In the first line that Pixel shows us, where is he getting 3 mana for the tayam activation during the loop? 1 from the original strangleroot, 1 from the undying strangleroot, and the last one from... where? Edit: I figured it out. In case anyone else is confused, here's how the combo works: Prerequisites: all permanents on the battlefield, 1 mana in mana pool 1) Strangleroot etbs, gets vigilance counter from tayam 2) tap strangleroot for 1 mana 3) sacrifice strangleroot to carrion feeder. Undying triggers and strangleroot returns to the battlefield with a +1/+1 counter. Tayam gives it a vigilance counter as well. 4) tap strangleroot for 1 mana. Now 2 mana have been made by strangleroot and you have 3 total including the 1 floating from the prerequisites. 5) activate tayam using the 3 mana from step (4), removing the +1/+1 counter from strangleroot, the vigilance counter from strangleroot, and the +1/+1 counter from carrion feeder. Hold priority. 6) While holding priority, sacrifice strangleroot to carrion feeder. Strangleroot will return to the battlefield with a +1/+1 counter due to undying. 7) tap strangleroot to float 1 mana. This will be the 1 floating mana for the next time you loop this combo. 8) sacrifice strangleroot to carrion feeder. Because strangleroot has a +1/+1 counter, Undying wont happen 9) let tayam's ability resolve, returning strangleroot to the battlefield with a vigilance counter and, importantly, no +1/+1 counter. 10) repeat from step 1
thanks for the detailed explanation! im a newer mtg player and i have a tayam deck, so even though im only playing casually with friends this video sparked my interest the entire holding priority bit sounds like some insane yugioh anime bs 😂 i dont think my friend group would let me perform that, even if its following actual mtg rulings
Great explanation, but what is the overall purpose of this loop if you're just getting strangleroot over and over but you dont have any death trigger damage creatures out like zulaport or elas il kor? Unless that part is just a given and im just ignorant thats highly probable.
@@hkeene6 the purpose of this loop is to fill your graveyard and to get infinite counters. Tayam's ability mills 3 cards during each iteration which fills the grave. Carrion feeder gains an extra counter each time you go through the loop. Once your grave is full, you can add pieces into the combo to win the game. For example, you can add Lion's Eye Diamond to the loop to make the loop mana-positive (because you can still tap strangleroot for mana, sacrifice it, then trigger undying, and you remove the counter to activate Tayam). With infinite mana and infinite Tayam activations, pick your favorite winning line.
@@eliorbilow8797 okay i see now with the mention of LED. From a sort of budget perspective, without thinking about proxies, does this also work with lotus bloom which when you squint your eyes real hard can kinds do the same thing?
Never played In these colors, been looking through so many commanders and this one just fits everything I want. And I love how stupidly complicated it is because it feels like I'm constantly learning something from it. Your content is amazing!
I've been playing tayam for over a year now, everyone keeps saying tayam is a trash commander then get mad when I win on their turn in response to their won con. The amount of times I've done that, them have an answer for it, then I activate tayam and put another infinite on the stack to win is amazing
All these deck techs are super appreciated. I'm getting more into cedh after about 7 years of casual commander play. I'll likely use every deck I can, to try and understand as much of the format as possible. Learning how to play the deck, helps you fight the deck. Plus in the meantime I can figure out what kind of player I really am.
Damn....now this is an insane deck tech break down along with some excellent discussion of deck building/game theory. I've been waiting for this video and it exceeded my expectations. Great job guys!
Been brewing a Malcolm/Kraum Blue Moon Tempo list with my friend. Still testing and getting things right, but the plan is to take it to a 48 man tournament June 10trh. Will keep everyone posted.
Great insights :O I love your content *_* You are so regularly talking about the decks you want or have already sleeved up. I'd find it super interesting to see an IRL Video of you collection, decks (and maybe proxies) and your approach to building Decks in paper. Like which and how many decks you actually have built and lying around, and what you have already picked apart again :)
These two mfs are in my irl playgroup and seeing the deck that started as a shitty meme pile evolve into an actual deck that has to be taken seriously is pretty rad
Need a updated video for this as so many tayam list and plans running around, the tayam discord generally disagrees more then agrees on what is good or not.
As it at least from what was described, what this deck brings that is different from other Tayam's approach is that this deck aims to be reactive. It is interesting that this choice was successful. Good work.
A headsup too anyone trying too jump on this list all of the wincons in the primer are not in the decklist in the descruption u have a besutiful deck with a great control strat and very effiecient st milling out but no way too win i orinted the list in a hurry snd didnt notice and got very lucky i put my own backup wincon in
Coming from playing Sakashima krark, jeska tymna, meren& skittles, KCI(modern preban) 5c cdh Jodah. I think I may be able to pivot to pilot this, and I have enough knowledge of layers to pick this up and run it well enough. I like a good challenge that makes you think and not just dem-con to thoracle or brain dead breachers.
I am inexperienced, but is he saying you can put 5 counters on wall of roots at once in one turn? Is there a way to get around it's once per turn stipulation in regards to wall of roots?
Oh that makes more sense. I thought you had wall of roots ETB and then say I’m putting 5 counters on it right away. That’s what I was confused about with the multiple activations.
ah yes finally a crazy good Aristocrats decks making it into cedh this archetype is stupidly good with redundant pieces and resilience available regardless of budget and/or power level and yea from first look at C20's Tayam got me thinking this guy's got real potential good job on making it with Tayam and break up some of the Grixis Heavy meta
Very interesting deck tech. Hard disagree with the logic that "skullwinder gives you access to counter spells". Your opponent still chooses where they're directing their counter spell. And you're still their opponent. Giving your opponents cards is bad in almost every situation, even if there's a chance they will use against another player. Even worse for you when they get to pick the card.
I know that if someone has Ad Naus on the stack and someone gives me a Skullwinder trigger to counter it that I'd just let it resolve out of spite (/j)
I've been running tayam casually for years and doing well but my pod has since power crept with the likes of a competitive yawgmoth and calamax. I need to juice him a lil bit and I'm hoping this helps
40:25 I like playing Aura Shards in my Najeela list since I don’t do much in turn 3, so I plan to play Aura Shards and destroy other players’ ramps. (Granted, my playgroup is less CEDH, and more high power).
i am not going to be overly critical of this guy's tayam design because he's obviously put in a lot of work into it, but i keep thinking to myself wouldn't it just be easier to just do devoted druid + swift reconfiguration so you can basically get infinite mana and infinite tayam activations all at the same time and doing it basically by turn 2 or 3? devoted druid + swift provides the infinite mana and the infinite counters to remove. i would love to know if the creator had tried to shoehorn that into his build before? the only card swap i would make is to replace nature's chosen with swift reconfiguration. i am not sure on what nature's chosen is used for.
Great content as always. Curious where you got the deck list you're discussing in the video, it doesn't match the deck list on the cEDH DDB. Is this an older version of the deck? Is there anywhere I could access this version?
@@ComedIanMTG List 3 is running Promise of Bunrei, as well as some other cards not on the list you're reviewing. Not a biggie, was just curious if the list you reviewed was available - looks like the current list was updated less than 24 hours ago so maybe Pixel/Tuukka made some changes recently.
@tiredguy709 It's also possible to just use an early activation to bring back a sac outlet and and undying creature to create the Sac engine configuration, which will allow those triggers to resolve on the undying creature which can then be sacced as part of the loop and keep you with a legal target for Safekeeper. Squandered Resources and Rain of Filth tend to be the other options to generate Gaea's Cradle loops in Tayam lists.
Now.. I've been looking around in the comments and google, but I can't seem to find how Plume Adventurer intinite combo works? Can anyone explain to me how it works?
Rip Is not common but is a problem, but at the same time the deck runs so many enchantment/artifact removal to make it almost irrelevant and often people will remove this stax effect for us as it is annoying for everybody
Oh nvm. I read some other questions, and you answered it there. The key note was set to 5 counters and not add 5 counters. If the once a turn clause wasn't there it would literally be infinite with just that one card.
Feels like the list shown is missing some pretty critical Tayam tech/optimizations/components. Young Wolf and Carrion Feeder, but no Geralf's Messenger to lethalize the loop, no Priest of Gix to infinitize the loop, and no Bartolome to provide back up sac outlet with identical functionality. No 0/0 base creature that etbs or other wise immediately generates 3 counters to help fuel the churn (Reyhan, Last of the Abzan style). A whole host of artifacts with activated abilities instead of pairing the artifact hate triumvirate stax pieces (Collector Ouphe, Stony Silence, Null Rod) with the RoL stax effects to empower the slow, grindy, critical mass accumulation lines of play. Interesting video, fun topic, clearly cool people involved in the list, but from a competitive perspective the list presented in the video feels underpowered compared to what I think most people would consider the most idealized variations on Tayam combo stax lists. Hope to see this evolve over time.
i hate moxfield, either the deck featured in the video was taken down since the video or their website is broken. i can type the EXACT name of the deck or the creator of the deck and moxfield gives me either just list of random decks featuring "thing" or "nothing matched your search criteria"
The list featured in this video is the Grindstone list in the ddb. You can also try to advanced search for decks that have Tayam as the commander and sort for most popular
discord.gg/UFuWfaKAM2
In the first line that Pixel shows us, where is he getting 3 mana for the tayam activation during the loop? 1 from the original strangleroot, 1 from the undying strangleroot, and the last one from... where?
Edit:
I figured it out. In case anyone else is confused, here's how the combo works:
Prerequisites: all permanents on the battlefield, 1 mana in mana pool
1) Strangleroot etbs, gets vigilance counter from tayam
2) tap strangleroot for 1 mana
3) sacrifice strangleroot to carrion feeder. Undying triggers and strangleroot returns to the battlefield with a +1/+1 counter. Tayam gives it a vigilance counter as well.
4) tap strangleroot for 1 mana. Now 2 mana have been made by strangleroot and you have 3 total including the 1 floating from the prerequisites.
5) activate tayam using the 3 mana from step (4), removing the +1/+1 counter from strangleroot, the vigilance counter from strangleroot, and the +1/+1 counter from carrion feeder. Hold priority.
6) While holding priority, sacrifice strangleroot to carrion feeder. Strangleroot will return to the battlefield with a +1/+1 counter due to undying.
7) tap strangleroot to float 1 mana. This will be the 1 floating mana for the next time you loop this combo.
8) sacrifice strangleroot to carrion feeder. Because strangleroot has a +1/+1 counter, Undying wont happen
9) let tayam's ability resolve, returning strangleroot to the battlefield with a vigilance counter and, importantly, no +1/+1 counter.
10) repeat from step 1
thanks for the detailed explanation! im a newer mtg player and i have a tayam deck, so even though im only playing casually with friends this video sparked my interest
the entire holding priority bit sounds like some insane yugioh anime bs 😂 i dont think my friend group would let me perform that, even if its following actual mtg rulings
Great explanation, but what is the overall purpose of this loop if you're just getting strangleroot over and over but you dont have any death trigger damage creatures out like zulaport or elas il kor? Unless that part is just a given and im just ignorant thats highly probable.
@@hkeene6 the purpose of this loop is to fill your graveyard and to get infinite counters. Tayam's ability mills 3 cards during each iteration which fills the grave. Carrion feeder gains an extra counter each time you go through the loop. Once your grave is full, you can add pieces into the combo to win the game. For example, you can add Lion's Eye Diamond to the loop to make the loop mana-positive (because you can still tap strangleroot for mana, sacrifice it, then trigger undying, and you remove the counter to activate Tayam). With infinite mana and infinite Tayam activations, pick your favorite winning line.
@@eliorbilow8797 okay i see now with the mention of LED. From a sort of budget perspective, without thinking about proxies, does this also work with lotus bloom which when you squint your eyes real hard can kinds do the same thing?
@@hkeene6 I think so
The Tayam twins are crazy good pilots! Always scary to face them in a tournament! Great video!
I couldn't agree more :)
@@ComedIanMTGI low-key regret recommending Hunting Grounds to Tuuka last year hahahaha
Gotta say, as a Teshar player, I really do appreciate this deck and a nice convoluted layered combo.
Never played In these colors, been looking through so many commanders and this one just fits everything I want. And I love how stupidly complicated it is because it feels like I'm constantly learning something from it. Your content is amazing!
I've been playing tayam for over a year now, everyone keeps saying tayam is a trash commander then get mad when I win on their turn in response to their won con. The amount of times I've done that, them have an answer for it, then I activate tayam and put another infinite on the stack to win is amazing
Just put together an enchantress toolbox build for tayam in casual and it plays super fun, can’t wait to see how it’s built in cedh
All these deck techs are super appreciated.
I'm getting more into cedh after about 7 years of casual commander play. I'll likely use every deck I can, to try and understand as much of the format as possible.
Learning how to play the deck, helps you fight the deck. Plus in the meantime I can figure out what kind of player I really am.
Damn....now this is an insane deck tech break down along with some excellent discussion of deck building/game theory. I've been waiting for this video and it exceeded my expectations. Great job guys!
Been brewing a Malcolm/Kraum Blue Moon Tempo list with my friend. Still testing and getting things right, but the plan is to take it to a 48 man tournament June 10trh. Will keep everyone posted.
One year later and the deck is still in continue evolutions, is truly one of the enigma when this coatimundi will reach its peak
Cannot wait for the massive influx of tayam players to the online tournament meta that think they know what there doing after watching this and go 0-3
Oof but also it's definitely one you need to play first before just jamming 100%
i like to call it "farm stigma"
I was thinking about this lmao...Another 3 Tayams pod with pilots who don't know what they are doing sounds miserable lol
Been dipping my toes into tayam for a little while now, can confirm I would go 0-3
My friends sent me here to try and understand the deck, to then explanation it to him, so that tella you how complicated this is
So stoked to hear more about this deck!!
Great deck tech (so far) and also one hell of a positive community on that Discord. Well worth cheking them out.
Thanx for making this! I’ve been very intrigued by Tayam since release
Why is he using wall of roots to generate multiple mana when the ability says you can only activate it once per turn? Am I missing something?
Yea I'm asking the same question
It so we can have 3 counters on it to remove with Tayam's ability.
@@matthewbesherse7001for the counters for Tayam
Yeeeesss Tayam. Stoked for a deep dive on the grindstone primer. Deck is complex as hell but a blast.
Good to see this commander get more attention. I've been brewing this in paper since came out.
Great insights :O I love your content *_*
You are so regularly talking about the decks you want or have already sleeved up. I'd find it super interesting to see an IRL Video of you collection, decks (and maybe proxies) and your approach to building Decks in paper. Like which and how many decks you actually have built and lying around, and what you have already picked apart again :)
New spicy tech: Insidious Roots.
That song in the ending credit has no right coming in so hard. That tune is a banger.
Amazing video! So helpful getting into Tayam. Would love to see the brothers play some pods with Tayam to see it in action!
These two mfs are in my irl playgroup and seeing the deck that started as a shitty meme pile evolve into an actual deck that has to be taken seriously is pretty rad
Need a updated video for this as so many tayam list and plans running around, the tayam discord generally disagrees more then agrees on what is good or not.
As it at least from what was described, what this deck brings that is different from other Tayam's approach is that this deck aims to be reactive. It is interesting that this choice was successful. Good work.
i always thought it was 3 counters from ONE creature... now i get how crazy it is
Thank you to pixel for explaining this deck. I still don’t think I am smart enough to pilot it but I am going to give it hell.
Great minds and great work. Finland represent! 🇫🇮
Thanks for the decktech, trying to bring this deck to my local league & see my oponents reaction.
Welp. Time to build Tayam. This was an awesome insight into the deck!
Literally started learning the primer a week ago. Clutch
Been waiting for this for a while now!
X2
A headsup too anyone trying too jump on this list all of the wincons in the primer are not in the decklist in the descruption u have a besutiful deck with a great control strat and very effiecient st milling out but no way too win i orinted the list in a hurry snd didnt notice and got very lucky i put my own backup wincon in
I've been considering picking this deck up for a while, but it's been so hard to find a solid list. I'll definitely be jumping in that discord!
Coming from playing Sakashima krark, jeska tymna, meren& skittles, KCI(modern preban) 5c cdh Jodah.
I think I may be able to pivot to pilot this, and I have enough knowledge of layers to pick this up and run it well enough.
I like a good challenge that makes you think and not just dem-con to thoracle or brain dead breachers.
I am inexperienced, but is he saying you can put 5 counters on wall of roots at once in one turn? Is there a way to get around it's once per turn stipulation in regards to wall of roots?
no, this was a shorthand but you can put the 5th counter on and not have it die was the point
Oh that makes more sense. I thought you had wall of roots ETB and then say I’m putting 5 counters on it right away. That’s what I was confused about with the multiple activations.
Tayam to learn!
Great video. I'd love for you to do a vid like this for your tivit list ian!
Thanks for the video comedian!
Also bump for algorithm
ah yes finally a crazy good Aristocrats decks making it into cedh
this archetype is stupidly good with redundant pieces and resilience available regardless of budget and/or power level
and yea from first look at C20's Tayam got me thinking this guy's got real potential
good job on making it with Tayam and break up some of the Grixis Heavy meta
Great video, can't wait to see new faces in the discord.
Curious how many of these will be at Baltimore after mox masters
@Comedian MTG What would your strategy be in playing against a deck as tayam? Let's say you are playing Dawnwaker Thras or Tivit ?
Very interesting deck tech. Hard disagree with the logic that "skullwinder gives you access to counter spells". Your opponent still chooses where they're directing their counter spell. And you're still their opponent. Giving your opponents cards is bad in almost every situation, even if there's a chance they will use against another player. Even worse for you when they get to pick the card.
I know that if someone has Ad Naus on the stack and someone gives me a Skullwinder trigger to counter it that I'd just let it resolve out of spite (/j)
This deck slaps!
I've been running tayam casually for years and doing well but my pod has since power crept with the likes of a competitive yawgmoth and calamax. I need to juice him a lil bit and I'm hoping this helps
Sad i didnt get to play you in TS3, couldnt quite sneak by jamaicandude in semis. Dope vid, deck seems quite big 🧠
40:25 I like playing Aura Shards in my Najeela list since I don’t do much in turn 3, so I plan to play Aura Shards and destroy other players’ ramps. (Granted, my playgroup is less CEDH, and more high power).
this deck is wild! what a cool brew to try out. How would i make this a casual deck? cut all the expensive mana and lands?
i am not going to be overly critical of this guy's tayam design because he's obviously put in a lot of work into it, but i keep thinking to myself wouldn't it just be easier to just do devoted druid + swift reconfiguration so you can basically get infinite mana and infinite tayam activations all at the same time and doing it basically by turn 2 or 3? devoted druid + swift provides the infinite mana and the infinite counters to remove. i would love to know if the creator had tried to shoehorn that into his build before? the only card swap i would make is to replace nature's chosen with swift reconfiguration. i am not sure on what nature's chosen is used for.
We talk about this in the video that does not work the way that is intended. Tayam only takes counters off creatures.
@@ComedIanMTG thanks for the explanation.
FINALLY!
Great content as always. Curious where you got the deck list you're discussing in the video, it doesn't match the deck list on the cEDH DDB. Is this an older version of the deck? Is there anywhere I could access this version?
Its list 3 on the ddb
@@ComedIanMTG List 3 is running Promise of Bunrei, as well as some other cards not on the list you're reviewing. Not a biggie, was just curious if the list you reviewed was available - looks like the current list was updated less than 24 hours ago so maybe Pixel/Tuukka made some changes recently.
@@kalebel-khatib796 yeah this was recorded less than 2 weeks ago so any changes are VERY new. Also you can always check the changelog on Moxfield
Let’s goooo Iaaaaaaaaannnnnn!!!!!
Lets go!
Can someone explain why sylvain safekeeper is a combo piece? I don’t think I understood the gaea’s cradle interaction that was mentioned
it sacrifices your gaea's cradle so that if you have infinite counters that nets you infinite mana
@@ComedIanMTG don’t you have to have a valid target to activate safekeeper? Since eventually everything will have shroud?
@@tiredguy709 yeah but you can do the combo at instant speed because the sacrifice is a cost it takes priority over the ability resolving
@@ComedIanMTG oh so you stack activations of safekeeper. Makes sense
@tiredguy709
It's also possible to just use an early activation to bring back a sac outlet and and undying creature to create the Sac engine configuration, which will allow those triggers to resolve on the undying creature which can then be sacced as part of the loop and keep you with a legal target for Safekeeper. Squandered Resources and Rain of Filth tend to be the other options to generate Gaea's Cradle loops in Tayam lists.
I’m not sure why the discord won’t redirect me to the server
Now.. I've been looking around in the comments and google, but I can't seem to find how Plume Adventurer intinite combo works? Can anyone explain to me how it works?
if it enters infinitely you perform the "trap" room infinitely which deals 5 to an opponent
you need to hold priority and activate again to skip the "draw a card" room so you dont deck yourself if you are running into this issue.
Question:
Is the mana from SGeist still relevant? Because u already said at the beginning of this loop, you already have infinite mana?
I think he meant "Not infinite" but English can be hard and the subtitles didn't help when you accidentally say the wrong thing.
So stoked
Nice! ❤
im not gonna lie that i know what's happening despite watching this video for more than 3 times. LOL
What happened if a rest in peace is played? Does this just stop working completely?
Rip Is not common but is a problem, but at the same time the deck runs so many enchantment/artifact removal to make it almost irrelevant and often people will remove this stax effect for us as it is annoying for everybody
Skullwinder gannggggg
But in the first Recruiter pile, how do you have three counters. Recruiter one and carrion two...? where is the third coming from?
He says you need just one more counter to kick it off
@@ComedIanMTG sorry didn't hear that part. How do you generate the infinite mana he was mentioning?
whats Endurance's best use in this deck?
How is wall of roots being activated more than once a turn?
Oh nvm. I read some other questions, and you answered it there. The key note was set to 5 counters and not add 5 counters. If the once a turn clause wasn't there it would literally be infinite with just that one card.
Hey i think your patreon link is broken i cant use it for some reason
legggoo
I watched the loop 5 times and still don't get it...
What I get is: I'm too stupid for this deck 😂
Gameplay videos please🙏
Discord link?
discord.gg/UFuWfaKAM2
Why does this keep telling me to install discord when I have it installed…
thats literally my name lmfao
Show us the way
Feels like the list shown is missing some pretty critical Tayam tech/optimizations/components.
Young Wolf and Carrion Feeder, but no Geralf's Messenger to lethalize the loop, no Priest of Gix to infinitize the loop, and no Bartolome to provide back up sac outlet with identical functionality.
No 0/0 base creature that etbs or other wise immediately generates 3 counters to help fuel the churn (Reyhan, Last of the Abzan style).
A whole host of artifacts with activated abilities instead of pairing the artifact hate triumvirate stax pieces (Collector Ouphe, Stony Silence, Null Rod) with the RoL stax effects to empower the slow, grindy, critical mass accumulation lines of play.
Interesting video, fun topic, clearly cool people involved in the list, but from a competitive perspective the list presented in the video feels underpowered compared to what I think most people would consider the most idealized variations on Tayam combo stax lists. Hope to see this evolve over time.
Make the cards bigger so we can read them
30:50
i hate moxfield, either the deck featured in the video was taken down since the video or their website is broken. i can type the EXACT name of the deck or the creator of the deck and moxfield gives me either just list of random decks featuring "thing" or "nothing matched your search criteria"
The list featured in this video is the Grindstone list in the ddb. You can also try to advanced search for decks that have Tayam as the commander and sort for most popular
Moxfield search shows most recent first, just search like any part of the title and tap filter "most views".
Awesome deck and awesome video