As someone who has lived in an isolated, psychology abused state for a time, I can't make myself hate the gargoyles. They are so relatable and realistic for anyone who can relate to Quasimodo's life. Humans need interaction in order to stay sane and when we can't do that, we crack. In order for our brains to protect us, we either personify inanimate objects, make intense imaginary friends/lives or even develope DID. Yes, it's jarring but it feels very real to me. I do think having them be imaginary would be best, but they HAVE to keep the ending scene when he's chained up the same if only for that line that just hits me every time. THINK OF THE FEELS MAN!!! (Yes I'm aware I am way too emotional about this.)
fraya1022 If the gargoyles were toned down, darker, and were firmly established to be imaginary friends I think they'd be great... That's what the gargoyles are like in the stage adaptation. They are the Greek Chorus and actually urge Quasimodo to throw Frollo off the cathedral in the end!
Sinister Sweet - I don't think they need to be "darker" in order to work. No matter the source material, this is still aimed at kids and it needs some light-hearted moments if it's going to get any approval from parents. The stage production was allowed to be darker in tone and the gargoyles worked there because they served a different purpose. I think they could have worked as is if they had worked better to make it fit. That upbeat and happy song can not work when we know that Paris is BURNING down. Yet, it was important to the development of the plot and Quasimodo's character. Quasimodo needed to cheer himself up, needed to believe that Esmeralda loved him back, needed to have that hope because otherwise it wouldn't have been nearly as painful to him or us when he gets his heartbroken. Again, also very relatable to have your "friends" cheer you up only for reality to not be so kind. They are there to help protect you, after all. And yes, they needed to be 100% imaginary.
@@fraya1022 you took the words right out of my mouth. Quite honestly, combining goofiness with artistic drama is one of the things I love about animation, so giving Quasimodo imaginary friends, in my opinion, could have really helped make the source material better, if done well. It's like Disney giving Beast/Adam servants to comfort him in his isolation and help him improve his life, or making Aladdin's Genie a Robin Williams style goofball who also has a lot of wisdom to teach him to love himself and give him friendship, or giving Simba a replacement who's way of teaching to let go of the past is to just not care, only to learn to find a more balanced lifestyle. Just make their big "cheer up song" happen at a more appropriate time, and, of course keep showing that they're not real. When they turned to stone before the climax, telling Quasi that he should be stronger than stone, they should indeed have stayed that way through the climax. One of the main reasons people love Bing Bong, is that when he allows himself to disappear from Riley's life so she can live a better, more fulfilling adult life, he stays gone for the rest of the movie. But yeah, not having the Gargoyles in this movie is like not having Todd in Bojack Horseman (also, the chains scene is definitely the best scene with them, and would be perfect if they didn't bring them back for the climax, and I actually don't mind Hugo, probably because of Jason Alexander). Having all that said, Clopin is my favorite character in terms of comic relief.
Hunchback is by far my favorite Disney film. But oh man do you bring up things that a lot of other reviewers don't seem to address (outside the Gargoyles). The tone was very wonky and with you pointing it out I finally see WHY it was wonky. So once again you make wonderful points and ways to better a film. And I am sad that it was not the film we ended up with.
I find it fascinating that you started out by taking inspiration from the NC and now you're adopting more of Lindsay's style. I'm glad to see more people taking this approach because it's less "let's all point at the silly goofs and laugh" and more "let's actually try to add something of value to this conversation by analyzing potential flaws and presenting alternatives." Good work man!
Hercules has even bigger tonal problems! Like after the climatic Titan "Battle" the insufferable "Good Guys" are celebrating laughing then Hades is like "Hey, idiots! Meg is dying!" and Hercules is like "Oh crap, I kind of forgot!
I know this movie is flawed, but it's still my favorite Disney movie to date. The stuff that's flawed is annoying, but the stuff that's good is SO GOOD. In particular, it has the best hero-villain dynamic of any Disney movie - one of the best of all time, really - and its soundtrack is freaking epic.
Since Disney has been rereleasing their animated movies as live action films, I honestly would be interested in a Hunchback of Notre Dame as a live action. There would be a chance to fix the tonal issues. Probably would never happen, though.
I would love a live-action remake of this movie. I've talked about it with one of my very good friends, and we both agreed that if it were to happen, Christopher Nolan should direct it, and Ralph Fiennes should play Frollo
I have missed your reviews so much! I like the over all look at the strengths and weaknesses. This was well thought out and cleanly presented. Looking forward to seeing more from you in the future.
I think that Disney really fixed this tonal problem in the 2016 stage play. They definitely played to the idea that the when the gargoyles spoke and interacted with him, they were all in Quasimodo's head. Not only that, but they stray away from the Disney story and use more details found in the book- such as Quasimodo's deafness, which also ties into some of the more psychological aspects in the play. The actor that played Quasi is a fantastic singer with a good speaking voice, and yet the entire play Quasi has a very stereotypical "deaf voice". What I've noticed after watching the play and listening to the studio cast recording several times now, is that the actor doesn't actually sing in his true voice around any other characters. It's only when he's alone or with the gargoyles that he actually sounds phenomenal, and I think that might hint at that he's only a good singer in his head. To everyone else he is most likely tone deaf. It's just little details like that that give a good look at Quasi's mental state after so many years of not necessarily psychological torture on Frollo's part, but just the absolute solitude of living in the bell towers (which I suppose is a form of psychological torture, but nothing like what the movie alluded to). I'm not exactly sure why this is the observation I decided to share, but I haven't seen a lot of people talking about it and I think it's great.
I highly recommend the musical, I love it so much. It does have its flaws, but I think it's really good. Then again I love basically anything HoND related, so maybe get a less biased opinion. ^^;
Not really. Where the Disney formula is.a brand, a specific set of characteristics used to identify and categorize a finite canon of films, the Hero's Journey is an archetype, a narrative framework used by millions of stories in hundreds of different cultures. Because of that, it's hard to say whether the Hero's Journey has really gotten better over time, given that it doesn't follow single, linear timeline like the Disney movies do. Yeah, modern works have made strides in things like accessibility and narrative cohesion, but I'd argue that plenty of older stories still hold up pretty well. Gilgamesh, Journey to the West, and The Arthurian Legends are some of my favorite stories, over even the likes of Lord of the Rings and Star Wars.
It has changed because if you look at campbell's writings on it (dude who coined the phrase "heroes' journey" in the first place ) it has expanded to include heroes who aren't dudes, who don't get tempted away by hot chicks and who don't have wise elderly mysterious wizard men helping them out. Moana is not a large shift if you ignore gender and interpersonal relationships between characters but if you are keeping those in mind, she is a shift from what Campbell was talking about, her story focuses way more on her finding herself than beating anything up or defeating some big bad, ultimately she just recognizes that tefiti is hurting and that she has the ability to help her out..and things change at the end, she is not the only thing in the work to change she still fits and is what nowadays we would definitely think of as a heroes journey story but is different from what the historical idea of it was
I don't think the Hero's Journey itself has changed in those particular respects; there have been stories about female heroes as long as there have been stories about heroes. Our dude-centric society just took a while to acknowledge that.
I think one of the biggest reasons why Disney didn't go full on dark or mature with the movie is because they remembered the abysmal failure of The Black Cauldron, arguably their darkest movie ever.
Strangely in spite of the gargoyles, I have to say that I still love the movie because of the moments where it gets dark and serious because that stuff is really good. I also like the changes you have with making the gargoyles a little more toned down and figures of Quasimodo's imagination which he made because of the horrific abuse that Frollo puts him through and have it end with him giving them up.
Hunchback is my favorite disney movies cause even if it does have it's massive tonal shifts (and the gargoyles which are a problem now that i'm an adult) I do have to give it credit for taking a lot of risks i don't think disney would even dare try today, such as making frolo the pervert or not even having quasimodo get the girl in the end, plus the amazing music, beautiful acting and Everything Frolo does makes it an incredible movie for me..... Hunchback 2.....I'm sorry you have to go through that. *Pours Liquor on the ground in respect*
Every time I watch it and it comes to the "A guy like you" scene I think to myself "Oh right. This scene exists. I forgot because I blocked it from my memory."
Agreed. If they did, it would give Disney a chance to correct their mistakes with the animated version and give us an adaptation of the story that could be absolutely phenomenal if done well.
"Hugo, the goat banging wonder-" The line read was so perfect and unexpected that I almost cried laughing. Amazing review and, can I just gush over that thumbnail for this video? It's so cool! I'm not sure which one I like better this one or the one you did for the rip off Snow White review. :D
This is the first video of yours I have ever watched and you are incredible. This is my favorite disney movie AND one of my favorite soundtracks of all time! The Bells Of Notre Dame sets such a great tone for the movie and it's sad that it didn't quite follow through.
Thank you!!! Thank you for mentioning Clopin! No one ever mentions Clopin, even though he gets the most fan attention. Have you seen all the fan art? And on top of that people may remember the colorful jester, but no one remembers his name because it’s only mentioned once in the entire film!
Great discussion of tone. I love your idea of how to moderate the gargoyles. Alternatively there could be animal sidekick, like a bird that behaves more realistically and doesn't talk.
Whilst I completely agree with you 'tonal disparity' analysis of Hunchback, I found it quite strange that you left out one of the most important elements in the Disney Hunchback mythology that would not only have perfectly illustrated the point you were trying to make vis-a-vie tonal consistency, but would also given your viewers the opportunity to re-watch a version of the Disney Hunchback story that contained what I believed to be that perfectly balanced tonal quality of which you spoke of. I'm talking about the re-written version of Disney's Hunchback that was created for their off-broadway musical stage show production which premiered in Germany. In that version, I think that the writers pretty much cleaned up most all of the tonal inconsistencies which you pointed out. First of all, they re-wrote the gargoyles as being a 'Greek Chorus', making it unambiguous that the conversation between them and Quasi occurred solely in his mind. As you pointed out in the video, this gave him the opportunity to bounce off his thoughts to other characters so as to further augment his character development, whilst doing so without all that jarring cheesy camp. That was just the tip of the iceberg, however. In this reworked version, they remained more faithful to Hugo's novel, restoring Frollo as the arch-deacon of Notre Dame Cathedral. There were so many more briliant changes that were made to the story, such as the fact that Quasimodo was the orphaned child of Frollo's brother, giving Frollo a more realistic motivation for wanting to take on the responsibility for raising him as his own. All I can say in a very cheap, quick summary is this: The off-broadway musical version of Disney's hunchback is a much more darker, adult-oriented version that was only able to be produced due to the fact that its creators were completely unfettered by the restraints that had stifled its cartoon version. If you really want to see a more faithful adaptation to Hugo's novel, retaining a consistently dark tonal quality, whilst at the same time hanging onto Menken's sublimely gothic score (sans the cheesy cabaret 'A Guy Like You' number, thank God), then I highly suggest you grab yourself a copy of the soundtrack! Disney's 'Notre Dame' has always been my favourite until I got my hands on this version! A word of warning, though...I mean it when I say that this version is faithful to the novel, so don't expect the usual 'Disney ending' (Hint: Esmerelda dies at the end, and the Hunchback in this version is deaf!!). PS: For those interested, here's the link to the video of the full show performed at the La Jolla Playhouse: th-cam.com/video/lKZbtLxxPfg/w-d-xo.html
I love that his way of fixing the tonal problems are pretty much everything that this stage musical did. The stage musical is a beautiful gift that i wish would have made it to broadway.
This is a great review of the film. I really like your suggestions as to how improve the movie as a whole. I also think the musical fixes the tone problems and actually kind of follows your notion of further establishing the imagery elements in Quasi's head. Plus they do this neat thing where Quasimodo is deaf (like in the novel) and so when he speaks its with a difficult, I cannot think of another word at the moment, speech pattern vs when he is singing his inner thoughts which are very clear. So, if you have the time, I would recommend checking the musical soundtrack out. Again, great work as always. Perhaps you and Matt could also discuss the Hunchback in one of your podcasts for at least part of the time, just a thought. Keep up the great work and I look forward to the next hunchback video as well as your other VEDS.
apparently Disney cleansed the material more than even the greatest lotions and potions ever could, so I'm prepared for something that's nothing alike, but I am interested in the novel, and should probably get to it pretty soon. This is helping to sell me on it.
I rewatched this one last summer and I think that the last time I'd seen it had been a good 9 or 10 years before that. Based on what I remembered of my opinion in years past, and based on the fact that this wasn't one of the Disney movies from the 90's the people held up to the same extent as the others, I had tempered expectations, but I couldn't believe how good I thought it was in the end.
Quasi: Take All the dreams you've sown, Take all your lies, AND LEAVE ME ALONE~!!! Saints of Notre Dame, leaving one by one: Alright Quasimodo, we'll leave you alone, Alright Quasimodo, we'll trouble you no longer, You're right Quasimodo, we're only made of stone, We Just Thought That You Were Made of Something, Stronger. The musical treats Quasi's issues much more realistically, with him talking to the statues and stained glasses of the saints, with their version of the gargoyle song, Flight Into Egypt, much more powerful and far less jarring. It's at the end, that he fights back against them, against the demons in his head, and calls them out for the props they are. It's the last time we see them, except for a single line at the end when he throws Frollo off the roof. The musical version treats us more like adults than the movie did, as much as I love the movie, and I was thrilled to see many of the plot points from the book returned to the stage, including Esmeralda's death at the end and the implication that Quasi allows himself to die at her side. If the movie is a Must Rent, the musical is a Must See On Stage 20 Times.
Have you listened to the studio cast recording from about a year ago? It's really good and keeps a tone throughout it similar to the original novel. There should be a bootleg or two on TH-cam.
Critic Corner i agree. The original German Cast recording is also very good with a more even tone, albeit closer in plot to the film. Also has has some bootlegs online. And jardcore fans who add subtitles for our benefit XD
Just an Aaddendum. You would really like the German version of the musical since they basically fix the gargoyles exactly lime you would. Except tjey stick arou d for the finale. They actually represent his ego id and superego in that show. Theres a chilling moment where Frollo is negging Quasi to save him. He shouts "you dont want to hurt me" and the gargoyles (well hugo) say "yes you do" and Quasi throws Frollo off the cathedral
the goat loving part is actually from the book...Gringoire (an actual avatar for Victor Hugo) was so in love with Djali, he saved the goat and not Esmerelda
Fair enough, it's from the book, but just because something is accurate to the source material doesn't make it any less weird and distracting. I don't judge adaptations on source material accuracy, I judge them on the stories they try to tell in their own right. Source material comparison is absolutely interesting and worth taking into account, but I don't think it's the most important thing in adaptation, and I've never accepted, "Well, it was there in the original story" as an excuse for poor qualities. Thanks for the fun fact, though!
The book is dark, so dark and gruesome. You have an address people can send you stuff right? I have a few copies of the book and I would love to send it to you if you'd like to read it yourself. (Along with some art and other stuff.)
The musical is amazing. It has a lot of original music and still does the movie tunes beautifully. The original cast is phenomenal and I'll be in a production of it myself this coming spring!
Well, the musical treats the gargoiles as a product of Quasimodo's imagination and a moment like the one you suggested in the "fix of the gargoiles" part happens in the song "Made of stone". It is not the most perfect musical since I find that sometimes it gets a little bit slow paced, but still worth watching (I liked better the Paper Mill Playhouse better than La Jolla Playhouse, but thats just my opinion).
It's funny you talk about how the gargoyles can be improved, and that's pretty much what happens in the stage musical (except the gargoyles are now statues of saints)
Hunchback is still, bar none, my all time favourite animated Disney movie. Obviously I don't think you are trying to change that in anyone, but I mention that because I agree 100% with this review. It's my favourite because it has always connected with me on a deeper level than any other animated Disney movie. I have always noticed its unfortunate tone-based flaws, and can't STAND the Gargoyles. I always thought they should have kept the bird, who wouldn't ever SPEAK to Quasi, but who could still 'communicate' with him and be an ear to listen to him. Perhaps he could help Quasi out in some word-free way(think a less silly Pascal from Tangled), and by the end, he would learn to fly away, as Quasi learns he can live outside the cathedral without fear. But the ending you painted for the movie is absolute gold, and I would LOVE that version. If this movie ever gets the live-action treatment(which I know is both unlikely, and ill-advised), I HOPE they do fix the tone and perhaps find a way to change the gargoyles for the better, without erasing them completely.
With all of this said, among all the Disney movies that are being remade now, HoND is probably the one that needs it the most. I love your idea of what the gargoyles could have been and I dearly wish I could see that on the big screen. I keep hearing that the Broadway stage reworking mends a lot of the movie's flaws and is a little more faithful to the book, but I'd like to see what Disney would do with the film now if they ever remade it. I love this movie, but it could do with an upgrade.
Loved the review. And yeah, whatever critical ability I may have is forced to agree with you. Especially about that stupid gargoyle. I actually love the old one, though. and the tall one(Yes, I am this horrible with names) was kind of cute when he didn't have to play off of the buffoon. I also really loved the suggestions for fixing the tone. And...for giving me possible nightmares about what could have happened if they made this more kid-friendly. Ye gads! That would have been bad! But there is a part of me that literally loves almost all of the movie. I tend to be very forgiving of movie flaws. And for some reason, I kind of love most of the off-the-wall stuff that gets thrown at the audience. Especially when the crazy is from a certain bard or captain of the guard. Epsecially Follo. Forgive me if I spelt the name wrong, but that guy seems to be sheer perfection. I guess there is just a strange part in my brain that just liked being kept guessing, and thrown off-balance. And that is one thing this movie is really good at. It has just enough crazy to make me happy, and like you said, the music is simply mind-blowingly spectacular. Except the song nobody should ever remember. But heh, nothing is perfect.
Hey man, I absolutely love this movie and I agree with everything you had to say. I also like how you went through each possible scenario for fixing the film's tone problem and what the result might have looked like. I admit that this film's biggest flaw is the tone and this is something that I myself have given a lot of thought. It would have been all too easy for them to have taken out the dark aspects of the film and play it safe, but then you lose about 90% of what makes this film so unique, compared to Disney's other films. However, cutting out the comic relief entirely doesn't work either because it's somewhat necessary in order for younger viewers to be reassured that everything is fine after something dramatic and scary happens to the characters. I'm sure there are lots of people out there who will say "If they couldn't get the tone right, then they shouldn't have even tried to adapt it in the first place!" But I'm sure that there would have been a way to balance humour and darkness in a more effective way. For the record, I think your solution for fixing the Gargoyles is a damn good idea and I wish I had thought of it myself. It's just a shame because you can tell this movie could have easily been another Beauty and the Beast or another Lion King if Disney had just taken some extra time to execute the tone a little bit better. That being said, I still love this movie and I think it was extremely brave of Disney to try something so bold and different from their usual formula. And I listen to the soundtrack all the time because it is absolutely amazing. Anyway, great review. You've earned yourself a new subscriber!
DeCipher To rephrase, I actually like Hunchback's story more and find it to be less conventional than the stories in Beauty and the Beast and The Lion King. I love that Disney tried something so different and for more mature audiences. In the above comment, I meant that it could have been another BATB or TLK purely from a financial standpoint. Overall it wasn't quite as successful as those two and I wish it had been. Honestly, I blame the tone deaf comic relief for it's unpopularity. Comedic sidekicks have no place in such a dark story.
I seem to have just done a better job of compartmentalizing the contrasting tones than you have. That's not something that excuses the dysfunction I suppose, but some of us just have a higher tolerance for the dysfunction
In the musical version Quasimodo is afraid to help Esmeralda and the gargoyles encourage him to save her though he tells them to go away and they do telling Quasimodo “your right Quasimodo we are only made out of stone. We just though that you were made of something stronger”
I love and adore this film soooooo much, and I am a die hard Disney fan. This film inspires me more than any other Disney films. I know it does have flaws, but I don’t care! I actually find the gargoyles entertaining, and funny. It is really underrated and I hate that. (Plus I am aware that this is an old video too.) I’m about to say it........HUNCHBACK HAS THE BEST DISNEY SOUNDTRACK! Yep. I said it. Best movie ever. I have a lot of respect for it because of the risks that Disney took to make it. I love how dark and complex it is. I also agree with what you are saying as well. Hope you all enjoy your day. Bye bye.
To each their own CodedLockFilms, and you have a lot of great ideas. I still love this movie as is. To date I am impressed by what Disney got away with here (all with a G rating by the way). It is not perfect, but to quote the Nostalgia Critic, "the stuff that is good, is just really, really good."
This is one of my favorite movies. I think that the book is amazing, if not a bit too lengthy, and I really enjoy the French musical. I think the new broadway treatment goes a bit darker and the gargoyles become the choir, which is very clever. I think the movie is restricted by the Disney brand, but there was a lot that they pushed. The music is just fantastic and the look of the church is gorgeous.
i have to admit i LOVE the changes you proposed to the gargoyles. the musical actually has the ensemble (stand in for gargoyles) behave very similarly, but i love how pointed your approach is. and the musical soundtrack is absolutely wonderful- gargoyle song isn't there and the new ones written by alan menken are so so good. there are a few bootlegs floating around that i recommend (go for papermill if you can)
I think that the movie was just so, so, SO dark, the creators decided to throw in a bunch of slapstick humor to even out the mood. The just didn't seem to do it very well. But, yes, the soundtrack is AMAZING.
Disney did tone it down a lot as everyone dies in the book and Quasi being pelted with fruit is mild compared to the whipping he got in the book and movies and Frollo made him kiddnapp Esmeralda hence Quasi being arrested and being whipped and also Frollo attempted to rape Esmeralda when she was in sanctuary but Quasi gave her a whistle and he saved her again
I'm with you on the gargoyle front. Particularly with giving the Jason Alexander character a proverbial shove off the bell tower. However, Hellfire is absolutely non-negotiable.
How would one solve the Hunchback tonal problem? Answer: watch the broadway version... or, more accurately, the stage version. It's brilliant and incredibly moving.
Great review and ideas for fixing this movie. I do like the movie but yes, it has problems. Just curiously, have any movies you reviewed had the ultimate recommendation? I look forward to your review of HOND II.
For me The Hunchback of Notre Dame is Disney's darkest, most mature and adult movie that they've ever released!! Which is the main reason why it's of Disney's most acclaimed masterpieces. As both kids and adults can watch and relate to the movie's very dark themes of racism, genocide, religion, lust, corruption of power, and being a social outcast. The best animated movies are the ones where both children and adults can watch and enjoy together.
Man, great review, you've earned yourself a sub! I wholeheartedly agree with everything youve said. Gary Trousdale and Kirk Wise did more or less confirm the gargoyles are imaginary in the art book, but that leaves the end climax a bit up to interpretation, and feels a bit like a copout - the musical does fix a lot of tonal inconsistencies, but in my opinion still flows a littly clunky, and some of the songs don't feel as polished, specifically the bells of notre dame and how it's implimented really softens the great impact the movie had with its incredible opening. Plus I have to say I prefer how character interactions unfold in the movie for the most part, maybe I'm the odd one out, I hear the German vers of the musical feels much more polished but alas, I don't speak German so I can only listen and assume.
I thought this video was going to be about the sequel, but yeah, the original is very flawed. But I still really enjoy it. Good analysis on how it could've been improved.
I actually love that new scenario for the gargoyles :D It would have been an incredible scene IMO. I don't hate them as many people do apparently (except for Hugo), I think Victor is okay and Laverne has some very good lines (especially the last one). But this movie still remains my favorite Disney film
I think Disney wanted to create a movie that appealed more to adults but still have enough silly jokes to appeal to children. We are all entitled to our own opinions so I can see why you are skeptical about this movie, but I personally love it. I did not understand the whole theme of the movie as a kid and it was not till I was a bit older that I truly feel in love with this movie. Regardless of what you opinion of the movie is, Hellfire is undoubtedly one of the best Disney villain songs. Maybe not the THE best in your opinion, but definitely top 5 at least
Oh, Hellfire is a brilliant song. I only made the point that it would have to be taken out if one wanted to make the family-friendly version of the story. Thanks for your thoughts, and thank you for being so polite about them!
I'll just leave this here... soundcloud.com/landonbeall/drink-review-white-grape-cherry-kombucha-beds-veds-12 Great review, Jesse! I've never seen The Hunchback of Notre Dame, but MAN. Your edits sounds incredible. Disney tackling psychological stuff in a darker, more direct way than something like Inside Out sounds plan old great, and I would love to see them so stuff like that in the future. Looking forward to your HND2 review!
This might just be because I usually prefer more lighthearted stories, but I personally think that a more family-friendly version of this movie could have been great, albeit not as dark. However, for it to work I think that they would need to rework the story and character quite a bit to fit that type of movie. I know that the fans of the original book wouldn't be so welcoming to a movie that might ignore some of the darker elements of the book (which is also one reason why it's hard to make The Hunchback appropriate for kids in the first place). Still, knowing Disney and their storytelling, I believe we could've gotten a film that could be fun and lighthearted, while still telling a deep, meaningful story at its core.
the book is very dark but it is so full of description of scenery and back story you forget whats happening with the main story. plus it constantly grinds to a halt to give us lengthy backstory about a woman who voluntarily has secluded herself from the world out of grief only for it to turn out she is Esmeralda's mother. seriously it's not worth worrying about me spoiling that you could figure it out in one page. but i will give the book this it has one of the most incredible declarations of love I have ever read. unfortunately it's from Frollo to Esmeralda when she is imprisoned so understandably it isn't received very well. plus Frollo is explained to only be 36 in the book despite his appearance being that of a much older man so his being in love with her is less creepy in that sense. but otherwise i would recommend it. it very well written and the emotions of the characters are so vivid and so relatable you feel like you're there witnessing everything happening. also and this is a nice thing you will notice that alot of the lyrics in the film are in the book. one of my favorites is "if in god's plan he made the devil so much stronger then a man"
I don't know if you mentioned this or not (I got a little ways through before deciding to comment while I was thinking about it) but if since you like the more serious tones and plot of the movie you would probably really enjoy the stage musical. First of all, they get rid of the gargoyles and there is a lot more moral ambiguity not just black and white "This person is bad/this person is good" in it. There are beautiful songs in it too. I thought the music was great in the movie but once I listen to the musical soundtrack I was never able to go back to the movie. It basically is really much closer to the book and doesn't waste its time trying to add in cheap jokes for the kiddos. It is much more targeted towards an older more mature audience. (The tavern song/ someday/ finale/esmerelda/ place of miracles are all beautiful examples of this.) Anyway, you should check it out!
Julianna Mikell @ "moral ambiguity not just black and white "This person is bad/this person is good" in it" - If you're talking about Frollo then I don't see why this is a good thing. People don't just transform from being good to being sexual predators because they see a pretty girl as in the original book or this stage play. Disney's film Frollo is much more psychologically realistic.
I was saying that the play was a much more built and realistic character. In the movie he's pretty two dimensional. It's common in children's movies because kids that are 7 or 8 need things to be very exaggerated. I'm saying in the play he actually has a motivation he isn't just evil to be evil. No one who is bad realizes they are bad. The first thing you see in the Disney movie is him kill someone and not even care. In the stage play he hates them a specific group of people because of an experience he had. In this movie he just is doing it with no real rhythm or reason. It's just better writing to not have a two dimensional, flat character is what i'm saying (and is more true to the actual character.)
also, i forgot to mention, in the stage play, morally ambiguity was not just about Frollo. It was also about Quasi because (SPOILER) he kills frollo in the end and makes a few questionable decisions in the play. He was still a likable character, but he did things and said things that made him imperfect. (While, in the disney movie he was basically a sweet, kind, nothing but goodness and perfectness kind of character.)
Julianna Mikell@ "I was saying that the play was a much more built and realistic character." - How is becoming a sexual predator out of nowhere realistic? Maybe back in Hugo's time they still believed that a pretty girl could drive even the best man to become a rapist, but you can't write characters like that anymore based on what we know about psychology. Disney film Frollo's transition from oppressive religious bigot to sexual predator is much more realistic. "In the movie he's pretty two dimensional." - That would suggest he's defined by a single trait/motive which he swings between embracing and rejecting. This isn't the case. He has multiple goals; 1) Personal salvation 2) Expelling the gypsies from Paris 3) Catching Esmeralda. "In this movie he just is doing it with no real rhythm or reason." - There is a clear reason. He's a fire and brimstone Catholic and he sees the gypsies as heathens and sinners. Why would it need to be a personal motivation? Do you think all the Nazis had personal grievances against the jews, gypsies etc?
"Out of nowhere" ? In the play it isn't out of nowhere. The play leads up to it. It's basically everything in the movie with a lot more scenes of characters interacting giving more time for information. He was a bigot in the play too. It stemmed from his brother being kicked out of the church and his brother running off with a Romani girl. He's awful to Quasimodo because of how he's born in the movie but takes care of him because he gets guilted into it by the Arch Deacon. In the play (based much closer to the novel) He *is* the arch deacon and takes care of Quasi because it was his brother's child and his brother died. I'm saying that this gives him a more clear reason and a lot more depth to his character. Being one dimensional is not strictly based on how many motivations you have. A character is also considered 2 dimensional if they remain emotionally one thing through a story (in Frollo's case: evil/judging others while seeing himself as pure/holy. Which is why when Esmerelda (in his eyes) threatens this perception of himself he feels the need to kill her). He never has any genuinely good moments or any other traits other than being the bad guy. (It's a kids movie so that isn't a bad thing. It's normal writing in children's movies to make a character nothing but evil and unlikeable) but for a more mature story like the stage play, that is why they add a lot more layers. All I'm saying is compared to the incredibly developed version of the characters the disney movie ones are more flat. This isn't a bad quality for a kid's movie. I was suggestion the stage play to anyone who wanted something more mature with more developed characters.
I love this movie, and your review is good too. Frollo is probably Disney's best villain- you can't change one thing about him, as you acknowledged. Also, you can't get rid of Hugo the Gargoyle, because the joke with the Gargoyles' names wouldn't work. The book is pretty dark. My parents bought me a VERY abridged audiobook of it so I could see how different it is from the movie. Actually, a lot of the key scenes are reproduced in the Disney movie. But there are some important changes. Spoiler alert; Phoebus is a thoroughly unpleasant man in the book- he only wants Esmerelda for one thing. Also, Phoebus is one of only two major characters left alive at the end (the other two are not Quasi and Esmerelda). There is a major character called Gringoire, who is not in the Disney movie, because his story could not be made child friendly.
Hey when are you doing your Hunchback 2 review you said you were doing. It's been over a year since you made this. Could you please get your Hunchback 2 review up soon.
I like the Gargoyle song too. I just don't think it fits in with the rest of the soundtrack at all. I like cotton candy, but I wouldn't use it to garnish a steak.
Hunchback is my favorite Disney movie, for a lot of personal reasons. That doesn't mean I disagree with this review. There honestly is a tonal problem and the gargoyles add to that. I however would argue that the chaining up of Quasimodo is figurative, while being literal at the same time. I don't think having him struggling with what he should do, then turning to the gargoyles for help, only to have them tell him, he has to chose on is own...is not something that should happen. I personally feel Quasimodo has to argue with the gargoyles like he does in the movie, because he needs to learn to assert him self. Not just against Frollo but them as well. It is a great scene that teaches that you can't relay on only the negative (Frollo) or positive (Gargoyles) thoughts. He has to find balance and decide on his own, which he does by arguing with the gargoyles. I feel like if you had them tell him he had to figure it out on his own defeats the purpose of the scene. Which ultimately defeats his self realization. It is why one of my favorite lines in the movie are "We just thought you were made of something stronger" He does realize in that scene he doesn't need them as a crutch, without having them tell him. The musical is really good. There are parts of it I feel are done slightly better in the movie in terms of character relationships. Both are good in their own right and I love them. One upside to the musical is that they added a song called "Made of Stone" for this scene specifically, which I feel does a much better job of portraying what they were going for in this scene . You can see it in the movie, but the song makes it a little more tangible. That being said, really good review and it gave me some things to think about.
Your views on Hunchback are somewhat similar to my feelings on the Disney remakes, they feel like they're trying to be different from their predecessors but the fact that they have to either adhere to the Disney formula or have a lot of callbacks to the original which bring a lot of problems with tone. The Jungle Book, the only one I love so far has this problem too, especially with the songs, you have a scene where Shere Khan passive-aggressively threatens Raksha's Wolf cubs and then straight to the jazzy Bare Necessities. Also, while I know you like Maleficent, I can't bring myself to like it. I admit I was a bit too harsh on it on my first viewing and found more to like on my second viewing, but in my opinion, it was held back by the fact that it's Disney and can't have a downright tragic ending or have an outright villainous protagonist like There Will Be Blood or Taxi Driver. On the gargoyles, you could actually incorporate Hugo into the story, by making him a more poisonous influence like the Gollum psyche, like when it turns out Esmeralda loves Phoebous over Quasimodo, have him be tempted to act on his resentments and feelings of entitlement, but yeah, that idea of yours would vastly improve the gargoyles and make them more forgiveable.
Hey, Jesse! If Disney makes a Live-Action remake of "The Hunchback of Notre Dame", maybe replace the gargoyles with the mice and Quasimodo have been taking care of them, feeding them and clothing just like Cinderella. I know it's cliched, but it would make much sense.
As someone who has lived in an isolated, psychology abused state for a time, I can't make myself hate the gargoyles. They are so relatable and realistic for anyone who can relate to Quasimodo's life. Humans need interaction in order to stay sane and when we can't do that, we crack. In order for our brains to protect us, we either personify inanimate objects, make intense imaginary friends/lives or even develope DID. Yes, it's jarring but it feels very real to me. I do think having them be imaginary would be best, but they HAVE to keep the ending scene when he's chained up the same if only for that line that just hits me every time. THINK OF THE FEELS MAN!!!
(Yes I'm aware I am way too emotional about this.)
fraya1022 I think you've expressed yourself quite well there and explained how and why that works.
fraya1022 If the gargoyles were toned down, darker, and were firmly established to be imaginary friends I think they'd be great...
That's what the gargoyles are like in the stage adaptation. They are the Greek Chorus and actually urge Quasimodo to throw Frollo off the cathedral in the end!
Sinister Sweet - I don't think they need to be "darker" in order to work. No matter the source material, this is still aimed at kids and it needs some light-hearted moments if it's going to get any approval from parents. The stage production was allowed to be darker in tone and the gargoyles worked there because they served a different purpose.
I think they could have worked as is if they had worked better to make it fit. That upbeat and happy song can not work when we know that Paris is BURNING down. Yet, it was important to the development of the plot and Quasimodo's character. Quasimodo needed to cheer himself up, needed to believe that Esmeralda loved him back, needed to have that hope because otherwise it wouldn't have been nearly as painful to him or us when he gets his heartbroken. Again, also very relatable to have your "friends" cheer you up only for reality to not be so kind. They are there to help protect you, after all.
And yes, they needed to be 100% imaginary.
I like the idea of the gargoyles, but they are portraied poorly, totally over the top and that ruins that effect.
@@fraya1022 you took the words right out of my mouth. Quite honestly, combining goofiness with artistic drama is one of the things I love about animation, so giving Quasimodo imaginary friends, in my opinion, could have really helped make the source material better, if done well. It's like Disney giving Beast/Adam servants to comfort him in his isolation and help him improve his life, or making Aladdin's Genie a Robin Williams style goofball who also has a lot of wisdom to teach him to love himself and give him friendship, or giving Simba a replacement who's way of teaching to let go of the past is to just not care, only to learn to find a more balanced lifestyle. Just make their big "cheer up song" happen at a more appropriate time, and, of course keep showing that they're not real. When they turned to stone before the climax, telling Quasi that he should be stronger than stone, they should indeed have stayed that way through the climax. One of the main reasons people love Bing Bong, is that when he allows himself to disappear from Riley's life so she can live a better, more fulfilling adult life, he stays gone for the rest of the movie. But yeah, not having the Gargoyles in this movie is like not having Todd in Bojack Horseman (also, the chains scene is definitely the best scene with them, and would be perfect if they didn't bring them back for the climax, and I actually don't mind Hugo, probably because of Jason Alexander). Having all that said, Clopin is my favorite character in terms of comic relief.
Hunchback is by far my favorite Disney film. But oh man do you bring up things that a lot of other reviewers don't seem to address (outside the Gargoyles). The tone was very wonky and with you pointing it out I finally see WHY it was wonky.
So once again you make wonderful points and ways to better a film. And I am sad that it was not the film we ended up with.
I find it fascinating that you started out by taking inspiration from the NC and now you're adopting more of Lindsay's style. I'm glad to see more people taking this approach because it's less "let's all point at the silly goofs and laugh" and more "let's actually try to add something of value to this conversation by analyzing potential flaws and presenting alternatives." Good work man!
Nathaniel Esposito At least she talk down to people
Agreed. I like both styles but I think the format that he's adopted works for his style.
Hercules has even bigger tonal problems! Like after the climatic Titan "Battle" the insufferable "Good Guys" are celebrating laughing then Hades is like "Hey, idiots! Meg is dying!" and Hercules is like "Oh crap, I kind of forgot!
I know this movie is flawed, but it's still my favorite Disney movie to date. The stuff that's flawed is annoying, but the stuff that's good is SO GOOD. In particular, it has the best hero-villain dynamic of any Disney movie - one of the best of all time, really - and its soundtrack is freaking epic.
Since Disney has been rereleasing their animated movies as live action films, I honestly would be interested in a Hunchback of Notre Dame as a live action. There would be a chance to fix the tonal issues. Probably would never happen, though.
Actually, there is a 38-second TH-cam video where Alan Menken, the songwriter, has hinted that he might do a live-action remake.
Emily Schmitt that'd be AMAZING❤️
I would love a live-action remake of this movie. I've talked about it with one of my very good friends, and we both agreed that if it were to happen, Christopher Nolan should direct it, and Ralph Fiennes should play Frollo
Jacob Below Then,that would be totally awesome...
Actually. On Imdb, Robert Bathurst is rumored to be casted as Frollo.
But I would love to see Sacha Baron Cohen as Clopin. 😂
I have missed your reviews so much! I like the over all look at the strengths and weaknesses. This was well thought out and cleanly presented. Looking forward to seeing more from you in the future.
I think that Disney really fixed this tonal problem in the 2016 stage play. They definitely played to the idea that the when the gargoyles spoke and interacted with him, they were all in Quasimodo's head. Not only that, but they stray away from the Disney story and use more details found in the book- such as Quasimodo's deafness, which also ties into some of the more psychological aspects in the play.
The actor that played Quasi is a fantastic singer with a good speaking voice, and yet the entire play Quasi has a very stereotypical "deaf voice". What I've noticed after watching the play and listening to the studio cast recording several times now, is that the actor doesn't actually sing in his true voice around any other characters. It's only when he's alone or with the gargoyles that he actually sounds phenomenal, and I think that might hint at that he's only a good singer in his head. To everyone else he is most likely tone deaf. It's just little details like that that give a good look at Quasi's mental state after so many years of not necessarily psychological torture on Frollo's part, but just the absolute solitude of living in the bell towers (which I suppose is a form of psychological torture, but nothing like what the movie alluded to).
I'm not exactly sure why this is the observation I decided to share, but I haven't seen a lot of people talking about it and I think it's great.
I highly recommend the musical, I love it so much. It does have its flaws, but I think it's really good. Then again I love basically anything HoND related, so maybe get a less biased opinion. ^^;
I didn't particularly love the movie but after listening to musical it has grown a special place in my heart
Great work!! The Disney formula is similar to the Hero's journey. Both have changed and evolved for the better.
Not really. Where the Disney formula is.a brand, a specific set of characteristics used to identify and categorize a finite canon of films, the Hero's Journey is an archetype, a narrative framework used by millions of stories in hundreds of different cultures. Because of that, it's hard to say whether the Hero's Journey has really gotten better over time, given that it doesn't follow single, linear timeline like the Disney movies do. Yeah, modern works have made strides in things like accessibility and narrative cohesion, but I'd argue that plenty of older stories still hold up pretty well. Gilgamesh, Journey to the West, and The Arthurian Legends are some of my favorite stories, over even the likes of Lord of the Rings and Star Wars.
Zepher Fire since when has "the hero's journey" changed? Have you SEEN Moana? It's got the formula step by step.
It has changed because if you look at campbell's writings on it (dude who coined the phrase "heroes' journey" in the first place ) it has expanded to include heroes who aren't dudes, who don't get tempted away by hot chicks and who don't have wise elderly mysterious wizard men helping them out. Moana is not a large shift if you ignore gender and interpersonal relationships between characters but if you are keeping those in mind, she is a shift from what Campbell was talking about, her story focuses way more on her finding herself than beating anything up or defeating some big bad, ultimately she just recognizes that tefiti is hurting and that she has the ability to help her out..and things change at the end, she is not the only thing in the work to change
she still fits and is what nowadays we would definitely think of as a heroes journey story but is different from what the historical idea of it was
I don't think the Hero's Journey itself has changed in those particular respects; there have been stories about female heroes as long as there have been stories about heroes. Our dude-centric society just took a while to acknowledge that.
I suppose it would be more accurate to say that our viewpoint has changed?
I think one of the biggest reasons why Disney didn't go full on dark or mature with the movie is because they remembered the abysmal failure of The Black Cauldron, arguably their darkest movie ever.
A world without Hellfire...I can't even imagine that
Strangely in spite of the gargoyles, I have to say that I still love the movie because of the moments where it gets dark and serious because that stuff is really good. I also like the changes you have with making the gargoyles a little more toned down and figures of Quasimodo's imagination which he made because of the horrific abuse that Frollo puts him through and have it end with him giving them up.
Hunchback is my favorite disney movies cause even if it does have it's massive tonal shifts (and the gargoyles which are a problem now that i'm an adult) I do have to give it credit for taking a lot of risks i don't think disney would even dare try today, such as making frolo the pervert or not even having quasimodo get the girl in the end, plus the amazing music, beautiful acting and Everything Frolo does makes it an incredible movie for me.....
Hunchback 2.....I'm sorry you have to go through that.
*Pours Liquor on the ground in respect*
I think the Quasi actually had some sorta hallucination/imaginary friend thing going on in the original book by Victor Hugo.
I honestly forgot the gargoyles were in the movie I guess my brain was trying to block them out
Oh yeah the goofy falling laugh smh
Every time I watch it and it comes to the "A guy like you" scene I think to myself "Oh right. This scene exists. I forgot because I blocked it from my memory."
Hunchback is the movie I wish Disney would make a live action version of.
Agreed. If they did, it would give Disney a chance to correct their mistakes with the animated version and give us an adaptation of the story that could be absolutely phenomenal if done well.
A live action version of the musical.
They are making one. 😁
I like how all of the tonal fixes recommended essentially describe the stage version.
"Hugo, the goat banging wonder-" The line read was so perfect and unexpected that I almost cried laughing. Amazing review and, can I just gush over that thumbnail for this video? It's so cool! I'm not sure which one I like better this one or the one you did for the rip off Snow White review. :D
I'd always thought The Hunchback of Notre Dame was the Darkest of the Disney Animated movies
This is the first video of yours I have ever watched and you are incredible. This is my favorite disney movie AND one of my favorite soundtracks of all time! The Bells Of Notre Dame sets such a great tone for the movie and it's sad that it didn't quite follow through.
I love your newer reviews! You're so analytical!
You know, that's a really catchy theme song 😊
Thank you!!! Thank you for mentioning Clopin! No one ever mentions Clopin, even though he gets the most fan attention. Have you seen all the fan art? And on top of that people may remember the colorful jester, but no one remembers his name because it’s only mentioned once in the entire film!
Out of all the comedic aspects of Hunchback, Clopin was the most organic.
That was the most constructive critique of the gargoyles I've ever heard! Don't get rid of them, just insert them better.
Great discussion of tone. I love your idea of how to moderate the gargoyles. Alternatively there could be animal sidekick, like a bird that behaves more realistically and doesn't talk.
Whilst I completely agree with you 'tonal disparity' analysis of Hunchback, I found it quite strange that you left out one of the most important elements in the Disney Hunchback mythology that would not only have perfectly illustrated the point you were trying to make vis-a-vie tonal consistency, but would also given your viewers the opportunity to re-watch a version of the Disney Hunchback story that contained what I believed to be that perfectly balanced tonal quality of which you spoke of.
I'm talking about the re-written version of Disney's Hunchback that was created for their off-broadway musical stage show production which premiered in Germany. In that version, I think that the writers pretty much cleaned up most all of the tonal inconsistencies which you pointed out.
First of all, they re-wrote the gargoyles as being a 'Greek Chorus', making it unambiguous that the conversation between them and Quasi occurred solely in his mind. As you pointed out in the video, this gave him the opportunity to bounce off his thoughts to other characters so as to further augment his character development, whilst doing so without all that jarring cheesy camp.
That was just the tip of the iceberg, however. In this reworked version, they remained more faithful to Hugo's novel, restoring Frollo as the arch-deacon of Notre Dame Cathedral.
There were so many more briliant changes that were made to the story, such as the fact that Quasimodo was the orphaned child of Frollo's brother, giving Frollo a more realistic motivation for wanting to take on the responsibility for raising him as his own.
All I can say in a very cheap, quick summary is this: The off-broadway musical version of Disney's hunchback is a much more darker, adult-oriented version that was only able to be produced due to the fact that its creators were completely unfettered by the restraints that had stifled its cartoon version.
If you really want to see a more faithful adaptation to Hugo's novel, retaining a consistently dark tonal quality, whilst at the same time hanging onto Menken's sublimely gothic score (sans the cheesy cabaret 'A Guy Like You' number, thank God), then I highly suggest you grab yourself a copy of the soundtrack!
Disney's 'Notre Dame' has always been my favourite until I got my hands on this version! A word of warning, though...I mean it when I say that this version is faithful to the novel, so don't expect the usual 'Disney ending' (Hint: Esmerelda dies at the end, and the Hunchback in this version is deaf!!).
PS: For those interested, here's the link to the video of the full show performed at the La Jolla Playhouse:
th-cam.com/video/lKZbtLxxPfg/w-d-xo.html
I love that his way of fixing the tonal problems are pretty much everything that this stage musical did. The stage musical is a beautiful gift that i wish would have made it to broadway.
This is a great review of the film. I really like your suggestions as to how improve the movie as a whole. I also think the musical fixes the tone problems and actually kind of follows your notion of further establishing the imagery elements in Quasi's head. Plus they do this neat thing where Quasimodo is deaf (like in the novel) and so when he speaks its with a difficult, I cannot think of another word at the moment, speech pattern vs when he is singing his inner thoughts which are very clear.
So, if you have the time, I would recommend checking the musical soundtrack out. Again, great work as always. Perhaps you and Matt could also discuss the Hunchback in one of your podcasts for at least part of the time, just a thought. Keep up the great work and I look forward to the next hunchback video as well as your other VEDS.
apparently Disney cleansed the material more than even the greatest lotions and potions ever could, so I'm prepared for something that's nothing alike, but I am interested in the novel, and should probably get to it pretty soon. This is helping to sell me on it.
I rewatched this one last summer and I think that the last time I'd seen it had been a good 9 or 10 years before that. Based on what I remembered of my opinion in years past, and based on the fact that this wasn't one of the Disney movies from the 90's the people held up to the same extent as the others, I had tempered expectations, but I couldn't believe how good I thought it was in the end.
Quasi: Take All the dreams you've sown,
Take all your lies,
AND LEAVE ME ALONE~!!!
Saints of Notre Dame, leaving one by one: Alright Quasimodo, we'll leave you alone,
Alright Quasimodo, we'll trouble you no longer,
You're right Quasimodo, we're only made of stone,
We Just Thought That You Were Made of Something, Stronger.
The musical treats Quasi's issues much more realistically, with him talking to the statues and stained glasses of the saints, with their version of the gargoyle song, Flight Into Egypt, much more powerful and far less jarring. It's at the end, that he fights back against them, against the demons in his head, and calls them out for the props they are. It's the last time we see them, except for a single line at the end when he throws Frollo off the roof.
The musical version treats us more like adults than the movie did, as much as I love the movie, and I was thrilled to see many of the plot points from the book returned to the stage, including Esmeralda's death at the end and the implication that Quasi allows himself to die at her side. If the movie is a Must Rent, the musical is a Must See On Stage 20 Times.
This was actually my favorite movie
Have you listened to the studio cast recording from about a year ago? It's really good and keeps a tone throughout it similar to the original novel. There should be a bootleg or two on TH-cam.
Critic Corner i agree. The original German Cast recording is also very good with a more even tone, albeit closer in plot to the film. Also has has some bootlegs online. And jardcore fans who add subtitles for our benefit XD
Just an Aaddendum. You would really like the German version of the musical since they basically fix the gargoyles exactly lime you would. Except tjey stick arou d for the finale. They actually represent his ego id and superego in that show. Theres a chilling moment where Frollo is negging Quasi to save him. He shouts "you dont want to hurt me" and the gargoyles (well hugo) say "yes you do" and Quasi throws Frollo off the cathedral
Angela .Rajic ... well allright, I'll go see that!
A very underrated film.
the goat loving part is actually from the book...Gringoire (an actual avatar for Victor Hugo) was so in love with Djali, he saved the goat and not Esmerelda
Fair enough, it's from the book, but just because something is accurate to the source material doesn't make it any less weird and distracting. I don't judge adaptations on source material accuracy, I judge them on the stories they try to tell in their own right. Source material comparison is absolutely interesting and worth taking into account, but I don't think it's the most important thing in adaptation, and I've never accepted, "Well, it was there in the original story" as an excuse for poor qualities. Thanks for the fun fact, though!
I've liked this movie since I was a kid and while I still really like it I agree that is has some definite tone shifts.
I was waiting for this my friend and you didn't disappoint, great video! Can't wait for the next ones!
The book is dark, so dark and gruesome. You have an address people can send you stuff right? I have a few copies of the book and I would love to send it to you if you'd like to read it yourself. (Along with some art and other stuff.)
fraya1022 Are you still sending copies of it? I would like one since I don’t have any money to buy it and I really don’t like reading things online
The musical is amazing. It has a lot of original music and still does the movie tunes beautifully. The original cast is phenomenal and I'll be in a production of it myself this coming spring!
Well, the musical treats the gargoiles as a product of Quasimodo's imagination and a moment like the one you suggested in the "fix of the gargoiles" part happens in the song "Made of stone". It is not the most perfect musical since I find that sometimes it gets a little bit slow paced, but still worth watching (I liked better the Paper Mill Playhouse better than La Jolla Playhouse, but thats just my opinion).
Conclusion: the stage musical is definitely better in every way, barring the kind of visuals only animation can bring.
It's funny you talk about how the gargoyles can be improved, and that's pretty much what happens in the stage musical (except the gargoyles are now statues of saints)
The musical is awesome. No Hugo, a more serious tone, and the epic musical score is amazing.
Hunchback is still, bar none, my all time favourite animated Disney movie. Obviously I don't think you are trying to change that in anyone, but I mention that because I agree 100% with this review. It's my favourite because it has always connected with me on a deeper level than any other animated Disney movie. I have always noticed its unfortunate tone-based flaws, and can't STAND the Gargoyles. I always thought they should have kept the bird, who wouldn't ever SPEAK to Quasi, but who could still 'communicate' with him and be an ear to listen to him. Perhaps he could help Quasi out in some word-free way(think a less silly Pascal from Tangled), and by the end, he would learn to fly away, as Quasi learns he can live outside the cathedral without fear. But the ending you painted for the movie is absolute gold, and I would LOVE that version. If this movie ever gets the live-action treatment(which I know is both unlikely, and ill-advised), I HOPE they do fix the tone and perhaps find a way to change the gargoyles for the better, without erasing them completely.
*scrolls through yt feed* Codedlock is reviewing Hunchback?! YES!! :D
With all of this said, among all the Disney movies that are being remade now, HoND is probably the one that needs it the most. I love your idea of what the gargoyles could have been and I dearly wish I could see that on the big screen. I keep hearing that the Broadway stage reworking mends a lot of the movie's flaws and is a little more faithful to the book, but I'd like to see what Disney would do with the film now if they ever remade it. I love this movie, but it could do with an upgrade.
Spot on with the comments on the Gargoyles. The musical versions have done stuff like that. The fact that they are in his head, I mean.
All I can say is
If this is not Targeted to kids
It would be a brilliant movie and masterpiece
Hunchback is one of my favorite Disney films. If it weren't for those Gargoyles then it would of been a success
Loved the review. And yeah, whatever critical ability I may have is forced to agree with you. Especially about that stupid gargoyle. I actually love the old one, though. and the tall one(Yes, I am this horrible with names) was kind of cute when he didn't have to play off of the buffoon. I also really loved the suggestions for fixing the tone. And...for giving me possible nightmares about what could have happened if they made this more kid-friendly. Ye gads! That would have been bad!
But there is a part of me that literally loves almost all of the movie. I tend to be very forgiving of movie flaws. And for some reason, I kind of love most of the off-the-wall stuff that gets thrown at the audience. Especially when the crazy is from a certain bard or captain of the guard. Epsecially Follo. Forgive me if I spelt the name wrong, but that guy seems to be sheer perfection. I guess there is just a strange part in my brain that just liked being kept guessing, and thrown off-balance. And that is one thing this movie is really good at. It has just enough crazy to make me happy, and like you said, the music is simply mind-blowingly spectacular. Except the song nobody should ever remember. But heh, nothing is perfect.
Hey man, I absolutely love this movie and I agree with everything you had to say. I also like how you went through each possible scenario for fixing the film's tone problem and what the result might have looked like. I admit that this film's biggest flaw is the tone and this is something that I myself have given a lot of thought. It would have been all too easy for them to have taken out the dark aspects of the film and play it safe, but then you lose about 90% of what makes this film so unique, compared to Disney's other films. However, cutting out the comic relief entirely doesn't work either because it's somewhat necessary in order for younger viewers to be reassured that everything is fine after something dramatic and scary happens to the characters. I'm sure there are lots of people out there who will say "If they couldn't get the tone right, then they shouldn't have even tried to adapt it in the first place!" But I'm sure that there would have been a way to balance humour and darkness in a more effective way. For the record, I think your solution for fixing the Gargoyles is a damn good idea and I wish I had thought of it myself.
It's just a shame because you can tell this movie could have easily been another Beauty and the Beast or another Lion King if Disney had just taken some extra time to execute the tone a little bit better. That being said, I still love this movie and I think it was extremely brave of Disney to try something so bold and different from their usual formula. And I listen to the soundtrack all the time because it is absolutely amazing. Anyway, great review. You've earned yourself a new subscriber!
The Cinema Cynic@ Out of curiosity, how do you think Beauty and the Beast and Lion King are better than Hunchback?
DeCipher To rephrase, I actually like Hunchback's story more and find it to be less conventional than the stories in Beauty and the Beast and The Lion King. I love that Disney tried something so different and for more mature audiences. In the above comment, I meant that it could have been another BATB or TLK purely from a financial standpoint. Overall it wasn't quite as successful as those two and I wish it had been. Honestly, I blame the tone deaf comic relief for it's unpopularity. Comedic sidekicks have no place in such a dark story.
Hunchback is my fav disney movie. I am watching it right now.
I totally agree! But the beautiful moments in this movie give me chills!
I seem to have just done a better job of compartmentalizing the contrasting tones than you have. That's not something that excuses the dysfunction I suppose, but some of us just have a higher tolerance for the dysfunction
You should do Bambi II. That movie was awesome for a direct to video Disney sequel.
In the musical version Quasimodo is afraid to help Esmeralda and the gargoyles encourage him to save her though he tells them to go away and they do telling Quasimodo “your right Quasimodo we are only made out of stone. We just though that you were made of something stronger”
I love and adore this film soooooo much, and I am a die hard Disney fan. This film inspires me more than any other Disney films. I know it does have flaws, but I don’t care! I actually find the gargoyles entertaining, and funny. It is really underrated and I hate that. (Plus I am aware that this is an old video too.) I’m about to say it........HUNCHBACK HAS THE BEST DISNEY SOUNDTRACK! Yep. I said it. Best movie ever. I have a lot of respect for it because of the risks that Disney took to make it. I love how dark and complex it is. I also agree with what you are saying as well. Hope you all enjoy your day. Bye bye.
I'll actually be seeing the musical at some point in the next month or so... I'll tell you what I think about it!
This was very enjoyable. Thanks
To each their own CodedLockFilms, and you have a lot of great ideas. I still love this movie as is. To date I am impressed by what Disney got away with here (all with a G rating by the way). It is not perfect, but to quote the Nostalgia Critic, "the stuff that is good, is just really, really good."
This is one of my favorite movies. I think that the book is amazing, if not a bit too lengthy, and I really enjoy the French musical. I think the new broadway treatment goes a bit darker and the gargoyles become the choir, which is very clever. I think the movie is restricted by the Disney brand, but there was a lot that they pushed. The music is just fantastic and the look of the church is gorgeous.
i have to admit i LOVE the changes you proposed to the gargoyles. the musical actually has the ensemble (stand in for gargoyles) behave very similarly, but i love how pointed your approach is. and the musical soundtrack is absolutely wonderful- gargoyle song isn't there and the new ones written by alan menken are so so good. there are a few bootlegs floating around that i recommend (go for papermill if you can)
I wonder how the movie would have been received if it had been released under subsidiaries Miramax or Hollywood Pictures?
I think that the movie was just so, so, SO dark, the creators decided to throw in a bunch of slapstick humor to even out the mood. The just didn't seem to do it very well. But, yes, the soundtrack is AMAZING.
Disney did tone it down a lot as everyone dies in the book and Quasi being pelted with fruit is mild compared to the whipping he got in the book and movies and Frollo made him kiddnapp Esmeralda hence Quasi being arrested and being whipped and also Frollo attempted to rape Esmeralda when she was in sanctuary but Quasi gave her a whistle and he saved her again
I look forward to the live action remake, and hopefully the tonal problems do not happen again. And I also hope they don’t stuff it up.
I'm with you on the gargoyle front. Particularly with giving the Jason Alexander character a proverbial shove off the bell tower. However, Hellfire is absolutely non-negotiable.
How would one solve the Hunchback tonal problem? Answer: watch the broadway version... or, more accurately, the stage version. It's brilliant and incredibly moving.
Oh, HELL YES! I cannot wait for UAV Secret of the Hunchback. What a secret indeed.
This was fantastic! Very deep review
Fantastic video and even more fantastic hair! Keep rocking the style!
Great review and ideas for fixing this movie. I do like the movie but yes, it has problems. Just curiously, have any movies you reviewed had the ultimate recommendation? I look forward to your review of HOND II.
WE BACK
For me The Hunchback of Notre Dame is Disney's darkest, most mature and adult movie that they've ever released!! Which is the main reason why it's of Disney's most acclaimed masterpieces. As both kids and adults can watch and relate to the movie's very dark themes of racism, genocide, religion, lust, corruption of power, and being a social outcast. The best animated movies are the ones where both children and adults can watch and enjoy together.
It's not acclaimed, it's underrated. The Lion King is the one that is acclaimed.
I like your idea about fixing the tone. The musical is worth a viewing, I'm sure you can find it on TH-cam.
They tried to abandon the Disney formula entirely with Chicken Little and go a more DreamWorks route. It did NOT work.
Man, great review, you've earned yourself a sub! I wholeheartedly agree with everything youve said. Gary Trousdale and Kirk Wise did more or less confirm the gargoyles are imaginary in the art book, but that leaves the end climax a bit up to interpretation, and feels a bit like a copout - the musical does fix a lot of tonal inconsistencies, but in my opinion still flows a littly clunky, and some of the songs don't feel as polished, specifically the bells of notre dame and how it's implimented really softens the great impact the movie had with its incredible opening. Plus I have to say I prefer how character interactions unfold in the movie for the most part, maybe I'm the odd one out, I hear the German vers of the musical feels much more polished but alas, I don't speak German so I can only listen and assume.
Would you consider reviewing Fox and the Hound 2?
I thought this video was going to be about the sequel, but yeah, the original is very flawed. But I still really enjoy it. Good analysis on how it could've been improved.
This is a really great video. I subscribed.
I actually love that new scenario for the gargoyles :D It would have been an incredible scene IMO. I don't hate them as many people do apparently (except for Hugo), I think Victor is okay and Laverne has some very good lines (especially the last one). But this movie still remains my favorite Disney film
You're back!
I mean, I've been "back" since September 1st, and even then it was only after a month-long break. =)
I think Disney wanted to create a movie that appealed more to adults but still have enough silly jokes to appeal to children. We are all entitled to our own opinions so I can see why you are skeptical about this movie, but I personally love it. I did not understand the whole theme of the movie as a kid and it was not till I was a bit older that I truly feel in love with this movie. Regardless of what you opinion of the movie is, Hellfire is undoubtedly one of the best Disney villain songs. Maybe not the THE best in your opinion, but definitely top 5 at least
Oh, Hellfire is a brilliant song. I only made the point that it would have to be taken out if one wanted to make the family-friendly version of the story.
Thanks for your thoughts, and thank you for being so polite about them!
Yay! Your back!
I'll just leave this here... soundcloud.com/landonbeall/drink-review-white-grape-cherry-kombucha-beds-veds-12
Great review, Jesse! I've never seen The Hunchback of Notre Dame, but MAN. Your edits sounds incredible. Disney tackling psychological stuff in a darker, more direct way than something like Inside Out sounds plan old great, and I would love to see them so stuff like that in the future.
Looking forward to your HND2 review!
This might just be because I usually prefer more lighthearted stories, but I personally think that a more family-friendly version of this movie could have been great, albeit not as dark. However, for it to work I think that they would need to rework the story and character quite a bit to fit that type of movie. I know that the fans of the original book wouldn't be so welcoming to a movie that might ignore some of the darker elements of the book (which is also one reason why it's hard to make The Hunchback appropriate for kids in the first place). Still, knowing Disney and their storytelling, I believe we could've gotten a film that could be fun and lighthearted, while still telling a deep, meaningful story at its core.
the book is very dark but it is so full of description of scenery and back story you forget whats happening with the main story. plus it constantly grinds to a halt to give us lengthy backstory about a woman who voluntarily has secluded herself from the world out of grief only for it to turn out she is Esmeralda's mother. seriously it's not worth worrying about me spoiling that you could figure it out in one page. but i will give the book this it has one of the most incredible declarations of love I have ever read. unfortunately it's from Frollo to Esmeralda when she is imprisoned so understandably it isn't received very well. plus Frollo is explained to only be 36 in the book despite his appearance being that of a much older man so his being in love with her is less creepy in that sense. but otherwise i would recommend it. it very well written and the emotions of the characters are so vivid and so relatable you feel like you're there witnessing everything happening. also and this is a nice thing you will notice that alot of the lyrics in the film are in the book. one of my favorites is "if in god's plan he made the devil so much stronger then a man"
OK fair enough but we can all agree Clopin was perfect, right?
I don't know if you mentioned this or not (I got a little ways through before deciding to comment while I was thinking about it) but if since you like the more serious tones and plot of the movie you would probably really enjoy the stage musical. First of all, they get rid of the gargoyles and there is a lot more moral ambiguity not just black and white "This person is bad/this person is good" in it. There are beautiful songs in it too. I thought the music was great in the movie but once I listen to the musical soundtrack I was never able to go back to the movie. It basically is really much closer to the book and doesn't waste its time trying to add in cheap jokes for the kiddos. It is much more targeted towards an older more mature audience. (The tavern song/ someday/ finale/esmerelda/ place of miracles are all beautiful examples of this.) Anyway, you should check it out!
Julianna Mikell @ "moral ambiguity not just black and white "This person is bad/this person is good" in it" - If you're talking about Frollo then I don't see why this is a good thing. People don't just transform from being good to being sexual predators because they see a pretty girl as in the original book or this stage play. Disney's film Frollo is much more psychologically realistic.
I was saying that the play was a much more built and realistic character. In the movie he's pretty two dimensional. It's common in children's movies because kids that are 7 or 8 need things to be very exaggerated. I'm saying in the play he actually has a motivation he isn't just evil to be evil. No one who is bad realizes they are bad. The first thing you see in the Disney movie is him kill someone and not even care. In the stage play he hates them a specific group of people because of an experience he had. In this movie he just is doing it with no real rhythm or reason. It's just better writing to not have a two dimensional, flat character is what i'm saying (and is more true to the actual character.)
also, i forgot to mention, in the stage play, morally ambiguity was not just about Frollo. It was also about Quasi because (SPOILER) he kills frollo in the end and makes a few questionable decisions in the play. He was still a likable character, but he did things and said things that made him imperfect. (While, in the disney movie he was basically a sweet, kind, nothing but goodness and perfectness kind of character.)
Julianna Mikell@ "I was saying that the play was a much more built and realistic character." - How is becoming a sexual predator out of nowhere realistic? Maybe back in Hugo's time they still believed that a pretty girl could drive even the best man to become a rapist, but you can't write characters like that anymore based on what we know about psychology. Disney film Frollo's transition from oppressive religious bigot to sexual predator is much more realistic.
"In the movie he's pretty two dimensional." - That would suggest he's defined by a single trait/motive which he swings between embracing and rejecting. This isn't the case. He has multiple goals; 1) Personal salvation 2) Expelling the gypsies from Paris 3) Catching Esmeralda.
"In this movie he just is doing it with no real rhythm or reason." - There is a clear reason. He's a fire and brimstone Catholic and he sees the gypsies as heathens and sinners. Why would it need to be a personal motivation? Do you think all the Nazis had personal grievances against the jews, gypsies etc?
"Out of nowhere" ? In the play it isn't out of nowhere. The play leads up to it. It's basically everything in the movie with a lot more scenes of characters interacting giving more time for information. He was a bigot in the play too. It stemmed from his brother being kicked out of the church and his brother running off with a Romani girl. He's awful to Quasimodo because of how he's born in the movie but takes care of him because he gets guilted into it by the Arch Deacon. In the play (based much closer to the novel) He *is* the arch deacon and takes care of Quasi because it was his brother's child and his brother died. I'm saying that this gives him a more clear reason and a lot more depth to his character. Being one dimensional is not strictly based on how many motivations you have. A character is also considered 2 dimensional if they remain emotionally one thing through a story (in Frollo's case: evil/judging others while seeing himself as pure/holy. Which is why when Esmerelda (in his eyes) threatens this perception of himself he feels the need to kill her). He never has any genuinely good moments or any other traits other than being the bad guy. (It's a kids movie so that isn't a bad thing. It's normal writing in children's movies to make a character nothing but evil and unlikeable) but for a more mature story like the stage play, that is why they add a lot more layers. All I'm saying is compared to the incredibly developed version of the characters the disney movie ones are more flat. This isn't a bad quality for a kid's movie. I was suggestion the stage play to anyone who wanted something more mature with more developed characters.
I love this movie, and your review is good too. Frollo is probably Disney's best villain- you can't change one thing about him, as you acknowledged. Also, you can't get rid of Hugo the Gargoyle, because the joke with the Gargoyles' names wouldn't work.
The book is pretty dark. My parents bought me a VERY abridged audiobook of it so I could see how different it is from the movie. Actually, a lot of the key scenes are reproduced in the Disney movie. But there are some important changes. Spoiler alert; Phoebus is a thoroughly unpleasant man in the book- he only wants Esmerelda for one thing. Also, Phoebus is one of only two major characters left alive at the end (the other two are not Quasi and Esmerelda). There is a major character called Gringoire, who is not in the Disney movie, because his story could not be made child friendly.
The only Disney movie worth watching
Except for maybe Aladdin.
Hey when are you doing your Hunchback 2 review you said you were doing. It's been over a year since you made this. Could you please get your Hunchback 2 review up soon.
Cmon man, it's been almost two years. When the review for HOND 2 coming up. Please let it be soon.
Solution 3: make a Disney quality animated TV series which follows the novel to the letter complete with the... not so happy ending!
am I the only one who liked the Gargoyles song? I'd actually thought it was catchy
I like the Gargoyle song too. I just don't think it fits in with the rest of the soundtrack at all. I like cotton candy, but I wouldn't use it to garnish a steak.
Just watch the musical version. They literally fixed the tonal problems YEARS AGO.
Hunchback is my favorite Disney movie, for a lot of personal reasons. That doesn't mean I disagree with this review. There honestly is a tonal problem and the gargoyles add to that. I however would argue that the chaining up of Quasimodo is figurative, while being literal at the same time. I don't think having him struggling with what he should do, then turning to the gargoyles for help, only to have them tell him, he has to chose on is own...is not something that should happen. I personally feel Quasimodo has to argue with the gargoyles like he does in the movie, because he needs to learn to assert him self. Not just against Frollo but them as well. It is a great scene that teaches that you can't relay on only the negative (Frollo) or positive (Gargoyles) thoughts. He has to find balance and decide on his own, which he does by arguing with the gargoyles. I feel like if you had them tell him he had to figure it out on his own defeats the purpose of the scene. Which ultimately defeats his self realization. It is why one of my favorite lines in the movie are "We just thought you were made of something stronger" He does realize in that scene he doesn't need them as a crutch, without having them tell him.
The musical is really good. There are parts of it I feel are done slightly better in the movie in terms of character relationships. Both are good in their own right and I love them. One upside to the musical is that they added a song called "Made of Stone" for this scene specifically, which I feel does a much better job of portraying what they were going for in this scene . You can see it in the movie, but the song makes it a little more tangible.
That being said, really good review and it gave me some things to think about.
Your views on Hunchback are somewhat similar to my feelings on the Disney remakes, they feel like they're trying to be different from their predecessors but the fact that they have to either adhere to the Disney formula or have a lot of callbacks to the original which bring a lot of problems with tone. The Jungle Book, the only one I love so far has this problem too, especially with the songs, you have a scene where Shere Khan passive-aggressively threatens Raksha's Wolf cubs and then straight to the jazzy Bare Necessities. Also, while I know you like Maleficent, I can't bring myself to like it. I admit I was a bit too harsh on it on my first viewing and found more to like on my second viewing, but in my opinion, it was held back by the fact that it's Disney and can't have a downright tragic ending or have an outright villainous protagonist like There Will Be Blood or Taxi Driver. On the gargoyles, you could actually incorporate Hugo into the story, by making him a more poisonous influence like the Gollum psyche, like when it turns out Esmeralda loves Phoebous over Quasimodo, have him be tempted to act on his resentments and feelings of entitlement, but yeah, that idea of yours would vastly improve the gargoyles and make them more forgiveable.
Hey, Jesse! If Disney makes a Live-Action remake of "The Hunchback of Notre Dame", maybe replace the gargoyles with the mice and Quasimodo have been taking care of them, feeding them and clothing just like Cinderella. I know it's cliched, but it would make much sense.
I think your great and your one of my favorite youtubers