Adjusting the hammer spring as done in the video is actually used to increase/decrease the velocity of the pellet, (use a chronometer to check the velocity). A byproduct of increasing/decreasing the velocity is increasing/decreasing the hammer tension because you're adjusting the trigger to release more or less air during the shot. More air released means more trigger pressure, (Trigger Pull Weight) to release the amount of air to get the higher velocity. One thing to remember about adjusting the velocity is just like anything else... you drive the pellet too fast and the flight can become unstable and erratic, just like too little velocity can do the same thing. The goal is to find the sweet spot where the pellets you like to use fly the same with the best consistency. After all, consistency is what we want. One last thought... what is good for one pellet, may not work for the next. This is the reason we do so much tuning with the different pellets, record the information and set the rifle to the best setting depending upon which pellet we're shooting. Once the velocity is set where you want it, you can then adjust the "Trigger Weight Adjustment" screw to increase or decrease the "Trigger Pull Weight" were you like it. There are 3 Trigger adjustments under the rifle in and around the trigger guard. There are holes in the trigger guard to provide access to these adjustment screws. The first adjustment is the trigger sear, which makes the trigger "more touchy" and can lead to accidental trigger actuation if adjusted too light. The second adjustment is for the Trigger Weight, which makes the trigger harder or easier to pull, (this is what was being measured in the video) and lastly is the Trigger Travel Adjustment. The travel adjustment simply moves the position of the trigger backwards or forwards and makes the trigger "feel" like it's not travelling that far to actuate a shot. This information is in the instruction manual as to the location of each adjustment with a very brief uninformative description of how each adjustment works. I'm not trying to chop up the video... just trying to provide more information on all the trigger adjustments available on the avenger. Great Video by the way..
Adjusting the hammer spring has always made the trigger harder on all airguns typically and it has been talked about a lot especially in Crossman where people put adjustable Hammer Springs on them
Appreciate the video bud.. I pretty much have kept mine very close to what came from the factory as for setting. However I have added a walnut stock, aluminum barrel band, and a upgraded barrel end cap with built-in baffles that extend down into the shourd about 5 inches , which tightens up any kind of play or movement . I'm very happy with this rifle. It's been a real nail driver
Thanks! You can but my trigger was maxed out all adjustments out of the box (lowest) , and it felt great at 2lbs like mentioned...but you have to adjust HS to match valve pressure (more or less fps)
The Sear holds the hammer the more load you put on the hammer the more friction it puts on the mating surface between the sear and the hammer. Polish it and see this improve significantly.
you should have titled this beginners don't know. if the trigger is what holds the compressed spring and you increase the pressure what do you think is going to happen? and it got lighter when decreased? no way. lol it's most likely more apparent in a cheap 300 $ pcp.
@@anthonyb1127 hmm odd the so called experts ONLY measure trigger once and not show when they increase or decrease hammer spring tension for their tunes? Any no one mentions this...except me
@@ALLABOUTAIRGUNS they show how much a trigger pull is from the factory as a reference. all the motion including valve, air flow, hammer spring tension, and the harmonic tuning don't start until after the trigger is pulled. so even if the trigger does rise/fall you are still tuning the motions that happens after that, the trigger is just a mechanism to start the motion.
In the video and comments I keep seeing or hearing “tension”, that adjustment is altering the compression of that spring, not the tension, two totally different forces.
More Compression to a coil spring that directly rides the sear adds more tension to the trigger pull, aka tightening the trigger and increasing the weight to pull
I wouldn’t think a couple of oz trigger pu;; would make that much difference unless it also altered the way the trigger reacts such as first pull or break , Thanks for the info though >
Here a question you might be able to answer. I have new qb cheif with adjusting allen key . What is the factory pre set on it . Mine has zero preload on it with bolt closed . But when you put the bolt arm out and move it back about 4 to 5 mm. It starts preload. Why i am asking is it seems a air hog .my gauge on my gun might be off . I use the gauge on the pump to 2000 the gun shows 1700 . Here what going on the first four or five shot are hot and hit 2 inches high at 20 yd then by 6or 7 it settles for 10 or so even shots then start to fall fast . So my shot count is about 18 for a 22 cal . It should be more right. Ca you give me some advice.
Es lógico que se ponga algo más pesado el gatillo, por otro lado si dejas el resorte al mínimo tu válvula no abrirá completamente con presiones de más de 1500psi.
Excellent presentation!! thanks. new sub . . . kept forgetting to hit SUBSCRIBE, but your videos are DataDriven, like mine, and i respect DATA DRIVEN content! You do not exercis conjecture, so thank you. Happy Grouping Therapy!
Dude, it barely has a full pound of adjustment. Not even actually. I'd have thought it would be tunable from 4 or 5 lbs down to 2 or just under. That was all at the same regulator pressure setting though right? Isnt there a relationship between between reg setting, hammer spring, and where the trigger weight falls? I would think they have an effect on each other in some way. I know you mentioned turning the reg up from stock to get the velocity you wanted down range. What did you turn your reg up to and what are you getting fps? That would tell me a lot from there. I know what the trigger does now based on where you're at. But if you tune the reg back down and don't move your hammer spring will the trigger weight stay the same?
It's overwhelming cause I don't have mine in hand yet, but I can't wait to tweak it all. I don't want just a light trigger though, I also want to get as high a shot count (and fps) as I can 850 - 1000fps hopefully. Higher the better without diminishing returns on shot count. But there's another factor lol. Accuracy and grouping. I'll have to trade off on that vs fps, vs trigger weight, vs shot count. It's gonna be fun to do. I think it will group better or worse at certain reg pressures vs others. I see what you mean now somewhat. You ONLY moved the hammer spring, but nothing on the trigger. There is more trigger adjustment. That's just how it changed under the hammer adjustment. That is interesting.
per instructions you have to add hammer spring tension to increase the valve opening (2600psi is hightest I went 15.89s ~1050fps/hammer spring all the way in) ...hammer spring tension can effect the trigger weight more or less, depending on reg pressure you go I used my trigger pull gauge with no air and its the same results because the trigger pull isnt affected by valve pressure its the hammer spring tension that changes
@@jdewey1587 I try my friend. It usually involves a question, or 10. Lol. My avenger is supposed to be in on 2-8. It will all make much more sense when I get it in my hands and do some testing and experimentation.
@@therrienmichael08 I didn't for about the first month. I ended up lightening it up some and it made a huge difference. It feels great now. I still can't believe this trigger came on a $300 gun.
That depends entirely on the Regulator pressure. For example: My .22 using H&N 14.66gr. @ 2400psi gives the following: HS 0=871fps; 1=932; 2=979; 3=1008; 4=1020; 5=1023. As you can see anything higher is diminishing returns. I normally set my Reg at 2000psi and my HS at 1-1/4. This setting gives me 947fps, the best of both worlds. Power and Shot count. I now can switch to Hadies @ 910fps and JSB 18.1gr @ 860fps. I get 79 good shots before i fall off the Reg and still stay in the 800-950fps range where pellets like to live for best accuracy. This gun likes to sit at 29 fpe for best accuracy and shot count even though you can push it harder to 32 fpe.
Adjusting the hammer spring as done in the video is actually used to increase/decrease the velocity of the pellet, (use a chronometer to check the velocity). A byproduct of increasing/decreasing the velocity is increasing/decreasing the hammer tension because you're adjusting the trigger to release more or less air during the shot. More air released means more trigger pressure, (Trigger Pull Weight) to release the amount of air to get the higher velocity. One thing to remember about adjusting the velocity is just like anything else... you drive the pellet too fast and the flight can become unstable and erratic, just like too little velocity can do the same thing. The goal is to find the sweet spot where the pellets you like to use fly the same with the best consistency. After all, consistency is what we want. One last thought... what is good for one pellet, may not work for the next. This is the reason we do so much tuning with the different pellets, record the information and set the rifle to the best setting depending upon which pellet we're shooting.
Once the velocity is set where you want it, you can then adjust the "Trigger Weight Adjustment" screw to increase or decrease the "Trigger Pull Weight" were you like it.
There are 3 Trigger adjustments under the rifle in and around the trigger guard. There are holes in the trigger guard to provide access to these adjustment screws. The first adjustment is the trigger sear, which makes the trigger "more touchy" and can lead to accidental trigger actuation if adjusted too light. The second adjustment is for the Trigger Weight, which makes the trigger harder or easier to pull, (this is what was being measured in the video) and lastly is the Trigger Travel Adjustment. The travel adjustment simply moves the position of the trigger backwards or forwards and makes the trigger "feel" like it's not travelling that far to actuate a shot.
This information is in the instruction manual as to the location of each adjustment with a very brief uninformative description of how each adjustment works.
I'm not trying to chop up the video... just trying to provide more information on all the trigger adjustments available on the avenger.
Great Video by the way..
Correct. The hammer spring tension should not have anything to do with trigger tension.
Damn, thank you!
The king now that's funny.
Adjusting the hammer spring has always made the trigger harder on all airguns typically and it has been talked about a lot especially in Crossman where people put adjustable Hammer Springs on them
How many turns from all the way out is the max turns to all the way in?
when you increase the hammer spring tension on a sear type trigger the trigger weight will always increase its just a fact of life unfortunantly
I love thus trigger, idgaf what anyone says, 10 years in the army, many weapon platforms and this pcp is perfect for me.
Appreciate the video bud..
I pretty much have kept mine very close to what came from the factory as for setting. However I have added a walnut stock, aluminum barrel band, and a upgraded barrel end cap with built-in baffles that extend down into the shourd about 5 inches , which tightens up any kind of play or movement . I'm very happy with this rifle. It's been a real nail driver
Once you have the HS adjusted to your liking, can you re-adjust the trigger pull to what you feel comfortable with? Thanks for the info
Thanks! You can but my trigger was maxed out all adjustments out of the box (lowest) , and it felt great at 2lbs like mentioned...but you have to adjust HS to match valve pressure (more or less fps)
Please go through the process of adjusting the 3 trigger screws. I would like to get the let off weight close to 1 pound.
The Sear holds the hammer the more load you put on the hammer the more friction it puts on the mating surface between the sear and the hammer. Polish it and see this improve significantly.
Thanks!
U can a adjust the trigger itself to make it liter
Adjusting the hammer spring I saw in another demonstration also increased velocity.
you should have titled this beginners don't know. if the trigger is what holds the compressed spring and you increase the pressure what do you think is going to happen? and it got lighter when decreased? no way. lol it's most likely more apparent in a cheap 300 $ pcp.
Uh huh...if you actually knew what I knew
@@STKO2011 enlighten me
if a expert needs instructions on the box for that,. hang up and start over. lol
@@anthonyb1127 hmm odd the so called experts ONLY measure trigger once and not show when they increase or decrease hammer spring tension for their tunes? Any no one mentions this...except me
@@ALLABOUTAIRGUNS they show how much a trigger pull is from the factory as a reference. all the motion including valve, air flow, hammer spring tension, and the harmonic tuning don't start until after the trigger is pulled. so even if the trigger does rise/fall you are still tuning the motions that happens after that, the trigger is just a mechanism to start the motion.
That aint so bad, better than the 8lb trigger on my crossman break barrel np
Excellent video.
In the video and comments I keep seeing or hearing “tension”, that adjustment is altering the compression of that spring, not the tension, two totally different forces.
More Compression to a coil spring that directly rides the sear adds more tension to the trigger pull, aka tightening the trigger and increasing the weight to pull
This is info for beginners, explain to us the operation of a balanced valve and electronics in Daystate AG theirs solenoid hammer ...
Yeah. I'm a beginner. And that's okay.
But read my other comment and see if any of what I said makes sense to you please Mr Wizard. Thanks.
Balanced valve is kinda what I was getting at actually.
you can buy software tool to tune ....
What is the software for or what is being tuned just want to make sure that I understand Thanks again for a informative video
For Daystate electronics...not the airgun in this video...someone is just being a pest
I wouldn’t think a couple of oz trigger pu;; would make that much difference unless it also altered the way the trigger reacts such as first pull or break , Thanks for the info though >
Here a question you might be able to answer. I have new qb cheif with adjusting allen key . What is the factory pre set on it . Mine has zero preload on it with bolt closed . But when you put the bolt arm out and move it back about 4 to 5 mm. It starts preload. Why i am asking is it seems a air hog .my gauge on my gun might be off . I use the gauge on the pump to 2000 the gun shows 1700 . Here what going on the first four or five shot are hot and hit 2 inches high at 20 yd then by 6or 7 it settles for 10 or so even shots then start to fall fast . So my shot count is about 18 for a 22 cal . It should be more right. Ca you give me some advice.
what does that do for FPS
Awesome info I wonder if it does that for all pcp air guns 🤔
Probably depends on how the trigger is setup , sear engagement and everything
Es lógico que se ponga algo más pesado el gatillo, por otro lado si dejas el resorte al mínimo tu válvula no abrirá completamente con presiones de más de 1500psi.
I can't get to move the hammer spring bolt...already twist three Allen wrenches. Any idea why?
Turn it the other way? Or degass it first?
@@raynfir638 will do that!! Thanks!
Excellent presentation!! thanks. new sub . . . kept forgetting to hit SUBSCRIBE, but your videos are DataDriven, like mine, and i respect DATA DRIVEN content! You do not exercis conjecture, so thank you. Happy Grouping Therapy!
Hey James how many Hammer Springs turns does your Umarex origin have mine only has about 4 and 1/2 turns is all the turns that i get out of it.
you should be getting ~6 turns sometimes the hammerspring screw is rough
It's just a little short of 6 full turns but close enough to call it six turns.
@@ALLABOUTAIRGUNS mi avenger solo tiene 4 vueltas en el resorte del martillo que se debe
how to adjust velocity in an pcp air rifle adjust the trigger tension in or out?
Dude, it barely has a full pound of adjustment. Not even actually. I'd have thought it would be tunable from 4 or 5 lbs down to 2 or just under. That was all at the same regulator pressure setting though right?
Isnt there a relationship between between reg setting, hammer spring, and where the trigger weight falls? I would think they have an effect on each other in some way.
I know you mentioned turning the reg up from stock to get the velocity you wanted down range. What did you turn your reg up to and what are you getting fps? That would tell me a lot from there. I know what the trigger does now based on where you're at.
But if you tune the reg back down and don't move your hammer spring will the trigger weight stay the same?
It's overwhelming cause I don't have mine in hand yet, but I can't wait to tweak it all. I don't want just a light trigger though, I also want to get as high a shot count (and fps) as I can 850 - 1000fps hopefully. Higher the better without diminishing returns on shot count. But there's another factor lol. Accuracy and grouping. I'll have to trade off on that vs fps, vs trigger weight, vs shot count. It's gonna be fun to do. I think it will group better or worse at certain reg pressures vs others.
I see what you mean now somewhat. You ONLY moved the hammer spring, but nothing on the trigger. There is more trigger adjustment. That's just how it changed under the hammer adjustment. That is interesting.
per instructions you have to add hammer spring tension to increase the valve opening (2600psi is hightest I went 15.89s ~1050fps/hammer spring all the way in) ...hammer spring tension can effect the trigger weight more or less, depending on reg pressure you go I used my trigger pull gauge with no air and its the same results because the trigger pull isnt affected by valve pressure its the hammer spring tension that changes
@@jdewey1587 I try my friend. It usually involves a question, or 10. Lol. My avenger is supposed to be in on 2-8. It will all make much more sense when I get it in my hands and do some testing and experimentation.
I'm just not going to mess with mine out of the box.
@@therrienmichael08 I didn't for about the first month. I ended up lightening it up some and it made a huge difference. It feels great now. I still can't believe this trigger came on a $300 gun.
How much will the FPS change from the lowest to the Highest settings on the hammer spring
Every turn inward is a 100 fps increase.
That depends entirely on the Regulator pressure. For example: My .22 using H&N 14.66gr. @ 2400psi gives the following: HS 0=871fps; 1=932; 2=979; 3=1008; 4=1020; 5=1023. As you can see anything higher is diminishing returns. I normally set my Reg at 2000psi and my HS at 1-1/4. This setting gives me 947fps, the best of both worlds. Power and Shot count. I now can switch to Hadies @ 910fps and JSB 18.1gr @ 860fps. I get 79 good shots before i fall off the Reg and still stay in the 800-950fps range where pellets like to live for best accuracy. This gun likes to sit at 29 fpe for best accuracy and shot count even though you can push it harder to 32 fpe.
Thats with every sear type trigger. Of course, when you increase hammer spring tension it's harder for the sear to break.
Chris Kyle American sniper said he liked his trigger about 2 lbs. He said he liked it to surprise him.
Your results are specific to the Avenger so far. Food for thought though.
yep!
Increased tension equals more friction? Mind blown!
🤣🤣🤣
HEY JAMES..U REALLY ARE THE AIRGUN SCIENTIST NICE JOB 😋👍
⭐ ⭐ ⭐ ⭐ ⭐..BUDDY
Thanks man!
So all you would have to do is adjust the trigger
my trigger is maxed out...
Welcome, your majesty 👑
Haha thanks!
You're confusing ounces with tenths of an ounce.
Well, Tom Gaylord is the Godfather of air guns but ...............................King?
Yep that's what I been called...
I will give amazing advice... PLEASE don't use chroma
What bothers me the most is the creep..