I love those moments when EliGE gives that casual smirk whenever Thorin breaks down CS concepts that require deep analytical insight to fully grasp. It's like a silent acknowledgment between two experts-real recognizes real.
The good point about Mouz playing well even while losing on stage, comes from a subject matter expert. Elige, after all, looks good even while losing on Complexity :D
@@nofluffagain because in the past thorin used to throw shades on elige from time to time calling him a diva, He said thats what he heard from behind the scenes from elige teammates in the past
a journalist is going to drop stories if it makes sense. Im pretty sure there are a couple of inteviews with ex team liquid players that mention how he used to be@@jianchen7450
@@hayden0959 It felt like Twistzz and Elige had a falling out at the end tbh and now the power dynamic is in twistzz's favor so i think he'd probably veto a elige aquisition to not endanger his position rn - maybe in half a year if the experiment fails but by then elige would be gone (at elast i hope so) Just gimme the s1mple elige reunion in falcons lol
Hey commenters who think they caught Maui in a gotcha because he’s anti snap tap but pro jump throw bind, even Elige acknowledges that jump throw does NOT take skill, counter strafing does, hope that helps
This is an awesome concept, to have two analysts have a certified pro there to give a first person insight to what it’s like playing on vertigo for instance, it gives a unique perspective that you’d otherwise never get.
I think people are definitely acknowledging Donk and how crazy his stats are for his role, and I think for most people he's still the clear favourite for #1. The thing is that ZywOo has come closer because he's now won a Big Event MVP, which is clearly really important for HLTV, that's really what people are talking about. The upcoming tournaments will show whether Donk is actually still able to put up the insane numbers he could when he entered the Tier 1 scene, or whether the top teams have now adapted to his crazy playstyle.
@@44r0n-9 I think the terrible cologne run puts him 2 for now but I think that if he can put up the same stats he has been all year while being an entry, he should still be 1
They just check how many ticks you have both A and D activated, if you use snaptap, null binds or whatever it's impossible to have them pressed at the same time when you peek.
the jumpthrow actualy adds to the quality od CS as a game. It unlocks part of the strategic side of the game whereas snap tap just raises the skill floor. It is about philosophy I think. And I think it is consensus that we want a better strategic game rather than teams deathmathing each other because the game is designed to be only who can headshot one another better.
When will the stats take into account the player and the opponents equipment value? This way we can actually take into account eco frags, the AWP being OP, players hitting 1 deags on full bought players. Of course there is some balancing and it wouldnt actually be the literal cost of the weapons in game, bc then M4's seem more OP than AKs, but it wouldnt be hard to balance it out.
Normally counterstrafing to a complete stop has four steps in total - pressing down a to move out, lift up a, press d for a certain period of time, release d. Snaptap is disastrous because it interferes with the interactions between different keys. Thus step 2 can be overridden or overlapped with step 3 because the keyboard is doing the job of deactivating one key and activating another simultaneously. RT is not as controversial because it simply minimises the response time for the detection of actuation and deactivation by tracking the movements of keys during the entire travel, but it does not skip any steps listed above and definitely not 'two things at the same time.' RS from Wooting is teetering on the edge of interfering with interactions between different keys because it detects the key pressed down the furthest and only actuates that. But it only deactivates the key(s) during its travel back up. Thus it minimises the time a user takes for deactivation, but it does not interfere with the games programming for the actuation of a key, as the user still have to do step 2, just with its duration shortened significantly. It acts more like a 'key lift assist.'
I say yes to in-game jump throw binds. Also being able to bind key combinations in-game settings would be nice. In the console we can do that of course but making it easier would be nice.
was describing the CS pro scene to a friend the other day and i theorized that the reason NA has historically been so weak compared to other regions is our lack of internet cafes! gaming culture is so tied to personal PCs that it's less accessible, games are less discoverable, and people get into them at older ages. we have so few players who've like, been playing since they were 8 with their friends cause they had an internet cafe 5 mins from their house
Interesting theory, but I think it's more likely to be a work ethic and mindset issue. Many of these players, particularly in NA, take no pride in what they do. It's just a paycheck - a conveniently massive one.
The part people miss about the loss of 'QOL' binds is that its not about removing them but removing a grey area of using binds to automate. It is creating a clear line of delineation between single action commands and dual action commands (ie., minor to major automation) This before we pick apart the argument that it is "just a QOL feature" and "you don't want to see people miss smokes", which is it, QOL or an important skill feature that can be missed. Not mention that "Valve wants us to do Jump+Throws" ignores that perhaps Valve still wants it to be a skill but let it slide til now. Just petition Valve to put these features in the game and they can choose the ones they want.
the biggest thing about counter strafing is that we actually get to see now that people are looking at counter strafing data is that people who we thought were movement gods arnt actually good at counter strafing.
Elige himself, Twistzzz, NAF...That's just who plays rn and comes to mind. Players like shroud and steel used to play. NA will never be a powerhouse sure, but we always have a spot.
Well I dont know about Elige, but it was really enjoyable watching Vitality vs Navi final. The fact that teams have managed to make Nuke and Inferno T sided is probably an issue of the mr12.
Best example of the insane Vitality T entries was Spinx on Inferno in the GF, killing one in pit from balcony then spray transfer 2 players on site in a instant, all headshots. And the fact they were 3 Ts on balcony made it hard for the CTs to shoot anyone, and even if Spinx died, who's behind him with an AK? Fucking ZywOo. (2-8 on Inferno if you wanna check)
Isn't someone missing a jump-throw under high pressure situation the same as missing a strafe in the same situation? You ban snap-tap, it is only fair to ban other things which make your game easier like jump-throw binds.
They did… Just found out yesterday when I was playing face it and kept chucking my smokes in front of myself. Aaand nading myself :) I was very pleased with this change yes yes😂 Also snap tap and jump throw are very different mechanics that weigh wayyyy differently on the outcome of a game.
Exactly. They keep saying it's so easy to smoke even without the binds but then right after complain about missing because they don't have the bind anymore.
I hope if Elige doesn’t get a shakeup from his teammates with a change soon, that he seriously considers the move to eu. He’s young enough to do a Twistzz and come back after a couple of years to a legacy org that has the money to pay tier 1 salaries. Even if he’s fallen off in a few years he would still farm NA on return
I wish -yeki +elige could happen. I still believe in Yekindar but I don’t believe he’s going to reach the level Elige is at right now and it would be amazing to see the Twistzz/Elige/Naf trio play together again. I know it’ll never happen tho :(
Snap tap is bad = valve update, now detectable and kicks you out. At the same time you can use spinbot without detection or shoot 5 awp shots at once. Go figure.....
Donk is putting up the same or better ratings not only as an entry. But with WAY LESS RECOURSES. Everyone else even close to his rating is getting awp drops 3-4 times a game. He’s putting up those number using way less of his team’s economy. He’s still the best player in the world
Elige point about in general missing "easy shots" is somewhat valid, yet there was nothing micro about that wiff from ticket to pit, that was the most crucial shot in that mirage. It was the most basic standard peek you could have without a flash or any utility to cause any disruption in focus, no wide swing, no jiggle at the angle. Weird to make excuses for him tbh. Also same goes for the Zywoo 1v3 clutch mirage A retake, yes the first shot missed since he jumped at a lucky timing, but the second shot....... Jesus christ there is no excuse for that seriously And those 3 shots weren't all blatant wiffs during that map either maybe half if even that, those are just the worst ones, that had the most negative impact.. There's a reason why jL cried after the game, and idk if people noticed how w0nderful looked next to him when he saw it when they received the silver medal on stage. Just FYI I'm rarely a hater, and in fact I'm a long term Na'Vi fan, and I actually like w0nderful as well, but when shit like this happens it needs to addressed so it can be fixed, can't just ignore it.
Maui: "snap tap is bad because people can't make mistake in high pressure situation" also Maui: "Jump throw bind is good because people would not do mistake in high pressure situation"
This. I mean it takes skill to perfectly push the right buttons in the right moment to have the right throw. With jumpthrow binds that skill is gone. And if you miss nades it's on you. Better players will miss nades less and will differentiate them from the worse players. It is absolutely a skill issue. Besides if Elige is saying it's easy without binds, then what is the problem of banning them??
@@ourboyhemingway Maybe, but missing a smoke or flash is far more impactful than counter strafe 0.1 sec faster and they all argue about importance of human erorr. Hypocrites.
If they are banning snaptap will they ban rapid trigger? Thinking of getting a hall effect keyboard but unsure if rapid trigger is gonna get hit by the ban hammer
Snap tap automatically gives priority to the last pressed out of two keys at an inhuman speed (essentially instant), while rapid trigger only mitigates the mechanical delay involved with releasing a key where the switch has to physically return to it's normal state. There isn't a world where rapid trigger can be considered cheating. As far as in-game detection is concerned, I'm not sure, but for what it's worth I've played a couple games since the patch using the Wooting 60HE and not been kicked or anything.
22:20 I dont understand this argument at all. Maui talks about snaptap-esque features removing the chance to mess up in high pressure situations and now argues that jump binds should be allowed so you dont mess up in high pressure situations? And then Elige says that jumpthrow binds arent a skill thing because they are easy but also at the exact same time if you remove it then pros will miss spokes? How does this line up thinking make any sense?
am i the only one who has had zero issues with jump throw consistency just pressing space and throwing? valve claims they added a system to make jump throws consistent and from I've seen it works fine
Because their muscle memory for the last 10 years has been using a jumpthrow bind. Any moron with hands can press their spacebar and release mouse1 at the same time.
imo it is pro-player cope because it's just what they're used to. I like Elige, but I think his reasoning doesn't make sense. It's so much easier to police "one button can't do two things" than "well we don't want one button to do two things in most cases but here are the cases that it's okay". If Valve wants jump throws to be easier (and they are already easy...), they'll just add a setting for it.
If AWPERS have the advantage in Survival stats then Riflers have the advantage in ADR stats. Also you can definitely fake a KPR stats with exit frags and ecos. I do agree Donk gets ignored sometimes. But he’s still in the lead for me with ZywOo behind alongside m0nesy.
Jump throw bind shouldn't be in pro play and here's why. They take all the variance out of the smoke play. You can in theory never miss a smoke. Throw the same smoke every time. Now take it away for one tournament. Watch how many smokes are missed and how more exciting it is. 2v2 and the t player misses his smoke that changes everything. Guaranteed smokes is the same as guaranteed counterstrafe. This is the most skilled esport imo, and players want to make it less skillful. So anyone can throw the pro smokes. That's lame put skill back into the game don't take it out.
I usually don’t go to comment sections however for this one I just have to. So I found out that jump-throw was gone in my face it yesterday when I chucked nades at myself, I was not too happy. However I can manage being without it and I’ll be fine. I can learn to smoke without it… Now since you think snap-tap and jump-throw are the same essentially. Can you tell me how I can compete against someone using snap-tap? Because as I mentioned I can learn to smoke without jump-bind but I cannot compete with hardware ie snap-tap. Artificially counter-strafing for my opponents whilst mine is only my mechanical input. Also the whole missing smokes makes it more exciting angle is not a very skilled take on the matter. Watching tactics unfold as they were meant to and then having the other team try to counter it is much more intriguing than watching botched smokes everywhere.
22:02 To say that they're easy to hit, yet possible to miss under pressure, and saying at the same time that snaptap waters down skill sealing since you can't miss the counterstrafes, as they do happen sometimes with professional players too. Well then, you should agree also the same that missing a run jump throw can be missed sometimes, and it does require skill to successfully pull off in a high pressure situation, like hitting the counter strafe in a high pressure situation. There is a fist sized gaping hole in that logic that doesn't correspond with essentially the same question, with a slight difference in application.
Exactly. I can't tell how many times I've seen pros miss the Inferno CT smoke in CSGO (now virtually impossible to miss thanks to volumetric smokes). They even made it easier for people to do the jump throws and much more consistent than CSGO, to the point that there isn't much reason to have a jump throw bind. The bind was useful because CSGO was so difficult to consistently throw with the dynamic trajectory
If your smoke lineup requires three keys while moving and holding your legs crossed then it's not a real lineup, it's just one in a ten throw that you have convinced yourself is a legitimate move because you are allowed to cheat in game. Quality of life is not a real argument, if it's easy to do then just do it, if you miss a nade then apparently it wasn't easy to do. Why are you arguing two points at the same time.
All the arguments Elige used against snap tap. He used for jump throw bonds. If it's bad for snap tap it's bad for jump throw. Missing smokes is interesting it changes everything. You miss a smoke get fucked you messed up.
Maui looks like he just got out of prison but is ready to go back
yeah he just did 15 years, it explains how bad his camera is.
the days goes by and the takes get hotter
Only for a one time only heist mission with the boys
He's taken the fall for torzsi - APOLOGIZE to your chat Maui 😂
Mike Patton
Elige as a guest? this gonna be a banger, I know it!
My instant reaction 😅
Nice of Thorin to host a StarCraft pro
Elige's smile brings me much joy
I love those moments when EliGE gives that casual smirk whenever Thorin breaks down CS concepts that require deep analytical insight to fully grasp. It's like a silent acknowledgment between two experts-real recognizes real.
Yo Maui can you spot me real quick?
He can teach you cholo workout
The good point about Mouz playing well even while losing on stage, comes from a subject matter expert. Elige, after all, looks good even while losing on Complexity :D
col is low tier 2 without elige lol
Elige is potential top 5 for 2024. Shame his current org doesn't have the resources to field more talent.
Yall aint ready for Elige to leave CoL and look like Rock Lee when he took off the ankle weights
@@TheOrlandoLassus same with someone like xantares
Oof.
Wow I never expected elige to be a guest on this show.
and it fits so well
Why
@@nofluffagain because in the past thorin used to throw shades on elige from time to time calling him a diva, He said thats what he heard from behind the scenes from elige teammates in the past
Elige used to be a massive diva i think he know that himself. Adults can take critizism and be proffesional i know crazy @@jianchen7450
a journalist is going to drop stories if it makes sense. Im pretty sure there are a couple of inteviews with ex team liquid players that mention how he used to be@@jianchen7450
we're getting closer to the JL guest for snake and banter
Hopefully not as he is literally embodiment of Reddit big chungus
@@bokonoo77 what the heck is a reddit big chungus?
@@MauMautz something cancer im sure
@@MauMautzthe bunny, the myth, the legend…. The one and only Reddit Big Chungus
@@MauMautz WHOLESOME KEANU REEVES BIG CHUNGUS 💯 DOGGO R/PICS FRONTPAGE
There’s a career on the desk for EliGE if he ever wants it
I sure hope so. I need that Launders - Elige combo
He's got good insight and well spoken but a bit too milktoast and need some spice to be on a desk
I can't wait to see Elige back on a championship winning roster. Whether it's coL or somewhere else, he's still got so much greatness left in him.
elige and s1mple to falcons
reunite them
Why are we assuming that is gonna happen
Kick Yaki from Liquid and bring Elige back to where he belongs along side NAF and Twistzz
@@hayden0959 It felt like Twistzz and Elige had a falling out at the end tbh and now the power dynamic is in twistzz's favor so i think he'd probably veto a elige aquisition to not endanger his position rn - maybe in half a year if the experiment fails but by then elige would be gone (at elast i hope so)
Just gimme the s1mple elige reunion in falcons lol
@@hayden0959 no thanks dont want him malding every other round, been there done that
Always love seeing elige on a pod. The GOAT of NA
The two best commentators & analysts in CS. It's insane how much better you guys are than the usual people at ESL, etc.
i dont think im on the minority, but pros missing nades makes a good laugh for me
Now this is a massive pull
Glad to see Maui borrowing Kassads camera.
Hey commenters who think they caught Maui in a gotcha because he’s anti snap tap but pro jump throw bind, even Elige acknowledges that jump throw does NOT take skill, counter strafing does, hope that helps
I reckon most people never used jump throw bind in cs2, it's so easy to throw good smokes
i love having a player as a guest! getting more players would be super sick
damn Maui using his philosophy degree
Don't forget about his economics degree as well he is a double major
01:30:09 Elige's face after you say f___ is something!
Banger. Have EliGe back again sometime!
This is an awesome concept, to have two analysts have a certified pro there to give a first person insight to what it’s like playing on vertigo for instance, it gives a unique perspective that you’d otherwise never get.
I think people are definitely acknowledging Donk and how crazy his stats are for his role, and I think for most people he's still the clear favourite for #1. The thing is that ZywOo has come closer because he's now won a Big Event MVP, which is clearly really important for HLTV, that's really what people are talking about. The upcoming tournaments will show whether Donk is actually still able to put up the insane numbers he could when he entered the Tier 1 scene, or whether the top teams have now adapted to his crazy playstyle.
@@44r0n-9 I think the terrible cologne run puts him 2 for now but I think that if he can put up the same stats he has been all year while being an entry, he should still be 1
Elige with Thorin? this is gonna get spicy I just know it :D
They just check how many ticks you have both A and D activated, if you use snaptap, null binds or whatever it's impossible to have them pressed at the same time when you peek.
Great episode with an excellent guest. Love hearing Elige talk about CS.
the NA Hitman himself
The bald eagle himself 🦅
the jumpthrow actualy adds to the quality od CS as a game. It unlocks part of the strategic side of the game whereas snap tap just raises the skill floor. It is about philosophy I think. And I think it is consensus that we want a better strategic game rather than teams deathmathing each other because the game is designed to be only who can headshot one another better.
When will the stats take into account the player and the opponents equipment value? This way we can actually take into account eco frags, the AWP being OP, players hitting 1 deags on full bought players. Of course there is some balancing and it wouldnt actually be the literal cost of the weapons in game, bc then M4's seem more OP than AKs, but it wouldnt be hard to balance it out.
Elige is always such a great guest!
Normally counterstrafing to a complete stop has four steps in total - pressing down a to move out, lift up a, press d for a certain period of time, release d. Snaptap is disastrous because it interferes with the interactions between different keys. Thus step 2 can be overridden or overlapped with step 3 because the keyboard is doing the job of deactivating one key and activating another simultaneously. RT is not as controversial because it simply minimises the response time for the detection of actuation and deactivation by tracking the movements of keys during the entire travel, but it does not skip any steps listed above and definitely not 'two things at the same time.' RS from Wooting is teetering on the edge of interfering with interactions between different keys because it detects the key pressed down the furthest and only actuates that. But it only deactivates the key(s) during its travel back up. Thus it minimises the time a user takes for deactivation, but it does not interfere with the games programming for the actuation of a key, as the user still have to do step 2, just with its duration shortened significantly. It acts more like a 'key lift assist.'
I say yes to in-game jump throw binds. Also being able to bind key combinations in-game settings would be nice. In the console we can do that of course but making it easier would be nice.
was describing the CS pro scene to a friend the other day and i theorized that the reason NA has historically been so weak compared to other regions is our lack of internet cafes! gaming culture is so tied to personal PCs that it's less accessible, games are less discoverable, and people get into them at older ages. we have so few players who've like, been playing since they were 8 with their friends cause they had an internet cafe 5 mins from their house
Interesting theory, but I think it's more likely to be a work ethic and mindset issue. Many of these players, particularly in NA, take no pride in what they do. It's just a paycheck - a conveniently massive one.
The part people miss about the loss of 'QOL' binds is that its not about removing them but removing a grey area of using binds to automate.
It is creating a clear line of delineation between single action commands and dual action commands (ie., minor to major automation)
This before we pick apart the argument that it is "just a QOL feature" and "you don't want to see people miss smokes", which is it, QOL or an important skill feature that can be missed. Not mention that "Valve wants us to do Jump+Throws" ignores that perhaps Valve still wants it to be a skill but let it slide til now.
Just petition Valve to put these features in the game and they can choose the ones they want.
the biggest thing about counter strafing is that we actually get to see now that people are looking at counter strafing data is that people who we thought were movement gods arnt actually good at counter strafing.
Elige is a great guest, great episode as usual!
When elige said "leash", I swear I heard him say his own name instead
XD
Pog guest and great episode!!
❤
Pro player as guest. Damn ! 🔥🔥🔥
elige, it's already a one region game bro
what do you mean soon?
Elige himself, Twistzzz, NAF...That's just who plays rn and comes to mind. Players like shroud and steel used to play. NA will never be a powerhouse sure, but we always have a spot.
Its gonna be🔥
If they take out vertigo and put in train, cobblestone or cache this would be one of the best map pools IMO.
Elige Bad Point - Complexity need roster changes
This would have been hilarious lol
LFN CS continue to deliver. Thanks for the content
nice video right amount of banter and analysis
So glad someone said it😭 Please bring back Cobble, Train or Cache, so over dogshit vertigo. Sucks to play, sucks to watch.
Well I dont know about Elige, but it was really enjoyable watching Vitality vs Navi final. The fact that teams have managed to make Nuke and Inferno T sided is probably an issue of the mr12.
Best example of the insane Vitality T entries was Spinx on Inferno in the GF, killing one in pit from balcony then spray transfer 2 players on site in a instant, all headshots. And the fact they were 3 Ts on balcony made it hard for the CTs to shoot anyone, and even if Spinx died, who's behind him with an AK? Fucking ZywOo. (2-8 on Inferno if you wanna check)
1:00:25
That's during the cologne 2022 final🎉
ft elige !!!!!!!
Damn LFN CS is stepping up their game !!!!
The default laggy, inconsistent subtick movement needs to be fixed immediately. Banning null binds without doing that first is insane.
pre shit faced for this thanks for all the cs2 takes
Isn't someone missing a jump-throw under high pressure situation the same as missing a strafe in the same situation? You ban snap-tap, it is only fair to ban other things which make your game easier like jump-throw binds.
They did… Just found out yesterday when I was playing face it and kept chucking my smokes in front of myself. Aaand nading myself :) I was very pleased with this change yes yes😂 Also snap tap and jump throw are very different mechanics that weigh wayyyy differently on the outcome of a game.
Exactly. They keep saying it's so easy to smoke even without the binds but then right after complain about missing because they don't have the bind anymore.
100%
Skill issue @@chazedfame1498
@@JardTheRatskill issue
The Bald Beast in the flesh. Great episode.
I hope if Elige doesn’t get a shakeup from his teammates with a change soon, that he seriously considers the move to eu. He’s young enough to do a Twistzz and come back after a couple of years to a legacy org that has the money to pay tier 1 salaries. Even if he’s fallen off in a few years he would still farm NA on return
I wish -yeki +elige could happen. I still believe in Yekindar but I don’t believe he’s going to reach the level Elige is at right now and it would be amazing to see the Twistzz/Elige/Naf trio play together again. I know it’ll never happen tho :(
maui with the toaster camera love it
Snap tap is bad = valve update, now detectable and kicks you out. At the same time you can use spinbot without detection or shoot 5 awp shots at once. Go figure.....
i like the jump throw update
Straight fire guest
now that's a fucking guest!
We gotta get Maui jumping with scroll wheel ASAP
Loved Elige on this one. NA GOAT
I enjoyed Maui's Freddie Mercury cosplay here
Donk is putting up the same or better ratings not only as an entry. But with WAY LESS RECOURSES. Everyone else even close to his rating is getting awp drops 3-4 times a game. He’s putting up those number using way less of his team’s economy. He’s still the best player in the world
How did you guys get Elige as a guest ? Amazing
Absolute banger episode
Elige needs to grow some compassion for noobs.
Obv it doesnt change much for elige.
But there's pros with far worse movement.
Donk still #1 🔥
so which prison gang has maui been inducted into?
Elige is a crowd puller even on basic videos.
Weren’t jump throws just collateral damage to the snap tap detection?
Niko Q3 2024: snap tap on
Niko Q4 2024: snap tap off
XANTAP goes hard. Still waiting for fenttap though
HE CANT PLAY LIKE SIMPLE. ROFL genius
Young moses on the show
1:28:00 I just googled cause the numbers seemed unbelievable
Astralis won 16 4 true, but s1mple went 22 16 not 24 and 4
That first cut lmao
Elige point about in general missing "easy shots" is somewhat valid, yet there was nothing micro about that wiff from ticket to pit, that was the most crucial shot in that mirage.
It was the most basic standard peek you could have without a flash or any utility to cause any disruption in focus, no wide swing, no jiggle at the angle. Weird to make excuses for him tbh.
Also same goes for the Zywoo 1v3 clutch mirage A retake, yes the first shot missed since he jumped at a lucky timing, but the second shot....... Jesus christ there is no excuse for that seriously
And those 3 shots weren't all blatant wiffs during that map either maybe half if even that, those are just the worst ones, that had the most negative impact.. There's a reason why jL cried after the game, and idk if people noticed how w0nderful looked next to him when he saw it when they received the silver medal on stage.
Just FYI I'm rarely a hater, and in fact I'm a long term Na'Vi fan, and I actually like w0nderful as well, but when shit like this happens it needs to addressed so it can be fixed, can't just ignore it.
1 key should never do 2 actions, its a good rule.
maui looks like a gta sa los santos thug
Adopt an Aggresive Rifler NGO 🖤
When did elidge start looking like Tyler “storm” Wood :p
Maui: "snap tap is bad because people can't make mistake in high pressure situation" also Maui: "Jump throw bind is good because people would not do mistake in high pressure situation"
This. I mean it takes skill to perfectly push the right buttons in the right moment to have the right throw. With jumpthrow binds that skill is gone. And if you miss nades it's on you. Better players will miss nades less and will differentiate them from the worse players. It is absolutely a skill issue.
Besides if Elige is saying it's easy without binds, then what is the problem of banning them??
Yeah pros will mess up a counter strafe far more often than they’ll mess up a jump throw this is a really stupid attempt at a gotcha moment lil bro
@@ourboyhemingwayand? 😂
@@ourboyhemingway Maybe, but missing a smoke or flash is far more impactful than counter strafe 0.1 sec faster and they all argue about importance of human erorr. Hypocrites.
If they are banning snaptap will they ban rapid trigger? Thinking of getting a hall effect keyboard but unsure if rapid trigger is gonna get hit by the ban hammer
On valve servers, snaptap etc only kicks you, no bans
Nah that stuff has been out for a while
Snap tap automatically gives priority to the last pressed out of two keys at an inhuman speed (essentially instant), while rapid trigger only mitigates the mechanical delay involved with releasing a key where the switch has to physically return to it's normal state. There isn't a world where rapid trigger can be considered cheating.
As far as in-game detection is concerned, I'm not sure, but for what it's worth I've played a couple games since the patch using the Wooting 60HE and not been kicked or anything.
240pSnake
Damn Maui leave us some pixels
22:20 I dont understand this argument at all. Maui talks about snaptap-esque features removing the chance to mess up in high pressure situations and now argues that jump binds should be allowed so you dont mess up in high pressure situations? And then Elige says that jumpthrow binds arent a skill thing because they are easy but also at the exact same time if you remove it then pros will miss spokes? How does this line up thinking make any sense?
am i the only one who has had zero issues with jump throw consistency just pressing space and throwing? valve claims they added a system to make jump throws consistent and from I've seen it works fine
@@Polyvalent yeah ive never used jumpbinds in cs2
Because their muscle memory for the last 10 years has been using a jumpthrow bind. Any moron with hands can press their spacebar and release mouse1 at the same time.
imo it is pro-player cope because it's just what they're used to. I like Elige, but I think his reasoning doesn't make sense. It's so much easier to police "one button can't do two things" than "well we don't want one button to do two things in most cases but here are the cases that it's okay". If Valve wants jump throws to be easier (and they are already easy...), they'll just add a setting for it.
Why tf maui looks like he is going to say something extremely racist
Elige. My goat.
The problem I have with valve removing snap tap is that I have to experience the full depth of cs2’s terrible movement again.
bring cl_bob back or at least the one that was there at launch
@@MusicJunkie37 Oh brother that wont help. Snaptap made strafing feel like csgo again
@@xlgapelsin6173 It would help, just not as much as snaptap I guess idk I didnt try the latter
maui's cholo arc incoming
If AWPERS have the advantage in Survival stats then Riflers have the advantage in ADR stats. Also you can definitely fake a KPR stats with exit frags and ecos. I do agree Donk gets ignored sometimes. But he’s still in the lead for me with ZywOo behind alongside m0nesy.
Imagine Elige for Rain in Faze😮
Jump throw bind shouldn't be in pro play and here's why. They take all the variance out of the smoke play. You can in theory never miss a smoke. Throw the same smoke every time. Now take it away for one tournament. Watch how many smokes are missed and how more exciting it is. 2v2 and the t player misses his smoke that changes everything. Guaranteed smokes is the same as guaranteed counterstrafe. This is the most skilled esport imo, and players want to make it less skillful. So anyone can throw the pro smokes. That's lame put skill back into the game don't take it out.
I usually don’t go to comment sections however for this one I just have to. So I found out that jump-throw was gone in my face it yesterday when I chucked nades at myself, I was not too happy. However I can manage being without it and I’ll be fine. I can learn to smoke without it… Now since you think snap-tap and jump-throw are the same essentially. Can you tell me how I can compete against someone using snap-tap? Because as I mentioned I can learn to smoke without jump-bind but I cannot compete with hardware ie snap-tap. Artificially counter-strafing for my opponents whilst mine is only my mechanical input. Also the whole missing smokes makes it more exciting angle is not a very skilled take on the matter. Watching tactics unfold as they were meant to and then having the other team try to counter it is much more intriguing than watching botched smokes everywhere.
Xertion is so BONKERZ as degster is :)
22:02 To say that they're easy to hit, yet possible to miss under pressure, and saying at the same time that snaptap waters down skill sealing since you can't miss the counterstrafes, as they do happen sometimes with professional players too. Well then, you should agree also the same that missing a run jump throw can be missed sometimes, and it does require skill to successfully pull off in a high pressure situation, like hitting the counter strafe in a high pressure situation.
There is a fist sized gaping hole in that logic that doesn't correspond with essentially the same question, with a slight difference in application.
Exactly. I can't tell how many times I've seen pros miss the Inferno CT smoke in CSGO (now virtually impossible to miss thanks to volumetric smokes). They even made it easier for people to do the jump throws and much more consistent than CSGO, to the point that there isn't much reason to have a jump throw bind. The bind was useful because CSGO was so difficult to consistently throw with the dynamic trajectory
Agreed.
jump throw isnt a skill check anymore, just make it not convoluted.
@@nickk4044jumpthrows in go was hell to nail without the bind, now they are easy so just let us use the bind
@@HerbaceousM8apparently it is, otherwise they wouldnt be missed in high pressure moments
banger
If your smoke lineup requires three keys while moving and holding your legs crossed then it's not a real lineup, it's just one in a ten throw that you have convinced yourself is a legitimate move because you are allowed to cheat in game. Quality of life is not a real argument, if it's easy to do then just do it, if you miss a nade then apparently it wasn't easy to do. Why are you arguing two points at the same time.
bangerrrr
More players please.
All the arguments Elige used against snap tap. He used for jump throw bonds. If it's bad for snap tap it's bad for jump throw. Missing smokes is interesting it changes everything. You miss a smoke get fucked you messed up.
Youd think thorin would like the team elo system being such a tennis fan