Françoise L Meyer je sais bien mais Thomas parle très bien français et si tu écoutes bien, il y a des moments où il ne roule pas les "r" - alorrrrrrrrs ! On n'est pas dans le baroque français, là ! et puis le talent du chanteur est AUSSI de savoir prononcer les langues étrangères ! Il ne suffit pas d'ouvrir la bouche et de sortir une bouillie ! Avec leur "r" roulé ainsi, on diraît qu'ils vont cracher (voir Bryn Terfel) ! C'est de la kiné respiratoire pour grands bronchiteux ! Allez, rions un peu ! Il y a tant de chanteurs qu'on peut bien rechercher l'excellence, non ?
O sistema Fach (Fach = repartição, categoria, classificação, no sentido de técnica vocal) é um sistema alemão criado para classificar vozes, no âmbito de facilitar a classificação vocal da pessoa e de facilitar a procura por cantores de classificações específicas no canto lírico. Previne um cantor de cantar uma ária que seria incapaz. A classificação é baseada no timbre (intensidade, cor), na extensão (extremos grave e agudo) e na tessitura (região confortável de cada voz - extensão e tessitura são coisas completamente diferentes). Esse sistema é SOMENTE utilizado para classificar cantores líricos, exclusivamente para a ópera.Então se você ver por aí um cantor popular com uma classificação enorme (com nome, sobrenome, rg, cpf e comprovante de residência - tipo aquelas soprano lírico - ligeiro spinto coloratura), se for no canto popular, ESTÁ ERRADO. Essa classificação só é válida para o CANTO LÍRICO. No canto popular são somente usadas as classificações convencionais: Soprano, Mezzo Soprano, Contralto, Tenor, Barítono e Baixo.
This is from a version of the whole opera made for the Italian baritone Mattia Battistini. Massenet would not have been able to transpose the whole opera down a third (more or less) without completely modifying the entire orchestration and all the other vocal parts, Charlotte would have become a contra-contralto! He left the rest of the music at the original pitch and modified only Werther's part. I heard it at Martina Franca in 2003 with Luca Grassi in the title role. It worked wonderfully, I didn't miss having a tenor, I felt the role of Werther became more brooding and mentally unstable, though that might simply have been due to Grassi's very fine interpretation. There were difficulties with the production because the original singer for Charlotte was indisposed, so she mimed on the stage on the first evening, while Eufemia Tufano sang, score in hand, in the orchestra pit, this may have added extra tension to the performance. At the second performance, Tufano sang on stage (there were only two performances, but you can find extracts here on TH-cam). I might be wrong, but I thought the Battistini version was actually in Italian, not French.
@@voltape Who is "he"? if you're referring to Massenet let me remind you that he has been dead for some time; if you mean Hampson it would most likely be beyond his competence (as I said it would require serious work in the orchestral parts). This is Massenet's baritone version of the aria modified by the composer for the baritone Mattia Battistini, like it or leave it. This performance is for those who are interested in hearing a different version signed by Massenet himself - a version of musicological interest. If you find it disturbing that it doesn't sound like the familiar tenor version, I suggest you go listen to the countless recordings that exist of the original tenor version.
@@CzarDodon I was wondering just that; if it works with a baritone. It’s become such an iconic tenor opera, sometimes it is hard to picture another voice in the same role, much less the frenzy this opera must have caused for it to be made into a performable version for a different voice type. This seems to be unique circumstance, tho! Just for sh&$s and giggles, I wonder if there are any other operas for which this was done. I’ve seen sopranos perform mezzo parts, vice versa, but I’m pretty sure this is the first I’ve seen an entire opera rewritten for another voice type.
L'interprétation surtout est saisissante, la voix aussi pour moi. S'il roule les "r", plein d'autres font ça aussi. Même Français et ténors.
Quelle honte de chanter ça de cette manière après Battistini...
Les r roulés dommage
Les roulements de "r" - affrrrrrrrrrrrreux ! (d'accord avec Alain Flaux) -
Vous ne connaissez rien à l'opéra.
@@sananton2821 Ah ! je ne l'avais pas vu ce com-là :-)
Bonjour
Ça tombe bien car la version qui sortira la semaine prochaine humblement de moi sera sans r roulés.... www.cyrilrovery.com
Baryton
Françoise L Meyer
je sais bien mais Thomas parle très bien français et si tu écoutes bien, il y a des moments où il ne roule pas les "r" - alorrrrrrrrs ! On n'est pas dans le baroque français, là ! et puis le talent du chanteur est AUSSI de savoir prononcer les langues étrangères ! Il ne suffit pas d'ouvrir la bouche et de sortir une bouillie ! Avec leur "r" roulé ainsi, on diraît qu'ils vont cracher (voir Bryn Terfel) ! C'est de la kiné respiratoire pour grands bronchiteux ! Allez, rions un peu ! Il y a tant de chanteurs qu'on peut bien rechercher l'excellence, non ?
Bravo Cyril ! Certains chanteurs français ont enfin compris qu'on n'était pas obligé de rouler les "r" en français après la période baroque !
Rovery Cyril
Sans r roulés, c'est mal. Cela ignore totalement la tradition francophone du chant classique.
But why did Massenet change the aria - He could just lower it to baritone voice range! o for that matter, for bass voice range!
O sistema Fach (Fach = repartição, categoria, classificação, no sentido de técnica vocal) é um sistema alemão criado para classificar vozes, no âmbito de facilitar a classificação vocal da pessoa e de facilitar a procura por cantores de classificações específicas no canto lírico.
Previne um cantor de cantar uma ária que seria incapaz. A classificação é baseada no timbre (intensidade, cor), na extensão (extremos grave e agudo) e na tessitura (região confortável de cada voz - extensão e tessitura são coisas completamente diferentes).
Esse sistema é SOMENTE utilizado para classificar cantores líricos, exclusivamente para a ópera.Então se você ver por aí um cantor popular com uma classificação enorme (com nome, sobrenome, rg, cpf e comprovante de residência - tipo aquelas soprano lírico - ligeiro spinto coloratura), se for no canto popular, ESTÁ ERRADO. Essa classificação só é válida para o CANTO LÍRICO.
No canto popular são somente usadas as classificações convencionais: Soprano, Mezzo Soprano, Contralto, Tenor, Barítono e Baixo.
This is from a version of the whole opera made for the Italian baritone Mattia Battistini. Massenet would not have been able to transpose the whole opera down a third (more or less) without completely modifying the entire orchestration and all the other vocal parts, Charlotte would have become a contra-contralto! He left the rest of the music at the original pitch and modified only Werther's part. I heard it at Martina Franca in 2003 with Luca Grassi in the title role. It worked wonderfully, I didn't miss having a tenor, I felt the role of Werther became more brooding and mentally unstable, though that might simply have been due to Grassi's very fine interpretation. There were difficulties with the production because the original singer for Charlotte was indisposed, so she mimed on the stage on the first evening, while Eufemia Tufano sang, score in hand, in the orchestra pit, this may have added extra tension to the performance. At the second performance, Tufano sang on stage (there were only two performances, but you can find extracts here on TH-cam). I might be wrong, but I thought the Battistini version was actually in Italian, not French.
@@CzarDodon but he could just transpose the aria not the entire opers
@@voltape Who is "he"? if you're referring to Massenet let me remind you that he has been dead for some time; if you mean Hampson it would most likely be beyond his competence (as I said it would require serious work in the orchestral parts). This is Massenet's baritone version of the aria modified by the composer for the baritone Mattia Battistini, like it or leave it. This performance is for those who are interested in hearing a different version signed by Massenet himself - a version of musicological interest. If you find it disturbing that it doesn't sound like the familiar tenor version, I suggest you go listen to the countless recordings that exist of the original tenor version.
@@CzarDodon I was wondering just that; if it works with a baritone. It’s become such an iconic tenor opera, sometimes it is hard to picture another voice in the same role, much less the frenzy this opera must have caused for it to be made into a performable version for a different voice type. This seems to be unique circumstance, tho! Just for sh&$s and giggles, I wonder if there are any other operas for which this was done. I’ve seen sopranos perform mezzo parts, vice versa, but I’m pretty sure this is the first I’ve seen an entire opera rewritten for another voice type.