Wanted to get a video out on this after my first Dess video performed so well! It only felt right to do a followup. I do have a larger video w/ my Sweepstakes reactions on the way, but editing and captions are gonna take a bit. I plan on bringing more IF music here, too, but I just need to figure out how to schedule it between video essays. My Patreon: patreon.com/dorked My Ko-Fi: ko-fi.com/invertedfate More Analysis Content: th-cam.com/video/4VfHhBh1c8c/w-d-xo.html More Deltarune Theories: th-cam.com/video/KueHgAZcV00/w-d-xo.html Inverted Fate: invertedfate.com/chapters Mother 3 Footage by Blazenton: th-cam.com/channels/srX3TzPUp05eruJvNrzMmA.html Mayor Holiday Art by yBlookynho: www.reddit.com/r/Deltarune/comments/te718w/speaking_of_communion_kris_did_you_know_that_the/ Cyber City footage by RainyD
Nice! I really like your videos, because you correct misunderstandings that the fandom has about a lot of things, and your theories don’t really go off the deep end.
Me and my partner watched it while clutching each other as if a major historical event playing out on the news. It may as well have been a nuclear event
The idea that Kris might play the piano automatically as a means to pull themself out of a traumatic episode actually makes sense, given how embarrassed they seem to be when they realize they are being watched and how frequently they do so when at Noelle’s. Being Dess’s sister, it could be hard for them to look at her without seeing Dess, especially if they are unable to tell her what happened. Which makes it worse when we force them to play in Ch. 1&2 and they are unable to make cohesive music.
It also makes sense since the nurse says they used to play the piano at the hospital... it wasn't for the patients, but to soothe Kris's anxiety when visiting Rudy, perhaps.
The more that we learn about Dess, the more confident I feel about the notion that she is the Knight. The way that her mystery has been woven into the main plot seems like the perfect set up for such a major reveal.
Yeah, I think that's one big benefit Dess!Knight has as a theory. There's a certain elegance to tying all these plot points together in a big, emotional punch of a reveal. While I'm also partial to Papyrus!Knight, I do think Dess would be more connected to our core Deltarune cast.
@@Dorked Yeah, agreed. And I feel as though the Weird Route may involve forcing Noelle to kill her own sister, which would fit with the Mother 3 parallel. Also, as for how Dess disappeared, I think that she may have gone missing during a snowstorm. That would explain why Noelle stands in front of an open freezer at the grocery store lost in thought, as well as what the spell Snowgrave is based on and why she denies its existence. Seeking refuge from the blizzard, Dess could have tried to hide inside of the shelter, only to end up… wherever the UNUSED text takes place. Perhaps the Titans are responsible for her being there, which might explain where the scratching is coming from. The reason Asgore was fired by the Mayor could have been because he refused to go outside and look for her, and instead suggested to wait out the storm first. Thus, when it was revealed that Dess was nowhere to be found, he was deemed partially culpable and unfit for the job.
I personally think Alvin Boom is the knight, but I think Dess = Knight has a lot of merit too. It would be a good plot twist that isn’t overly anticipated. I hope Papyrus isn’t the knight though, Toby is trying to differentiate Deltarune from Undertale and I feel like adding undertale characters wouldn’t help a lot, we already have many interesting characters such as Kris, Susie and Noelle.
This is not a theory, more something that I noticed. There's actually 3 cases of "lost siblings" in deltarune one way or another: Dess - we have the clear example, she is the one that's literally lost. Asriel - In a way he's lost from the picture, at being at college, if you think about it he also has disappear, even if we do know where he is, he still isn't here. And the we have the meta example Papyrus - He isn't in the game, he is the only Undertale character that's been messing (well he and Asriel). It just feels like toby is doing a parallel with this 3 characters. Like how everyone seen like messing and remember Asriel, but people act like they don't wanna remember Dess? Or how there's some evidence or clues of maybe the three of them being, having or going into the dark world. What does all of this mean? No clue! 🤸 But I think is something. P.S: Sorry if I misspelled something, I'm not a English speaker
Very interesting ideas! :D They are indeed a trinity of "lost siblings", in their own ways. That's really intriguing, & something I'll keep in mind... (Your spelling & grammar were mostly just fine, but it's "missing", not "messing." Missing means something isn't where it should be. Messing means making a mess, or error like "messing up".)
My theory has not changed as of yet: Dess isn't the Knight, and is trapped in the bunker. However, she might still be able to communicate in the Bunker somehow...there may have been a Dark World in the Bunker at some point, where Dess managed to contact somebody at last to help her...Spamton. No doubt the deal was helping him to get her out. But somehow, the connection was cut...using two pieces of info, the garbage noise and Onionsan's song, here's what I think happened: Someone closed the Bunker Fountain, causing Spamton to lose contact with her since you can't call anyone between worlds it seems. That's why Onionsan is only now hearing the song: it wasn't there for the longest time. This closing required Dess to find help in the Light World...and possibly managing to contact the Knight. (Could be anyone in Hometown, no candidate would be able to just ignore this...) kickstarting the events of the game.
Yeah, I think Bunker Theory is still a really valid angle! There's really so many ways to read into it, but I feel like the bunker has to be building to something big.
@@BrownKirbyEpic "Alright, Kris. You, ready?" * Yes "Let's do this." Susie and Kris open the bunker, to find literally nothing inside. "Huh?" "What the heck!? There's literally nothing here!!" "You naive children... Can't you see?" A dark, menacing shadow appears in the opening, blotting out the duo's only source of light. "While you were busy meddling with this random, useless bunker, I was preparing my ultimate plan." "Now, face the endless wrath of the Roaring Knight..." "ICE E"
I don't think she'd be straight up abusive because if there's anything that Toby Fox games does is show how people are complex and not caricatures. But it's kinda odd that Noelle is so afraid of her mom that she doesn't even want to bother her for the spare key to get inside the house. If Queen really is supposed to represent Noelle's mom then whether she intends to or not, I imagine she's being controlling in some fashion. However Queen despite being that way also shows that seeing Noelle as a peon wasn't out of anything malicious, but because from her perspective, she wanted what was best for her. It's rare for fiction to show how stuff like this can be multi faceted so I'm glad Toby is giving room for everyone to have depth.
I think Toby will make for a complicated take on the mayor, but there's still something with her not having a particularly healthy relationship with Noelle. Noelle is terrified of her and has been for a long time. Doesn't want to risk bothering her when she forgot her keys to the mansion in chapter 1. Plus the new info on the sweepstakes site.. it's a lil' concerning.
@@bat2564 When Noelle got scared from the video game & was crying, she was trying to choke down her tears because she was afraid her Mom would come in & take the console away. Though, that can be interpreted either as a kind of punishment (losing access to her beloved games) for being 'weak' enough to cry over it... OR just a sort of "If this is so upsetting to you, I'll take it away to protect you from it." In which case, Noelle isn't so much afraid of her Mom, but just is determined not to lose her console, weighing her short-term fear against its long-term benefits.
there's a popular theory that queen is trying to play the part of every party member's mother to them (acting like toriel around kris, acting like c around noelle, etc) which raises some questions about ralsei
Dess being the knight is something I've been thinking about for a while now. With the possibility of Noelle being/becoming the angel,I've thought the angels heaven is Dess trying to create the ideal world for her sister,either not knowing or not caring about the consequences that could come from opening too many dark fountains. Maybe she does know,and thats why we've only had one extra being opened at a time. I've also been thinking about how Spamton and Queen both tried helping Noelle in their own twisted ways and didn't actually take into account what Noelle actually wanted. It could be Dess is doing the same thing,or maybe since she is her sister she actually does know what Noelle wants. Another thought I've had is,If Dess actually is the knight and created the dark worlds,is it possible she made the cyber world specifically to help make Noelle more confident like we see happen because of Queen? I've also thought it could be possible she made the card kingdom world specifically to make Susie less of a bully because she knows of Noelle's crush on her. That part has tons of holes,though. This is a bit of a ramble,just wanted to get this all out there.
Yeah, there's definitely a compelling argument that the Cyber World specifically was made for Noelle's benefit, with how much emphasis there is on making Noelle "stronger". It really depends on how much the knight is aware of in terms of the individual dark world adventures, too, but since I lean towards the cyber world being made around the time Berdly and Noelle came to study, it feels really targeted at them (mostly Noelle).
Wait doesn’t the dark world reflect the will of it’s fountain? This makes great sense. Susie had lancer to guide her towards being nicer, noelle had queen to give her confidence, I wonder what next chapter will be?
About the “only had one extra being opened at a time” thing, why is it assumed that the roaring happens if 3 dark fountains are opened? If I haven’t missed something, surely it could be any number above 2, and the three fountains with three titans shown in the cutscene when ralsei explained the roaring is probably just a result of the rule of three.
@@TheYeetedMeat Yeah, the 3 is kind of just a guess, but it makes sense since Ralsei seemed CERTAIN that if Berdly made that 3rd fountain, that the Roaring would begin right then & there. Though of course, it could ALSO be simply from a dark fountain being opened right inside of the realm of another one. Thus calling to mind the Chair part of the $pamton's $weepstakes website, "But what if it could... get darker than dark?"
I'm honestly kind of surprised how likely Dess being locked in the bunker is, I thought it was a bit too out there at first. I do wonder why no investigations haven't been performed on the bunker unless Kris said nothing. Also I hope we get to see more of Dess like her former self instead of it only being her corrupted(?) self.
The nature of the bunker is so peculiar. How old is it, for one? If it predates the mayor and is inaccessible from outsiders, maybe that's why it still stands despite the mayor being the type who'd probably not want such an unknown variable... Unless it benefits her, maybe.
One thing Im afraid of is that were gonna run in to Dess in a future Chapter, but Toby will have introduced something like "A Lightner who stays in a Dark World for too long will turn in to a Darkner, thus making a return to the Light World impossible." Probably not going to happen, but its something that I thought of while listening to findher.ogg a few months ago.
Oh, that would be really dark and really sad. Though I will say it's not unwarranted to consider, given Seam's talk of not wanting to be in the dark world at night.
@@Ammiteur9 i mean, its kinda sweet as well, him preparing for the worst. after all , a place to live in a another world is great to have if you the living in your home becomes to risky, like if susie and kris get framed for crime by the knight.
@@Ammiteur9 it could be more of a misguided attempt to be kind. Since the worlds seem to bring out feelings of nostalgia, and deal with entertainment (toys, internet, tv) and imaginative power fantasies (magic spells, heroes) it could be akin to a childhood fantasy that Ralsei might think is better for them. Their reality and their home lives being hard to deal w/. Staying in fantasy land could be ralsei’s way of giving them happiness and control over their lives, whereas irl they have to fight for control.
It's possible. But if he was faking his illness, wouldn't the nurse or doctor find out? It's easy for a medical professional to find out if someone is faking an illness after some tests after all. And he kinda has too many eyes on him to be sneaking out of the hospital without anyone noticing...
@@youraverageplutoenjoyer7677 he could just have an illness but nothing to severe. and maybe the dark world has in some way given him some type of power in the light world as well , which would even make a severe illness less dangerous than it appears...
@@Lividowly or maybe he has a thorn ring (since spamton did say there were 2) maybe when hes in the hospital he equips the thorn ring and hides to be able to use it as a front, and the doctors wouldn't know any better, so he hides it as a watch or something
The bunker theory was more or less the conclusion I came to after the Sweepstakes as well. I also have a theory that ties the bunker in with Kris and their weird situation with the player and their SOUL. Basically, Kris and Dess entered the bunker together, and both had some kind of encounter with Gaster (as evidenced by the slowed-down Entry 17 noises heard there). The encounter resulted in Dess becoming trapped in the code, and Kris having their SOUL taken by Gaster, who then experimented on it to make it into a connection point for the player. Kris's weird and creepy behavior prior to the game could be a symptom of their soullessness, and them freezing up and rushing to the piano when hanging out with Noelle, in addition to just remembering trauma (though that could also be part of it), could be them venting their frustration at being unable to emotionally connect to Noelle they way they could with their SOUL in place. The piano could be one of the few remaining sources of comfort for them, and perhaps Asriel is the only person they still feel comfortable talking with, as he might be the only one who knows what really happened. Based on the similarities between Chara's speech patterns and those of the second speaker in Deltarune's opening in the Japanese translation, I believe that it was Kris (the Deltarune world's version of Chara) interrupting Gaster and putting their/the player's SOUL into their own body rather than the vessel you created. In the context of Kris being soulless for years before then thanks to Gaster, this would essentially be them going, "no, fuck you, that's my SOUL, you're not putting it in some random greyscale hodgepodge, give it back." And it's only once their SOUL is back in place that they're able to connect with people again, quickly befriending Susie and reconnecting with Noelle in the first two chapters. I believe that they put their SOUL back after taking it out not because they necessarily need it to survive, but because they absolutely do not want to go back to being unable to feel love again, even if it means letting the player puppet them around. I still give Kris at least a 50% chance of being the Knight, just due to the Occam's Razor logic of them being the only one to create a Fountain onscreen (as well as the clearly premeditated nature of said Fountain, and the general conspiratorial vibes I got between them and Ralsei regarding the Cyber World Fountain, though that's a whole other wildly speculative can of worms), and I agree with you that if they are the Knight, then their initial motivation was likely to study the Fountains as a means to find and save Dess, and/or get revenge on Gaster for what happened to both of them. As for Dess being the Knight... While the Mother 3 connection is certainly intriguing, I find it hard to believe that Dess is both the Knight and the voice in the code, for the reasons you discussed in the video. And of those two, I find her being the voice in the code far more likely, just due to the fake 404 page giving off those kinds of vibes. Besides Kris, the only Knight candidates that really make sense to me are Father Alvin (due to Gerson's status as a renowned storyteller, the metaphorical links between Dark Worlds and fiction, and Alvin seemingly wanting Gerson to be proud of him), and Mrs. Holiday (mostly just due to the repetition of the arc word "cold" in relation to both her and the Roaring). But the brainwashed sibling villain reveal was certainly powerful when Mother 3 did it, and I can absolutely see Toby doing something cool with it too. That was all a bunch of highly speculative rambling that will fall to pieces the moment the next chapter releases, but hopefully it made at least some kind of sense. If you took the time to read all this, Dorked, I wanted to take the time to congratulate you on successfully dragging me back into Undertale AU hell with the power of Inverted Fate's sheer quality. I read through the whole thing last week, and it's absolutely incredible. The delivery format on the website is genius; I probably wouldn't have been nearly as invested if the soundtrack wasn't dynamically integrated into the comic format. Kudos to you and everyone else who worked on it, and I can't wait for the conclusion!
Just wanna say thanks for the detailed comment! I'm really sleepy from pulling a late nighter on the video so I haven't been able to read it in full, but I appreciate the thoughtful response and kind words.
My headcannon voice for Spamton is that he talks and sounds like a used car salesman (80s maybe?) but when the text is in brackets the voice abruptly goes for a monotone robot voice and just as abruptly goes back to normal after the brackets, also the symbol swearing is just a censor bleep
My idea is that he talks like an insane person but the brackets have him talking in the most suave, sweep-you-off-your-feet voice imaginable, and the change between the two is so abrupt that its impossible to get used to
Something unrelated to Dess, but I'm still wondering about the Ice-E box winking, I think you might had mentioned it in the Deltacast, it could easily be Noelle imagination but I wonder if it did indeed move. Dess believed her sister, it wasn't like she was playing along or anything like that, she really believed her, because no one would go to a graveyard to bury a cardboard box. Then again they are teens and they sometimes do dumb stuff like this. But in any case, I want to bring it up because is a thing that happens when is really dark, objects seem to look like they are moving or that they take the shape of something else. In real life is just a thing of the mind, playing tricks because you cannot tell what you are seeing, but in here I think it might be how Darkness might communicate with the Light World, because is in the dark where they take form, this is why they're an actual person in the Dark World, the darkness might be giving them life while the light is making them look like ordinary objects.
that is actually a really good theory. maybe they need a lot of darkness to fully manifest as a being. and, well, all im saying is "the shadows cutting deeper. photon readings negative." which would imply darker than dark coming from the fountains, which allows the objects to manifest.
@@Captain8771OnGithub Yeah, you are right, this darkness coming from the fountains is what gives them life and create their worlds, but their flaw is that only the ones that fit that world is able to stay there without turning into stone. And only the Fountain of pure Darkness can keep them living without this issue. Which leads to so many questions. Like what makes a Dark fountain pure? Does it happens naturally? Because the others so far has been people opening them.
@@janiradariasmorales7918 maybe its to do with a certain spooky scary skeleton from the void opening it? personally i think the grand fountain is in the void, and the closet is a portal there. altough anything's possible. its toby fox after all.
@@Captain8771OnGithub I'm not sure if Gaster is capable of opening fountains, yet, if he's still in the code, which he might be. So far, if is the same character, he might be the man who gives us eggs and messing with the secrets bosses. Though I starting to wonder if the one handing us eggs is Everyman, because we seen so much Easter eggs with this guy, way too much to be a coincidence. It still could be Gaster of course, but I'm wondering if Everyman is gonna end up being really important in this story. As for the Void, I while ago saw one of Dorked's videos that was about misconceptions in the fandom and the Void is one of them. There's no Void, that's a thing the fandom had made. So, I think the correct thing would be the code? because I think you can still find him there.
The thought just occurred to me that perhaps Dess could have disappeared in the closing of a dark world. If she remained in a dark world during its closing, then she could possibly end up trapped within as an item in the light world, turning a Lightner into a Darkner. If this was the case, that would explain why Noelle knows how to use ice magic but doesn't understand basic combat, and why Kris is afraid of the Dark world in chapter 1 but continues to create Dark Fountains after this point to search for Dess.
Honestly I'm a big fan of the theory that Dess is the knight, or at least in some way connected to the knight. There so many interesting narrative and thematic possibilities at play.
Smth came into my mind is that Dess is the Angel,working as an equivalent to UT Asriel. It really doesn't have any proof other than obvious connections to Noelle but I find it neat,specially combined with my favorite DR theory Knight-pyrus.
Ooh, that COULD be really interesting. A lot of people expect Noelle to be a manifestation of the Angel, but Dess did have a hand in the Angel doll, and it would make a fun subversion. Plus fallen angels are also a thing. Lots of ways this could go! (Also yes, Knightpyrus is also great. Really wanna tackle that at some point, too.)
I desperately need to see conversation between Papyrus-The-Knight and Asriel. In Undertale their strange relationship was kinda forgotten in community, but in Deltarune... It's strange, how in WHOLE cast of significant characters of first game these two are "missing". Can you imagine, If in this universe Asriel (or what is going on with Ralsei) will become Papyrus's eagle enemy.
@@chielobana1926 A headcanon I have is that every incarnation of Asriel is bound to become friends with Papyrus(he was friends with an Asriel unable to feel empathy afterall),so itd be neat if the last chapter was Kris and Asriel together for the first half and facing Papyrus,then they find out he wasn't actually evil,with the second half being a road to reach the Angel,with the teams either being Kris Susie and Ralsei(or Noelle who knows)or Kris(A human),Papyrus(A monster)and Asriel(And a prince from the dark). Then again,just a headcanon.
I can’t wait for more deltarune chapters to be released! It seems that the more and more it goes on the better and even sadder it gets. I also really wanna know if we (the player) finally get our vessel instead of involuntary possessing Kris. I’m also glad that ever since Deltarune got released the Undertale fandom got less toxic which is a win-win for me since I love both deltarune and undertale deeply
Deltarune being as spread out as it is certainly gives a lot more time to ruminate on certain chapters, which is pretty cool. We'll be getting three chapters next time, so I wonder how that'll impact the theory space.
This may not be necessarily related to her disappearance in the long term, but I'm curious how much of the Sweepstakes' content was premade. Chapter 1 had plenty of explanations for its scenes and characters, but nothing like the almost room by room stories 2 has developed (such as Ice-E winking and the "sighting", all the cats and Cat Petterz, cars with legs and Cat Petterz... again). Was everything we saw part of the story from the beginning, or were some details added/affirmed after Spamton gained his popularity and provided more incentive to put thoughts in writing? Did traits like Kris's coolness or Dess's fierceness become emboldened only as a result?
I think a lot of it was at least alluded to, tbh. Noelle mentions Ice-E related pranks in chapter 1. Cat Petterz has been a thing since early on, plus even Blood Crushers gets a mention at the end of chapter 2. xD Toby has had this game in development for a long time. But I do think the sweepstakes itself took form after Spamton's popularity.
I agree with @Dorked. The game has been in development for a long time. I think at least most of the relevant lore information was already there, they just found an different way to use it in the Sweepstakes.
@@bpsara I think there's at least something that wouldn't have happened without the Sweepstakes. Most of Dess's character, sure, but I wouldn't be surprised if some of the Cat Petterz stories or Kris's "gamer reaction" scene would've been left unsaid/undeveloped.
NICE. Dess being the Knight is an interesting theory, and one that I haven't really considered before... I'm not sure how i feel about the theory, but it would certainly explain a lot. No matter what, this was an amazing video.
Yeah, I'm not 100% married to the idea either, but I think the narrative potential is really interesting, and worth consideration. It would also make the Kris red herring (if they are one) SUPER intriguing.
Dess as a character in Deltarune is hard to pinpoint. I for sure feel like she will be an integral part to Noelle's future character arc, regardless of Snowgrave or not. But most of the information we find about Dess is outside the game itself. Like the loose text strings in the game files or the pages on Spamton Sweepstakes. That makes me wonder what we will come to find out about Dess in game when the time comes. For the most part there's some scattered info about her from Noelle and Rudy, but not much more. There is also the possibility of the strange Spamton dialogue in his shop of "... can anyone hear me? Help..." being from Dess. It seems REALLY spontaneous and out of character even for Spamton to just blurt that out. But that does open up to the possibility of Dess being able to take control over some of the darkeners. Even when not being present in their Darkworld. Could that mean something similar with Gaster happened to Dess where she's scattered across time and space, but only for the darkworlds? Where pieces of her suddenly make contact with a Darkworld and she's able to puppet a darkner, even for a small moment. I'll sure say, there is a lot you could speculate about Dess, and I'll be looking forward to what Toby has in store.
Yeah, she's so fascinating because we know just enough about her and yet she's oddly... absent. And it's only Noelle and Rudy who mention her. Plus all the funky meta stuff. She could be very similar to what Gaster was in UT, just more up front.
ive been speculating pretty much the same. dess and gaster almost seem to exist in a space outside of the games at the moment, which i suspect will tie back into how we the players are also entities that exist outside of the game. ive also been theorizing that the [redacted] figure from the unused undertale room 272 might actually be dess. that room is connected to the soundtest room which is where we hear gaster's theme which is what led many people to consider the figure as a possible gaster candidate, but it doesnt make much sense that the mysteryman sprite and redacted would both be gaster
Thank you very much! Dess is just such a fascinating mystery, and mysteries are fun to spitball ideas about. xD I feel like she's the "Gaster" of Deltarune in that respect.
Personally I stuck with Mayor Holiday being the Knight, opening Dark Worlds to search for her missing daughter, with Dess being trapped in a Dark World. But Dess Knight is also a really cool theory, especially with Noelle as the Angel in mind! Anyway, I really liked this one, and look forward to that Terra analysis (people often just boil him down to "naive hunk who serves as the main antagonist's vessel who would trust absolutely anyone, but there's more to him).
my theory has been that Asriel, Noelle, Dess, & Kris went out to explore & then Noelle & Asriel bailed bc they were scared. but Dess & Kris went on. they went inside, & smth took Dess & trapped her in the code of their reality. Kris knows what's in there & they can't even say what they saw. Asgore fails to find Dess & so the Mayor kicks him off the force. Toriel & Asgore were already tense before that, but getting kicked off the force & this whole investigation going terribly rly tipped it & they got divorced. years have gone by & Kris still hasn't said anything. i personally think that Kris definitely knows way more about what's happening to them & it's obvious they have their own motives.
@@Dorked it lines up pretty well & gives a pretty clear picture as to how gloomy Kris' life was prior to the events of the game beginning. it shows that Kris is more than just lonely. it's a lot heavier than that. it kinda do rly hope it goes this way just bc i think it ties most of the main mysteries together
There are a lot of potential "strings" tying a lot of characters together... The person lost in the "strings" of code. Gaster, or us, pulling the strings on events/characters to control them. Spamton's puppet parallel of making the phones ring by being an obedient puppet, letting the strings pull his actions. If you try to equip the Puppet Scarf to Noelle, she says it feels like guitar strings, & if you take her to Spamton's closed shop, she starts off nervous, but then smiles & says it feels nostalgic. Dess is associated with a guitar, & the "FindHer" music piece. & how do you play guitar? You pull the strings & make them ring. :O I'm wondering if one of the most complete endings will involve a musical medley. With Kris playing the piano, Dess playing guitar, Asriel adding vocals (since Father Alvin says that he was a major singer in choir), & maybe Onion-san singing the Old Song From the Sea (which may or may not layer with, or even be, "Dont' Forget"). I wonder if we'll discover other characters' instruments along the way... (And as a bonus, maybe The Original Starwalker will ring a bell, because it keeps away the birds that are pissing him off. ;3 And Queen will play her mixtape, & Lancer will play "Splat" noises, LOL!) ((Man, now I'm wondering if Toby's big reveal of something will be combining parts of all different pieces of music in each chapter into one big piece. I wouldn't put it past him~!))
for the runaway theory, i feel like mrs holiday wasn’t as cold as she seems now until recently. perhaps she was strict before, but not cruel, but the stress caused by her political position plus having a missing daughter and an ill husband drove her to becoming more grouchy and unsociable, perhaps burying herself in her work to avoid having to confront her inner turmoil. if queen is a reflection of mrs holiday, then that would line up, since sweet cap’n cakes tell us that though queen wasn’t an amazing leader, before the knight showed up she wasn’t a tyrant at all
Nice video! I personally don't think that Dess is The Knight (I'm WAAAAY to dedicated to the idea of it being Alvin lol) but it's definitely made me reconsider her role in the story, which I didn't think too much of before beyond simply being a posthumous character
Yeah, Alvin Knight is another really interesting angle! There's been some really compelling arguments for it, and I think he's absolutely still worth considering.
@@Dorked like, fun evidence you might not know, his sprite fits the exact dimensions of the closet many people theorise the knight hid in to make the cyber fountain to the pixel. the only real thing he's missing is a strong emotional throughline with the cast, which can easily be set up in a church scene that seems to be being built up
Here is my personal theory on the textboxes and Asgore being fired. So, this is more about Ralsei because I've been trying to figure him out for a while especially with all the little details in chapter 2, and this is just my theory Ralsei was a young kid (also human), probably around 6-7 and was obsessed with the idea of new worlds and adventures. So he went to the police station after school to see what he could do. Then Asgore told him the prophecy, thinking of it as a joke and it wouldn't work. Ralsei got so excited he could barley sleep that night. The next day after school he went into the closet and made the first fountain, sending him to the castle town. He thought it was a bit lonley so he brought some of his favorite toys and games. His parents asked what he was doing so Ralsei brought them with him to show them what he had made. His parents thought it would just be a fun game of pretend but then they all jumped into castle town and everything came to life and Ralsei was SO HAPPY. Then, the roaring came. Ralsei didn't know about it. He hid in the castle, but when it was over....he had lost everything....His parents...his only friends.... And most importantly, he slowly started to lose his human form. After that he isolated himself in the castle for years until Kris and Susie came along. Then he realized, the prophecy was true. (I know there are a few gaps but please leave any questions! Id be more than happy to answer them!)
Good to see someone talking about Dess! I feel like that's a mystery a lot of people don't talk about for someone so important. I feel like what happened to Dess involved a Dark World in the Bunker. If I remember correctly, Dess said she'd take Noelle to a place like the Dark World, which could imply knowledge of the Dark World. Dess being the Knight is also an interesting theory, though I don't think she's the Knight herself but I think she is connected to the Knight.
Big omori spoiler 4:03 the song that kris plays on the piano is very similar to omori ost 159-remina Which plays during the truth sequence of omori. This has some worrying implications.
Toby did mention once that coincidentally, a recent indie game had some similar plot points to what he has planned for Deltarune. I, like many others, have a feeling that game was Omori. (Before anyone says anything, Omori was in development long before Toby even started work on Deltarune and Undertale. While Toby did Collab with Omocat with the "Merry CD" in the game, Toby had zero input on the game's development. And also, Omocat, as far as I'm aware, isn't working on Deltarune with Toby so she couldn't have known what Toby has planned for the game. And Toby already has Deltarune's story fully planned out since even before Omori released.) With all that being said, the more I look into everything we know about Dess so far, the more and more I think of Omori. (If anyone reading this has not played Omori yet, please stop reading this because like the op's comment, this is huge spoilers for the game.) Dess being Noelle's big sister, Her going "missing", Kris being Noelle's childhood friend whom hasn't really communicated much with her in a long time outside of school or maybe small talk, Also Kris having some sort of involvement in Dess disappearing and trauma to boot, Dess having used to play the guitar, Kris having played the *_piano..._* It's not one to one, of course. But we can't deny the similarities. I just hope the bunker didn't have stairs...
Oh, I thought I was the only one who had thought about the possibility of Mayor Holiday being the knight xD. Tbh, I'm inclined to think Dess won't have an antagonistic role, instead i think Noelle will join the gang in future chapters and together they'll have to rescue her sister, revealing bits and pieces of Kris's backstory at the bunker in the process.
I think the person in the files is more likely to be The Vessel more than anything and seek's cool deltarune mod only convinced me further lol. I can see either Dess or the Mayor as The Knight.
Huh. vessel is interesting in that respect. It's so hard to really know what the Vessel's deal is at this time. I imagine it'll come back later, but HMM...
Just finished looking through the Spamton Sweepstakes last week and finally got to look at that sweet sweet Dess lore. (btw Omori spoilers in this) I definitely think Kris playing the piano is a trauma response, and I like the idea that Kris and Dess were the only ones brave enough to enter the bunker, and/or just go explore somewhere that Asriel and Noelle didn't, and what they saw led to Dess's disappearance and Kris closing themself off. That leads into a theory I like that something about this traumatic experience led Kris to be connected to Gaster or evenly willingly seek him out which resulted in the play connecting to them. And yeah Dess definitely didn't run away, in fact I find it very likely Carol/Mayor Holiday was a fine mother that is just heavily suffering from the disappearance of her child and becoming an extreme helicopter parent over her remaining one so she never has the same fate. It's sad and an unhealthy response, but understandable. It makes me think of how- *and I'm going to preface this section with HEAVY Omori spoilers-* Sunny's mother acted after Mari's death, letting Sunny stay inside despite knowing it's not good for him because she's afraid of losing him. While on the topic of Omori, I find it funny how directly the instrument connections mirror Omori's. While the protagonist played violin, the missing older sister of the friend group played piano. Meanwhile in Deltarune, the protagonist plays piano, and the missing older sister of the friend group plays guitar, another string instrument. Also the whole idea of Dess being the knight is thematically fitting too. Just like how it's revealed that the mysterious antagonistic entity of 'Something' is just Sunny's traumatic interpretation of Mari, a puppeted Dess could be more literally an antagonist that's hard to face down because of Kris's trauma. I too am a sucker for the confusing bit of mystery in a story suddenly being connected in one thread in the end, something which Omori does well and I hope Deltarune pulls off too. We never really realized how right Toby was when he made that tweet years ago that Omori would be very similar to Deltarune huh? And speaking of I _love_ the idea of a goner Dess being the knight, that's such an awesome theory and definitely connects to Mother 3 well (yes I spoiled myself on Mother 3 watching this video but idc lol). 7:55 P.S. love the art of Mayor Holiday as the knight, and that she has a face similar to Noelle's but the mask resembles Gyftrot. Reminds me of a Ch3 video someone made with Kris being chased down by a Knight in Undyne's Undertale armor in the Dark World, only for the mask to be lifted up to reveal a confused Napstablook who just ended up there lol.
I've had a Theory that includes this idea ever since ch2 came out and I've been polishing it ever since. The sweepstakes only renforced my Idea. It's not exactly about Dess or Doctor W. D Gaster, it's like... A global theory that Links important stuff together and propose an explanation that doesn't just boils down to "it's Gaster !" I like to call it The Bunker Incident Theory. I genuenly think this theory has the potential to become one of the most relevant theories out there, or inspire people to make their own theories about it... Alas, as a non-english person I have nowhere to post it, I don't even know where I should post it in fact, and non english Deltarune yt videos are so niche there's no point in doing so... When I see guys like you who are only just now starting to realize what's going on, i'm enraged because Reading my theory might have allowed you to figure it out sooner and/or have an Epiphany and solve the entire lore who knows ? It's so frustrating....
Tbh the bunker being a dark world and Dess going missing there feels so- perfect It's woven perfectly into the story and also ties the darkworld as something Kris has already experienced and maybe hasn't connected the dots on yet, since they perhaps repressed many memories if it was that traumatic. I personally love the bunker dark world theory and will be kind of disappointed if it's not the case- since other Dess theories are usually less interesting and disconnected from the main story. Her being missing in a DARK WORLD would be such a perfect tie in as to why the police force failed to find her, why the bunker is locked, Kris' traumatic experience there, and Asgore being fired
As for the text strings, i think an easy way for the text strings to be both dess, and for dess to be the knight, is to say the text strings arnt happening concurrently with the story, they're just an echo of what already transpired, perhaps the text is even her origin story so to speak. I mean think about it, she would have to been missing for years at this point, and only now she's asking for help? What the hell was she doing before then? Sleeping?
Yeah, I could see the strings being retrospective, like maybe it's a message that's been severely delayed and it's only reaching its destination in the present.
I know this video is a year old, but i feel like dress is in a dark world, but she is not being in any way controlled, so she actually wants to stay there
i wrote a mother 3 related comment under your video related to noelle's mother literally this morning and now i see it here. ik the video was made 8 months ago but still, it's amazing that you got that vibe too
Your videos never disappoint! Also, Dess is a freaking awesome older sister. I can totally imagine her beating the crap out of Kris after they scare Noelle.
I literally had the same idea a long time ago to make a video on how Dess is the knight because of the similarities from mother 3 like how Claus went missing just like Dess and so on, but I guess you beat me to it lol also heres something I realised, in mother 3 your goal is to pull needles, in deltarune your goal is to seal fountains, there are seven needles in mother 3, there are seven chapters in deltarune, which probably means seven fountains to seal
I don't buy the "trap within the code". Deltarune seems to have a world more like ours so i think the quotes in the code are more for story telling than literal. I could be wrong. Anyway the Dess Knight theory ties up a lot of things together, and knowing Toby's love for Mother 3, i can definitely see it. But there is still a lot that isn't connected. Papyrus, Gerson, Ice-e, Gaster. Right now we don't have much but everything seems to be significant. Anyway intresting video! As a fan of KH i'm eager to see your Terra analysis. And i hope you'll do more KH in the future as Well!
The thing is, Deltarune still does have some weird meta vibes. For instance, the file select menu in its default state has a bunch of weird, cryptic Gaster dialogue (Mystic Slime recently did a video going into some detail on this). I do think it's less explicit, but the player, at least, is still an active part of the story what with the whole player vs protagonist angle with Kris.
Yeah. But Gaster and the player feels like more out of this world. Even Gaster dialogue about the save files is weird. He treat as some sort of experiment as if he could duplicate worlds. Though i won't say there isn't meta elements. I think the biggest difference between Deltarune and Undertale right now is that we know for sure Undertale world's operate like a video game. When Deltarune seems to not be the case. Except in rare instances. We'll see. The stuck into the code theory is plausible.
nothing gets me more excited than waking up and having a deltarune-related video in my sub box time to get 9 minutes worth of snacks I love the idea that Dess or the Mayor is the knight, surprised i haven't come across either of those theories before. In terms of the unused text strings, I've always presumed they were Dess's reactions from the past, someone who has just been trapped in the dark world and reacting to it. There'd be plenty of reasons why this wouldn't be the case (it updating for chapter 2 does imply some sense of it being current), but fuck it, dess is now my favourite candidate for the knight. I'd love the switch of how the unused text portrays her as "lost, scared, and confused" to have her then be pulling the strings in all of the dark worlds. getting zapped to a new world and then becoming its overlord, hell yeah. you go start that roaring girl. (a couple of "stream-of-consciousness" thoughts coming from this: 1. with a lot of theories connecting the knight and Gaster for reasons I currently forget, if Dess disappeared into the bunker, that'd likely satisfy the presumed connection due to how gastery that area is. real gaster vibes, that bunker has. 2. one thing that would have to be determined if this theory was true would be why is dess attempting to cause a roaring? is she a villain or just an antagonist? is her motives good & ralsei is lying to everyone about the destructive forces (or even of the existence of the roaring)? would dess be being misled, or has her time in the darkness made her want to cause the roaring?) anyways, hope 𝓽𝓱𝓮 𝓪𝓵𝓰𝓸𝓻𝓲𝓽𝓱𝓶 is satisfied with my interaction with the video, lmao. time to go find a solid 5 hour block of time to finally go watch the deltacast
All I'm gonna say is that we better not find her in a dark world. Susie herself told us that eating (and probably drinking) literally don't matter and prolonging your stay longer than three days just sounds like a death sentence. Not to mention that being a dusty corpse or just a corpse probably doesn't stop them from becoming a darkner due to the rule of inanimate things being powered back up by a dark fountain.
Something just occurred to me that I haven't seen anyone freaking out about, but now I am. I was reading through the comments on this video when someone mentioned Seam warning about being in dark world at night; the quote I could find is: "You don't want to get caught when the sun goes down..." And Kris just opened a dark fountain at night. I wonder if the reason most of the future chapter images Toby showed off are from chapter 4 instead of chapter 3 is because something harrowing goes on in chapter three in-between or unexpectedly after the movie/tv show shenanigans with the weather people and shadow men.
As someone who is a massive Mother 3 fan, I gotta say this theory was a wonderful surprise. I think I even see some parallels with Lucas and Kris specifically. Both are the younger sibling of their respective games, Both are for the majority of the time silent protagonists, Both are clearly dealing with stress in the lives. Yeah, I really like this theory! Can’t wait to see more videos! :D.
@@Dorked lol I didn’t expect you to respond, idk why but seeing someone with nearly 30k subs use my content is astonishing, (it’s my birthday and that made my day)
I have a pet theory in my head that the song "Don't forget" will later be sung by a male singer [Gaster, Asriel, Ralsie, Asgore, Rudy, Father alvin, ect] somewhere in chapters 3-5, and eventually it will be sung as a duet between the male and female singers. This could symbolize the parental assurance of Toriel and Asgore to Kris, or the lost love between Dess and Asriel, or some other "greater than the some of its parts" revelation in the story. I partially get the idea from elsewhere in gaming [Spoilers ahead]. Bastion's "Setting sail, coming home" re-contextualizes 2 separate songs as part of a single duet between a mother and son. In "Want to be free" by sea power, which is featured in an altered way in the game "Disco Elysium", what first appears to be a solo is actually a duet with a female voice if you listen closely enough and you hear the female vocals isolated in a boat ride to the game's final area, and the motif is meant to symbolize the main character's lingering memories of his ex-wife. [Spoilers end] I also think the don't forget motif will appear in the final battle theme/sequence.
I REALLY gotta play Bastion. I have it on Steam. It's just... big game backlog. xD I do think a "full" version of Don't Forget will come into play later, though, and have plot relevance!
Neat analysis video! Was very interesting! The support for the mayor as The Knight seems fairly persuasive. Dess being The Knight seems to be a little more up in the air, but in a narrative structure way, it could make sense! Thanks so much for uploading this!
Yeah, I think either Holiday has a compelling case to make and is a bit more central to the core cast than Alvin or Papyrus, even if I can dig those theories too.
I'm not sure Dess would be the knight, I mean if she was walking around the town you'd think it would be a pretty big deal right, like somebody would notice? I mean MAYBE nobody would have noticed her, but given that the cyberworld fountain was opened during the day I think it would be very hard for Dess to avoid being seen. Though it is an interesting possibility, and I wouldn't be too surprised if it ended up being true.
I think it depends on how stealthy the knight is, too. I think with any candidate it raises a lot of questions about how they aren't being seen. At least with someone like Alvin or the Mayor, stuff like Cyber World would be less suspicious, tho.
I believe that Rudy is a knight, his family has too many connections to the machinations of the Dark World for no real good reason, and there are some hints that he can be cured with the help of the Dark World. In the neutral ending, when Birdley broke his wing, it was left broken in the World of Light. So it's entirely possible that Rudy got sick in the Dark World and is unable to be cured unless he figures how to do it in the Dark World. Dess missing is also a good motivation for him to open up the Dark Worlds. The only problems are 1. He probably would not want to hurt Noelle by sending her to an unown world. Well the Queen actually wanted to protect Noelle the entire time, maybe Rudy was aware of this fact and didnt give a shit about anybody else getting hurt. Also it's entirely possible that it was all a coincidence and he got children in there by accident. But hey, this won't be the first time Toby Fox has made up a story about someone's father doing something irresponsible to little kids. 2. He can't leave the hospital in his condition. Well, probably not. We should ask... his Doctor.
Definitely one of the more convincing knight theories out there, it would be a really neat way of tying up all the loose threads and mysteries the game has presented.
Thanks! It's definitely one I think has a lot of emotional potential and would have a simple elegance. As much as I love Knight Papyrus, I think the personal connection to Dess would really up the emotional stakes.
I wonder if mystery of her disappear will affect our perceptions of Lore. I mean, it would be extremely unexpected and cool, if Dess has NOTHING to do with Gaster's secrets, and she is a part of something different. ...I just need River Person to be connected to Deltarune from the very beginning.
I think it'd be a bit odd if there was no connection simply because I like when things are a bit more elegant in their connections and it'd keep a tight focus, but it's entirely possible! There's just a lot of weirdness going on with her, and all the strands of info we have are quite perplexing.
Dess most likely is dead and their is a good chance that they never were able to cover the body so she was mark as MIA This is also would explain why we never see a grave for her, but I believe that her mother is in denial of the lost of her own child. Because she is the mayor of the town, she most likely order people not to make a grave for Dess. This also explains why Noelle and her mother relationship is quite shaking, due to the fact Noelle might look quite similar to Dess, so every time Noelle mother would see Noelle she would see a part of Dess which then brings back all the terrible memories she has been trying to forget. Usually a person who is tending to forget about a bad experience would focus on working on something in this case, we see that Noelle mother is always busy but in reality she only keeps busy so those bad memories don't return. Kinda sad if this true. Also this post is before watching the video.
I personally don't think she's dead just because the way they talk about her in the game feels so contrary to that. Noelle wouldn't joke about Kris being lucky Dess isn't there if she was dead-dead (granted, denial), plus the error page to me evokes something more mysterious and meta. xD
@@Dorkedhmm true, well in reality we won't know the truth until the game drops but that probably be another year or so. It's always interesting to see what kind of theories pop up with this series
Knight Dess is a theory I've wholeheartedly believed in for a little bit now. I can't wait for Toby to make me cry over 13 year olds again like Mother 3 did!
While Dess as the Knight is interesting, I'm not too sure. It's heavily implied that the Knight is someone opening fountains from the light world, and for it to be Dess it'd imply she's been walking around town without anyone noticing. (I know you can open fountains from INSIDE a Dark World, but it doesn't seem to be accesible to Lightners or foreign darkners until there's a fountain there)
I have my own headcanon of how these theories COULD work. I’m not trying to be cleaver/ original. I honestly just want it to make sense. 1. We don’t know how long dark world doors have existed in hometown. If they have been around for years is it possible kris and Susie were not the ones to discover them first? 2. I would like to know if asrial and Dess discovered any dark fountains when Noelle and kris were Little. If true then asrial and Dess could have been DELTA WARRIORS fighting against their own angels heaven years ago. Given how popular asrial is I like to imagine bratty, catty and pizza pants had opportunities to join the the duo in some adventures. It would make GREAT fan fiction if this was true. I call this theory GEN DELTA theory. 3. How this concludes loops back into the Dess is the Knight theory. As a result of playing heroes or due to being careless with other worldly magic. Dess and asrial were separated from each other. Asrial returned to the light world and lost the ability to return to the dark. Dess for unknown reasons became trapped in the dark world with no way to return. 4. Here the story picks up on what we know. Asrial never reviled the truth about what happened ( a sort of dark parallel to flowey hiding the power of determination in undertale) Asgore fails to find Dess and gets fired by Dess’s mother mayor holiday. Noelle becomes heartbroken and she and kris don’t connect as kids anymore. And life goes on. 5. Next I want to spitball some possible conclusion theories on my personal GEN DELTA theory. Asrial became desperate to get his friend (possibly girlfriend) back so left for university, maybe to study the nature of dark worlds in a academic fashion. If the core of undertale was never made in this world it would be thematically accurate for the professor of asrial university to be W.D.Gaster that would study science and physics legitimately. 6. Dess on the other hand is a complete mystery. Weather due to madness, loneliness or prolonged exposure to dark world environments. She also is constantly studying her prison and learning its secrets. She takes on the identity of THE KNIGHT and with the goal of bridging the dark and light worlds opens more fountains. By enlisting king she bought time to open more fountains until three medaling brats Ruined her plans. 7. Finally once asrial triumphantly returns he will enlist his old crew bratty, catty and pizzapants. Dive back into their childhood bonding experience assist the current DELTA WARRIORS and save Dess from the darkness. Don’t forget … I’m with you in the dark…🎶 Feel free to make this into a fanfic anyone who’s reading. I’m too lazy. Thank you I’m spent.
Ok, I paused the video, so I don't know what you're about to say, but in generally I really like the Dess is the knight theory. I find it very interesting how years of absense, potentially being lost in a dark world, could've affected her, and how Noelle would react and act through all of this. I also like it because Noelle, Kris, Ralsei, Susie and Dess seem to be the most important characters in Deltarune and this way, everyone has a significant role to the main story of restoring balance between light and dark.
Yeah, I absolutely agree that Dess Knight would be super poignant in the character drama, the connections to other plot mysteries, and fitting in with the current setup of the main cast.
@@Dorked I finished the video now, you did a great job, this will definetly join my playlist of theorys I listen to when I'm drawing. I wanted to say something about the Text in the code. If we say that Dess got lost in the bunker or/and a dark world It could be that the text is from the past when Dess just recently got lost in there or a few days after, and we're just now able to see it. That way Dess could be the knight, while the text being still from her. But this counts only for the scrapped text in the code and not for the text Spamton says, if we assume that was Dess/the person lost in the code as well. (I forgot if you theorized that, I'm sorry). Also since we seemingly get new text with each chapter, this could also be an argument against that. Also I forgot to say, Dess being the knight gives both Dess and Noelle a more active role in the game instead of them just happily reuniting or something like that, and I'd love to see that.
Funny how you mention Mother 3, I also think that deltarune has many M3 inspired things in it, which is also why I personally think we're getting a chapter that's very similar to the sunflower chapter.
(mother 3 spoilers) the roaring could also be inspired by the dark dragon, where if all seven needles were pulled by a source of evil, the dragon would emerge from the earth and wipe out all life on earth. sound familiar?
Honestly after this video I am more inclined to believe that Dess might be a roaring knight. It'd be really interesting for the plot and the whole game in general. She's definitely one of the most likely candidates. I think she's alive as well and we'll find her later in the game. Either as a knight or in other circumstances. The mayor being a knight is intriguing and possible too. Also very interesting mother 3 connection. I've played this game several times now, but the parallel with Noelle and Dess to Lucas and Claus has never crossed my mind.
I wonder If this is why kris had a save file in the dark world, Of course it wouldn't be the same dark world but they also have a save in chapter two, HalfbreadChao's theory as to how this happened is that kris can save in the light world, maybe when kris and Dess entered the bunker, (if they ever did anyway) Dess wasn't able to make it out of the dark world, or somehow got stuck there when the fountain sealed, maybe she turned into an object in the light world, (that's clearly far fetched) But if kris sealed the dark world with Dess in it what happens, do they just wake up? But anyway I think that's why Kris wants to open the dark fountain. Anyway, that's just my two cents.
i think dess is the [redeacted] figure in the unused undertale room 272. it matches with the unused dialog of someone asking for help from a dark place where no one can hear them as the words of the figure are hidden from us not only by being written in lowercase wingdings but also by being quite literally redacted. whats more is that exiting to the south of room 272 leads you to the sound test room where the infamous gaster's theme can be found, which ends with the words "thanks for your feedback, be seeing you soon!" and brings to mind the fact that deltarune was labeled as a "survey program" when it was initially released. the figure in 272 also kind of looks like it has an antler on its head
If she is the redacted figure, it's probably not Deltarune Dess, since Dess is confirmed to be fine in Undertale in both the casino dialogue and Asgore alarm clock dialogue on the official Undertale website. Sans mentions "the antlered girl and her sister" and Asgore mentions both of Rudy's daughters growing up on the surface.
@@Dorked i think something similar to what happened to gaster happened to dess but to a less extreme extent since characters still seem to remember her. the voice in the code seems to be trapped in a weird limbo between existence and non existence, the only evidence of them found in the hard to reach area of usused game data. gaster (or who we believe to be gaster) also shows up in undertale despite the many many hints that hes also in deltarune. dess and possibly gaster might be trapped in a place outside of the games allowing them to freely move between the two worlds much like the player, who also exists outside of the games, can. plus the bunker thats seemingly connected to her disappearance just oozes gaster involvement. i think the fake page not found and hidden dess page kind of supports this since its almost like evidence of her is being obscured. correct me if im wrong but im pretty sure only her family really mentions her
Hey dorked not to be a pain nor am I trying to pester you but I don't suppose you could upload floweys theme checkmate that plays when flowey betrays everyone in inverted fate, it's a banger. Cool video btw, hope you're doing well :)
I wonder if there’s any connection between the bunker and the time Noelle recalls in the puzzle sequence, where they explored the woods behind the church.
I thank Sarah for retweeting out this video on her twitter! Me wanting to know everything there is to know about Deltarune like the high lore nerds, I wanted to ask a couple of things after watching. But before that, thank you as well for that Mother 3 warning, it was much appreciated. I'm currently paused midway through my own playthrough of the game :) First, where have we seen the text strings, like the one at 8:14? I feel like I've seen these, but I can't remember where. And second, do you think Kris' inability to play the piano is due to their stress of other people watching, or due to the player's control of them? Third, do you think your videos will suffice to thoroughly understand all this world's lore up to this point? Or is there people that you'd also recommend I check out? Thank you for this video, I quite enjoyed it and will likely watch more of your channel.
A lack of sound effect doesn't mean a lack of importance. Rouxls Kaard doesn't use a talk sound despite being a recurring character. The secret bosses lack portraits. It's a bit too early to rule out some importance to the story.
Can't wait to see what you've got to say about this, always looking forward to theory vids from this community! I'll probably edit this comment with my thoughts below after watching :) DISCLAIMER: A lot of this theorycrafting is predicated upon Dess being the one trapped in the code. That's an assumption, and I could be wrong about that. I just can't think of anyone else it could be outside of the vessel? or maybe asriel??? (that one's a stretch) so keep that in mind. Hard agree on Dess being a very likely candidate for the Knight. I had always thought this was a serious possibility, hasn't changed in my mind since. There's also plenty of evidence to support her at least creating the Ch. 2 dark world. Queen seeks out specifically Noelle, which would track if the Knight she had spoken to mentioned her, or resembled her in some way. Additionally, Spamton having dialogue ripped from what I assume to be her implies that she has some kind of direct connection to the dark world by some means. Dess is also mentioned several times throughout the story, with a literal puzzle spelling out her name to calendar dates and search history regarding her disappearance. One thing to also note is ICE-E makes an appearance here as well. ICE-E is one of the only characters to have any kind of connection to Dess other than Noelle, Asriel, and Kris. Personally, I have a theory regarding ICE-E's involvement with her disappearance (they might have dragged her into the bunker aha), but it's kind of a stretch so I won't go too far in depth on that. The only thing bothering me about it is her being trapped in the code. That makes me confused, but I have another idea that I kind of like better? I think it's possible that Dess is a secret playable character in the game. I know, simple, but let me explain myself. All this talk about eggs and breaking the game makes me think that there's some way to break into the code itself at some point. Possibly through Cat Petterz, the weird route, the eggs, through the ice cave, another unforseen method, a combination of all of these, or something entirely new. Whatever way Toby comes up with, you'll be able to do it and find her. From what I can gather she'll play the role of a bard. The iconography she's associated with gives a very traditional bard vibe, a guitar being one of the most common avenues for people to make music. Additionally, she might have ties to the song of the sea, and it's possible that this is in direct correlation to her disappearance. It's also strange how if Kris is involved with her disappearance, then it's implied that their way of coping with that is to play music. Additionally, if you remember in Undertale, you play music on a piano to unlock a secret in waterfall. I almost wonder if the arrows you use in that song directly correlate to the puzzle that Noelle describes being in the ice cave. That holds less weight though, as it's kind of a reach. Music holds great significance in the Mother series as well. Giegue is ultimately defeated in Mother 1 using the Sing command. This tells me that Dess's music, possibly the song of the sea, could make a unique impact during the roaring. Especially if the Angel's Heaven described has anything to do with Noelle. Though the player is implied to be the Angel described in Undertale, so be sure keep that in mind as well. She could change the outcome of the prophecy itself, as it's perfectly possible that it doesn't account for a force that is ultimately outside of the code of the game, unable to affect much of anything under normal circumstances. And I think it's perfectly possible that there is a timeline in Deltarune where Dess is never found. It's kinda sad but makes sense, considering most players don't know of her existence. Her stats probably suck and she's very likely cursed like Susie describes analogically, but I think she's got something vital to determining the outcome of Deltarune's story. Though there is only one ending, perhaps she changes something important in that ending? We can't possibly know just yet, but I can't wait to see what that thing is exactly.
While I’m inclined to agree with this theory, I have something else to add to it. I personally believe that while Dess could be the Knight, she’s probably being controlled by somebody else. I personally think that the person behind everything is Gaster, and that Dess is being controlled like a puppet. Not only would this make for an emotional climax, but could also continue the theme of control, or the lack of control, but would also make a great parallel to Kris. Those are my thoughts on the theory.
Maybe there's a "player" behind Dess, forcing her go scr as the knight. Maybe the assumption that Noelle is the Angel is a red herring and the Angel is Dess... idk, but I'm excited to find out
I wonder if, because of all these theories on who the Knight might be with various different candidates, when the Knight's true identity is finally revealed in the game... will we end up being surprised? Or will we already have built up so many expectations out of all the characters that are possible candidates that no matter who it turns out to be, we're not really surprised? Or will it turn out to be someone completely new or someone unexpected, like Burgerpants? Or Temmie?! OR EGG?!?? Maybe we should just not make any expectations, maybe that would make the "surprise" more worth it? I don't know. Regardless, I am very excited for chapters 3-5 and will without hesitation say to Toby Fox "SHUT UP AND TAKE MY MONEY!" Metaphorically, of course. ;)
I just can't see Dess being dead because neither Noelle nor Rudy speak about her in a way that implies death. It'd be kinda messed up if Noelle said "you're lucky Dess isn't here" in that kinda context.
This is my theory, I think Dess is working under the Knight, and with this culminating at the end of chapter 5 revealing Dess is working under the knight. Also telling from the current theme of dark fountains, we can deduce that places with two or more rooms and or locked away to the player is most likely going to be where a dark fountains gonna happen, which means there’s a high chance that Noellle‘s house may be a dark fountain. Theory number 2 is that Noelle‘s mom is the roaring. This makes a lot of because The fact that Each dark fountain takes place in a location that Noelle spend a lot of time in. Also the queen symbolizing Noelle‘s mom and the way she idolizes the Roaring Knight make a lot of sense
I think Noelle's mom being the knight actually would be pretty sensible too, and would bring some juicy conflict for sure. It's another theory I can vibe with.
ok idea. what if the bunker that dess and kris entered was a dark world and dess got lost in it while kris made it out. this could be why kris has a save point in chapter 1 that the player saves over, and this also could explain why kris opened a fountain in chapter 3. after queen explained how fountains are made, maybe kris, feeling guilty about what happened to dess, decided to open one to try to find her. idk lol 😭
While Dess being The Knight is certainly a possibility, I think it would be interesting to see Asriel as The Knight. What if the internet was cut out on purpose, and Asriel didn’t want Kris communicating with him, so he wouldn’t interrupt. Maybe he wanted to protect Kris, and prevent him from seeing what he is involved with. Maybe he doesn’t know Kris is involved in the prophecy?
Dess cannot be a goner, she still exist in this world, or atleast is remembered, the goner kid describe "a universe where everything is the same, except you don't exist"
Here's the thing. Never is being a goner confirmed to be associated with being forgotten. Asgore took a long time to replace Gaster. We don't truly know what the nature of a "goner npc" is. Goner Kid's dialogue could just as easily be commentary on how you can only get their fun event in certain playthroughs and they otherwise never appear.
@@Dorked i don't think gaster is exactly a goner, he doesn't exist but he is incredible diferent compared to his followers, and we also have the fact that every goner is a resprite of some npc, with the only notable exception being gaster (unless some character is actually the "normal" gaster), and dess being featured in every game, instead of some fun events, would be considerabilly diferent from the goners, unless of course the diferent saves are the diferent fun events of this universe, but removing an important npc seens much more drastic them changing flavor text, but outside of that, i think you are right and goners probabilly weren't forgotten, just to irrelevant to be refered to in any other part of the game
Ok, so when a deer gets it’s antlers grown in, it sheds a kind of flesh off of them that causes it to be really bloody and gross. If Dess is the knight, that would be a really cool design choice
Wanted to get a video out on this after my first Dess video performed so well! It only felt right to do a followup. I do have a larger video w/ my Sweepstakes reactions on the way, but editing and captions are gonna take a bit. I plan on bringing more IF music here, too, but I just need to figure out how to schedule it between video essays. My Patreon: patreon.com/dorked
My Ko-Fi: ko-fi.com/invertedfate
More Analysis Content: th-cam.com/video/4VfHhBh1c8c/w-d-xo.html
More Deltarune Theories: th-cam.com/video/KueHgAZcV00/w-d-xo.html
Inverted Fate: invertedfate.com/chapters
Mother 3 Footage by Blazenton: th-cam.com/channels/srX3TzPUp05eruJvNrzMmA.html
Mayor Holiday Art by yBlookynho: www.reddit.com/r/Deltarune/comments/te718w/speaking_of_communion_kris_did_you_know_that_the/
Cyber City footage by RainyD
Nice! I really like your videos, because you correct misunderstandings that the fandom has about a lot of things, and your theories don’t really go off the deep end.
So, due to Asgore's failure, I guess you could the Mayor used him as the... Scape Goat...
Commenting for the algorithm 💖💖💖
I like how you say “In the Aftermath of the Spamton Sweepsstakes” like it was a nuclear fallout or something
I mean, Spamton ass alone might as well be nuclear fallout. xD
@@Dorked BUT IT SMELLS SO [[FRAGRANT]] AND [[DELICIOUS]] DONT YOU WANT TO JUST [[TRY IT]] [[@#!%]]?! !!!!!
Spamton ass :heart_emoji:
I love spamton he is like.. A guy!
Me and my partner watched it while clutching each other as if a major historical event playing out on the news. It may as well have been a nuclear event
@@Lucy-zv4xc goals
The idea that Kris might play the piano automatically as a means to pull themself out of a traumatic episode actually makes sense, given how embarrassed they seem to be when they realize they are being watched and how frequently they do so when at Noelle’s. Being Dess’s sister, it could be hard for them to look at her without seeing Dess, especially if they are unable to tell her what happened. Which makes it worse when we force them to play in Ch. 1&2 and they are unable to make cohesive music.
Yeah, that's kinda what I'm leaning to as well.
It also makes sense since the nurse says they used to play the piano at the hospital... it wasn't for the patients, but to soothe Kris's anxiety when visiting Rudy, perhaps.
If Dess turns out to be the knight I think it'd be cool if the sharp object she used to open up the fountains was one of her shedded antlers
Ooh, that WOULD be neat, actually. xD Really hardcore, too.
Walking around with one antler on her head (the One Antlered Angel), the other in her hand. Used as a weapon if we battle her too. That'd be badass! 😎
I think it could also be a guitar pic
@@ZaCloud-Animations___she-her only if the antler is ridiculously longer than the other antler
@@isthiscereallife Why would it have to be longer?
The more that we learn about Dess, the more confident I feel about the notion that she is the Knight. The way that her mystery has been woven into the main plot seems like the perfect set up for such a major reveal.
Yeah, I think that's one big benefit Dess!Knight has as a theory. There's a certain elegance to tying all these plot points together in a big, emotional punch of a reveal. While I'm also partial to Papyrus!Knight, I do think Dess would be more connected to our core Deltarune cast.
@@Dorked Yeah, agreed. And I feel as though the Weird Route may involve forcing Noelle to kill her own sister, which would fit with the Mother 3 parallel.
Also, as for how Dess disappeared, I think that she may have gone missing during a snowstorm. That would explain why Noelle stands in front of an open freezer at the grocery store lost in thought, as well as what the spell Snowgrave is based on and why she denies its existence.
Seeking refuge from the blizzard, Dess could have tried to hide inside of the shelter, only to end up… wherever the UNUSED text takes place. Perhaps the Titans are responsible for her being there, which might explain where the scratching is coming from.
The reason Asgore was fired by the Mayor could have been because he refused to go outside and look for her, and instead suggested to wait out the storm first. Thus, when it was revealed that Dess was nowhere to be found, he was deemed partially culpable and unfit for the job.
I personally think Alvin Boom is the knight, but I think Dess = Knight has a lot of merit too. It would be a good plot twist that isn’t overly anticipated. I hope Papyrus isn’t the knight though, Toby is trying to differentiate Deltarune from Undertale and I feel like adding undertale characters wouldn’t help a lot, we already have many interesting characters such as Kris, Susie and Noelle.
Not me about to replay the entire game so I can figure out if the knight uses he/him or they/them
@@G00dTaste The knight is actually refered to as "it" by Q.U.E.E.N.
This is not a theory, more something that I noticed. There's actually 3 cases of "lost siblings" in deltarune one way or another:
Dess - we have the clear example, she is the one that's literally lost.
Asriel - In a way he's lost from the picture, at being at college, if you think about it he also has disappear, even if we do know where he is, he still isn't here.
And the we have the meta example
Papyrus - He isn't in the game, he is the only Undertale character that's been messing (well he and Asriel).
It just feels like toby is doing a parallel with this 3 characters. Like how everyone seen like messing and remember Asriel, but people act like they don't wanna remember Dess? Or how there's some evidence or clues of maybe the three of them being, having or going into the dark world.
What does all of this mean? No clue! 🤸
But I think is something.
P.S: Sorry if I misspelled something, I'm not a English speaker
Very interesting ideas! :D They are indeed a trinity of "lost siblings", in their own ways. That's really intriguing, & something I'll keep in mind...
(Your spelling & grammar were mostly just fine, but it's "missing", not "messing."
Missing means something isn't where it should be.
Messing means making a mess, or error like "messing up".)
@@ZaCloud-Animations___she-her thank you!
really interesting observation
My theory has not changed as of yet: Dess isn't the Knight, and is trapped in the bunker. However, she might still be able to communicate in the Bunker somehow...there may have been a Dark World in the Bunker at some point, where Dess managed to contact somebody at last to help her...Spamton. No doubt the deal was helping him to get her out. But somehow, the connection was cut...using two pieces of info, the garbage noise and Onionsan's song, here's what I think happened: Someone closed the Bunker Fountain, causing Spamton to lose contact with her since you can't call anyone between worlds it seems. That's why Onionsan is only now hearing the song: it wasn't there for the longest time. This closing required Dess to find help in the Light World...and possibly managing to contact the Knight. (Could be anyone in Hometown, no candidate would be able to just ignore this...) kickstarting the events of the game.
Yeah, I think Bunker Theory is still a really valid angle! There's really so many ways to read into it, but I feel like the bunker has to be building to something big.
@@Dorked imagine if it was just a fakeout though
@@BrownKirbyEpic
"Alright, Kris. You, ready?"
* Yes
"Let's do this."
Susie and Kris open the bunker, to find literally nothing inside.
"Huh?"
"What the heck!? There's literally nothing here!!"
"You naive children... Can't you see?"
A dark, menacing shadow appears in the opening, blotting out the duo's only source of light.
"While you were busy meddling with this random, useless bunker, I was preparing my ultimate plan."
"Now, face the endless wrath of the Roaring Knight..."
"ICE E"
I think Queen is a metaphor for Noelle’s mother, I don’t think she’s a bad mother, just struggles to connect emotionally
I don't think she'd be straight up abusive because if there's anything that Toby Fox games does is show how people are complex and not caricatures. But it's kinda odd that Noelle is so afraid of her mom that she doesn't even want to bother her for the spare key to get inside the house. If Queen really is supposed to represent Noelle's mom then whether she intends to or not, I imagine she's being controlling in some fashion.
However Queen despite being that way also shows that seeing Noelle as a peon wasn't out of anything malicious, but because from her perspective, she wanted what was best for her.
It's rare for fiction to show how stuff like this can be multi faceted so I'm glad Toby is giving room for everyone to have depth.
I think Toby will make for a complicated take on the mayor, but there's still something with her not having a particularly healthy relationship with Noelle. Noelle is terrified of her and has been for a long time. Doesn't want to risk bothering her when she forgot her keys to the mansion in chapter 1. Plus the new info on the sweepstakes site.. it's a lil' concerning.
@@Dorked Whats the new info on her mother? I dont think i caught that one
@@bat2564 When Noelle got scared from the video game & was crying, she was trying to choke down her tears because she was afraid her Mom would come in & take the console away. Though, that can be interpreted either as a kind of punishment (losing access to her beloved games) for being 'weak' enough to cry over it... OR just a sort of "If this is so upsetting to you, I'll take it away to protect you from it." In which case, Noelle isn't so much afraid of her Mom, but just is determined not to lose her console, weighing her short-term fear against its long-term benefits.
there's a popular theory that queen is trying to play the part of every party member's mother to them (acting like toriel around kris, acting like c around noelle, etc) which raises some questions about ralsei
so i guess you could say that after her sister’s vanishing, Noelle was full of…
Dess-pair?
Vanishing...? more like..
dess-appearing
*slow clap*
Dess being the knight is something I've been thinking about for a while now. With the possibility of Noelle being/becoming the angel,I've thought the angels heaven is Dess trying to create the ideal world for her sister,either not knowing or not caring about the consequences that could come from opening too many dark fountains. Maybe she does know,and thats why we've only had one extra being opened at a time. I've also been thinking about how Spamton and Queen both tried helping Noelle in their own twisted ways and didn't actually take into account what Noelle actually wanted. It could be Dess is doing the same thing,or maybe since she is her sister she actually does know what Noelle wants. Another thought I've had is,If Dess actually is the knight and created the dark worlds,is it possible she made the cyber world specifically to help make Noelle more confident like we see happen because of Queen? I've also thought it could be possible she made the card kingdom world specifically to make Susie less of a bully because she knows of Noelle's crush on her. That part has tons of holes,though. This is a bit of a ramble,just wanted to get this all out there.
Yeah, there's definitely a compelling argument that the Cyber World specifically was made for Noelle's benefit, with how much emphasis there is on making Noelle "stronger". It really depends on how much the knight is aware of in terms of the individual dark world adventures, too, but since I lean towards the cyber world being made around the time Berdly and Noelle came to study, it feels really targeted at them (mostly Noelle).
Wait doesn’t the dark world reflect the will of it’s fountain? This makes great sense. Susie had lancer to guide her towards being nicer, noelle had queen to give her confidence, I wonder what next chapter will be?
About the “only had one extra being opened at a time” thing, why is it assumed that the roaring happens if 3 dark fountains are opened? If I haven’t missed something, surely it could be any number above 2, and the three fountains with three titans shown in the cutscene when ralsei explained the roaring is probably just a result of the rule of three.
@@ttracs Toriel has Error 403: Forbidden to make her not think of Asgore as a [[Pieces of Feces]].
@@TheYeetedMeat Yeah, the 3 is kind of just a guess, but it makes sense since Ralsei seemed CERTAIN that if Berdly made that 3rd fountain, that the Roaring would begin right then & there. Though of course, it could ALSO be simply from a dark fountain being opened right inside of the realm of another one. Thus calling to mind the Chair part of the $pamton's $weepstakes website, "But what if it could... get darker than dark?"
I'm honestly kind of surprised how likely Dess being locked in the bunker is, I thought it was a bit too out there at first. I do wonder why no investigations haven't been performed on the bunker unless Kris said nothing. Also I hope we get to see more of Dess like her former self instead of it only being her corrupted(?) self.
The nature of the bunker is so peculiar. How old is it, for one? If it predates the mayor and is inaccessible from outsiders, maybe that's why it still stands despite the mayor being the type who'd probably not want such an unknown variable...
Unless it benefits her, maybe.
One thing Im afraid of is that were gonna run in to Dess in a future Chapter, but Toby will have introduced something like "A Lightner who stays in a Dark World for too long will turn in to a Darkner, thus making a return to the Light World impossible." Probably not going to happen, but its something that I thought of while listening to findher.ogg a few months ago.
Oh, that would be really dark and really sad. Though I will say it's not unwarranted to consider, given Seam's talk of not wanting to be in the dark world at night.
That would make Ralsei making rooms for us pretty twisted as well...
@@Ammiteur9
i mean, its kinda sweet as well, him preparing for the worst.
after all , a place to live in a another world is great to have if you the living in your home becomes to risky, like if susie and kris get framed for crime by the knight.
@@chongwillson972 I thought it was sweet as well, I hope it actually isn't something twisted (I also don't think it's the case)
@@Ammiteur9 it could be more of a misguided attempt to be kind. Since the worlds seem to bring out feelings of nostalgia, and deal with entertainment (toys, internet, tv) and imaginative power fantasies (magic spells, heroes) it could be akin to a childhood fantasy that Ralsei might think is better for them. Their reality and their home lives being hard to deal w/. Staying in fantasy land could be ralsei’s way of giving them happiness and control over their lives, whereas irl they have to fight for control.
Imagine if if turns out that Rudy is the knight all along and he's in the hospital as a cover up lol
That would be such a huge plot twist. xD Then again, it is Toby. Who knows?
It's possible. But if he was faking his illness, wouldn't the nurse or doctor find out? It's easy for a medical professional to find out if someone is faking an illness after some tests after all. And he kinda has too many eyes on him to be sneaking out of the hospital without anyone noticing...
@@youraverageplutoenjoyer7677
he could just have an illness but nothing to severe.
and maybe the dark world has in some way given him some type of power in the light world as well , which would even make a severe illness less dangerous than it appears...
@@youraverageplutoenjoyer7677 maybe the hospital knows but doesn't tell anyone for some reason
@@Lividowly or maybe he has a thorn ring (since spamton did say there were 2) maybe when hes in the hospital he equips the thorn ring and hides to be able to use it as a front, and the doctors wouldn't know any better, so he hides it as a watch or something
The bunker theory was more or less the conclusion I came to after the Sweepstakes as well. I also have a theory that ties the bunker in with Kris and their weird situation with the player and their SOUL. Basically, Kris and Dess entered the bunker together, and both had some kind of encounter with Gaster (as evidenced by the slowed-down Entry 17 noises heard there). The encounter resulted in Dess becoming trapped in the code, and Kris having their SOUL taken by Gaster, who then experimented on it to make it into a connection point for the player. Kris's weird and creepy behavior prior to the game could be a symptom of their soullessness, and them freezing up and rushing to the piano when hanging out with Noelle, in addition to just remembering trauma (though that could also be part of it), could be them venting their frustration at being unable to emotionally connect to Noelle they way they could with their SOUL in place. The piano could be one of the few remaining sources of comfort for them, and perhaps Asriel is the only person they still feel comfortable talking with, as he might be the only one who knows what really happened.
Based on the similarities between Chara's speech patterns and those of the second speaker in Deltarune's opening in the Japanese translation, I believe that it was Kris (the Deltarune world's version of Chara) interrupting Gaster and putting their/the player's SOUL into their own body rather than the vessel you created. In the context of Kris being soulless for years before then thanks to Gaster, this would essentially be them going, "no, fuck you, that's my SOUL, you're not putting it in some random greyscale hodgepodge, give it back." And it's only once their SOUL is back in place that they're able to connect with people again, quickly befriending Susie and reconnecting with Noelle in the first two chapters. I believe that they put their SOUL back after taking it out not because they necessarily need it to survive, but because they absolutely do not want to go back to being unable to feel love again, even if it means letting the player puppet them around. I still give Kris at least a 50% chance of being the Knight, just due to the Occam's Razor logic of them being the only one to create a Fountain onscreen (as well as the clearly premeditated nature of said Fountain, and the general conspiratorial vibes I got between them and Ralsei regarding the Cyber World Fountain, though that's a whole other wildly speculative can of worms), and I agree with you that if they are the Knight, then their initial motivation was likely to study the Fountains as a means to find and save Dess, and/or get revenge on Gaster for what happened to both of them.
As for Dess being the Knight... While the Mother 3 connection is certainly intriguing, I find it hard to believe that Dess is both the Knight and the voice in the code, for the reasons you discussed in the video. And of those two, I find her being the voice in the code far more likely, just due to the fake 404 page giving off those kinds of vibes. Besides Kris, the only Knight candidates that really make sense to me are Father Alvin (due to Gerson's status as a renowned storyteller, the metaphorical links between Dark Worlds and fiction, and Alvin seemingly wanting Gerson to be proud of him), and Mrs. Holiday (mostly just due to the repetition of the arc word "cold" in relation to both her and the Roaring). But the brainwashed sibling villain reveal was certainly powerful when Mother 3 did it, and I can absolutely see Toby doing something cool with it too.
That was all a bunch of highly speculative rambling that will fall to pieces the moment the next chapter releases, but hopefully it made at least some kind of sense. If you took the time to read all this, Dorked, I wanted to take the time to congratulate you on successfully dragging me back into Undertale AU hell with the power of Inverted Fate's sheer quality. I read through the whole thing last week, and it's absolutely incredible. The delivery format on the website is genius; I probably wouldn't have been nearly as invested if the soundtrack wasn't dynamically integrated into the comic format. Kudos to you and everyone else who worked on it, and I can't wait for the conclusion!
Just wanna say thanks for the detailed comment! I'm really sleepy from pulling a late nighter on the video so I haven't been able to read it in full, but I appreciate the thoughtful response and kind words.
we haven't even met dess but shes already my favorite character.
There is at least some context to her personality, so totally fair
My headcannon voice for Spamton is that he talks and sounds like a used car salesman (80s maybe?) but when the text is in brackets the voice abruptly goes for a monotone robot voice and just as abruptly goes back to normal after the brackets, also the symbol swearing is just a censor bleep
Ooh, I can vibe with something like that. xD Makes sense to me.
ManlyBadassHero's interpretation is the backbone to this
jerma spamton 4 life
I fricking love this headcanon!
My idea is that he talks like an insane person but the brackets have him talking in the most suave, sweep-you-off-your-feet voice imaginable, and the change between the two is so abrupt that its impossible to get used to
Something unrelated to Dess, but I'm still wondering about the Ice-E box winking, I think you might had mentioned it in the Deltacast, it could easily be Noelle imagination but I wonder if it did indeed move.
Dess believed her sister, it wasn't like she was playing along or anything like that, she really believed her, because no one would go to a graveyard to bury a cardboard box.
Then again they are teens and they sometimes do dumb stuff like this.
But in any case, I want to bring it up because is a thing that happens when is really dark, objects seem to look like they are moving or that they take the shape of something else.
In real life is just a thing of the mind, playing tricks because you cannot tell what you are seeing, but in here I think it might be how Darkness might communicate with the Light World, because is in the dark where they take form, this is why they're an actual person in the Dark World, the darkness might be giving them life while the light is making them look like ordinary objects.
that is actually a really good theory. maybe they need a lot of darkness to fully manifest as a being. and, well, all im saying is "the shadows cutting deeper. photon readings negative." which would imply darker than dark coming from the fountains, which allows the objects to manifest.
@@Captain8771OnGithub Yeah, you are right, this darkness coming from the fountains is what gives them life and create their worlds, but their flaw is that only the ones that fit that world is able to stay there without turning into stone.
And only the Fountain of pure Darkness can keep them living without this issue.
Which leads to so many questions.
Like what makes a Dark fountain pure? Does it happens naturally?
Because the others so far has been people opening them.
@@janiradariasmorales7918 maybe its to do with a certain spooky scary skeleton from the void opening it? personally i think the grand fountain is in the void, and the closet is a portal there. altough anything's possible. its toby fox after all.
@@Captain8771OnGithub I'm not sure if Gaster is capable of opening fountains, yet, if he's still in the code, which he might be.
So far, if is the same character, he might be the man who gives us eggs and messing with the secrets bosses.
Though I starting to wonder if the one handing us eggs is Everyman, because we seen so much Easter eggs with this guy, way too much to be a coincidence.
It still could be Gaster of course, but I'm wondering if Everyman is gonna end up being really important in this story.
As for the Void, I while ago saw one of Dorked's videos that was about misconceptions in the fandom and the Void is one of them.
There's no Void, that's a thing the fandom had made.
So, I think the correct thing would be the code? because I think you can still find him there.
@@janiradariasmorales7918 ah dammit, i was fanon'd. everyman seems like an interesting theory though
The thought just occurred to me that perhaps Dess could have disappeared in the closing of a dark world. If she remained in a dark world during its closing, then she could possibly end up trapped within as an item in the light world, turning a Lightner into a Darkner. If this was the case, that would explain why Noelle knows how to use ice magic but doesn't understand basic combat, and why Kris is afraid of the Dark world in chapter 1 but continues to create Dark Fountains after this point to search for Dess.
Oh, that has terrifying implications. I'd love to see what would come of that.
Uhm... all lightners just re-appear in their old positions after a dark fountain closes. We see this in chp 1 and chp 2
Honestly I'm a big fan of the theory that Dess is the knight, or at least in some way connected to the knight. There so many interesting narrative and thematic possibilities at play.
Smth came into my mind is that Dess is the Angel,working as an equivalent to UT Asriel.
It really doesn't have any proof other than obvious connections to Noelle but I find it neat,specially combined with my favorite DR theory Knight-pyrus.
Ooh, that COULD be really interesting. A lot of people expect Noelle to be a manifestation of the Angel, but Dess did have a hand in the Angel doll, and it would make a fun subversion. Plus fallen angels are also a thing. Lots of ways this could go! (Also yes, Knightpyrus is also great. Really wanna tackle that at some point, too.)
I desperately need to see conversation between Papyrus-The-Knight and Asriel. In Undertale their strange relationship was kinda forgotten in community, but in Deltarune...
It's strange, how in WHOLE cast of significant characters of first game these two are "missing".
Can you imagine, If in this universe Asriel (or what is going on with Ralsei) will become Papyrus's eagle enemy.
@@chielobana1926 A headcanon I have is that every incarnation of Asriel is bound to become friends with Papyrus(he was friends with an Asriel unable to feel empathy afterall),so itd be neat if the last chapter was Kris and Asriel together for the first half and facing Papyrus,then they find out he wasn't actually evil,with the second half being a road to reach the Angel,with the teams either being Kris Susie and Ralsei(or Noelle who knows)or Kris(A human),Papyrus(A monster)and Asriel(And a prince from the dark).
Then again,just a headcanon.
I can’t wait for more deltarune chapters to be released! It seems that the more and more it goes on the better and even sadder it gets. I also really wanna know if we (the player) finally get our vessel instead of involuntary possessing Kris. I’m also glad that ever since Deltarune got released the Undertale fandom got less toxic which is a win-win for me since I love both deltarune and undertale deeply
Deltarune being as spread out as it is certainly gives a lot more time to ruminate on certain chapters, which is pretty cool. We'll be getting three chapters next time, so I wonder how that'll impact the theory space.
This may not be necessarily related to her disappearance in the long term, but I'm curious how much of the Sweepstakes' content was premade. Chapter 1 had plenty of explanations for its scenes and characters, but nothing like the almost room by room stories 2 has developed (such as Ice-E winking and the "sighting", all the cats and Cat Petterz, cars with legs and Cat Petterz... again). Was everything we saw part of the story from the beginning, or were some details added/affirmed after Spamton gained his popularity and provided more incentive to put thoughts in writing? Did traits like Kris's coolness or Dess's fierceness become emboldened only as a result?
I think a lot of it was at least alluded to, tbh. Noelle mentions Ice-E related pranks in chapter 1. Cat Petterz has been a thing since early on, plus even Blood Crushers gets a mention at the end of chapter 2. xD Toby has had this game in development for a long time. But I do think the sweepstakes itself took form after Spamton's popularity.
I agree with @Dorked. The game has been in development for a long time. I think at least most of the relevant lore information was already there, they just found an different way to use it in the Sweepstakes.
@@bpsara I think there's at least something that wouldn't have happened without the Sweepstakes. Most of Dess's character, sure, but I wouldn't be surprised if some of the Cat Petterz stories or Kris's "gamer reaction" scene would've been left unsaid/undeveloped.
NICE.
Dess being the Knight is an interesting theory, and one that I haven't really considered before...
I'm not sure how i feel about the theory, but it would certainly explain a lot.
No matter what, this was an amazing video.
Yeah, I'm not 100% married to the idea either, but I think the narrative potential is really interesting, and worth consideration. It would also make the Kris red herring (if they are one) SUPER intriguing.
@@Dorked Yeah.
I do believe that Kris has some past trauma related to the dark fountains though...
what about dess being kidnapped by the night?
Dess as a character in Deltarune is hard to pinpoint. I for sure feel like she will be an integral part to Noelle's future character arc, regardless of Snowgrave or not. But most of the information we find about Dess is outside the game itself. Like the loose text strings in the game files or the pages on Spamton Sweepstakes. That makes me wonder what we will come to find out about Dess in game when the time comes. For the most part there's some scattered info about her from Noelle and Rudy, but not much more. There is also the possibility of the strange Spamton dialogue in his shop of "... can anyone hear me? Help..." being from Dess. It seems REALLY spontaneous and out of character even for Spamton to just blurt that out. But that does open up to the possibility of Dess being able to take control over some of the darkeners. Even when not being present in their Darkworld. Could that mean something similar with Gaster happened to Dess where she's scattered across time and space, but only for the darkworlds? Where pieces of her suddenly make contact with a Darkworld and she's able to puppet a darkner, even for a small moment.
I'll sure say, there is a lot you could speculate about Dess, and I'll be looking forward to what Toby has in store.
Yeah, she's so fascinating because we know just enough about her and yet she's oddly... absent. And it's only Noelle and Rudy who mention her. Plus all the funky meta stuff. She could be very similar to what Gaster was in UT, just more up front.
ive been speculating pretty much the same. dess and gaster almost seem to exist in a space outside of the games at the moment, which i suspect will tie back into how we the players are also entities that exist outside of the game.
ive also been theorizing that the [redacted] figure from the unused undertale room 272 might actually be dess. that room is connected to the soundtest room which is where we hear gaster's theme which is what led many people to consider the figure as a possible gaster candidate, but it doesnt make much sense that the mysteryman sprite and redacted would both be gaster
This is super interesting, raised some curious points. Awesome job Dorked! Can’t wait to see how these theories turn out, and Inverted Fate as well!
Thank you very much! Dess is just such a fascinating mystery, and mysteries are fun to spitball ideas about. xD I feel like she's the "Gaster" of Deltarune in that respect.
Personally I stuck with Mayor Holiday being the Knight, opening Dark Worlds to search for her missing daughter, with Dess being trapped in a Dark World. But Dess Knight is also a really cool theory, especially with Noelle as the Angel in mind! Anyway, I really liked this one, and look forward to that Terra analysis (people often just boil him down to "naive hunk who serves as the main antagonist's vessel who would trust absolutely anyone, but there's more to him).
Yeah, god. Terra deserves so much better. I do hope to bring some light to the greater nuances of his character, at least!
Yet another Dorked theory video banger
Soup was here.
Howdy, Soup! :) Thanks for the support and the kind words.
my theory has been that Asriel, Noelle, Dess, & Kris went out to explore & then Noelle & Asriel bailed bc they were scared. but Dess & Kris went on. they went inside, & smth took Dess & trapped her in the code of their reality. Kris knows what's in there & they can't even say what they saw. Asgore fails to find Dess & so the Mayor kicks him off the force. Toriel & Asgore were already tense before that, but getting kicked off the force & this whole investigation going terribly rly tipped it & they got divorced. years have gone by & Kris still hasn't said anything. i personally think that Kris definitely knows way more about what's happening to them & it's obvious they have their own motives.
Yeah, I think that's a pretty logical assumption of the events. I'd be surprised if that's not the direction things go.
@@Dorked it lines up pretty well & gives a pretty clear picture as to how gloomy Kris' life was prior to the events of the game beginning. it shows that Kris is more than just lonely. it's a lot heavier than that. it kinda do rly hope it goes this way just bc i think it ties most of the main mysteries together
There are a lot of potential "strings" tying a lot of characters together...
The person lost in the "strings" of code.
Gaster, or us, pulling the strings on events/characters to control them.
Spamton's puppet parallel of making the phones ring by being an obedient puppet, letting the strings pull his actions.
If you try to equip the Puppet Scarf to Noelle, she says it feels like guitar strings, & if you take her to Spamton's closed shop, she starts off nervous, but then smiles & says it feels nostalgic.
Dess is associated with a guitar, & the "FindHer" music piece. & how do you play guitar? You pull the strings & make them ring. :O
I'm wondering if one of the most complete endings will involve a musical medley. With Kris playing the piano, Dess playing guitar, Asriel adding vocals (since Father Alvin says that he was a major singer in choir), & maybe Onion-san singing the Old Song From the Sea (which may or may not layer with, or even be, "Dont' Forget"). I wonder if we'll discover other characters' instruments along the way...
(And as a bonus, maybe The Original Starwalker will ring a bell, because it keeps away the birds that are pissing him off. ;3 And Queen will play her mixtape, & Lancer will play "Splat" noises, LOL!)
((Man, now I'm wondering if Toby's big reveal of something will be combining parts of all different pieces of music in each chapter into one big piece. I wouldn't put it past him~!))
for the runaway theory, i feel like mrs holiday wasn’t as cold as she seems now until recently. perhaps she was strict before, but not cruel, but the stress caused by her political position plus having a missing daughter and an ill husband drove her to becoming more grouchy and unsociable, perhaps burying herself in her work to avoid having to confront her inner turmoil. if queen is a reflection of mrs holiday, then that would line up, since sweet cap’n cakes tell us that though queen wasn’t an amazing leader, before the knight showed up she wasn’t a tyrant at all
Nice video! I personally don't think that Dess is The Knight (I'm WAAAAY to dedicated to the idea of it being Alvin lol) but it's definitely made me reconsider her role in the story, which I didn't think too much of before beyond simply being a posthumous character
Yeah, Alvin Knight is another really interesting angle! There's been some really compelling arguments for it, and I think he's absolutely still worth considering.
@@Dorked like, fun evidence you might not know, his sprite fits the exact dimensions of the closet many people theorise the knight hid in to make the cyber fountain to the pixel. the only real thing he's missing is a strong emotional throughline with the cast, which can easily be set up in a church scene that seems to be being built up
Here is my personal theory on the textboxes and Asgore being fired.
So, this is more about Ralsei because I've been trying to figure him out for a while especially with all the little details in chapter 2, and this is just my theory
Ralsei was a young kid (also human), probably around 6-7 and was obsessed with the idea of new worlds and adventures. So he went to the police station after school to see what he could do. Then Asgore told him the prophecy, thinking of it as a joke and it wouldn't work. Ralsei got so excited he could barley sleep that night. The next day after school he went into the closet and made the first fountain, sending him to the castle town. He thought it was a bit lonley so he brought some of his favorite toys and games. His parents asked what he was doing so Ralsei brought them with him to show them what he had made. His parents thought it would just be a fun game of pretend but then they all jumped into castle town and everything came to life and Ralsei was SO HAPPY. Then, the roaring came. Ralsei didn't know about it. He hid in the castle, but when it was over....he had lost everything....His parents...his only friends....
And most importantly, he slowly started to lose his human form.
After that he isolated himself in the castle for years until Kris and Susie came along. Then he realized, the prophecy was true.
(I know there are a few gaps but please leave any questions! Id be more than happy to answer them!)
Good to see someone talking about Dess! I feel like that's a mystery a lot of people don't talk about for someone so important. I feel like what happened to Dess involved a Dark World in the Bunker. If I remember correctly, Dess said she'd take Noelle to a place like the Dark World, which could imply knowledge of the Dark World. Dess being the Knight is also an interesting theory, though I don't think she's the Knight herself but I think she is connected to the Knight.
Big omori spoiler
4:03 the song that kris plays on the piano is very similar to omori ost 159-remina
Which plays during the truth sequence of omori.
This has some worrying implications.
Toby did mention once that coincidentally, a recent indie game had some similar plot points to what he has planned for Deltarune. I, like many others, have a feeling that game was Omori. (Before anyone says anything, Omori was in development long before Toby even started work on Deltarune and Undertale. While Toby did Collab with Omocat with the "Merry CD" in the game, Toby had zero input on the game's development. And also, Omocat, as far as I'm aware, isn't working on Deltarune with Toby so she couldn't have known what Toby has planned for the game. And Toby already has Deltarune's story fully planned out since even before Omori released.) With all that being said, the more I look into everything we know about Dess so far, the more and more I think of Omori. (If anyone reading this has not played Omori yet, please stop reading this because like the op's comment, this is huge spoilers for the game.)
Dess being Noelle's big sister, Her going "missing", Kris being Noelle's childhood friend whom hasn't really communicated much with her in a long time outside of school or maybe small talk, Also Kris having some sort of involvement in Dess disappearing and trauma to boot, Dess having used to play the guitar, Kris having played the *_piano..._* It's not one to one, of course. But we can't deny the similarities. I just hope the bunker didn't have stairs...
Oh, I thought I was the only one who had thought about the possibility of Mayor Holiday being the knight xD.
Tbh, I'm inclined to think Dess won't have an antagonistic role, instead i think Noelle will join the gang in future chapters and together they'll have to rescue her sister, revealing bits and pieces of Kris's backstory at the bunker in the process.
That's an entirely plausible angle, too, that I think is pretty valid, especially if Dess is trapped in the dark worlds/the code/etc.
I think the person in the files is more likely to be The Vessel more than anything and seek's cool deltarune mod only convinced me further lol. I can see either Dess or the Mayor as The Knight.
Huh. vessel is interesting in that respect. It's so hard to really know what the Vessel's deal is at this time. I imagine it'll come back later, but HMM...
Just finished looking through the Spamton Sweepstakes last week and finally got to look at that sweet sweet Dess lore. (btw Omori spoilers in this)
I definitely think Kris playing the piano is a trauma response, and I like the idea that Kris and Dess were the only ones brave enough to enter the bunker, and/or just go explore somewhere that Asriel and Noelle didn't, and what they saw led to Dess's disappearance and Kris closing themself off. That leads into a theory I like that something about this traumatic experience led Kris to be connected to Gaster or evenly willingly seek him out which resulted in the play connecting to them.
And yeah Dess definitely didn't run away, in fact I find it very likely Carol/Mayor Holiday was a fine mother that is just heavily suffering from the disappearance of her child and becoming an extreme helicopter parent over her remaining one so she never has the same fate. It's sad and an unhealthy response, but understandable. It makes me think of how- *and I'm going to preface this section with HEAVY Omori spoilers-* Sunny's mother acted after Mari's death, letting Sunny stay inside despite knowing it's not good for him because she's afraid of losing him.
While on the topic of Omori, I find it funny how directly the instrument connections mirror Omori's. While the protagonist played violin, the missing older sister of the friend group played piano. Meanwhile in Deltarune, the protagonist plays piano, and the missing older sister of the friend group plays guitar, another string instrument. Also the whole idea of Dess being the knight is thematically fitting too. Just like how it's revealed that the mysterious antagonistic entity of 'Something' is just Sunny's traumatic interpretation of Mari, a puppeted Dess could be more literally an antagonist that's hard to face down because of Kris's trauma. I too am a sucker for the confusing bit of mystery in a story suddenly being connected in one thread in the end, something which Omori does well and I hope Deltarune pulls off too. We never really realized how right Toby was when he made that tweet years ago that Omori would be very similar to Deltarune huh?
And speaking of I _love_ the idea of a goner Dess being the knight, that's such an awesome theory and definitely connects to Mother 3 well (yes I spoiled myself on Mother 3 watching this video but idc lol).
7:55 P.S. love the art of Mayor Holiday as the knight, and that she has a face similar to Noelle's but the mask resembles Gyftrot.
Reminds me of a Ch3 video someone made with Kris being chased down by a Knight in Undyne's Undertale armor in the Dark World, only for the mask to be lifted up to reveal a confused Napstablook who just ended up there lol.
I've had a Theory that includes this idea ever since ch2 came out and I've been polishing it ever since. The sweepstakes only renforced my Idea.
It's not exactly about Dess or Doctor W. D Gaster, it's like... A global theory that Links important stuff together and propose an explanation that doesn't just boils down to "it's Gaster !" I like to call it The Bunker Incident Theory.
I genuenly think this theory has the potential to become one of the most relevant theories out there, or inspire people to make their own theories about it...
Alas, as a non-english person I have nowhere to post it, I don't even know where I should post it in fact, and non english Deltarune yt videos are so niche there's no point in doing so...
When I see guys like you who are only just now starting to realize what's going on, i'm enraged because Reading my theory might have allowed you to figure it out sooner and/or have an Epiphany and solve the entire lore who knows ? It's so frustrating....
Tbh the bunker being a dark world and Dess going missing there feels so- perfect
It's woven perfectly into the story and also ties the darkworld as something Kris has already experienced and maybe hasn't connected the dots on yet, since they perhaps repressed many memories if it was that traumatic.
I personally love the bunker dark world theory and will be kind of disappointed if it's not the case- since other Dess theories are usually less interesting and disconnected from the main story. Her being missing in a DARK WORLD would be such a perfect tie in as to why the police force failed to find her, why the bunker is locked, Kris' traumatic experience there, and Asgore being fired
As for the text strings, i think an easy way for the text strings to be both dess, and for dess to be the knight, is to say the text strings arnt happening concurrently with the story, they're just an echo of what already transpired, perhaps the text is even her origin story so to speak.
I mean think about it, she would have to been missing for years at this point, and only now she's asking for help? What the hell was she doing before then? Sleeping?
Yeah, I could see the strings being retrospective, like maybe it's a message that's been severely delayed and it's only reaching its destination in the present.
I know this video is a year old, but i feel like dress is in a dark world, but she is not being in any way controlled, so she actually wants to stay there
i wrote a mother 3 related comment under your video related to noelle's mother literally this morning and now i see it here. ik the video was made 8 months ago but still, it's amazing that you got that vibe too
Your videos never disappoint!
Also, Dess is a freaking awesome older sister. I can totally imagine her beating the crap out of Kris after they scare Noelle.
Dess has what seems to be a really fiery personality, which makes for a fun contrast with the ice themes the family has. Dec-EMBER, haha.
I literally had the same idea a long time ago to make a video on how Dess is the knight because of the similarities from mother 3 like how Claus went missing just like Dess and so on, but I guess you beat me to it lol
also heres something I realised, in mother 3 your goal is to pull needles, in deltarune your goal is to seal fountains, there are seven needles in mother 3, there are seven chapters in deltarune, which probably means seven fountains to seal
Yeah, unless Toby pulls a twist and we have fewer or more dark fountains than expected, I kinda figure that's how it might go.
I don't buy the "trap within the code". Deltarune seems to have a world more like ours so i think the quotes in the code are more for story telling than literal. I could be wrong.
Anyway the Dess Knight theory ties up a lot of things together, and knowing Toby's love for Mother 3, i can definitely see it. But there is still a lot that isn't connected. Papyrus, Gerson, Ice-e, Gaster. Right now we don't have much but everything seems to be significant.
Anyway intresting video! As a fan of KH i'm eager to see your Terra analysis. And i hope you'll do more KH in the future as Well!
The thing is, Deltarune still does have some weird meta vibes. For instance, the file select menu in its default state has a bunch of weird, cryptic Gaster dialogue (Mystic Slime recently did a video going into some detail on this). I do think it's less explicit, but the player, at least, is still an active part of the story what with the whole player vs protagonist angle with Kris.
Yeah. But Gaster and the player feels like more out of this world. Even Gaster dialogue about the save files is weird. He treat as some sort of experiment as if he could duplicate worlds. Though i won't say there isn't meta elements.
I think the biggest difference between Deltarune and Undertale right now is that we know for sure Undertale world's operate like a video game. When Deltarune seems to not be the case. Except in rare instances. We'll see. The stuck into the code theory is plausible.
nothing gets me more excited than waking up and having a deltarune-related video in my sub box
time to get 9 minutes worth of snacks
I love the idea that Dess or the Mayor is the knight, surprised i haven't come across either of those theories before. In terms of the unused text strings, I've always presumed they were Dess's reactions from the past, someone who has just been trapped in the dark world and reacting to it. There'd be plenty of reasons why this wouldn't be the case (it updating for chapter 2 does imply some sense of it being current), but fuck it, dess is now my favourite candidate for the knight. I'd love the switch of how the unused text portrays her as "lost, scared, and confused" to have her then be pulling the strings in all of the dark worlds. getting zapped to a new world and then becoming its overlord, hell yeah. you go start that roaring girl.
(a couple of "stream-of-consciousness" thoughts coming from this:
1. with a lot of theories connecting the knight and Gaster for reasons I currently forget, if Dess disappeared into the bunker, that'd likely satisfy the presumed connection due to how gastery that area is. real gaster vibes, that bunker has.
2. one thing that would have to be determined if this theory was true would be why is dess attempting to cause a roaring? is she a villain or just an antagonist? is her motives good & ralsei is lying to everyone about the destructive forces (or even of the existence of the roaring)? would dess be being misled, or has her time in the darkness made her want to cause the roaring?)
anyways, hope 𝓽𝓱𝓮 𝓪𝓵𝓰𝓸𝓻𝓲𝓽𝓱𝓶 is satisfied with my interaction with the video, lmao. time to go find a solid 5 hour block of time to finally go watch the deltacast
Hope you enjoy the bite-sized video! :) And the snacks, of course.
@@Dorked Both were equally fantastic, thank you! 😁
All I'm gonna say is that we better not find her in a dark world.
Susie herself told us that eating (and probably drinking) literally don't matter and prolonging your stay longer than three days just sounds like a death sentence.
Not to mention that being a dusty corpse or just a corpse probably doesn't stop them from becoming a darkner due to the rule of inanimate things being powered back up by a dark fountain.
The other thing, too, is like... Seam implies bad things about being in the dark world at night. So yeah, her being trapped has worrying implications.
Something just occurred to me that I haven't seen anyone freaking out about, but now I am. I was reading through the comments on this video when someone mentioned Seam warning about being in dark world at night; the quote I could find is: "You don't want to get caught when the sun goes down..."
And Kris just opened a dark fountain at night.
I wonder if the reason most of the future chapter images Toby showed off are from chapter 4 instead of chapter 3 is because something harrowing goes on in chapter three in-between or unexpectedly after the movie/tv show shenanigans with the weather people and shadow men.
It's so hard to tell right now, because we have so little info. Toby said Chapter 3 would be funny, but that doesn't rule out something darker.
As someone who is a massive Mother 3 fan, I gotta say this theory was a wonderful surprise. I think I even see some parallels with Lucas and Kris specifically. Both are the younger sibling of their respective games, Both are for the majority of the time silent protagonists, Both are clearly dealing with stress in the lives. Yeah, I really like this theory! Can’t wait to see more videos! :D.
Thanks for the kind words! I really do wanna play mother 3 soon but I'm still on the first game xD
love the use of nightmare knight's theme in this. im a die hard cucumber quest fan. adore the fan music toby made way back then
Just came across this, thanks so much for using my mother 3 content and crediting me for it 🙏
It's really important to me to give credit whenever I use others' clips. Recording game footage is really time consuming!
@@Dorked lol I didn’t expect you to respond, idk why but seeing someone with nearly 30k subs use my content is astonishing, (it’s my birthday and that made my day)
I have a pet theory in my head that the song "Don't forget" will later be sung by a male singer [Gaster, Asriel, Ralsie, Asgore, Rudy, Father alvin, ect] somewhere in chapters 3-5, and eventually it will be sung as a duet between the male and female singers. This could symbolize the parental assurance of Toriel and Asgore to Kris, or the lost love between Dess and Asriel, or some other "greater than the some of its parts" revelation in the story.
I partially get the idea from elsewhere in gaming [Spoilers ahead]. Bastion's "Setting sail, coming home" re-contextualizes 2 separate songs as part of a single duet between a mother and son. In "Want to be free" by sea power, which is featured in an altered way in the game "Disco Elysium", what first appears to be a solo is actually a duet with a female voice if you listen closely enough and you hear the female vocals isolated in a boat ride to the game's final area, and the motif is meant to symbolize the main character's lingering memories of his ex-wife. [Spoilers end]
I also think the don't forget motif will appear in the final battle theme/sequence.
I REALLY gotta play Bastion. I have it on Steam. It's just... big game backlog. xD I do think a "full" version of Don't Forget will come into play later, though, and have plot relevance!
Neat analysis video! Was very interesting! The support for the mayor as The Knight seems fairly persuasive. Dess being The Knight seems to be a little more up in the air, but in a narrative structure way, it could make sense!
Thanks so much for uploading this!
Yeah, I think either Holiday has a compelling case to make and is a bit more central to the core cast than Alvin or Papyrus, even if I can dig those theories too.
I'm not sure Dess would be the knight, I mean if she was walking around the town you'd think it would be a pretty big deal right, like somebody would notice? I mean MAYBE nobody would have noticed her, but given that the cyberworld fountain was opened during the day I think it would be very hard for Dess to avoid being seen.
Though it is an interesting possibility, and I wouldn't be too surprised if it ended up being true.
I think it depends on how stealthy the knight is, too. I think with any candidate it raises a lot of questions about how they aren't being seen. At least with someone like Alvin or the Mayor, stuff like Cyber World would be less suspicious, tho.
i love the idea of Gaster and Dess just chilling at the bottom of the bunker playing buck bumble all day
I believe that Rudy is a knight, his family has too many connections to the machinations of the Dark World for no real good reason, and there are some hints that he can be cured with the help of the Dark World. In the neutral ending, when Birdley broke his wing, it was left broken in the World of Light. So it's entirely possible that Rudy got sick in the Dark World and is unable to be cured unless he figures how to do it in the Dark World. Dess missing is also a good motivation for him to open up the Dark Worlds. The only problems are 1. He probably would not want to hurt Noelle by sending her to an unown world. Well the Queen actually wanted to protect Noelle the entire time, maybe Rudy was aware of this fact and didnt give a shit about anybody else getting hurt. Also it's entirely possible that it was all a coincidence and he got children in there by accident. But hey, this won't be the first time Toby Fox has made up a story about someone's father doing something irresponsible to little kids. 2. He can't leave the hospital in his condition. Well, probably not. We should ask... his Doctor.
Rudy would be quite the twist. I guess it depends on the severity of his illness
Definitely one of the more convincing knight theories out there, it would be a really neat way of tying up all the loose threads and mysteries the game has presented.
Thanks! It's definitely one I think has a lot of emotional potential and would have a simple elegance. As much as I love Knight Papyrus, I think the personal connection to Dess would really up the emotional stakes.
Great video as usual, and can’t wait for the Spamton Sweepstakes retrospective!
Is so excited to learn more about Dess in the future 😳
I wonder if mystery of her disappear will affect our perceptions of Lore.
I mean, it would be extremely unexpected and cool, if Dess has NOTHING to do with Gaster's secrets, and she is a part of something different.
...I just need River Person to be connected to Deltarune from the very beginning.
I think it'd be a bit odd if there was no connection simply because I like when things are a bit more elegant in their connections and it'd keep a tight focus, but it's entirely possible! There's just a lot of weirdness going on with her, and all the strands of info we have are quite perplexing.
Dess most likely is dead and their is a good chance that they never were able to cover the body so she was mark as MIA
This is also would explain why we never see a grave for her, but I believe that her mother is in denial of the lost of her own child. Because she is the mayor of the town, she most likely order people not to make a grave for Dess. This also explains why Noelle and her mother relationship is quite shaking, due to the fact Noelle might look quite similar to Dess, so every time Noelle mother would see Noelle she would see a part of Dess which then brings back all the terrible memories she has been trying to forget. Usually a person who is tending to forget about a bad experience would focus on working on something in this case, we see that Noelle mother is always busy but in reality she only keeps busy so those bad memories don't return. Kinda sad if this true.
Also this post is before watching the video.
I personally don't think she's dead just because the way they talk about her in the game feels so contrary to that. Noelle wouldn't joke about Kris being lucky Dess isn't there if she was dead-dead (granted, denial), plus the error page to me evokes something more mysterious and meta. xD
@@Dorkedhmm true, well in reality we won't know the truth until the game drops but that probably be another year or so. It's always interesting to see what kind of theories pop up with this series
Knight Dess is a theory I've wholeheartedly believed in for a little bit now. I can't wait for Toby to make me cry over 13 year olds again like Mother 3 did!
Haha. I'm so excited for whatever emotional rollercoaster ride Toby has in store. It will be quite juicy...
Excited to see what you say about Skies Forever Blue. If you haven't heard about it yet, go watch it. It might give you some insight or ideas.
Can’t wait for Spamton Sweepstakes 2: Jevil Jiveaway
While Dess as the Knight is interesting, I'm not too sure. It's heavily implied that the Knight is someone opening fountains from the light world, and for it to be Dess it'd imply she's been walking around town without anyone noticing. (I know you can open fountains from INSIDE a Dark World, but it doesn't seem to be accesible to Lightners or foreign darkners until there's a fountain there)
Yeah, she'd have to be stealthy about it. That is one edge the Mayor has, being the one in charge.
I have my own headcanon of how these theories COULD work.
I’m not trying to be cleaver/ original. I honestly just want it to make sense.
1. We don’t know how long dark world doors have existed in hometown. If they have been around for years is it possible kris and Susie were not the ones to discover them first?
2. I would like to know if asrial and Dess discovered any dark fountains when Noelle and kris were Little. If true then asrial and Dess could have been DELTA WARRIORS fighting against their own angels heaven years ago. Given how popular asrial is I like to imagine bratty, catty and pizza pants had opportunities to join the the duo in some adventures.
It would make GREAT fan fiction if this was true. I call this theory GEN DELTA theory.
3. How this concludes loops back into the Dess is the Knight theory. As a result of playing heroes or due to being careless with other worldly magic. Dess and asrial were separated from each other. Asrial returned to the light world and lost the ability to return to the dark. Dess for unknown reasons became trapped in the dark world with no way to return.
4. Here the story picks up on what we know. Asrial never reviled the truth about what happened ( a sort of dark parallel to flowey hiding the power of determination in undertale) Asgore fails to find Dess and gets fired by Dess’s mother mayor holiday. Noelle becomes heartbroken and she and kris don’t connect as kids anymore. And life goes on.
5. Next I want to spitball some possible conclusion theories on my personal GEN DELTA theory. Asrial became desperate to get his friend (possibly girlfriend) back so left for university, maybe to study the nature of dark worlds in a academic fashion. If the core of undertale was never made in this world it would be thematically accurate for the professor of asrial university to be W.D.Gaster that would study science and physics legitimately.
6. Dess on the other hand is a complete mystery. Weather due to madness, loneliness or prolonged exposure to dark world environments. She also is constantly studying her prison and learning its secrets. She takes on the identity of THE KNIGHT and with the goal of bridging the dark and light worlds opens more fountains. By enlisting king she bought time to open more fountains until three medaling brats Ruined her plans.
7. Finally once asrial triumphantly returns he will enlist his old crew bratty, catty and pizzapants. Dive back into their childhood bonding experience assist the current DELTA WARRIORS and save Dess from the darkness.
Don’t forget … I’m with you in the dark…🎶
Feel free to make this into a fanfic anyone who’s reading. I’m too lazy. Thank you I’m spent.
idk if you've spoken on this yet but id rlly love to see a video of you discussing your thoughts on the "papyrus is the knight" theory!! :] /nf
Ok, I paused the video, so I don't know what you're about to say, but in generally I really like the Dess is the knight theory. I find it very interesting how years of absense, potentially being lost in a dark world, could've affected her, and how Noelle would react and act through all of this.
I also like it because Noelle, Kris, Ralsei, Susie and Dess seem to be the most important characters in Deltarune and this way, everyone has a significant role to the main story of restoring balance between light and dark.
Yeah, I absolutely agree that Dess Knight would be super poignant in the character drama, the connections to other plot mysteries, and fitting in with the current setup of the main cast.
@@Dorked I finished the video now, you did a great job, this will definetly join my playlist of theorys I listen to when I'm drawing.
I wanted to say something about the Text in the code.
If we say that Dess got lost in the bunker or/and a dark world
It could be that the text is from the past when Dess just recently got lost in there or a few days after, and we're just now able to see it.
That way Dess could be the knight, while the text being still from her.
But this counts only for the scrapped text in the code and not for the text Spamton says, if we assume that was Dess/the person lost in the code as well. (I forgot if you theorized that, I'm sorry). Also since we seemingly get new text with each chapter, this could also be an argument against that.
Also I forgot to say, Dess being the knight gives both Dess and Noelle a more active role in the game instead of them just happily reuniting or something like that, and I'd love to see that.
Funny how you mention Mother 3, I also think that deltarune has many M3 inspired things in it, which is also why I personally think we're getting a chapter that's very similar to the sunflower chapter.
I wanna play the game properly so bad, but I'm also stubborn and trying to go through the series chronologically. Mother 1... sure is a game!
@@Dorked I can imagine that... I constantly get stuck in Earthbound.
(mother 3 spoilers)
the roaring could also be inspired by the dark dragon, where if all seven needles were pulled by a source of evil, the dragon would emerge from the earth and wipe out all life on earth. sound familiar?
Yeah! I think that's entirely possible, too. :O That's part of why I'm like "hmmmm, there's gotta be some Mother 3 inspiration in here."
Honestly after this video I am more inclined to believe that Dess might be a roaring knight. It'd be really interesting for the plot and the whole game in general. She's definitely one of the most likely candidates. I think she's alive as well and we'll find her later in the game. Either as a knight or in other circumstances. The mayor being a knight is intriguing and possible too. Also very interesting mother 3 connection. I've played this game several times now, but the parallel with Noelle and Dess to Lucas and Claus has never crossed my mind.
My personal hc is that she got trapped in the bunker, became Gaster’s reluctant apprentice, and did his bidding.
That's an interesting possibility, too. :O I can see it.
I wonder If this is why kris had a save file in the dark world, Of course it wouldn't be the same dark world but they also have a save in chapter two, HalfbreadChao's theory as to how this happened is that kris can save in the light world, maybe when kris and Dess entered the bunker, (if they ever did anyway) Dess wasn't able to make it out of the dark world, or somehow got stuck there when the fountain sealed, maybe she turned into an object in the light world, (that's clearly far fetched) But if kris sealed the dark world with Dess in it what happens, do they just wake up? But anyway I think that's why Kris wants to open the dark fountain.
Anyway, that's just my two cents.
Hehehe, these Deltarune Videos, just makes me anticipate the Next Update even more, do we have any idea of when we should expect the Next Chapters?
This is a cool video with things i havent though about good job
5:03
Just wanted to say: OMORI
Yeah, there's apparently a lot of unintentional similarities to Omori, according to a vague Toby tweet. xD
@@Dorked th-cam.com/video/njgcjGojRKk/w-d-xo.html WELL !!!! OMORI / OMOCAT + TOBY FOX COLLABED ON THIS AAAAA IM SO EXCITED :D
8:45 knowing Toby I wouldn't be surprised if he made Dess into the Jeff of the party.
i think dess is the [redeacted] figure in the unused undertale room 272. it matches with the unused dialog of someone asking for help from a dark place where no one can hear them as the words of the figure are hidden from us not only by being written in lowercase wingdings but also by being quite literally redacted.
whats more is that exiting to the south of room 272 leads you to the sound test room where the infamous gaster's theme can be found, which ends with the words "thanks for your feedback, be seeing you soon!" and brings to mind the fact that deltarune was labeled as a "survey program" when it was initially released. the figure in 272 also kind of looks like it has an antler on its head
If she is the redacted figure, it's probably not Deltarune Dess, since Dess is confirmed to be fine in Undertale in both the casino dialogue and Asgore alarm clock dialogue on the official Undertale website. Sans mentions "the antlered girl and her sister" and Asgore mentions both of Rudy's daughters growing up on the surface.
@@Dorked i think something similar to what happened to gaster happened to dess but to a less extreme extent since characters still seem to remember her. the voice in the code seems to be trapped in a weird limbo between existence and non existence, the only evidence of them found in the hard to reach area of usused game data.
gaster (or who we believe to be gaster) also shows up in undertale despite the many many hints that hes also in deltarune. dess and possibly gaster might be trapped in a place outside of the games allowing them to freely move between the two worlds much like the player, who also exists outside of the games, can. plus the bunker thats seemingly connected to her disappearance just oozes gaster involvement. i think the fake page not found and hidden dess page kind of supports this since its almost like evidence of her is being obscured. correct me if im wrong but im pretty sure only her family really mentions her
Hey dorked not to be a pain nor am I trying to pester you but I don't suppose you could upload floweys theme checkmate that plays when flowey betrays everyone in inverted fate, it's a banger. Cool video btw, hope you're doing well :)
I plan to but I'm working with someone for a visualization for it.
I wonder if there’s any connection between the bunker and the time Noelle recalls in the puzzle sequence, where they explored the woods behind the church.
I thank Sarah for retweeting out this video on her twitter! Me wanting to know everything there is to know about Deltarune like the high lore nerds, I wanted to ask a couple of things after watching. But before that, thank you as well for that Mother 3 warning, it was much appreciated. I'm currently paused midway through my own playthrough of the game :)
First, where have we seen the text strings, like the one at 8:14? I feel like I've seen these, but I can't remember where.
And second, do you think Kris' inability to play the piano is due to their stress of other people watching, or due to the player's control of them?
Third, do you think your videos will suffice to thoroughly understand all this world's lore up to this point? Or is there people that you'd also recommend I check out?
Thank you for this video, I quite enjoyed it and will likely watch more of your channel.
Father Alvin isn't important. He doesn't have his own voice (sound effect).
A lack of sound effect doesn't mean a lack of importance. Rouxls Kaard doesn't use a talk sound despite being a recurring character. The secret bosses lack portraits. It's a bit too early to rule out some importance to the story.
@Dorked maybe, but that would be unusual for game style
@@AlbiFlorus Catti and Jockington don't currently have their own vfx despite being pretty heavily foreshadowed that they'll appear in a dark world.
@TheAdvertisement yes, if we use their names in vessel maker, we'll have text "you we'll meet someone really wonderful"
Can't wait to see what you've got to say about this, always looking forward to theory vids from this community! I'll probably edit this comment with my thoughts below after watching :)
DISCLAIMER: A lot of this theorycrafting is predicated upon Dess being the one trapped in the code. That's an assumption, and I could be wrong about that. I just can't think of anyone else it could be outside of the vessel? or maybe asriel??? (that one's a stretch) so keep that in mind.
Hard agree on Dess being a very likely candidate for the Knight. I had always thought this was a serious possibility, hasn't changed in my mind since. There's also plenty of evidence to support her at least creating the Ch. 2 dark world. Queen seeks out specifically Noelle, which would track if the Knight she had spoken to mentioned her, or resembled her in some way. Additionally, Spamton having dialogue ripped from what I assume to be her implies that she has some kind of direct connection to the dark world by some means. Dess is also mentioned several times throughout the story, with a literal puzzle spelling out her name to calendar dates and search history regarding her disappearance. One thing to also note is ICE-E makes an appearance here as well. ICE-E is one of the only characters to have any kind of connection to Dess other than Noelle, Asriel, and Kris. Personally, I have a theory regarding ICE-E's involvement with her disappearance (they might have dragged her into the bunker aha), but it's kind of a stretch so I won't go too far in depth on that. The only thing bothering me about it is her being trapped in the code. That makes me confused, but I have another idea that I kind of like better?
I think it's possible that Dess is a secret playable character in the game. I know, simple, but let me explain myself. All this talk about eggs and breaking the game makes me think that there's some way to break into the code itself at some point. Possibly through Cat Petterz, the weird route, the eggs, through the ice cave, another unforseen method, a combination of all of these, or something entirely new. Whatever way Toby comes up with, you'll be able to do it and find her. From what I can gather she'll play the role of a bard. The iconography she's associated with gives a very traditional bard vibe, a guitar being one of the most common avenues for people to make music. Additionally, she might have ties to the song of the sea, and it's possible that this is in direct correlation to her disappearance. It's also strange how if Kris is involved with her disappearance, then it's implied that their way of coping with that is to play music.
Additionally, if you remember in Undertale, you play music on a piano to unlock a secret in waterfall. I almost wonder if the arrows you use in that song directly correlate to the puzzle that Noelle describes being in the ice cave. That holds less weight though, as it's kind of a reach. Music holds great significance in the Mother series as well. Giegue is ultimately defeated in Mother 1 using the Sing command. This tells me that Dess's music, possibly the song of the sea, could make a unique impact during the roaring. Especially if the Angel's Heaven described has anything to do with Noelle. Though the player is implied to be the Angel described in Undertale, so be sure keep that in mind as well. She could change the outcome of the prophecy itself, as it's perfectly possible that it doesn't account for a force that is ultimately outside of the code of the game, unable to affect much of anything under normal circumstances. And I think it's perfectly possible that there is a timeline in Deltarune where Dess is never found. It's kinda sad but makes sense, considering most players don't know of her existence. Her stats probably suck and she's very likely cursed like Susie describes analogically, but I think she's got something vital to determining the outcome of Deltarune's story. Though there is only one ending, perhaps she changes something important in that ending? We can't possibly know just yet, but I can't wait to see what that thing is exactly.
All righty! :) Thanks for the comment, too. It does help the beastly algorithm!
@@Dorked Gotta love that untamable stream of seemingly random equations that determine what videos go in the notification box
While I’m inclined to agree with this theory, I have something else to add to it. I personally believe that while Dess could be the Knight, she’s probably being controlled by somebody else. I personally think that the person behind everything is Gaster, and that Dess is being controlled like a puppet. Not only would this make for an emotional climax, but could also continue the theme of control, or the lack of control, but would also make a great parallel to Kris.
Those are my thoughts on the theory.
Maybe there's a "player" behind Dess, forcing her go scr as the knight. Maybe the assumption that Noelle is the Angel is a red herring and the Angel is Dess... idk, but I'm excited to find out
Very cooo theories!!
I wonder if, because of all these theories on who the Knight might be with various different candidates, when the Knight's true identity is finally revealed in the game... will we end up being surprised? Or will we already have built up so many expectations out of all the characters that are possible candidates that no matter who it turns out to be, we're not really surprised?
Or will it turn out to be someone completely new or someone unexpected, like Burgerpants? Or Temmie?! OR EGG?!??
Maybe we should just not make any expectations, maybe that would make the "surprise" more worth it? I don't know.
Regardless, I am very excited for chapters 3-5 and will without hesitation say to Toby Fox "SHUT UP AND TAKE MY MONEY!"
Metaphorically, of course. ;)
I love the idea of Dess being the Knight, but my personal belief is that they're ICE-E (yes, ICE-E) or at least someone heavily related to him.
Maybe this is long debunked but after seeing ch2's snowgrave route, i kind of just assumed noelle had accidentally killed dess with snowgrave
I just can't see Dess being dead because neither Noelle nor Rudy speak about her in a way that implies death. It'd be kinda messed up if Noelle said "you're lucky Dess isn't here" in that kinda context.
This is my theory, I think Dess is working under the Knight, and with this culminating at the end of chapter 5 revealing Dess is working under the knight. Also telling from the current theme of dark fountains, we can deduce that places with two or more rooms and or locked away to the player is most likely going to be where a dark fountains gonna happen, which means there’s a high chance that Noellle‘s house may be a dark fountain.
Theory number 2 is that Noelle‘s mom is the roaring. This makes a lot of because The fact that Each dark fountain takes place in a location that Noelle spend a lot of time in. Also the queen symbolizing Noelle‘s mom and the way she idolizes the Roaring Knight make a lot of sense
I think Noelle's mom being the knight actually would be pretty sensible too, and would bring some juicy conflict for sure. It's another theory I can vibe with.
I want a link to the music in the parts about mother 3 probably its music from the mother series but I dont know how to find it
ok idea. what if the bunker that dess and kris entered was a dark world and dess got lost in it while kris made it out. this could be why kris has a save point in chapter 1 that the player saves over, and this also could explain why kris opened a fountain in chapter 3. after queen explained how fountains are made, maybe kris, feeling guilty about what happened to dess, decided to open one to try to find her. idk lol 😭
The first file you see says "Kris" when it is the first world you've ever loaded.
All worlds after that have an [EMPTY] save.
While Dess being The Knight is certainly a possibility, I think it would be interesting to see Asriel as The Knight. What if the internet was cut out on purpose, and Asriel didn’t want Kris communicating with him, so he wouldn’t interrupt.
Maybe he wanted to protect Kris, and prevent him from seeing what he is involved with. Maybe he doesn’t know Kris is involved in the prophecy?
what is the song that plays at 7:04 it is such a damn banger
Say, have you checked out any Deltarune Fan-Content, like Comics or other kinds?
I've played Deltatraveler, but that's mostly it because I've been so busy.
@@Dorked hm, i see.
Really cool theory, would be epic if it happened!
What is the music from 5:40 please?
Nightmare knight by Toby fox!
@@Dorked Oh yes! I remember now thank you!!
Dess cannot be a goner, she still exist in this world, or atleast is remembered, the goner kid describe "a universe where everything is the same, except you don't exist"
Here's the thing. Never is being a goner confirmed to be associated with being forgotten. Asgore took a long time to replace Gaster. We don't truly know what the nature of a "goner npc" is. Goner Kid's dialogue could just as easily be commentary on how you can only get their fun event in certain playthroughs and they otherwise never appear.
@@Dorked i don't think gaster is exactly a goner, he doesn't exist but he is incredible diferent compared to his followers, and we also have the fact that every goner is a resprite of some npc, with the only notable exception being gaster (unless some character is actually the "normal" gaster), and dess being featured in every game, instead of some fun events, would be considerabilly diferent from the goners, unless of course the diferent saves are the diferent fun events of this universe, but removing an important npc seens much more drastic them changing flavor text, but outside of that, i think you are right and goners probabilly weren't forgotten, just to irrelevant to be refered to in any other part of the game
WAIT I JUST NOTICED there's only two strings on the guitar :O
Ok, so when a deer gets it’s antlers grown in, it sheds a kind of flesh off of them that causes it to be really bloody and gross. If Dess is the knight, that would be a really cool design choice
I believe either Noelle or dess is the Angel not the Knight. And wherever dess is trapped in is the Angels heaven... whatever that means
Ice e kidnapped dess 100% ice e is the Knight too
Ice-E as the knight would be funny, but I imagine THE WARRIOR as the knight. xD
@@Dorked don't you see? The warrior _is_ ice e and so is pizzapants and so is purple guy and so is Gaster and so is dess. EVERYONE IS ICE-E