That bit about being unable to find any evidence that people "turned" on SA2's story plays well with the theory I've had for ages now: the Sonic fanbase exists as an anti-echo chamber, where everyone is trapped in an endless cycle of gaslighting themselves that the latest hot take is actually popular concensus.
'If I may be pedantic- and I may, it's 65.5% of the gig after all-' I think that's a new standard of excellent bad joke for Snake. I don't mind it, you know.
Your talk about games' legacies and preservation really highlights one of your biggest strengths as a writer/critic. You're very good at getting into serious topics about things like artistic intent and integrity, the value of emotional connections to imperfect creations, and the joy of watching as people change as creators over time, all without ever getting pretentious or talking down to the viewer. You always come across as a normal guy who has a passion for games, the people who make them, and how we interact with them, and not someone trying to act above everyone else like a lot of video essayists do. The segment in your Yakuza 5 about the franchise being one of the most mature ones out there is another great example, as is the extensive deep dive you did into why Saints Row (the new one)'s writing and characters just fall apart at the seams the more you think about them instead of taking the easy route of screaming "woke".
I do feel I have an ego, I try to keep it in check for videos. I do find there are certain topics which are held back by people treating them as things which demand utmost respect and kinda makes you sound like a wanker talking about them and really put people off. Approach them like they're anything else, have a bit of a laugh while still respecting them and I think more people would be happy to talk about artistic intent, preservation, legacy and so on, but they're so agrandised that I think people feel they have to treat them extra-reverentially
@@TehsnakererI think you hit the nail on the head that some people are held back by being TOO respectful of certain topics when discussing them. As though they're worried about being seen as some kind of philistine if they don't make a show of acknowledging the importance of the subject, so they break out the thesaurus to sound sophisticated. They clearly don't know that the deepest conversations you'll ever have are when everyone involved is at least one beer in and sharing a plate of nachos or other snack food. Also, most people have a bit of an ego, it's a common result of human psychology where we're predisposed to view ourselves in a positive light. Recognizing it and knowing to dial it back just means that you've got enough emotional intelligence to do so.
@@nerdyvids1 You can certainly see it that way for some subjects, but I think many of us just naturally prefer valuing our compassion more. Not for a logical reason (it's not about being a smartass or winning an argument as the goal), but we choose what we value more for ourselves and our relation to others. And I think that's fine to acknowledge.
@@Tehsnakerer the Ego bit is very true. Recently unsubscribed from a TH-camr I initially liked because a lot of his content was him making his topics sound extremely grand and was using it mostly to fuel his own ego, not to mention that he REALLY likes to make fun of stupid people. It got old.
Sonic is more hood than people give him credit for. You'd be surprised how many big rappers cite Sonic as their inspiration for getting into the genre.
Yeah I really appreciate the earnestness of this particular era. I also have an increased awareness of how the series has been perceived online and how that perception has changed over the past two decades. It's funny to think about the amount of people who have watched playthroughs or videos about Sonic 06 versus how many people have actually played the game. The kids today see Sonic 06 and think "Sonic? Oh, sick!", what a time to be alive.
As someone that actually DID play 06, the Sonic levels are decently fun. Was fun to see how low I could get the timer from abusing the gems. 24/7 slowdown baby
That bit where you said one of the characters is the Shinada of Sonic, and the 6 PoV character side-by-side shot, reminded me so much of Yakuza 5 that I started to see the "YUME" pop-up on-screen when you mention the word 'dream' even when you didn't do that. I think your "YUME" bit has unintentionally become a pavlovian MK ultra thing for me :S
I really loved the section about how a narrative around a game is shaped by reactions to alleged mostly unfounded perceptions to it. I feel another great example of this is Doom 3 where people say "People don't get it because they're expecting a classic Doom game when it's actually an action survival horror" which is such a popular talking point at this point Doom 3 is known as a mistunderstood horror game when in reality it's way closer to like Half Life
As someone who has seen others dismiss the idea that stories that play with ludicrous concepts can also tackle deeper themes or ideas… Thank you. It’s something that bothers me when people don’t try to engage a story on its terms because “Oh this boss attacks with bees” or the like. (A specific example I know. Yes the Game in question is Metal Gear Solid 3. No I do not think the person has good taste.) To see someone willingly to engage with earnest stories with earnestness… means a lot to me. Sonic holds a dear place in my childhood, even if I can’t claim to have played most of the Franchise. Or even be good at the ones I have played. But the character of free spirited blue speedster has kept me interested in this series despite it all.
I loved Adventure for Dreamcast unironically as a kid, and now semi ironically as a grown man-child for how it tries so many things it is not qualified to do with stupid levels of confidence. It's a monumental checklist of completely absurd ideas (Fishing Levels) and narrative decisions (Chao massacre scene) that should have been cut at the drawing board but were put in anyway. I love it.
I really miss how in the early 2000s you had these games that were mostly targeted towards children trying to "grow up" with their audience and leading to absurd scenarios. I'll never forget when in MegaMan X4 they reveal that your sidekick was actually a bad guy with a cutscene of him just cutting a few reploids apart and there's blood flying everywhere and people screaming in pain. It was actually kind of thrilling to play games back then because you never knew what kind of crazy shit could happen.
@@nickkiller-0710 Well speaking about X4, how about the reveal that you were playing as the entity responsible for the entire conflict of the X series, when we found out Zero was the OG Maverick and infected Sigma?
In relation to the Sonic Heroes section, one game that was a surprising hit when I visited a friend of mine this summer was Balan Wonderworld in co-op. Balan Wonderworld's co-op allows your two player characters to stick together by touching each other. When magnetised together both players are able to control your two characters as one unit, only breaking apart when both players move away from each other. But most importantly - by sticking to each other, your individual powerups can be used together. Suddenly, the game is no longer a one button game. Want a weapon and a jump ability at the same time? Together you can do that. Want the speed-up 50% of the time power-up 100% of the time? Time your activation with your partner and you're going fast forever. Want a speed-up and a glide at the same time? Sure, go wild! You can end up with some silly combos that can launch you across the levels and explore in ways the game was clearly never designed for - but it was compelling to experiment with mixing and matching the tools and seeing what we could come up with. When we looked up discussions of the game afterwards we were surprised to see just how little attention there was for this mode. I thought even despite the game's dire reputation that at least someone would have seen the potential in it like we did. Instead we've just been annoying all our other friends by becoming irritating evangelists for it ever since. And I guess that's now spread here too, so, uh, sorry about that. Don't get me wrong, it didn't save Balan or anything, it's still a very flawed game - but I think in the right hands this co-op style could be turned into something special - and seeing Heroes played with three people is only re-affirming that to me. Maybe one day...
@@asbyeternal291 I dont think thats a value of balan tho, i think its that everything is more fun with friends. I didnt enjoy my time with life is strange, but it sure was fun to torture my sister with it
the Adventure era will always be my favorite. Sonic is the best when it try to be a shonen imo haha. I also didn't expect the end of the video to be so *heavy* was quite nice. I've never played 06, but i do love the ideas it went for, it's so bizare. I'm happy that Frontier come back to the forgotten taking itself seriously era.
Frontiers is cringe nostalgia baiting garbage and all it original ideas suck ass. There has been no improvements to sonic recently no matter what anyone might say, just a horizontal shift along the shit spectrum. The talentless hack Ian Flynn has even less originality than Ken Penders. Sonic is still utterly doomed and dead.
I attribute a lot of the current success of sonic right now to one crucial thing: Fans of the series that got into the gaming industry - and then got into Sega. I always remember Aaron Webber, who spent years at Sega's social team, being one of the first "funny social media accounts" before the concept got infuriating. I remember the story of how Sonic Mania likely wouldn't have happened if not for his suggestion - and with it, Sega's renaissance might not have happened either. The late 2010s - 2017 in particular, were very formative years for Sega, I feel. Sonic was learning to take itself seriously again, and Yakuza finally got the recognition it always deserved. I can only imagine everyone at Sega feeling this vindication that all their efforts were finally paying off properly - and it likely only happened because a few dedicated folk decided to push towards it, because Sega themselves felt defeated. It took a fan effort to localize yakuza 5, which then made them localize yakuza 0, and it took one dedicated sonic fan to poke at the idea of getting fans to do ports of the classic sonic games, then mania. Knowing that Aaron Webber is now at Sega's planning team makes me confident that they're only improving from here - we've gone past downhill, now it's time for the dizzying heights.
There’s a bizarrely similar story to that with an indie game that recently came out called Arzette: Jewel of Faramore. It’s a giant send up of the CDI Zelda games, but rather than being a parody, it’s a love letter. It’s a genuinely well made game, and it feels like the creators took a look past all the YTPs (of which they made several) and at how the ideas in the games themselves could have worked.
@@nerdyvids1 Yeah that one's pretty cool. In a similar vein (I definitely remember Zelda 2 being the but of several internet diss sessions back in the day) I think the Zelda 2 Remastered guy put out an original IP based on the gameplay of it, but I can't remember what it was called.
As weird as this sounds, I've lately started to struggle to view games beyond their skeleton of being a bunch of code with set-dressing. So seeing the way you imprint value, often in very unconventional ways that the creators of said games likely never intended, is very inspiring. It actually reminds me a lot of the way fighting game players love their genre and embrace its characters and world fully. I wonder if you ever delved into that audience before?
I love watching fighting games and find the FGC really interesting (definitely a ton more character and passion than E-sports I feel) but I'm kinda crap at the games and don't really have the time to put aside to get good. I respect them from a distance, I suppose
@@Tehsnakerer We in the FGC try to push the idea that the moment you have fun is the moment you pick a character and press buttons. Sometimes there's a feeling of stigma that exhasperates the idea that fighting games are more complicated than they are at their core, which I think is overblown but understandable. Winning is not really the goal as it is learning new things or experiencing a clash of two players' different mindsets. Some content creators such as Thorgi's Arcade loves fighting games and makes retrospective about their history and influence on its fans, and he admits to not being great at the genre. Then there's content creators like Sajam that enjoys bringing in people of any skill level to the FGC. He actually recently hosted a bunch of tournaments, "The Sajam Slam", where the competing players were content creators new to the genre. It was very wholesome. (this may sound like advertisment, but I just found it a fascinating look into a community that tends to enjoy things on a more personal matter, rather than what is seen as "objective" in other circles. I think you might find it interesting as a spectator.)
Ah yes, Sanic. No joke, my sister made her own posters out of printer paper when we were young, and I've got a strong memory of her room having an entire wall dedicated to Shadow the Hedgehog. The room itself no longer exists due to house renovations, but that memory, man... That feels like the proper energy for Sonic to me. EDIT: and now I see the Wario mod of Sonic Adventure 2. CAN'T SAY I WAS EXPECTING THAT
I remember when I learned how the acronym SA stopped meaning Sonic Adventure and was used as a euphemism for a type of assault. Made me feel awkward when I said I was a SA fan.
dude i'm not even 10 minutes in and the way you put your love of SA1 into words makes me feel like ive just rediscovered why i love the game so much myself
For the longest time, Pokecapn's LP of '06 was an absolute favorite of mine. A real casual "we're just kinda wingin' it" vibe about it. In recent years, MattMcmuscles' LP ended up taking the top spot, and I feel it's almost entirely due to Liam being at the controls. Going in completely blind, he brought his usual can-do attitude and gave the game the fairest of chances, while still being critical when necessary (and the rare "okay, this ACTUALLY sucks" moments were worth it). Taking alternate routes in stages (usually to get the Silver Medals), doing side missions I didn't even know existed, feeling that sense of "what could have been" when the game didn't always stick its landings, and genuinely getting excited by parts of the game that were kinda hype, he approached the game in a way I hadn't seen others do and it was such a refreshing change of pace. It's a very fun playthrough for me to revisit.
I don’t want to sound corny but this video really does feel like an adventure. It’s so all over the place but somehow never feels like it’s gone too far, and then loops back around on itself to explore the most important topics. There’s an absurd feeling of nostalgia seeing so many TH-cam videos I watched when I was younger (I remember watching that nerdcubed grass simulator video) discussed in the same context as the same sonic games I played as a kid. This video might be one of your best. These sonic videos of yours are so weird but also so refreshing to watch. I don’t think anyone other than you could have made something like this. Here’s to playing more sonic games wrong in the future.
That whole segment on SA2 and media criticism really struck me. With the rise of assholes like Cinemasins trying to hyper out-logic and oursmart every story or saying it's bad when a character isn't a logic machine, a lot of people's got it in their head that THIS was how you criticize media absolutely shattering their developing media literacy in the process. I was prone to this for awhile especially in my teenage years, and am glad to say for the most part I've outgrown it. I myself am a fan of Somecallmejohnny and have been for over a decade now, and in retrospect his SA2 story section is one of his weakest ones to me. Thankfully it seems a lot more people as a whole are able to overlook logic errors in favor of more emotional storytelling and themes, which I'd consider a good thing.
IIRC, the issue with the Silent Hill 2 remasters was less due to the hardware and more due to Konami having lost the completed gold version of the game and the developers having to work with an earlier less complete build with little in the way of documentation to guide them.
Yup. Square famously also lost the Source Code to the original Kingdom Hearts game and had to work from scratch with the remaster for the KH Collection. It looked great all things considered.
Ah, one of those classic videos that I wish I could upvote twice. I think that "God it feels good to write about Sonic" comes through in the video, this has to be one of your most insightful yet.
Of all the things to make fun of Arin for it seems pretty weird to focus on a scene that is 100% not his fault. "Just don't touch the sticks if you don't want to be launched through the level geometry" is not a good statement.
@@Kirbyoto2098 The thing is, I think it's the other way around. Arin *did* release the stick, which is what caused that to happen. You can see Sonic slow down and stop shortly before phasing through the geometry. And in later levels, similar things happen, where Sonic slows down before suddenly dying, during automated sections. And if that's true, then it is certainly _at least_ 50% his fault. And it could even be argued 100% if he was doing it _on purpose_ to make the game look worse than it was. It's the same guy that made fun of a guide because it didn't give specific directions to the Master Emerald Shards, because he didn't realize they're placed in randomized locations; and then doubled down when the comments called him out on it.
Sometimes in Game Grumps it's very noticeable that Arin didn't finish high school. He lacks problem solving and comprehension skills. And he also made his whole persona online about being a grump at games, so he leans into what works and gets him views.
I was getting genuinely misty-eyed at the conclusion to The TH-camr Game section where you were talking about honest failures and how fandom opinion is largely a passing thing. I think this might be my favorite video of yours! Your script really captured the wide range of contextual factors that go into creating and releasing something. How people react to that is generally one of my favorite topics. Nice work!
"Condemned to Eternal Darkness that's all Too human to forget ever happened" Brilliant Line. Btw, I've been looking forward to this video for a while and it did not disappoint and I feel it's one of your best videos you've done. Your segments on Sonic Adventure 2 and even the third section of 06, I feel was by far the strongest section and personally was the one I think I identified most, regarding how people can view and critique and inherent positives and negatives. Made for a very strong discussing because Frankly while I'm not a huge fan of the game, I completely agree that SA2 is a good example of that sort of subject. Speaking from someone who is not a sonic but has probably similar passion and attachment for other series(Resident Evil would be mine), I'm kind of jealous how well you've written and articulated things on commenting on these subjects, God Speed Snake.
The discussion surrounding “TH-cam Games” to me felt like a much needed shot at putting words to the qualities these kinds of games have Excellent video, a fantastic continuation of Playing Sonic Wrong! While I can’t put my finger on an exact idea, I do think a discussion regarding drastic console version differences can be found with Colors or Generations, how in a way, 2 games are made under one title. Bit out in the open like AdventureDX, but could be interesting.
I love these videos because they don’t mindlessly waste time by ‘analyzing’ every single thing as if it matters. You’ve always focused on the heart, which really impacted me. Cheers
i feel the need to let you know. you've helped me sleep for about 4 years now ive watched all your reviews and at this point have been able to figure out which one im listening to without even turning my monitor back on xd. thank you for your videos i love your content ^-^
I loved this video. Your comment near the end about how the franchise is actually respecting and getting excited about itself is spot on. With Frontiers and the upcoming Shadow stuff, the franchise has really been "embracing the cringe", but in a way that actually takes the good ideas from the more messy titles and refines them, instead of just treating them as mistakes and trying to be in on the joke like in the so-called "Meta" era. I still really like games like Colors and Generations on their own merits, but I LOVED Frontiers for getting closer to that ideal sweet spot of shonen anime-esque presentation where there's room for wacky cartoon animal hijinks, hype-as-fuck battles, and emotionally resonant storytelling and character writing. To your ask for weird ways of playing the future games, maybe try playing through Unleashed through the Generations Unleashed Project? It could be a good way to talk about mods and fan conversions in a similar way you touched upon with BetterSADX and ports/rereleases. Considering it's the only way to play Unleashed on PC without emulation, but it also cuts out more than half the game yet leaves only the "good" parts, it could be an interesting look into how fans themselves treat the task of preserving and/or improving games.
Yeah that's pretty interesting, like, if not going for a 1:1 recreation, what's fair when it comes to deciding what parts of a game should be preserved?
I remember this Generations mod I played that allowed you to play as Classic Sonic in Modern stages and vice versa, that I had fun with the novelty of it for a few hours. There might be something in there about how the same space can be recontextualized when you swap in a completely different character to move through it.
Man this might be some of the best writing you've ever done. You have such a great way of covering complex topics in a way that feels like you can convey the nuance of it, without getting too bogged down in the details. I loved this one a lot. I'd love to talk about my thoughts on everything presented here, but to do that would require writing an entire essay of my own lol. But I do want to say that I really appreciate the stuff you make. It's a kind of pure and personal form of media that is extremely special.
Here's an idea: Play Sonic Rush on a modded Wii U, with the screen setting set to "Top Screen on TV, Bottom Screen on Gamepad", and have that section talk about how the Wii U was both a poorly thought out mess as well as a fascinating piece of technology unlike anything seen before or since, and how hardware gimmicks are kinda dead now.
The moment you asked for suggestions for the next video i already knew exactly what to suggest. Play through all of unleashed on a completed file so you can replay whatever level, and then play through all the day stages back to back, then all the night stages back to back. I will not say what i think you can gleam and subsequently discuss from this experience bc its funnier that way.
Very much appreciate you dropping this in the middle of me experiencing the biggest amount of sonic brainrot I've ever had(i love the little blue bastard so much). Been going through rush and have been having a blast with it except for the 7th special stage and f-zone.
Rush is the shit man. It's really hard but it's such a good game. And as far as debut's for side characters go, it's a good showing for Blaze. It's a shame she's such a nothing character in the modern games.
Regarding ideas for the boost era, you could try doing it WITHOUT using the boost. Once you take out the defining characteristic of an era, what are you left with? Can a game survive or even thrive if you do without its main component? Can you use what’s left to replace that part? Plus, it’s a good segue into self imposed challenges, and new ways to replay games. Have you seen what people have done to Mario 64 to avoid pressing the A button? How Pokemon completely changes when a nuzlocke player needs to dive deep into Pokemon strategy?
For Unleashed, play all the day content at once, and then all the night content at once. The ratio and pacing of the two has always been something I can never decide how much it affects my opinion of the game.
I feel like it's going to take me several rewatches of this video to get to grips with all the wordplays and clever little twists you throw into writing these. More than once I had to pause and rewind because something you said set my mind running and I stopped paying attention to the current topic.
I feel like the best way to tackle Generations would be with the Super Mario 64 mod, as a way to segue into fans preserving games independently of their parent companies through source code leaks, recreations, modding as a whole, etc. It's a pretty deep pool to talk about regarding older games, especially as a flip-side to the remaster/official port topic you covered here.
Definitely making a video about youtube and the internet zeitgeist with sonic b-roll truly achieves doing "talking about playing sonic the wrong way" in a wrong (but interesting) way.
For boost ideas, you could try the Mario 64 mod for Generations. It could potentially open up some discussion of mod scenes in general, the unleashed project for Generations (which could link with a discussion of how a lot of people prefer to ignore that werehog stages exist), the mario 64 PC port and other reverse engineering projects, Sega's laissez faire approach to fangames and mods, or just talking about movement in platformers (Mario 64 is famously designed to "just be fun to move around" but place it in generations levels and you get tedium and jank). I don't really give much of a shit about sonic outside of 2 and generations though so I got no idea for the rest of the boost games. Maybe an F rank only speedrun or something? Could maybe prompt some discussion about scoring systems, like exploring how some shmups become completely different games when you get good at them and are going for high scores instead of just survival or how character action games often rely on you caring about your score/rank in order to get any sort of enjoyment out of them.
I was absolutely hooked with this one. Aside from being an era I have great nostalgia for, the discussions about how games work, not only literally but how they also work in our heads is very interesting to me, I especially loved your "gimmick" for 06. It's definitely hard to have anything fresh come out of 06 discussion nowadays, but this sure was a treat. Funny how I only really guessed the gimmick for SA1, but that was also mixed in with my own experiences of jank that is, apparently, not that uncommon. My first time playing Adventure DX was from a sketchy game compilation disc that my grandparents' PC used to have - and this obviously pirated copy of SA1 came with a very amusing little quirk. Everything was perfectly okay (Well, as okay as DX can be), except for the fact that every single instance of a song in the game was instead replaced with Windy Valley Act 1. And I mean... *every* song. Made moments like Gamma's ending, Tikal getting trampled and even Super Sonic in his entirety hilarious and tonally dissonant. As for tossing my hat into the ring of suggestions, I have a couple. Well, mostly for conversation topics rather than gimmicks. For the Storybook games, I think it'd be interesting to discuss how forced gimmicks or gaming peripherals (and the gigantic trend they were) are a massively double edged sword as they can backfire very hard. You'd think it'd have died with the Wii, but here's the Switch still having motion controls with its joycons. Maybe a discussion on controllers as a whole? As for the gimmick... It'd be a spin on the whole "give me the controller, you're playing it wrong" by actually having someone else play it for you, while you shout at them what to do. It sounds completely unviable and cumbersome and im not sure how it can even work, but hey, could be worth exploring. Alternatively, swap buttons around, so that you have to do an extra mental step when the game tells you to press a specific button, but you have that button assigned to something else. As for the boost games in general, how the over-abundance of visuals and particles and post processing end up masking the complete lack of depth in the actual game. Reminds me of how you turned off motion blur for the driving in White Gold because it was attempting to mask how slow you actually were going. Basically, attempting to hide the lack of substance under immense layers of "style". Maybe crank up the visuals of the games so far off into insane numbers that you're borderline blinded by VFX. Or just play Unwiished. That'd be funny too. That could unironically sprout a conversation about how certain games turned into completely different ones when ported to other consoles. Other examples could be Spider-Man Web of Shadows on PS2, turned into a 2D brawler.
While I don't have something so concrete in mind for Unleashed, I think there's merit in comparing the versions both with eachother, but also with Sonic Rush. The HD version is the one that "stuck", but it's also the version that had less impact? The SD version was done by Dimps, who obviously were Sonic veterans, and the next Boost era game took just as much from SD Unleashed as it did from HD; hell, it was on an SD system, not to mention Unleashed's unique shaders being tossed to the wayside for the rest of the HE1 era.
The worst case of a popular Internet video setting the negative public perception of a game is Hbomberguys video on Fallout 3. To this day, I have to see F3 get shit on and presented as the worst fallout game, even in videos that have literally nothing to do with fallout, all because the creator supposedly likes New Vegas. It's depressing 😞
That's an opinion I got secondhand and I didn't even watch that video. But anyone saying it's the worst Fallout game when 4 or 76 or that one really bad isometric shooter exists is insane. I do howevwr subscribe to the idea that Bethesda doesn't really get what Fallout was supposed to be, both from videos on the older games and from my limited exposure to playing them.
@@manjackson2772 No but people to this day single 3 out as the game that ruined Fallout or whatever else people like to say about it and that video is part of why.
The thing that gets me about the chaos control thing is that like - its exactly the same principle as the end of Jojo Part 3 with Dio and Jotaro realizing he could stop time too. Given the similarities of the power set and popularity of Jojo at the time in japan it's very likely this was an intentional reference that your supposed to have picked up the parallels with as a Japanese kid.
I'm only about 40 minutes in, but I don't think it's really possible to talk about Sonic, much less this era of the franchise, WITHOUT mentioning how it was perceived and judged by the internet at the time compared to now. I don't think a single game series has really seen the type of evolution that Sonic discourse has, for better and worse.
I wish the internet hadn't ruined Sonic Adventure for me. The fanbase has been so disgustingly elitist and toxic about it that my enjoyment has been destroyed. Sonic just kinda hurts now.
I think a simple one that would be hard to show in videos would be playing the rush series holding the ds vertically. And then using this as a way to showcase how sonic has approached being mobile over 2 decades.
First and foremost, your content has been a part of my life for a good while and always provides years of entertainment. Seeing you review a game I’ve held highly and with reverence along with your description of sonic adventure’s gameplay being absolutely on point really made my evening. Cheers 🍻
I vote properly speedrunning Generations, actively skip all story, bonuses and optional knicknacks and abuse tricks to cheese everything Generations was a summation of the "gotta go fast" series At the time it wanted to stay the hell away from its own ow-the-edge history and just be "silly fast jump game" And it did actually play pretty good, lead to some funny mods But that was it And the topic is "pure gameplay and quality vs story, presentation, art, meaning, legacy, overambitious jank etc"
I don't give a shit about Sonic but the SA2 part of this video might be my favourite section of any video I've watched this year. I truly can't overstate my love of this channel's earnestness and open-mindedness in approaching storytelling and critique no matter the subject. Not to mention the cracking jokes as always. Premium content ❤
Seeing this continued Is a lovely thing to see The only thing I can think of for Sonic colors Is to think of better jokes to use than the ones they've used in cutscenes Although I don't know if that's wrong so maybe just playing The remaster but that feels like cheating to me for some reason
A suggestion I have is to stream one of the games to someone who doesn't know the game's story in Japanese or a language they don't understand to see how well they can guess what's actually happening right. Kinda inspired from what you did in that old Jojo's Bizarre Adventure video you made where you showed people not familiar with the series what they thought the story was just using the panels.
Oh thank the heavens I have something to watch to get me through this boring shift. Impeccable timing as ever Snake, you sure live up to the speed of the blue hedge and yellow ant.
The Section on overly literal critique and people who are supposedly "objectively" analyzing a piece of media ironically understanding less of it than a more casual viewer very much resonated with me There's a certain podcast, which I will not name (because its fans are a bit... weird) that I stopped watching for this very reason. Even when it was PAINFULLY obvious that a point that had been made would be elaborated on, challenged or otherwise expanded upon just a minute later, they would still pause the video and discuss for minutes on end how it made "literally no sense"... only to then be disproven 30 seconds later by the very same video. And this would continue ad nauseum for potentially hours of a full podcast dragging on... and on... and on... and on... And its not like I'd seen these videos ahead of time or anything, it was my first time seeing them too, yet these people couldn't help themselves but take everything at 200% face value, to the point that they missed the bloody forest for the trees. Your comparison of people going through "stages" as they grow up and consume media I think is very succinct, because I believe a lot of people fail to realize that "rational" intelligence is not the only thing necessary to understand and challenge media. Emotional intelligence is of equal or perhaps greater value, but also requires that the person earnestly engage with the piece of media and try their best to be forthcoming and understanding, at least for a time. In other words, it takes maturity to see a story for its face value, its deeper value and the things hidden between the lines But hey, its much easier to just be snarky and impatient, then actually properly engage with something, right? Anyway, weird rant over, thank you Snake for making me think and putting into words what often miffs me with certain "critics" out there
This video was a blast! I remember enjoying the first video on playing Sonic wrong well enough (should rewatch it to refresh my memory), and was not expecting this behemoth and a half. And it brings out a lot of topics that frankly aren’t talked about enough. I honestly feel bad that I never get to the point of conceptualizing topics like this in my head or on paper. That being said, I so hope the next video is some jank galore video game. Can't get enough of those.
I myself has had an interesting journey with Sonic over the last year when after playing Pizza Tower and absolutely adoring it, I decided to give the classic-style games another go after trying and bouncing off of them for years by forcing myself to beat Mania and the genesis games. This led to me completely re-assessing many of the preconceived notions I had not just about Sonic but how to approach gaming in general, as I more or less forced myself to like Sonic after playing most of the well-received titles. I've began to branch out into genres I've previously always told myself I didn't like because I got bored partly through, particularly RPGs, when in reality I just had to acclimate myself and understand what these games are trying to do instead of writing them off because I wasn't 100% entertained every second of it. In a way, Sonic has reignited the joy gaming brought to me in the past that had begun to wane due to constantly playing the same sorts of experiences over and over again.
It's funny, that's kinda why I started doing these videos 11 years back, felt in a slump with gaming and was trying to make myself see them more... Organically? again, force myself to branch out and tackle them differently, and there's been some ups and downs and rediscoveries but I think it has given me a broader appreciation of games in the process
@@Tehsnakerer Something valuable I learned while forcing myself to like Sonic is that trying to dissect _why_ I like the types of games I like, beyond the simple "because it's fun" or "because it's cool" and trying to find those aspects in the games I normally bounce off of. It helps that I had the desire to be a gaming youtuber growing up, so I tend to approach games from a similar analytic lens your videos do.
This video actually cements you as my favorite youtuber, as someone whos watched your yakuza 5 video twice lmfao, you just do it in a way no one else does man!
it's interesting watching this series as somebody.. not into sonic. the amount each section is About Sonic varies, even while using it as a springboard to discuss other topics. it's good. i like this random scattering of topics using a personal interest to tie them together, it feels natural
Loved this one. Worth the wait 100%, I have never seen someone explain my thoughts on sa2 (it’s the coolest shit ever, literally unmatched, shadow is goated, I never, ever want to play it over sa1). Also top of my head, unleashed can’t be modded on a console, and doing the video on a pc port of the daytime segments would feel cheap, so I’d suggest to talk about the incredible boost gameplay for like 4 minutes and then have over an hour of analysis about the werehog gameplay as if it were part of one of your yakuza videos would be goated. The idea of you talking about how something like shield cancelling turned that half of the game into a blast for you is what I’m hoping to see, cause I do think it’s underrated when gone at as an actual game instead of as a chore. I think it could be used to talk about experimentation within a target audience’s range as a result. And if you don’t want to write another yakuza type video I totally get it, but keep in mind by the time you get to editing playing sonic wrong 3 you’ll probably be a while removed from your video about Yakuza 9: Return of Shimano
The way you talked about the earnestness of Sonic Adventure era stories kinda gives me a connection that might actually help me appreciate them more: Crush 40. Their music too was the coolest thing ever when I was younger. Then I grew up and saw it as kind of am ironic pleasure since it was a bit cringeworthy. But honestly, putting such earnestness into the songs makes them really endearing even oast being just really damn solid melodies. With how connected the band and Sonic are, I think they're also perfectly analogous to one another.
Snake is a speed type, Sweed is a flying type, TH-cam's hotcyder is a power type
Grass grows, birds fly and Sonic fans mock Arin Hanson. Never change, fellas
We need just one thing to unite us and if it's gonna be this shared pisstaking we gotta take that piss
@@TehsnakererWe stand together, brother
@@Tehsnakerer Monkeys together piss
Why he was ever considered for ambassador we'll never know
@@mahohiyajo3137because SEGA saw the Wendy's Twitter account and thought being represented by a snarky hater is a 300iq ironic move
Sonic Unleashed but you only play the day/night stages when it's day/night irl. It will really make you *feel* like Sonic.
Will it make him feel the exaggerated swagger of a blue hedgehog though?
But also when playing at night he needs to wear wrist-weights while his hands submerged in honey
Oh god, Eggmanland...
"Gentrified Jank" What a horrible term. I am stealing that.
I know from the Yakuza videos that Tehsnakerer is the Champion of Gentrification
That bit about being unable to find any evidence that people "turned" on SA2's story plays well with the theory I've had for ages now: the Sonic fanbase exists as an anti-echo chamber, where everyone is trapped in an endless cycle of gaslighting themselves that the latest hot take is actually popular concensus.
'If I may be pedantic- and I may, it's 65.5% of the gig after all-' I think that's a new standard of excellent bad joke for Snake. I don't mind it, you know.
Your talk about games' legacies and preservation really highlights one of your biggest strengths as a writer/critic. You're very good at getting into serious topics about things like artistic intent and integrity, the value of emotional connections to imperfect creations, and the joy of watching as people change as creators over time, all without ever getting pretentious or talking down to the viewer. You always come across as a normal guy who has a passion for games, the people who make them, and how we interact with them, and not someone trying to act above everyone else like a lot of video essayists do.
The segment in your Yakuza 5 about the franchise being one of the most mature ones out there is another great example, as is the extensive deep dive you did into why Saints Row (the new one)'s writing and characters just fall apart at the seams the more you think about them instead of taking the easy route of screaming "woke".
I do feel I have an ego, I try to keep it in check for videos. I do find there are certain topics which are held back by people treating them as things which demand utmost respect and kinda makes you sound like a wanker talking about them and really put people off. Approach them like they're anything else, have a bit of a laugh while still respecting them and I think more people would be happy to talk about artistic intent, preservation, legacy and so on, but they're so agrandised that I think people feel they have to treat them extra-reverentially
@@TehsnakererI think you hit the nail on the head that some people are held back by being TOO respectful of certain topics when discussing them. As though they're worried about being seen as some kind of philistine if they don't make a show of acknowledging the importance of the subject, so they break out the thesaurus to sound sophisticated. They clearly don't know that the deepest conversations you'll ever have are when everyone involved is at least one beer in and sharing a plate of nachos or other snack food.
Also, most people have a bit of an ego, it's a common result of human psychology where we're predisposed to view ourselves in a positive light. Recognizing it and knowing to dial it back just means that you've got enough emotional intelligence to do so.
@@nerdyvids1 You can certainly see it that way for some subjects, but I think many of us just naturally prefer valuing our compassion more. Not for a logical reason (it's not about being a smartass or winning an argument as the goal), but we choose what we value more for ourselves and our relation to others. And I think that's fine to acknowledge.
@@Tehsnakerer the Ego bit is very true. Recently unsubscribed from a TH-camr I initially liked because a lot of his content was him making his topics sound extremely grand and was using it mostly to fuel his own ego, not to mention that he REALLY likes to make fun of stupid people. It got old.
Sonic was never hood [BUZZER SOUND]
Sonic was never food [BUZZER SOUND]
Sonic was never wood [EXTREMELY LOUD BUZZER SOUND]
Sonic is more hood than people give him credit for. You'd be surprised how many big rappers cite Sonic as their inspiration for getting into the genre.
@@HOTD108_ yeah thats why the buzzer played?
Hmm, yes, sonic IS blood
Yeah I really appreciate the earnestness of this particular era. I also have an increased awareness of how the series has been perceived online and how that perception has changed over the past two decades. It's funny to think about the amount of people who have watched playthroughs or videos about Sonic 06 versus how many people have actually played the game. The kids today see Sonic 06 and think "Sonic? Oh, sick!", what a time to be alive.
It's fascinating how fan perception changes over time. It reminds me of how the Star Wars prequels went from reviled to beloved.
Please have my children
Do more netlore
As someone that actually DID play 06, the Sonic levels are decently fun. Was fun to see how low I could get the timer from abusing the gems.
24/7 slowdown baby
There's my favorite /v/ e-celeb!
PERFECTLY BANAL COMMENT VAGUELY IN RELATION TO THE VIDEO SO AS TO BOOST ENGAGEMENT ON THE ALGORITHM
GENERIC BUT EARNEST THANKS
REPLYING TO BOOST ENGAGEMENT.
ENGAGEMENT REPLY THAT I DESPERATELY HOPE WILL GAIN ME LIKES, OUT OF A FUTILE NEED TO BE LOVED
SNARKY REPLY THAT MAKES ME LOOK LIKE AN ASSHAT IN AN ATTEMPT TO BE NOTEWORTHY
UNFUNNY EDGY JOKE
"I am Shadow the Hedgehog, the ultimate frycook in this McDonalds kitchen. I will use my skills to pay the bills, THIS IS WHO I AM!"
Tehsnakerer STILL making my head hurt with alliteration and rhyming, but I'm not fighting it anymore. His linguistic codes have rewritten me.
I think the main reason why sonic adventure 2 is called sonic adventure 2 is because the devteam adores duality
Ah, Sonic Heroes. The source of one man's gamer dementia.
Greetings my fellow Ross Scott fan!
Greetings my fellow OneyPlays fan! Would you like to sharpen a pencil?
cirno ⁉
Shaa!
@@viscountrainbows2857 Awards time! First award: Shaa!
"All we can ever really do is say what we feel right now" is such a powerful quote from a video about Sonic video games. Thank you for another banger.
That bit where you said one of the characters is the Shinada of Sonic, and the 6 PoV character side-by-side shot, reminded me so much of Yakuza 5 that I started to see the "YUME" pop-up on-screen when you mention the word 'dream' even when you didn't do that.
I think your "YUME" bit has unintentionally become a pavlovian MK ultra thing for me :S
I really loved the section about how a narrative around a game is shaped by reactions to alleged mostly unfounded perceptions to it. I feel another great example of this is Doom 3 where people say "People don't get it because they're expecting a classic Doom game when it's actually an action survival horror" which is such a popular talking point at this point Doom 3 is known as a mistunderstood horror game when in reality it's way closer to like Half Life
As someone who has seen others dismiss the idea that stories that play with ludicrous concepts can also tackle deeper themes or ideas…
Thank you.
It’s something that bothers me when people don’t try to engage a story on its terms because “Oh this boss attacks with bees” or the like.
(A specific example I know. Yes the Game in question is Metal Gear Solid 3. No I do not think the person has good taste.)
To see someone willingly to engage with earnest stories with earnestness… means a lot to me.
Sonic holds a dear place in my childhood, even if I can’t claim to have played most of the Franchise.
Or even be good at the ones I have played.
But the character of free spirited blue speedster has kept me interested in this series despite it all.
I loved Adventure for Dreamcast unironically as a kid, and now semi ironically as a grown man-child for how it tries so many things it is not qualified to do with stupid levels of confidence. It's a monumental checklist of completely absurd ideas (Fishing Levels) and narrative decisions (Chao massacre scene) that should have been cut at the drawing board but were put in anyway. I love it.
I really miss how in the early 2000s you had these games that were mostly targeted towards children trying to "grow up" with their audience and leading to absurd scenarios.
I'll never forget when in MegaMan X4 they reveal that your sidekick was actually a bad guy with a cutscene of him just cutting a few reploids apart and there's blood flying everywhere and people screaming in pain.
It was actually kind of thrilling to play games back then because you never knew what kind of crazy shit could happen.
@@nickkiller-0710 Well speaking about X4, how about the reveal that you were playing as the entity responsible for the entire conflict of the X series, when we found out Zero was the OG Maverick and infected Sigma?
I'll watch the whole vid after I wake up, but man am I glad the randomizer's intro was the intro you posted on twitter. It's such a perfect sync.
In relation to the Sonic Heroes section, one game that was a surprising hit when I visited a friend of mine this summer was Balan Wonderworld in co-op.
Balan Wonderworld's co-op allows your two player characters to stick together by touching each other. When magnetised together both players are able to control your two characters as one unit, only breaking apart when both players move away from each other.
But most importantly - by sticking to each other, your individual powerups can be used together.
Suddenly, the game is no longer a one button game.
Want a weapon and a jump ability at the same time?
Together you can do that.
Want the speed-up 50% of the time power-up 100% of the time?
Time your activation with your partner and you're going fast forever.
Want a speed-up and a glide at the same time?
Sure, go wild!
You can end up with some silly combos that can launch you across the levels and explore in ways the game was clearly never designed for - but it was compelling to experiment with mixing and matching the tools and seeing what we could come up with.
When we looked up discussions of the game afterwards we were surprised to see just how little attention there was for this mode. I thought even despite the game's dire reputation that at least someone would have seen the potential in it like we did.
Instead we've just been annoying all our other friends by becoming irritating evangelists for it ever since. And I guess that's now spread here too, so, uh, sorry about that.
Don't get me wrong, it didn't save Balan or anything, it's still a very flawed game - but I think in the right hands this co-op style could be turned into something special - and seeing Heroes played with three people is only re-affirming that to me.
Maybe one day...
@@asbyeternal291 I dont think thats a value of balan tho, i think its that everything is more fun with friends. I didnt enjoy my time with life is strange, but it sure was fun to torture my sister with it
that sounds fascinating. Shame it's something hidden behind something that evidently not a lot of people weer aware of.
the Adventure era will always be my favorite. Sonic is the best when it try to be a shonen imo haha. I also didn't expect the end of the video to be so *heavy* was quite nice. I've never played 06, but i do love the ideas it went for, it's so bizare. I'm happy that Frontier come back to the forgotten taking itself seriously era.
The best and only era, shadow
Frontiers is cringe nostalgia baiting garbage and all it original ideas suck ass.
There has been no improvements to sonic recently no matter what anyone might say, just a horizontal shift along the shit spectrum. The talentless hack Ian Flynn has even less originality than Ken Penders. Sonic is still utterly doomed and dead.
Absolutely same and live and learn will never not go hard the final story in general just makes me emotional th biolizard is such a deku aspect
I attribute a lot of the current success of sonic right now to one crucial thing: Fans of the series that got into the gaming industry - and then got into Sega. I always remember Aaron Webber, who spent years at Sega's social team, being one of the first "funny social media accounts" before the concept got infuriating. I remember the story of how Sonic Mania likely wouldn't have happened if not for his suggestion - and with it, Sega's renaissance might not have happened either.
The late 2010s - 2017 in particular, were very formative years for Sega, I feel. Sonic was learning to take itself seriously again, and Yakuza finally got the recognition it always deserved. I can only imagine everyone at Sega feeling this vindication that all their efforts were finally paying off properly - and it likely only happened because a few dedicated folk decided to push towards it, because Sega themselves felt defeated.
It took a fan effort to localize yakuza 5, which then made them localize yakuza 0, and it took one dedicated sonic fan to poke at the idea of getting fans to do ports of the classic sonic games, then mania. Knowing that Aaron Webber is now at Sega's planning team makes me confident that they're only improving from here - we've gone past downhill, now it's time for the dizzying heights.
Hell yeah, that's a great write up and I feel you're onto something
There’s a bizarrely similar story to that with an indie game that recently came out called Arzette: Jewel of Faramore. It’s a giant send up of the CDI Zelda games, but rather than being a parody, it’s a love letter. It’s a genuinely well made game, and it feels like the creators took a look past all the YTPs (of which they made several) and at how the ideas in the games themselves could have worked.
@@nerdyvids1 I love Arzette for signifying that we're at the point where funny things from ~20 years ago are looked upon with genuine fondness.
@@nerdyvids1 Yeah that one's pretty cool. In a similar vein (I definitely remember Zelda 2 being the but of several internet diss sessions back in the day) I think the Zelda 2 Remastered guy put out an original IP based on the gameplay of it, but I can't remember what it was called.
Yakuza 5 and 0 weren't localised by fans lmao, both got official localisations by the same teams that had localised the earlier titles as well.
we are so back
As weird as this sounds, I've lately started to struggle to view games beyond their skeleton of being a bunch of code with set-dressing. So seeing the way you imprint value, often in very unconventional ways that the creators of said games likely never intended, is very inspiring. It actually reminds me a lot of the way fighting game players love their genre and embrace its characters and world fully. I wonder if you ever delved into that audience before?
I love watching fighting games and find the FGC really interesting (definitely a ton more character and passion than E-sports I feel) but I'm kinda crap at the games and don't really have the time to put aside to get good. I respect them from a distance, I suppose
@@Tehsnakerer We in the FGC try to push the idea that the moment you have fun is the moment you pick a character and press buttons. Sometimes there's a feeling of stigma that exhasperates the idea that fighting games are more complicated than they are at their core, which I think is overblown but understandable.
Winning is not really the goal as it is learning new things or experiencing a clash of two players' different mindsets. Some content creators such as Thorgi's Arcade loves fighting games and makes retrospective about their history and influence on its fans, and he admits to not being great at the genre. Then there's content creators like Sajam that enjoys bringing in people of any skill level to the FGC. He actually recently hosted a bunch of tournaments, "The Sajam Slam", where the competing players were content creators new to the genre. It was very wholesome.
(this may sound like advertisment, but I just found it a fascinating look into a community that tends to enjoy things on a more personal matter, rather than what is seen as "objective" in other circles. I think you might find it interesting as a spectator.)
Ah yes, Sanic. No joke, my sister made her own posters out of printer paper when we were young, and I've got a strong memory of her room having an entire wall dedicated to Shadow the Hedgehog. The room itself no longer exists due to house renovations, but that memory, man...
That feels like the proper energy for Sonic to me.
EDIT: and now I see the Wario mod of Sonic Adventure 2. CAN'T SAY I WAS EXPECTING THAT
honey not now, the pun man is playing sonic wrong again
WE MAKING IT OUT OF GREEN HILL ZONE WITH THIS ONE BOYS
(if Sega actually lets us do that)
I remember when I learned how the acronym SA stopped meaning Sonic Adventure and was used as a euphemism for a type of assault. Made me feel awkward when I said I was a SA fan.
My mind conjured a joke response to this but it doesn't belong in a YT comment section
I guess that's one point to the otherwise extravagant title of SADX
I don't want to know what an SA: Director's Cut is.
dude i'm not even 10 minutes in and the way you put your love of SA1 into words makes me feel like ive just rediscovered why i love the game so much myself
SA1's level design is a big reason why it's my favourite Sonic game.
For the longest time, Pokecapn's LP of '06 was an absolute favorite of mine. A real casual "we're just kinda wingin' it" vibe about it.
In recent years, MattMcmuscles' LP ended up taking the top spot, and I feel it's almost entirely due to Liam being at the controls. Going in completely blind, he brought his usual can-do attitude and gave the game the fairest of chances, while still being critical when necessary (and the rare "okay, this ACTUALLY sucks" moments were worth it). Taking alternate routes in stages (usually to get the Silver Medals), doing side missions I didn't even know existed, feeling that sense of "what could have been" when the game didn't always stick its landings, and genuinely getting excited by parts of the game that were kinda hype, he approached the game in a way I hadn't seen others do and it was such a refreshing change of pace. It's a very fun playthrough for me to revisit.
Pokecapn LP mention!! God that series made so many of my childhood evenings
I don’t want to sound corny but this video really does feel like an adventure. It’s so all over the place but somehow never feels like it’s gone too far, and then loops back around on itself to explore the most important topics. There’s an absurd feeling of nostalgia seeing so many TH-cam videos I watched when I was younger (I remember watching that nerdcubed grass simulator video) discussed in the same context as the same sonic games I played as a kid.
This video might be one of your best. These sonic videos of yours are so weird but also so refreshing to watch. I don’t think anyone other than you could have made something like this. Here’s to playing more sonic games wrong in the future.
Sonic Boost Era, but you choose to walk
sonic leas... forget I even tried to talk.
That whole segment on SA2 and media criticism really struck me. With the rise of assholes like Cinemasins trying to hyper out-logic and oursmart every story or saying it's bad when a character isn't a logic machine, a lot of people's got it in their head that THIS was how you criticize media absolutely shattering their developing media literacy in the process. I was prone to this for awhile especially in my teenage years, and am glad to say for the most part I've outgrown it. I myself am a fan of Somecallmejohnny and have been for over a decade now, and in retrospect his SA2 story section is one of his weakest ones to me. Thankfully it seems a lot more people as a whole are able to overlook logic errors in favor of more emotional storytelling and themes, which I'd consider a good thing.
It took Shadow in Sonic the Hedgehog 3 movie for him to come back. Take note...
IIRC, the issue with the Silent Hill 2 remasters was less due to the hardware and more due to Konami having lost the completed gold version of the game and the developers having to work with an earlier less complete build with little in the way of documentation to guide them.
Yup. Square famously also lost the Source Code to the original Kingdom Hearts game and had to work from scratch with the remaster for the KH Collection. It looked great all things considered.
Ah, one of those classic videos that I wish I could upvote twice. I think that "God it feels good to write about Sonic" comes through in the video, this has to be one of your most insightful yet.
9:04 The subtle Game Grumps shade is perfection.
Of all the things to make fun of Arin for it seems pretty weird to focus on a scene that is 100% not his fault. "Just don't touch the sticks if you don't want to be launched through the level geometry" is not a good statement.
@@Kirbyoto2098 The thing is, I think it's the other way around. Arin *did* release the stick, which is what caused that to happen. You can see Sonic slow down and stop shortly before phasing through the geometry. And in later levels, similar things happen, where Sonic slows down before suddenly dying, during automated sections.
And if that's true, then it is certainly _at least_ 50% his fault. And it could even be argued 100% if he was doing it _on purpose_ to make the game look worse than it was.
It's the same guy that made fun of a guide because it didn't give specific directions to the Master Emerald Shards, because he didn't realize they're placed in randomized locations; and then doubled down when the comments called him out on it.
Sometimes in Game Grumps it's very noticeable that Arin didn't finish high school. He lacks problem solving and comprehension skills. And he also made his whole persona online about being a grump at games, so he leans into what works and gets him views.
11 minutes in and there are already so many sly puns that i lost count of them, this is why you're my favorite reviewer Snakerer
I was getting genuinely misty-eyed at the conclusion to The TH-camr Game section where you were talking about honest failures and how fandom opinion is largely a passing thing. I think this might be my favorite video of yours! Your script really captured the wide range of contextual factors that go into creating and releasing something. How people react to that is generally one of my favorite topics. Nice work!
Only now am I finding out there's a mod to fix SA2 PC's stick calibration issues. Thank fuck.
I felt a stab of pain in my heart when you said the gamecube was your 4th place console. Great video as always! Hope you have been doing well
"Condemned to Eternal Darkness that's all Too human to forget ever happened"
Brilliant Line.
Btw, I've been looking forward to this video for a while and it did not disappoint and I feel it's one of your best videos you've done. Your segments on Sonic Adventure 2 and even the third section of 06, I feel was by far the strongest section and personally was the one I think I identified most, regarding how people can view and critique and inherent positives and negatives. Made for a very strong discussing because Frankly while I'm not a huge fan of the game, I completely agree that SA2 is a good example of that sort of subject. Speaking from someone who is not a sonic but has probably similar passion and attachment for other series(Resident Evil would be mine), I'm kind of jealous how well you've written and articulated things on commenting on these subjects,
God Speed Snake.
The discussion surrounding “TH-cam Games” to me felt like a much needed shot at putting words to the qualities these kinds of games have
Excellent video, a fantastic continuation of Playing Sonic Wrong!
While I can’t put my finger on an exact idea, I do think a discussion regarding drastic console version differences can be found with Colors or Generations, how in a way, 2 games are made under one title. Bit out in the open like AdventureDX, but could be interesting.
This was not what I expected from a Sonic video. I forever appreciate you for being so authentic
I love these videos because they don’t mindlessly waste time by ‘analyzing’ every single thing as if it matters. You’ve always focused on the heart, which really impacted me. Cheers
I was about to start drawing when saw this pop up. Your videos are truly a godsend
i feel the need to let you know. you've helped me sleep for about 4 years now ive watched all your reviews and at this point have been able to figure out which one im listening to without even turning my monitor back on xd. thank you for your videos i love your content ^-^
I loved this video. Your comment near the end about how the franchise is actually respecting and getting excited about itself is spot on. With Frontiers and the upcoming Shadow stuff, the franchise has really been "embracing the cringe", but in a way that actually takes the good ideas from the more messy titles and refines them, instead of just treating them as mistakes and trying to be in on the joke like in the so-called "Meta" era. I still really like games like Colors and Generations on their own merits, but I LOVED Frontiers for getting closer to that ideal sweet spot of shonen anime-esque presentation where there's room for wacky cartoon animal hijinks, hype-as-fuck battles, and emotionally resonant storytelling and character writing.
To your ask for weird ways of playing the future games, maybe try playing through Unleashed through the Generations Unleashed Project? It could be a good way to talk about mods and fan conversions in a similar way you touched upon with BetterSADX and ports/rereleases. Considering it's the only way to play Unleashed on PC without emulation, but it also cuts out more than half the game yet leaves only the "good" parts, it could be an interesting look into how fans themselves treat the task of preserving and/or improving games.
Yeah that's pretty interesting, like, if not going for a 1:1 recreation, what's fair when it comes to deciding what parts of a game should be preserved?
I appreciate the restraint to keep Sonic 06’ out of the thumbnail or title
"These stages are playgrounds" ... "You really get to play on-and-off these grounds"
True artistry, you never fail to get a giggle out of me
I remember this Generations mod I played that allowed you to play as Classic Sonic in Modern stages and vice versa, that I had fun with the novelty of it for a few hours. There might be something in there about how the same space can be recontextualized when you swap in a completely different character to move through it.
Snake! You are alive! I'm afraid it's been 9 years
Yeah I had to beat these games with one arm after camp omega
Damn, I felt that "it's been two years" at the start...well glad to see it back.
Unlike that time.
Man this might be some of the best writing you've ever done. You have such a great way of covering complex topics in a way that feels like you can convey the nuance of it, without getting too bogged down in the details. I loved this one a lot. I'd love to talk about my thoughts on everything presented here, but to do that would require writing an entire essay of my own lol. But I do want to say that I really appreciate the stuff you make. It's a kind of pure and personal form of media that is extremely special.
Here's an idea:
Play Sonic Rush on a modded Wii U, with the screen setting set to "Top Screen on TV, Bottom Screen on Gamepad", and have that section talk about how the Wii U was both a poorly thought out mess as well as a fascinating piece of technology unlike anything seen before or since, and how hardware gimmicks are kinda dead now.
The moment you asked for suggestions for the next video i already knew exactly what to suggest. Play through all of unleashed on a completed file so you can replay whatever level, and then play through all the day stages back to back, then all the night stages back to back.
I will not say what i think you can gleam and subsequently discuss from this experience bc its funnier that way.
Very much appreciate you dropping this in the middle of me experiencing the biggest amount of sonic brainrot I've ever had(i love the little blue bastard so much). Been going through rush and have been having a blast with it except for the 7th special stage and f-zone.
Rush is the shit man. It's really hard but it's such a good game. And as far as debut's for side characters go, it's a good showing for Blaze. It's a shame she's such a nothing character in the modern games.
Regarding ideas for the boost era, you could try doing it WITHOUT using the boost.
Once you take out the defining characteristic of an era, what are you left with? Can a game survive or even thrive if you do without its main component? Can you use what’s left to replace that part?
Plus, it’s a good segue into self imposed challenges, and new ways to replay games.
Have you seen what people have done to Mario 64 to avoid pressing the A button? How Pokemon completely changes when a nuzlocke player needs to dive deep into Pokemon strategy?
For Unleashed, play all the day content at once, and then all the night content at once. The ratio and pacing of the two has always been something I can never decide how much it affects my opinion of the game.
I feel like it's going to take me several rewatches of this video to get to grips with all the wordplays and clever little twists you throw into writing these. More than once I had to pause and rewind because something you said set my mind running and I stopped paying attention to the current topic.
I feel like the best way to tackle Generations would be with the Super Mario 64 mod, as a way to segue into fans preserving games independently of their parent companies through source code leaks, recreations, modding as a whole, etc. It's a pretty deep pool to talk about regarding older games, especially as a flip-side to the remaster/official port topic you covered here.
Great! Really enjoyed the last playing Sonic Wrong Video 🤙
This is DSP’s realm, don’t corner his market man lmao
True, no one wins against DSP, but I''m hoping to be the first man to pull of a draw
Your description of Sonic Adventure really took me back. I can't wait to boot it up tomorrow. Great video, my dude!
What a perfect timing!
I was just in the middle of watching the older reviews.
>Eternal Darkness
>Too Human
If intentional, what a swing of quality and content mentioned in the same sentence.
Definitely making a video about youtube and the internet zeitgeist with sonic b-roll truly achieves doing "talking about playing sonic the wrong way" in a wrong (but interesting) way.
For boost ideas, you could try the Mario 64 mod for Generations. It could potentially open up some discussion of mod scenes in general, the unleashed project for Generations (which could link with a discussion of how a lot of people prefer to ignore that werehog stages exist), the mario 64 PC port and other reverse engineering projects, Sega's laissez faire approach to fangames and mods, or just talking about movement in platformers (Mario 64 is famously designed to "just be fun to move around" but place it in generations levels and you get tedium and jank).
I don't really give much of a shit about sonic outside of 2 and generations though so I got no idea for the rest of the boost games. Maybe an F rank only speedrun or something? Could maybe prompt some discussion about scoring systems, like exploring how some shmups become completely different games when you get good at them and are going for high scores instead of just survival or how character action games often rely on you caring about your score/rank in order to get any sort of enjoyment out of them.
I was absolutely hooked with this one. Aside from being an era I have great nostalgia for, the discussions about how games work, not only literally but how they also work in our heads is very interesting to me, I especially loved your "gimmick" for 06. It's definitely hard to have anything fresh come out of 06 discussion nowadays, but this sure was a treat.
Funny how I only really guessed the gimmick for SA1, but that was also mixed in with my own experiences of jank that is, apparently, not that uncommon. My first time playing Adventure DX was from a sketchy game compilation disc that my grandparents' PC used to have - and this obviously pirated copy of SA1 came with a very amusing little quirk. Everything was perfectly okay (Well, as okay as DX can be), except for the fact that every single instance of a song in the game was instead replaced with Windy Valley Act 1. And I mean... *every* song. Made moments like Gamma's ending, Tikal getting trampled and even Super Sonic in his entirety hilarious and tonally dissonant.
As for tossing my hat into the ring of suggestions, I have a couple. Well, mostly for conversation topics rather than gimmicks.
For the Storybook games, I think it'd be interesting to discuss how forced gimmicks or gaming peripherals (and the gigantic trend they were) are a massively double edged sword as they can backfire very hard. You'd think it'd have died with the Wii, but here's the Switch still having motion controls with its joycons. Maybe a discussion on controllers as a whole? As for the gimmick... It'd be a spin on the whole "give me the controller, you're playing it wrong" by actually having someone else play it for you, while you shout at them what to do. It sounds completely unviable and cumbersome and im not sure how it can even work, but hey, could be worth exploring. Alternatively, swap buttons around, so that you have to do an extra mental step when the game tells you to press a specific button, but you have that button assigned to something else.
As for the boost games in general, how the over-abundance of visuals and particles and post processing end up masking the complete lack of depth in the actual game. Reminds me of how you turned off motion blur for the driving in White Gold because it was attempting to mask how slow you actually were going. Basically, attempting to hide the lack of substance under immense layers of "style". Maybe crank up the visuals of the games so far off into insane numbers that you're borderline blinded by VFX.
Or just play Unwiished. That'd be funny too. That could unironically sprout a conversation about how certain games turned into completely different ones when ported to other consoles. Other examples could be Spider-Man Web of Shadows on PS2, turned into a 2D brawler.
While I don't have something so concrete in mind for Unleashed, I think there's merit in comparing the versions both with eachother, but also with Sonic Rush. The HD version is the one that "stuck", but it's also the version that had less impact? The SD version was done by Dimps, who obviously were Sonic veterans, and the next Boost era game took just as much from SD Unleashed as it did from HD; hell, it was on an SD system, not to mention Unleashed's unique shaders being tossed to the wayside for the rest of the HE1 era.
The worst case of a popular Internet video setting the negative public perception of a game is Hbomberguys video on Fallout 3. To this day, I have to see F3 get shit on and presented as the worst fallout game, even in videos that have literally nothing to do with fallout, all because the creator supposedly likes New Vegas. It's depressing 😞
That's an opinion I got secondhand and I didn't even watch that video. But anyone saying it's the worst Fallout game when 4 or 76 or that one really bad isometric shooter exists is insane. I do howevwr subscribe to the idea that Bethesda doesn't really get what Fallout was supposed to be, both from videos on the older games and from my limited exposure to playing them.
@@Calvin_CoolageDid those games even exist when hbomb made his video?
@@manjackson2772 No but people to this day single 3 out as the game that ruined Fallout or whatever else people like to say about it and that video is part of why.
The thing that gets me about the chaos control thing is that like - its exactly the same principle as the end of Jojo Part 3 with Dio and Jotaro realizing he could stop time too. Given the similarities of the power set and popularity of Jojo at the time in japan it's very likely this was an intentional reference that your supposed to have picked up the parallels with as a Japanese kid.
I'm only about 40 minutes in, but I don't think it's really possible to talk about Sonic, much less this era of the franchise, WITHOUT mentioning how it was perceived and judged by the internet at the time compared to now. I don't think a single game series has really seen the type of evolution that Sonic discourse has, for better and worse.
The only thing to rival the ever changing discourse is how Star Wars fans view Star Wars.
I wish the internet hadn't ruined Sonic Adventure for me. The fanbase has been so disgustingly elitist and toxic about it that my enjoyment has been destroyed. Sonic just kinda hurts now.
Fuck me, spooky British guy AND gaming British guy upload on the same day?!? Hell fucking yes!
Out of curiosity who's the other one?
@@zenngarden7322 the Tape Library. If you like spooky shit, he is absolutely the best.
I think a simple one that would be hard to show in videos would be playing the rush series holding the ds vertically.
And then using this as a way to showcase how sonic has approached being mobile over 2 decades.
First and foremost, your content has been a part of my life for a good while and always provides years of entertainment. Seeing you review a game I’ve held highly and with reverence along with your description of sonic adventure’s gameplay being absolutely on point really made my evening. Cheers 🍻
I vote properly speedrunning Generations, actively skip all story, bonuses and optional knicknacks and abuse tricks to cheese everything
Generations was a summation of the "gotta go fast" series
At the time it wanted to stay the hell away from its own ow-the-edge history and just be "silly fast jump game"
And it did actually play pretty good, lead to some funny mods
But that was it
And the topic is "pure gameplay and quality vs story, presentation, art, meaning, legacy, overambitious jank etc"
You've made Heroes sound like a legitimately engaging experience with your experimentation. Props.
I don't give a shit about Sonic but the SA2 part of this video might be my favourite section of any video I've watched this year. I truly can't overstate my love of this channel's earnestness and open-mindedness in approaching storytelling and critique no matter the subject. Not to mention the cracking jokes as always. Premium content ❤
Seeing this continued Is a lovely thing to see The only thing I can think of for Sonic colors Is to think of better jokes to use than the ones they've used in cutscenes
Although I don't know if that's wrong so maybe just playing The remaster but that feels like cheating to me for some reason
A suggestion I have is to stream one of the games to someone who doesn't know the game's story in Japanese or a language they don't understand to see how well they can guess what's actually happening right. Kinda inspired from what you did in that old Jojo's Bizarre Adventure video you made where you showed people not familiar with the series what they thought the story was just using the panels.
Oh thank the heavens I have something to watch to get me through this boring shift. Impeccable timing as ever Snake, you sure live up to the speed of the blue hedge and yellow ant.
The Section on overly literal critique and people who are supposedly "objectively" analyzing a piece of media ironically understanding less of it than a more casual viewer very much resonated with me
There's a certain podcast, which I will not name (because its fans are a bit... weird) that I stopped watching for this very reason. Even when it was PAINFULLY obvious that a point that had been made would be elaborated on, challenged or otherwise expanded upon just a minute later, they would still pause the video and discuss for minutes on end how it made "literally no sense"... only to then be disproven 30 seconds later by the very same video. And this would continue ad nauseum for potentially hours of a full podcast dragging on... and on... and on... and on...
And its not like I'd seen these videos ahead of time or anything, it was my first time seeing them too, yet these people couldn't help themselves but take everything at 200% face value, to the point that they missed the bloody forest for the trees.
Your comparison of people going through "stages" as they grow up and consume media I think is very succinct, because I believe a lot of people fail to realize that "rational" intelligence is not the only thing necessary to understand and challenge media. Emotional intelligence is of equal or perhaps greater value, but also requires that the person earnestly engage with the piece of media and try their best to be forthcoming and understanding, at least for a time. In other words, it takes maturity to see a story for its face value, its deeper value and the things hidden between the lines
But hey, its much easier to just be snarky and impatient, then actually properly engage with something, right?
Anyway, weird rant over, thank you Snake for making me think and putting into words what often miffs me with certain "critics" out there
Always a great day when a new Tehsnakerer vid pops up in my notifications
I missed you man. So happy you are still making art like this. Cant wait for the next vid
oh my god the projared segment had me in stitches, you're such a GOAT snake
Oh thank goodness you’re here snake we need someone to work on this terrible dullness
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a sequel to that video is a surprise to be sure, but a welcome one
This video was a blast! I remember enjoying the first video on playing Sonic wrong well enough (should rewatch it to refresh my memory), and was not expecting this behemoth and a half. And it brings out a lot of topics that frankly aren’t talked about enough. I honestly feel bad that I never get to the point of conceptualizing topics like this in my head or on paper.
That being said, I so hope the next video is some jank galore video game. Can't get enough of those.
I watched the first video for the first time a couple days ago, and realized that Part 2 you promised hadn't come out yet. Perfect timing.
I myself has had an interesting journey with Sonic over the last year when after playing Pizza Tower and absolutely adoring it, I decided to give the classic-style games another go after trying and bouncing off of them for years by forcing myself to beat Mania and the genesis games. This led to me completely re-assessing many of the preconceived notions I had not just about Sonic but how to approach gaming in general, as I more or less forced myself to like Sonic after playing most of the well-received titles.
I've began to branch out into genres I've previously always told myself I didn't like because I got bored partly through, particularly RPGs, when in reality I just had to acclimate myself and understand what these games are trying to do instead of writing them off because I wasn't 100% entertained every second of it. In a way, Sonic has reignited the joy gaming brought to me in the past that had begun to wane due to constantly playing the same sorts of experiences over and over again.
It's funny, that's kinda why I started doing these videos 11 years back, felt in a slump with gaming and was trying to make myself see them more... Organically? again, force myself to branch out and tackle them differently, and there's been some ups and downs and rediscoveries but I think it has given me a broader appreciation of games in the process
@@Tehsnakerer Something valuable I learned while forcing myself to like Sonic is that trying to dissect _why_ I like the types of games I like, beyond the simple "because it's fun" or "because it's cool" and trying to find those aspects in the games I normally bounce off of. It helps that I had the desire to be a gaming youtuber growing up, so I tend to approach games from a similar analytic lens your videos do.
Oh gosh, a snaker vid! Perfect watch during my COVID recovery.
This video actually cements you as my favorite youtuber, as someone whos watched your yakuza 5 video twice lmfao, you just do it in a way no one else does man!
it's interesting watching this series as somebody.. not into sonic. the amount each section is About Sonic varies, even while using it as a springboard to discuss other topics. it's good. i like this random scattering of topics using a personal interest to tie them together, it feels natural
Loved this one. Worth the wait 100%, I have never seen someone explain my thoughts on sa2 (it’s the coolest shit ever, literally unmatched, shadow is goated, I never, ever want to play it over sa1). Also top of my head, unleashed can’t be modded on a console, and doing the video on a pc port of the daytime segments would feel cheap, so I’d suggest to talk about the incredible boost gameplay for like 4 minutes and then have over an hour of analysis about the werehog gameplay as if it were part of one of your yakuza videos would be goated. The idea of you talking about how something like shield cancelling turned that half of the game into a blast for you is what I’m hoping to see, cause I do think it’s underrated when gone at as an actual game instead of as a chore. I think it could be used to talk about experimentation within a target audience’s range as a result. And if you don’t want to write another yakuza type video I totally get it, but keep in mind by the time you get to editing playing sonic wrong 3 you’ll probably be a while removed from your video about Yakuza 9: Return of Shimano
I'm a simple man. I see Tehsnakerer upload a Sonic video and I sit down to watch it.
The way you talked about the earnestness of Sonic Adventure era stories kinda gives me a connection that might actually help me appreciate them more: Crush 40.
Their music too was the coolest thing ever when I was younger. Then I grew up and saw it as kind of am ironic pleasure since it was a bit cringeworthy. But honestly, putting such earnestness into the songs makes them really endearing even oast being just really damn solid melodies.
With how connected the band and Sonic are, I think they're also perfectly analogous to one another.