Exposing the Biggest Lie in Pizza Making
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Here I was thinking, why are people so dumb as to buy a baking stone, when it's obvious from high school science that a baking steel would transfer the heat faster and that the latter would not crack or shatter due to water contact when hot or when being dropped. Thanks for explaining why baking stones are used though.
However, a baking steel is not the best for transferring heat. A copper baking plate is much better, that's is if you can find it and afford it though.
btw you dont need to spend 200 dollars on a pre seasoned baking steel. i ordered a 1/4" slab of steel online for like 40 dollars a few years ago and removed the machine oil with vinegar and seasoned it myself. Definitely more work but it was worth the effort to save so much money.
I was just going to ask about this. I'm a metal worker so I was wondering what sort of steel it is, if it's anything weird or exotic but apparently now. Time to jam a big off cut of .250 plate into the oven and rock n roll.
@@bennyb.1742i made one of my own out A36 steel, i tried looking up what they’re made of and it seems that’s it, it’s at least safe for it, the worst part is getting the mill scale off of it if you get it hot rolled. I tried vinegar but couldn’t find a tub big enough for the steel so i just used a grinder
@@leifericson923i am also thinking of making it on my own. Do you recommend a36 or 304?
This is what I did too. I bought a big sheet of 6mm mild steel from an online metal supplier for 1/6 the cost of the same piece of steel sold as a pizza steel.
Yup! My regular steel subcontractor (I'm a general contractor) found me a scrap 1/4" A36 piece of steel, rounded the corners for me and I took it and cleaned/seasoned it.
Here is my budget recommendation. Lodge sells a cast iron pizza pan and it's pretty big. I use it like a stone/steel but it's priced like stone and works more like a steel. I paid $20 on sale and I think it's normally like $30.
Link?
A pizza screen is also worth investigating. If your rack can get close to the heating element, the screen allows hot air and radiant heating to do a pretty decent crisp. (Think toaster-like results.)
If you can get a cheap carbon steel sheet it will transfer heat better than the cast iron. If the cast iron is working for you though probably not worth the minor upgrade
I've used my lodge cast iron pan as a pizza steel, flipped upside down in the oven. Work's okay'ish, but definitely not as good as a pizza steel. Definitely worth a try if you already have one for other things.
We also use cast iron. We cook multiple pizzas in succession, so the heat retention is important. Still helps to preheat for an hour or so btw.
I have had the same stone for 12 years. My current oven goes to 500, which I preheat for 30 mins. Then turn on the broiler for 10 minutes. I kick the oven back to the highest baking temp before I slide the pizza in. I keep the stone on an upper rack and it gets ripping hot. While a steel may be better, this little technique has given me good crispy crust
forget pre-heating for a half our. just go straight to the broiler to pre-heat and save yourself 20 minutes
If you switch to a steel, I guarantee your results improve drastically
@@Mr._Chievous that’s a joke right? Broiler on a cold stone is a recipe for a cracked stone
@@Grunttamer??? The broiler doesnt get hot immediately, its gonna build up to its temp which will give the pizza stone plenty of time to heat up
buttery flaky crust
Pizza Dough Ingredients, Baking Tips, and Surfaces
Neapolitan
Flour: 500g (00 Flour), Water: 325ml, Salt: 10g, Yeast: 3g, Olive Oil: None
Hydration: 65%
Special Notes: High-temperature oven (900°F/450°C) for 90 seconds
Toppings: Tomato sauce, mozzarella, basil, olive oil
Surface: Pizza stone or wood-fired oven floor
New York
Flour: 600g (Bread Flour), Water: 360ml, Salt: 12g, Yeast: 5g, Olive Oil: 15ml
Hydration: 60%
Special Notes: Cold fermentation for 24-72 hours
Toppings: Pepperoni, tomato sauce, mozzarella, oregano
Surface: Pizza stone or steel (500°F)
Grandma's
Flour: 400g (All-Purpose), Water: 280ml, Salt: 8g, Yeast: 2g, Olive Oil: 30ml
Hydration: 70%
Special Notes: Thin and crispy, baked in a sheet pan
Toppings: Thin tomato sauce, mozzarella, garlic, basil
Surface: Oiled sheet pan (450°F)
Detroit
Flour: 500g (Bread Flour), Water: 300ml, Salt: 10g, Yeast: 3g, Olive Oil: 10ml
Hydration: 60%
Special Notes: Caramelized cheese crust in a rectangular pan
Toppings: Wisconsin brick cheese, tomato sauce, pepperoni
Surface: Rectangular blue steel pan or cast iron (500°F)
Chicago Deep Dish
Flour: 600g (All-Purpose), Water: 330ml, Salt: 12g, Yeast: 4g, Olive Oil: 40ml
Hydration: 55%
Special Notes: Thick crust with cornmeal, baked for 35 minutes
Toppings: Sausage, bell peppers, onions, mozzarella
Surface: Deep-dish pan (425°F)
Sicilian
Flour: 550g (Bread Flour), Water: 350ml, Salt: 12g, Yeast: 6g, Olive Oil: 20ml
Hydration: 63%
Special Notes: Thick and airy crust, long fermentation
Toppings: Tomato sauce, mozzarella, oregano
Surface: Rectangular sheet pan (450°F)
Roman
Flour: 600g (00 Flour), Water: 400ml, Salt: 10g, Yeast: 4g, Olive Oil: 25ml
Hydration: 67%
Special Notes: Thin and crispy
Toppings: Thin-sliced potatoes, rosemary, garlic, olive oil
Surface: Pizza stone or steel (450°F)
California-Style
Flour: 550g (All-Purpose), Water: 330ml, Salt: 11g, Yeast: 4g, Olive Oil: 15ml
Hydration: 60%
Special Notes: Unique toppings like avocado and herbs
Toppings: Avocado, bacon, mozzarella, arugula
Surface: Pizza stone or steel (500°F)
St. Louis
Flour: 500g (All-Purpose), Water: 275ml, Salt: 8g, Yeast: 2g, Olive Oil: None
Hydration: 55%
Special Notes: No yeast, cracker-like crust
Toppings: Provel cheese, sausage, green peppers
Surface: Pizza stone or steel (450°F)
New Haven-Style
Flour: 600g (Bread Flour), Water: 375ml, Salt: 12g, Yeast: 3g, Olive Oil: 10ml
Hydration: 62.5%
Special Notes: Coal-fired ovens; charred, chewy crust
Toppings: Tomato sauce, mozzarella, clams, garlic
Surface: Coal-fired oven floor or pizza stone (700°F)
Artisan
Flour: 500g (00 Flour), Water: 350ml, Salt: 10g, Yeast: 3g, Olive Oil: 15ml
Hydration: 70%
Special Notes: Wood-fired ovens; crispy, airy crust
Toppings: Buffalo mozzarella, cherry tomatoes, basil, olive oil
Surface: Pizza stone, wood-fired oven floor, or steel (750°F)
Every since watching your trial and error of making the perfect pizza, I've wanted a pizza steel. Thanks for sharing your favorite brand ❤
9:43 Missing file. Early enough that you could fix and reupload if you want.
I'm saving for my first pizza steel. For now, I use the Helen Rennie method of putting the pizza on parchment paper directly on the bottom rack
Whoops, thanks for the heads up. It was just a previous comment where someone said my baking sheet is seasoned to the high heavens haha.
I've always wondered why people are using stones in their home oven, when metal conducts heat way more efficiently. I bought a pizza stone to a while ago and I was extremely underwhelmed.
For pizza and flatbreads the steel wins, but stones are good for loaves since they need to bake much longer.
@@annchovy6I use cast iron for all my bread-baking and get terrific rise and crip bottom crusts. It's not even a dutch oven, I use an 11 3/4 #10 Griswold or more usually an 11 1/4 Wagner griddle. And spritz with water every 4 mins 3x. Can't see how a pizza stone would give better results.
Yeah for a home oven I'd upgrade to steel. The outdoor Gozney's do just fine with a stone, but they can also get double the heat output.
@@annchovy6 dutch oven just the best for breads in home oven
Steel is a lot more expensive
Making home pizza on a budget -- instead of using a purchased Pizza Stone or Steel, I use an unglazed Floor tile from a big-box home store. It cost less than $5 and works great. I measured the inside of my oven and then got the largest unglazed Floor Tile that would fit in the oven.
Frankly, to get the crust more crunchy, I just leave it in an extra couple of minutes.
It's a good idea to test for lead.
@@tuvoca825 Don't be such a baby
What was the largest unglazed tile you were able to get? Years ago, I was able to find 6x6" tiles so grouped four of them together.
@@juicer52 I think mine is at least 24" square, but it might be 30' Square (I.m not at home so I can't measure.
I pretty consistently get a bake equivalent to your steel bake example, on my home oven pizza stone. It’s 16x16 squared stone, and gets to nearly 600°F on my convection roast setting.
I’ve been using the pizza circle rings used in pizza shops
The metal actually create these burn marks on the bottom like it’s searing the bottom
i bought a 30-35 lb pizza steel which was in slightly rough condition, but just the smallest amount of polishing then only 2 seasonings and it makes a very good steel...so good that if u preheat max next to the heat coils it will incinerate the pizza. for neapolitan, new haven, and new york styles with works very well, as all other styles too. for neapolitan style i preheat in the oven max right next to my bottom coil bc that one switches on the most (ive tried top and middle and the results were not good), then after 50 minutes i move the steel to the top and preheat my broiler which takes about 2-3 minutes, then i bake. i constantly rotate (spinning, middle, left and right) so it doesnt keep burning the same spot, and also the lifting time spares some incineration. isnt done in a minute, but maybe 2 sometimes 3. then i have to put it at the bottom and preheat maybe 5-10 minutes then do it all again, but itll never be as good. preheating again 15-20 is the best, but dont wanna wait that long for more pizzas. idk if having such a large and heavy steel does anything special (it covers about the whole oven rack, and the thickness i think is .4". the breadth of it is nice bc i can bake many things across the whole thing at once)
ps: mine was $70 off amazon, and has a hanging hole in two corners, though i just leave it in the oven
Oooof! Moving that 25-30 lb hot steel seems like a challenge not to mention potentially dropping it on the oven glass door!
You can make a baking steel for cheaper by buying A36 hot rolled steel (some options online). The only downside is that there's a lot of prepwork like soaking the whole thing in vinegar to get gunk off of it and then seasoning it. It ends up being 1/2 or even 1/3 the cost of official ones, so the effort was worth it for the better pizza.
yeah, i wrangled a 1/4" thick 18x18 steel for like $30; i just needed to file off some sharp edges, then clean and season it
As long is foodgrade
Oh you certainly can but I wouldn't recommend the home brew method for most cooks. Understanding steel grades, how to modify the steel, how to prep and deburr it, how to prep it for being food grade........ It's nice to know it can be done but realistically I recommend people just buy the correct product. You're talking 20 or 40 dollars, i mean come on.
@@simonandersson9179 Flat top griddles used in diners and restaurants are made from A36 steel.
@@Knight_Kin the price difference is more like $100
I found a 16” rounds lodge cast iron with no walls that works great. Only spent 30 dollars on it. It was probably the best upgrade for my home pizza making.
Online?
I have it, and it's nowhere near as good as a pizza steel. The cast iron has about half the thermal conductivity of the steel used for pizza steel, and it's as thin as .16" in parts, compared to .25"-.50" for a pizza steel (.38" being the sweet spot).
Love my steel, plus seems like a big heat sink that helps regulate Temps in my gas oven during regular every day cooks
i was recently wondering if it would be apt for me to leave it in there for this exact purpose. thanks
it's gonna take too long to heat up. the oven is supposed to be able to regulate it's own temperature with the thermastat
With my electric oven at 525 F and a pizza steel, I need about 8 minutes per pie. 6 minutes baked, turning half way through, then 2 minutes of broiler. I also use the 2nd from the top rack, and get best results after a 2 hour preheat (90 minutes isn't enough).
I had a stone a while back and noticed steels were seemingly favored in ads recently. But they are a lot more expensive than stones, so I appreciate this vid!
Another brilliant presentation 🙂
Money money money...the last 14" stone I bought from Walmart was like $13 which is attractive compared to the least expensive steel, and for someone starting from zero a decent way to dip a toe, make a few dozen on stone and if you (like me) get addicted to making your own pies, a steel becomes easy to justify. I am very satisfied with 1/4 inch as I only make one in a session.
I've never tried the sheet pan method, never occurred to me, but will, just for fun.
My setup in my 60 year old electric which struggles to hit 475 is steel second rack up, 1/2" thick stone top rack for the broiler phase, move the pie when the time is right.
There are a lot of candied dates for BIGGEST Lie in Home Pizza Making, I'm not sure stones vs other surfaces rises to the top though.
Anyone who pays attention to your YT videos and really tries to follow your advice will make better and better pies with practice, we can't ask for much more, thanks.
After going through multiple stones which eventually cracked, I switched to a steel in 2015. I only needed to season it once and it’s been going strong since then
I got a baking steel because it would not crack and took up less space, good to know it works better too.
The upside down baking tray/sheet method is what I was doing before I got a baking steel and it's good enough if you only make pizza once in a while even in a electric oven
This weekend I did broiler only, up at the top. About 6-min/pie. No par-baking was needed. Pie on a 1/4” pizza steel. Will be my go-to method going forward and I’ve experimented a lot with temps, times, and par-baking.
There is a lodge cast iron round pizza pan that I think would be great to try because it is only $40, but I have a 1/2in steel so I have never had a reason to try.
I have one of these, and it's nice because you can use it for more than just pizza
Yo! This is what I use. I got in on sale for only $20. Only down side is that you have to wait a good while before baking a second pizza for good results, but I assume a steel is pretty similar.
I have it, and it's nowhere near as good as a pizza steel. The cast iron has about half the thermal conductivity of the steel used for pizza steel, and it's as thin as .16" in parts, compared to .25"-.50" for a pizza steel (.38" being the sweet spot).
For people who have both and making a few pizzas at a time, you could stack the steel on the stone to keep the steel heated longer as the stone "charges" the heat retention of the steel. Be careful of the oven rack from bowing due to the large amount of weight and possibly coming off the side rails.
Seems kind of pointless , because you have to also heat the stone , air doesn't take much heat , but the stone compared to the steel and pizza has much more thermal capacity , so it would take more energy
Cast iron is the right answer here IMO. It's got all (or at least most) of the advantages of a pizza steel. And you can use it for more than just making pizza. When I make pizza at home, I preheat three cast iron pans (Lodge: 12", and two 10" griddles) to 475. Then add the dough. Creates great pizza. Total cost of those three cast pans are a total of $65 at Walmart today. And again...they are super versitile instead of just having a big steel slab that only does one thing.
As someone who used cast irons for ages until finally moving to a pizza steel - the steel is way more convenient because you can use a pizza peel, and it's more consistent.
I use mine on the BBQ as a griddle, so it is multipurpose in that way. Makes amazing smashburgers, and you can do it for four people because the surface area is so large.
couldn't make great pizza for years, then discovered how to make german "flame cake" and now my pizzas are bueno too. imho regular metal baking tin and oven at least 210°C. high temp really makes the difference :)
Steels are great for your grill as well...smash burgers...veggies, etc . and of course you can do this method with pizza and have your oven broiler up and running for the transfer. You can also get your grill hotter than most ovens . I prep the pie on parchment paper on the tray for easy transfer to the steel then you let the dough start to cook and set for about two minutes. The paper will brown a bit but not burn. Then you just lift up the pizza with a spatula a little and pull the paper out. Easy Peasy. From then on you can turn /remove your pie with your spatula ..metal one of course .
This man knows what he’s talking about. Well done. 👍
You sir are becoming the George Motz of the Pizza making world. I am not really interested making fresh pizza. Though during the shutdown, I discovered using Naan Bread from the store can be used as a pizza crust. It works for me well enough for a personal size pizza. I also discovered, I can make a pizza on the stove top in a cast iron square pan. I put a top on it to help it cook from the bottom and the top to help melt the cheese. Get the cast iron pan screaming hot in the oven, dress your Naan bread pizza and put it in the cast iron pan on the stove top. Cooks in about 7 - 9 minutes. Again, works for me. I like stones for frozen pizzas. I think it helps with absorbing the moisture frozen pizzas can have. I really enjoyed this video. I am going to keep my 25 year old pizza stone for frozen pizza. If I get into making fresh pizza, I will certainly think about getting a baking steel.
I have tried both the stone and the steel. The steel is way better.
My first great pizza was in a 8" stainless steel pan, actually it was pretty close to neapolitan (high bubbly edges). I just threw it on my stove at first, assembled the pizza in the pan while actively heating it on the stove (can be tricky to land the dough in perfectly but with small pizzas its fine) and then go under a preheated broiler.
These days I use a large cast iron round pizza plate by lodge (idk what its called really) so i guess it is closer to steel than stone. The results are gorgeous for a home oven
Not sure if it was mentioned, but an other perk with steel is that liquid won't ever crack it. So basically you cannot destroy it.
Cast-iron will. Rolled steel probably won't, but some people are recommending cast-iron in the comments so I thought I'd add my 2 cents.
I recently got a steel and I'm never going back to a stone, there is no comparison! :) One other thing that should be mentioned about stones is that they are quite easy to break. I broke at last 2 stones in the past : dropped one, other cracked in oven, presumably because i didn't let it fully dry after cleaning.
Why would it be wet for cleaning?
I know this sounds crazy, but I have gotten the best results from a home oven by using a thin pizza stone directly on top of a baking steel. The baking steel burns the underside of the pizza before the top is done, but the stone helps mellow out the heat. By having the steel under the stone, this ensures that the stone doesn’t lose too much of its heat during the cooking process. Best of both worlds!
Steel loses heat much faster than stone. I doubt it's even making much of a difference than if you just used the stone by itself. If you flipped it and put the stone under the steel, the stone would sap some of the steel's heat, mellowing it out but also not letting the steel cool off too fast. Interesting. I'd run some experiments.
I agree, especially if your oven can't go above 250c/480F with a fan, then a stone will take way to long to be practical if you're making a couple of pizzas. It's pretty hard to find a steel over 14" in Sweden though.
I have a nerd chef ultimate half inch steel on the top rack directly under the broiler.
I usually do a hour on high broil to heat up the steel and then set the oven to 550 for an hour before baking to get the max heat into the steel.
Then it's 2 minutes then spin for another 2 minutes. Broil on high for 30 secs spin for another 30 secs. Done.
When broiling just keep an eye on it so you can get the desired finish to your liking.
How often do you actually eat pizza? Is it pretty much every day? or do you try to space it out and keep things balanced?
I use a baking steel. I also have add good results baking the crust with only the sauce and other toppings first. Then in about 5 mins remove the pizza and add my cheese and put it back in the oven. If I do not do this sometimes the cheese will begin to burn/get too dark to my liking. I use a home gas oven that only goes up to 475 to 500 f. Thanks for your videos.
I bought a pizza stone a couple of years ago for my electric kitchen oven. I switched from the oven to a BBQ, and the results improved dramatically. Also, I pre-bake my pizza with only the tomato sauce and the parmigiano reggiano on top for two minutes first to get a crunchy bottom and crust without burning the other toppings like the mozzarella or the onions. Nevertheless, it seems the steel plate would still be the better choice.
I got a 15 inch Lodge cast iron pizza pan and that bad Larry is way better than the stone I was using before. Definitely recommend it!
Is the diameter 15" of the base? Or do they include the handles? Lodge always exaggerates their sizes and measures from the widest part of the rim.
@ yeah it’s the diameter of the base. Definitely worth every penny. Shit gets hotter than a thousand suns so fast!
I'm curious how cast iron works compared to your steel. We went from a stone to cast iron and haven't looked back, especially because we cook at least a couple pizzas in succession, so the heat retention is important.
We preheat it on the bottom rack for 60 minutes at 475F, and cook it on the bottom rack. We use a little semolina or corn meal to help with the sliding off of the peel.
Charlie, you are one of my two favorite pizza channels! Question, what does adding olive oil do to making pizza dough do? Like adding 2 Tablespoons to the dough for a 16 oz. ball vs. not adding the oil?
I love the taste of oil in pizza dough. I prefer a neutral oil like peanut, so that I don't eat heat destroyed oil. My comment might offend Italian's though.
I have always wondered about these weird pizza stone things for home use. But after seeing this I realized that I probably would not get all that much better quality out of it. As some of the commoners say the recipe for the dough and giving the dough enough time to rise and proof goes a long way in making the dough actually tastes like restaurant quality
Great vid and, coupled with the cheese one you did (mozzarella cow, buffalo, shredded), I have some hopes of making a decent pizza at home! Just a side note, because I do have a stone set already I use for bread, I have found with other foods that need the broiler finish that removing one of the racks before I turn the oven on, cooking down lower in the oven as you suggest, then grabbing two pot holders or gloves moving the entire stone covered rack up for the finish. Not ideal but an option but it works. I will definitely try the upside down baking sheet though!
I just use a thin steel pan with oil drizzled on it. No pizza peel i spread the pizza on the pan and load it at 500 degrees (highest temp on my oven) on the lowest rack for 12 min and it comes out perfect each time.
You don't preheat the pan? I find a huge difference in both the rise of the crust and overall crispiness between preheating and not preheating.
@@AlokSomani No i don't, i build my pizza directly on the pan to avoid the need of using a peel and having the need to transfer a built 16" pizza onto a "16 inch pan which is rather difficult to line up once the pizza is built. If i had a 20" pan for transferring a 16" pizza it would be easier. But so far I'm very comfortable doing it my current way and it saves a transferring step which i like. Drizzling a bit of avocado oil on the pan is what gets it crispy. I've never seen anyone do this on their pan pizzas and thought I'd try it. I know everyone has their own style but this is the research I've done for my setup and everyone i let try says it's some of the best pizza they've ever had.You can try this technique if you like but imo the best way is what you can dial in for your setup.
@@ryuken4065 Cool, yeah, whatever works for you. I haven't tried cooking pizza in a steel pan, so I don't know how much difference preheating that would make anyway (they tend to be pretty thin). I use a thick cast iron pizza pan, so it definitely needs the preheating. But yes, the transfer is a hassle after fully building even a 14 inch pizza. Corn meal or semolina helps there.
Steel pan with oil seems like it would be crispy and tasty.
@@AlokSomani Yess the pan is thin but i've never burned my pizzas. When i first tried this technique i thought i'd start mid oven so i don't burn the pizza but it turns out better when i tried lowest rack closer to heating element.
I only wish the baking steels would have a raised lip on each of the 3 sides, with one side (the front edge of the steel that faces you) without a lip. I just think it'd make cleanup easier and prevent any particulates from getting off the surface of the steel, onto the oven floor/base, after cooking.
We prefer a baking steel as well. Our oven has a 'convection roast' setting that gives heat from the top and bottom simultaneously, saving us the step of switching to the broiler during cooking. We still use our stone for baking bread.
I use an Anova oven with steam injection and a baking steel. For years I used pizza stones in gas and electric ovens. Steel works best and I can clean carbon deposits off it as well.
I bought mine about 10 years ago from Baking STeel in Hanover MA. I drove down and got it (I custom ordered a specific size), and they were so cool and nice. Gave me the tour :D Best oven pizza ever with this thing - not to mention the other stuff they make with their steels.
I have always seen these videos and have consistently read that steels are better, but I’ve always achieved amazing results with my stone. Perhaps it’s my oven or the dough recipes I use, but my stone-baked pizzas always come out looking like yours cooked on your steel. I don’t have convection either.
Same here, F this guy for saying stones are a "lie". With his anecdotal evidence.
It took me years to figure out how to make a restaurant quality pizza at home. Finding the proper dough hydration, proofing, oven temps and and cooking surfaces. The pizza steel is the way to go. I put my pies in an aluminum pizza pan for 3/4 of the bake on the steel and remove it from the pan for the last 1/4 using a narrow offset spatula, sliding it directly on the steel again. This allows the cheese and toppings extra time to cook and keeps the bottom from overcooking. It takes some practice turning the pies out of the pan onto the hot steel. I rub a cold butter stick and then some olive oil on the pans before putting in the dough to keep it from sticking.
I recently did an experiment with one of my old cast iron skillets. I don't have a huge surface to bake an XL family size pizza sheet, but for a Napolitana like in this video it's perfect. Result: yup! it works so much better than those porous stones. I think it also absorbs heat so much faster, so again, makes so much more sense for a home kitchen that doesn't bake pies in an assembly line cadence.
I have a stone. Granite. 30 millimeters thick!
It really makes a difference.
And turn the oven up to 300 degree C.
The heat stored in the stone is really noticeable. Even after opening the oven it still keeps the heat really well, and more even.
Would be interesting to see you do a compare of that.
Use a 30 millimeter thick granite stone that is as large as fits the oven. And 300 degree C.
And use a proper oven - if you have that over there?
I used to work at a couple pizza places and we always used pizza screens and I love screens, they let the crust get crispy and work for more than just pizza.
My oven has the broiler below the oven. I just take all the racks out and place my stone on the bottom of my oven. I believe this allows the stone to reach a higher temp because it has direct contact for heat transfer vs the air
I use screens,clean up is the obly downside.
Even commercial sheet pans seem to warp at the highest temperatures my oven gets to.
If you set your pizza steel about 2/3 down, you then can make use of your broiler as well. I preheat my oven to 550F, then I crank on the broiler, which helps to get the floor of the steel up to 670F. Switch back to 550F oven, launch the pizza... then you can pop back on the broiler as you want to to help finish the pizza.
You getting pretty jacked up Charlie… keep the gains going my dude!!!
Haha thanks!
I've been using a 7$cad walmart steel pizza pan and it seems to do the trick, nice and dark bottom, transfers heat too well sometimes hahaha
On the cheapest GE electric oven that runs to 500 it takes 10 min per pizza so a steel would help a lot with that. This oven won't let you run the broiler and main heating unit at the same time so you lose a ton of heat.
They're like $20. I put it under the boiler first which gets the stone plenty hot. I also use a screen which works fine for frozen pizzas.
I’ve been using a pizza steel for years, but I could never find one as big as my oven could handle until I saw this video. I just ordered the Baking Steel Plus using your link which is 15” deep x 20” wide, the perfect depth for my oven. Thanks! Can’t wait to use it!
Buy an ad.
@ Why to you have to troll? I’m just a fan of the product. I searched for years for something that meets my needs and whenever that happens I like to let other people know so they don’t have to search forever like I did.
@@tridoc99 I said, buy an ad.
@@salazam Still don’t know what you mean
@@tridoc99 "sTiLL dOn'T kNoW wHaT yOu MeAn"
Thanks for this video Charlie. I just ordered a Big Horn Propane Pizza Oven. I settled on that after many hours of reviews and videos. That one has a side burner as well as burners under the stone so it can get hot faster and keep the heat better when spinning the pies. My question on this video is what do you think about use it a steel in a pizza oven that can get to 800+ F vs a stone? I can see why the steel would be better in a lower temp oven, but would it be too hot in a higher temp oven?
When I bought a stone, I got a worse result with it than with just a baking sheet. Then I bought a thick baking steel and with it I get really great pizzas. I haven't made pizza in 3 months, so I have to do it in the next few days
By the way, could you give me a hint, what oven setting is the best for pizza. I gave an electric oven with multiple options to set it up: bottom heat only, top heat only, top and bottom heat and finally hot air ventilation.
Preheating for 90 minutes is quite a long time. I wonder if you could do a comparison for length of preheating at 30-minute intervals maybe? Leaving the oven running on high for so long is a lot of extra cost and pre-planning so it would be interesting to see if there's a point of diminishing returns.
I use one of my cast iron skillets to cook pizza. This particular one was originally owned by my great grandmother, circa 1880.
I preheat it in the oven, typically 430 F, and toss some corn meal in it before putting the pizza in it.
I don't go to 500 F, because I've found this works better with all the toppings I put on my pizza. Typically, I'll cook it for 12 to 15 minutes, based on how the crust is crisping and the cheese is browning.
I also, but some grated Asiago cheese around the edge of the pizza for the last 3 minutes or so to make some nice crisp cheese sides to go with the pizza.
Myself and some friends have purchased our steels from 222 Steel Designs in Pennsylvania. Local company, Made in USA. 1/4” A36 seasoned steel. Not the most expensive, but not the cheapest. My steel is a GAME-CHANGER!
For anyone wanting a cheaper alternative to the expensive baking steal. Lodge cast iron sells a pizza baking pan 15 inch for less than $50 USD. The downsides compared to the steal is that the pizza pan has handles that are raised so your peel needs to be narrow enough to fit between the handles. A 12 inch peel and making pizzas the same size works fine though I find that I usually make 10 pizzas and that is if you want to use a peel since you could always build the pizza on a piece of parchment paper then slid it onto the pan. Another downside is that it is cast iron and that means you need to care for it as you would any cast iron you don't want rusting out on you. I have a gozney pizza oven now so the only thing I use the pizza pan for is baking bread but it is what allowed me to make delicious pizza before getting a dedicated oven.
You might want to try putting the parchment on the peel and then build the pizza.
I have it, and it's nowhere near as good as a pizza steel. The cast iron has about half the thermal conductivity of the steel used for pizza steel, and it's as thin as .16" in parts, compared to .25"-.50" for a pizza steel (.38" being the sweet spot).
The cast iron or stainless steel pan method with hob and broil is far superior and faster. Just using a home temp oven is too slow. Cook the bottom of the pizza on the hob 1-2 mins. Move to broiler cook the top for 3-4 mins. The direct heat gets a better result.
Low temp oven = use steel
High temp oven = use stone
I used steel in a Weber grill that goes up to 300 degrees celsius, and it completely charred the bottom.
I use a steel in my home oven that goes up to 275 C. Works perfect, best buy ever if you like pizza and baking bread.
Thanks for this. This is not a knee jerk response, I have been thinking about this for a few days! I bake my pizzas on a stone, my brother bakes on a steel. I just need to leave my pizza on for a few more minutes than he does. I get a nice black ring around my pepperoni with the longer time, no broiler needed. He doesn’t get that with a steel. I think the stone is a little slower but the pizza top and bottom is better than a steel!
I bought 6" square unglazed clay tiles from a flooring store and arrange those on the oven rack. Very inexpensive and easy to replace one if it cracks.
one of my fav channels keep doing you bro
Why use either... Just use a pizza screen... No need to run your oven for 90 min prior...
I've been thinking about why New York pizzerias have their own unique taste that is difficult to replicate at home. The seasoning on a stone, with months/years of use, might deposit flavor into it that you can smell just firing up the stone itself. I noticed this when firing up my outdoor propane pizza oven that uses a stone.
The oven in a NY pizzeria is also used pretty much every day of the week, indoors, and with pizzas going in and out every hour. On top of that the years of experience the pizzeria owners have, they know much more in depth about every single detail that goes into a good New York slice.
The pizza stone has its role, but if you haven't been juicing your home oven...
You can use a steel and the steel is just more effective (too effective for high temp ovens). Plus easier to handle and store when you're not using it.
Steel is up to temp in half the time of a stone too.
Hi mate , have you ever tried making pizza with spelt flour ? If not I’d be very interested in seeing you try as spelt is low GI for those people who can’t handle high gluten.
I just saw your video "How I Made the Perfect NYC Pizza (Full Documentary)". Very informative and thank you for the in-depth effort! When it came to tomato sauces, I use Don Pepino pizza sauce here in NC. It tastes great for me and besides, it's imported...from NJ! 😋👍😁😸
So, what happens with the stone going a bit longer?
I've always hated pizza stones. Drop it and they break, they're difficult to keep clean (in my opinion) and like you mentioned, they don't do the best at transferring heat to create a crispy crust.
Yeah you have to clean them with an oil, soap and water destroys stones and will guarantee they will crack in the oven.
I just scrape off any residue while the stone is hot and pre-heating for 30 to 45 minutes is a must!
dropping a pizza steel comes with its own hazards
You can get a lot of the benefit of a baking steel with a cast iron pizza pan. One trick is you can start the pizza on the stove top pouring lots of heat into the bottom of the pan, then, when you can see that the bottom has started cooking you pop it in the oven right under the broiler until the top is cooked. one big advantage is no preheating necessary. if you have two pans you can make the continuously .
I have been using a simple pizza screen on the bottom rack of my oven at 550. Gets a good crisp to it and nice charring on the bottom. However, the top of the pizza is another story. But it works for now. But a friend of mine with a machine shop just cut me out an 18”x22”x3/8” pizza steel that I will be picking up later today so I will finally be able to cook on the top rack or near it and use the broiler function.
My issue is that the oven in my apartment has the broiler in the pull out drawer below the main oven compartment, which I use to store all my excess cake tins. So my steel gets too hot and burns my pizza by the time the cheese is all nice and gooey. My apartment doesn't have the cabinet space to store my excess baking belongings.
Or how about a thin pizza pan made of steel that you can build a pizza on without extra equipment. No peel no pizza steel just let if finsh in the steel sheet pan and let it melt and brown without the broiler. Why make it so complicated. Grocery stores sell 16" pizza pans with holes in them that work so good! Without much preheat. And you don't need to use a pizza peel.
I wish Charlie would test a Calphalon pizza pan. Build the pizza on it put it in.
I use a Lodge cast iron round griddle. It works great. It's only around 10 inches so my pizzas are small but enough for 1 or 2 people. I have a stone too but I'd think metal is a little better.
I switched to pizza steel years ago. Much more durable and easier to clean. I have used both cast iron and stainless steel. They aren’t actually more expensive if you know what to look for. There are companies that sell slabs of steel cheap that’s how I got my stainless steel ones.
You can get a Lodge cast iron pizza stone for $40. I just keep it in the oven.
I also switched to steel, there is no comparison.
I have a stove top cast iron griddle with one flat side. I put that in the oven and make oval pizzas. Works great
Vevor sells baking steel plates 0.2" or 0.4" thick for around $50 or less on eBay.
Only downside is the dimensions are odd, like 20" x 14.2"or 16.2"x 14.2". But you solve that by buying a smaller steel (hot rolled/a36/mild steel) plate of similar thickness that fills out the short dimension your bigger plate. Just clean and season it before using.
wonder how cool it would be to bake on a pink salt block. It has even more conductivity then steel.
Would a stone in a Halo 16 outdoor pizza oven be better than a baking steel?
...therefore using an Aluminium baking plate would be around FIVE TIMES more heat efficient both in time to heat and transfer.
My favorite way to cook a pizza is in my cast iron skillet. But if you're wanting a more traditional style pizza, Dyna-Glo makes a 14in cast iron "Grill Pan" that is $20 at Home Depot that ships for free. Only way the pizza stone is really useful is on my charcoal grill.
What about using the broiler in an oven that has one?
Thermal conductivity is only one consideration. Pizza stones are often made from ceramic which varies in porosity which act as a thermal insulator. I use a natural granite stone cut from an old countertop which is cheap, readily available, 4 times the conductivity of ceramic (though less than steel). What you don't address in the video (unless I missed it) is thermal mass. In your experiment, what are the weights of your stone vs steel? By my thinking, thermal conductivity will have much less impact than mass. Case in point, using a thin baking sheet made of steel has exactly the same conductivity as the pizza steel, but lacks the mass. That is the big difference. Throw out your "stone" and steel. Get a nice thick 3/4" piece of granite instead. If you salvage a piece from an old counter, the cost is only in having it cut. Just heat it at high temp on your grill outside to burn off any oils or sealers that may be present.
It’s crazy though because I’ve cooked your recipe on my stone several times and my pizzas always crisp up nice with a nice bottom just like you show in this video with the pizza cooked on a steel. In fact i would even say mine typically look better than what you have shown in this video. So maybe a steel is better but I’m getting the same results and better with my stone on the lowest rack at 550F preheated for one hour.
Thank you for this video, I was buying a stone cause I saw this video recommending it.
why not turn the stone over, move to top rack, then start cooking? or did i miss that?
IA quick Google search says iron is 3x as dense as granite. Let alone more conductive. If you order pizza in, fry it in butter In a cast iron pan once you get it home. Fair warning, you'll never be able to eat pizza straight from the pizzeria again. Doesn't matter how good the initial pizza oven was, they don't come close to the crispness achieved by this extra step.
The Lodge cast iron pizza pan is a good alternative for less money than a steel, browning on the bottom looks about the same
Also, what happened with the bagels? Still working on it?
It didn’t seem to have a ton of interest relative to pizza stuff, so I took a break from it. I’m hoping to get back to it at some point though and come up with a final recipe!
@@CharlieAndersonCookingcool! My daughter asks like every week. Lol.
The Steel is nice and efficient once it's heated but waiting an hour and a half just to preheat the steel is not practical for most home use. It sure does give you nice results though.
You don’t have to preheat for an hour and a half. I have an infrared thermometer and my steel is fully up to temperature in 30-45 minutes.