Me and my silly little children of 9 use a nockgun and tried line battling in Paris. Just imagine the other player's faces when they see 10 navymen and 1 officer line up and fire in sync.
The problem with the nock gun is it has a really tight spread making it basicly useless for crowd control because enemies are never gonna be lined up enough to get full use out of it and the blunderbuss has a wider spread but less damage then the navy pistol per pellet even tho more pellets are going to be hitting individual zombies making the navy pistol unironicly potentially better then both of those at crowd control especially because the fast reload. Just walk up close to a small group of shamblers then annihilate them then reload real quick and onto the next really useful because small groups all over the place is way less situational then an entire hord perfectly lined up as much as i love the nock gun it makes me so sad to say all this because i always like big guns and picking tanky characters in games and the nock is the closest to that because it looks like a minigun😔
After Copenhagen update, seaman no longer everyone’s favorite. They used to bust all over the zombies while I watch them using my carbine and sabre. Looks like that days have gone
@GiorgiGiorgi-i9l me too, I remember asking people on the server what thing I should but first, and some one say hand axe, so I bought it. I can’t believe that expirience is already more than a year
In endless, nockgun is kinds your friend, you can re-select seaman class in endless, you do not have to reset, it auto-respawns you and also if u spawn with a nock gun, it already loads all barrels, meaning you dont have to reload the nock gun everytime.
Tip(learned this from 2fore2):i always thought that the shove is only useful for sapper but when i watch 2 fore2s navy pistol video i changed my mind its really underratted bc sometimes a zombie just gets in your face and if your planning to use handaxe weapons then the shove of the navy and carbine can really help combat the ghoul system and well bc eversins the ghoul system handaxe weapons have been like dead to me(your own opion ofc)
as someone with nearly 400 hours in the game, mostly playing as seaman, I can 100% say that the blunderbuss is the strongest weapon in the game once you get used to it, and nothing has ever come close to its potential. (I almost exclusively play on hardcore so I will be talking about that) The blunderbuss can shred most hordes on its own, and a couple of them with good aim can lock down most chokepoints in the game on their own, its got enough damage to kill 2-3 zappers, a large crowed of shamblers, that horde of runners on san sebastian or all of the above mixed together with a well placed shot. At close range its a damage powerhouse, cleaving out a nice cone out of the horde, and at medium range its got the spread to shave a couple layers off the horde waltzing over to your team Its reload time is short enough to keep laying down hate as long as its needed, and with a fife nearby you can easily rack up 200+ kills per medium sized objective map, im usually hitting around 300 kills per san sebastian with a fifer on the team The navy pistol I find is better for closer ranged maps with more moving around like copenhagen and paris (excluding the end part), its not got the consistant horde clear of the blunderbuss but the shorter reload means your not gonna be left behind by the team as much, the pistol whip is good for if your reloading and get jumpscared by a runner as it reload cancels, but is otherwise pretty useless outside of whacking your team on the head for funny. Its damage is alright, enough for consistantly killing the first few enemies in a group, its more of a self defense or saviour weapon than a crowed control weapon, its quick reload, good spread and good damage lets you deal with enemies that are coming after you quite often, and easily save allies that have been grabbed or tackled, but as far as dealint with zappers your gonna have to be right up in their face to do anything. The nock... outside of being a gimmick, the only use ive found for this gun is past wave 29 on endless on hardcore, before wave 29 the blunderbuss still out-performs it in every aspect aside from zappers, most of the people that use it consistantly are the same people that argue "oh but it can kill 11 zappers in a single shot no other gun can do that" while ignoring the fact that, outside of testing or private servers, you are never going to see 11 zappers at once, let alone have them all in a perfectly straight line for you to shoot, then you have to wait almost 30 seconds to reload the thing back to full again, yes im aware that you can animation cancel to speed it up, or only load a couple barrels, but if your only loading 2-3 barrels then you might aswell be using the blunderbuss for the same damage, quicker reload and better crowed control The biggest problem with the nock is that its got absolutely zero spread, none. No matter how many shots are loaded, they are fired in a straight shot forward, the bullets are in a circle, and you can at most hit 2 width of zombies, assuming their arms overlap and you are aiming for their arms. Its got bad crowed control, no consistant damage and no practical use outside of late game endless on hardcore, you spend more time reloading the thing than fighting enemies, just for a one time use blast a round-shot sized hole through the enemy horde, but even then cannons reload faster than the nock AND usually have access to canister shot for some actual crowed control
As someone with nearly 1000 hours (don't ask me how it got that bad) I agree and disagree with the blunderbuss being the strongest weapon in the game. I do in fact think it's the best weapon for the seaman class, without a doubt, but as for all weapons, I still think the regular musket with the bayonet is a great contender for the best weapon in the game. Even without the officer charge, a skilled infantryman can hold entire objectives by himself with well placed head shots and good timing, it's how people were able to duo San Sebastian after all. For endless mode however, I still do think that the seaman class is supreme, as if you have good teammates, you can get well over 2,000 kills in a single endless match by just using the blunderbuss. Maybe at around wave 50 the nock gun may outperform the blunderbuss, but I don't know because I never see servers get that high. All of my experience is on normal servers and not hardcore, and I don't really know the differences between normal and hardcore, so you can take what I say with a grain of salt.
@@jellyboi8032 As an Infantry main with 600 hrs and 300,000+ Kills and 227 KD Musket Bayonet is only good if you don't mind getting screwed over by the hitbox or teammates pulling Shamblers away from time to time, You're better off using the Carbine and Horshoe with the Heavy Saber most of the time, and if you really want to Hypercarry and farm kills you can use the Lancer/Pike to front 24/7 (My main weapon). Musket Bayonet is still great on most objective maps and great to worthless after round 33 in normal endless as Zombies take 2 headshots to kill by then and In most cases the hordes are too dense to use it as a main weapon before that point, don't bother using it in Hardcore, Hardcore Objective it can still be somewhat useful, the best players trio maps with it on Hardcore but also fail a ton of attempts due to the Bayonet's lack of pen or consistent Hitbox even in ideal conditions, but in Hardcore Endless don't bother, sure it has the best charge damage but you might as well again just use the Lance and Heavy Saber for that in Endless. Getting kills with the Seaman can be difficult on Normal Endless, it just depends on how many Seaman there are and of course how you position yourself, Blunderbuss is however still strong on late game in both Normal mode and Hardcore, I see getting 2000 kills is easily possible but you essentially have to start at wave 1 in Tylorean or Hougoumont for you to do so without the rounds being too difficult for the team to keep progressing, I got 1000 kills with the Blunderbuss from just entering rounds 16 to 29 on Tylorean, 2k is easily doable.
i think it's 11 seconds for the first barrel on the nock gun, then the reload time per barrel decreases drastically, either way it's still somewhat viable
@@slav7103 actually i think its slightly slower than the musket but its such a forgettable difference that its usually better (although i usually still play infantry because im obsessed with the heavy sabre)
I usually use navy pistol since i want to dish out damage quicker and to give some space to my team by killing either bombers, igniters, zappers, and runners or in short the specials but nock could be the best if use correctly out of any seaman's weapon (in my opinion) and blunderbuss is just a combination of nock and navy but lower damage and slow on the reload
honestly I don't like the navy pistol that much, every time I've tried to use it it just barely puts a dent in crowds of zombies unlike the blunderbuss and nock gun
I personally don't like the boarding axe, mind you, it's a weapon that has the range of the hand axe (4 units) and the attack speed of the saber (0.55 seconds). The group mode simulates a saber but with the range of the hand axe (less range than a common saber) with a measly 5 additional damage, while the individual mode can only attack 1 shambler at a time, making it vulnerable to grabs, if not hitting the head requires two hits to eliminate. This gun is OBJECTIVELY bad on both counts! Just choose between saber consistency or hand ax damage!
nock gun dmg: 250 per shot 7 pellets 10 penetration PER pellet 250 X 7 X 10(might be wrong if damage falloff existed to penetrations) = 17500 dmg X2 if a bugle is occuring =35000 dmg. do i have to say anything else? this is probably more than enough to kill the full limit horde also. 10 X 7 = 70 so i guess the max amount it can kill is 70. 140 if buffed by bugle. but like said in the video. if you shoot all 7 shots at a single zombie it'll splash them with 1750 dmg. yeah imagine being the shambler in that situation
@ Dude if it’s actually 6.2 seconds then that would make the navy pistol way more powerful than I thought. However the description for the officer’s pistol says it has the fastest reload in game and it says it’s reload is 6.2 seconds. I guess I’ll have to time the navy pistol reload to make sure.
4:19 boarding axe is just trash the 5 extra damage make you 2 swing zombie in other objective but it will again take 3 swing in the finale but handaxe is always gonna be 2 swing regardless of what part you are in,for the spike part it just useless handaxe can just take 2 or 3 swing to kill a single zapper plus the spike part can only hit 1 zombie right now nock and boarding axe is the least useful seaman weapon
not really. in the latest version of the event, the horseman had damage resistance against the nock gun, essentially reducing its damage when you use it against the horseman.
To be honest with you, I'd argue that the Handaxe is actually better. At 45 base damage, that's genuinely amazing. While yeah, the base damage for the backside of the boarding axe is 52, I've used it for probably 50 hours of gameplay, and I've probably only ever really could utilize the backside a total of 1 or 2 times. The issue with the backside is that its 1 penetration makes it useless since most of the time, you're going to be going up against multiple zombies at once, not just one. Is the boarding axe bad? No. It's just that it's "upside" against the handaxe is extremely situational and in that case, not really worth it.
I see a lot of people prefer the HA to the BA but I just personally prefer the BA, granted this was recorded like about a month ago so there might be some “slight hiccups” 😅
0:34 navy pistol take 8 seconds to reload in total if you want correct information just use the fandom since the people in the official wiki never check or play the game or smth
Y’know, I think I’m one of the only people who like the classic blunderbuss. I find the nockgun’s long reload time quite tedious and not very practical in most cases, and I find the navy pistol to be very inaccurate and the stun ability is quite trivial in my opinion, the blunderbuss has decent accuracy, and a relatively average reload time that can clear out hordes as well as shooting bombers
Seven Nock Gunners on Tyrolean is so fun
That is great but they mostly use blunderbuss
@@mush1s217 Yeh it's faster
Me and my silly little children of 9 use a nockgun and tried line battling in Paris. Just imagine the other player's faces when they see 10 navymen and 1 officer line up and fire in sync.
Man being a Nockker feels fine especially when you get that perfection
With a fifer
The problem with the nock gun is it has a really tight spread making it basicly useless for crowd control because enemies are never gonna be lined up enough to get full use out of it and the blunderbuss has a wider spread but less damage then the navy pistol per pellet even tho more pellets are going to be hitting individual zombies making the navy pistol unironicly potentially better then both of those at crowd control especially because the fast reload. Just walk up close to a small group of shamblers then annihilate them then reload real quick and onto the next really useful because small groups all over the place is way less situational then an entire hord perfectly lined up as much as i love the nock gun it makes me so sad to say all this because i always like big guns and picking tanky characters in games and the nock is the closest to that because it looks like a minigun😔
just load 2/3 barrel dude
2 unnamed endless maps:
Wait till he finds out about the actual minigun
After Copenhagen update, seaman no longer everyone’s favorite. They used to bust all over the zombies while I watch them using my carbine and sabre. Looks like that days have gone
Man the Seaman Demons no longer as powerful...
How'd they nerf the seaman?
@dragongaming6967 they don’t nerf it, people just using it less because line infantry got lots of new equipment
My first gun Nock gun that i buy from the shop when i was a new G&B player
the nock gun was the second thing i bought from the shop, second to the carbine
I buyed the carbine first, then nock
@@Tsuna_no2 me too
My first weapon on seaman that I bought was hand axe
@GiorgiGiorgi-i9l me too, I remember asking people on the server what thing I should but first, and some one say hand axe, so I bought it. I can’t believe that expirience is already more than a year
In endless, nockgun is kinds your friend, you can re-select seaman class in endless, you do not have to reset, it auto-respawns you and also if u spawn with a nock gun, it already loads all barrels, meaning you dont have to reload the nock gun everytime.
Wait, it still count to get the old guard badge?
Yes
@@BeginnerTimmy14058Yes, when you switch class in endless and look at the leaderboard you'll see it doesn't count as a death.
@@marschallblucher6197 Thanks for the info, Blucher
Thanks for letting me be apart of the vid!
I’m pretty sure the barrels have different load times, also the boarding axe was intended to act as a watered down bayonet for the seaman
Tip(learned this from 2fore2):i always thought that the shove is only useful for sapper but when i watch 2
fore2s navy pistol video i changed my mind its really underratted bc sometimes a zombie just gets in your face and if your planning to use handaxe weapons then the shove of the navy and carbine can really help combat the ghoul system and well bc eversins the ghoul system handaxe weapons have been like dead to me(your own opion ofc)
HELL YEAH 🗣THAT'S ME IN THE INTRO AND THE THUMBNAIL!!! WOWZA!!!
I'm very honoured 😇!!
I remember joining a layered line of Sealads on the Tyrolean village and chanting of Nelson's death
I like nock gun because the of sound effect and how I usually just use one bullet because it is faster yet still deadly.
Wow the power of the seaman
The nock gun's reloading is absurd but loads of damage
I'm probably gonna grind for this once I buy the double barrel pistol.
as someone with nearly 400 hours in the game, mostly playing as seaman, I can 100% say that the blunderbuss is the strongest weapon in the game once you get used to it, and nothing has ever come close to its potential. (I almost exclusively play on hardcore so I will be talking about that)
The blunderbuss can shred most hordes on its own, and a couple of them with good aim can lock down most chokepoints in the game on their own, its got enough damage to kill 2-3 zappers, a large crowed of shamblers, that horde of runners on san sebastian or all of the above mixed together with a well placed shot.
At close range its a damage powerhouse, cleaving out a nice cone out of the horde, and at medium range its got the spread to shave a couple layers off the horde waltzing over to your team
Its reload time is short enough to keep laying down hate as long as its needed, and with a fife nearby you can easily rack up 200+ kills per medium sized objective map, im usually hitting around 300 kills per san sebastian with a fifer on the team
The navy pistol I find is better for closer ranged maps with more moving around like copenhagen and paris (excluding the end part), its not got the consistant horde clear of the blunderbuss but the shorter reload means your not gonna be left behind by the team as much, the pistol whip is good for if your reloading and get jumpscared by a runner as it reload cancels, but is otherwise pretty useless outside of whacking your team on the head for funny.
Its damage is alright, enough for consistantly killing the first few enemies in a group, its more of a self defense or saviour weapon than a crowed control weapon, its quick reload, good spread and good damage lets you deal with enemies that are coming after you quite often, and easily save allies that have been grabbed or tackled, but as far as dealint with zappers your gonna have to be right up in their face to do anything.
The nock... outside of being a gimmick, the only use ive found for this gun is past wave 29 on endless on hardcore, before wave 29 the blunderbuss still out-performs it in every aspect aside from zappers, most of the people that use it consistantly are the same people that argue "oh but it can kill 11 zappers in a single shot no other gun can do that" while ignoring the fact that, outside of testing or private servers, you are never going to see 11 zappers at once, let alone have them all in a perfectly straight line for you to shoot, then you have to wait almost 30 seconds to reload the thing back to full again, yes im aware that you can animation cancel to speed it up, or only load a couple barrels, but if your only loading 2-3 barrels then you might aswell be using the blunderbuss for the same damage, quicker reload and better crowed control
The biggest problem with the nock is that its got absolutely zero spread, none. No matter how many shots are loaded, they are fired in a straight shot forward, the bullets are in a circle, and you can at most hit 2 width of zombies, assuming their arms overlap and you are aiming for their arms. Its got bad crowed control, no consistant damage and no practical use outside of late game endless on hardcore, you spend more time reloading the thing than fighting enemies, just for a one time use blast a round-shot sized hole through the enemy horde, but even then cannons reload faster than the nock AND usually have access to canister shot for some actual crowed control
As someone with nearly 1000 hours (don't ask me how it got that bad) I agree and disagree with the blunderbuss being the strongest weapon in the game. I do in fact think it's the best weapon for the seaman class, without a doubt, but as for all weapons, I still think the regular musket with the bayonet is a great contender for the best weapon in the game. Even without the officer charge, a skilled infantryman can hold entire objectives by himself with well placed head shots and good timing, it's how people were able to duo San Sebastian after all. For endless mode however, I still do think that the seaman class is supreme, as if you have good teammates, you can get well over 2,000 kills in a single endless match by just using the blunderbuss. Maybe at around wave 50 the nock gun may outperform the blunderbuss, but I don't know because I never see servers get that high.
All of my experience is on normal servers and not hardcore, and I don't really know the differences between normal and hardcore, so you can take what I say with a grain of salt.
As someone with 10,000,000 hours I concur.
@@jellyboi8032 As an Infantry main with 600 hrs and 300,000+ Kills and 227 KD Musket Bayonet is only good if you don't mind getting screwed over by the hitbox or teammates pulling Shamblers away from time to time, You're better off using the Carbine and Horshoe with the Heavy Saber most of the time, and if you really want to Hypercarry and farm kills you can use the Lancer/Pike to front 24/7 (My main weapon). Musket Bayonet is still great on most objective maps and great to worthless after round 33 in normal endless as Zombies take 2 headshots to kill by then and In most cases the hordes are too dense to use it as a main weapon before that point, don't bother using it in Hardcore, Hardcore Objective it can still be somewhat useful, the best players trio maps with it on Hardcore but also fail a ton of attempts due to the Bayonet's lack of pen or consistent Hitbox even in ideal conditions, but in Hardcore Endless don't bother, sure it has the best charge damage but you might as well again just use the Lance and Heavy Saber for that in Endless.
Getting kills with the Seaman can be difficult on Normal Endless, it just depends on how many Seaman there are and of course how you position yourself, Blunderbuss is however still strong on late game in both Normal mode and Hardcore, I see getting 2000 kills is easily possible but you essentially have to start at wave 1 in Tylorean or Hougoumont for you to do so without the rounds being too difficult for the team to keep progressing, I got 1000 kills with the Blunderbuss from just entering rounds 16 to 29 on Tylorean, 2k is easily doable.
Whenever I play seaman, I shoot, go behind barricades, reload, and rinse and repeat.
i think it's 11 seconds for the first barrel on the nock gun, then the reload time per barrel decreases drastically, either way it's still somewhat viable
i didn't realized until this comment that nock gun reload faster (1 pellet) and deal more damage than infantry rifle
@@slav7103 actually i think its slightly slower than the musket but its such a forgettable difference that its usually better (although i usually still play infantry because im obsessed with the heavy sabre)
@@penguinplus1238 i mean rifle (one with out bayonet) not musket
@@slav7103 ohhhh
Fully loaded nock gun is basically a portable cannon
Fun fact are not good was actually longer to reload in real life than it was in game.
It would be cool if they added it where You can reload The Nock gun back again even if you Unequip it
I usually use navy pistol since i want to dish out damage quicker and to give some space to my team by killing either bombers, igniters, zappers, and runners or in short the specials but nock could be the best if use correctly out of any seaman's weapon (in my opinion) and blunderbuss is just a combination of nock and navy but lower damage and slow on the reload
To add-on the reload for the navy pistol is longer,and the range is shorter.
if you land a headshot with a gun it deals 900x damage by the way
honestly I don't like the navy pistol that much, every time I've tried to use it it just barely puts a dent in crowds of zombies unlike the blunderbuss and nock gun
actually you dont need to load all the bullets in the nock gun loading 1 in the gun is 9 seconds being faster the the musket
as a nock gun + hand axe user, good points, im too used to them to switch though :(
I personally don't like the boarding axe, mind you, it's a weapon that has the range of the hand axe (4 units) and the attack speed of the saber (0.55 seconds). The group mode simulates a saber but with the range of the hand axe (less range than a common saber) with a measly 5 additional damage, while the individual mode can only attack 1 shambler at a time, making it vulnerable to grabs, if not hitting the head requires two hits to eliminate.
This gun is OBJECTIVELY bad on both counts! Just choose between saber consistency or hand ax damage!
they actually buffed its range last time i checked but yes its bad
blunderbus has never been underrated, just swapped out bc ppl want to use something different
I dont realy like the navy pistol because of the stuby rang thats why i use the nock gun
nock gun dmg:
250 per shot
7 pellets
10 penetration PER pellet
250 X 7 X 10(might be wrong if damage falloff existed to penetrations)
= 17500 dmg
X2 if a bugle is occuring
=35000 dmg.
do i have to say anything else? this is probably more than enough to kill the full limit horde
also.
10 X 7 = 70
so i guess the max amount it can kill is 70. 140 if buffed by bugle.
but like said in the video. if you shoot all 7 shots at a single zombie it'll splash them with 1750 dmg. yeah imagine being the shambler in that situation
Penetration isn't buffed by bugle, only damage is, however the rest is correct :)
Btw the BA and the HA have different head multipliers, the BA having a 1.5x headshot mult, compared to the Hand Ax’s 1.2x mult.
its actually 2,3x for every melee weapon with the exception of pickaxe, axe, spade and boarding axe's pointy side, which is 2,8x
ha, somebody fell for the in game shop stats
i can't tell how proud i am of my friend (Swuyrus) ended up on a yt video...
If all your bullets land on the headless horseman with nock gun, (iirc he has around 3000 health) you can do SERIOUS DAMAGE!!
bro headless horseman have 90% resistance against nock gun
1750-90% so you gonna deal like 175 damage
Blunder buss / hand axe user 🗣️🔥
In game it says the navy pistol has a reload time of 8 seconds, not 6.2 seconds.
6.2 is illustrated on the Wiki and because some in-game stats are incorrect, I’ve gone off of the Wiki instead
@ Dude if it’s actually 6.2 seconds then that would make the navy pistol way more powerful than I thought. However the description for the officer’s pistol says it has the fastest reload in game and it says it’s reload is 6.2 seconds. I guess I’ll have to time the navy pistol reload to make sure.
The officers brass pistol is just a less deadly blunderbuss
Brass Pistol
+longest reload for the Officer class (8.8s)
+charge farm go brrr
@@Ace-cf2tsdouble barrel pistol:
@@okaydoold Single barrel reload:
(DB pistol is the fastest reloading)
@@Ace-cf2ts lol, 8 seconds is faster than the pistol's 6.7?
unless you reload anim cancel yeah thats crazy
Cool video!
Nock gun supremacy.
-A nock gun user.
Semen class?
Doesn't the navy pistol have like an 8 second reload
the navy pistol reloads in 8 seconds not six (why are these stats always so inaccurate)
4:19 boarding axe is just trash
the 5 extra damage make you 2 swing zombie in other objective but it will again take 3 swing in the finale but handaxe is always gonna be 2 swing regardless of what part you are in,for the spike part it just useless
handaxe can just take 2 or 3 swing to kill a single zapper plus the spike part can only hit 1 zombie
right now nock and boarding axe is the least useful seaman weapon
navy pistol reload is 8.2
Blunderbuss still good in endless
Se-men class haha funny.
navy pistol is now 8 seconds 😔😔😔😔
Nock gun my beloved 🥰
Also if evryone in hollow used nock gun, the horse man would die in an millisecond
not really. in the latest version of the event, the horseman had damage resistance against the nock gun, essentially reducing its damage when you use it against the horseman.
@@Daryavahush but.... if all have the nockgun whit all amo it will still "one shot it"
To be honest with you, I'd argue that the Handaxe is actually better. At 45 base damage, that's genuinely amazing. While yeah, the base damage for the backside of the boarding axe is 52, I've used it for probably 50 hours of gameplay, and I've probably only ever really could utilize the backside a total of 1 or 2 times. The issue with the backside is that its 1 penetration makes it useless since most of the time, you're going to be going up against multiple zombies at once, not just one. Is the boarding axe bad? No. It's just that it's "upside" against the handaxe is extremely situational and in that case, not really worth it.
True at hardcore the BA is quite bad, tbh just equip hand axe or sabre at this point
I see a lot of people prefer the HA to the BA but I just personally prefer the BA, granted this was recorded like about a month ago so there might be some “slight hiccups” 😅
@@AverageBoat100 Boarding axe with pointed headshot hits the 1tap breakpoint for shamblers on hardcore
death by blunderbussy.... (im sorry)
How to shift lock
Change my mind: the nock guns damage is only good for the headless horseman
[edit] I got my mind changed
it has 80%-90% damages penalty against the horseman
Never mind you changed my mind
the semen
0:34 navy pistol take 8 seconds to reload in total
if you want correct information just use the fandom since the people in the official wiki never check or play the game or smth
Y’know, I think I’m one of the only people who like the classic blunderbuss. I find the nockgun’s long reload time quite tedious and not very practical in most cases, and I find the navy pistol to be very inaccurate and the stun ability is quite trivial in my opinion, the blunderbuss has decent accuracy, and a relatively average reload time that can clear out hordes as well as shooting bombers
Ye buying a Nock gun is my biggest mistake in G&B
C men
the boarding axe sucks
Fax