The Washington Naval Treaty was a bitch. It would be interesting to see how many major ships were scrapped, changed, never finished, etc. (how do you make a ship 26 feet longer?) My take is that the treaty was a mistake for America and England. They had the money to build whatever they wanted and Japan and Germany could not keep up. And then you get both of them cheating. I'd say that both Japan and Germany got to build what they could afford and we were left playing catch up.
Cool high quality video, but I never understood your disdain for this class in previous mentions. Use what you got, they obviously made speed a priority to keep up with the carriers during the refits vice burdening them down with extra armor, and in 1941-1942, they were still extremely useful assets to act as fast escorts or to put down cruisers and below. Despite them all being annihilated, they proved their worth.
What would you think would happen if the escorting ships of the Pearl Harbor (The battleships and cruisers) striked as well? And sending another wave at the Harbor?
Vickers gun salesman: "If you act right now we can upgrade your ship with NOT 12" guns, NOT 13" guns, BUT 14" guns absolutely free! All you have to do is pay for shipping and handling'
At that range the 16in sporting US ships were within range of Type 93 torpedoes, they were lucky the Japanese did not score any hits with them (see the Battle of Tassafaronga for reference of what might have happened). At greater ranges the Japanese would have had no means to reply.
@@VersusARCH Washington got radar that have both range and direction. Japanese still uses Eyeballs MK 1 (human spotters) for ranging. And it was a night battle. Advantage goes to Washington.
@@1968gadgetyo The fact that Washington did not fire earlier cost the US three destroyers sunk and one battleship as well as one destroyer heavily damaged.
This is due to the ship initially being designed for 5x2 12" guns, with the 4th turret to be located between the two rear turrets if ended up with. When they swapped the design to 14" guns during construction, they weren't able to change the layout horribly much, and basically dropped a turret location. This is why there is space enough for another turret between the X and Y turrets on the ships. For something similar to the layout it would have had with the 12" armament, have a gander at the Amagi class.
More like: The British sales slaps the Kongou: "You can fit so many 14-inch guns in this baby!" Kongou slaps the salesman: "Yours is hardly fourteen inches ne!"
That dark. brooding image of Haruna sunk and settled in shallow water is fascinating. If I were a kid there, I'd be desperate to get out to it and explore.
Lord, that is a horrifying thought to me. I’ve always had an irrational fear of being in the water next to a large ship, a partially sunk one would set off so many heebie-jeebies for me.
Not fast enough to outrun the torpedoes from US. Sealion ,which sank her... along with an escorting destroyer who happened to run into one of the tin fish !
Vickers: "We will sell you the ability to erase the British Empire in East Asia" Japan: "We'll do it with aerial torpedos regardless, but a thank you is in order"
Blue Boats When the US had not imposed an oil embargo on Japan for the war in Manchuria and China I don’t think they would have swung south into Malaysia and Indonesia. They did that to get their hands on the oilfields of Indonesia
Except that they really didn’t do all that much either. Yes they sortied a lot more often, but most of their sorties didn’t end in something noteworthy. Their speed often gets brought up because of their ability to keep up with carriers or go into the Slot, but big-gun vessels are bad carrier escorts anyways (the big guns are pointless when you aren’t ever going to be in range of the enemy, and AA can be put on smaller, cheaper warships). Two of the three times they went into the Slot they lost, and they don’t even have the excuse of losing to enemy airpower. In terms of achievements they’re quite awful. The reality of WWII is that ALL big-gun vessels were obsolete and superfluous. I have no idea why Yamato is singled out for this far more general problem. Edit; Don't use the Battle off Samar to argue the Kongos achieved more than other Japanese capital ships, as most of Kongo's supposed achievements there have been found to be wrongly credited to her, being feats by the cruisers or even Yamato.
The Rake It was only at first that they held them back for the decisive battle; after Midway, the Japanese held them back because they (and really, everyone else) couldn’t use their battleships cost-effectively anyways, and unlike the Americans (who could, and did, throw away money on pointless battleships and STILL have enough to build a ton of warships that actually mattered), they couldn’t afford to use them in inefficient ways either.
@@therake8897 Not even that, Second Guadalcanal is really the only battle they could have proved their worth in. Yeah battleships in general ended up doing little in both world wars, though in WWI they were at least necessary for the occasions they came out and fought, while in WWII you can't even say that in most cases.
@@therake8897 That was only before Midway (as I stated in an earlier comment)-afterwards they gave on on a decisive battle and didn't bother with the battlefleet due to them being pointless.
Just got the coffee... 2:20 "Persuaded the Japanese to select the larger weapon" Somehow I have the impression that the IJN officials were quite dissapointed that they only have the 14" guns... :)
@@thanakonpraepanich4284 I don't know. What I know, is that the Japanese army (pre or post WWii?) issued bayonets to the heavy machine guns, to make a point, that it is an assault weapon.
No one was inspired by Battle of the Midway (Chalton Heston version)? Try Azur Lane. The memes are more historical accurate. Like Enterprise got repair bonus with Vestal in the fleet.
Mine would be models I built in the 70s Iowa and a modern carrier, as well as Midway (1976), In Harms Way (1965) and the many submarine movies of the time. Amazing always to tour an old sub and see the machine shop etc... they packed into it.
@Ron Lewenberg i think nicer than Hood and Alaska but Roma ... and incredible ship ! I think 1st Yamato, 2nd Roma, 3rd Ise aircraft carrier battleship, 4th Kongo, 5 Dunkerque, 6 Bismarck, 7 Hood, 8 Warspite, 9 North Carolina, 10 schleswig holstein.
@Enslaved singaporean 2 If the Kongo's count as battleships, then the Alaska's should too. The Alaskas are about the same size as the Kongo's, have slightly better armor but worse torpedo protection, and their more modern 12" guns had better penetration and a higher rate of fire than the Kongo's 14"s... An Alaska would also stand a pretty good chance of winning a duel with a Sharnhorst class. The Alaska is slightly faster and has an immune zone against the Sharnhorst's guns from 18 km out to maximum range, while the Sharnhorst has no immune zone against the Alaska's 12" guns. The bad reputation of "battle" cruisers is pretty much the reason the CB hull designation stands for Cruiser, "big" (large), instead of Cruiser, Battle. The fact that they were intended as carrier escorts doesn't really change much, since in a sense carriers fufill functionally the same role as battlecruisers. (scouting, commerce raiding, and being able to outrun or outrange enemy ships.) The aircraft trumps any gun armed ship for range, but they can't operate at night, and an Alaska could match or overmatch anything fast enough to actually catch a carrier taskforce at night while being cheaper than an Iowa.
By far one of the most aesthetically pleasing class of warships of the world wars, and one that I most wish had somehow been preserved (along with Nagato, of course).
I still find it somewhat surprising that the Royal Navy didn't look for a way to keep HMS Tiger. Especially since she was retired right when the freak-out of the threat of the Deutschland-class as commerce raiders was happening. Battlecruisers were the perfect counter to fast commerce-raiding cruisers, yet Britain was willing to dispose of one of their only 4 remaining battlecruisers. I can't seen any real chance of the Royal Navy using Tiger as a training ship with the specific plan to remilitarize her in wartime the way Japan did with Hiei. Britain was the only nation that was completely scrupulous about complying with the naval treaties, whereas everybody else looked for loopholes to exploit or in the cases of Italy and Japan just outright cheated. For example, the reason the KGV class had 10 rather than the originally planned 12 guns is that with the planned 3 quad turrets they would exceed the 35,000 ton limit by a mere 500 tons. So the only way Tiger would've been saved from the London Treaty would've been to sacrifice HMS Revenge instead. Given Tiger's greater flexibility and Revenge's lack of potential for further upgrades, I think that would've been a good trade.
@@RedXlV Drach covered this exact scenario in his five minute guide on HMS Tiger showing that the RN made the correct choice in saving the Revenge class ships.
I know the Kongos weren’t the best Battleships/Battlecruisers in history but they are some of my favorite ships. They have undeniably good lines, fast and relatively well armed they hold a special place in my heart
It depends on what your definition of good or bad. Due to the dominance of airpower, most engagements in the Pacific War involved formations of cruisers and destroyers sprinting into a contested sea zone to avoid air attack and fighting under the cover of darkness. The Kongo class was fast enough to go in with these formations and was easily the most active Japanese fast BB. In that sense, it was an oddly appropriate design for its time. The question is whether Kongo's unique capabilities enabled the IJN to do something good or if it just enabled them to do something really dumb. In hindsight, it was the second. Contesting Guadalcanal was a bad idea. At the time, IJN had an incredible superiority in night battles, but this advantage was negated by the Americans just needing to cripple a ship enough that their airplanes could use it for target practice when the sun came up again.
Whatever the resulting end for these ships the IJN got tremendous value from them. Building bigger and fewer battleships proved a mistake compared with large numbers of smaller vessels. Carriers today are making the same mistake, prime targets in a peer conflict.
Prior to the Washington Naval Treaty, Japanese battle line tactics revolved around having two squadrons with one made up of fast ships (armored cruisers or battlecruisers). The fast squadron would work with the main squadron using what were called "L" tactics. They would approach the enemy battle line with the fast squadron trailing and no matter which way the enemy battle fleet turned the two squadrons would separate on headings about 90 degrees apart to sandwich the enemy between them so the enemy was taking fire from two directions. The WNT ended the plans for the 8-8 or 8-8-8 fleet so the Japanese had to group their existing capital ships together as one unit. There was no need for battlecruisers in the new doctrine so the ships had their protection improved slightly as discussed in the video (which was excellent as always) and they were redesignated as fast battleships. So physically they weren't much better protected than when in their battlecruiser role but their mission and role had changed by the 30s. That is why they should be considered fast (and admittedly lightly armored) battleships in WW2.
You have never specifically said why you seem to dislike the Vickers 14" gun. From what I've seen the only reason to favor the 13.5 over the 14 was because they (the RN) had a stock of 13.5" shells dating back to Queen Victoria sitting around. Hardly (in my opinion) a reason to choose a weapon.
I don't dislike it, it's just hilarious at how pushy they were trying to sell it literally anyone with even a tangential interest in naval artillery. :D
@@Drachinifel Ok, I had considered that as a possibility from the way you said it. I was also mindful that later the RN went to a 14" gun. Another consideration was that the biggest bottleneck in warship production was the big guns. I thought that if the RN had gone to a 14" instead of a 13.5" that they could have benefited from Vickers already existent capacity.
You have so many videos of ships in drydock. Ever consider a series of videos on the history of drydocks and their value in wars? Can't save the ship if it can't be repaired.
@@bkjeong4302 . I don't think there was any assurance it would not be used in the Atlantic, however wrecking the dock certainly made sure. You are right in that the value of dry docks is not given the attention that perhaps they deserve.
You would be surprised by how many of us can be tame and discuss the actual history of the ship without screeching an anime girl based on said ship's lines.
@@bakaweiner6956 There is a DDoS attack that requires a VPN to play, even if you're using the likes of KC3 Kai. (I'm using SoftEther VPN Gate as that VPN.) This is not permanent, according to devs. Gotland is currently a limited-time drop, and will get her second retrofit soon.
@@bakaweiner6956 Not at the moment. In the previous event, we had the following new ships: - HNLMS De Ruyter - USS Houston - HMAS Perth - Shinshuu Maru (LHA) - Akishimo - Hirato - USS Atlanta (with a certain Hard only equipment, AACI is more powerful than Maya's, but Maya is more versatile) We also had a mini-event involving Hishimochis. The reward was remodel materials. Save for a small part, I pretty much skipped the event. Also, Okinami had her second retrofit.
Can you do a video on the Type 3 shell? Or if possible on the different types of aerial bombs and/or a series of video covering the different torpedoes used during both world wars by each country like France, britain and etc? A last series of video you could do would be the evolution of food preservation in the royal navy and other navy's in the world. Thanks to do those video on naval ammunations and food preservation that is also a large aspect of naval warfare that aren't often covered in video's. Thanks to take note of that :)
If I remember the accounts of Hiei at Guadalcanal correctly, USS Laffey's gunfire on her bridge wounded the Japanese admiral in command of the raid force and killed his second in command. Laffey's action, far as I can see, was the cause of the Japanese turning back that night.
Very useful ships! Their high speed was of great value, same as with Hood, Renown, and Repulse. They made ideal escorts for the Japanese carriers, and thus were kept quite busy in the early part of the war.
American cruisers, when gun shops go to war French, Italian & Soviet destroyers, when Formula 1 cars go to war German battleships, when grandpa goes to war with new toys
Really enjoy your videos. Though the ending's seem a bit 'cold'. I, personally, would like to hear you give a brief summation of what you thought of the classes/ships you review at the end of every video - say, 60 seconds long or so.
The design and construction of the Kongo class deserves a greater discussion (I think you had pointed out that you are going to do this). It wasnt the case of Armstrong's salesmen selling 14 inch guns there was a complex interaction with the Japanese team who had technincal knowladge and experience and Armstorngs naval artitects with the Royal Navy keeping a close eye on developments. This was different than sales to other countries that seemed simply to go along with the salesmen (thinking of the South American battleships) or accept whatever the Royal Navy told them (the RAN and HMAS Australia - they could have got a better design).
Five minutes guide to the CAM ships of the Merchant Marine! Strapping a Hurricane to your front deck to intercept FW200s with no way of landing the plane is about the most hardcore thing one could do in WW2.
@@spikespa5208 Nope, the hurricat pilots were passionate and to be frank, insane. Who wants to launch off a ship to engage in a dogfight where even if you win you're going to have to ditch in the ocean. If they launched, they swam and hoped that someone would pick them up... Now imagine the ship you launched from sinking. Balls. Of. Steel.
I'm guessing that they were classified as "fast battleships" after reconstruction more as a matter of the IJN retiring the "battlecruiser" designation than to suggest they were actually considered the equal of a modern battleship.
In fact, from what I've read, the ship was not lost due to Washington's fire itself, but instead accidentally scuttled following efforts to counterflood the damage caused by Washington.
Dang. Ship was hit by 18.1-inch shells from Yamato, first shell that hit her probably sealed her fate. I believe Kongo claimed a hit on Gambier Bay, but the hit was also claimed by Yamato, who had the shorter range and the correct firing angle.
The growth of the pagoda structures reflect the Japanese faith in their optical rangefinders. As their weight and size grew, they needed ever taller and stronger structures to support and make best use of them. This also reflected how little faith the IJN had in radar, since their doctrine was their rangefinders would be more than adequate day or night. It wasn't until late 1942 that the Japanese realized how much USN surface search and radar fire control was mauling their ships. That set off a furious pace of development for their own radars. UNfortunately, it did the same for the army, with many identical types being developed in tandem with no coordination between the two services. If some miracle would have occured and the talented men for all services worked together, the IJN may have had effective radars by late 1944, but even that would have been too late. There are very few cases in the history of warfare where the types of circular gunfights engaged in by the Japanese armed services so badly impacted their chance of survival, let alone victory.
It's not just optics that require a high vantage point; radar also does better the higher it is placed (though the Japanese didn't make use of it for most vessels)
@@bkjeong4302 True, although these pagoda masts were built to increase the height of radio antennas as well as optics. The low powered, regenerative circuit radios of the 20's required as much height as possible if they were going to get any kind of useable range, especially in the Pacific. The early USN radars were primarily mounted on carriers and battleships for the same reasons. It was the development of superhet multiple stage receivers and higher powered transmitters that made absolute antenna height less important during the late 30's onward.
There are some historical claims that Hiei could be saved from sinking if her Captain didn't ignored order to beach her in the shallow waters of a nearby combat zone island... On the other hand... I'm not sure if such beaching would make any overall difference for Hiei's ultimate fate due graduately increased American air superiority over Guadalcanal which would no doubt result in constant air raids against her both from Henderson Field and US Navy carriers operating in the area.
A Japanese captain ignoring a direct order in the very brutal IJN? That's pretty much suicidal. Did he go down with his ship or kill himself? If she had been beached and made into a stationary gun position the Americans would have just bombed her into oblivion.
@@bakaweiner6956 hey, don't try to play that the Japanese were victims. Japan started a war with the US and the US was sure as shit going to finish it.
Asheer: Hiei was badly damaged, and despite efforts to tow her with her rudder jammed, she was further damaged by bombs and torpedoes. Admiral Abe (who had been wounded) ordered the ship to be abandoned, destroyers took off the survivors and then torpedoed the ship. Since admiral Abe was on board, the captain cannot be blamed for anything as he was following orders. It was due to the jammed rudder that Hiei was doomed. It has also been found, that like other Japanese ships that were sunk, Hiei's forrward magazine blew up as she went under indicating either too sensitive shell fuses, shells with fuses installed in storage, or a fire was raging around the magazine.
Somehow, I envision this ship chomping down on one of her sister ships with a maw running the entire length of the ship in a sea of blazing, sinking ships while ominous, yet badass organ music blares in the background. Weird.
Interesting, I've got the same mental image. XD Of course, this is also interspersed with images of a girl with really quite elaborate hair, screaming "Burningu Love!" at the top of her lungs. There really is a heck of a lot of wild and crazy stuff floating around in my skull.
I guess Azur Lane designer had this image in mind when they started working on Friedrich de Grobe. Put a 9th symphony in as a background music and you are set.
Been anxiously waiting for this one since I found this channel 10 months ago. The Kongous have always been my favorite class of Japanese ships, even before Kancolle made my love for them even stronger by tapping into my weebishness. And its good to see their legacy of *burning love* lives on in the modern JMSDF Aegis missile destroyers that bear two of their names. Hopefully not suffering similar fates.
![[Live] : ONE 169 วันนี้!! "อนาโตลี vs อูมาร์"](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/IK3YZVWuFJg/mqdefault.jpg)
Pinned post for Q&A :)
When you get around to doing Kirishima be sure to check out the analysis of the wreck that was recently done thanks to the R/V Petrel.
Which do you prefer? War thunder or World of Warships?
The Washington Naval Treaty was a bitch. It would be interesting to see how many major ships were scrapped, changed, never finished, etc. (how do you make a ship 26 feet longer?) My take is that the treaty was a mistake for America and England. They had the money to build whatever they wanted and Japan and Germany could not keep up. And then you get both of them cheating. I'd say that both Japan and Germany got to build what they could afford and we were left playing catch up.
Cool high quality video, but I never understood your disdain for this class in previous mentions. Use what you got, they obviously made speed a priority to keep up with the carriers during the refits vice burdening them down with extra armor, and in 1941-1942, they were still extremely useful assets to act as fast escorts or to put down cruisers and below. Despite them all being annihilated, they proved their worth.
What would you think would happen if the escorting ships of the Pearl Harbor (The battleships and cruisers) striked as well? And sending another wave at the Harbor?
Vickers gun salesman: "If you act right now we can upgrade your ship with NOT 12" guns, NOT 13" guns, BUT 14" guns absolutely free! All you have to do is pay for shipping and handling'
"But wait! There's more . . . "
With this all new flex 15" youll be able to have more firepower
*NOW THATS A LOT OF DAMAGE*
3 easy payments of 19.99$!!!!!!
"If you act now, we'll throw in 10 cases of Earl Grey tea."
@@Jpriest13 the emperor : shut up and take my money!
Nothing ever ends well with the sentence " Close range 16 inch shells."
That is a very clear case of "giving is more blessed than taking"
At that range the 16in sporting US ships were within range of Type 93 torpedoes, they were lucky the Japanese did not score any hits with them (see the Battle of Tassafaronga for reference of what might have happened). At greater ranges the Japanese would have had no means to reply.
Depends on whether your pitching, or catching.
@@VersusARCH Washington got radar that have both range and direction. Japanese still uses Eyeballs MK 1 (human spotters) for ranging. And it was a night battle. Advantage goes to Washington.
@@1968gadgetyo The fact that Washington did not fire earlier cost the US three destroyers sunk and one battleship as well as one destroyer heavily damaged.
That rear gun layout is somehow so appealing.
Misspelled "appalling". :V
the IJN Amagi battle cruiser had a roughly Similar rear layout ,but it had 3 twin turrets
Rather like the UK's Tiger. I would guess for similar reasons as they are not all that dissimilar.
Just like the German Battlecrusiers
This is due to the ship initially being designed for 5x2 12" guns, with the 4th turret to be located between the two rear turrets if ended up with. When they swapped the design to 14" guns during construction, they weren't able to change the layout horribly much, and basically dropped a turret location. This is why there is space enough for another turret between the X and Y turrets on the ships. For something similar to the layout it would have had with the 12" armament, have a gander at the Amagi class.
British salesman slaps the hull of the Kongo: "You can fit so many 14 inch guns in this baby!"
"The ladies are impressed by the big guns. Are you sure we cannot get you into the 14" upgrade package?"
Numerous years later: "are the ladies still impressed by big guns?" Yes, "well then... Put 18.1" guns on this ship and the next can have 20" guns... "
Damn ladies they whaled too much gacha just for the guns.
More like:
The British sales slaps the Kongou: "You can fit so many 14-inch guns in this baby!"
Kongou slaps the salesman: "Yours is hardly fourteen inches ne!"
Whats it gonna take to put you in 8 of these babies today
"Would sir like a 14 inch gun with that?"
“Why yes. Left, please”
Hail Vickers!
Jolly good, jolly jolly good
righto and all that tosh
14 inch guns on deck and cow toung in the freezers we are ready for war sir.
That dark. brooding image of Haruna sunk and settled in shallow water is fascinating. If I were a kid there, I'd be desperate to get out to it and explore.
Lord, that is a horrifying thought to me. I’ve always had an irrational fear of being in the water next to a large ship, a partially sunk one would set off so many heebie-jeebies for me.
"Wow, that battleship is really moving!"
"Kongo?"
"Yes, it Kongo very fast!"
Underrated comment
Exit stage left
oh Groannnn lol
Take my fookin like and fly faster out of here
Not fast enough to outrun the torpedoes from US. Sealion ,which sank her... along with an escorting destroyer who happened to run into one of the tin fish !
To me, the (rebuilt) Kongo class is the best looking capital ship class
They look great ngl, but the Tirpitz is my personal favorite :)
I prefer the Roma and the Iowa class but the Kongo cl. is beautiful as well
Prince of wales: Amateurs
Nagato is also quite nice to look at....
North Carolina class for me.
Vickers: "We will sell you the ability to erase the British Empire in East Asia"
Japan: "We'll do it with aerial torpedos regardless, but a thank you is in order"
Blue Boats
When the US had not imposed an oil embargo on Japan for the war in Manchuria and China I don’t think they would have swung south into Malaysia and Indonesia. They did that to get their hands on the oilfields of Indonesia
"Vickers did manage to slide their ever persistent fourteen inch gun salesman into at least one meeting."
"a close range knife-fight"
Aren't ALL knife-fights 'close range'?
@Steve Blakley But then isn't that a sword fight? :)
@@CSSVirginia Not if they are messers, which are officially knives (30+ inches/76+ cm long)
@@nk_3332 Your are technically correct. Which is the best kind of correct.
@Steve Blakley Or they're thrown.
Ah yes the Kongo class, AKA, "thanks for doing nothing Yamato. Guess we have to do all the work."
Except that they really didn’t do all that much either.
Yes they sortied a lot more often, but most of their sorties didn’t end in something noteworthy. Their speed often gets brought up because of their ability to keep up with carriers or go into the Slot, but big-gun vessels are bad carrier escorts anyways (the big guns are pointless when you aren’t ever going to be in range of the enemy, and AA can be put on smaller, cheaper warships). Two of the three times they went into the Slot they lost, and they don’t even have the excuse of losing to enemy airpower.
In terms of achievements they’re quite awful.
The reality of WWII is that ALL big-gun vessels were obsolete and superfluous. I have no idea why Yamato is singled out for this far more general problem.
Edit; Don't use the Battle off Samar to argue the Kongos achieved more than other Japanese capital ships, as most of Kongo's supposed achievements there have been found to be wrongly credited to her, being feats by the cruisers or even Yamato.
The Rake
It was only at first that they held them back for the decisive battle; after Midway, the Japanese held them back because they (and really, everyone else) couldn’t use their battleships cost-effectively anyways, and unlike the Americans (who could, and did, throw away money on pointless battleships and STILL have enough to build a ton of warships that actually mattered), they couldn’t afford to use them in inefficient ways either.
@@therake8897 Not even that, Second Guadalcanal is really the only battle they could have proved their worth in.
Yeah battleships in general ended up doing little in both world wars, though in WWI they were at least necessary for the occasions they came out and fought, while in WWII you can't even say that in most cases.
@@therake8897 That was only before Midway (as I stated in an earlier comment)-afterwards they gave on on a decisive battle and didn't bother with the battlefleet due to them being pointless.
It did help Admiral Yamamoto gain weight in Hotel Yamato.
Just got the coffee...
2:20 "Persuaded the Japanese to select the larger weapon"
Somehow I have the impression that the IJN officials were quite dissapointed that they only have the 14" guns... :)
Did they went home and produced 41cm/45 gun because they thought they were conned by British arms dealer on Kongou?
@@thanakonpraepanich4284 I don't know. What I know, is that the Japanese army (pre or post WWii?) issued bayonets to the heavy machine guns, to make a point, that it is an assault weapon.
@@karlvongazenberg8398 only the Type 96 and 99 can fix bayonet
I have not researched it much myself, however my impression was the modernization of the Japanese was heavily influenced by western powers.
@@jonathanerickson1543 True. In this case, Imperial Japan succeeded. Unfortunately, Imperial China failed to modernize in time.
Unironically, kantaii collection was what started my love for naval history and warships, its all thanks to KONGOU DESU!
I credited Dogfights episode "Death Of The Japanese Navy" for my interest in the Pacific War.
No one was inspired by Battle of the Midway (Chalton Heston version)? Try Azur Lane. The memes are more historical accurate. Like Enterprise got repair bonus with Vestal in the fleet.
Mine would be models I built in the 70s Iowa and a modern carrier, as well as Midway (1976), In Harms Way (1965) and the many submarine movies of the time. Amazing always to tour an old sub and see the machine shop etc... they packed into it.
Same here. Kongou may have caught my attention, but Iowa hooked me in.
It's funny that an animated Japanese propaganda awakened my inner history geek
The retrofited Kongo is one of the most beautiful capital ships during ww2 in my opinion
amen to that
@Ron Lewenberg i think nicer than Hood and Alaska but Roma ... and incredible ship ! I think 1st Yamato, 2nd Roma, 3rd Ise aircraft carrier battleship, 4th Kongo, 5 Dunkerque, 6 Bismarck, 7 Hood, 8 Warspite, 9 North Carolina, 10 schleswig holstein.
@@therake8897 really nice, just like Kongo
@Enslaved singaporean 2 but Alaska is a capital ship.
@Enslaved singaporean 2 If the Kongo's count as battleships, then the Alaska's should too. The Alaskas are about the same size as the Kongo's, have slightly better armor but worse torpedo protection, and their more modern 12" guns had better penetration and a higher rate of fire than the Kongo's 14"s...
An Alaska would also stand a pretty good chance of winning a duel with a Sharnhorst class. The Alaska is slightly faster and has an immune zone against the Sharnhorst's guns from 18 km out to maximum range, while the Sharnhorst has no immune zone against the Alaska's 12" guns.
The bad reputation of "battle" cruisers is pretty much the reason the CB hull designation stands for Cruiser, "big" (large), instead of Cruiser, Battle.
The fact that they were intended as carrier escorts doesn't really change much, since in a sense carriers fufill functionally the same role as battlecruisers. (scouting, commerce raiding, and being able to outrun or outrange enemy ships.) The aircraft trumps any gun armed ship for range, but they can't operate at night, and an Alaska could match or overmatch anything fast enough to actually catch a carrier taskforce at night while being cheaper than an Iowa.
BURNING LOVE!!!
Whether in real life, Kancolle, Aoki Hagane, or Azur Lane, The Kongo is a favorite of mine. Awesome video.
So annoyed that Alexsis Tipton phoned in her role in Kancolle
@@kaymish6178 Phoned in?
Don't forget World of Warship. The only fun to play capital ship I got to.
Arpegio of blue steel has the best kongou.
@@TheLiamis All for of the Kongos in Arpegio are made of love and win.
I like aesthetic of Kongo class so much, and the history of the ship herself.
Also, Kongo best waifu, no objection accepted
Haruna, and you know it. :)
No Hood is.
@@lansen943 BOI
The Kongo sisters are all supreme Waifus, but Kaga is where it's at.
@@reverend3578 had us in the first half not gonna lie
I love the Kongo class, arguably Japan’s best looking capital ships. Great video!
Kongou-desu!
Nah, though, the Kongou-class are definitely some rather interesting battlecruisers.
BURNING LOVE!
KONGO-DESU!
Sorry i will see myself out.
No, no, we can talk...
Burning Love!
This had to exist. It wasn't optional. You're not to blame, you are merely the lightning rod that was struck by the bolt.
I'm sorry, I have to go find a weeb to punch in the face
@@thekinginyellow1744 you can punch me if you want :D
Arpegio of blue steel was where my live of Kongou. Great looking ship.
7:40 For a second I thought this was a painting of a fortified volcano.
By far one of the most aesthetically pleasing class of warships of the world wars, and one that I most wish had somehow been preserved (along with Nagato, of course).
Thanks for the work you put into the channel Drach. We all benefit.
Shame the Royal Navy couldn't have pulled the same stunt with the Tiger.
I still find it somewhat surprising that the Royal Navy didn't look for a way to keep HMS Tiger. Especially since she was retired right when the freak-out of the threat of the Deutschland-class as commerce raiders was happening. Battlecruisers were the perfect counter to fast commerce-raiding cruisers, yet Britain was willing to dispose of one of their only 4 remaining battlecruisers.
I can't seen any real chance of the Royal Navy using Tiger as a training ship with the specific plan to remilitarize her in wartime the way Japan did with Hiei. Britain was the only nation that was completely scrupulous about complying with the naval treaties, whereas everybody else looked for loopholes to exploit or in the cases of Italy and Japan just outright cheated. For example, the reason the KGV class had 10 rather than the originally planned 12 guns is that with the planned 3 quad turrets they would exceed the 35,000 ton limit by a mere 500 tons. So the only way Tiger would've been saved from the London Treaty would've been to sacrifice HMS Revenge instead.
Given Tiger's greater flexibility and Revenge's lack of potential for further upgrades, I think that would've been a good trade.
@@RedXlV Drach covered this exact scenario in his five minute guide on HMS Tiger showing that the RN made the correct choice in saving the Revenge class ships.
Lot's of information that I didn't know before about the class, especially Hiei. This is why I love this channel. Well done sir.
"Haruna spending much of the 1920s in reserve after suffering from an explosion in one of [her] turrets."
Haruna: Daijoubu desu
My little sisters work so hard dess.
I know the Kongos weren’t the best Battleships/Battlecruisers in history but they are some of my favorite ships. They have undeniably good lines, fast and relatively well armed they hold a special place in my heart
It depends on what your definition of good or bad. Due to the dominance of airpower, most engagements in the Pacific War involved formations of cruisers and destroyers sprinting into a contested sea zone to avoid air attack and fighting under the cover of darkness. The Kongo class was fast enough to go in with these formations and was easily the most active Japanese fast BB. In that sense, it was an oddly appropriate design for its time.
The question is whether Kongo's unique capabilities enabled the IJN to do something good or if it just enabled them to do something really dumb. In hindsight, it was the second. Contesting Guadalcanal was a bad idea. At the time, IJN had an incredible superiority in night battles, but this advantage was negated by the Americans just needing to cripple a ship enough that their airplanes could use it for target practice when the sun came up again.
Whatever the resulting end for these ships the IJN got tremendous value from them. Building bigger and fewer battleships proved a mistake compared with large numbers of smaller vessels. Carriers today are making the same mistake, prime targets in a peer conflict.
Came for the Kantai comments, is not disappointed.
Prior to the Washington Naval Treaty, Japanese battle line tactics revolved around having two squadrons with one made up of fast ships (armored cruisers or battlecruisers). The fast squadron would work with the main squadron using what were called "L" tactics. They would approach the enemy battle line with the fast squadron trailing and no matter which way the enemy battle fleet turned the two squadrons would separate on headings about 90 degrees apart to sandwich the enemy between them so the enemy was taking fire from two directions.
The WNT ended the plans for the 8-8 or 8-8-8 fleet so the Japanese had to group their existing capital ships together as one unit. There was no need for battlecruisers in the new doctrine so the ships had their protection improved slightly as discussed in the video (which was excellent as always) and they were redesignated as fast battleships.
So physically they weren't much better protected than when in their battlecruiser role but their mission and role had changed by the 30s. That is why they should be considered fast (and admittedly lightly armored) battleships in WW2.
You have never specifically said why you seem to dislike the Vickers 14" gun. From what I've seen the only reason to favor the 13.5 over the 14 was because they (the RN) had a stock of 13.5" shells dating back to Queen Victoria sitting around. Hardly (in my opinion) a reason to choose a weapon.
I don't dislike it, it's just hilarious at how pushy they were trying to sell it literally anyone with even a tangential interest in naval artillery. :D
@@Drachinifel Ok, I had considered that as a possibility from the way you said it. I was also mindful that later the RN went to a 14" gun. Another consideration was that the biggest bottleneck in warship production was the big guns. I thought that if the RN had gone to a 14" instead of a 13.5" that they could have benefited from Vickers already existent capacity.
You have so many videos of ships in drydock. Ever consider a series of videos on the history of drydocks and their value in wars? Can't save the ship if it can't be repaired.
Hence the St. Nazaire raid.
@@grahvis That particular one wasn't a good example, as Tirpitz was never planned to head there in the first place.
@@bkjeong4302 .
I don't think there was any assurance it would not be used in the Atlantic, however wrecking the dock certainly made sure.
You are right in that the value of dry docks is not given the attention that perhaps they deserve.
@@grahvis The Germans had no such plans, Hitler put an end to Atlantic surface ops after Rheinbunung.
Good idea.
I was expecting "burning love" but the comment section was more civilized than I thought
You would be surprised by how many of us can be tame and discuss the actual history of the ship without screeching an anime girl based on said ship's lines.
Last time I was this early, the Imperial Japanese navy was still a threat
They have quite the navy now, including Kaga and Izumo ( aircraft/ Helicopter carriers) destroyers and some other neat stuff
Well the imperial Japanese Navy no longer I think nobody is imperial anymore
You a ghost, a vampire or a living dead?
@@thelvadam2884 and 2 carriers named after the battle carriers.
Born in England and returned to Japan, first ship of Kongou class, Kongou desu!
Ah, Kongo. A ship of such energy, filled to the brim with Burning Love.
My first ring in Kantai Collection. Got her Kai 2C form immediately.
@@bakaweiner6956 Don't worry, it's still pain and suffering.
@@bakaweiner6956 There is a DDoS attack that requires a VPN to play, even if you're using the likes of KC3 Kai. (I'm using SoftEther VPN Gate as that VPN.) This is not permanent, according to devs.
Gotland is currently a limited-time drop, and will get her second retrofit soon.
@@bakaweiner6956 Not at the moment. In the previous event, we had the following new ships:
- HNLMS De Ruyter
- USS Houston
- HMAS Perth
- Shinshuu Maru (LHA)
- Akishimo
- Hirato
- USS Atlanta (with a certain Hard only equipment, AACI is more powerful than Maya's, but Maya is more versatile)
We also had a mini-event involving Hishimochis. The reward was remodel materials. Save for a small part, I pretty much skipped the event.
Also, Okinami had her second retrofit.
Hiei kai-Ni "C" for the next update this April 25, 2020
That final image of Haruna is such a sad sight. She (and indeed the class as a whole) deserved a better fate than lady luck handed them.
Designers: So how much superstructure should the new battleship have?
IJN: *Y E S*
Actually the reason for pagoda masts was partially due to the LACK of a big superstructure.
@@bkjeong4302 Still though, it made their ships look goofy
@@beanlord4347 *cough* Fusō *cough*
wow. you pack so much into such a short bit. this was so very good, then suddenly over with. thanks, Drach! well done!
Can you do a video on the Type 3 shell? Or if possible on the different types of aerial bombs and/or a series of video covering the different torpedoes used during both world wars by each country like France, britain and etc?
A last series of video you could do would be the evolution of food preservation in the royal navy and other navy's in the world.
Thanks to do those video on naval ammunations and food preservation that is also a large aspect of naval warfare that aren't often covered in video's.
Thanks to take note of that :)
Thank you for taking care of your fans that are trying to stay home. You are A+ personality.
OOOOOOOHHHH
Bongo bongo bongo, I dont wanna leave my kongo oh no no no no~
If I remember the accounts of Hiei at Guadalcanal correctly, USS Laffey's gunfire on her bridge wounded the Japanese admiral in command of the raid force and killed his second in command.
Laffey's action, far as I can see, was the cause of the Japanese turning back that night.
Very useful ships! Their high speed was of great value, same as with Hood, Renown, and Repulse. They made ideal escorts for the Japanese carriers, and thus were kept quite busy in the early part of the war.
Japanese cruisers, when skyscrapers go to war
Japanese aircraft carriers... when you do your ironing at war on the main deck!
Japanese destroyer. When you came out of mcdonald to participate the war
Japanese Submarines, when HOLLYWOOD, HOLLYWOOD, HOLLYWOOOOOD!!!!!
Benjamin Johnson Yamato class battleships, when hotels go to war
American cruisers, when gun shops go to war
French, Italian & Soviet destroyers, when Formula 1 cars go to war
German battleships, when grandpa goes to war with new toys
Kongo is amazing. My favourite WW2 warship. Looking forward for the longer video on the class, and the Kongo herself!
It's not just Drach's video -- it is the cascading deep dive(s) into the battles he mentions..................
I know everyone else has, but I have to too:
BUUUUURNINGUU LAAAAAAV!!!!!
YESSS, THE KONGO VIDEO IS HERE, AFTER A YEAR OF WAITING
The photo at 5:00 is one of the most beautiful I have ever seen of a warship. Lovely light picking out the lines and a slight mistiness. Gorgeous.
If you support a TH-camr, "likes" do not matter, minutes watched does. So please watch it all the way through.
One of my favorite looking ships of all time.
Tried Kongo in wows and loved it, then found ARP and now it (and Haruna) and musashi are some of my favs.
Currently grinding through Nagato :-/
I'm on Fuso
Pretty cool looking ships. I remember building a kitset Kirishima when I was a sprog.
Really enjoy your videos.
Though the ending's seem a bit 'cold'.
I, personally, would like to hear you give a brief summation of what you thought of the classes/ships you review at the end of every video - say, 60 seconds long or so.
The design and construction of the Kongo class deserves a greater discussion (I think you had pointed out that you are going to do this). It wasnt the case of Armstrong's salesmen selling 14 inch guns there was a complex interaction with the Japanese team who had technincal knowladge and experience and Armstorngs naval artitects with the Royal Navy keeping a close eye on developments. This was different than sales to other countries that seemed simply to go along with the salesmen (thinking of the South American battleships) or accept whatever the Royal Navy told them (the RAN and HMAS Australia - they could have got a better design).
Five minutes guide to the CAM ships of the Merchant Marine!
Strapping a Hurricane to your front deck to intercept FW200s with no way of landing the plane is about the most hardcore thing one could do in WW2.
Kamikazes?
Spike's Pa well, most of them survived, so bonus points for that.
@@spikespa5208 Nope, the hurricat pilots were passionate and to be frank, insane. Who wants to launch off a ship to engage in a dogfight where even if you win you're going to have to ditch in the ocean. If they launched, they swam and hoped that someone would pick them up... Now imagine the ship you launched from sinking.
Balls. Of. Steel.
I'm guessing that they were classified as "fast battleships" after reconstruction more as a matter of the IJN retiring the "battlecruiser" designation than to suggest they were actually considered the equal of a modern battleship.
I see muh fellow weebs have overtaken this comment section. Glorious.
*Burning Love*
Baningu rabu!!!!!
Me: *diving into Kongou's deck* BOMBS AWAY!!! *drops bombs and pulls up*
@@thefellathathuntsvatniks Shouldn't it be a Submarine? Or be a mad bastard and fire your Orelikon at Hiei.
@@ravenwing199 I'm inside my Dauntless, you know...
@@thefellathathuntsvatniks Uh Ok but I actually got a functional Mk14 torpedo.
In fact, from what I've read, the ship was not lost due to Washington's fire itself, but instead accidentally scuttled following efforts to counterflood the damage caused by Washington.
Wow nice damage control
Yes. Although it had a lot to do with how the ship was built, the flooding made her top heavy lol. So she was just tumbling from side to side )))
@Nguyen Johnathan Great read, thanks for the link.
Damage control was not a strong point of the Japanese Navy. The fate of Kongo is proof of that.
But she was screwed anyway because she didn’t stand a chance against Washington
Here we go again!
25mm type 96 AA
Why they sOck = drydock 18
Why they persisted = drydock 55
This has been a public service message 🤓
The 25mm Type 96 Aircraft Notification System, in the US, would be sold at Wal-Mart along with the Red Ryder BB guns...
Normally just listen but like the Recolored Photos, really added to the video for me
Surprised to see you've covered this ship already. I wish you would cover the story of the sinking as well, and it's race to Taiwan before sinking.
My Father served aboard USS Gambier Bay during the Battle off Samar.
Dang. Ship was hit by 18.1-inch shells from Yamato, first shell that hit her probably sealed her fate.
I believe Kongo claimed a hit on Gambier Bay, but the hit was also claimed by Yamato, who had the shorter range and the correct firing angle.
The comment section of this video will be
I N T E R E S T I NG
Nicely outfitted specifications for their time and circumstance.
The growth of the pagoda structures reflect the Japanese faith in their optical rangefinders. As their weight and size grew, they needed ever taller and stronger structures to support and make best use of them. This also reflected how little faith the IJN had in radar, since their doctrine was their rangefinders would be more than adequate day or night. It wasn't until late 1942 that the Japanese realized how much USN surface search and radar fire control was mauling their ships. That set off a furious pace of development for their own radars. UNfortunately, it did the same for the army, with many identical types being developed in tandem with no coordination between the two services. If some miracle would have occured and the talented men for all services worked together, the IJN may have had effective radars by late 1944, but even that would have been too late. There are very few cases in the history of warfare where the types of circular gunfights engaged in by the Japanese armed services so badly impacted their chance of survival, let alone victory.
It's not just optics that require a high vantage point; radar also does better the higher it is placed (though the Japanese didn't make use of it for most vessels)
@@bkjeong4302 True, although these pagoda masts were built to increase the height of radio antennas as well as optics. The low powered, regenerative circuit radios of the 20's required as much height as possible if they were going to get any kind of useable range, especially in the Pacific. The early USN radars were primarily mounted on carriers and battleships for the same reasons. It was the development of superhet multiple stage receivers and higher powered transmitters that made absolute antenna height less important during the late 30's onward.
Competition for topside real estate, sensor coverage, wave length allocation and prioritization is alive and well in the 21 century.
Kongo is my favourite ship of all time,great looking and just awesome 😍
Burning love!!
burning love
I was actually wondering what the hell am i suposed to do im so bored. *New vid with Kongo waifu* Yeeeeeeeeeee
Pacific theater still my focus. Thanks!
Drach does not have subscribers. He has worshippers.
I'd have said shipmates, myself.
@@AWMJoeyjoejoe I'll agree with that title!
@@AWMJoeyjoejoe I'll admit, it was a toss-up between the two...
You mean warshippers
Hail Drach.
I did not know they were that old and had been rebuilt that much. Thanks!
Fellow Shikikans, Teitokus and/or just random weebs passing by. It is our time to shine
It's over
Kongo-san HIEI!
"Zenkan, sentou haichi!"
Kongou-Dess
Burning Love!
Somehow Yamato guide uploaded las year did not get overrun by us weebs like this.
Time that I had seen a video about the Kongō-class.
My question for your Q & A is about the Imperial Japanese Navy's infamous Long Lance Torpedo.
Kiroshima: Heheheheh
South Dakota: F**k
Washington: *Hello there*
General Washington!, you are a bold one
I didnt know the Kongos had different pagoda masts. I cant wait for the video on Takao, it's my favorite ship!
That mast just grew like a tree over the years! Higher and thicker.
Kongo Fuso and Nagato are just such beuatifull ships
I always like the massive tower structure. Who ever was on top could see for miles and it looked bad ass.
There are some historical claims that Hiei could be saved from sinking if her Captain didn't ignored order to beach her in the shallow waters of a nearby combat zone island...
On the other hand... I'm not sure if such beaching would make any overall difference for Hiei's ultimate fate due graduately increased American air superiority over Guadalcanal which would no doubt result in constant air raids against her both from Henderson Field and US Navy carriers operating in the area.
A Japanese captain ignoring a direct order in the very brutal IJN? That's pretty much suicidal. Did he go down with his ship or kill himself?
If she had been beached and made into a stationary gun position the Americans would have just bombed her into oblivion.
@@bakaweiner6956 hey, don't try to play that the Japanese were victims.
Japan started a war with the US and the US was sure as shit going to finish it.
He couldn't run Hiei aground, her steering gear was wrecked and her rudder was jammed to starboard forcing her to turn in circles.
@@tisFrancesfault I wouldn't even bother to find victims in a war between colonisers...
Asheer: Hiei was badly damaged, and despite efforts to tow her with her rudder jammed, she was further damaged by bombs and torpedoes. Admiral Abe (who had been wounded) ordered the ship to be abandoned, destroyers took off the survivors and then torpedoed the ship. Since admiral Abe was on board, the captain cannot be blamed for anything as he was following orders. It was due to the jammed rudder that Hiei was doomed. It has also been found, that like other Japanese ships that were sunk, Hiei's forrward magazine blew up as she went under indicating either too sensitive shell fuses, shells with fuses installed in storage, or a fire was raging around the magazine.
I would love to see a video about the battle of malacca strait.
"Hey, these new U.S. battleships aren't so tough!" --_Kirishima_ , Guadalcanal, 1942
"Surprise, Mothaf-----!!!" -- U.S.S. _Washington_ , 5 seconds later.
It was radar. When the South Dakota suffered electric power loss, it was blind without radar like others with the IJN trained in night fighting.
5:06 That picture of Kongo in drydock is worth the whole price of admission. Nice.
Burning love
I stopped playing, but I still love facts!
Somehow, I envision this ship chomping down on one of her sister ships with a maw running the entire length of the ship in a sea of blazing, sinking ships while ominous, yet badass organ music blares in the background. Weird.
Interesting, I've got the same mental image. XD
Of course, this is also interspersed with images of a girl with really quite elaborate hair, screaming "Burningu Love!" at the top of her lungs. There really is a heck of a lot of wild and crazy stuff floating around in my skull.
I guess Azur Lane designer had this image in mind when they started working on Friedrich de Grobe. Put a 9th symphony in as a background music and you are set.
C-cadenza?
I'm so happy things are still going strong at 174.
BURNING LOOOOOOOOOOOVE!
Been anxiously waiting for this one since I found this channel 10 months ago. The Kongous have always been my favorite class of Japanese ships, even before Kancolle made my love for them even stronger by tapping into my weebishness.
And its good to see their legacy of *burning love* lives on in the modern JMSDF Aegis missile destroyers that bear two of their names. Hopefully not suffering similar fates.
Burning love!
Yes I am a weeb and regret nothing
same here
Thanks!
Finally, muh KONGO BONGO
An excellent video. A very informative "five minutes" more or even more. Two thumbs up! More or less.
Could you do a review of the Hiryu? It is one of my favorite ships so I thought it would be great to combine it with one of my favorite TH-camrs.
Kongo, along with Royal Oak and Barham were 3 British build battleship/cruiser sunk by submarine
And Thanks to WG I now have all 4 in my WoWs Port under the ARP Banner!
Same
Thank You a really enjoy your content.
Been waiting for this video! Thanks!