Its been my understanding that Type F fluid was only different in the aspect that it can handle the higher temps of Ford trannys and John Deere tractor fluid handles even higher just w/o the red dye. B&M trick shift is just repackaged Type F.
I done tore five c4s out now I found a small block c6 they r hard to find but I got one now I have a 398w in a 71 Torino seems to work great now I built one with new parts and smoked it
You deserved a vacation and a good little hiatus. I forgotten about the C4 and I hope that you can get the internal stuff done for it and put it together and put it all together and back in the truck.
I believe you smoke uncle tony bottlerocket just ain't on Casper leave his 318 ain't ready for Casper an tony well miss gear an u leave him at the start line no problem
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,Thanks Andy,,,,,new to c4's,,,,,,got a mystery unit in my 88 drag car,,,,,,I bought a used drag car,,,cause I had the cash ,,,,the 347 stang had expensive parts in the eng... I pulled the diff cover to discover 4.30 gears....The car was listed as having 3.73........In a light mustang , why would a 4.30 gear be needed with a C4....???,,,also was stated that it ran 10.13 @ 139 in the quarter mile [it has a nitrous plate] .....that may have been lies.......maybe the 4.30 rear gear was meant for eight mile racing.....????
Andy a A/C condensor makes a really good transmission cooler.I use them and the fluid rarely gets above 190. Cost is about the same as the ones you buy and I don't think youll have a/c on Casper.lol
I not a fan of automatic transmission however I do like power shift equipment.. many years ago when I had still had a automatic in my truck I spoke to a fellow who had a transmission shop in CANADA. He built performance transmission for diesel trucks . I asked about the sealing rings and a lot more oil pressure. He told me that the metal rings can stop moving and be damaged or damage the associated parts . The reason for the Teflon rings or what ever they are made OK. He mentioned also about clutch pack clearance , end play , and bind up of not having the correct shift timing . That may not be a problem with the c4.. I have heard that running max oil pressure is a bit hard on front pump gears ect ..I ran 10 wt hydraulic oil in my transmission for 20 plus years before it cam apart and I replaced it with a standard . I enjoy watching your videos thanks
Thanks for watching Jim, all of the things you mentioned are extremely important to a C4 especially since this transmission was never designed for this kind of abuse! I'm glad you like the videos.. Andy
@@UnityMotorSportsGarage What thickness direct clutches do you use ? And what valvebody do you use ? And direct clutch clearance ? I’m interested in doing some of these tricks on my trans !
Welcome back, Buddy! I know the gearbox is crucial. Are you trying a converter change early on, or use the old one and get a baseline? I’m almost as ready as you are to see Casper rolling again!
You will find out if Murphy's Law applies to you this year!!! Thanks for showing off some of the parts. It is interesting how problems are overcome, and some people think of things that I never would.
Very impressed with the condition of those bands, they look almost new. Looking forward to seeing the NNN with all of you guys, Casper is going to ghost the competition.
This is interesting. I have a 67 Merc Cougar with a 351W bored and stroked to 408ci. Estimated torque 500, hp 500. Currently using top loader 4 speed with but was thinking of going automatic. I have a C4 from a 77 Maverick that had a 302. Been curious about using with 500hp/500ftlbs of torque. Figured it would need some help. Car is Street driven only. NO racing!
Better to break soft parts than hard parts! Even if it is a pain in the butt to replace them every month or so. Edit: that 180⁰ temperature, was that F or C?
Thank you so much for all the info you put out, so helpful. Question for you, I can’t seem to get the reverse high clutch and sun gear input shell to fully seat. I can feel all the clutches seating by counting them, but the housings will not fully seat, taken it apart and put it back together so many times. The gaps between the tabs that mesh together measure at just over 3/16. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. 🙏
Make a video on how to calibrate the valve body to where the band releases when the clutch applies and what causes a flare up between 2nd and 3rd also show us your viewers where to mount a temperture sensor. Great content by the way and thanks for sharing your expertise.
Good luck Andy! The match between Uncle Tony and you may very well come down to choice of transmission. Gil Younger of Transgo did my automatics for Stock competition and street duty. Gil was the A/T guru! I still have the FMX he did in my original 351 Mach 1 and it performs flawlessly after 52 years of use. In our Pro-Stock and Comp. cars we used Lencos and Liberties.
Bill, I have to have a Lenco at some point in my life... Hopefully this C4 will last long enough to get the TH400 finished so I can just do a back to back swap... Fingers crossed
My only C4 trans was great, i loved it simply because it was simple and shifted perfectly every time. If only there was a large C4. The best design is always the simplest design. I now am using a 4r70w. This trans is also wonderful with very few mods, definitely use the stub shaft delete billet sunnix drum. Worth every penny.
The 4r70 is a very good transmission... having a lower first gear ratio is a plus as well... The C4 in my opinion the easiest 3 speed transmission to work on! Thanks for watching Mark
I have a question, you seem knowledgeable with the Ford C4 trans. I had a guy build one for me, he used to own a trans shop. I have it in a fox body Mustang. I was going around a corner once and hammered on it, car went sideways, and it went like it was in neutral, lost all gears, I went down the road and revved it up a bit and it came to. This has happened to me a few times, the guy that built it said it is probably the valve body but was also wondering, I have a deep sump pan without the filter extension, could it have starved for oil? Any thoughts or issues?
Absolutely it probably was starved for fluid.. without the extension it could possibly suck air which would cause that condition.. I've never had that issue but to lose all gears means a loss of line pressure Andy
@@UnityMotorSportsGarage Thanks for the reply Andy, I kind of felt the same way! I explained it to the guy that built it, he told me that the valve bodies on the C4s distort as well and cause problems similar to that. I have seen guys use a filter with extension housing for a 727 filter as they are bigger. I am going to try it and see after I get this new engine built.
welcome back Andy..."helped" rebuild alought of turbo hydro 350's & 400's....installed a B&M street strip shift kit in a C4....but had "no" idea the clutches were so small in a C4....!..wow...big differance even with a TH 350...!...had good luck with my little C4 in a near stock 69 mustang...& I "BEAT" the live'n S*** out of it...never had an issue....shifted high gear so hard the dash would shake...!...hope all goes well @ the no name nationals 4 u & casper...pull'n 4 u....reguards Brian
I killed C4s, tried tha Art Carr 200R4, killed them, ended up with a small block C6. It lived. The C4 will not last but it will work for a while. Just saying...
One thing that Jay really stressed is if I did my transmission myself, was to make sure I did modifications to the number 9 bearing, or it will fail. He said the C5 case already has the mods done from ford.
P. S., I was just getting ready to start bugging you to see if you were okay and I hope that you enjoy your vacation and weekend. Thanks for your time and effort with your new video. As always I will be sharing, liking and as always commenting my old self away. Enjoy your Monday!
My question is unless you're running class racing why not just put the Power robbing C6 in there lose a couple of tenths and not have to ever screw with the transmission?
The C4 came in the truck originally, Casper has evolved over the years and I ran the C4 with my 600hp 393w and it did fine... I'm going with a TH400 because of two things.. cost TH400 vs C6 to build them to handle equal power the C6 costs more to build, and parts availability for the TH400 is far greater than the C6... Thanks for watching Andy
After burning my dynamic c4 after being on expressway going to car show and then going thur it, was shocked at what my tranny temp was when i put a gauge on it and did the same route again w the gauge.
Andy you have a C-5 pan fill, no difference on the inside between C-4 and C-5, just case differences on how the bell bolts to the case and where the filler tube goes in, also if you are looking for a core C-4 to build for high HP need to find 72' and up non-lockup (push in modulator)
I talked to a guy at the Alabama stop on power tour who had a Lenco in a blown BB camaro. When I seen the shifters I thought about your truck and I waited on the guy to come back over to the car. I asked him about it’s street manners and he said if everyone knew how much fun and easy to drive they were there would be more on the street. He did fully explain to me about driving it.
@@UnityMotorSportsGarage I didn’t know that the no name nationals was still several months away. If you decide not to take my trailer then I may look into going. Not to race my garbage but for the “show” part of the even. It might be good for the channel 🤷🏻♂️
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I don't understand why this gentleman doesn't have 100k subscribers. This is one of the best channels of its type on youtube.
Thanks for the kind words... Im glad you like it! It means a lot to me..
Andy
Its been my understanding that Type F fluid was only different in the aspect that it can handle the higher temps of Ford trannys and John Deere tractor fluid handles even higher just w/o the red dye. B&M trick shift is just repackaged Type F.
Great video Andy, good to hear from umsg. Can't wait to see Casper burning rubber and taking Names!!!!
I done tore five c4s out now I found a small block c6 they r hard to find but I got one now I have a 398w in a 71 Torino seems to work great now I built one with new parts and smoked it
You deserved a vacation and a good little hiatus. I forgotten about the C4 and I hope that you can get the internal stuff done for it and put it together and put it all together and back in the truck.
I believe you smoke uncle tony bottlerocket just ain't on Casper leave his 318 ain't ready for Casper an tony well miss gear an u leave him at the start line no problem
Nathan, I hope you are right! It's going to be interesting, he is throwing the kitchen sink at it for this race! Should be good...
I'm a huge fan of UTG but he don't stand a chance against you & Casper! Lol cheers brother
It's going to be interesting...
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,Thanks Andy,,,,,new to c4's,,,,,,got a mystery unit in my 88 drag car,,,,,,I bought a used drag car,,,cause I had the cash ,,,,the 347 stang had expensive parts in the eng... I pulled the diff cover to discover 4.30 gears....The car was listed as having 3.73........In a light mustang , why would a 4.30 gear be needed with a C4....???,,,also was stated that it ran 10.13 @ 139 in the quarter mile [it has a nitrous plate] .....that may have been lies.......maybe the 4.30 rear gear was meant for eight mile racing.....????
That would be my guess.. it was for the 1/8mile. Thanks for watching
Andy
Andy a A/C condensor makes a really good transmission cooler.I use them and the fluid rarely gets above 190. Cost is about the same as the ones you buy and I don't think youll have a/c on Casper.lol
just think - all this right off the cuff - no editing.
Well done Andy,
Thanks DV, it's the only way I know to do it... Lol
I not a fan of automatic transmission however I do like power shift equipment.. many years ago when I had still had a automatic in my truck I spoke to a fellow who had a transmission shop in CANADA. He built performance transmission for diesel trucks . I asked about the sealing rings and a lot more oil pressure. He told me that the metal rings can stop moving and be damaged or damage the associated parts . The reason for the Teflon rings or what ever they are made OK. He mentioned also about clutch pack clearance , end play , and bind up of not having the correct shift timing . That may not be a problem with the c4.. I have heard that running max oil pressure is a bit hard on front pump gears ect ..I ran 10 wt hydraulic oil in my transmission for 20 plus years before it cam apart and I replaced it with a standard . I enjoy watching your videos thanks
Thanks for watching Jim, all of the things you mentioned are extremely important to a C4 especially since this transmission was never designed for this kind of abuse! I'm glad you like the videos..
Andy
@@UnityMotorSportsGarage What thickness direct clutches do you use ? And what valvebody do you use ? And direct clutch clearance ? I’m interested in doing some of these tricks on my trans !
Welcome back, Buddy! I know the gearbox is crucial. Are you trying a converter change early on, or use the old one and get a baseline? I’m almost as ready as you are to see Casper rolling again!
Its good to be back.. I'm going to run my old converter and see how it reacts then have Dynamic dial it in..
Hp doesn't kill transmissions. Torque kills them. 700hp big block vs 700hp from a honda is not the same
Torque and Weight! Thanks for watching
Andy
You will find out if Murphy's Law applies to you this year!!! Thanks for showing off some of the parts. It is interesting how problems are overcome, and some people think of things that I never would.
Did you buy the frictions and steels from dynamic? I don't see them on they're site.
John I sure did.. you can call them and they will hook you up!
Very impressed with the condition of those bands, they look almost new. Looking forward to seeing the NNN with all of you guys, Casper is going to ghost the competition.
Ted they look brand new... The Kevlar bands are the way to go!
Thanks for watching
Andy
This man knows His stuff on the C 4, it is a good trans.
Good job on this andy the fluid pressure from 2nd to 3rd gear is important to some people don't know that 👍👍
Line pressure is everything... Mine was set on 240, I will definitely check it again once it is in the truck.. thanks for watching Terry
How about an e4od?
This is interesting.
I have a 67 Merc Cougar with a 351W bored and stroked to 408ci. Estimated torque 500, hp 500. Currently using top loader 4 speed with but was thinking of going automatic. I have a C4 from a 77 Maverick that had a 302. Been curious about using with 500hp/500ftlbs of torque. Figured it would need some help.
Car is Street driven only. NO racing!
I have always respected the Ford guys.
Same here about Mopars... I started out being a Mopar guy
..had a '70 Duster with a really hot 340 in it!
Andy
@@UnityMotorSportsGarage Your carb tuning videos are very useful. Thanks Andy
@@texasmopar5557 thanks! I'm glad you enjoyed them...
Keep it up Andy!
Good information Andy.
Thanks for all the great tips.
Take care, Ed.
Thanks Ed! Tomorrow DV and I will be doing a live and plan to talk more about the oil... Thanks for watching
Andy
@@UnityMotorSportsGarage thank you for letting me know Andy.
great video bud but it would be nice to know more about some of the modifications. keep up the great work and good luck.
I like the attention to detail! 💯
It's got be some crazy torque and heat generated inside that drum when 240 psi slams these discs together!
Yes! It in a fight with itself...lol
Great video Andy Thanks !!!
Bob can you email me your address I found those plates yesterday..
tunnelram393w@gmail.com
Better to break soft parts than hard parts!
Even if it is a pain in the butt to replace them every month or so.
Edit: that 180⁰ temperature, was that F or C?
Scott that is F° I agree, like I said you can tell when it's time to change the clutches.. once you hear it flair.. time to yank it out!
@@UnityMotorSportsGarage thanks, Andy!
Thank you so much for all the info you put out, so helpful. Question for you, I can’t seem to get the reverse high clutch and sun gear input shell to fully seat. I can feel all the clutches seating by counting them, but the housings will not fully seat, taken it apart and put it back together so many times. The gaps between the tabs that mesh together measure at just over 3/16. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. 🙏
The C4 can handle the power if built right but it can't take a cars heavy weight. The case is simply too small
Make a video on how to calibrate the valve body to where the band releases when the clutch applies and what causes a flare up between 2nd and 3rd also show us your viewers where to mount a temperture sensor. Great content by the way and thanks for sharing your expertise.
How do you feel about a deep pan and a cooler? I’m about to start a rebuild and have never seen a C4 before.
Good luck Andy! The match between Uncle Tony and you may very well come down to choice of transmission. Gil Younger of Transgo did my automatics for Stock competition and street duty. Gil was the A/T guru! I still have the FMX he did in my original 351 Mach 1 and it performs flawlessly after 52 years of use. In our Pro-Stock and Comp. cars we used Lencos and Liberties.
Bill, I have to have a Lenco at some point in my life... Hopefully this C4 will last long enough to get the TH400 finished so I can just do a back to back swap... Fingers crossed
@@UnityMotorSportsGarage We're with you man!
My only C4 trans was great, i loved it simply because it was simple and shifted perfectly every time. If only there was a large C4. The best design is always the simplest design.
I now am using a 4r70w. This trans is also wonderful with very few mods, definitely use the stub shaft delete billet sunnix drum. Worth every penny.
The 4r70 is a very good transmission... having a lower first gear ratio is a plus as well... The C4 in my opinion the easiest 3 speed transmission to work on! Thanks for watching Mark
There is my good Man the C 6. But You need about 50 hp to run it so it creates some drag.
How fast can a c4 go buddy is having issues keeping it together in a mustang 680s in the 8th mile should that be a issue 2900 lbs
I have a question, you seem knowledgeable with the Ford C4 trans. I had a guy build one for me, he used to own a trans shop. I have it in a fox body Mustang. I was going around a corner once and hammered on it, car went sideways, and it went like it was in neutral, lost all gears, I went down the road and revved it up a bit and it came to. This has happened to me a few times, the guy that built it said it is probably the valve body but was also wondering, I have a deep sump pan without the filter extension, could it have starved for oil? Any thoughts or issues?
Absolutely it probably was starved for fluid.. without the extension it could possibly suck air which would cause that condition.. I've never had that issue but to lose all gears means a loss of line pressure
Andy
@@UnityMotorSportsGarage Thanks for the reply Andy, I kind of felt the same way! I explained it to the guy that built it, he told me that the valve bodies on the C4s distort as well and cause problems similar to that. I have seen guys use a filter with extension housing for a 727 filter as they are bigger. I am going to try it and see after I get this new engine built.
@@UnityMotorSportsGarage I do think if I keep having issues after trying this, I am going to send my valve body to Dynamic.
I would call Dynamic up and discuss it forsure
Andy
welcome back Andy..."helped" rebuild alought of turbo hydro 350's & 400's....installed a B&M street strip shift kit in a C4....but had "no" idea the clutches were so small in a C4....!..wow...big differance even with a TH 350...!...had good luck with my little C4 in a near stock 69 mustang...& I "BEAT" the live'n S*** out of it...never had an issue....shifted high gear so hard the dash would shake...!...hope all goes well @ the no name nationals 4 u & casper...pull'n 4 u....reguards Brian
Thanks Brian, I can't wait till the NNN.. it's going to be fun!
Great video Andy, that transmission should hold up to all those callouts. Might be a few more it needs to hold up to!
Thanks Jeff.. it should be good for a good 30 passes before the direct clutches start going away... Weight is the enemy of the C4!
I killed C4s, tried tha Art Carr 200R4, killed them, ended up with a small block C6. It lived. The C4 will not last but it will work for a while. Just saying...
Musky, you are right... The C4 is a great transmission but clutch life is very limited in high hp combos.. and 4000lbs just makes matters worse.. 😆
One thing that Jay really stressed is if I did my transmission myself, was to make sure I did modifications to the number 9 bearing, or it will fail. He said the C5 case already has the mods done from ford.
That number #9 is a big deal for sure. Jay does sell a nice #9 roller bearing setup
Talk to us about a temperature probe location, in the pan maybe?
P. S., I was just getting ready to start bugging you to see if you were okay and I hope that you enjoy your vacation and weekend. Thanks for your time and effort with your new video. As always I will be sharing, liking and as always commenting my old self away. Enjoy your Monday!
Yeah John, you will be seeing tons of Casper content in the next few weeks... Thanks for watching and the kind words!
Andy
My question is unless you're running class racing why not just put the Power robbing C6 in there lose a couple of tenths and not have to ever screw with the transmission?
The C4 came in the truck originally, Casper has evolved over the years and I ran the C4 with my 600hp 393w and it did fine... I'm going with a TH400 because of two things.. cost TH400 vs C6 to build them to handle equal power the C6 costs more to build, and parts availability for the TH400 is far greater than the C6...
Thanks for watching
Andy
I asked about 120mph in another vid. That engine must have been screaming like 5500. Whats your highway cruise rpm ?
Cody it has 4.30 gears with a 28" tall rear tire.. I'm at about 3800 rpm at 65-70 mph give or take.
After burning my dynamic c4 after being on expressway going to car show and then going thur it, was shocked at what my tranny temp was when i put a gauge on it and did the same route again w the gauge.
Brian, it's a eye opener... I've burned one up like that before as well...
Andy
Wow! that's the first video I've watched and I need MORE! I enjoy watching an intelligent Mechanic bend wrenches & you rock!
Thanks for the kind words Jeffrey! That means a lot to me
Andy
Howdy Andy, what do you run for a tranny cooler?
Very cool!
I hope you plan to hit the track for test and runs long before the nationals.
Andy you have a C-5 pan fill, no difference on the inside between C-4 and C-5, just case differences on how the bell bolts to the case and where the filler tube goes in, also if you are looking for a core C-4 to build for high HP need to find 72' and up non-lockup (push in modulator)
I can’t wait to see you at the nnn. I bought that 49 ford just for it but crap just keeps coming up. I hope this happing more that once. Much love 🤙🏼
Riding with Alex Taylor 55 used borrowed transmission parts.
Good info andy
Thank you for that walk through. Lots of good information.
👍👍
😀
Great video!
Thanks Richard
Will the NNN be televised?
No, but there will be tons of coverage of it here on TH-cam..
@@UnityMotorSportsGarage 🤗.
I talked to a guy at the Alabama stop on power tour who had a Lenco in a blown BB camaro. When I seen the shifters I thought about your truck and I waited on the guy to come back over to the car. I asked him about it’s street manners and he said if everyone knew how much fun and easy to drive they were there would be more on the street. He did fully explain to me about driving it.
Yeah HG, I have to get me a Lenco at some point in my life... Has to happen! I think it would be awesome
@@UnityMotorSportsGarage I didn’t know that the no name nationals was still several months away. If you decide not to take my trailer then I may look into going. Not to race my garbage but for the “show” part of the even. It might be good for the channel 🤷🏻♂️
@@LeftForDeadGarage dude you should come! It will be a awesome time.. we can convoy out there
@@UnityMotorSportsGarage I’ll msg you on FB about it