I'd love to hear more about the Queens of England who have been titled "She-wolves" or the like because they were not willing to just be swept into the quiet meek wife role. As usual fantastic video!
There is a book called 'She Wolves: The Women who ruled England before Elizabeth' by Helen Castor which includes Isabella, Matilda, Eleanor of Aquitaine and Margaret of Anjou. I haven't read it yet (on my shelf waiting) but I have been told it is very good.
Edward was a weak king, he could never live up to his father, he made a lot of bad decisions, ultimately he paid a very heavy price,the dispensers and gaviston just used him to their advantage. Thank you Dr kat, well. Presented and narrated.
Can’t wait for the continuation, Isabella & Mortimer, Edward III’s self-emancipation, etc. English history is so fascinating, as the say “you couldn’t make this stuff up, no one would believe it possible”, but it really happened.
When I was 6 i was given a children's book on kings and queens which said Edward was murdered with a red hot iron. At the time I remember thinking, " ow, nasty way to die, being hit over the head with a red hot iron..." it wasn't till I heard the story again when I was older I realised that's not what was implied.
I think you're thinking of Richard II! I also made the mistake of remembering the rumor as being about Edward II, but when I went back to double check it was Richard.
I think the Despensers thought their favor with the King put them above everyone else and therefore protected. Yes, I think they ignored what happened to Gaveston, and thought they could get anything they wanted. 2. Yes, please have more videos on this time and the She-wolf.
they engaged in criminal actions and as is the nature of most criminals, they think that they will get away with it despite the fate of all those before them. the despenser s had no right to all the properties and power that they grabbed and only the kings power allowed their actions. talk about absolute power corrupting absolutely ...!
I saw you cover this subject and immediately had to watch it. Isabella and her relationships with Edward and his relationships with Gaveston and Despenser is some of my favorite medieval dramas to relate to friends and family not in the know. People think history is boring, but honestly Edward II had the social life of a reality tv show.
You forgot Edward's love of making dry walls and breeding sheep. I love that aspect of him. He's a complicated person. The nobles didn't know when they were well off with Piers - greddy arrogant party boy, but the Despensers were so much more and so much worse.
@@Anna_Key They have a common ancestor: Thomas le Despenser, of Elington (d. 1218). One son Sir Hugh le Despencer fathered his namesake descendants, while another son Geoffrey (possibly named Galfridus) produced what eventually became the present Earl Spencer line.
I'd vote for another video on Edward II and Isabella (though with as little detail about his gruesome end as possible). I'm more interested in how accurate Marlow's play is.
Edward did not have a gruesome end. The hot poker story is just a myth that was propagated after his death. A way to explain a death that left no obvious external explanation. He was likely smothered or drowned.
Thank you for this one: it takes me back. Piers was an early historical obsession of mine, and I remember gathering many bits of documentation about him. In 1980, after graduating Brooklyn College, I was in England on a small Shakespeare scholarship, and one of my friends there drove us both to Warwick Castle, where we looked in vain for Blacklow Hill so that I could properly mourn the event. To my recollection, Piers was overweening, and foolish in the way he gathered enemies, but he had a knack for governing (during his exile to Ireland, he actually did a fairly good job at representing and defending his king without offending the people in power in Ireland), and, had things been more intelligently handled, he might have had a long and successful career. I had a simultaneous obsession with another royal favorite, don Alvaro de Luna, who flourished and fell under the reign of Juan II of Castile. He lasted a lot longer than Piers, though undergoing a similar number of exiles forced upon him by his enemies. I remember drawing up a lot of comparisons between the two sets of relationships.
I feel ashamed I have never heard of her before! But she definitely sounds like my kind of woman and would love to hear more about her! I might just have to go and do some investigating myself this weekend 🙂
@@kelly-annejenner486 there was a series of documentaries here on TH-cam about the English queens that had been dubbed "she-wolves"! I can't remember the exact name but I'm sure it would be easy to find!
@@bajubner I will look it up! I absolutely adore the Tudor period, mainly because it’s all gory and there’s no messing about like there is nowadays, but also thanks to Queen Elizabeth the first! To rule back in those times in married is, in my opinion amazing! But then I think Queen Victoria and our current Queen are also very strong women to look up to and are good role models to how the monarchy should be. Thank you for letting me know about that though I’ll go find it and add to my watch list 🥰
@@kelly-annejenner486 It's a great doco, & it's based on a book of the same name, "She-Wolves" by Helen Castor, which is one of the most enjoyable history books I've ever read. It's also about Empress Matilda, Eleanor of Aquitaine & Margaret of Anjou; other fascinating & powerful queens.
Eward's "strange hobbies" reminds me of George III's interest in agriculture and animal husbandry. I feel like there's a correlation between unconventional rulers and pastoralism...
I always found it interesting that Edward II was so influenced by the Dispensers after the "sticky" end Gaveston had. Logical thought would be he would have learned the lesson of how favorites can negatively influence his court and governance. But in fact he traded one bad influence for an even worse one. Great video, Dr. Kat! And super interesting part of history.
He did not have the intelligence to rule in the first place, incest breeding at it's best outcome, keep the line noble gave some very mentally unstable people
I don't think he was mentally unstable at all. I think he was just very human and probably gay. In love with these men but obliged by society and his rule to have a wife and several heirs, he was blinded by love. We always say love is blind and humans will usually put pleasure and love before obligation i think.
The idea that she is remembered as a she wolf makes me think. I think it’s pretty easy to look back at what she did and say how could she do that or frame her as being violent if you don’t think about what was her alternative. Do we really think she would’ve lived a really long time if she hadn’t taken out those who were moving against her and her children? Was she looking at two choices -one where she was ruthless and put her son on the throne and the alternative being letting her sonCome under the influence and control of the DeSpensers? If she was a man of the time these kinds of political ploy’s were completely acceptable and normal. I think she would make a great subject for a shortseries!!!
She was a woman of her time and those kinds of political ploys were indeed considered acceptable and normal. Being called a she-wolf is not derogatory. It means she was a force to be reckoned with. Her story would make a fantastic series, if done correctly.
@@svargyle I watched a documentary series I think called she wolves, England’s early Queens that pretty much put for the term as being negative and derogatory. It was hung on a lot of these early powerful women and I don’t think it was positive at least according to that doc you series. I do know that you can’t trust one series on a subject though.I would be interested to have a reading the past on the term and the Queens it’s often applied to.
@@BevMargaret it was a great series and early in English history, while there were only 3 "she-wolves" officially, basically almost any Queen from France who acted on her own agency was called a "she-wolf."
@@BevMargaret I would be interested in what contemporaries thought of her as well. If they were against her, politically, they would certainly say negative things, just as anyone would now. Her friends probably were more positive. I suspect a bigger deal was probably made because of her adultery with Mortimer, even if everyone 'understood' why that might happen. I think this subject would make an interesting Dr. Kat video. :)
It seems rather likely Edward II was at least bi-sexual. It is also entirely possible to father children while being gay. Having a son was considered a duty and Edward obviously respected Isabella enough to do his “job”.
I also got the bisexual vibe from him!! how often do historians just sweep this under the rug as "well we can't just extrapolate sexuality since society's expectations were so different" when it could EASILY be explained by a queer theory perspective?? short sighted to just ignore the possibility at all.
It isn’t likely. There is no historical evidence on which to make that assumption. To do so is to project 21st Century social liberalism on a FAR more restrictive 14th Century personality. That is revisionism of the worst kind.
@@MTCason - Why isn’t it likely? Believe it or not there were gay people in the 14th century and his obvious “patronage” of Piers Galveston goes way beyond “friendship”. And also, being gay or bi-sexual does not make one a “liberal”. I think it more a case of projecting 21st century bigotry rather than “social liberalism”. There’s no direct evidence either way. That is why I said “rather likely” than “He was certainly”.
@@vdimasteremeritus In what sense is it 'obvious' that his patronage of Piers went beyond friendship? There were no signs of that and no reports from contemporary chroniclers to suggest it. There's nothing to make it 'rather likely', least of all when Edward produced five children and one of them illegitimate. I'm not a bigot in the slightest but I don't believe in assuming the sexual identity of people who are dead and gone beyond what is evident. Edward I was criticized for his own favoritism towards certain close associates, as was Edward III in his own turn. It was a well-known latter Plantagenet fault, especially after the turbulence reigns of Henry III and Edward II bred natural suspicion and a tendency to distrust those beyond the men (and believe it or not, most of those who had cogent political and military power at the time were MEN) they could trust. The foundation of the Order of the Garter was foremost to bind a select group of knights to Edward III who he could trust to command his armies in France. That certainly doesn't make him homosexual any more than Gaveston or the Despensers do his father.
@@MTCason Aren't you also assuming the sexual identity of a dead person though? It makes just as much sense for him to have been bisexual or gay considering the historical record as it does for him to have been straight. Assuming heterosexuality as the default state doesn't do historical study any favors.
I love that you're going back further in to the middle ages. I find this era much more fascinating since there is necessarily more conjecture, since there are far fewer original sources. I know this isn't a book review channel, but Ian Mortimer's book; Edward III: The Perfect King, has some interesting opinions about this time period and Edward II's fate.
The she-wolves would be a welcome addition and I would love to see your presentation on the subject. The emancipation of Eddie III would be a fun one, as well.
If Edward II had been an effective ruler, military commander and administrator, he could have been bonking the palace butcher's donkey, eight choirboys AND Gaveston ... the nobility wouldn't have given two hoots.
Oh Dr Kat, do please continue Queen Isabella's story I am fascinated by the queens England has had. Why were most of them vilified? Was Eleanor of Aquitaine really such a horrible example of womanhood? What about Mathilda? Strong women in history like Margaret Beaufort or Margaret of Anjou are generally dipicted as unnatural.
Thank you for another great video. I think all rulers have had favorites from the beginning of time until the present. Edward II was an ineffectual ruler who couldn't conceal his overt favoritism nor keep his barons in check. And yes, I would LOVE to see a video of the legacies of Edward II and Isabella.
I think so too, Edward allowed his lovers to become too powerful, which put them in danger. Isabella put up with an awful lot of disrespect from Edward, before she turned on him. She was an impressive woman.
Hi, Dr. Kat. Another video triumph, as always. Definitely, when it comes to Edward II, the apple fell a LONG way from the tree. Longshanks must have been spinning in his grave. Too bad Isabella couldn't have been his daughter - she would have been a much more capable ruler than that milque-toast son ever was. Anyway, please count me in for another video like this - great stuff! BTW, please give my best to Jamie and Gabriel. 👍😁
I’ve been reading up on this ever since I found out that Edward’s cousin, Henry Earl of Lancaster, was my 22nd great-grandfather. Apparently, he was the one who captured Edward and Hugh the Younger in Wales, and then later headed the regency council of Edward III and (spoilers!) then had Mortimer declared traitor and executed.
I don't know why these stories don't get the "publicity" that the Tudors do. Queen Isabella and the Edwards were just as interesting and dramatic. Thanks for the vid!
I would love to see you produce a video explaining why and how 'Canterbury', and the 'Archbishop of Canterbury', became the center and head of the Church of England, both before, and after the Protestant Reformation. (❤️ your channel.)
I am currently reading Les Rois Maudits by French historian Maurice Druon which covers the reigns of Philippe lr Bel of France and Edward II. I can thoroughly recommend it
This turned on as I was going to sleep. I'm a first timer. I made sure to restart so I could hear it. My current area of study (William I to Elizabeth I), Shouldn't you use Despensed not Despenser?
It wasn't at all unique in Medieval times that men of nobility & aristocracy had sexual/romantic relationships with other men & sexual/dynastic realtionships with women. The upper classes saw procreation as their duty. Family lines & family names had to be upheld. Alliances with other nobles & aristocrats had to be forged & children, through arranged marriages, were the currency in these essential transactions. Though the concepts of "homosexuality" and "bisexuality" weren't codified in the same ways they have come to be in modern times, there is no basis at all to believe that human nature was so different then that such inclinations didn't exist. Edward II wasn't a bright man & he was so imbued with feelings of infallibility & entitlement he believed he could flaunt his same sex romantic interests & no one would baulk. To be fey & "Well we don't know for sure" about what is now and was at the time, so palpably a fact - that Gaveston & Despenser were royal paramours - is to my mind, intellectually dishonest.
Mistresses seem to be happy with dresses, jewels and fancy accommodation. Everyone rolls their eyes and looks the other way. Male favourites, however, are something else. Bad news!
Dr Kat, if ever you read comments on old videos.... It's interesting to contrast Tubers' back catalogues with recent vids. Usually the difference is obvious, but with yours, one can't see a difference! You've been excellent since the beginning. However the newer audio visual equipment is noticeable. Back on topic, Edward II seems to have devolved in maturity and judgement. I think it may partly have been because he was free of serious consequences for so long and reacted just as a spoilt brat does.
I hate that Isabel is so demonized by history. Let’s be realistic here everyone has a point where enough is enough. First she suffered the humiliation of having to deal with Pierce in the marriage, then the Dispencer took her money and the people who were there for her since she first came to England and then her children. When you mess with a woman children that a decoration of war.
I don’t think that Pierce had anything to do with the level of hatred that the Despencer received. The Despencer I think learned something from Pierce like if your Edward favorite you can do whatever you want, and to make sure that the nobles fear you. Their big mistake is that instead of making Isabel an ally like Pierce did they made her an enemy.
Hugh Despenser the Younger was a power hungry greedy bully who did whatever he wanted even before he became the king’s favorite. I highly recommend Kathryn Warner’s book about him, it’s purely amusing
The Hughes' weakness was thinking that they were smarter than Piers and would succeed where Piers had not. They were bullies of the worst sort and connivers in persuading the King to rely on their judgment of the Queen's loyalty to France.
Gosh, but that was a good story! I love that Queen Isabella got her revenge on her husband. Either she had some natural pluck, or else someone taught her very well when she was a child, because I remember myself as a teenaged girl, not even knowing which end was up, let alone how to do all the things this superwoman did. I wish I'd known about her when I was a child; I would have made her my own role model!
I tend to lean toward not lot respecting the lesson over not learning it well. He was century ahead of others who practiced with much arrogance ‘! Did it my way” which also got them executed ‘their way.” If you are goin to be a Humpty Hump Thee, . a thick armoire is more usefully than possessing a thick head. I don’t know if She-wolf” is an apt monitor but the ‘Tricky Dicky equalizer “ work well in what Queen Isabella ultimately accomplished.
I think the nobles assumed DeSpencer the younger was assumed to be Edward’s lover as he was not just eviscerated but also emasculated while still living.
Margaret de Clare, Countess of Gloucester is Leonard Emmett Smith's 20th great grandmother. Leonard Emmett Smith → Viola Winifred Smith his mother → Jones David Waggoner her father → Martin Franklin Waggoner his father → James Waggener his father → Richard Waggoner his father → Ann Waggener his mother → James Jones, II her father → James Jones his father → James S Jones, I his father → David Nathaniel Jones his father → John Elias Jones his father → Sir William Jones, Kt. his father → Elizabeth Jones his mother → Juliana Cornwall her mother → Elizabeth Corbet her mother → Anne Devereux, 7th Baroness Ferrers of Chartley her mother → Sir William Ferrers, 6th Baron of Ferrers of Chartley her father → Edmund de Ferrers, 5th Baron Ferrers of Chartley his father → Robert de Ferrers, 4th Baron Ferrers of Chartley his father → Elizabeth de Cobham his mother → Margaret de Audley, Countess of Stafford her mother → Margaret de Clare, Countess of Gloucester her mother
Margaret de Clare, Countess of Gloucester is Oliver Hokanson's 20th great grandmother. Oliver Hokanson → Yada his mother → Nellie eldora Yada her mother → Mary Elvira Hurd her mother → Joseph Wiram Reed her father → Wealthy N. Reed his mother → Freeman Williams her father → Isaac Williams, II his father → Dorothy Williams his mother → John Freeman, I her father → Sgt. Joseph Freeman his father → John Edmund Freeman his father → Edmund Freeman his father → John Freeman his father → Henry Freeman his father → Lawrence Freeman his father → Sir John Freeman, Baron Fremingham of Glassenbury his father → Henry de Fremingham (Freeman) his father → Lady Agnes de Fremingham his mother → Earl Edmund Stafford, 5th Earl of Stafford her father → Hugh de Stafford, 2nd Earl of Stafford his father → Margaret de Audley, Countess of Stafford his mother → Margaret de Clare, Countess of Gloucester her mothe
Guy de Beauchamp, 10th Earl of Warwick is Oliver Hokanson's 20th great grandfather. Oliver Hokanson → Yada his mother → Nellie eldora Yada her mother → Mary Elvira Hurd her mother → Joseph Wiram Reed her father → Wealthy N. Reed his mother → Freeman Williams her father → Isaac Williams, II his father → Dorothy Williams his mother → John Freeman, I her father → Sgt. Joseph Freeman his father → John Edmund Freeman his father → Edmund Freeman his father → John Freeman his father → Henry Freeman his father → Lawrence Freeman his father → Sir John Freeman, Baron Fremingham of Glassenbury his father → Henry de Fremingham (Freeman) his father → Lady Agnes de Fremingham his mother → Earl Edmund Stafford, 5th Earl of Stafford her father → Philippa de Beauchamp Countess of Stafford his mother → Thomas de Beauchamp, 11th Earl of Warwick her father → Guy de Beauchamp, 10th Earl of Warwick his father
Guy de Beauchamp, 10th Earl of Warwick is Leonard Emmett Smith's 20th great grandfather. Leonard Emmett Smith → Viola Winifred Smith his mother → Jones David Waggoner her father → Martin Franklin Waggoner his father → James Waggener his father → Catherine Waggoner his mother → Martha Anne Gaines her mother → Robert George, II her father → General Robert George his father → Hester George his mother → Ann Fawdon her mother → William Smith, of Isle of Wight her father → Robert Hovell Smith, II his father → Mirable Hovell als Smyth his mother → Margaret Blunt her mother → Edmund Poley, Esq. her father → Constance Poley his mother → William Geddinge her father → Ann Alice Gedding his mother → Thomas Astley her father → Thomas Astley his father → Elizabeth de Beauchamp, Baroness Astley his mother → Guy de Beauchamp, 10th Earl of Warwick her father
Some history buffs believe Edward II's predilection for male favourites was his downfall; but I agree completely with Dan Jones' assessment: "Some folks believe Edward and Piers (Gaveston) were lovers, and that was his problem. I dont agree. No one knows what went on behind the doors of the Royal bedchamber. But I actually believe Edward could have been bedding his page boy, his priest and his horse...as long as he was running the kingdom well." A fairly logical statement, I'd say.
Thank you so much for this very informative video. I cannot begin to tell you how refreshing it is to hear such a slow, methodical, cogent and clear talk from a professional historian. Nothing rushed; no dreadful American accents from lamebrain retards who cannot speak English and who do not understand our culture but pretend that they do. Just simple, clear, educated speech from a historian who knows her stuff. Once again; thank you so much!
I already knew I had a connection to Edward II, my 20th great-grandmother was his sister, Elizabeth. I recently found out that my 21st great-grandmother Eleanor Despenser, wife of Sir Hugh de Courtenay, was the aunt of Hugh Despenser! I was already a fan of medieval history, but those added connections make it even more interesting. I know I’m only one of many thousands of descendants, and my family line is predominantly through daughters and younger sons, so there are no titles, land, or money, but it is still fascinating! I only found through a DNA match with a more recent ancestor who’d still had enough social status to have been written about in the 18th century.
OMG! I am directly descended from this whole mess! ..look at this! Piers de Gaveston, 1st Earl of Cornwall is your 21st great grandfather. You → Carol-Len Smith your mother → Leonard Emmett Smith her father → Viola Winifred Smith his mother → Jones David Waggoner her father → Martin Franklin Waggoner his father → James Waggener his father → Richard Waggoner his father → Ann Waggener his mother → James Jones, II her father → James Jones his father → James S Jones, I his father → David Nathaniel Jones his father → John Elias Jones his father → Sir William Jones, Kt. his father → Elizabeth Jones his mother → Edmund Cornwall her father → Edmund Cornwall, Sr., 7th Baron of Burford his father → Elizabeth Cornwall his mother → Lucy Lenthall her mother → Elizabeth Grey her mother → Alice Basset, Lady of Bytham her mother → Amy de Gaveston her mother → Piers de Gaveston, 1st Earl of Cornwall her father and it gets crazier! look at this!.. Hugh Despenser the Younger is your 22nd great grandfather. You → Oliver Hokanson your father → Ellen Louise Yada his mother → Nellie eldora Yada her mother → Mary Elvira Hurd her mother → Joseph Wiram Reed her father → Joseph Reed his father → Samuel Reed his father → Ezekiel Reed his father → Mary [Dyer] Reed his mother → Grizzell Wheeler her mother → Philip Squire her father → Jane Squire his mother → Ursula Jackson her mother → Richard Hildyard, Esq. her father → Martin Hildyard, of Winestead his father → Christopher Hildyard, 4th Lord of Winestead his father → Peter Hildyard, 3rd Lord of Winestead his father → Elizabeth Hastings his mother → Sir John Hastings, of Gressenhall, de jure 9th Lord Hastings her father → Sir Edward de Hastings his father → Anne le Despencer his mother → Edward le Despenser, 1st Baron le Despencer her father → Sir Edward le Despenser his father → Hugh Despenser the Younger his father and worse!!! look here! OMG!!!...Eleanor de Clare, suo jure 6th Lady of Glamorgan is your 22nd great grandmother. You → Oliver Hokanson your father → Ellen Louise Yada his mother → Nellie eldora Yada her mother → Mary Elvira Hurd her mother → Joseph Wiram Reed her father → Joseph Reed his father → Samuel Reed his father → Ezekiel Reed his father → Mary [Dyer] Reed his mother → Grizzell Wheeler her mother → Philip Squire her father → Jane Squire his mother → Ursula Jackson her mother → Richard Hildyard, Esq. her father → Martin Hildyard, of Winestead his father → Christopher Hildyard, 4th Lord of Winestead his father → Peter Hildyard, 3rd Lord of Winestead his father → Elizabeth Hastings his mother → Sir John Hastings, of Gressenhall, de jure 9th Lord Hastings her father → Sir Edward de Hastings his father → Anne le Despencer his mother → Edward le Despenser, 1st Baron le Despencer her father → Sir Edward le Despenser his father → Eleanor de Clare, suo jure 6th Lady of Glamorgan his mother...and it gets even more insane now!! bc Isabella the she wolf of france is also a ggggggrandmother...look!!! Isabella of France, Queen consort of England is your 21st great grandmother. You → Oliver Hokanson your father → Ellen Louise Yada his mother → Nellie eldora Yada her mother → Mary Elvira Hurd her mother → Joseph Wiram Reed her father → Wealthy N. Reed his mother → Freeman Williams her father → Isaac Williams, II his father → Dorothy Williams his mother → John Freeman, I her father → Sgt. Joseph Freeman his father → John Edmund Freeman his father → Edmund Freeman his father → John Freeman his father → Henry Freeman his father → Lawrence Freeman his father → Sir John Freeman, Baron Fremingham of Glassenbury his father → Henry de Fremingham (Freeman) his father → Lady Agnes de Fremingham his mother → Anne of Gloucester, Countess of Stafford her mother → Thomas of Woodstock, 1st Duke of Gloucester her father → Edward III, king of England his father → Isabella of France, Queen consort of England his mother ALSO! MY SONS ARE THEREFORE BECAUSE OF THE NEXT TREE, DOUBLE DECENDENTS! because my husband is also a direct decendent...look here.. Isabella of France, Queen consort of England is your husband's 18th great grandmother. You → Charles Gonzales your husband → Sarah Burchim his mother → iowa iola Birchum her mother → Susie Street her mother → Zedikiah Street her father → Joseph Street, III his father → Sarah Street his mother → John Tate her father → James Tate, III, Planter his father → James Tate, II his father → James Tate, I his father → Sir William Tate, MP his father → Dorothy Tate his mother → Francis Tanfield of Gayton her father → William Tanfield, I, Esq. his father → Catherine Neville his mother → Edward Neville, 3rd Baron of Bergavenny her father → Joan Beaufort, Countess of Westmorland his mother → John of Gaunt, 1st Duke of Lancaster, 1st Earl of Richmond her father → Edward III, king of England his father → Isabella of France, Queen consort of England his mother...iam floored...and beyond astonished...
A few of these people mentioned are my mum's ancestors: Edward I, both Despensers, Guy de Beauchamp, barons Percy & Clifford, Eleanor de Clare, Bartholomew Badlesmere, Edmund FitzAlan. I’d like to know more about Hugh the Younger; for so gruesome an end he must’ve done some heavy shit.
Thank you so much for this video. I know I’m late to the party, but as Hugh deSpencer came up as one of my ancestors in my latest foray, I was really curious and I love that one of my favorite creators has done a video about him!
I really liked your videos but the constructivist flippancy (talking about being Gay or Bisexual as an act), the total lack of sympathy for the reality of homophobia and the insensitivity to how Edward and particularly Galveston factor into the history of homophobic caricature are extremely hurtful. Please think about how you talk about Gay and Bisexual Men.
I've noticed in my very amateur researches that weak leaders end up surrounded by bad actors of one kind or another. Edward the 2: case in point. Also I suspect that Isabelle was raised and educated to be a queen and did what was necessary for the good of the nation. Can you imagine the horror when she finally realized that the man she is supposed to support in the ruling of a nation was a baffoon at best and a danger to his own nation at worst? I think she saved the country!
Isabella had been married to a weak trifling possibly gay idiot. This is the woman who is depicted in Braveheart as having slept with William Wallace. She was sent away as a royal bride at 12 and when she grew up enough to understand what the f*** was going on she had a s*** fit and I do not blame her
Your well and tastefully detailed recount is so well craved by so many, because---- it is---- REALITY! HISTORY is NOT a Study of the Past!!!! It is a Study of the Present! The "PRESENT" is not a "snapshot", the size of an infinitely small "nano--second", such as in Calculus! It is an incessant, continuous flow of an infinite number of "events", which "chemically react" with an infinite number of factors and motivations, and so forth ad infinitum!!!! To see what we have been doing---- WRONG!!!!! We also, by studying these infinite number of "Rivers of Fate", we can also realize that we can "Take the Bull by the Horns"---- and---- actually, CREATE OUR OWN------ UTOPIA---- OWNED AND CONTROLLED BY----------OURSELVES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! In summary, Madam, let You Tube, and everyone else, know, that your videos are Most Valuable!!!! Since these will entertain us, as we are intelligent, your videos analyzing History will make all of us---- face up to the "Shaking Reality of the---- FUTURE"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Madam, Dr. Kat, in a quiet moment of Peace, alone, fall into the "infinitely beyond deepest" trance, that you could attain, and, realize just how valuabe are the "invitations", of desperately deep research into Human Nature and its unfolding, in order to come to "shocking", but life--saving terms with the infinite number of decisions, which we make, without realizing that we are---- making them! Until we realize, infinitely deeply, the consequences of EACH of the infinite number of decisions we make, even subconsciously, we are on passive, if not, active, "conveyer belt" moving towards---- SELF--destruction, or, NOT MOVING, towards "Messianically Transcendent" rescuing improvements on our lives, such as, the full cure of horrid diseases, life --extension, World Peace, the end to abuse, torture, and Crime! Thank You, Dr. KAT, for all your exciting, and also relaxing, and, above all, edifying, videos!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I do hope that you keep on acquiring more, more monetarily supporting advertisers---- you deserve it!!!! Thank you, You Tube, Thak you , all involved in their production!!!!
It would be interesting---if, in your capable and balanced historical viewpoints----to do a video of the 'commonality' of 'Bi-sexuality' with the Kings, Princes, etc. of England. During some seminars---nearly 50 odd years ago, at University; my one Professor of Psychology/Anthropology did lecture that with-in the emotional make-up of Men of Power --mostly referring now to the Financial Barons but also Modern Political Leaders---a sexual drive arises with-in them to out-let with in a modern concept of 'Favorite' or the Bromance...for these men are so driven by an Alpha Male self image that the Alpha Male subgroups itself---oft' wondered just how long and quiet the prestige of being the 'heir-to-the-Throne's' or to the King, himself--Favorite lingers here even into the 21st Century. Thanks---you are charming and erudite presentations. Great videos
I had a wave of deja vu for a moment when i realized how similar some of those royal scandals are to some of the internet drama i'm currently following lmao
Can you imagine? Poor Isabella; she must have read chivalric stories of great knights and kings, the like of whom would "sweep her off her feet". And, look what she got! And, so young. As a homosexual man I can tell you if I were king I would manage to get an heir. I imagine she did not get her romantic knight in Edward. And, I feel for him as well; being in love and no being able to, oh wait...I guess he did act on it! Isabella, literally growing up as a queen, must have thought WTF?! I like Isabella's balls. The "she-wolf" things I certainly will agree probably came about by men. I have watched this three times. Wonderful.
You ladies need to try to think more clearly and, at least. consider the effect of all the silly, modern women stuff on your ideas--men bad, women good. Lots to consider with history besides your anger because men no longer want to date you. And, surprise! I am a homosexual male with a doctorate and even post doctoral work; saying that only to keep you from the "ignorant man" thing. I am not ignorant. I am a thinker and a wonderer about all sides of issues as it appears Dr. Kat is; which is why I like her.
Dr. you Kat, thank you again. You make my mornings here in Nashville much more fun. Yes! More about Edward II and his (using one of your words in another video) demanding pecker. You are a delight and so witty in your delivery.
I really enjoy (admire) how you can tell the story of a man and give insights into women’s history. Likewise, tell the stories of monarchs and nobles and give insights into social history. Brava!
Local interest in the Dispensers has increased recently with the finding of parts of The Youngers body buried by the High Altar at Hulton Abbey in Stoke This is due to his wifes connection with the Audley family on whose lands the monks built their Abbey. Very little of the Abbey remains apart from the graveyard and layout of the foundations of the main church The remains fit exactly with the description of what were given back to his wife for burial at Tewkesbury, as only a few could be find to give to her.
My own interest in Edward II, apart from Marlowe’s play, was piqued when I discovered my descent from Longshanks. This was an excellent account of a queen’s skillful use of her subservient position to wield considerable power informally. It is also a lesson about pride in politics and the seeking of power for its own sake rather than to serve the welfare of the many, from which servant leadership a sovereign’s power really flows.
Great video! I really appreciate how you provide context for each subject you discuss. I think that Piers Gaveston was such an obvious eejit that the Despensers thought they could easily manipulate Edward II in much the same way but without making the obvious mistakes Gaveston made. Frankly, Edward II strikes me as being far from the sharpest knife in the block--dangerous in that he seems to have lacked much in the way of forethought and was easily swayed by whoever had his ear at the time. The Despensers probably (and somewhat accurately) thought that the trick was to keep Edward' captivated so that no one else could catch his attention.
I've been interested I'm English history since watching the Tudors. Thank you for making a subject which can be difficult and hard to follow come to life. You are the best!
I'd love to hear more about the Queens of England who have been titled "She-wolves" or the like because they were not willing to just be swept into the quiet meek wife role. As usual fantastic video!
There is a book called 'She Wolves: The Women who ruled England before Elizabeth' by Helen Castor which includes Isabella, Matilda, Eleanor of Aquitaine and Margaret of Anjou. I haven't read it yet (on my shelf waiting) but I have been told it is very good.
@@MazMedazzaland oh I'll have to add that to my reading list! Thank you :)
@@avalonseer
Helen Castor also hosted a TV series based on the book.
It was broadcast on the BBC Iplayer, not sure if it's still available there!!
@@kateh2007 oh I'll have a look! Thanks again.
I have read it and can confirm it is worth it.
I was drinking tea when you whispered “incredibly seriously” and did a spit take. Thank you for the laugh. I love your work, Dr. Kat!!
Are you British? This comment is so British haha 💜
That was funny. I don't drink tea but I did spit out my coffee!!
Edward was a weak king, he could never live up to his father, he made a lot of bad decisions, ultimately he paid a very heavy price,the dispensers and gaviston just used him to their advantage. Thank you Dr kat, well. Presented and narrated.
I was actually brushing my teeth ….and went what?? Lol 😂 …as I love to listen to Dr. Kat in the mornings. 👍🏻✨🤩✨
@@made-line7627 Not all Brits drink tea, just saying. 😉
We need to start a Dr Kat "Fan Club"
I second this.👍🏻
So it is spoken,
So it shall be done.
Absolutely!
love her
Yessss!!!
Can’t wait for the continuation, Isabella & Mortimer, Edward III’s self-emancipation, etc. English history is so fascinating, as the say “you couldn’t make this stuff up, no one would believe it possible”, but it really happened.
My family includes John of Gaunt and Katharine Swynford. It is so much drama, lmao.
When I was 6 i was given a children's book on kings and queens which said Edward was murdered with a red hot iron. At the time I remember thinking, " ow, nasty way to die, being hit over the head with a red hot iron..." it wasn't till I heard the story again when I was older I realised that's not what was implied.
Lllllll lol llll
I think you're thinking of Richard II! I also made the mistake of remembering the rumor as being about Edward II, but when I went back to double check it was Richard.
This sounds like a Medieval version of a trailer park with gang leaders, gangs, rumors, spite, caterwauling and pettiness that lead to assassinations.
Welcome to the Medieval world!
The way Piers would come back after exile like, “I’m back, B****es!!”
Oh, how he must’ve loved being a royal pain in the arse!! 😂
Gaveston is Boris Johnson's historical hero. Says a lot about both of them if you ask me.
@@serendpity3478 Seriously? Oh dear. That's actually hilarious.
@@serendpity3478 Very telling, indeed!
He was called back by Edward II…
Lmao, are you a fan of team four star, by chance?
I think the Despensers thought their favor with the King put them above everyone else and therefore protected. Yes, I think they ignored what happened to Gaveston, and thought they could get anything they wanted. 2. Yes, please have more videos on this time and the She-wolf.
That kind of behavior and thought still happens today
"Those who don't remember the past are condemned to repeat it."
they engaged in criminal actions and as is the nature of most criminals, they think that they will get away with it despite the fate of all those before them. the despenser s had no right to all the properties and power that they grabbed and only the kings power allowed their actions. talk about absolute power corrupting absolutely ...!
I saw you cover this subject and immediately had to watch it. Isabella and her relationships with Edward and his relationships with Gaveston and Despenser is some of my favorite medieval dramas to relate to friends and family not in the know. People think history is boring, but honestly Edward II had the social life of a reality tv show.
You forgot Edward's love of making dry walls and breeding sheep. I love that aspect of him. He's a complicated person. The nobles didn't know when they were well off with Piers - greddy arrogant party boy, but the Despensers were so much more and so much worse.
Are the Despensers the ancestors of Diana, Princess of Wales?
@@Anna_Key They have a common ancestor: Thomas le Despenser, of Elington (d. 1218). One son Sir Hugh le Despencer fathered his namesake descendants, while another son Geoffrey (possibly named Galfridus) produced what eventually became the present Earl Spencer line.
I'd vote for another video on Edward II and Isabella (though with as little detail about his gruesome end as possible). I'm more interested in how accurate Marlow's play is.
"gruesome end" indeed. Sorry for the pun. I don't really think his "end" was involved in his death.
You can’t clean up history because of peoples sensibilities
Edward did not have a gruesome end. The hot poker story is just a myth that was propagated after his death. A way to explain a death that left no obvious external explanation. He was likely smothered or drowned.
Thank you for this one: it takes me back. Piers was an early historical obsession of mine, and I remember gathering many bits of documentation about him. In 1980, after graduating Brooklyn College, I was in England on a small Shakespeare scholarship, and one of my friends there drove us both to Warwick Castle, where we looked in vain for Blacklow Hill so that I could properly mourn the event. To my recollection, Piers was overweening, and foolish in the way he gathered enemies, but he had a knack for governing (during his exile to Ireland, he actually did a fairly good job at representing and defending his king without offending the people in power in Ireland), and, had things been more intelligently handled, he might have had a long and successful career. I had a simultaneous obsession with another royal favorite, don Alvaro de Luna, who flourished and fell under the reign of Juan II of Castile. He lasted a lot longer than Piers, though undergoing a similar number of exiles forced upon him by his enemies. I remember drawing up a lot of comparisons between the two sets of relationships.
@@markanderson0022 Thank you so very much, Mark! I'm doing very well, hoping the same by you.
@@markanderson0022 Great to hear! I'm Maria, from Brooklyn.
Fascinating, thank you! And, I must confess, a relief to be away from the Tudors, who seem to dominate everywhere…
Thank you for saying that! I always say that there are other dynasties besides the bloody Tudors. More Plantagenets please!!
Isabella is one of my favourite historical figures. We stan a woman saying "enough is enough, I'm in charge now"
She was remarkable!
I feel ashamed I have never heard of her before! But she definitely sounds like my kind of woman and would love to hear more about her! I might just have to go and do some investigating myself this weekend 🙂
@@kelly-annejenner486 there was a series of documentaries here on TH-cam about the English queens that had been dubbed "she-wolves"! I can't remember the exact name but I'm sure it would be easy to find!
@@bajubner I will look it up! I absolutely adore the Tudor period, mainly because it’s all gory and there’s no messing about like there is nowadays, but also thanks to Queen Elizabeth the first! To rule back in those times in married is, in my opinion amazing! But then I think Queen Victoria and our current Queen are also very strong women to look up to and are good role models to how the monarchy should be. Thank you for letting me know about that though I’ll go find it and add to my watch list 🥰
@@kelly-annejenner486 It's a great doco, & it's based on a book of the same name, "She-Wolves" by Helen Castor, which is one of the most enjoyable history books I've ever read. It's also about Empress Matilda, Eleanor of Aquitaine & Margaret of Anjou; other fascinating & powerful queens.
Eward's "strange hobbies" reminds me of George III's interest in agriculture and animal husbandry. I feel like there's a correlation between unconventional rulers and pastoralism...
See also: Louis XVI's clockmaking and Marie Antoinette's dairy farm
Also the tsar Nicholas II and his love for manual labor. Apparently he really enjoyed chopping wood
I always found it interesting that Edward II was so influenced by the Dispensers after the "sticky" end Gaveston had. Logical thought would be he would have learned the lesson of how favorites can negatively influence his court and governance. But in fact he traded one bad influence for an even worse one. Great video, Dr. Kat! And super interesting part of history.
He did not have the intelligence to rule in the first place, incest breeding at it's best outcome, keep the line noble gave some very mentally unstable people
I don't think he was mentally unstable at all. I think he was just very human and probably gay. In love with these men but obliged by society and his rule to have a wife and several heirs, he was blinded by love. We always say love is blind and humans will usually put pleasure and love before obligation i think.
The idea that she is remembered as a she wolf makes me think. I think it’s pretty easy to look back at what she did and say how could she do that or frame her as being violent if you don’t think about what was her alternative. Do we really think she would’ve lived a really long time if she hadn’t taken out those who were moving against her and her children? Was she looking at two choices -one where she was ruthless and put her son on the throne and the alternative being letting her sonCome under the influence and control of the DeSpensers? If she was a man of the time these kinds of political ploy’s were completely acceptable and normal. I think she would make a great subject for a shortseries!!!
She was a woman of her time and those kinds of political ploys were indeed considered acceptable and normal. Being called a she-wolf is not derogatory. It means she was a force to be reckoned with. Her story would make a fantastic series, if done correctly.
@@svargyle I watched a documentary series I think called she wolves, England’s early Queens that pretty much put for the term as being negative and derogatory. It was hung on a lot of these early powerful women and I don’t think it was positive at least according to that doc you series. I do know that you can’t trust one series on a subject though.I would be interested to have a reading the past on the term and the Queens it’s often applied to.
@@BevMargaret it was a great series and early in English history, while there were only 3 "she-wolves" officially, basically almost any Queen from France who acted on her own agency was called a "she-wolf."
@@BevMargaret I would be interested in what contemporaries thought of her as well. If they were against her, politically, they would certainly say negative things, just as anyone would now. Her friends probably were more positive. I suspect a bigger deal was probably made because of her adultery with Mortimer, even if everyone 'understood' why that might happen. I think this subject would make an interesting Dr. Kat video. :)
Oh Dr Kat, I just feel like a little girl listening to her Mom when you tell these amazing tales of history!
It seems rather likely Edward II was at least bi-sexual. It is also entirely possible to father children while being gay. Having a son was considered a duty and Edward obviously respected Isabella enough to do his “job”.
I also got the bisexual vibe from him!! how often do historians just sweep this under the rug as "well we can't just extrapolate sexuality since society's expectations were so different" when it could EASILY be explained by a queer theory perspective?? short sighted to just ignore the possibility at all.
It isn’t likely. There is no historical evidence on which to make that assumption. To do so is to project 21st Century social liberalism on a FAR more restrictive 14th Century personality. That is revisionism of the worst kind.
@@MTCason - Why isn’t it likely? Believe it or not there were gay people in the 14th century and his obvious “patronage” of Piers Galveston goes way beyond “friendship”. And also, being gay or bi-sexual does not make one a “liberal”. I think it more a case of projecting 21st century bigotry rather than “social liberalism”. There’s no direct evidence either way. That is why I said “rather likely” than “He was certainly”.
@@vdimasteremeritus In what sense is it 'obvious' that his patronage of Piers went beyond friendship? There were no signs of that and no reports from contemporary chroniclers to suggest it. There's nothing to make it 'rather likely', least of all when Edward produced five children and one of them illegitimate. I'm not a bigot in the slightest but I don't believe in assuming the sexual identity of people who are dead and gone beyond what is evident. Edward I was criticized for his own favoritism towards certain close associates, as was Edward III in his own turn. It was a well-known latter Plantagenet fault, especially after the turbulence reigns of Henry III and Edward II bred natural suspicion and a tendency to distrust those beyond the men (and believe it or not, most of those who had cogent political and military power at the time were MEN) they could trust. The foundation of the Order of the Garter was foremost to bind a select group of knights to Edward III who he could trust to command his armies in France. That certainly doesn't make him homosexual any more than Gaveston or the Despensers do his father.
@@MTCason Aren't you also assuming the sexual identity of a dead person though? It makes just as much sense for him to have been bisexual or gay considering the historical record as it does for him to have been straight. Assuming heterosexuality as the default state doesn't do historical study any favors.
You are one of the most interesting people I’ve ever listened to, and I’ve learned so much. Thank you!
I love that you're going back further in to the middle ages. I find this era much more fascinating since there is necessarily more conjecture, since there are far fewer original sources. I know this isn't a book review channel, but Ian Mortimer's book; Edward III: The Perfect King, has some interesting opinions about this time period and Edward II's fate.
YES, a video on Isabella of France please, she was definitely a game changer in English history.
Oh yes, please do carry on with another about the end of Edward II, and more about Queen Isabella!
The she-wolves would be a welcome addition and I would love to see your presentation on the subject. The emancipation of Eddie III would be a fun one, as well.
Thank you for delving further back into English history. The Tudors get so much more attention.
Too much, I think. Just about all of English history is fascinating!
agreed!! this is fascinating and underrated
If Edward II had been an effective ruler, military commander and administrator, he could have been bonking the palace butcher's donkey, eight choirboys AND Gaveston ... the nobility wouldn't have given two hoots.
Part of it was his lack of discretion. King James l interests didn't seem to create many issues.
That was great! Could we have another about Henry II and Thomas a Beckett?
Oh Dr Kat, do please continue Queen Isabella's story I am fascinated by the queens England has had. Why were most of them vilified? Was Eleanor of Aquitaine really such a horrible example of womanhood? What about Mathilda? Strong women in history like Margaret Beaufort or Margaret of Anjou are generally dipicted as unnatural.
Thank you for another great video. I think all rulers have had favorites from the beginning of time until the present. Edward II was an ineffectual ruler who couldn't conceal his overt favoritism nor keep his barons in check. And yes, I would LOVE to see a video of the legacies of Edward II and Isabella.
I love this particular medieval drama!
Don't leave us hanging! Please continue with the story of Queen Isabelle and Mortimer!
Edward II was not the sharpest tool in the shed.
Isabella sounds like a very smart strong and impressive woman
I think so too, Edward allowed his lovers to become too powerful, which put them in danger. Isabella put up with an awful lot of disrespect from Edward, before she turned on him. She was an impressive woman.
Hi, Dr. Kat. Another video triumph, as always. Definitely, when it comes to Edward II, the apple fell a LONG way from the tree. Longshanks must have been spinning in his grave. Too bad Isabella couldn't have been his daughter - she would have been a much more capable ruler than that milque-toast son ever was. Anyway, please count me in for another video like this - great stuff! BTW, please give my best to Jamie and Gabriel. 👍😁
I’ve been reading up on this ever since I found out that Edward’s cousin, Henry Earl of Lancaster, was my 22nd great-grandfather. Apparently, he was the one who captured Edward and Hugh the Younger in Wales, and then later headed the regency council of Edward III and (spoilers!) then had Mortimer declared traitor and executed.
I don't know why these stories don't get the "publicity" that the Tudors do. Queen Isabella and the Edwards were just as interesting and dramatic. Thanks for the vid!
Yes please to a follow up video on Isabella!
Oh this is going to be *GOOD!!!*
Clicked before I'd even read the entire title lol
(To be fair, I do that with all Dr Kat videos)
I would love to see you produce a video explaining why and how 'Canterbury', and the 'Archbishop of Canterbury', became the center and head of the Church of England, both before, and after the Protestant Reformation. (❤️ your channel.)
I'd love to hear more about Edward II and Isabella!!
I am currently reading Les Rois Maudits by French historian Maurice Druon which covers the reigns of Philippe lr Bel of France and Edward II. I can thoroughly recommend it
This turned on as I was going to sleep. I'm a first timer. I made sure to restart so I could hear it. My current area of study (William I to Elizabeth I), Shouldn't you use Despensed not Despenser?
Thankyou. Good to learn about a less well known period of history. Keen to learn more.
Holy molly where all the nobility horrible people? The history would make it seem so.
It wasn't at all unique in Medieval times that men of nobility & aristocracy had sexual/romantic relationships with other men & sexual/dynastic realtionships with women. The upper classes saw procreation as their duty. Family lines & family names had to be upheld. Alliances with other nobles & aristocrats had to be forged & children, through arranged marriages, were the currency in these essential transactions. Though the concepts of "homosexuality" and "bisexuality" weren't codified in the same ways they have come to be in modern times, there is no basis at all to believe that human nature was so different then that such inclinations didn't exist.
Edward II wasn't a bright man & he was so imbued with feelings of infallibility & entitlement he believed he could flaunt his same sex romantic interests & no one would baulk. To be fey & "Well we don't know for sure" about what is now and was at the time, so palpably a fact - that Gaveston & Despenser were royal paramours - is to my mind, intellectually dishonest.
👸🏻🏰
Is there any truth to the idea that Long Shankes threw one of Edward’s “favorites “ out a window, or was that just Hollywood?
Mistresses seem to be happy with dresses, jewels and fancy accommodation. Everyone rolls their eyes and looks the other way. Male favourites, however, are something else. Bad news!
Wow!!
Dr Kat, if ever you read comments on old videos....
It's interesting to contrast Tubers' back catalogues with recent vids. Usually the difference is obvious, but with yours, one can't see a difference! You've been excellent since the beginning. However the newer audio visual equipment is noticeable.
Back on topic, Edward II seems to have devolved in maturity and judgement. I think it may partly have been because he was free of serious consequences for so long and reacted just as a spoilt brat does.
You would think that there was some sense of deja poo poo (that feeling you've seen this merde before) when the Despensers came along
❤ your videos!!!
I hate that Isabel is so demonized by history.
Let’s be realistic here everyone has a point where enough is enough. First she suffered the humiliation of having to deal with Pierce in the marriage, then the Dispencer took her money and the people who were there for her since she first came to England and then her children. When you mess with a woman children that a decoration of war.
I don’t think that Pierce had anything to do with the level of hatred that the Despencer received.
The Despencer I think learned something from Pierce like if your Edward favorite you can do whatever you want, and to make sure that the nobles fear you. Their big mistake is that instead of making Isabel an ally like Pierce did they made her an enemy.
Hugh Despenser the Younger was a power hungry greedy bully who did whatever he wanted even before he became the king’s favorite.
I highly recommend Kathryn Warner’s book about him, it’s purely amusing
The Hughes' weakness was thinking that they were smarter than Piers and would succeed where Piers had not. They were bullies of the worst sort and connivers in persuading the King to rely on their judgment of the Queen's loyalty to France.
Love your channel ❤️
revisiting from the She-Wolf.
Gosh, but that was a good story! I love that Queen Isabella got her revenge on her husband. Either she had some natural pluck, or else someone taught her very well when she was a child, because I remember myself as a teenaged girl, not even knowing which end was up, let alone how to do all the things this superwoman did. I wish I'd known about her when I was a child; I would have made her my own role model!
Truly the only big mistake Isabella made was taking Mortimer as her lover.
I tend to lean toward not lot respecting the lesson over not learning it well. He was century ahead of others who practiced with much arrogance ‘! Did it my way” which also got them executed ‘their way.” If you are goin to be a Humpty Hump Thee, . a thick armoire is more usefully than possessing a thick head. I don’t know if She-wolf” is an apt monitor but the ‘Tricky Dicky equalizer “ work well in what Queen Isabella ultimately accomplished.
Love you and your videos!! Please keep them coming.
I think the nobles assumed DeSpencer the younger was assumed to be Edward’s lover as he was not just eviscerated but also emasculated while still living.
Margaret de Clare, Countess of Gloucester is Leonard Emmett Smith's 20th great grandmother.
Leonard Emmett Smith
→ Viola Winifred Smith
his mother → Jones David Waggoner
her father → Martin Franklin Waggoner
his father → James Waggener
his father → Richard Waggoner
his father → Ann Waggener
his mother → James Jones, II
her father → James Jones
his father → James S Jones, I
his father → David Nathaniel Jones
his father → John Elias Jones
his father → Sir William Jones, Kt.
his father → Elizabeth Jones
his mother → Juliana Cornwall
her mother → Elizabeth Corbet
her mother → Anne Devereux, 7th Baroness Ferrers of Chartley
her mother → Sir William Ferrers, 6th Baron of Ferrers of Chartley
her father → Edmund de Ferrers, 5th Baron Ferrers of Chartley
his father → Robert de Ferrers, 4th Baron Ferrers of Chartley
his father → Elizabeth de Cobham
his mother → Margaret de Audley, Countess of Stafford
her mother → Margaret de Clare, Countess of Gloucester
her mother
Margaret de Clare, Countess of Gloucester is Oliver Hokanson's 20th great grandmother.
Oliver Hokanson
→ Yada
his mother → Nellie eldora Yada
her mother → Mary Elvira Hurd
her mother → Joseph Wiram Reed
her father → Wealthy N. Reed
his mother → Freeman Williams
her father → Isaac Williams, II
his father → Dorothy Williams
his mother → John Freeman, I
her father → Sgt. Joseph Freeman
his father → John Edmund Freeman
his father → Edmund Freeman
his father → John Freeman
his father → Henry Freeman
his father → Lawrence Freeman
his father → Sir John Freeman, Baron Fremingham of Glassenbury
his father → Henry de Fremingham (Freeman)
his father → Lady Agnes de Fremingham
his mother → Earl Edmund Stafford, 5th Earl of Stafford
her father → Hugh de Stafford, 2nd Earl of Stafford
his father → Margaret de Audley, Countess of Stafford
his mother → Margaret de Clare, Countess of Gloucester
her mothe
Guy de Beauchamp, 10th Earl of Warwick is Oliver Hokanson's 20th great grandfather.
Oliver Hokanson
→ Yada
his mother → Nellie eldora Yada
her mother → Mary Elvira Hurd
her mother → Joseph Wiram Reed
her father → Wealthy N. Reed
his mother → Freeman Williams
her father → Isaac Williams, II
his father → Dorothy Williams
his mother → John Freeman, I
her father → Sgt. Joseph Freeman
his father → John Edmund Freeman
his father → Edmund Freeman
his father → John Freeman
his father → Henry Freeman
his father → Lawrence Freeman
his father → Sir John Freeman, Baron Fremingham of Glassenbury
his father → Henry de Fremingham (Freeman)
his father → Lady Agnes de Fremingham
his mother → Earl Edmund Stafford, 5th Earl of Stafford
her father → Philippa de Beauchamp Countess of Stafford
his mother → Thomas de Beauchamp, 11th Earl of Warwick
her father → Guy de Beauchamp, 10th Earl of Warwick
his father
Guy de Beauchamp, 10th Earl of Warwick is Leonard Emmett Smith's 20th great grandfather.
Leonard Emmett Smith
→ Viola Winifred Smith
his mother → Jones David Waggoner
her father → Martin Franklin Waggoner
his father → James Waggener
his father → Catherine Waggoner
his mother → Martha Anne Gaines
her mother → Robert George, II
her father → General Robert George
his father → Hester George
his mother → Ann Fawdon
her mother → William Smith, of Isle of Wight
her father → Robert Hovell Smith, II
his father → Mirable Hovell als Smyth
his mother → Margaret Blunt
her mother → Edmund Poley, Esq.
her father → Constance Poley
his mother → William Geddinge
her father → Ann Alice Gedding
his mother → Thomas Astley
her father → Thomas Astley
his father → Elizabeth de Beauchamp, Baroness Astley
his mother → Guy de Beauchamp, 10th Earl of Warwick
her father
Arrogant is alway , the downfall of many power hungry men
Some history buffs believe Edward II's predilection for male favourites was his downfall; but I agree completely with Dan Jones' assessment: "Some folks believe Edward and Piers (Gaveston) were lovers, and that was his problem. I dont agree. No one knows what went on behind the doors of the Royal bedchamber. But I actually believe Edward could have been bedding his page boy, his priest and his horse...as long as he was running the kingdom well."
A fairly logical statement, I'd say.
Great video. Enjoyed it very much. Thank you 😊
It was very dangerous to be a Plantagenet king’s favourite.
Thank you so much for this very informative video. I cannot begin to tell you how refreshing it is to hear such a slow, methodical, cogent and clear talk from a professional historian.
Nothing rushed; no dreadful American accents from lamebrain retards who cannot speak English and who do not understand our culture but pretend that they do.
Just simple, clear, educated speech from a historian who knows her stuff.
Once again; thank you so much!
I already knew I had a connection to Edward II, my 20th great-grandmother was his sister, Elizabeth. I recently found out that my 21st great-grandmother Eleanor Despenser, wife of Sir Hugh de Courtenay, was the aunt of Hugh Despenser! I was already a fan of medieval history, but those added connections make it even more interesting.
I know I’m only one of many thousands of descendants, and my family line is predominantly through daughters and younger sons, so there are no titles, land, or money, but it is still fascinating! I only found through a DNA match with a more recent ancestor who’d still had enough social status to have been written about in the 18th century.
OMG! I am directly descended from this whole mess! ..look at this! Piers de Gaveston, 1st Earl of Cornwall is your 21st great grandfather.
You
→ Carol-Len Smith
your mother → Leonard Emmett Smith
her father → Viola Winifred Smith
his mother → Jones David Waggoner
her father → Martin Franklin Waggoner
his father → James Waggener
his father → Richard Waggoner
his father → Ann Waggener
his mother → James Jones, II
her father → James Jones
his father → James S Jones, I
his father → David Nathaniel Jones
his father → John Elias Jones
his father → Sir William Jones, Kt.
his father → Elizabeth Jones
his mother → Edmund Cornwall
her father → Edmund Cornwall, Sr., 7th Baron of Burford
his father → Elizabeth Cornwall
his mother → Lucy Lenthall
her mother → Elizabeth Grey
her mother → Alice Basset, Lady of Bytham
her mother → Amy de Gaveston
her mother → Piers de Gaveston, 1st Earl of Cornwall
her father
and it gets crazier!
look at this!.. Hugh Despenser the Younger is your 22nd great grandfather.
You
→ Oliver Hokanson
your father → Ellen Louise Yada
his mother → Nellie eldora Yada
her mother → Mary Elvira Hurd
her mother → Joseph Wiram Reed
her father → Joseph Reed
his father → Samuel Reed
his father → Ezekiel Reed
his father → Mary [Dyer] Reed
his mother → Grizzell Wheeler
her mother → Philip Squire
her father → Jane Squire
his mother → Ursula Jackson
her mother → Richard Hildyard, Esq.
her father → Martin Hildyard, of Winestead
his father → Christopher Hildyard, 4th Lord of Winestead
his father → Peter Hildyard, 3rd Lord of Winestead
his father → Elizabeth Hastings
his mother → Sir John Hastings, of Gressenhall, de jure 9th Lord Hastings
her father → Sir Edward de Hastings
his father → Anne le Despencer
his mother → Edward le Despenser, 1st Baron le Despencer
her father → Sir Edward le Despenser
his father → Hugh Despenser the Younger
his father and worse!!! look here! OMG!!!...Eleanor de Clare, suo jure 6th Lady of Glamorgan is your 22nd great grandmother.
You
→ Oliver Hokanson
your father → Ellen Louise Yada
his mother → Nellie eldora Yada
her mother → Mary Elvira Hurd
her mother → Joseph Wiram Reed
her father → Joseph Reed
his father → Samuel Reed
his father → Ezekiel Reed
his father → Mary [Dyer] Reed
his mother → Grizzell Wheeler
her mother → Philip Squire
her father → Jane Squire
his mother → Ursula Jackson
her mother → Richard Hildyard, Esq.
her father → Martin Hildyard, of Winestead
his father → Christopher Hildyard, 4th Lord of Winestead
his father → Peter Hildyard, 3rd Lord of Winestead
his father → Elizabeth Hastings
his mother → Sir John Hastings, of Gressenhall, de jure 9th Lord Hastings
her father → Sir Edward de Hastings
his father → Anne le Despencer
his mother → Edward le Despenser, 1st Baron le Despencer
her father → Sir Edward le Despenser
his father → Eleanor de Clare, suo jure 6th Lady of Glamorgan
his mother...and it gets even more insane now!! bc Isabella the she wolf of france is also a ggggggrandmother...look!!! Isabella of France, Queen consort of England is your 21st great grandmother.
You
→ Oliver Hokanson
your father → Ellen Louise Yada
his mother → Nellie eldora Yada
her mother → Mary Elvira Hurd
her mother → Joseph Wiram Reed
her father → Wealthy N. Reed
his mother → Freeman Williams
her father → Isaac Williams, II
his father → Dorothy Williams
his mother → John Freeman, I
her father → Sgt. Joseph Freeman
his father → John Edmund Freeman
his father → Edmund Freeman
his father → John Freeman
his father → Henry Freeman
his father → Lawrence Freeman
his father → Sir John Freeman, Baron Fremingham of Glassenbury
his father → Henry de Fremingham (Freeman)
his father → Lady Agnes de Fremingham
his mother → Anne of Gloucester, Countess of Stafford
her mother → Thomas of Woodstock, 1st Duke of Gloucester
her father → Edward III, king of England
his father → Isabella of France, Queen consort of England
his mother ALSO! MY SONS ARE THEREFORE BECAUSE OF THE NEXT TREE, DOUBLE DECENDENTS! because my husband is also a direct decendent...look here..
Isabella of France, Queen consort of England is your husband's 18th great grandmother.
You
→ Charles Gonzales
your husband → Sarah Burchim
his mother → iowa iola Birchum
her mother → Susie Street
her mother → Zedikiah Street
her father → Joseph Street, III
his father → Sarah Street
his mother → John Tate
her father → James Tate, III, Planter
his father → James Tate, II
his father → James Tate, I
his father → Sir William Tate, MP
his father → Dorothy Tate
his mother → Francis Tanfield of Gayton
her father → William Tanfield, I, Esq.
his father → Catherine Neville
his mother → Edward Neville, 3rd Baron of Bergavenny
her father → Joan Beaufort, Countess of Westmorland
his mother → John of Gaunt, 1st Duke of Lancaster, 1st Earl of Richmond
her father → Edward III, king of England
his father → Isabella of France, Queen consort of England
his mother...iam floored...and beyond astonished...
A few of these people mentioned are my mum's ancestors: Edward I, both Despensers, Guy de Beauchamp, barons Percy & Clifford, Eleanor de Clare, Bartholomew Badlesmere, Edmund FitzAlan. I’d like to know more about Hugh the Younger; for so gruesome an end he must’ve done some heavy shit.
Thank you so much for this video. I know I’m late to the party, but as Hugh deSpencer came up as one of my ancestors in my latest foray, I was really curious and I love that one of my favorite creators has done a video about him!
I really liked your videos but the constructivist flippancy (talking about being Gay or Bisexual as an act), the total lack of sympathy for the reality of homophobia and the insensitivity to how Edward and particularly Galveston factor into the history of homophobic caricature are extremely hurtful. Please think about how you talk about Gay and Bisexual Men.
I've noticed in my very amateur researches that weak leaders end up surrounded by bad actors of one kind or another. Edward the 2: case in point. Also I suspect that Isabelle was raised and educated to be a queen and did what was necessary for the good of the nation. Can you imagine the horror when she finally realized that the man she is supposed to support in the ruling of a nation was a baffoon at best and a danger to his own nation at worst? I think she saved the country!
Except she didn’t. In fact her and Mortimer’s rule was so bad that her own son had to stage a coup to get rid of them.
Isabella had been married to a weak trifling possibly gay idiot. This is the woman who is depicted in Braveheart as having slept with William Wallace. She was sent away as a royal bride at 12 and when she grew up enough to understand what the f*** was going on she had a s*** fit and I do not blame her
Isabella is a fascinating and powerful figure. I would love to see a segment on her.
*incredibly seriously*
Your well and tastefully detailed recount is so well craved by so many, because---- it is---- REALITY!
HISTORY is NOT a Study of the Past!!!! It is a Study of the Present!
The "PRESENT" is not a "snapshot", the size of an infinitely small "nano--second", such as in Calculus! It is an incessant, continuous flow of an infinite number of "events", which "chemically react" with an infinite number of factors and motivations, and so forth ad infinitum!!!!
To see what we have been doing---- WRONG!!!!!
We also, by studying these infinite number of "Rivers of Fate", we can also realize that we can "Take the Bull by the Horns"---- and----
actually, CREATE OUR OWN------
UTOPIA---- OWNED AND CONTROLLED BY----------OURSELVES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
In summary, Madam, let You Tube, and everyone else, know, that your videos are Most Valuable!!!!
Since these will entertain us, as we are intelligent, your videos analyzing History will make all of us---- face up to the "Shaking Reality of the---- FUTURE"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Madam, Dr. Kat, in a quiet moment of Peace, alone, fall into the "infinitely beyond deepest" trance, that you could attain, and,
realize just how valuabe are the "invitations", of desperately deep research into Human Nature and its unfolding, in order to come to "shocking", but life--saving terms with the infinite number of decisions, which we make, without realizing that we are----
making them!
Until we realize, infinitely deeply, the consequences of EACH of the infinite number of decisions we make, even subconsciously, we are on passive, if not, active, "conveyer belt" moving towards----
SELF--destruction, or, NOT MOVING, towards "Messianically Transcendent" rescuing improvements on our lives, such as, the full cure of horrid diseases, life --extension, World Peace, the end to abuse, torture, and Crime! Thank You, Dr. KAT, for all your exciting, and also relaxing, and, above all, edifying, videos!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I do hope that you keep on acquiring more, more monetarily supporting advertisers----
you deserve it!!!!
Thank you, You Tube,
Thak you , all involved in their production!!!!
I’m a descendant of Edward II through the Washington family.
It would be interesting---if, in your capable and balanced historical viewpoints----to do a video of the 'commonality' of 'Bi-sexuality' with the Kings, Princes, etc. of England. During some seminars---nearly 50 odd years ago, at University; my one Professor of Psychology/Anthropology did lecture that with-in the emotional make-up of Men of Power --mostly referring now to the Financial Barons but also Modern Political Leaders---a sexual drive arises with-in them to out-let with in a modern concept of 'Favorite' or the Bromance...for these men are so driven by an Alpha Male self image that the Alpha Male subgroups itself---oft' wondered just how long and quiet the prestige of being the 'heir-to-the-Throne's' or to the King, himself--Favorite lingers here even into the 21st Century. Thanks---you are charming and erudite presentations. Great videos
What did Hugh Dispenser dispense?
I had a wave of deja vu for a moment when i realized how similar some of those royal scandals are to some of the internet drama i'm currently following lmao
Personally, I would love being called the She Wolf of France. lol
Can you imagine? Poor Isabella; she must have read chivalric stories of great knights and kings, the like of whom would "sweep her off her feet". And, look what she got! And, so young. As a homosexual man I can tell you if I were king I would manage to get an heir. I imagine she did not get her romantic knight in Edward. And, I feel for him as well; being in love and no being able to, oh wait...I guess he did act on it! Isabella, literally growing up as a queen, must have thought WTF?! I like Isabella's balls. The "she-wolf" things I certainly will agree probably came about by men. I have watched this three times. Wonderful.
Dr.Kat, is the Earl of Warwick also the Duke of Lancaster? Thanks!
You ladies need to try to think more clearly and, at least. consider the effect of all the silly, modern women stuff on your ideas--men bad, women good. Lots to consider with history besides your anger because men no longer want to date you. And, surprise! I am a homosexual male with a doctorate and even post doctoral work; saying that only to keep you from the "ignorant man" thing. I am not ignorant. I am a thinker and a wonderer about all sides of issues as it appears Dr. Kat is; which is why I like her.
Dr. you Kat, thank you again. You make my mornings here in Nashville much more fun. Yes! More about Edward II and his (using one of your words in another video) demanding pecker. You are a delight and so witty in your delivery.
Queen Isabella was amazing
I really enjoy (admire) how you can tell the story of a man and give insights into women’s history. Likewise, tell the stories of monarchs and nobles and give insights into social history. Brava!
Local interest in the Dispensers has increased recently with the finding of parts of The Youngers body buried by the High Altar at Hulton Abbey in Stoke This is due to his wifes connection with the Audley family on whose lands the monks built their Abbey. Very little of the Abbey remains apart from the graveyard and layout of the foundations of the main church The remains fit exactly with the description of what were given back to his wife for burial at Tewkesbury, as only a few could be find to give to her.
I’ve just been looking at portraits of Gaveston painted when he was alive,I can see why Edward liked him 😜
My own interest in Edward II, apart from Marlowe’s play, was piqued when I discovered my descent from Longshanks. This was an excellent account of a queen’s skillful use of her subservient position to wield considerable power informally. It is also a lesson about pride in politics and the seeking of power for its own sake rather than to serve the welfare of the many, from which servant leadership a sovereign’s power really flows.
Great video! I really appreciate how you provide context for each subject you discuss.
I think that Piers Gaveston was such an obvious eejit that the Despensers thought they could easily manipulate Edward II in much the same way but without making the obvious mistakes Gaveston made. Frankly, Edward II strikes me as being far from the sharpest knife in the block--dangerous in that he seems to have lacked much in the way of forethought and was easily swayed by whoever had his ear at the time.
The Despensers probably (and somewhat accurately) thought that the trick was to keep Edward' captivated so that no one else could catch his attention.
As a fellow she-wolf, I’d like to hear more about Isabella!
Thanks for the video. The story of Edward, Isabella and Mortimer has always attracted me and it was very nice to listen to it
Yassss, was hoping you'd end up doing this video!
Agree with your assessment of Gaveston and the Despensers…please do another video on Isabella and Edward!
I've been interested I'm English history since watching the Tudors. Thank you for making a subject which can be difficult and hard to follow come to life. You are the best!