution of that potentially amazing plot point failed. Not failed as in "good lord, this is horrible," but failed as in "man, this could have been so much better..."
The seasons for me are split between developed and non-developed Big Bads. On one side are Faith & the Mayor, Spike/Angelus, Dark Willow/Trio. On the other are Adam/The Initiative, The First, and Glory. The Master doesn't really fit into either category as he's a bit of a toon and was a warmup from a short season.
But anyway I prefer the Big Bad's in category 1 as theres enough depth to not make their screen time solely reliant on how well the actor can chew scenery. And right, the Initiative worked conceptually but, as I was trying to get at here, may have been a bit too ambitious for what Buffy as a show does WELL. Small sets like the library and the magic box. Small intimate scenes. Usually when the show becomes overburdened by scope it slips into camp. Primary exception being The Gift.
Whereas Angel as a show handled scope better (i.e., Wolfram & Hart), while still managing to give us the smaller, more intimate sets and moments we crave.
Passion of the Nerd Adam is the worst thing about season 4, that's where it took a decline for me into less interesting territory
Awesome commentary as always. I remember this episode as kind of a surprise as well, having not figured out who the commandos were. Also, I think 'bromandos' is a better word to describe them than 'brolgiers'.
I like your pun-game.
Broldiers looked good on paper but didn't roll off the tongue.
defrostedrobot77 or Fernando?
or an ABBA song
Angel 107 is up next. I'm reviewing that show as it aired.
Passion of the Nerd Please more buffy guides. please contact netflix and tell them to bring buffy back
I sometimes think I'm the only Buffy fan who liked Riley. The way he is here is definitely why -- cutting off his bros when they start with the objectification, making friends with WIllow, and generally being a non-broody type. It was refreshing.
The scene with Willow and Spike is one of the classics. And the best thing about the comedy is that it totally makes sense from either point of view, given the characters.
And with the Spike / Willow scene, there's the wonderful look of realization of her face after she says "why don't we wait a half hour and try again?" that she just willingly offered her life to Spike, and she hits him with the lamp. Up until that point she's just being her natural helpful Willow, until she realizes what the conclusion of her help will be.
babs3241 I like Riley, I like Dawn, hell I even like Warren! No no I went too far there. Warren not so much. I don't know why so many Buffy fans hate these characters. Even if they are annoying, they are still created by Joss and that makes even his most unimaginative character better than anything else on tv.
Here maybe, but later on when he learns Buffy is stronger than he can ever be and can't deal with that not so much.
You aren't the only one! I really liked Riley - even later on. Riley fans FTW!
Im a Riley fan too! Well, i prefer Spike and Angel over Riley, but still. He's an awesome character and i absolutely love him.
Also i like Dawn, Connor, Andrew, Xander... darn. I love every single hated character.
The Xander/Harmony fight is my absolute favorite fight in the series! There's just something so fun about it.
Hey hey, welcome back :) Awesome video once again, however I was wondering. When Spike escapes the Initiative and kills the few scientists; I could have sworn that Forest has a line saying that they have now activated the chip and that it would work from that point then in the scene outside willows dorm he doesn't do anything to drastic in terms of damage (Probably thanks to the editing) but yeah; Always got an eye on Spike when he attacks anything. I think I am remembering it wrong but yeah I always assumed they put the chip in then activated it as a result of him escaping like it was always a fail safe.
Riley says the chip is functioning AFTER the dorm scene. He can't hurt anyone without intense neurological pain. And yet if you watch the Dorm scene slowly he is throwing and hurting people. He may have thrown Willow into the soldiers. Later Spike says the chip triggers from the THOUGHT of hurting someone. If he knows he's not going to he can go right up to the point before he does with no pain. And yet...tossing Willow...
Yeah, I would say the scenes definitely reek of a muddy set of rules and it would leave many fans guessing, they are far more consistent with his chip there-after. I did skip through the episode and I couldn't find anything to really set in that it wasn't a mistake because both you or Joss would surely have found it if there was a justification but when I watch it with friends I make the claim that he was just pushing people........ (He isn't doing any harm, thats whyyyyy...try not to think about it....)
@@MauLerYT maybe the chip has to adapt to each individual and thus takes a while to "learn" how to read spikes thoughts, hence its inconsistent activation early on.
The only head canon I've ever been to put together regarding the chip was that it was only recently initialized and not fully operational until it had some "input parameters", i.e. stimuli to analyze and respond to. Biting: way over the line, shock. Grabbing by the neck: eh, don't know yet, I'll file that one for analysis. Throwing people: file and re-analyze. Eventually it has enough empirical data to start shocking Spike at even the subtlest moments of violence. Maybe I should have whispered that in Joss' ear back in 1999.
The one thing that really bothered me about the chip was how it seemed to know if what/who Spike was hitting was human when Spike himself didn't. It had no way of knowing that. It wasn't magical.
The MMonster Presumably it has some limited outer scanning capability. It’s not picking Spike’s brain to see if he thinks what he’s attacking is human but checking the surrounding area for human life forms. Parameters for human is input into the chop so it can tell the difference between a human and say a vampire which is close. Likewise this is why it registers revived Buffy as non human. Her physical makeup is just different enough from its parameters that it claims her as non human. It’s not testing for magic just for set definition of biological makeup. Otherwise the chip wouldn’t go off against a slayer or a witch as it would detect magic and say “go nuts”.
oh this is really good
I also noticed Spike hurt humans to escape. It's impossible not to notice (just like Harry Potter not seeing the thestrals in his way back home in book 4). Yes, it's mostly throwing them after the editing (and I just found out there was editing), but the very first thing he does is grab a guy's throat.
Glad to see you back, Ian. Breaks are sooo overrated!
I felt like Spike's introduction to season 4 felt super forced. But I have a lot of trouble complaining about it because of how much I like Spike lol.
His introduction didn't feel at all forced to me. Him sticking around, that's another matter. Though not that I could really complain.
well him sticking around to get the chip out.
I'd say that to be a kind of forced introduction, it was really well made. It was a huge headache for the writers, who needed to figure out a valid way to make him fit into the scoobies. Sometimes I wonder if the whole Initiative plot was created only because of him
Austin's Obsession Productions I thought it felt perfectly natural. Spike originally came to kill Buffy, which makes perfect sense, and he stayed because of the chip, which also makes perfect sense.
I do agree with you tsukigalleta. For what may or may not have been forced, they did do a really good job of it, but the storyline may very well have been made just to get a fan favorite character back on the show. That's what it felt like when they brought Spike back. He's a fan favorite, so how can we make him a regular on the show? He's supposed to hate them, he's supposed to try and kill them. He can't be the big bad AGAIN. So they give him an impotence chip so he can be one of the scoobies. And if fans liked Druscilla better, I'm sure they would've figured out a way to get her to be a scooby instead of Spike. The chip felt like it was just a mcguffin to permanently wedge him back into the show. That being said, I'm not sorry they did it, because seasons 5-7 have some incredible Spike moments. Hard not to love the guy lol.
It is funny how likable Riley is in this episode, and I always try to figure out where exactly the writers lost the charm his characters have.
I don't know if I agree that Season 4 is Buffy's funniest, though it is damn funny. A lot of the humor can be specifically ascribed to useless Giles and chipped Spike, rather than the whole cast and all the writing be funny, at least for me. Season 3 I find has stronger comedic work between Band Candy, the Zeppo, Doppelgangland, etc. Might just be me though. Hugely looking forward to Something Blue, and Restless when we eventually get there
I think they lose him a bit with the insecurity complex as the Initiative crumbles.
I find Xander and Anya's interactions hilarious too
tsukigalleta Agreed, though I love them in pretty much every season
As much as I don't think Riley really fits comfortably within the overall narrative or the Scooby ensemble dynamic, I have to admit that almost all of his little character moments really work for me. Being from the midwest myself, he really does strike me as being a spot on representation of a certain type I know very well. He's not a bad character (or actor) by any means, just not the one this particular shows needs.
@@PassionoftheNerd for me the biggest problem with Riley is how much his relationship with Buffy progresses off screen. Some of these season 4 episodes take place weeks apart, let alone the months long difference between 4 ending and 5 starting. Everybody loves to make Willow and Tara one of the shows most epic romances(and it is) but really they only ever even knew each other for 2.5 years and weren't even together for all of it. They meet halfway through 4 and break-up halfway through six and get together again the day before she dies.
Yay!! I always like the Spike/Willow moments. Loved that he remembered her pink fuzzy sweater with the lilac underneath. It fits with him. Nice catch on parallel with Riley/Willow and Spike/Willow scenes.
Ok, you know, its funny - regarding Spike fighting his way out of the Initiative and the chip not working...I have watched Buffy since its original airing and have re-watched it more times than I can count. For some reason, I always had believed that the chip was implanted but it wasn't ACTIVATED until he escaped. Watching this guide and realizing it was a goof, I realize I have NO IDEA where I seemed to get that from. It's never stated, it's not referenced, I don't know why I thought this. But this is part of the reason I *LOVE* these guides - I see things I haven't seen before. I make connections and understand things better having watched them. Thank you so much, I really love these guides!
I also like Riley in this episode. If he'd stayed this way, I might have continued. Poor guy.
You don't know how much this made my day. This is my last day of spring break and I was hoping you would post one and right when I gave up hope you prevailed!
Wow. It has been awhile since I've seen this episode b/c I was legitimately frightened when Spike came into Willow's room. Also, nice noticing the parallels with Riley and Spike (I never noticed that before). Ahhh yes the Initiative and what comes next....my least favorite "Big Bad" tied only with Season 7's Big Bad. On the other hand, one of the funniest episodes in Buffy is right around the corner :)
I KNEW you were going to post today! I was just re-watching some guides last night thinking it MUST be nearing that time again. Yay!
Xander and Harmony should have gotten their own buddy-cop comedy!
If you think about it, the fact that Spike got in and out of those places and past/through all those people without "hurting" a human being is actually a testament to how dangerous and skilled he is in a tight place.
It's not perfect, but I like this episode. Not least of all because of when Riley punched the douche, Buffy pummeled the commandos , and Spike... well actually he sorta just brushed up against people. And another great review!
Love this episode for it's humor--the "slap fight" between Xander and Harmony, the great witticism between Willow and Spike, the dry humor of Giles and Xander...as for Riley as the "love interest,"--he definitely grew on me.
Another great one, Ian!
The Iniciative is totally The Little Rascalls. The name brings me that feeling of "We're man, we have to interfere somehow. That's what we do, even when nobody needs us to". SPOILER ALERT: that becomes so clear when Riley tries to help Buffy in her slaying and only gets in her way".
FINALLY! Bless your heart! I've spent the day Buffying via Passion.... and lost the strand at ep s04ep5..... I NEEDED this today!
I have to say i always quite enjoyed season 4. Nice to see the return of the guide. Thank you :)
I think the chip just needed to adapt to Spike before it could work properly (as someone suggests in the comments). It took Spike some time to figure out that it was activating based on his intent. Spike's intent at the Initiative and the dorm was to escape, not to attack, so it didn't activate the chip. When he attacked Willow, his intent was clearly to kill her. Once the chip registered that, it fired.
Finally! I was waiting for so long! Love you're videos.
I always thought of spikes escape and not feeling pain was because they didn't activate the chip yet. I thought of it as a precautionary installment and when he escaped, they were like "oh crap, time to turn the chip on"
Me too. Turns out it was just an error.
Happiness equals that video you didn't expect to see for a while!!!
I can't English nor adjective how much I love these videos!
You don't know how hard I marked out when I saw the notification of this video. Thank you!
Ian's voice is as beautiful as the Bangel dance scene
I was having kind of a bad day until I saw that you'd uploaded something, so, thanks!
I love these sooooo much! I honestly don't know what I'm going to do when you're done with both series! I look forward to them so much
When i'm done lets start another series.
Ever watched Xena, the Warrior Princess? XD
I love your recaps. Thank you for doing them!
I can't wait for Something Blue and Hush. I love those.
"I don't think I've ever captured this amount of detail about a man-friend's outfit" Yeah, this is definitely evidence in the "Willow was interested in the Buffybot for more than just science" column...
I like it. Subtext bell gets to make a return soon.
"A return"? From 4x10 onward, it's gonna be more like "The subtext bell strikes back" :)
I'm getting to the point now that I enjoy watching this channels reviews as much as I did the show.
I liked Riley when he was introduced but, somewhere along the way I started to wish they would break-up in season5. But yeah, he's awesome in this episode.
it obviously never says this, but when I saw the episode originally, I thought the chip in Spike's head was a prototype that the initiative didn't activate until he escaped.
My theory was bolstered at the end of the episode when Walsh asks Riley about Spike's fighting abality and how well the chip performed.
Id like to defend the "mistake" because i also caught that at the beginning but i always saw it as spikes NEED to escape. It was him fighting against that agony to escape the even worse agony of being contained and experimented on. I dont remember much of how the show addressed it but i think spike being held by the initiative was pretty traumatic for him, and getting out was more important to him than the pain he was going through to escape.
Yay you're back! Yesterday I was going to post how much I missed your videos!
yayyyy you're back!💜
Pointless aside; I actually remembered the fellow who played Graham when I saw him in Longmire...I can't remember where I put important documents but I remember minor characters in Buffy. But hey, entertaining guide. I chose(and choose) to believe the cheese references are not just about the food.
Big fan of your work from Argentina! Keep it up!
I just found your channel and watched "Why you should watch" and Season 1. Then I noticed you hadn't completed the series and had to jump to the last one you did to check the date. I was so relieved to see a recent date. Love your work so much. No one but my brother can I get to watch this show. Gonna post your "Why" video and hope.
so weird haha literally on my walk home from work had the urge to watch some of your vids.checked and saw the last vid was 3 weeks ago. look again and theres a new one uploaded! thankyou!
@3:02 "They engage in a furious battle of Mortal Kombat..." :)
Spike complaining to Willow about his inability to perform was one of the first Buffy scenes I ever saw, when I was flipping through channels. "Oh, I get it now," I said to myself. "It's metaphor." This was apparently more than a dumb TV show for airhead children.
That shout out to Something Blue! ❤️
I actually liked this season. I like the idea that someone like Walsh can get drunk on power and like she knows best. I even liked Riley though what he does after sullies it for me. I even like the Big Bad for this season. Not sure why really.
Ian. Great video as always. But I think you should bring up two more things about this episode.
The first is when Riley confessed his feelings for Buffy to her. Willow then went on a depresses rambling (rambling is the wrong word but I can't think of a better word right now.) about how the relationship will turn out bad and someone will be broken. I always read that as a subtle way to hint at the outcome of Riley and Buffy's relationship. (Though I could be over reaching. To me it just fit so much).
Second was when the Riley and his strike force was explaining what happened at the dorm explaining how it was a strong domineering man or beast. Almost as if nursing their egos of why they lost.
Either way the video was good as always :) Excited for more videos
I missed the domineering man comment. That was relevant. I'll watch for it and try and backfill.
If not maybe do some kind of top 10 list of things you may have missed. I am not sure if you missed other stuff but if other people missed stuff maybe do a whole "Top 10 stuff I missed so far" Maybe after Season 4 or possibly after Adam becomes awake?
I'm planning on making some addendum videos for seasons at some point. Maybe I'll do season one after I finish 4 and so forth. Try and correct some misses and mistakes.
I feel like emotionally there are some things in the buffyverse that you can only appreciate fully when you have experienced what it is portraying. Noticing the *possible* realism and recognising how on point the writing is are two different things. Willow's heartbreak this season is the example that made me realise this; after having been through heartbreak, I love, hate, and appreciate how realistic they made her characters reactions to such a devastating feeling.
Two at once! Thank you!
The scenes with Xander vs. Harmony and Willow and Spike's whole encounter rank among the funniest in the series, in my opinion.
Ya know, I never realized how decent Riley is in this episode. Good to see you back! Also, the caption on the videos thumbnail is Wild at Heart, and not the Initiative. Can't wait for the angel review!
First one who caught it. Thanks. Fixing it now.
Dawn wasn't written poorly, so much as the casting was done the wrong age and the writing never changed to match.
Harmony vs Xander was the best. t
The music, the slow mo, everything. Just perfect
I watch Buffy ALL THE TIME and I can't believe I never noticed the inconsistencies with spikes chip in this episode.... I feel so unintelligent
It's always been a pet peeve of mine how clumsy they make Buffy in this season. She's a bit of a goof in general and definitely awkward, but she constantly bumps into people, drops things, spills drinks and breaks things in the first seven episodes and it feels so forced. I was watching this episode wondering if Stephanie Meyer got the idea for Bella from this one.
Huh. You'd think Willow would know better than to say "come in" to anyone without seeing them first.
1:26 It ends up being a bit rich of Riley to punch Parker since he's even worse than him but is more subtle about it. I also hate Forrest and his whole "blindly loyal, unquestioning soldier" thing.
Bro, you should make a playlist of ALL guide episodes!! I would watch that all day, EVERY day!
Honestly this might be Riley's most likable episode and probably the one that best explains what Buffy might see in him. Actual Captain America energy that I wish they'd managed to carry forward.
Honestly this episode and Riley with Willow was the only reason I always tried to excuse Riley's behavior and kept trying to like him (it couldn't go beyond "I just wish he wasn't with Buffy maybe like a background character that pops in from time to time")
The term "broldiers" deserves an award.
'i always worried what would happen when that bitch got some funding' iconic
Xander's action hero monologue was hilarious! So was the slow motion "fight" between him and harmony! 🤣🤣🤣
Good episode. Good review.
Sets up many things that would play out for seasons to come.
Season 4 as I said and as you said here, is a very transitional season. It was a combination of where the show was and where the show would go.
It'll be interesting to see it play out in your reviews ahead.
I still don't know how I feel about the whole Initiative story arc at all. I found it to be totally over the top and it didn't quite sit well within the emotional realness of the Buffy world. And I'm also conflicted about Riley - it's nice to see Buffy with someone who is gentle and kind, but then he moves towards the whole "soft cock" persona which is grating. And Professor Walsh ... she's a sociopath
Okay Xander v harmony was the best self aware satire ever
"Well, then how about this: we whip out the Ouija board, light a few candles, summon some ancient unstoppable evil - Mayhem
Mayhem Mayhem - we show up, kick its ass."
Cut to-
"Well, I didn't know what was gonna happen! I just thought there were gonna be dances and songs. I just wanted to make sure we'd... we'd work out. Get a happy ending."
Xander thinks demon summoning will help the group act as a group again. Wee bit unethical.
Much Love and thank you for the guide, as always! Caught some snippets of the live-editing process. I was torn between watching you edit to not spoil the guide. But maybe next time on youtube, it's comfy. er.
My head canon for Walsh talking about the "dogs" in class is that they were loose on campus so she wanted to warn people. She probably gave them a better run down in private.
"A misstep" is right. The Initiative (group, not episode) is the biggest mistake the series ever made plot-wise.
As much as people seem to like Riley for not objectifying women in the opening scene, it was the moment when I realized he has no personality and is boring.
pike has chemistry with anyone he shares scene with. That is the reason he is such a fan favorite. But he and Harmony were always more than humorous together, I agree.
Riley and Willow's scene at 2:45 had me briefly thinking the writers were going to make them a couple. Thank god Tara came along and the writers are smart.
Despite not being anywhere near a favorite (and more of a Initiative exposition episode), the clip of 3:02-3:04 is one of the most comedic of both BtVS and AtS. Not to mention, Spike's metaphor of not being able to "perform." Why is it that a lot of times the best comedy is in the mediocre to bad episodes on all show - even this one.
Willow should know better than to invite people in like that.
The containment policy wa what made me realize that the Initiative didn't have a clue what they were doing.
I liked the wide pan around the "cam-like interior" as well as the music that went along with it. I don't know about anyone else though.
The Spike and Riley comparisons in the video disturbed me.
I loved your acknowledgment of Spike's escape. Not something anyone notices until they rewatch it, and when they do, all they can do is cringe at the flub.
love these videos so much!
This ep is great because it started the arch of Spike developing into what he eventually becomes. And it started right here when the chip is put in his head.
One of my favorite episode of Buffy the vampire slayer . It was good episode
Always wondered how the hellmouth they managed to build that underground base without anyone knowing ?
Under a campus no less.
I just had a thought. Buffy like's cheese, dreams are our subconscious. In restless the scoobies dreams are connected slightly. These dreams were caused by the spell they did. Was the cheese man created because Buffy like's cheese?
I love Xander and Harmony's slap fight.
Given here and Lovers Walk, its no surprise that Spike would later seek Willow re: a newly drugged and sane Drusilla the 8 issue comic from IDW right before his and Angel"s return in S8.
As for the Initiative, not Trio bad but could've been handled more. Hell, it would've been a good opportunity to bring back the invisible girl Marcie as part of them
Good review. This is one of the sleeper episodes of the season I think. Actually quite liked Riley up to about the mid-way point of the season. It was all down hill after that IMO. The Willow-Spike exchange is one of my favourite scenes ever on Buffy, maybe in television.
i always tjought, the reason spike could attack the intittave guys without feeling pain was because the chip didnt start working until he tried to feed/kill off someone
I always thought that the chip worked on what he felt Primal pleasure with, because it allowed him to do the same thing to Demons because he didn't feel the same Rush of the hunt.
They also could have done more with the initiative like making it a rogue government-funded branch of the Watchers. And the dude bro Commandos and was kind of stupid they're about four years older than them that kind of attitude would make more sense if they were freshmen not teachers aides let alone soldiers Undercover.
For some reason I took spikes ability to hit the initiative people as him not perceiving them in his mind as innocent because they were experimenting on him he sees them and bad guy as evil
I just assumed that the initiative guys were testing or dipping into Dr. Walsh's super drug supply and that made them less human somehow, enabling spike to attack them. He couldn't hit Riley in S5 because the effects of the drugs had started to wear off