I have a BBSHD. For someone getting into mtb for the first time during covid, it made such a big difference that I would have given up on my second trail run if it wasn't for it. Now I go every other weekend and have the assistance only at L1. Saved my life and sanity :). Whilst initially I was inspired by the cheapb, my next project it to build a full sus ebike. I'll have to re-watch your earlier vid as I want a similar frame but non carbon ideally
I think its a great options for those who have an old mtb, thats been colecting dust. We grow older, and trails get harder, this would make us older folks get back to trails. Once you get to experience it, maybe you will pun up to a full brand emtb, and hope they come down in price for then. Great vid Rob
Seems fun! I just wonder, how many chains did you go through over that month? I usually change the chain after 2 months in the summer on my Haibike with a gen 3 Bosch. I only ride like 300km/month tops.
This is what you call good content. This is exactly what the industry is lacking. Someone that escapes the premium and normal things and tests crazy stuff like that 1500w motor! Keep it up Rob!
Great to see a pro from an a real mtb background considering a self built bike. More content like this please. Not everyone is able to dish out on a premium ebike that costs as much as a Harley Davidson. Echoing some of the comments and above, this is what the industry needs. Someone to step away from premium ebikes and build something that is accessable to the masses and new affordable options. Say No to Ebike monopoly
Agree! DIY kits have been a thing since the dawn of ebikes, It's nice to see guys that represent the commercial pre-built scene showing off and testing what is out there in the DIY scape as well as showing anyone can build a great ebike for far less money - or even get someone to build it and will still cost a decent chunk less.
Your spot on, I wish there was more of this type of video, far more interesting than looking at another generic expensive ebike that most can't afford. You get channels like EMBN that occasional touch on the subject, mainly with a retired guy who is very good, but I always get the feeling the presenters are a bit snobbish towards the DIY kits, and that's probably because they are heavily backed by the main manufacturers, at least this was a fair review.
I've now used one of these for almost a year and here is my take on it. Maintenance is going to be a thing, especially when the kit is used at high power. - It's crazy powerful. 1500w is no joke and I commute to work with it at 50kph, almost the whole way, daily. That's around 600 rides per year at near max power just by itself. - The clutch in the chainring ensures the pedals don't spin when the motor is driving the chainring. My first clutch, "freewheel 1.0", died two days after receiving the kit. CYC replaced it with an upgraded "freewheel 2.0", which lasted a few months (and was rated for 350Nm of torque). It too broke, but CYC replaced it for free. My advice is if you like to start up by standing on the pedals and you weigh what I do (100kg) you might overcome the sprags in "freewheel 2.0" after a few months, but it's also possible my first "freewheel 2.0" was defective. - There is also a clutch inside the motor's gearbox which avoids you spinning the motor while pedaling. It's a "one way bearing" sprag clutch. Mine broke after about 9 months of use rendering the motor inoperable. I am currently awaiting a replacement, and this isn't easy; it involves pulling the sprocket and then pulling the bearing, and then re-seating both. This will be a challenge for the mechanically uninclined. That clutch is only rated for 60Nm so it's easy to see why that failed. Bear in mind, my motor is thrashed at 1500w every single day on a commute at 50kph and also in weekends for fun. Also, I suspect the Gen 3 CYC Stealth has an upgrade in this department but don't quote me on this. - The crankarms and BB on the Gen 2 kit are square taper and suffer the usual failure with the square taper on the arms rounding out over time. The Gen 3 kit uses ISIS splined crankarms to avoid this problem. - The BAC855 controller and BAC based app disconnect regularly, but CYC have changed away from this to their own controller and app so this too will likely not be an issue with the Gen 3. - The motor does experience heat rollback if used above 1200w for about 15 minutes in my experience, but the Gen 3 again improves on that. - The provided chainring is designed for a 9 speed or smaller chain and the thick-thin engagements will not work well on an 8 speed or larger chain, leading to chain drops. - The motor is loud. I don't care, but some people might. On the plus side, the brass gears are almost certainly more durable than the nylon gears used by other manufacturers, so tradeoffs have been made here.
There's so many reviews of cyc stuff that consistently go like "yeah it's great! I mean, it broke, but they replaced it for free within 3 days, it'll get fixed in the next version, can't complain, right? Anyway it broke again and they replaced it for free within 3 days, it'll get fixed in the next version, 4th times the charm?" great customer service and all but can I get one that doesn't break??
I have just fitted a Bafang BBS02 kit to a trek dual sport. I bought the USB programming cable & used changed the parameters using settings I found online. Game changer! You mention the CYC motor doesn't start straight away. Can this not be changed? I changed my bbs02 and the power now eases in gradually plus it's now very gear dependant. I'm so impressed with my conversion. Yes, it doesn't look as good as a manufacturer bike but it was less than half the price of a new ebike.
Thanks for being positive towards this bolt on motor Rob, other ebike channels are less encouraging and seem to disparage them. The cost of commercial brands ebikes are more than I want to pay for a car but as an older less fit athlete I want to continue in the activity. I run a Tongsheng Tsdz 2 and love it. The chainline is terrible and the Cyc looks much better but the noise has just put me off!!! I encourage you to do more of this type of content as review s of the latest ten grand super ebike are leaving me cold and envious!!!
Good comments, I think your kit is similar to the bafang I have just installed, my chain line was crap, I have an 11 speed cassette and couldn't get into 1st or 2nd without the chain trying to come off, lucky lekkie do a kit that sorted out out, now it's fine I don't know if that will fit your motor though.
@@acelectricalsecurity sadly the lekkie ring doesn't fit the tongshen motor as I bought one and was very disappointed. Have now shifted cassette outwards using spacers so have less gears but better chainline.
I have both a full fat Levo and a bafang 1500w 52v 20AH rockhopper. You will hammer the battery at 1500w. Even the higher AH batteries dont last as long as you would like when using full power and ultimately leaves you thinking about less power for more range almost every ride. It takes about 30 mins of riding hard up and down trails to realise you better switch to a lower mode to stay out longer. I love power, usually the more the better, but when in the zone of fun, the last thing you want is to be told by your battery its time to go home. The Levo, however, is almost perfect in every way. Yes, less power, but more range, more time out = more fun overall. In my honest opinion, anything over 750w on a primarily off road MTB is pointless until battery tech develops a bit more (solid state MTB batteries perhaps?)
I think you've opened up a can of worms there Rob, I think once these bolt on units become a bit more refined they'll become a very real alternative to the over priced offerings from the big players!
I watched your previous video on the bike build and ordered a Stealth. Fitted to an older 09 Giant Reign 0 which is in great condition, using existing rear cluster and chain. The motor absolutely rocks. I have run in normal street mode and played with the assist levels and tried race mode on assist level one and found this to be great on single track trails, gives you the torque to tackle anything. I used a ceramic lube on the chain and found it cut the noise down. I'm hoping the cluster and chain can handle the power otherwise I'll change to a Box 2 Prime 9 speed group set. I did 23kms of singletrack on a mix of street and race assist and still had a relatively full battery at the finish. The bike weighs 19.5kg complete. My wife rides a Focus Thron2 6.9 with the Bosch kit and now I have no issue keeping up. With the loose battery issue I have 2 stainless steel hose clamps around the battery as well as the bottle mount screws. Thanks for your inspiration to do this.
Hi mate, super interested in doing this myself only factor for me it price. How much has it cost you all in? I got a bit confused when he showed the battery separately to the kit, don't know if it's $1000 all in or is there more things to add in.
@@ZeroGHome24 My complete kit including battery cost $2500 AUD in Australia, so its a cheap alternative to the current ebikes out there! I'm really impressed with the performance
@@ZeroGHome24 I had a look at buying their motor and their bigger battery, the cost is quite a lot, that whole package plus import tax and delivery to the UK was around £1600, where as my bafang kit will have cost nearly £1000, because there's other things you need and I got for a better experience, like gear sensor, brake levers with built in sensors, ebike chain, lekkie bling ring kit, bottom bracket reducers etc, these things I didn't factor in before I bought the kit
Been watching these guys for years. Finally had the spare cash. Thought I would beat the rush ordered last week. Custom 60amp 36v battery and CYC stealth are going on my 2019 Vitus Sommet plus wide range 50-11 8 speed drive train. Thanks for the vid Rob.
Your right speed isn't everything, especially off road, on one of my bikes, which is set up for road use, I use a 350w hub motor with a 36v 12ah battery, and the thing is great, it never struggles, keeps going and going, it kicks in and and out automatically and it's only got 40nm of torque, I get about 40miles on a charge, and where I live it's all hills mostly big ones.
This will hopefully show that you don't need to spend a fortune for an ebike. Some of the prices coming out for the new ebikes are just becoming ridiculous! Awesome content Rob 👍
I don’t think the power should get any higher that the current full fat 80-90Nm bikes. More focus should be on losing weight and increasing range. If we are not careful, it will harm access to riding areas for everyone as they will be seen as motorbikes but making it too had to differentiate from lower powered bike, so all ebikes (and maybe non assisted bikes) will be locked out.
Thats easy to say if you are able bodied or younger , if you are on the heavy side and or have health issues and need extra assistance , that is not a lot of power mate , in fact its very average , really for legalities what is more of a concern in my book is the speed , fit people on decent bikes can do well over 25 kph with no motor ! you have to ask yourself are the E bike speed limits realistic ? Torque and power is less of an issue IMO as long as speeds are at common sense level , finding the happy medium is the thing. As for your comment about losing weight , i can guarantee you , even if the bikes where 98 assistance and people just had to virtually turn the pedals to keep the motor running , that would still be exercise , and far better for those people than sitting on their arse in front of the telly .
@@mikldude9376 I think you are replying to the wrong comment 🤔 I didn’t say anything about not loosing weight and I agree that ebikes are great for people with injuries or health issues. What I don’t agree with is having more power than they do now. A pedal assisted bike should only give a few times more assistance than you put in, not getting up there with the power of dirt bikes. The current full powered ebikes have plenty of power. Anyone can put down more watts than even the fittest non assisted rider. If you can’t ride with that much assistance I don’t think you should be on a bike. Also if you have health issues or an injury , do you think it’s a good idea to be on something that can put down more power than several very fit riders? You still can do over 25kph on a restricted ebike, I’ve done it myself. It’s just not assisted over 25kph. On single track trails 25kph is plenty on the climbs, it’s way faster that the fittest non powered rider could do and on the descents gravity is your friend and you can easily do over 25kph💁🏼♂️ Maybe road bikes or commuter bikes the speed could be raised a bit, but we are talking mountain bikes here.
@@streddaz totally agree. The real difference is on the road where a good cyclist can go way faster than 25 kph. Ganna averages around 54 kph in his time trials. But he’s still doing it at less than 500 watts. With a 250 watt assist I could match the power - but not the aero bike or position honed in wind tunnel testing! Out on the trails a 25 kph limit is fine in my view.
I think there is a lot of rider techniques that could improve performance on the uphills, namely anticipation and being in the right gear. The noise could be unusually loud because of the install, the frame can amplify the noise. There are ways to super secure these batteries, which have way more capacity than the low wattage factory bikes.
i really appreciate the honest review that you gave the motor, looking at it from a standard emtb "specialist" perspective. but what i would've really liked to see was a more in depth review talking about the controllers. on most off the shelf ebike you can't do when it comes to mod the ebike, neither it makes sense since the motor are all about optimization more then raw power. but when talking about aftermarket motors (like the stealth, the x1 pro, the bbshd and so on) you have a huge variety of controllers you could chose from. Most of the people are running bac (either 855 or even 2000) with those motors, others are running Phaserunner controllers. in the cyc community it's a well known fact that going from a standard cyc controller to a well tuned bac855 will make a night and day difference for the refinement you're talking about in the video, making it closer to an off the shelf emtb feeling or even better in some case. although cyc is having some problem regarding compatibility with bac controllers, you should've really make a comparison between a bbshd, a x1 (either stealth or pro) both with a bac855, and an off the shelf powerful emtb. really great content anyway!
Should've gone a direct hub motor. Mine takes hills way better without even pedaling lol.. 1500w motor and 50 amp controller, it does power wheelies just by touching the throttle. Running on a hard tail knobbly 26x2.50 tyre
I have been running this motor for 3 months on a 2005 santa cruz nomad. Set at around 500watts peak seems to work for me. mostly bike parks. so much fun! But yes when following my mate on a pedal bike the slow uphill is less assisted, going to look at higher gearing to get cadence up. Oh and the noise is a bit embarrassing.
This is how I use bbs02 starting out on hills- punch the throttle for a second or two to overcome the lag built into straight assist mode, motor engages instantly with trottle, no need to pay extra $ for advanced torque sensing capability doing this simple trick!
Finally channels like this consider those conversion kits. ...and those ridiculous legal power and speed limitations have to go away in this time and age of alternative transportations. Bikes are no longer just for exercise.
I couldnt disagree more. Those limitations impact lots of other trail users and even the trails themselves. Right now I think the balance is about right.....
Can't beat a nice diy ebike, tha satisfaction of putting it together yourself. I love your build. I've a bbshd with a ludicrous controller running about 200nm and I call it my uphill mountain bike 😁.
Awesome! Do you have picture or something? I also build my own ebike from lose parts and run bbshd motor with lots of fun. Just didn't get into (mosfet) modding it yet, since 1500W stock power is already OK to me. lately I've converted it into 8speed IGH to fix my chain dropping & bouncing issue's
@@zachm.3049 my profile picture here is of the bbshd, ludicrous v1 controller set to 50 amp, 52v 50amp 15ah battery, great fun but funnily my other bike leaves it standing 😂.
@@nanopete6472 wow 2 batteries! Or just the 52v 15Ah driving the 50Ah controller? Still a nice build based on the profile picture. I had to use rear rack for my 52V 14S 8P 3500mah Sanyo 18650 battery. So to me big jumps are out of the question.
@@zachm.3049 1 battery, I use this for 'madder' rides upto about 20 ish miles. My other bike 52v 34ah 1768Wh for longer cruising rides. Love diy ebikes
I really want to see the 'lightest ebike' motor if it ever gets into production. Several power options, good torque rating, and supposed to be quiet too. But it has been promised to be available for around a year now, and still no signs of any actually being produced.
Hello from California really good video I really enjoyed it. I built a downhill bike with the Pro gen 2 (250nm) with strong, quality components and it is INSANELY fun and with great throttle feel. It does 38 mph easily. I'm reminded by you to proceed cautiously.
I'm planning on building an ibis Ripley AF with the CYC stealth kit and a custom 2kg battery. One of the aspects that attracted me to it is the ability to mount the motor inside the frame triangle, so you don't lose ground clearance. The Ibis rear suspension allows that kind of setup.
Get the brass gears with a good packing of the special grease and low end noise becomes a lot more quiet .defo still screams on high rpm same as the steel gears
Good stuff Rob. CYC has long ways to go. Stealth and Pro Gen II is good but their 72V platform on the Pro Gen II needs work with the controller. Great people though. Excited to see what's coming out next. I do love their design more so than the BBSHD. BBSHD is just more customizable and can run 4000W using aftermarket kits which I run at the moment.
I have a vitus mythique and what's cool about this setup is that there's enough room to fit a water bottle on the downtube in front of the motor and still clear the front tire when the front fork is fully compressed.
I've fitted a Bafang BBSHD Motor to my old Scott 29er Hard tail, and it's bonkers offroad. I've a 2100ah battery on it and the motor is rated at 1000-1500w. Marvellous offroad and drive it with a thumb throttle as well as peddle assist. Once you've gone electric, it's hard to go back. I fitted my battery inside a frame bag so solved the mounting issues. I may see you in Swinley Forest Rob.
Great video first video that I've seen where the DIY crushes the performance of store bought ebike. I will say if you used another DIY BBSHD mid drive with the same BAC 855 Controller the BBSHD is quite as a mouse. I cant tell you how many times I've startled deer on the trail. Now if you want a real treat put the mid drive on a Down Hill Bike with 200mm of travel. Now were talking. Similar to what that is but just not as LOUD. Mount that battery above the motor on the down tube for better COG if you have the clearance. You want a lower center of gravity. I bet you feel a difference especially around corners. WOW is that mid drive loud. That would drive me crazy on the trail. Try the BBSHD it's so quite and bullet proof up to 2500W with the proper controller.
I'm on my second emtb build and have the gen 2 cyc stealth with all of its controller issues finally sorted. I ended up with an older controller that worked but so much depends on gearing. My bike is an 07 Santa Cruz downhiller with 26" wheels and a 9 speed gear set. The stealth has a 6000 rpm motor so it can rev past your ability to pedal and it's amazing to use the throttle when climbing. I have a 38 tooth crank sprocket and a 38/11 tooth cassette and that gives me the ability to climb really steep stuff without stalling and still do 40+ mph with a fully charged battery. A lot depends on your batteries BMS. Mine will put out 40 amps continuous so with 40 amps at 48 volts, that is basically 2KW of power. This motor will do that. That said, it will take a toll on your drive train which is not designed to handle that much power. I completely trashed the splines on my rear hub and had to replace everything. So much fun.👍👍
@@dougnash6316 interesting. I just ordered the 32T Stealth and upping my cassette to 11-46t. Making me second guess it... but I'm running primarily full suspension mtb on technical trails.
@@Rickydbaby Mine is very wheelie prone. I dont think you will have a problem with a 46t, just back off on the pas. If your top gear is 11t you will still get 40mph. mine is 26" wheels and 9sp. Battery is from Luna. I live in North Vancouver where we have mind bending terrain. Way beyond my skills but lots of thrills just the same.
Ordered a stealth Gen 3. Gonna put it on my full suspension giant trance 27.5" I'm pumped. I heard they refined the torque sensing a bit and quiet upped the motor a little. I'm really excited. How's your rear wheel and hub holding up?
Been using the bafang BBS02 and BBHD for years. Solid and reliable motors that i have put thousands of miles on. The huge benefits are the throttle which you dont get on standard bikes and it cost a fraction of the price and loads more power than an off the shelf bikes brand. For me its a no brainer, more power, throttle for more fun, more torque and a quarter of the price. Also running a higher voltage battery means higher speed. batteries on off the shelf bikes are a huge rip off, they charge such a high mark up for less capacity.
I have a bbshd with a hotted up controller putting out 3200w with a 52v 25ah battery . Love the bbshd . I bought a metal replacment gear for it and lekkie bling ring . Its really fast but you have to respect it . Look up luna cycles they sell parts for the motors . You can buy ludicrous controller like mine has . they sell the metal gear also . If you want you can destroy gears and chains by thrashing it out in to high gears but i treat mine with respect . I bought good parts on my bike to make it . 203mm 4 piston brakes are a must . You cant have the go without the stopping power . I have a hub motor bike that runs 60v 30ah battery . That tops out at 63kph . I cant believe the price they rip people off for ebikes . I build my own battery packs aswel .
@@delmanorshun2471 about that I used it most days to commute to work, about 42 miles a day round trip. Huge hill's and long runs flat out. Eventually gave up the ghost. it was 750w motor and I was running it at 1300 for long periods. Served me well in that time with zero maintenance required. Did not think twice about getting the bbshd when she gave up the ghost.
Impressive for that small size (that's what she said) I have a bafang bbs02b 750w (max 1470w) and that does around 120nm of torque. Way less noisy than this one and under half price :) I'm close to 3000km on it, haven't really been too nice to it, but it still runs like new. Although i actually did lower the controller amps from 24 to 20 in the beginning. Can still do 50kmh on flat if no wind. You should give that a try if you haven't already ;) The only thing i can say, is the size, if you do a lot of trails with rocks etc, this one is probably a really good pick since it's so small.
I wish you would have made more of a disclaimer about ebike conversion kits. When you put a conversion kit on a bicycle that was manufactured as a non-electric bike you are changing the way forces are put on the frame and components by quite a bit. Especially with a beast of a motor like this one. 150Nm of force, plus whatever the rider is imputing is quite a bit more than acoustic bicycles are designed for! Especialy if someone were to do this with a higher end full suspension frame. The linkage was not designed to handle that. I know that lots of people have installed conversion kits without any problem, and in the vast majority of cases it is going to be fine. But you are almost certainly voiding any warranty on the bike. I am not trying to tell people that they should absolutely not do this, but I think it should be something they consider before doing this to any bike. Especially if they were to buy a new frame or complete bicycle to convert (and void warranty).
Thanks Rob, really entertaining. All well and good in the dry, but what’s it going to be like in the slop of a British Winter. There are several exposed moving parts and how waterproof is the whole set up. Can we have part two in February? Cheers
I'm confused. In April you talked about the new Bafang M500 is better starting pedaling than the older version. Here you say the CYC is WORSE than the Bosch at that, but better at everything else. I wish you would talk about the differences between the CYC and the Bafang. You are the only one who brought up that point of the power when slow pedaling, so I appreciate that...but trying to learn what I need!
@@RobRidesEMTB My pleasure Rob. I just was thrilled to see your review on the CYC motor. The timing was perfect. I just did my maiden voyage on mine. 32 miles and 6000 feet. Still had juice in the battery afterwards. Really a nice way to go. Assisted exercise. I’m 61 and it’s nice to be able to cover so much ground in a shorter time.
Hi Rob After watching this video and considering building my first ebike for sometime now I’m still leaning towards a of the shelve model, but what a beast it is
I had a 2019 s works levo that retailed for $12k, and the 1000w bbshd kit on my 160mm transition sentinel is WAY more fun especially when I can kick the power up to 1700 watts momentarily. Granted, the bike feels more like a motorcycle than a MTB and not nearly as refined as the levo.
I built my own bike with a bbshd motor and a norco storm 2 . Hotted up the controller to 3200w with a 52v 25ah battery . It has 5 levels of power to choose from and i put big 203mm discs on it with 4 piston hydraulic calipers . Cost about $2,000 to build . Could have bought a duel suspension frame but i dont mind hardtails anyway . Done over 2000km on it and still going strong . I cant swallow the price they rip you off for an ebike . I also have a 2000w hub motor bike aswel . Thats 60v 30ah battery .
Awesome Rob. Considering you can pick up a new Mythique for £1300 it seems really viable for someone starting out in the ebike world. Great video, love the content. 🤙
Really enjoyed the video. Your insight will help me with my recumbent trike E-build. I was considering the cyc motor for a Catrike 5.5.9.and now I am convinced this will be a blast to build and ride.. Ride Hard, Ride Fast, Ride Safely.
I think we should do a comparison between my BBSHD 1000w mondraker dune build! I would be interested to see whether the CYC's torque sensing is a big improvement over the BBSHD's standard power delivery
Amazing review! Thanks for bringing unbiased info about these kits to the world. Indeed, it's the little details that really matter. I've used the bafang bbshd (tonnes of power, but no torque sensor so for on-road use only), and the tongsheng TSDZ2 (half the torque, a torque sensor, but needs a lot of DIY skills to unlock its potential with firmware changes). I had big hopes for this motor, but bang on, getting the power delivery curves right is why you pay Bosch et al the big bucks. I love that cyc are continually improving their products, and I can't wait to upgrade my Frankenbike when they're on the next gen!
@@IronX77 not if you tune it correctly. I have mine tuned so that I hop on the Kenevo and it feels primitive compared to the bbshd. The problem is not the lack of torque sensor, it is that people do not program the start up and stop pedalling times ... at all in most cases. Then you can adjust the ramp up amperage as well to get it more like a better feel for you. The bbshd comes programmed for like a cargo bike ... adjust it for mtb use.
@@BarryJTaylor not true. The only way to ride a bbshd offroad is with throttle...using like a motorcycle. Pas will never feel good in trails. I have bikes with shimano and bosch, and as a bike you can compare.
Curious if you could get noticeable drop in the center of gravity using a hardtail which would allow for more room in the diamond to lower the battery, and if so, would the difference be good enough to outweigh the benefits of full suspension. I realise this is hugely personal to riding style and variations in frames, though it'd be great to hear your opinion from a high-level perspective. This video has inspired me, like a cherry on top, to go this route as I've been studying a while & your videos are in my reference list ~ cheers!
I have a bbshd running 3200w . Its a beast . You have to give it respect or your dead meat . Pulls wheelies so easy and can chew the shit out of the chain and cogs if your in the wrong gear . I have no idea what nm it puts out now . Fucking lots is my guess . I can start in top gear but dont do it .
Please keep an eye over the Battery mounts. They may ruin your frame in some time. I added some adapters for stability and currently think of adding some screw holes to reinforce the connection to that 5kg chunk.
Rob, great comparison, my biggest issue is the noise of the CYC motor, while riding do you notice that as much as I do as a viewer? Oh wait you covered that haha, cheers!
I put a 3000 watt Luna Cyclone ( $400, out of stock now) motor on my commuter mountain bike with throttle control. Think a throttle override might solve your starting problem. I have no problem starting up as long as you switch gears before stopping. I didn't know if I would like it so went with an old beater hardtail bike I had. But I am impressed with your video and what a suspension can do. May end up switching to a full suspension. Think the noise of the Cyclone is far less than that motor in the video but still lots of gear whine. No solution. (Maybe at the manufacturing end, an oil filled gearbox or/and helical cut gears though less efficient) Find bike fun, 3000watts OK.
Bad ass, Im doing a cyc stealth next after xmas on a full suspension, Just finished a bafang carrera hellcat lmt edition 29er conversion, An i proper enjoyed it, Massive satisfaction when you finished, So yeah i will be doing another with a cyc stealth, The cyc pro, CYC seems to be the only ones so far thats not in it for the marketing, DIY E-bikes are the future its as simples as that, Wont find me cueing up for petrol, lol, DIY E-bikes is the way too go.....
@@cathreneswanepoel9586 First i heard about the new line being more stealthy with the sound, Personally i like the fact its got a noise of the future, lol, So many times i felt rude from unexpectingly to scare squirel half to death, At least little animals know you coming lol, The weather have opened an the sky is blue today, So it will be a nice afternoon/evening ride, Only put 90 miles on my bafang, Be nice to hit the century no issues, Feel more safer now to go further as i got the spare chain delivered yesterday, Amazon do a top chain with all the tools for 16 qiud, Bargain highly recomended.... After xmas i will be doing another E-bike with a stealth motor, It looks more ruggid an tougher than that pro ironically, I dont like the glass or see through part on the cyc pro, If they done one without the glass part an made it like stealth motor i would buy the pro, But either way already looking foward to doing another E-bike before i even got the parts, lol, Its addictive the E-bike build thing, Now i know why Johnny nerd out does what he does, Just, Johnny nerd out knows what he talking about, lol.... Cheers for telling me the new stealth motors are silent....
Have the bafang bbshd motor on my 29er with a chain stubber running a phaserunner and field weakener 72 volt 60 amps ish 3000 watt stock motor was 1000 watt nominal 1700 peak 160nm torque amped that up 200 nm torque to keep it safe anything above 250 nm torque i kept snapping chains and that sucked so kept it at 200 nm toe its about 3000 watt nominal now about 4300 peak
I thing you dont have the correct settings. My cyc stealth on my Radon Swoop 210 Downhillbike acts exactly as a bosch motor. Starting to push me up a hill, if i just lay my foot on the pedal (if i want). I think you dont have actived the Torque sensor as PAS (or not enough start power?). Your description of the PAS (robotic on off on off feeling) sounds more as a BBS HD or BBS02. Great Video and nice bike 👍🏽👌🏼 your drone footage is recorded with a skydio 2? Keep on the work
I tried a load of settings. CYC sent me some to test too. I could never get the very fine power / torque sensing to get anywhere near the Bosch, on technical climbs / starting off on (very) steep hills. I found it doesn't have that same finesse at lower RPM and low level torque. (I definitely had the Torque Sensor selected).
@@RobRidesEMTB sounds really strange... Mine is completly different. My friend with his bike with bosch motor was impressed too, that the feeling was so close to his motor. As is said, i just lay the foot on the pedal and the motor is trying to push me forward th-cam.com/video/MuTQtWn8HYw/w-d-xo.html
@@batfastardo741 Definitely had in torque sensing mode. It does give power, as soon as pedals are pushed, but very low power and torque at low cadence up stpee technical climbs. needs a lot more cadence for it to really take off.
to stabilize the battery you should stuff some 2K epoxy putty between the downtube and battery, that will prevent lateral movements. the Bafan BBSHD puts out about the same power but is super silent, pretty heavy though and definitely not so compatible with pressfit bb shells. rpm is also beyond pedaling potential though, because there's a limit to the amount of torque a mtb drivetrain can handle. more power needs more rpm for that reason.
Woah, what a kit! Incredible power from the small size, torque sensing, motor! Would you fit one?
I have a BBSHD. For someone getting into mtb for the first time during covid, it made such a big difference that I would have given up on my second trail run if it wasn't for it. Now I go every other weekend and have the assistance only at L1. Saved my life and sanity :). Whilst initially I was inspired by the cheapb, my next project it to build a full sus ebike. I'll have to re-watch your earlier vid as I want a similar frame but non carbon ideally
Absolutely 💯
I think its a great options for those who have an old mtb, thats been colecting dust. We grow older, and trails get harder, this would make us older folks get back to trails. Once you get to experience it, maybe you will pun up to a full brand emtb, and hope they come down in price for then. Great vid Rob
YES
Seems fun! I just wonder, how many chains did you go through over that month? I usually change the chain after 2 months in the summer on my Haibike with a gen 3 Bosch. I only ride like 300km/month tops.
This is what you call good content. This is exactly what the industry is lacking. Someone that escapes the premium and normal things and tests crazy stuff like that 1500w motor! Keep it up Rob!
Great to see a pro from an a real mtb background considering a self built bike. More content like this please. Not everyone is able to dish out on a premium ebike that costs as much as a Harley Davidson. Echoing some of the comments and above, this is what the industry needs. Someone to step away from premium ebikes and build something that is accessable to the masses and new affordable options. Say No to Ebike monopoly
im assuming its a legal issue.
@@Ropetable I'm talking about the niche things that Rob finds out and shares with us. Not just this motor.
Agree! DIY kits have been a thing since the dawn of ebikes, It's nice to see guys that represent the commercial pre-built scene showing off and testing what is out there in the DIY scape as well as showing anyone can build a great ebike for far less money - or even get someone to build it and will still cost a decent chunk less.
Your spot on, I wish there was more of this type of video, far more interesting than looking at another generic expensive ebike that most can't afford.
You get channels like EMBN that occasional touch on the subject, mainly with a retired guy who is very good, but I always get the feeling the presenters are a bit snobbish towards the DIY kits, and that's probably because they are heavily backed by the main manufacturers, at least this was a fair review.
I've now used one of these for almost a year and here is my take on it.
Maintenance is going to be a thing, especially when the kit is used at high power.
- It's crazy powerful. 1500w is no joke and I commute to work with it at 50kph, almost the whole way, daily. That's around 600 rides per year at near max power just by itself.
- The clutch in the chainring ensures the pedals don't spin when the motor is driving the chainring. My first clutch, "freewheel 1.0", died two days after receiving the kit. CYC replaced it with an upgraded "freewheel 2.0", which lasted a few months (and was rated for 350Nm of torque). It too broke, but CYC replaced it for free. My advice is if you like to start up by standing on the pedals and you weigh what I do (100kg) you might overcome the sprags in "freewheel 2.0" after a few months, but it's also possible my first "freewheel 2.0" was defective.
- There is also a clutch inside the motor's gearbox which avoids you spinning the motor while pedaling. It's a "one way bearing" sprag clutch. Mine broke after about 9 months of use rendering the motor inoperable. I am currently awaiting a replacement, and this isn't easy; it involves pulling the sprocket and then pulling the bearing, and then re-seating both. This will be a challenge for the mechanically uninclined. That clutch is only rated for 60Nm so it's easy to see why that failed. Bear in mind, my motor is thrashed at 1500w every single day on a commute at 50kph and also in weekends for fun. Also, I suspect the Gen 3 CYC Stealth has an upgrade in this department but don't quote me on this.
- The crankarms and BB on the Gen 2 kit are square taper and suffer the usual failure with the square taper on the arms rounding out over time. The Gen 3 kit uses ISIS splined crankarms to avoid this problem.
- The BAC855 controller and BAC based app disconnect regularly, but CYC have changed away from this to their own controller and app so this too will likely not be an issue with the Gen 3.
- The motor does experience heat rollback if used above 1200w for about 15 minutes in my experience, but the Gen 3 again improves on that.
- The provided chainring is designed for a 9 speed or smaller chain and the thick-thin engagements will not work well on an 8 speed or larger chain, leading to chain drops.
- The motor is loud. I don't care, but some people might. On the plus side, the brass gears are almost certainly more durable than the nylon gears used by other manufacturers, so tradeoffs have been made here.
There's so many reviews of cyc stuff that consistently go like "yeah it's great! I mean, it broke, but they replaced it for free within 3 days, it'll get fixed in the next version, can't complain, right? Anyway it broke again and they replaced it for free within 3 days, it'll get fixed in the next version, 4th times the charm?"
great customer service and all but can I get one that doesn't break??
I have just fitted a Bafang BBS02 kit to a trek dual sport. I bought the USB programming cable & used changed the parameters using settings I found online. Game changer! You mention the CYC motor doesn't start straight away. Can this not be changed? I changed my bbs02 and the power now eases in gradually plus it's now very gear dependant. I'm so impressed with my conversion. Yes, it doesn't look as good as a manufacturer bike but it was less than half the price of a new ebike.
Thanks for being positive towards this bolt on motor Rob, other ebike channels are less encouraging and seem to disparage them. The cost of commercial brands ebikes are more than I want to pay for a car but as an older less fit athlete I want to continue in the activity. I run a Tongsheng Tsdz 2 and love it. The chainline is terrible and the Cyc looks much better but the noise has just put me off!!! I encourage you to do more of this type of content as review s of the latest ten grand super ebike are leaving me cold and envious!!!
Good comments, I think your kit is similar to the bafang I have just installed, my chain line was crap, I have an 11 speed cassette and couldn't get into 1st or 2nd without the chain trying to come off, lucky lekkie do a kit that sorted out out, now it's fine I don't know if that will fit your motor though.
@@acelectricalsecurity sadly the lekkie ring doesn't fit the tongshen motor as I bought one and was very disappointed. Have now shifted cassette outwards using spacers so have less gears but better chainline.
As an ageing Mountain biker of 63 years old this really appeals to me. Great review and something for me to consider.
I have both a full fat Levo and a bafang 1500w 52v 20AH rockhopper. You will hammer the battery at 1500w. Even the higher AH batteries dont last as long as you would like when using full power and ultimately leaves you thinking about less power for more range almost every ride. It takes about 30 mins of riding hard up and down trails to realise you better switch to a lower mode to stay out longer. I love power, usually the more the better, but when in the zone of fun, the last thing you want is to be told by your battery its time to go home. The Levo, however, is almost perfect in every way. Yes, less power, but more range, more time out = more fun overall. In my honest opinion, anything over 750w on a primarily off road MTB is pointless until battery tech develops a bit more (solid state MTB batteries perhaps?)
Good summary, exactly what I was thinking. It's like having a V8 in your car and a 10 liter fuel tank. Lot's of power for a few km.
Maybe just run the stealth at level 2? Still got the throttle when you need it. Should be legit.
I think you've opened up a can of worms there Rob, I think once these bolt on units become a bit more refined they'll become a very real alternative to the over priced offerings from the big players!
@@fastemx thats it
@@fastemx Exactly as long as you don't ride like a dick, dick being the ultimate word used ..
These motors aren't new, we've been using them for years and laughing at ppl spending 4k+ for bosh...the mainstream is only just catching on.
There's been bolt on for years. The tsdz2 with firmware upgrades was really impressive. This is sorta the successor
Bafang pretty much refined already since this vid borne fyi Matey...
I love watching DIY builds crush off the shelf premiums.
Obviously crush because of the stupid 250w eu or 750w us laws
I watched your previous video on the bike build and ordered a Stealth. Fitted to an older 09 Giant Reign 0 which is in great condition, using existing rear cluster and chain. The motor absolutely rocks. I have run in normal street mode and played with the assist levels and tried race mode on assist level one and found this to be great on single track trails, gives you the torque to tackle anything. I used a ceramic lube on the chain and found it cut the noise down. I'm hoping the cluster and chain can handle the power otherwise I'll change to a Box 2 Prime 9 speed group set. I did 23kms of singletrack on a mix of street and race assist and still had a relatively full battery at the finish. The bike weighs 19.5kg complete. My wife rides a Focus Thron2 6.9 with the Bosch kit and now I have no issue keeping up. With the loose battery issue I have 2 stainless steel hose clamps around the battery as well as the bottle mount screws. Thanks for your inspiration to do this.
Hi mate, super interested in doing this myself only factor for me it price. How much has it cost you all in? I got a bit confused when he showed the battery separately to the kit, don't know if it's $1000 all in or is there more things to add in.
+1 on the Stealth & Box 2 combo - a marriage made in heaven
@@ZeroGHome24 My complete kit including battery cost $2500 AUD in Australia, so its a cheap alternative to the current ebikes out there! I'm really impressed with the performance
The battery is a big heavy item, so I got three nylon straps from Amazon for £4 as a belt and braces thing, they hold the battery really snug
@@ZeroGHome24 I had a look at buying their motor and their bigger battery, the cost is quite a lot, that whole package plus import tax and delivery to the UK was around £1600, where as my bafang kit will have cost nearly £1000, because there's other things you need and I got for a better experience, like gear sensor, brake levers with built in sensors, ebike chain, lekkie bling ring kit, bottom bracket reducers etc, these things I didn't factor in before I bought the kit
Would love to see you try the new CYC Photon, much quieter and better torque sensing
Great video rob.
Honest review.
If it makes people smile when ridding.
Then it's a winner in my book.
Loving the tan walls. Bike looks great Rob. Most home builds look just that!
Great video, I us the bbshd, and you dont realise how fast it can climb till you go against a mainstream bike.
The CYC is the dream motor
The noise ain’t that bad dude. Friggin love mine. Eats up the Marin Headlands. Thank you for your wonderful channel.
Been watching these guys for years.
Finally had the spare cash. Thought I would beat the rush ordered last week.
Custom 60amp 36v battery and CYC stealth are going on my 2019 Vitus Sommet plus wide range 50-11 8 speed drive train.
Thanks for the vid Rob.
you should always go for the most voltage possible.
@@theRCspot if U want speed . Which I don't want.
@@nobrakes7247 48V-52V is more than enough for the Stealth kit
Your right speed isn't everything, especially off road, on one of my bikes, which is set up for road use, I use a 350w hub motor with a 36v 12ah battery, and the thing is great, it never struggles, keeps going and going, it kicks in and and out automatically and it's only got 40nm of torque, I get about 40miles on a charge, and where I live it's all hills mostly big ones.
great that you also test such motors in comparison to your other e-bikes!
This will hopefully show that you don't need to spend a fortune for an ebike. Some of the prices coming out for the new ebikes are just becoming ridiculous! Awesome content Rob 👍
Your right, the prices of these bikes are on a par with decent cars, crazy really
I have a couple cyc builds, and all the ability to taylor the pas settings are in the app, even including the ramp up and ramp down motor time.
I don’t think the power should get any higher that the current full fat 80-90Nm bikes. More focus should be on losing weight and increasing range.
If we are not careful, it will harm access to riding areas for everyone as they will be seen as motorbikes but making it too had to differentiate from lower powered bike, so all ebikes (and maybe non assisted bikes) will be locked out.
Was going to comment this. Completely agreed.
Thats easy to say if you are able bodied or younger , if you are on the heavy side and or have health issues and need extra assistance , that is not a lot of power mate , in fact its very average ,
really for legalities what is more of a concern in my book is the speed , fit people on decent bikes can do well over 25 kph with no motor !
you have to ask yourself are the E bike speed limits realistic ?
Torque and power is less of an issue IMO as long as speeds are at common sense level , finding the happy medium is the thing.
As for your comment about losing weight , i can guarantee you , even if the bikes where 98 assistance and people just had to virtually turn the pedals to keep the motor running , that would still be exercise , and far better for those people than sitting on their arse in front of the telly .
@@mikldude9376 I think you are replying to the wrong comment 🤔
I didn’t say anything about not loosing weight and I agree that ebikes are great for people with injuries or health issues. What I don’t agree with is having more power than they do now. A pedal assisted bike should only give a few times more assistance than you put in, not getting up there with the power of dirt bikes.
The current full powered ebikes have plenty of power. Anyone can put down more watts than even the fittest non assisted rider. If you can’t ride with that much assistance I don’t think you should be on a bike.
Also if you have health issues or an injury , do you think it’s a good idea to be on something that can put down more power than several very fit riders?
You still can do over 25kph on a restricted ebike, I’ve done it myself. It’s just not assisted over 25kph.
On single track trails 25kph is plenty on the climbs, it’s way faster that the fittest non powered rider could do and on the descents gravity is your friend and you can easily do over 25kph💁🏼♂️
Maybe road bikes or commuter bikes the speed could be raised a bit, but we are talking mountain bikes here.
@@streddaz totally agree. The real difference is on the road where a good cyclist can go way faster than 25 kph. Ganna averages around 54 kph in his time trials. But he’s still doing it at less than 500 watts. With a 250 watt assist I could match the power - but not the aero bike or position honed in wind tunnel testing! Out on the trails a 25 kph limit is fine in my view.
I think there is a lot of rider techniques that could improve performance on the uphills, namely anticipation and being in the right gear. The noise could be unusually loud because of the install, the frame can amplify the noise. There are ways to super secure these batteries, which have way more capacity than the low wattage factory bikes.
Thanks for your feedback Rob. Great video! Can't wait until my kit arrives to give my Chinese hardtail new life.
If i clock a rider on the super kit ill call the feds
i really appreciate the honest review that you gave the motor, looking at it from a standard emtb "specialist" perspective. but what i would've really liked to see was a more in depth review talking about the controllers. on most off the shelf ebike you can't do when it comes to mod the ebike, neither it makes sense since the motor are all about optimization more then raw power. but when talking about aftermarket motors (like the stealth, the x1 pro, the bbshd and so on) you have a huge variety of controllers you could chose from. Most of the people are running bac (either 855 or even 2000) with those motors, others are running Phaserunner controllers. in the cyc community it's a well known fact that going from a standard cyc controller to a well tuned bac855 will make a night and day difference for the refinement you're talking about in the video, making it closer to an off the shelf emtb feeling or even better in some case. although cyc is having some problem regarding compatibility with bac controllers, you should've really make a comparison between a bbshd, a x1 (either stealth or pro) both with a bac855, and an off the shelf powerful emtb.
really great content anyway!
Should've gone a direct hub motor. Mine takes hills way better without even pedaling lol.. 1500w motor and 50 amp controller, it does power wheelies just by touching the throttle. Running on a hard tail knobbly 26x2.50 tyre
I have been running this motor for 3 months on a 2005 santa cruz nomad. Set at around 500watts peak seems to work for me. mostly bike parks. so much fun! But yes when following my mate on a pedal bike the slow uphill is less assisted, going to look at higher gearing to get cadence up. Oh and the noise is a bit embarrassing.
This is how I use bbs02 starting out on hills- punch the throttle for a second or two to overcome the lag built into straight assist mode, motor engages instantly with trottle, no need to pay extra $ for advanced torque sensing capability doing this simple trick!
Finally channels like this consider those conversion kits. ...and those ridiculous legal power and speed limitations have to go away in this time and age of alternative transportations. Bikes are no longer just for exercise.
I couldnt disagree more. Those limitations impact lots of other trail users and even the trails themselves. Right now I think the balance is about right.....
Yes! powerful motors is what the UK YT space is missing.
my 60yr old dad turned an old marin quake freeride into an ebike during lockdown. the thing is nuts.
Can't beat a nice diy ebike, tha satisfaction of putting it together yourself. I love your build. I've a bbshd with a ludicrous controller running about 200nm and I call it my uphill mountain bike 😁.
Awesome! Do you have picture or something? I also build my own ebike from lose parts and run bbshd motor with lots of fun.
Just didn't get into (mosfet) modding it yet, since 1500W stock power is already OK to me.
lately I've converted it into 8speed IGH to fix my chain dropping & bouncing issue's
@@zachm.3049 my profile picture here is of the bbshd, ludicrous v1 controller set to 50 amp, 52v 50amp 15ah battery, great fun but funnily my other bike leaves it standing 😂.
@@nanopete6472 wow 2 batteries! Or just the 52v 15Ah driving the 50Ah controller? Still a nice build based on the profile picture. I had to use rear rack for my 52V 14S 8P 3500mah Sanyo 18650 battery. So to me big jumps are out of the question.
@@zachm.3049 1 battery, I use this for 'madder' rides upto about 20 ish miles. My other bike 52v 34ah 1768Wh for longer cruising rides. Love diy ebikes
I really want to see the 'lightest ebike' motor if it ever gets into production. Several power options, good torque rating, and supposed to be quiet too. But it has been promised to be available for around a year now, and still no signs of any actually being produced.
Hello from California really good video I really enjoyed it. I built a downhill bike with the Pro gen 2 (250nm) with strong, quality components and it is INSANELY fun and with great throttle feel. It does 38 mph easily. I'm reminded by you to proceed cautiously.
Between crushing the hill climb and pulling away from the drag race this makes a really compelling case for DIY ebikes
I'm planning on building an ibis Ripley AF with the CYC stealth kit and a custom 2kg battery. One of the aspects that attracted me to it is the ability to mount the motor inside the frame triangle, so you don't lose ground clearance. The Ibis rear suspension allows that kind of setup.
Same thought here, I think the motor-in-frame orientation with a custom-fit battery to the front triangle can be really quite spectacular.
Get the brass gears with a good packing of the special grease and low end noise becomes a lot more quiet .defo still screams on high rpm same as the steel gears
Good stuff Rob. CYC has long ways to go. Stealth and Pro Gen II is good but their 72V platform on the Pro Gen II needs work with the controller. Great people though. Excited to see what's coming out next. I do love their design more so than the BBSHD. BBSHD is just more customizable and can run 4000W using aftermarket kits which I run at the moment.
I'm running a bafang 250w motor on my normal mountainbike and it's quite refined and so wonderfully easy to unlock....
I have a vitus mythique and what's cool about this setup is that there's enough room to fit a water bottle on the downtube in front of the motor and still clear the front tire when the front fork is fully compressed.
Would be interesting to see a similar DIY bike but with a Bafang BBSHD in that test.
I've fitted a Bafang BBSHD Motor to my old Scott 29er Hard tail, and it's bonkers offroad. I've a 2100ah battery on it and the motor is rated at 1000-1500w. Marvellous offroad and drive it with a thumb throttle as well as peddle assist. Once you've gone electric, it's hard to go back. I fitted my battery inside a frame bag so solved the mounting issues. I may see you in Swinley Forest Rob.
2100 ah battery 😂
@@Louis-lu5wh poops, too many zeros, sorry.
@@SimonPass230267 hahaha
Great video first video that I've seen where the DIY crushes the performance of store bought ebike. I will say if you used another DIY BBSHD mid drive with the same BAC 855 Controller the BBSHD is quite as a mouse. I cant tell you how many times I've startled deer on the trail. Now if you want a real treat put the mid drive on a Down Hill Bike with 200mm of travel. Now were talking. Similar to what that is but just not as LOUD. Mount that battery above the motor on the down tube for better COG if you have the clearance. You want a lower center of gravity. I bet you feel a difference especially around corners. WOW is that mid drive loud. That would drive me crazy on the trail. Try the BBSHD it's so quite and bullet proof up to 2500W with the proper controller.
I'm on my second emtb build and have the gen 2 cyc stealth with all of its controller issues finally sorted. I ended up with an older controller that worked but so much depends on gearing. My bike is an 07 Santa Cruz downhiller with 26" wheels and a 9 speed gear set. The stealth has a 6000 rpm motor so it can rev past your ability to pedal and it's amazing to use the throttle when climbing. I have a 38 tooth crank sprocket and a 38/11 tooth cassette and that gives me the ability to climb really steep stuff without stalling and still do 40+ mph with a fully charged battery. A lot depends on your batteries BMS. Mine will put out 40 amps continuous so with 40 amps at 48 volts, that is basically 2KW of power. This motor will do that. That said, it will take a toll on your drive train which is not designed to handle that much power. I completely trashed the splines on my rear hub and had to replace everything. So much fun.👍👍
38 cassette / 38 chainring... wow you're really putting a lot of stress on that motor. It's doing it well geared that high?
@@Rickydbaby No overheating, and it climbs really well.
@@dougnash6316 interesting. I just ordered the 32T Stealth and upping my cassette to 11-46t. Making me second guess it... but I'm running primarily full suspension mtb on technical trails.
@@Rickydbaby Mine is very wheelie prone. I dont think you will have a problem with a 46t, just back off on the pas. If your top gear is 11t you will still get 40mph. mine is 26" wheels and 9sp. Battery is from Luna. I live in North Vancouver where we have mind bending terrain. Way beyond my skills but lots of thrills just the same.
Ordered a stealth Gen 3. Gonna put it on my full suspension giant trance 27.5" I'm pumped. I heard they refined the torque sensing a bit and quiet upped the motor a little. I'm really excited. How's your rear wheel and hub holding up?
Been using the bafang BBS02 and BBHD for years. Solid and reliable motors that i have put thousands of miles on. The huge benefits are the throttle which you dont get on standard bikes and it cost a fraction of the price and loads more power than an off the shelf bikes brand.
For me its a no brainer, more power, throttle for more fun, more torque and a quarter of the price.
Also running a higher voltage battery means higher speed.
batteries on off the shelf bikes are a huge rip off, they charge such a high mark up for less capacity.
For how long have you been using Bbso2? 2 years, 3 years?
Ive had my bbshd for nearly 4 years now and I still think its the way to go, especially if you program it to feel more natural.
I have a bbshd with a hotted up controller putting out 3200w with a 52v 25ah battery . Love the bbshd . I bought a metal replacment gear for it and lekkie bling ring . Its really fast but you have to respect it . Look up luna cycles they sell parts for the motors . You can buy ludicrous controller like mine has . they sell the metal gear also . If you want you can destroy gears and chains by thrashing it out in to high gears but i treat mine with respect . I bought good parts on my bike to make it . 203mm 4 piston brakes are a must . You cant have the go without the stopping power . I have a hub motor bike that runs 60v 30ah battery . That tops out at 63kph . I cant believe the price they rip people off for ebikes . I build my own battery packs aswel .
@@delmanorshun2471 about that I used it most days to commute to work, about 42 miles a day round trip. Huge hill's and long runs flat out.
Eventually gave up the ghost. it was 750w motor and I was running it at 1300 for long periods. Served me well in that time with zero maintenance required.
Did not think twice about getting the bbshd when she gave up the ghost.
@@jonoh404.....the controller must have been dead
Impressive for that small size (that's what she said)
I have a bafang bbs02b 750w (max 1470w) and that does around 120nm of torque.
Way less noisy than this one and under half price :) I'm close to 3000km on it, haven't really been too nice to it, but it still runs like new. Although i actually did lower the controller amps from 24 to 20 in the beginning. Can still do 50kmh on flat if no wind. You should give that a try if you haven't already ;) The only thing i can say, is the size, if you do a lot of trails with rocks etc, this one is probably a really good pick since it's so small.
I wish you would have made more of a disclaimer about ebike conversion kits. When you put a conversion kit on a bicycle that was manufactured as a non-electric bike you are changing the way forces are put on the frame and components by quite a bit. Especially with a beast of a motor like this one. 150Nm of force, plus whatever the rider is imputing is quite a bit more than acoustic bicycles are designed for! Especialy if someone were to do this with a higher end full suspension frame. The linkage was not designed to handle that. I know that lots of people have installed conversion kits without any problem, and in the vast majority of cases it is going to be fine. But you are almost certainly voiding any warranty on the bike.
I am not trying to tell people that they should absolutely not do this, but I think it should be something they consider before doing this to any bike. Especially if they were to buy a new frame or complete bicycle to convert (and void warranty).
Thanks Rob, really entertaining. All well and good in the dry, but what’s it going to be like in the slop of a British Winter. There are several exposed moving parts and how waterproof is the whole set up. Can we have part two in February? Cheers
Yes, please do a follow up video on how well the bike and motor and battery have stood up after a year.
I'm confused. In April you talked about the new Bafang M500 is better starting pedaling than the older version. Here you say the CYC is WORSE than the Bosch at that, but better at everything else. I wish you would talk about the differences between the CYC and the Bafang. You are the only one who brought up that point of the power when slow pedaling, so I appreciate that...but trying to learn what I need!
Thanks!
Wow thanks Michael, that's very unexpected and generous of you! I've never received a thanks before!
@@RobRidesEMTB My pleasure Rob. I just was thrilled to see your review on the CYC motor. The timing was perfect. I just did my maiden voyage on mine. 32 miles and 6000 feet. Still had juice in the battery afterwards. Really a nice way to go. Assisted exercise. I’m 61 and it’s nice to be able to cover so much ground in a shorter time.
So looks this is the 2 stroke of the E-Bike world!😁
Is there a way to add a twist throttle to this kit so I don't have to pedal constantly?
It comes with 1
Hi Rob
After watching this video and considering building my first ebike for sometime now I’m still leaning towards a of the shelve model, but what a beast it is
That 1500w ⚡bike is awesome👍 Nice clean build🏆
I don't even have an e bike but I love this channel so much lol
Same same but not for long
I’ve ordered one of these kits - great test! Thank you
What a great review, after hearing the noise and not so instant RPM
I decided to keep my pushbike as it is and cary on saving to get a new
Levo.
I had a 2019 s works levo that retailed for $12k, and the 1000w bbshd kit on my 160mm transition sentinel is WAY more fun especially when I can kick the power up to 1700 watts momentarily. Granted, the bike feels more like a motorcycle than a MTB and not nearly as refined as the levo.
I can’t wait to get this motor on my bike! Ima buy the 72v version and beat everything which has pedals 😂
i like the DIY method. the pride in creating something very personal can be emotional at best.
I built my own bike with a bbshd motor and a norco storm 2 . Hotted up the controller to 3200w with a 52v 25ah battery . It has 5 levels of power to choose from and i put big 203mm discs on it with 4 piston hydraulic calipers . Cost about $2,000 to build . Could have bought a duel suspension frame but i dont mind hardtails anyway . Done over 2000km on it and still going strong . I cant swallow the price they rip you off for an ebike . I also have a 2000w hub motor bike aswel . Thats 60v 30ah battery .
3000 watts is pushing a 52 volt battery to the limit. You need 72 volts at 60amps
What kinda rear hub are you running? And how is it holding up with all that power.
Awesome Rob. Considering you can pick up a new Mythique for £1300 it seems really viable for someone starting out in the ebike world. Great video, love the content. 🤙
Really enjoyed the video. Your insight will help me with my recumbent trike E-build. I was considering the cyc motor for a Catrike 5.5.9.and now I am convinced this will be a blast to build and ride.. Ride Hard, Ride Fast, Ride Safely.
I think we should do a comparison between my BBSHD 1000w mondraker dune build! I would be interested to see whether the CYC's torque sensing is a big improvement over the BBSHD's standard power delivery
They about the same power
We need a:
* Bafang M625 Motor
VS
* CYC X1 Stealth Motor
Comparison plzzzzzz
Nothing will beat riding on a normal mtb, but you need balls for that. Still, respect for diy build.
Will you be reviewing CYC'S new Photon motor?
Yes
Amazing review! Thanks for bringing unbiased info about these kits to the world. Indeed, it's the little details that really matter. I've used the bafang bbshd (tonnes of power, but no torque sensor so for on-road use only), and the tongsheng TSDZ2 (half the torque, a torque sensor, but needs a lot of DIY skills to unlock its potential with firmware changes). I had big hopes for this motor, but bang on, getting the power delivery curves right is why you pay Bosch et al the big bucks. I love that cyc are continually improving their products, and I can't wait to upgrade my Frankenbike when they're on the next gen!
I dont know why you dont use your bbshd off road?? Its the best motor ever off road! Have you not adjusted it via PC and cable?
@@BarryJTaylor It only had a cadence sensor, not a torque sensor, so it's very on off, which makes technical climbing very difficult
@@IronX77 not if you tune it correctly. I have mine tuned so that I hop on the Kenevo and it feels primitive compared to the bbshd. The problem is not the lack of torque sensor, it is that people do not program the start up and stop pedalling times ... at all in most cases. Then you can adjust the ramp up amperage as well to get it more like a better feel for you. The bbshd comes programmed for like a cargo bike ... adjust it for mtb use.
@@BarryJTaylor not true. The only way to ride a bbshd offroad is with throttle...using like a motorcycle.
Pas will never feel good in trails.
I have bikes with shimano and bosch, and as a bike you can compare.
@@antenorareal clearly you have not adjusted your bbshd config. The cable cost $20 and the interface s/w is free.
Thinking of putting one of these motors on a 2010 stumpy fsr
How does it compare to the lift mtb kit?
Curious if you could get noticeable drop in the center of gravity using a hardtail which would allow for more room in the diamond to lower the battery, and if so, would the difference be good enough to outweigh the benefits of full suspension. I realise this is hugely personal to riding style and variations in frames, though it'd be great to hear your opinion from a high-level perspective. This video has inspired me, like a cherry on top, to go this route as I've been studying a while & your videos are in my reference list ~ cheers!
How long did the battery last in turbo legal mode? And the price?
Sweet video. You should do a Bafang 1500w build and do a comparison. Bafang is also much quieter.
I have a bbshd running 3200w . Its a beast . You have to give it respect or your dead meat . Pulls wheelies so easy and can chew the shit out of the chain and cogs if your in the wrong gear . I have no idea what nm it puts out now . Fucking lots is my guess . I can start in top gear but dont do it .
Bafang BBSHD is so much better than this
@@mnc303 agree
Please keep an eye over the Battery mounts. They may ruin your frame in some time. I added some adapters for stability and currently think of adding some screw holes to reinforce the connection to that 5kg chunk.
I bet if you look in the settings you can alter the time the PAS takes to cut in.
Try a Bafang Ultra its 160 Nmt and tuneable to your requirements.
Grate video! Thank you for sharing, I'll definitely consider picking up this kit for a future project.
Rob, great comparison, my biggest issue is the noise of the CYC motor, while riding do you notice that as much as I do as a viewer? Oh wait you covered that haha, cheers!
Unleashed the Beast to a old MTB. And enjoy it again riding...
I put a 3000 watt Luna Cyclone ( $400, out of stock now) motor on my commuter mountain bike with throttle control. Think a throttle override might solve your starting problem. I have no problem starting up as long as you switch gears before stopping.
I didn't know if I would like it so went with an old beater hardtail bike I had. But I am impressed with your video and what a suspension can do. May end up switching to a full suspension. Think the noise of the Cyclone is far less than that motor in the video but still lots of gear whine. No solution. (Maybe at the manufacturing end, an oil filled gearbox or/and helical cut gears though less efficient)
Find bike fun, 3000watts OK.
Bike looks sooo good Rob! Anxiously waiting this part 2. What a blast. Ill be following the thread for sure
So where are you testing it?
What is the kit cost & where is there a list of full suss frames this fits?
Bad ass, Im doing a cyc stealth next after xmas on a full suspension, Just finished a bafang carrera hellcat lmt edition 29er conversion, An i proper enjoyed it, Massive satisfaction when you finished, So yeah i will be doing another with a cyc stealth, The cyc pro, CYC seems to be the only ones so far thats not in it for the marketing, DIY E-bikes are the future its as simples as that, Wont find me cueing up for petrol, lol, DIY E-bikes is the way too go.....
The new X1 Stealth gearboxes are also quieter
@@cathreneswanepoel9586 First i heard about the new line being more stealthy with the sound, Personally i like the fact its got a noise of the future, lol, So many times i felt rude from unexpectingly to scare squirel half to death, At least little animals know you coming lol, The weather have opened an the sky is blue today, So it will be a nice afternoon/evening ride, Only put 90 miles on my bafang, Be nice to hit the century no issues, Feel more safer now to go further as i got the spare chain delivered yesterday, Amazon do a top chain with all the tools for 16 qiud, Bargain highly recomended....
After xmas i will be doing another E-bike with a stealth motor, It looks more ruggid an tougher than that pro ironically, I dont like the glass or see through part on the cyc pro, If they done one without the glass part an made it like stealth motor i would buy the pro, But either way already looking foward to doing another E-bike before i even got the parts, lol, Its addictive the E-bike build thing, Now i know why Johnny nerd out does what he does, Just, Johnny nerd out knows what he talking about, lol....
Cheers for telling me the new stealth motors are silent....
Have the bafang bbshd motor on my 29er with a chain stubber running a phaserunner and field weakener 72 volt 60 amps ish 3000 watt stock motor was 1000 watt nominal 1700 peak 160nm torque amped that up 200 nm torque to keep it safe anything above 250 nm torque i kept snapping chains and that sucked so kept it at 200 nm toe its about 3000 watt nominal now about 4300 peak
I love it, always liked mid drives
How was the range. Really considering getting of these
Great e bike build!
Hi . I live in UK. How can I buy it?
I have a BB02 1250w, hardtail. 900 miles so far ripping for $900 can't ask for more.
Random question, but why don't you do any of the tests with the seat up? Just looks a bit awkward pedalling with the dropper down.
Love this DiY, thanks for sharing it.
I thing you dont have the correct settings. My cyc stealth on my Radon Swoop 210 Downhillbike acts exactly as a bosch motor. Starting to push me up a hill, if i just lay my foot on the pedal (if i want). I think you dont have actived the Torque sensor as PAS (or not enough start power?). Your description of the PAS (robotic on off on off feeling) sounds more as a BBS HD or BBS02. Great Video and nice bike 👍🏽👌🏼 your drone footage is recorded with a skydio 2? Keep on the work
I tried a load of settings. CYC sent me some to test too. I could never get the very fine power / torque sensing to get anywhere near the Bosch, on technical climbs / starting off on (very) steep hills. I found it doesn't have that same finesse at lower RPM and low level torque. (I definitely had the Torque Sensor selected).
@@RobRidesEMTB sounds really strange... Mine is completly different. My friend with his bike with bosch motor was impressed too, that the feeling was so close to his motor. As is said, i just lay the foot on the pedal and the motor is trying to push me forward
th-cam.com/video/MuTQtWn8HYw/w-d-xo.html
@@Raphi86 sounds like you have torque sensor in Control Command Source not Pedal sensor, that gives instant power.
@@batfastardo741 Definitely had in torque sensing mode. It does give power, as soon as pedals are pushed, but very low power and torque at low cadence up stpee technical climbs. needs a lot more cadence for it to really take off.
to stabilize the battery you should stuff some 2K epoxy putty between the downtube and battery, that will prevent lateral movements.
the Bafan BBSHD puts out about the same power but is super silent, pretty heavy though and definitely not so compatible with pressfit bb shells. rpm is also beyond pedaling potential though, because there's a limit to the amount of torque a mtb drivetrain can handle. more power needs more rpm for that reason.
Why is the saddle always so low when climbing? seems hard on the knees?
Keep them coming, I enjoy all of these videos
I might not be seeing it for looking, but is there a link for the parts please, thanks.
That things mental, what a kit!
Great review!
Can you please do Bafang M620 (G510). Can be street legal with programing cable or eggrider.
this has all the information i needed. thank you sir
Were you running that in the full 1500 watt mode?
Awesome bit of kit. You built it well.