Princess Sally Acorn: The Sonic Character Sega Wants You to Forget (and Why You Never Will)
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 14 ก.ย. 2020
- #sonicthehedgehog #sallyacorn #rally4sally
Despite Sega's best efforts, they can't seem to exterminate their rodent problem: Princess Sally Acorn. One of the longest running characters in the Sonic franchise, longest relationship Sonic's ever had, and a deeply devoted fanbase despite never appearing in the mainline Sonic games. Today I go over her history, why she's the best gal for the blue blur, and why people still love her to this very day...and why we haven't seen the last of her.
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For those asking about the music, everything is from the Sonic games.
The Saturn version of Rustic Ruins is what I used during the relationship portion of the chat, I assume that's the piece most of you are looking for.
If you have any other spots you need help with, let me know.
You do realize Sally Acorn isn't canon right? Neither is Sonic SatAM, TAoStH, nor the Archie Comics. Amy's the real love interest to Sonic at this point. Amy is to Sonic as Princess Peach is to Mario. It's really NOT up for debate, Game Apologist. Sorry, but it's true. I know this will most likely upset you considering your comment here 27:52 about Sonamy shippers being so called "weirdos," but that's just how it is. It may seem like Sonic doesn't love Amy back, but he does. In Sonic 06 (which believe it or not is canon) if you choose Amy instead of Elise, the guy in charge of the Test of Love says "You chose Amy. Your long time love," in Sonic Chronicles (Also canon despite what SEGA says) Sonic has the option to tell Amy how he feels, and in Sonic Unleashed Sonic can go on a date with her. Sonic even loves her back in Sonic X. Hence 27:49. And don't bother saying that Sonic X isn't canon. In may not be 100%, but the lore is INDEED canon. Many aspects of it are. SEGA and Sonic Team actually worked on Sonic X and most of what happened in that show are based off of the events from the main games such as Sonic Adventure 1 and 2, Sonic Battle, and the Sonic Advance games. Yuji Naka was even a producer. If you still proceed on saying that Sonic X isn't canon, then that's pretty foolish. It's okay if you love Sally Acorn and the Archie Comics, but you shouldn't force whatever you want for people who don't want it. I'm sure you were quite the 90s kid lol, but you shoudn't ruin Amy, or Sonic, or Blaze, or any other character just because of how much you love Sally Acorn. And just for the record it's saddening that you call Sonamy fans "weirdos" cause they really have good and valid reasons for shipping them and loving them as a couple. Basically Sonic and Amy's relationship is pretty much like Ash and Serena's relationship from Pokémon and Huey and Jasmine's from The Boondocks. Sure Serena and Jasmine aren't exactly obsessive, but it's the same case scenario.
RockWAREstar ummm
RockWAREstar yeah I know but the Paragraph...
RockWAREstar not really needed
@@mrnnc6805 Problem? You don’t need to react like I’m throwing a huge fit over Sonamy. I’m not a shipper.
"...but if you want Sonic to fall for this gal you gotta get the fans to fall for her first."
*I think they fell a little too hard.*
Especially Danny boi.
oh no oh god oh why
Nah mate, when i was 8, I fell for the other kind of bait..
@SuperHankinsBros game grumps.
@@bagelgod946 why waat?
The thing that always stood out to me about Sonic and Sally's relationship was that it was built on respect. Sonic followed orders because he respected Sally's ability to make a solid plan. Sally let Sonic break those orders because she respected his instincts and knew that even if things went bad, he would be able to get himself out of trouble without endangering anyone else.
True.
You always respect the guy on the grounds opinion of the current situation. Makes a good leader great.
I wish more fictional relationships were like that!
Exactly. And that's part of what made Sally a great leader, she earned it. She earned the respect of her peers rather than just being the princess.
Yes Exactly 👍 that’s exactly on what I said.
You know I hate how some people make this a Amy vs Sally thing. I think both characters deserve better.
Agreed especially with the other sonic relationships especially one from three comics that had tails and sonic cucked and just bad and a certain human on 06
Yeah that is also annyoing me sally and amy are friends they arent rivals or enemies! Sally and amy deserve better!
Why put two bad bitches against each other?
Only Amy deserves better because she is wearing clothes
@@iceman92211bro who hurt you💀
If Sally were to show up in a Sonic game . Sega would pull a Mario Odyssey and include her randomly like how they did Pauline .
Exactly
I be down for that especially if they have her sing lol
though unlike with Sally, Pauline still showed up in Mario vs Donkey Kong games after the first one and did end up playable in Mario Kart Tour
sally should be in sonic frontiers
@@wyzolol hmmm
I know it’s not the main subject of the video but I _completely_ agree when you say that Amy Rose deserves a better treatment... Just like Sally, she can be such a great character when used by competent writers!
Yeah, she needs someone who actually pays attention to her. As someone who has been in Amy's shoes and even gotten stuck in one-sided relationships, her crush on Sonic isn't healthy (not to mention so, so stressful) and she needs to let go and find someone who sees her as the whole wide universe (but maybe wait a couple years before that as she's still quite young).
True
I think that a way that could happen is with sally talking to her so she can become more independent
i completl agree with this. but i would see the lovable, cheery , amy we all loved in sonic adventure 2 and 1. her personality and priority's where not always centred around sonic, and more about the ones in danger. But know sega ruined it. and made her an annoying brat that is obsessed with sonic. Making amy an obsessed bratty child is one of the biggest mistakes sega made. I just hope she comes back to her senses, and instead of making her sally acorn #2 , Give her the level headed caring little goofball ofa hefghog she was.
Are y'all forgetting that Amy used the Chaos Emeralds to wish herself to be older? She's got the mind of a child. Which makes Amy X ANYONE really fuckin weird.
I miss Sally honestly. She was a well written sting female character and I do think that influenced my own interest growing up in strong women who could bring something substantial to the table, and not always need to be the damsel.
*Hundredth like*
It’s just too bad Ken Penders screwed THAT up big time with his sexism (which in this case, is going overboard with Sally Acorn’s anger to the point where it really does look like she wants to hit Sonic with a Piko-Piko Hammer for forgetting her dates and their friends when all he was trying to do was find his way back home and be a hero, which is so not her! m.th-cam.com/video/0ldpZ4noYsY/w-d-xo.html) in Issue #134 of Archie Sonic.
so... where is she exactly in the comics at this point?
Roberto Blake I honestly agree with most of the video I think she should be brought back but my problem is that ppl will hate her so my point is this as a list.
Amy who can barely manage stuff and is a yandere who needs saving a little too much and can't keep up.
Sally who has half of tails I.Q. and can hold her own in a way and always has a strategy built for any scenario and rarely needs saving.
My choice is sally no offense a girl who can hold her own and be smart is a win plus who wouldn't want a badass princess
@@devinnewsom1972 "Need saving a little too much"? Man, Amy wasn't kidnapped since Sonic CD, at least to a point where Sonic has to save her, it was even backwards in SA2. I agree that Sally should be in the games but that doesn't mean Amy should be cut from the franchise (at least no one but Charmy should be).
I assume you meant strong instead of sting.
“Almost every form of media is afraid of a stable relationship”
So true. Peter Parker is currently reeling from constant relationship bullshit thanks to Marvel. Dude has died five times. Poor kid can’t get a break.
Edit: Came back a year later to report that Spider-Man’s love life is still being screwed over.
I fucking hate Paul.
Oh really? Have you watched Bob's Burgers?
@@dragondelsur5156 Yes. Good show
F-Zilla Don’t forget about Mephisto, Peter Sold his Marriage To MJ to Mephisto just to save the life of his Dying Aunt who the whole point of her character is that she’s the “old lady who’s just one overly salty bowl of soup away from death”!!!!!!!! Also may I just acknowledge the fact that SPIDER MAN MADE A DEAL WITH THE DEVIL!!!!!!!!! Geez it’s no wonder Linkara decided to boycott Spider man comics until they retcon One More Day out of existence!!!!!!
Peter still remembers that event
Which is weird considering almost every single piece of media attempts pairing the "leading man and lady" by the end of the run time, even if the paring makes no sense and the two characters have zero chemistry. (Cough) Steve and Sharon (cough)
Okay but my headcannon is that Sally taught Amy how to be a good leader and acted like a mentor for her so that’s why Amy takes over the leader role in the IDW comics
Nahhh Amy learned herself!
Remember Sonic Heroes
@@skeetermagee2487 that’s why it’s called *H E A D C A N O N*
@@jennyberger8229 what the heck is a head canon
@@skeetermagee2487 It could be both! Amy always had leadership potential which might even be why Sally might train her and once she left, she really really knew how to lead.
@@skeetermagee2487 it's basically how a person thinks something happened or how it went down,Hence the term Head canon
"It's amazing Disney doesn't own you yet"
Don't say that out loud!
Mickey: Did i hear the sound of capitalism?
@@dragondelsur5156 no. Its the sound of your failing company, mickey.
It's ok. Disney is in emergency mode and is hemorrhaging money
Omg how would people react if Disney bought Sega? I’m really curious lmao
Brandon Williams Well it would enrage every fan. If they wanted to go further beyond and buy PlayStation,Xbox and Nintendo as well, it would cause World War 3 to happen
I want Sally and Bunnie to make a comeback. I think they were the strongest overall of the characters.
Same here, if they both show up in the modern Sonic games. I would lose my mind
Bunn was awesome
Nicole would have a game style different, maybe to "Hack" Zones using some kind of platforming retro-style, or futurist
Sadly, it would require them getting the characters back after loosing their copyright.
@@ruandalserept According to this vid, those specific characters aren't actually included in the copyright. Sega lost some stuff, but none of the core freedom fighters. They aren't used because Sega Japan dislikes what the Americans came up with (or so it's assumed).
Give Sally the Pauline treatment she comes back popular than ever living a good life knows sonic as a past lover and keeps touch with the friends Pauline even appears in spin offs
Run fast super blue, jump up don’t be scared
If only. 😭😭
They were past lovers? Like they dated😭
Pauline is great. It's so cute that they gave her prominence. Sally deserves that too.
Premise is SEGA can treat her like Nintendo do to Pauline.
Remember Nintendo also don't let Stanley and Syrup return.
Sally is so well-written, she has her own comic series, it was a short one, but one that showed how developed sally is, even without sonic. Honestly, if Big the cat, the MOST HATED character besides charmie, can be in MULTIPLE games, and media, then so can sally because there’s actually fans of her, and she may even be able to save the Sonic series, just get a talented, devoted team that has knowledge of the series, then BOOM. Problem solved.
Her series lasted, like, three issues, and the last issue plot twist was that the Sally followed in the mini-series was actually a disposable robot that gets destroyed at the end.
Also it sold like shit.
WAIT, BIG THE CAT AND CHARMY BEE ARE HATED???? WHY THEYRE MY FAVES 🦶🦶🦶🦶🦶🦶
oh well
@@insertunoroginalnamehere6189 Big the Cat is A. Written like Lenny from _Of Mice and Men,_ and B. The character who forces you to play an extremely basic fishing game when what you want to do is run around the level like a coked-up hummingbird.
Charmy is every obnoxious over-caffinated child in one.
She’s comic canon…
But not game canon.(if you don’t count cameo)
no just no
This just makes me sad because I’m reminded of how many lovable characters are reduced to nothing these days...
Vector...
...Cream...
Blaze.
At least Vector outside of Free Riders was barely ever badly written even in Boom and TSR was he one of the most on point Characters and Blaze and Cream are properly in luck with being absent so that no one can ruin them.
Well I guess we have now more Sonic?
Wait a minute
CREAM AND VECTOR?!?!?
marine....
Please they really be doing Blaze injustice. She's easily the most developed and interesting Sonic character, but they do nothing with her.
One thing:
Sally + Sonic = sanic
Lol
XD
See, this is why it works. Amic doesn't have the same ring to it.
It all makes sense.
@@four-en-tee exactly! XD
I personally loved the SatAM series. Sonic didn’t feel out of place. It was like putting The Flash in a post-apocalyptic universe. Once you explore his presence there, he’s larger than life. Sonic might not be the leader that Sally is, but she’s basically the Lois Lane to Sonic’s Superman. He can do things nobody else can when they need him. She keeps him grounded when he needs it. And they definitely work well as a couple; they have chemistry.
I love sonic satam too
I miss that series. It was great.
Same
I often compared Sonic SatAM to a story of a boy superhero and group of children freedom fighters
And SkyNet as the big bad
I love SatAM, but I love AOSTH even more.
@@kobayashibrynhild9622 gladly its been revived by fans! They even got Crash 40 to cover the main theme (fastest thin alive)!
I’ll admit, I’m more of a Sonamy shipper, but I still respect Sonally. I remember when I was little I would rent the SATAM dvds and was obsessed with Sonic and Sally’s chemistry. The way Sally’s character was used showed me how a main heroine should be written. I really wish Nintendo took notes and did this with their characters such as Peach. I miss Sally so much and wish she was relevant again.
big respect for you. I'm a Sonally shipper ❤️
me whos a sonadow shipper
@@randomdudelol4976 lmao one of my bromance/crack ships
@@randomdudelol4976 I don't mind random ships but that is just plain wierd
Respect. There are way too many disrespectful Sonamy shippers. Glad to find one that’s not. (I’m a sonally shipper)
Sega's constantly trying to force sonics world into a Mario style formula when there's so much untapped potential to create an incredible world and story
The problem with SEGA's approach to Sonic is that they've accrued this amazing and dizzyingly large cast of characters, with different shapes, sizes, personas and backgrounds... and they refuse to DO anything with them. They've expanded their world so much, but they insist on keeping it a static one. Shadow's CONSTANTLY a brooding jerk, Amy's ALWAYS chasing Sonic, Tails is PERPETUALLY twelve. There's only so much you can do with characters you don't allow to change.
@@martindovah3810 Most of them have material for spin-off games, they don't have to always be attached to Sonic to exist.
@@dragondelsur5156 Very true. I was pondering last knight on how Boom would've been a great Freedom Fighters game where Sonic maybe makes a cameo or two. The hack n' slash team-based combat would be better suited for them than it was for our cerulean speedster. Rotor's the Support, Bunnie's the Heavy, Antoine is Precision (maybe stealth), and Sally DPS. It would have made so much more sense for all that walking around and stuff.
@@martindovah3810 Supremely long overdue for a Freedom Fighters based video game. So much wasted potential. 😔
@Anonymous Eagle
That....
is extremely stupid. There are several characters in the Sonicverse that share similar traits and abilities but they have a limit with inventors?!?
"I think she is a great character, at least when used by great story tellers"
Soooo... the entire sonic franchise in a nutshell?
In a nutshell
oof. So true it hurts. XD
Actually just about any fiction in a nutshell, to be honest.
@@rainshadow1844 At this point, this franchise has become fanfiction.
@@dragondelsur5156 No doubt about that.
Sally acorn is a legendary character and doesn't deserve the hate that everyone gives her.
Some of the sonamy fans hate her to shed be a good friend
I hate her a bit due canon but .... not rabbid hate. Just took me a little more to understand until start to read more in deep and understand how she was written.... AND THEN get destroy by Penders drama.
I don’t hate Sally, I HATE how everyone compares any female character, preexisting or new, to Sally.
@@phantomsanic3604 I agree, to me Sally and the rest of the freedom fighters by that matter, I always felt over-hyped by people and I didn't understand why. I didn't grow up with the cartoon nor read the Archie comics until it got cancelled in 2017 so I didn't have any nostalgia for them, having read all of Archie comics run on sonic three times now I can say that... Sally isn't that great, she is a good character but I was never really interested in her like I was with other characters, Bunnie and Antoine are to me the best characters amongst the original freedom fighters which makes me kind of sad that most people don't talk or give a damn about Antoine, people usually talk about bring Sally or Nicole or Bunnie back but my boi Antoine gets forgotten ( I understand leaving Rotor behind as he is very forgetful and kind of useless now)
While I like Sonamy I'm not obsessed about it and I tend to stay away from shipping. I have seen people be so aggressive about the Archie comics and how it should be brought back as the definitive canon that honestly gave me a sour taste to the comics, not to mention that Penders fucked up so much that cool concepts will never be explored. I recommend reading the IDW comics as they are genuinely good but I understand if people that grew up with Archie or the cartoon might not like it
She deserves the hate for destroying the consistency of the girls
I'm pretty neutral on the whole Sonic/Amy Rose/Sally love triangle, I like both. You show me a picture of Sonamy, I'll think it's cute. You show me a picture of Sonally, I'll think it's cute. Really, I like both characters honestly (I'd even dare say more than Sonic XD). I want Sally to make a comeback. I hope that she can appear once more, it'd be so cool. It's pretty upsetting the Archie comics were cancelled.
I love sonally
Same here.
Me too.
@PurpleOwlAnimation okey
I kinda liked the later stages of the archie comics where she was established more like an old flame/ ex that just became a very close friend even as he started dating Amy
"It feels like they didn't even play the games, let alone consult the people who made the games!"
That's because they didn't. According to what I've read (mostly in the Thanks, Ken Penders blog) SEGA provided the comic writers with little to no help on the game plots; for example, for the Sonic Adventure adaptation, the staff had to use a non-localized copy of the game and figure out the plot from there; furthermore, Ken Penders, the main writer on the 'classic' era of the comics has in several ocasions admitted that he never played the games, and not only that, he ignored the plots and developments that any other writer did; again, in the Sonic Adventure adaptation, made in four parts, the previous writer established that, like in the games, Chaos cannot be submissed through violence, and Sonic needs to use positive energy to remind Chaos about its purpose; come Ken Penders on the final part, literally the first line Super Sonic says is about how he's going to trash Chaos, ignoring all of the buildup, theme and purpose of the battle. And then Knuckles saves the day. With a Spider-Man reference.
ken had a hard on for knuckles i could tell, when i first read the mobius 25 years later saga i kept saying "why are we STILL following knuckles? where's Sonic and his family? Tails? Shadow? Rouge? Amy??" it was quite annoying and the favoritism was hurting.
I'm on my lunch break right now, and I have the graphic novel collection of Sonic Adventure literally right next to me as I found your comment. I knew Ken Penders was involved somehow.
Knuckles: *I'm gonna put some dirt in your eye*
What?
It hurts me that they'd throw away one of their most developed, likeable lead characters, for seemingly no reason. She was grounded, she knew how important responsibilities were, and she wasn't just a damsel in distress. I would really love to see her return!
Can’t, she goes against sjw feminist. A strong woman, who will have children and marries a man. Sally isn’t a Mary Sue or a captain marvel.
The reason is actually well outlined in the video: Introducing her would, in a lot of very significant ways, take focus away from Sonic.
I mean, I understand that they're already doing that with Original the Character, but that isn't really the point. It also doesn't help that there are probably actually more than two worlds: The Classic World and the Adventure World are two for certain, but you look then at everything that came after Unleashed and it's all kind of a jumbled mess of different canons.
@@PhycoKrusk But at the same time, they want to focus on the world and characters...without focusing on the world and characters as outlined in the video.
Sonic stories besides the general "Sonic takes down robotnik" of classic/classic-esque games want to give some attention to the world of sonic at large, want the characters to be more of what they are...but at the last second you just move away from all of that.
@@vcom741 Because the last time they tried fleshing out Sonic's world, the gaming community collectively shat on them for it.
You'd be surprised by the amount of people who don't want Sonic to be anything more than him just fighting Eggman forever and nothing else, and Sega not wanting anymore backlash is doing just that.
@@sonic5993 Suppose I wanted to start to paint. My first attempt would be crap. And people will let me know its crap. Hell I'd know its crap.
Doesn't mean I should stop
You gave Sally the greatest justice I've ever seen. Really inspiring stuff.
How can she the greatest when she is not wearing anything ?
@@iceman92211does that really matter your acting like those 5 year old sonamy fans who hate sally for the dumbest reasons💀
@iceman92211 It does not matter she's an animal animals don't need clothes
While I like her updated outfit, I liked that Sally was a female character that didn’t wear clothes, not necessarily for a pervy reason (I swear), but because it didn’t go with the “men can go naked, women cannot” trope that you’d see in other Sonic media, The Regular Show, and so on.
Well the thing is that it looks awkward and embarrassing and it would be hard to take females seriously when they have big exposed breasts
She should really be in the games. I can see her getting along well with Blaze actually.
I literally was just thinking of that a while ago! Someone said we don't need Sally in the game continuity because we already have an action princess: Blaze. Why not have both and have a cool friendship between the two! Two cool royal girls from parallel dimensions together at last? Hell yeah!
Sally should never appear in the games continuity. She'd rob so many roles from many other characters that she'll be a flat out black hole mary sue.
@@yungmuney5903 there's a lot to be said of redundancy, no reason not to have multiple characters filling the same roles, you then have the freedom to put some characters in danger without crippling the story too much
I love both of them 😁
Josh Crowell two badass princesses fighting together sounds awesome!
17:34 i like how sonic is naked at his wedding while sally is all dressed up
He just getting ready
@@NoNamex1412 Clearly he's just prepared ahead of time.
@@mitchfletcher2386 ah yes
@@mitchfletcher2386 you know how he his. He gotta go fast
Gotta make the family fast!
I love Sally.
It was such a missed opportunity when SEGA didn’t bring in the freedom fighters for Forces.
Or at least mention them in something like in the IDW comics.
I know honestly- sally got me into sonic. When they broke up I was like wtf 🤬
@@lynstrawberry5645all that forced romantic drama on Archie was really weird to me, not to mention the "Slap" but if I have to give them credit on one thing, the relationship between Antoine and Bunnie was the best one in the comic.
I feel that we are never gonna see the freedom fighters again, force's was the perfect and only way to introduce them into the games but now the time has passed, they could be brought back but they would suffer major changes to fit into whatever game they were to be introduced. Sally would suffer the most changes and Rotor surprisingly would need the least (probably because he was the least developed or focused on)
Fun fact: Sally does actually appear in a comic related to Sonic Forces... Sorta.
She appears as a photo on a map, not in great detail but you tell its her due to her recognisable colours and the vague shape of her hair, and it has been confirmed by the artist that it is sally
@REDBlurr also Bunnie Rabbot appears in the same panel as the other picture on the left of the Sally one
@@lenag2002 What comic, issue number?
@@Ether101_Prime it’s the sonic forces digital comic that was released on the sonic twitter and tumblr pages it was a 4 part mini series
@@lenag2002 You need to be more precise then that.
@@Ether101_Prime its in the 2nd issue of that Sonic Forces Comic, "Looming Shadow", page two in the panel with Rouge. It's unmistakably them!
This was simply phenomenal. So many memories and emotions for me. Seeing the sega world statue i stood at at 6 years old in the dirt.. seeing your narrations on sally's roboticization.. this was a rush and a pleasure to watch. Thank you for the effort you put into your content Nick and for being you. If i cover worst/best sonic games, it would be a privelege to have you guest star.
Just let me know, dude! Thank you!
Pog. I watch both your content and this is like my dream come true.
Hey it’s phantom strider I would love to see you work on a top 10 list together. I hope you’re doing well.
You two would make truly fantastic collaborators!
Bruh, I totally forgot about you Phantom-Strider, I used to watch you all the time!
I ship Sonic and good games, true OTP
Same. The best ship really
What good games?
The original trio, colors and more
Sonic and good games is the most nonsensical fan canon I've ever heard
Or does it make the most sense
I feel like the story is more interesting with the American flavoring versus the simpler Japanese version. I would like to see the return of Sally and the Freedom Fighters. I know Mighty and Ray aren’t allowed in IDW, but I feel like it’s overall reductive to take pieces of a whole story and telling writers, “No! You can’t play with these!”
I hated it so much when they started to make new characters like tangle wishper and other
They are good characters but let's agree that surge is more like a female version of scourge
Wait why aren’t Mighty and Ray allowed in IDW?
@@acemagalor2519 Because of how Archie wrote them both
@@somebudy150 actually both surge and scourge are inspired by ashura
Well it's better like that, maybe the IDW will be the first canon comics, since Sega Japan is actively following its creation to bé sure not to restarting a waste like how Archie ended up to be (it was good at the start, and then went to a fucking garbage) or how Fleetway comics were (please, they didn't even followed some basic rules of Sonic universe)
I like Amy, I admire Sally. Amy is good natured and always jumps to save those who rely on her. Sally (from SatAM at least) is an intelligent pragmatic leader, almost too good for Sonic! Similar but different characters. Personally I believe neither of them need our favourite blue hedgehog. If they both had their own storylines for new productions that would be awesome.
But Amy _wants_ Sonic.
@@johnathanegbert9277 this is true! I can’t remember whether Sally was so passionate about Sonic.
I dislike the fact Amy is like a spoiled teen where if she doesn’t get her way AKA being with sonic she “throws a fit” or “makes sonic so uncomfortable when he talks about sally that he has to say he loves her cause he’s afraid of her and her hammer
@@therainbowdiamond9344 Honestly as a huge fan of Amy who genially wanted her to get together with Sonic, got to say, kid me was not a fan with how Archie treated Amy as character.
Sometimes It felt like they took her worse traits and diled it up to 12.
She did get better as time went on but I think kid me was to butt hurt over the fact that Sonic was banging the chipmunk and not the pink hedgehog to care.
@@xavierrivera3407I can agree with you but I don't have the nostalgia for Satam or Archie comics so that may be a part of it. I knew Amy for far longer than Sally and I grew up playing Unleashed, so I always saw her as a major player for the cast (also thought she and sonic were in a more serious relationship than the two actually were, kid me saw them as couple instead of good friends)
Sally is a good character but I never gravitated towards her like I did for Antoine or Bunnie and that's after having reread the Archie comics twice by now
Heroes like Sonic are remembered.
But legends like Sally will never die.
"Follow your heart, kid. And you'll never go wrong."
:3
That’s just what they want you to think.
They become a part of you
DAMN RIGHT
But sonic IS a legend lol.
"there's not a single sonic character that could escape the perversion"
*flashbacks of Robotnik being sexualized in many images*
_Th-That checks out_
Flashback of the pharaoh Robotnik from AOSTH......
@@stormwolf5848 I think the first one that comes to my mind is a fan art piece where he's a stripper. It was funny
Robotnik's thicc ass in AOSTH:
The best kind of R34
Oh god. Ewwwww. The only character I want to see sexualized is IndigoNite0's gijinka version of Boom!Shadow. You'll know why as soon as you see him.
Okay, so I looked it up, and I'm happy to have found out that she is indeed owned by Sega. Why they refuse to use her is beyond me, but thank heavens Penders doesn't own her. You know he's writing fanfiction between Sally and his Skunk oc. :p
Oh thank gos-
WHAT IS KEN DOING NOW?
@@walkerphillips2818 making weird fetish art and NFTs
God, that skunk was a bastard in the comics
@@rivaraptor4277My god, he was man, I remember that he was way older the Sally like in his thirties or something.
@@giuliamelomessina2750 Write Like This:-"i remember he was Way older than Sally"!
As a sonamy Fan I don't hate sally in any way, yet I do respect this character and respect the son ally shipers out there....also great video :)
You shouldn’t respect this character because she destroyed the consistency of the girls
Bunnie and Antoine also deserve to come back
Snively to some extent
Not sure about Antoine, but I'm 100% on Bunnie.
What could possibly liven up a story better than a cyborg rabbit with a southern accent.
Darkfox Bill He had sone really interesting moments. Just wish they cut back on the French stereotypes.
so does Nicole
Antoine but Sex flipped.
I had the biggest crush on her as a kid cause of Kath Soucie voicing her in the cartoon xD
Ay real talk though
Jax
I feel the same with Christine Cavenaugh when she voiced Bunnie
@@JackDesert May Christine rest in peace...
Back when people didn’t call other people furries like that
18:02 “The ninja turtle action figure rendition of Pepe le pew”. Oh my gosh I’m laughing so hard! That is SO accurate! That skunk was the most annoying character in the comics.
he was creepy I never liked him
@@thisname1071 Neither did I.
He's property of Ken Penders now, so he can't be used again, but... no great loss.
Geoffrey St. John, I think he was called? 🤔
He did get improved later in the comics, but his early appearances were rough.
Americans creating a sonic comic in the 90s: Archie or sega America: we gotta sexualize the chipmunk.
Japan in the late 90s creating a sonic game in 3D: Yuji Naka: We gotta sexualize a bat and give her boobs, my intentions are beyond everyone's understanding!
Except the Japanese actually gave the bat clothes instead of just exposing her whole body like the way the Americans did
@@iceman92211 "there's actually been rumours that rouge's cleavage got exposed but eventually it got censored.
*what a price to pay* " - guptill89
@@wolfenden9805 what are you talking about ?
@@iceman92211 top ten hottest female sonic characters ?
I was quoting the iconic quote
@@wolfenden9805 please don’t make a reference to that terrible video especially on a video about Sally of all things
Excellent video. You illustrated why Sally’s character works so well in any context, and I especially enjoyed your comments on the Mecha Sally arc. A lot of fans don’t give it enough credit because it didn’t receive a proper ending and only gave Sally a few opportunities to be a genuine threat to the heroes. But I think her introduction and impact on the Freedom Fighters deserves the recognition you gave it. I think bringing Sally into IDW or the games would need to reinvent the context of her character as a princess or even remove her from the rest of the freedom fighters. But I agree that she deserves another shot, at the very least in a new stand alone animated series.
Thank you for the kind words, sir. I've recently been binging your amazing channel (also lowkey jealous that you have the greatest Nick title of any of us Nicks on TH-cam)
Even without the proper ending to that arc and universe, I still imagine that they make it out okay. I guess the romantic in me is going with that since Sally and Sonic were able to reconnect and work through those hardships.
I guess it wouldn't have been so bad leaving that universe behind, had we just gotten a decent amount of closure for it's characters. Maybe not all as I'm sure some plot threads would still be left open, but that'd be fine since that universe was always so vast and ever changing that there was no way any sort of stability would remain.
And that just goes to show just how alive and fully realized Mobius in the comics really was. That the fight was never going to end, but had they concluded that universe by saving Sally and potentially finishing off Robotnik, then it would indicate that these characters can get through no matter what challenges get thrown their way.
But I'm not too upset over it though, since I like to think of it as the case anyway. Sally and everything involving the setting of Mobius (yes especially all the stuff involving Knuckles heritage and family) really did over something even greater than the some of their parts, and I will always remember that legacy fondly.
Cool, I’ve been watching since you started doing the Sonic Speed Readings, cause I love bizarre and occasionally great Sonic comics can be. Thanks for the username compliment. I feel like I’d want to change it to be more original/in line with my content, but I’m in too deep to change it now!
The only problem with that is ken penders owns the rights to the archie characters😩
Derrick Steves I believe it’s mostly the echidna stuff, Lara-Su, and other characters he created while he was writing for Archie.
Don't be sorry for Antione, he gets his own girl in the end ^^
yes, bunnie
Antoine gets to be fairly badass as time moves forward.
coma is a woman?
@@Gelgoog 🅱️ruh
@@martindovah3810 game theory: Post super genesis wave is actually all a coma dream by twan
Holy shit, I did NOT expect a video about Sally to make me cry... But goddamn, the narration of both the future "King Sonic" timeline and Sally's roboticization hit me in the feels harder than I could ever imagine... This was a fantastic video, and you should absolutely be proud of all the hard work and passion that you put into this. Great job, man!
How on earth did you cry from watching a video about an anthropomorphic squirrel with no clothes ?
Like you must be furry fan if this makes you cry
I’m a fan of Sonic and Blaze being a thing, but at the same time I love Sally as a character and hey, multiple continuities can have multiple love interests
That’s an interesting ship
Sonic and Blaze literally kiss at the end of Rush. But people don't remember their chemistry because of that shitty Sonic 06 and making Blaze with Silver. Blaze was designed to be Sonic's equal.
Thank you!
@@MilesTraveler is there proof of that? can I see the video or something?
@@miss_chelles1338 TH-cam no longer allows links. I suggest going in playing Sonic Rush
Any new sonic female character gets shown.
Fans: *I can ship that*
Oh the struggles of a sonic fan.
Male and female: interact
Shippers: *I can milk you*
@@ShibuNub3305 so true
edge lord indeed.😂
It’s the hard knock life for us
i thought you were the edge lord that comments on almost every sonic related video.
I ship Sonic and Tails
The SIMPmunk joke made me laugh.
Every. _Single._ Time.
32:27
Oh boy.. 😆
7:09
As much as I love Sally, I'm ambivalent about her returning to current media. She worked as well as she did in the cartoons and comics because she was a member of the core cast and had room to grow. Current Sonic media is so stringently regulated by people totally out of touch with basic principles of storytelling that anything they do with her moving forward will be drastically different from what she was before. Best case scenario, they introduce her in the IDW comics and we can "fall for her" again as a new character, but at that point, why not just make a new character that's a spiritual successor rather than digging up the original's grave?
A competent writer could change my mind, but at this point, I'm in favor of a clean break
My honest opinion:
Let the IDW comics be their own thing and never mind with characters like Sally and the Freedom Fighters.
However, it has been established that Sonic has multiple continuities, and every one of those timelines have interesting characters.
SatAM and Archie comics had Sally and the Freedom Fighters.
Sonic X had Chris Thorndyke and Cosmo.
Sonic Boom had Sticks the Badger.
Fleetway comics had Porker Lewis, Johnny Lightfoot, Shortfuse the Cybernik and Tekno the Canary.
IDW has Tangle and Whisper.
And that's just the tip of the iceberg.
Now... imagine a timeline where ALL of those characters existed!
If those stories were competently done, it could be amazing!
@@FuryanJedi13 I agree with this head on.
And now we have Ian. A competent writer
@@bradleydrake6941 yeah, the writer that made Sally a dumb and useless character
@@FuryanJedi13 I would like to see Sally and the Freedom Fighters get a new version of storytelling in IDW tho, in the way that is compatible with the current Sonic core games and media, since indeed the Archie comic story was more like its own thing. But still, Sally and others need more spotlights. If we just keep them in the original story, they would never gain the actual respect and spotlights that other main game cast have.
Don't know if this is an unpopular opinion but one of my problems with the Sally redesign was the fact that they added clothes. Like, you don't see them adding shorts to male characters. They don't have anything to hide and it's odd to make all female characters wear clothes and all male characters to not. Some male characters should have clothes and some female characters shouldn't.
They also stripped Sally of her cheek fur. This is due to the fact that in the games all female characters do not have fur on their cheeks, only male ones have it. I don't know what this design decision of Sega is connected with, but for me it's very strange.
I think she looks better in a full outfit, very sleek. Maybe they don't have anything to hide but maybe the girls just like fashion more than the male characters. Feminine attire just has so much more accessories to play with that's why I love Blaze's and Rouge's design so much, a heart shaped bust is perfect for someone as flirtatious as Rouge, a flowy robe is perfect for someone as timid and cosmic as Blaze. Keeping Sally's vest and adding a general "hiker" look is great for someone as strong and heroic as Sally.
I do like her new clothing though. I think it makes her character stand out, and show her personality, like she is a strong and likes-adventzres-type female character.
Wait you have problems with her having clothes rather than her being completely exposed ?
Is this some opposite day to you ?
@@iceman92211At its core, it's a want to have the male and female characters treated similarly. Since clothing is optional for the dudes, but natural question is "why not for the girls?"
When you find out that Sally's VA also voiced Lola Bunny:
EVERY BODY GET UP, ITS TIME TO SIMP NOW
WE GOT A REAL JAM GOING DOWN, WELCOME TO THE SIMP SLAM, SIMP SLAM
HERE'S YOUR CHANCE, DROP YA PANTS, ITS THE SIMP SLAM!
ALRIGHT ALRIGHT ALRIGHT!
Y e s.
N O.
This comment is made me laugh a lot. *It needs more likes*
Among others.
Furry
"I guess you could call me a SIMPmunk"
and just for that you get a subscriber and a like.
obviously the editing and the way you explain your points and all that jazz is cool too...
I subscribed for the Antoine cuck joke
what is the music at 33:45? Anyone know?
For some reason reading it made me laugh even more.
@@jet100a what you askin me for?
@@SXR123_YT lots of likes, people are bound to click on your comment and see my comment and they might know
As controversial as Sally was in the Sonic franchise, I really do miss her and the Freedom Fighters and wish they got at least cameos in some way in the Sonic games, or at least have a proper official Sonic SatAM graphic novel series to finish off the series at least.
I like the graphic novel idea and heck I would be down to seeing Satam be given a proper ending in like a movie but... It doesn't feel right anymore, I don't trust anyone other than the late Ben Hurst to do it as he had a plan of how it would end...
Fuck Ken Penders honestly
Why do you want a female character with no clothes?
It's weird that King Sonic looks almost exactly like his teenage version yet he's 40 years old.
True
You ever seen an old dog or cat?
I guess it's the fur that covers it, but by and large they don't really age in an obvious way compared to humans...
(or maybe we just can't spot the signs of age as easily...)
@@KuraIthys Uncle Chuck exists, so I thought Sonic would slowly resemble him more as he aged, maybe even growing a stache or something.
Copperlock maybe tweaking his quils and give him slight eye wrinkles and a slightly pale blue would do it
I think that's the fault of Mobian's/their anthros' design. It's difficult to show their characters in different age groups expect for slight tweaking in height and adding things like wrinkles or gray hair/fur.
0:44 the answer is polyamory. polyamory is the answer to every shipping war.
This comment got a mighty chuckle from me.
damn, you won the internet dude!
HELL YEAH!!!
*You!* Keep talking...
alright man, you get a sub from me. this comment is *GOLD*
One more thing.....child me will NEVER FROGIVE how Sonic SatAM ended. I was mentally and emotionally tormented for countless years by never seeing what came next. I mean, nightmares, crying fits, daydreams galore, writing in to the comic editors.
I was denied something epic and beautiful. I am owed blood.
Fun fact: Classic Sonic's timeline has been established as an alternate timeline from Modern Sonic's, so Sega now has every excuse to bring Sally into the games in Classic Sonic's timeline.
When they confirmed that?
Forces, though it wasn't stated directly in game but interviews about it.
@@johnoz2284 Sonic Mania and Sonic Forces. Mania is more of an implication rather than a straight-up confirmation, as it shows Classic Sonic in a situation Modern Sonic was never in; Forces, however, pretty much just tells us, as Tails calls Classic Sonic the Sonic from "that other dimension" rather than the Sonic from the past.
@@jomogaming2 Ooooo ok yea that makes sense
Sonic forces is a load of bullshit.
There are *no* characters from any *fandom* that can excape pervertion..
Kirby has to be safe right.... Right?
@@targettoad691 Kirby is just one big mouth hole
@@targettoad691 No I'm sorry little one.
@@targettoad691 There's some piece of art that shows meta knight getting Kirby *pregnant*
What has this world come to.
Rule 34
I have 0 knowledge or interest on the Sonic franchise, and yet I was completely invested throughout this whole video. It’s clear you’ve done your research & now I know way more about this franchise than I did before!
Why would you be invested in a video about a squirrel with no clothes ?
I really miss her as Sonic’s love interest. They were an amazing pair
Pure facts. I like SonAmy but Sonally was a better choice
I love it as well.
Sonally was good... But Antoine and Bunnie were superior in my opinion
She’s not wearing clothes so she is terrible
The reason why Sega hated Sally and SatAM/Archie was simply they made their own canon.
That becomes a problem when Sega is building up their game canon, with characters like Amy, Knuckles and Shadow being created.
Archie never prioritised the games. They cared more for SatAM.
Sega also was not comfortable with the plots, especially romance and how they treated game characters compared to SatAM’s characters.
Penders also contributed in his own way, but I’m saying that Archie was living on borrowed time as soon as Sonic made the jump to the Dreamcast.
Look at how Sonic was shown in Japan. He’s determined, a free spirit, and a bit of attitude.
In the US, he was just attitude.
It seems every other Sonic follows the Japanese version. Modern Sonic (Drummond, Griffith and Roger), Boom Sonic, Classic Sonic (Gens/Mania/Forces), IDW Sonic, Sonic X Sonic.
Sega did not want the Freedom Fighters because they contradict Sonic.
I don't know what you're talking about Boom sonic is a boring grandpa. Pontaff/Roger sonic is *nothing* but terrible jokes. Overall, Meta sonic is as far away from Japanese/Junichi/Ryan/Jason sonic as you can get.
'Ninja turtle action figure of Pepe Le Pew'. That made me burst out laughing. It is the perfect description of Geoffery St John.
he killed the boy😭💀
Sally was always one of my favorite characters. She's such a strong female character, and an awesome opposition to the typical princess trope
Exactly and not an brat like amy in my opinion😩
Well I like both Amy and Sally cus Amy is like that anime girl who has a crush on u and I feel like on the most recent comics they made her a little less how do u say..........OBSESSED and Sally is that concentrated girl dealing with those problems but still has a girly side
@@implimentsomethinghereloli8690 yeah but amy being less obsessed doesn't make an difference she's just getting Sally's character traits, you can tell and amy is an yandre not like an fake anime girl, plus how many fucking times has she threatened sonic it's childish and selfish and that's why i hate her character and always will!😡
@@implimentsomethinghereloli8690 Amy in the current comics is a borings Mary Sue version of Sally. She's ain't cheerful and optimistic like she was back then which is what her character is MEANT to be. IDW Amy is Sally without the character development
Best female SEGA/Archie character's
1. Blaze
2. Sally
3. Nicole
4. Rouge
5. Tangle
6. Whisper
7. Bunnie
8. Wave
9. Cream
10. Tikal
11. Sticks
12. Boom Amy(she's cool)
Amy isn't a fan girl and that's not how her character started off either, she admires sonic and loves him, she not just some fan girl she's his friend and she's worked hard on improving herself as a person and becoming stronger so that she can help out sonic because she loves adventuring with him.
Sorry but that's literally what she was and I honestly can't stand the way she acted for a long time. She only just got some what likeable and that's because she stopped chasing him
@@sgnanbu2484 I get if you started tolerating Amy in Boom but don't pretend that she only became likable once Sega turned her into a false role model.
Yeah I remember that she was a plenty capable and interesting character in Sonic Adventure. Then they totally drop that a couple games later.
@@MilesTraveler You know I actually like her origins as a fangirl. In the Archie comics she was a little girl who grew up in Merica during Robotnik's reign and heard stories of a heroic blue hedgehog named Sonic and began to write tons of fan mail to him and after being rescued by him vowed to fight along side him and the Freedom Fighters. With the help of a magic ring and some training from Julie-Su, in about a year, Sally acknowledged has a fully fledged member of the team. Amy to Sonic is like Deku to All Might. Deku who grew up watching All Might saving people as a little boy and wanted nothing more than to become a hero like his idol who strives to protect the happiness and smiles of those around him. Amy who while has a huge crush goes above and beyond a fangirl sits by the sidelines but a fangirl who worked to become the kind of hero like her role model. Also in Archie there was a moment where she wished to become older but it only made physically older and still had the mind of a child. I actually like this because to me it means the idealistic child that wanted to fight bad guys and refuses to give up did not die. Ad this brings me to my personal favorite moment in Archie Sonic; after suffering some repeated losses after losing Sally, Antoine and Bunnie, Sonic had fallen into a depressed state believing that the Freedom Fighters are done for. But it was Amy (along with Tails) who snapped him out of it; to quote Amy: "You didn't quit when you got arrested. You didn't quit when Robotnik came back. You didn't quit when we lost old Mobotropolis, or Knothole, or our families, or any other time! So get up! We've got Freedom Fighters to save!". This to me sums up Amy's character; even if the world has gone down hill and even in the face of her hero losing his will to fight, the child like spirit in her heart refuses to cave in to despair and instead re inspire her hero to continue the fight because even he has given up she hasn't and she has him to thank him for that.
she was alovable little girl who looked up to sonic, but not obsessive to just not care abt anybody around her. taht scene where she asked sonic to take care of a flicky that eggman was chasing after was just so sweet. when she defended a robot, instead of letting sonic bash him was a heroic act to her charcter developlment. but then sega just ruined it and made her an obsessive brat that would marry sonic at any cost.
Honestly, Sally's redesign from the most recent rebooted Archie comics had to be her BEST DESIGN YET!! It was just perfect!
Yet it barely lasted in comparison to the inappropriate one
So that’s embarrassing lol
On Monday, August 31, 2020 in his Bumblekast Q&A, Ian Flynn once again addressed the matter regarding Sally and the Freedom Fighters. He explained that he and his staff still weren't allowed by SEGA (Sonic Team) to use those characters in IDW Sonic. He also explained in clear details that even if he and his staff and the creative editor were given the authorization to use them in IDW Sonic that absolutely NO reference can be made to Archie Sonic or Sonic SatAM as they're 100% off the table and he stated that Archie Sonic is gone. He made it clear that if they're ever permitted to use them in IDW Sonic that he and his staff wouldn't have full creative freedom to do whatever they want with the Freedom Fighters as guidelines would have to be followed (there were no mentions of those mandates as they only pertained to Archie Sonic, not IDW Sonic).
Ian further stated that he, Evan Stanley, his staff and the creative editor would have to figure out how the Freedom Fighters would even fit into IDW Sonic, what purpose they would serve, and if their purpose is needed in the comics depending on the events in the story since unlike Archie Sonic, IDW Sonic takes place in an already established canon modern Sonic universe from the video games with a largely extensive cast of characters who fill in most of the required roles given to them. He added that new characters like Tangle, Whisper, Jewels, Dr. Starline, Rough and Tumble fill in the other roles that were left vacant at the time. Ian explained that with Sonic SatAM, everything was new; Tails was so new that he was added into the show at the last second, which was why he wasn't in many of the adventures Sonic went on and why Rotor substituted as Sonic's best friend and genius mechanic. He added that classic Amy Rose was exclusive to Sonic CD and didn't exist in the other Sonic game mediums at the time or in the other Sonic cartoon shows at the time either, and Knuckles wasn't invented yet. He said that even though Archie Sonic comics built up from that however, none of it counts at all as what can be used in IDW Sonic. In other words, everything from Archie Sonic is completely irrelevant and off the table.
He went on to explain that Sally and the Freedom Fighters can't just be in IDW Sonic comics as fan service alone just to say they exist in the comics just to please a certain group of audience that want those characters. Ian elaborated in explaining that the Freedom Fighters need to have a reason and a needed purpose to exist in IDW Sonic and he repeated in saying that all events that happened in Archie Sonic doesn't count. He explained how the philosophy of Sally and the Freedom Fighters being brought into IDW Sonic would have to be carefully planned. He said that Sally's character type is rare in the IDW Sonic comics as most of the characters are free agents acting on their own and Nicole would be closely tied to Sally and Bunny would be unique in her own way. He stated that the major problems would be figuring out how to fit Rotor and Antoine into the comics since Tails is canonically established as Sonic's best friend and technician genius thus Rotor would be too synonymous to Tails. He further added that Antoine would have to be completely reconstructed since he was originally a mildly offensive stereotype of a cowardly Frenchmen and his tired trope was overused in both Archie Sonic and Sonic SatAM.
Ian also stated that fans trying to pressure him to add Sally and the Freedom Fighters into IDW Sonic won't work. He stated that if the Freedom Fighters are ever allowed into IDW Sonic, it will be because of polite fan response and because of a lot of people from a lot of different levels working towards that goal. Beyond that, it's completely out of his hands.
And Ian Flynn isn’t leaving Sonic either. Evan Stanley has to collaborate with Ian Flynn with the new comic issues for the new story arc. He’ll be returning as head writer after Evan’s time as head writer is over. He stated this in another video. Evan Stanley will be focusing more on world-building as she feels that the game characters need a break after that whole world ending Metal Virus story arc. And no, she doesn’t have the authorization to use the Freedom Fighters either in the upcoming issues. Fans need to understand that blaming Ian Flynn, Evan Stanley and IDW Publishing won’t bring Sally and the Freedom Fighters back. Sonic is the legal property of Sonic Team and SEGA of Japan. They would have to go through Sonic Team and SEGA of Japan now as IDW Sonic is canon to their modern Sonic video games.
I know a lot of western fans love Sally Acorn and want to see her and the Freedom Fighters brought into IDW Sonic. But the truth of the matter is that if Sally and Freedom Fighters were brought into IDW Sonic, they won’t be anything like their Archie Sonic/Sonic SatAM counterparts and the fans of those characters will no doubt be heavily upset and disappointed to see that nothing about Sally and the Freedom Fighters from Archie Sonic or Sonic SatAM was carried over.
This needs to be upvoted so more people can see.
@@dbzsonic1069 I know that Archie Sonic and SatAM fans will hate this, but this is the reality and truth regarding Sally and the Freedom Fighters and this is coming from Ian Flynn himself. Though Sonic's and Amy's co-creator, Naoto Ohshima, tweeted on Twitter that he likes the Sonic SatAM cartoon however, he admitted once that he never read Archie Sonic comics and Sonic Team and SEGA of Japan never acknowledged or accept anything about Archie Sonic or Sonic SatAM. When SEGA of America tried to introduce Sally and the Freedom Fighters into the Sonic games through Sonic-X-treme during the mid-1990s for the SEGA Saturn, both the president and executives of SEGA of Japan were unimpressed, looked down on it and disregarded it as worthless and Sonic's co-creator, Yuji Naka, told the team that was working on it "Good Luck" before leaving as he and Sonic Team wanted no part of that project and they didn't want Sally and the Freedom Fighters in their Sonic video games.
Some time later after that, Yuji Naka, infuriated that they were using his 3D Saturn game engine he developed for NiGHTS into Dreams on that Sonic-X-treme project without his legal authorization, called and adamantly told the president of SEGA of America to stop using his game engine on that project and he stated that Sally and the Freedom Fighters don't fit with what Sonic is traditionally about and that the canon game characters' stories and development should only be handled by Sonic Team, and he threatened to quit SEGA if they refused to stop using his game engine which he stated was only for Sonic Team's use. The loss of Yuji Naka's game engine heavily crippled the project and with team members later getting sick, they were unable to complete the project and it was eventually cancelled and scrapped all together with only a few developed demos that were on hand.
Sonic Team and SEGA of Japan want both the IDW Sonic comics and the upcoming IDW Sonic classic Sonic mini-series to focus primarily and dominantly on their game characters and on the canon events that happened in their classic and modern Sonic video games with no reference made to Sonic SatAM or Archie Sonic. With the new characters that are created for IDW Sonic, SEGA (Sonic Team) are deeply involved in their creation and they must meet SEGA's (Sonic Team's) final approval before being used in the comics. In a video chat that Ian Flynn was having with a few colleagues some time ago, he explained that it's not like how it was during their days with Archie Comics when he and his staff could create characters inhouse and use them in the Archie Sonic comics. With IDW Sonic, he stated that they have guidelines from SEGA (Sonic Team) that they have to follow as both the new characters and new stories must follow their Sonic video games canonically. Also, with regards to Blaze's palace, which was finally seen in IDW Sonic issues #30 through 32, Ian Flynn stated that its artistic design was developed by SEGA (Sonic Team), not by IDW publishing, and the Tangle and Whisper logo was also designed by SEGA (Sonic Team), not by IDW publishing, and the official IDW Sonic 2020 Annual cover was developed by Yui Karasuno of Sonic Team. Unlike with Archie Sonic and Sonic SatAM, Sonic Team and SEGA of Japan are deeply involved with both IDW Sonic comics and the live action Sonic movies as IDW Sonic is being sold in Japanese on Sonic Channel and the live action Sonic movie and merchandise are also advertised and sold on Sonic Channel.
And in Ian's September 21, 2020 Bumblekast Q&A, someone asked if there would ever be a crossover between IDW Sonic, Archie Sonic and Sonic The Comic. Ian Flynn replied that would come with the concept that everyone would agree to that and that there's so many parties involved in that that he, Ian Flynn, don't think that would be possible. He added that if someone did all of the legal work and asked him, Ian, to contribute, then sure he'd be part of that. But he concluded not to look for that on the horizon, in other words, it's not going to happen.
@@dbzsonic1069 25 people is not a small number.
An ex. behind the scenes employee said that the Ian Flynn mandates were a lie.
@@TheEzekiel300 A lot of fans have been saying this as they couldn’t find any official documents of those supposed mandates on SEGA of America’s websites.
20:40 - I mean to be fair, Sonic IS a monarch now according to Black Knight
YEAH, I WENT THERE
To be fair, I almost went back and edited in some Black Knight jokes, but I was too damn tired :P
@@GameApologist do you prefer chicken or turkey on a sandwich.
@Inky The Fox YT 🤣🤣
@@skimbeeble8115 Either one works for me, but why?
@Inky The Fox YT You're not you when you're hungry, have a Snickers
"An an American!, There is an American among us!"
Also Mecha Sally looks so badass. I thought it was lame how they got rid of her by rebooting the series/time line, then only having Nicole glitch out and transfer her memories to the new timeline's Sally. I would have loved to see Sonic some how get Mecha Sally her consciousness back, most likely at a terrible cost. Then have her live with the aftermath for a bit as living weapon. There is so much potential ranging from seeing her fighting against Robotnik with the weapons he built into her, to having to cope with no longer being flesh and blood.
timelines*
Personally, I always loved Sally (Edit: “Maybe that makes me a simp-munk…” XD). She was a strong, smart, and capable character that had a nice balance of strict bossiness and tender-hearted compassion for others. She also had solid backstory and some good character developments that made me appreciate her even more. That being said, she’s definitely one of my favorite Sonic characters (though, admittedly, I found her romantic pairing with Sonic himself to be kinda odd for some of the reasons mentioned in the video).
HOWEVER, as much as I wish she could’ve stuck around, with her timeline having been implemented with the main canon, I’m not sure it would be for the better. As we saw with Archie comics, they took the solid story set up by the show and, after a while, went off the deep end with it (for instance, I did not like the Mecha Sally bit of some of the other nutty storylines they decided go with). I honestly don’t have enough confidence to say that the same wouldn’t happen in the main canon as well. So maybe it’s better that she stays where she already works best (even if that means we get stuck with characters like Amy). It’s hard to say.
How is she smart when she is not wearing clothes ?
When it comes to Sonic the characters either love him or hate him. Sally knows Sonic. Sally calls him out on his bullshit but still sees and loves the real him below the bluster that's brave, free, and true.
Exactly sonally was an awesome ship👍😎
@FortyFore you should read the comics early on Sally's character isn't the best(still an improvement on amy) but later on she became an really developed character
@Long-Tailed Charmander he's with her in the comics because his character is more deeper and developed than just sonic wanting freedom and running and he even told sally i guess i can slow down for you
@FortyFore your welcome bro😁✌
@Long-Tailed Charmander Because he has more friends with different personalities to bounce off of.
Sally acorn sounding like an actual chipmunk is so funny to me for some god forsaken reason
The only character I love more than Sonic himself. God I miss her in an actual cartoon, she's so badass ❤
Yes
SIMP
31:16 Random note about Sega World Sydney. It was actually in fact Sega of Japan, yes, from Japan, that spent the $60 million USD to build that park that featured Sally prominently, including costume mascots and merch. Sega of Japan actually had no issues with the character in the 90s.
I think what really hurt Sally the most is that in the early 2000s, the comics really go off of the rails and in directions that Sega didn't actually like, especially with the infamous #150 that had that horrible scene with Evil Sonic and Bunnie Rabbot that implied rape... That is the issue that would force Sega to make some changes on what writers could or couldn't do in the comic. Penders would quit the comic after #159 and has stated that he quit because starting with #157 he no longer was allowed the same amount of creative freedom that he once had. I wonder why? Issue #150 and a good portion of the comics of that era, were just awful. Sally being associated with the awfulness that was this era is what really damaged her brand as a character. Penders later causing the book legal issues certainly did Sally no favors.
In 2013 they reboot the comic, and it's actually really good, and it's honestly really underappreciated. Being free of the 100 Echidna ocs and all of the other clutter and garbage that got put into the book by Penders was honestly really good for the comic. The book was able to be a lot more focused on the main cast of the freedom fighters, with Sally, Bunnie, Nicole, and Amy all getting some really good story arcs highlighting them and developing their characters. I also really loved a lot of the antagonists in this era of the comic like the Eggman's Dozen and Breezy the Hedgehog, I personally think this is when the comic was at its best. Honestly I wished they had simply rebooted the comic in 2006 at the beginning of Flynn's run and purged all of the toxic elements then and there which would have allowed Sally and the other freedom fighters the the ability to shake off the stigma of the Penders era. As a bonus they would also been able to avoid all of the legal troubles that came later if they had, and the book would probably still be going. What could have been.
Game Apologist talking about relationships was all that I needed to smile for the rest of the week. Love your content man, keep it up.
Ya
Same here
This video made me cry... That isn't the the correct response, and probably throws my opinion out with the bathwater, but seriously. My emotional attachment to the original freedom fighters is immense, not just Sally, but the whole team. The Archie comics ran for long enough that we got to see the best and the worst of every character (Penders' madness included). I think it really speaks to the quality of the writers that after all that, so many of us still love those critters. Thank you for giving them a voice. Thank you for everything you've done. :D
Amen
I’ve recently been throwing around the idea of me trying take all of the franchise and turning it into a coherent story, and this video made me realize that I really need to read the Archie comics if I want to do that.
I know this is a late reply but good luck on your journey, especially when you are reading the comics written by Ken Penders.
Do it and post it somewhere!
Interesting...
You produce anything yet?
By the way, there is a fanfiction which has largely done that. It's one of my faves at the moment.
@@FuryanJedi13 I haven’t produced anything no. As you could imagine, there’s a lot of group to cover, and I’m still in the very early stages of developing it.
As for the fan fiction you mentioned, could you possibly send me a link. Perhaps I could use it as inspiration.
@@FuryanJedi13 Yeah I want to know what fan fiction too!
Sally definitely has to return. We need her in a game.
She was never in any of the games, Sega didnt make Sally, Sally was made by American writers for an American audience
Yes All Of You Guys Are Right! Sally Needs To Be In A Game!
Let's Tell Sega!!!
We don’t want a girl with no clothes in the games
1: No wonder Sonic isn't into Amy.
2: Sally should be seen more in the games not just as a love interest to Sonic, but as a playable character.
This person understands me
Also the fact that Amy is literally 12 and it would be creepy for Sonic to like her
@@blaiseplayz6740 well sonic is only 3 years older then Amy and 1 year older then Sally
@@blaiseplayz6740 also its been a while since sa2 so they would be much older maybe even early adults
Sally could have an Energy system and use the Elemental Shields as her ability, like Tails' Flight or Mighty's Ground Slam.
Sally Acorn = Princess Leia to Sonic Han Solo
Amy Rose = Sakura to Sonic Sasuke
Isn't Sonic a bit more like Naruto than Sasuke? If anything Shadow mirrors Sasuke.
@@chosenmibhar But Sakura is the same fangirling useless immature girl as Amy and she only fawned over Sasuke even if they didn't really match well
Amy is not nearly as useless as Sakura. She literally saved Sonic several times and can hold her own in a fight. And last I checked, Sonic never tried to kill Amy.
@@uniquethoughts95 her saving sonic is only in the more recent history. She isn't completely useless beforehand, but she never really added very much to the story/games she was a part of. Amy was just a token girl character. And alot of Amy's more recent developement is even because of Sally. They put her in Sally's shoes and gave her more of Sally's personality. I really do thing Amy and sonic do have the *chemistry* of sakura and sasuke. Which is a sad exchange when you look at what we had/could have with Sally and sonic.
@@fireemberess She saved Sonic in the SA2 and 06, so no it's not just in recent times. She was the reason Gamma (the robot from SA1), Shadow, and Silver decided to turn good. It's not because of Sally. Amy has done great things on her own. Why is it so hard for people to give her credit? Either way, Amy has a way healthier relationship with Sonic than Sakura does with Sasuke in my opinion. SEGA clearly saw something good in her character.
Sonic characters: *exist*
Rule 34 artists:"allow us to introduce ourselves"
In a nutshell
I'd love Sally to appear as a playable character in official games anytime. I know her since I was a child watching Sonic SatAM, and that would be a heavy nostalgic impact
Girls with no clothes are not allowed in this franchise let alone a playable character
@@iceman92211 She has boots
Honestly got really big Lady and the Tramp vibes from Sonic and Sally, a fun loving, thrill seeking scoundrel paired with a more down to earth girl who’s still ready to let her hair down once in a while but honestly I think that’s the reason I can see the whole king Sonic thing panning out, the Tramp managed to settle down with Lady, she managed to ground him and he loved her enough to change and even still, the Tramp kept his wild side and I think we could see the same thing with Sonic.
Agreed.
That’s cool
Agreed 💯%
Well said my friend 👊🏾👊🏾
34:57 _Thank you._ It's so good to hear that from someone else.
Whether people like the comics or not, the fact is they had stories. They had depth. They _went_ places and gave us things to keep our interest, characters to get behind, and even lore to wonder about. They gave us a world.
The games? Maybe we're on the same planet, maybe we're not. At the end of the day, it doesn't matter because fast.
While Sonic's whole thing is speed, the games try to put in a story and...well, falling on your face at that speed hurts.
Sally herself and the dynamic between her and Sonic were some of my favorite things from the Archie comics, and I followed those for quite a while. She was so fleshed out and given such a background that she practically rivaled Sonic in some form of Chosen One status. She's no Xena, but she was still a warrior princess, willing to take the front lines if it meant saving the day.
People can say what they will about her design. Personally, I much preferred her boots'n'vest look to the cartoonish, fully dressed one, especially considering much of the cast was practically nude. But, I feel she was a good _character._
I would genuinely like to see the games do something with her and the rest of the Freedom Fighters.
Silver keeps popping up and always feels out of place. The only time he didn't was in '06 and...well...
It's so funny that as a 13 year old kid I wrote an entire story, basically forces but wayyy better understanding that concept! Sega can't reconcile the past with its modern era and it has them stuck in neutral for the last 20 years!! I wrote around this by basically saying that Sonic's world exists in another part of the galaxy that Kintobor discovered accidentally but man. Eggman is a human! Obviously he had to have been born on earth! Its not hard guys! Sheesh. Sigh
"It's no use!" (repeat adnauseam)
@@jaredpatterson1701 Sounds like the beginnings of a decent story.
I miss Sally so much. 😢
Your experience was my experience. I started off hateing but grew to love and respect her. Man she is such a well written character in the right hands
You should’ve continue hating on her due to her lack of clothing
Gotta say, I known little to nothing about Sally, but damn you've sparked my interests.
Alternatively Title:
Adult Ben 10 Explains which Furry Animals He'd Like to See Procreate
Bro don't do this too me
@JustVictor 17 I think I missed something.
@JustVictor 17 Yes, you need.
lmao
This made me laugh lmao
Cybershell returns, more Sonic coming and Nick makes a video on Sally all in a short span? You aren't fooling me 2020, what's the catch?
Later that day: *strange face-hugger like creature discovered*
The catch? Sega are still dumb
Makoto Yuki they always have been
Joshua Pacman is this the part when I get shot?
Makoto Yuki give me bobux
Holy shit, Sally went from being a character I barely even knew much nor cared about to one of my favorite Sonic characters after watching this video! I also didn’t know that she and Lola shared the same voice actress, which is pretty interesting. Good job dude!
Why would you start liking her when she is not wearing clothes ?
You hit the nail on the fricking head about relationships at 26:24 man.
Way To Go!!!!
Amy's my favorite Sonic character, but she's no replacement for Sally in any respect. Acting otherwise is disrespectful to both characters. I miss Sally's hardy, rebellious streak and what it meant for the series. I miss the way she and Sonic worked together, romantically and otherwise. There's no one else who matches him like she does. Amy's awesome, but she deserves someone who's better for her, more serious and grounded.
Thanks for posting!
Exactly
As a Sonic fan, I think both Amy and Sally are great.
@Ai7A Agreed, brotha!
Like maybe shadow. (Not current shadow of course)
@@iananderson4754 Absolutely! And yeah, Amy's too young for a relationship with *anyone* right now if you ask me.
For Sally, we rally.
The best counterpart to Sonic's character, and an independent character of her own. Thank you for this video. I've loved SatAM, and only read a few of the comics as a kid, but she had such a better flushed out personality that it made her a great character. Her being a great role model, and both intelligent, resourceful while at the same time having such a burden to carry made her a great motivator for the stories she's in.
I also love that Sally knows how to deal with Sonic, makes him think about his actions and about other people instead of just being a "cool dude with atitude" that never learns from mistakes.
I like Amy's character, but when her existence doesn't revolve around Sonic's. She can be interesting, but she throws it away when next to him, and was always given lame stories in the games, almost like a filler character. For me her best iteration was in Sonic Boom (ironically another western written media). She had a funny and enjoyable personality there, and she doesn't have to be like Sally to be great, she just needs to be her own hedgehog.
agreed! though Sally isn't a favorite of mine (i've never read the comics so there's no way for me to have a good opinion on her) she's definitely a great character, her being in the games isn't really possible (since she's not by SEGA of Japan) but her being in IDW has a big chance
and off topic, i kinda disagree with how Amy in Sonic Boom is the best version of her, she seemed too rude and arrogant most of the time and her crush on Sonic didn't feel like one (though it was cute in a few instances like when he delivered her a meal) she was missing her sweet and childish demeanor and personality from the modern games, i hope they add that in IDW in the future
Never been a huge Amy fan. I miss Sally. As the Archie comics went on, she brought out the best in Sonic. It was because of her, I feel, that his character became more mature and less into himself. It's because of Sally that I generally find strong female protagonists more interesting than dudes (if well-written, that is).
@@aaronsarchive82 Sally is a perfect example of a good female MC, i'd say Amy is too (currently, not in the 2000s-2010s , she's not "bad" but she's not written to be like a protagonist and served more as a supporting character, hence her childish nature) but that's just me loving her and relating to Amy
@@candy_ribbons I think I should re-phrase myself. I do like Amy as a character, especially in the comics, but I still feel like she has a lot of untapped potential, especially when it comes to romantic relationships. Sally felt like a full character to me, but Amy just seems undeveloped. She has a bigger chance to shine now, so maybe we'll see more of it in the comics now. (I haven't watch much of Sonic Boom so idk how different her character is there.)
Aaron Reese the problem I feel is that SEGA just didn't see her as anything besides "Sonic's annoying 'girlfriend'" in the Adventure and Modern era and currently, it feels like they just don't know what to do with her so they can please her sad haters that begged them to make her mature, I really do agree she's really underdeveloped and she has so much potential to be considered a much more important character
As for her in Sonic Boom, she's just an arrogant and bossy copy of Sally at least in the tv show, in the games she's fine but nothing special
Well deserved tears in my eyes for Sally
How do you have tears for a character like this ??
I will never forget Sally Acorn, the Knothole Freedom Fighters, or any of the characters from Archie, Underground, or the DIC cartoon! And, to my dying day, I will curse the name PENDERS!!!!
Nah, blame Sega of Japan with you heart and soul, even without Penders they wouldn't give a damn about these characters
You need to forget her because she’s very inappropriately designed
If Sonic's 30th year anniversary game is revealed to be called "Sonic: Mobius", I would lose my shit
Not gonna happen, but it’ll be amazing. Sonic Forces had a very good chance at introducing The Freedom Fighters to the video games canon, even if it’s understand a different origin. It’s not too different- maybe you play as Sally instead of the Custom Made character. Or instead- just take out classic sonic.
@@TGM_Productions Any chance to cut Classic Sonic off the series, i take it.
Dude, I had a hypothetical game called *Mobius* I was working on!
Nice-
@@dragondelsur5156 unfortunately we will most likely see classic Sonic again for the 30th anniversary and hopefully he'll get his own game instead of interfering with modern Sonics game
Sally cool, but my girl that I always liked from the comics is Bunnie Rabbot. She was the dopest (probably not a word, but whatever lol).
Yeah, she has a ton of potential as a game character too.
yeah dud
You should do one on the sonic villian that SEGA doesnt want you to forget about
*cough cough* zavok *cough*
This isn’t the video where you should type this comment
I kinda disagree about how IDW made Amy into the Sally figure, mainly because Amy’s characteristics were still at play and the fact that the comic makes a point to mention how Amy is in over her head when leading the Restoration, to the point that she gives the leader title to someone else. Plus, the beginning of IDW was based on Forces to technically blame Pontac and Graph for that plot poi t rather than Ian Flynn.
Flynn deserves better goddammit!!!!
Oh absolutely, he was the only thing holding Archie Sonic together after he-who-shall-not-be-named pulled the infamous BS. Man is constantly thrown into the worst, most restrictive writing situations and still manages to make things work in spite of executive meddling.
This! I definitely agree as someone who, shipping completely aside, is just an Amy fan in general. The lack of attention she’s gotten throughout the series is exactly part of why her characterization and flanderization issues began in the first place and I’d love for her traits to be highlighted more, not as someone completely new or different, or Sally, but as Amy Rose at her best. (Heck, I could even see some good friendship or banter between the two.)
22:44 thats like the sweetest thing ever. knowing sally has to deal with him going off to save the day like it were yesterday when he's a committed father and husband and he could get hurt, and she's upset about it, but she still kisses him after a quick spat. thats love
Exactly.
41:38 Try telling that to Sega, lmao. Heroes didn't do well enough? Better scrap the whole Team Mechanic concept. Shadow didn't do well enough? Guess we can't have any solo games for other Sonic characters anymore. Sonic 06 failed because it was rushed to all hell? Bye-bye Adventure style gameplay! Flawless logic on their part.
Unleashed was a failure by IGN standards? We need to go "back to our roots" when Sonic was "cartoony".
Sonic Free Riders used Kinect? No more Riders games.
Sega and Sonic Team rejected Sega Technical Institute's Super Mario 64 gameplay formula before Sonic Adventure series came out.
I mean Sonic Twist as cancelled Sonic game.
That's Sega for you throwing ideas around like darts on to a dartboard until one of them sticks and they stay with it.
I think that the "fact" that Sally is "irrelevant non-canon character" and that it's "dead relationship" with Sonic makes it only better for the Sally fans to enjoy it. Because like Sonic in Black Knight would say: What good is a world that goes on forever?
Sally shouldn't ever come back. And Sally fans should never ask for her to come back.
Her story in SatAM and Archie was that she and Sonic knew each other ever since they were children. Just imagine Sally being thrown as another disposable character into the current games. NOW of all times. That would kill everything that was ever good about her for good. She would be such a different character and she would never be allowed to do anything.
Sonic and Sally had a story together in the comics and it basically concluded. Which means that they completed their story. Amy or any other character that is pushed with Sonic these days will always only get some repetitive episode of 'will they / won't they'. And it will never be in a story. It will always be only some background character dialog flavor.
The fact that there is a thick line behind Archie Sonic is not a cause for sadness. Quite the contrary. The repetitive, never ending status quo of Sonic is what is sucking all life from his character. It is so empty and meaningless, that I am glad that all the characters and stories from the old era when things mattered are gone and untouchable by Sega. If they wanna ruin some characters going forward, at least we know they won't ruin the Archie ones. If they introduced Sally now, they would make her a background character with no story, no history, and no relevance to the plot. And every interaction with her would feel as genuine as interaction between Sonic and his cheerleaders from Generations.
These days, all other franchises that are "revived" are corrupted and butchered. The fact that "Archie and SatAM is dead" is the only thing that may yet save it. You should hope it lasts and hope that Sega doesn't perform some forbidden franchise necromancy. If anything, we should thank Ken Penders for the lawsuit that likely protected us from Sega ever touching the Archie characters again.
I sadly yet honestly agree. Writers who cared created Sally. Those people are gone now and have nothing to do with Sega. Game Sonic is nothing like comic or satam Sonic. Mondern Game Sonic doesn't have enough personality to generate chemistry with anyone.
Man, I hate our world sometimes.
1:20 - Man, I came back to my Sonic phase from when I was a kid, and I was wondering what happened to Sallie, since she was a main character on THAT EXACTLY TV SHOW THAT I WATCHED AS A LITTLE KID. Goodness, the memories.