Tomes Tier List Wolf Patch - Age of Wonders 4 (MP) Basics
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 22 มิ.ย. 2024
- #ageofwonders4
It's finally here, and this time only a few weeks after the patch dropped and it's not like you haven't been getting content from me in the meantime (sorry Victoria 3 people, I have no idea why you are still here but I actually might stream it soon- 1.6 looks pretty good once it is bug-free).
BOOM. All Tomes. Except the cultural ones which I guess I'm going to cover in the cultures and traits video next week. There's been some spicy stuff added to the game since we last visited our tomes back in October 2023(?), so we talk about Tome of Alchemy and Tome of Constructs and all that stuff plus New Necromancy and the meta changes regarding Order use and whatnot in a world without Shrines of Smiting. What's hot and what's not is the subject of today's video, broken up into a few more digestible chapters as I kinda felt like I was getting diminishing returns with 15+ chapters for updates like this. If you want more chapters, riot in the comment thread. Threaten to overthrow the Monarchy and establish a republic and bring down the government of King Louis. What are you doing here?
Introduction: (0:00)
Grading Criteria: (1:03)
Tier 1 Tomes: (3:22)
Tier 2 Tomes: (17:02)
Tier 3 Tomes: (37:04)
Tier 4 Tomes: (50:11)
Tier 5 Tomes: (1:07:52)
Previous Tome Tier Lists-
Tier 1 Tomes- • Tier 1 Tome Tier List ...
Tier 2 Tomes- • Tier 2 Tomes Tier List...
Tier 3 Tomes- • Tier 3 Tomes Tier List...
Tier 4 Tomes- • Tier 4 Tomes Tier List...
Tier 5 Tomes- • Tier 5 Tomes Tier List... - เกม
Oh also Miah informs me that Mists is fixed now and fair, but it's still incredibly powerful and meta-condensing. You don't need to play Mists to have a good build, but you do kinda need a good answer *for* mists, and that suggests top S tier to me right now.
All those fancy new tomes from Empire and Ashes are also in here, if you've been missing them. If you guys really want more chapters for the exact time stamp for each of the new tomes, just comment in here and I can find them for you, but I figured that most of you are degenerates who will watch me talk about old tomes and new tomes and just whatever I want so fewer chapters is fine.
Oh yeah, that is something I almost missed when I was covering the wolf update 1.2 that came out last week. Its funny, it was the last thing I actually talked about in my video from today (at like 8 minutes out of 8m30), that I posted only a few hours after this video XD
They kind of buried a few great changes in the "fixes" section and called attention how they removed clashing egos
thanks I've been really enjoying your tome guides
Glad you like them!
Lot of great info in this video! Thanks for sharing, Walker!
No problem!
Probably will miss this live but I have been WAITING and will catch the whole thing in bits and pieces soon enough! I am preemptively clicking like.
Excellent!
Great tier list as always. Just wanted to quickly mention that you didn't talk about how much the cascading spells synergise with the Materium Matrix. Meaning that that a single cast of one could potentially give your entire army +3 bolstered defence on top of the buffs they already give.
Yeah, at some point I could probably do a video about the high production things that are worth building and Matrices are definitely in that category. Could be a great opportunity to talk about synergies and applications and the like!
Excited for the updated list
Enjoy!
New here and I think this is a great list. Do you think thunder element is too strong right now? It is the only element that punishes 'wet' condition really hard. The -4 resistance + sundered resistance + unit buffs typically means if you have evoker/battlemages and you stack in starblades on top of that, and units are just melting left and right. This is further amplified by the new tome where you can cast downpour before engaging and it's just very oppressive at that point.
I do play offline only in brutal so I don't know how it stacks against other players though.
It's probably up there with Spirit for best damage type in the game right now, but I don't think that's inherently a problem. The signature debuff for Lightning damage - electrified - got nerfed really hard in the most recent patch and doesn't scale super well into the mid/late game. It's still a great damage type that typically makes your early game a lot faster and smoother (one of the strengths of Phantasm Warriors is their 1/2 lightning damage base attack, but be wary of bringing them vs anything that deals lightning damage).
Yo if Tome of the Eternal lord had as the hero skill the ability to "restore" corpses that exploded it would make all necromancy tomes maybe half a letter grade higher minimum, maybe a full letter grade.
This would be finally justifiy getting that useless Tome. There needs to be anti-anti-necromancy spells and abilities on the highest of Tiers. And there needs to be some kind of superiority of conservative(proper) necromancy compared to how plants and zeal/faith units are resurrected.
T5 Shadow Tome is neither bringing something new and exciting nor does it end the game any sooner.
@@zeusapollo6504 Yeah, basically, right now it is mostly flavor text.
Ok walker. I think you are me. Im a doehard fan of age of wonders and endless space 2, and nobody seems to care about these games much anymore. Im still playing them, and here you are still covering them. Super good stuff, thanks and looking forward to watching the eest of your stuff. Never play multiplayer because im too unpredictability available bit love it none the less
Fair enough! Endless Space 2 in particular is a real treasure that deserves a little time in the spotlight due to the "final" patch playing so well. Really hyped to hear we're getting more DLC for AoW4, though!
Haven't played since before the wolf update but this is great stuff!
Great time to start!
Very informative video! I watched your druidic terraformers video recently, and you should totally do a pre-built leader tierlist sometime 😊. Aric Rex is S+ tier
I think it would be fun.
SECOND THIS! Even if its just based off looking at the starting tome and not actually playing them
@@iTzTiMeToJuMp We might just get there. Next week I want to update the Traits + Cultures tier lists Monday/Tuesday, but if we end up with another productive Monday and a Tuesday to burn I might just sneak in pre-built leaders as a tier list if I can get good images for the tierlistmaker.
Thanks for the List .. My first play through was holding my Own with Spiders 🕷 Conquest victory but went with Guns for second build for holding Seals 💪 more damage but your not really moving and doom against all the angels with wings or demon teleportion
Spiders can put in some real work if you do your homework and shred enemy status resistance. You do need flash freeze to help them out if you are doing autoresolves, but with flash freeze they become reliable on most units with less than a million status resistance.
I haven't gotten around to trying the Fey Mists tome yet, but it looks like you need to use the transformation to not be disadvantaged by the mist tiles. Am I correct in assuming that this makes the tome less useful for a dragon ruler, since they won't be able to make themselves immune to the mist?
It will be less useful but not entirely so, as the breath weapon is an auto-hit. If you can make sure to give your ruler other things to do instead of attack vs 35 accuracy, you should have a much easier time of it.
Awesome info, I dropped a like
Do you think either of the T2 nature tomes are very much worth it if you’re going Druidic terraformers? I want to go elemental heavy, haven’t really played with them yet, and I’d definitely rather pick something else if it wasn’t for the terraforming in those tomes
I think Glades probably, as forest gives you guaranteed +20% production in your city if you cast it before you put down your outpost iirc. Fertility probably not, but it does give a lot of food as a flat in-city bonus which is generally what I look for to use Terraformers so maybe. Just don't bring a lot of Nymphs to every fight or you'll never level up.
@@wepgoh I didn’t realize the tiles had to be terraformed before the city goes down! The description doesn’t give me that impression at all. Good to know, thanks!
bro thank you
Legit any time, and by any time I mean at least 1-2 weeks of procrastination mandatory.
HYPE!
Hopefully worth the wait!
Tome of the Reaper should not only be considered, because of the buffed Reaper, but also because of Harvest Population, with just 5 cities which are very easy to have, you allready get 150 souls / turn and this city spell costs no upkpeep at all.
The moral and food modifier is absolutely irrelevant at this point, too. With High Culture i still had the best city morale on top of other enchantments like tools and minds, while its only important to not fall into negative city morale.
And for TC there is the reworked Greater Reanimation its not bad even though the synergy of overchannel: sleep + greater reanimation with T4/T5 units is now less potent on high Tier units, since its always a corrupt soul now.
The issu with Reaper generally is just the mechanical hostility to Necromancy generally in the game. There's a lot of ways to randomly hose Necromancers into space in Age of Wonders 4 for some reason.
will there be a SP stream tomorrow you think?
And good work on the updated tomes :) I might also be interested to see what are the most common builds in MP, those that works well without being overpowered/banned in MP
There will indeed! And probably Thursday too because I'm going to go to an Indian buffet for lunch before the stream tomorrow so it's gonna start a little later.
@@wepg thanks for the answer :) Just saw the upcoming stream appeared in my feed for tomorrow :) bookmarked !
“Horned Gods are not good”
Heartbreaking
It really is. It's super sad because I got a really good autoresolve game once where I cleared a Gold Wonder on T18 and got a Horned God.
The Horned God then devoured my economy with upkeep and autoresolved so poorly I disbanded it 9 turns later. It broke my heart.
@@wepgcan't be worse than the fire giant I got that tried to defeat units in a ranged duell and let my hero die because of this xD
I like the direction they moved for necromancy just need a slightly bigger impact. Hopefully the next big update gets us there!
I think Necromancy itself is very close to good, but the fact that enemies can just stand on your bone dragon to prevent you from bringing them back is just too much.
Naga Exemplars look cool even if it's a sidegrade/downgrade! They actually hold the damn shields up
Yeah, they vibe with their role as defensive tools a bit better too if you can find a way to take Glades for Aspect of the Root. Really gross on Exemplars generally, but especially if they have tools to keep themselves alive, very rude.
Ok, ok, but wait, hear me out... the ONE bit of copium I still have left xD ... with the Tome of Exaltation, the Shrines are a trap now and a total waste of time I agree, but the Ascended Warriors spell is actually *really* good... specifically if you use it in combination with the Astral Empire Development perk: Philosopher Soldiers (gain knowledge when units rank up)... an Astral/Order build can use this trick to cheaply summon armies of trash units, magically level them up, and blast through research in the late game while getting armies of legend-medal fodder to throw around
Yeah, this is probably the best normal use-case for Tome of Exaltation. It's still mostly not worth doing, but if you absolutely want to I forgive you.
@@wepg it's definitely a "win more" play in most situations haha (if you're pulling it off, then you probably could win without dipping into Exaltation just for the combo), but I could see it being useful for a surprise Magic victory in a 4+ player FFA, just quietly secure 2 gold wonders, lay low, let the other players get distracted fighting each other, and crush the binding/Age of ___ research before they realize what you're doing
I would like to point out that while Tome of Construct is powerful, Cascade Command Defense should be avoided for auto-battle, the AI largely misuse that spell. (By casting it before any friendly unit moves and thereby effectively waste mana and skip an entire turn)
Very good point, Cascading Command Defense is something you typically want to delay until you are at the point where you can turn casting off for most fights.
Is this tier list also viable for auto-resolve only mp games?
Should be.
I found myself agreeing with most of this list. Doomherald suffers with autocombat but I think it is quite good in manual combat. Fertility suffers from nymphs wasting exp, but I have had auto combat give me early warbreed/phoenix/phase beast at times. Might just be that I want to make Fertility work but I think it might be defensible as borderline B tier.
I love the buffed Astral Convergence tome. With cascading power active and an astral amplifier lens I find that explosive manifestation does some real work. Manual vs. AI that produces 1v12 -> easy victory, but even against a human I imagine it would be quite nasty to suffer 40 damage + a t3 melee spawning on your backline with more lightning bolts on the way.
I think you can justify Nymphs if you are going to be mana heavy and need ways to utilize that. Capturing a young dragon with a unit you summon off of a T2 tome can make a huge difference early game, especially if you babysit it aggressively. Fertility also has a good synergy with Terraformers that I haven't explored enough yet, though it is production intensive. Mammoth Primal maybe?
With the buffs to misfortune Mayhem is honestly infectious insanity + mark of misfortune. Combined with fey-mists your opponents need to call the inquisition lol
Yeah, Misfortune is a lot stronger now, that is absolutely true. Gremlins still suck though.
@@wepg Gremlins suck because T2 units from a T2 tome is terrible. But I tried fielding a gremlin in skirmish mod to fill in a t2 slot and that feels quite strong.
@@lirya8479 Quite fair!
@@wepgI hoped they would make them t3 too like the mistlings... Oh well lol
@@yeeterbohlen282 Yeah, it would make them a lot more viable outside of skirmish mod.
Idk the true death magic enchantment slaps hard. Especially when you hit an army with flash freeze or hell even blizzard. Plus it gives it to all of you battle mages and support units meaning than any of them can just kill a unit. Plus it synergies with a lot of other tomes too. For example the rain battlefield enchantment from Stormborne makes the frost damage hit stupid hard.
It rewards good positioning because if something teleports into your back line to lock down a battlemage but just gets murdered by the support unit two hexes away that’s fantastic value…as long as it’s not a hero who just murders the entire army because it has three teleports, killing momentum, and arcing weapons with stun or freeze on their weapon…you know. standard stuff.
True Death Magic is a very cool ability, but one that won't produce great results in autoresolves or manual PvP unless you lean *really* hard into it due to the ZoC problem. Not insurmountable, mind you, but very tricky to get great value out of against an opponent capable of thinking about positioning.
Haha fair enough. I will say battlefield reanimation is also great…unless they have ways of getting rid of corpses. Due to how death magic in the imperium tree works (you should always take it) if you have the mana, you can basically always rez your undead units and even cheese some one sided fights. But again you get hard countered by severing. And smart people.
How would you buff tome of the eternal lord? Withering mist seems like the one in need of a buff to me
@@MsDragonkingz in PvP you typically just stand on bodies that are problematic, though obviously you can permanently remove if you have the tools.
Can melee mages use true death magic while in Zone of Control?
Maybe! Worth testing in Debug mode or Skirmish, because based on description I'd guess yes. Banshee meta on Max Skirmish level?
@@wepg them or Chaos Eaters yeah!
I don't take it as my first T4 tome but I like Garden of bliss and Gaia's chosen from tome of paradise but maybe you never get to multiple T4 tomes in mp, its certainly not bad for single player.
It's really kinda sad that sooo many people are forced to either play alone or on auto-resolve only that people just assume that is how games are played. I really feel like the 100% ideal experience is playing out battles with and against your friends!
Yeah, PvP is a really great time. Hopefully it keeps getting more and more stable!
But where the culture tier lists?
Next week, along with society traits and everything else.
@@wepg I have this feeling that all the Chaos society traits, but 1, will be D Tier.
@@zeusapollo6504prolific swarmers and ritual cannibals are both OK. The others are just sad I think.
You do realize that mind controlled units can now be permanently added to your army right? I use it to get a Phoenix or a young dragon before turn 10. Yes, it costs mana, but so does summoning. Don't dismiss the effectiveness of stealing monster den units instead of summoning your own.
Yes, but in autoresolves you are really rolling the dice, and the risk-on is not worth it.
@@wepg You did mention something about using auto resolve exclusively in some cases. In which case, I will concede you're right. Sometimes I hit the jackpot and can recruit a Phoenix, other times it's random tier one trash mobs.
Why didn't you talk about tome of the horde at all? 😢
With the massive changes coming alongside Eldritch Realms, I'm almost certainly going to have to go back and do tier by tier tomes tier lists, so we'll be talking about Horde soon enough!
@@wepg alright thx.
So, I just got to your channel looking for some good aow4 stuff and I have mixed feelings. The information is good, however I feel the presentation of it could use some work. The thing that confuses me the most is that the video is already over an hour long, and you are telling people to go watch another video to get all of the information. Why completely skip over things? Why no overview for new people to the channel? I came here looking for good info that was arranged for consumption, not to play a scavenger hunt.
I sincerely hope going forward you either add the reference material videos in the description (or pinned comment), or you expand briefly on what you said last time (ex. "This is the tome of beasts, *name the spells that put it in A tier*, if you want more info, check the linked vid").
Just wanted to let you know why I only got to 9:42 left this comment and a dislike on the video and bounced.
TLDR: Didn't like homework in school, not gonna do it on YT lol.