Who were the Pechenegs?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 16 มิ.ย. 2024
- The medieval Eurasian steppe is a rather confusing place, for several reasons. The first, is that it played host to an ever shifting patchwork of nomadic and semi-nomadic peoples, whose various wars precipitated large-scale migrations at various points. Another, is that these peoples, by and large, left very little (if anything) by way of written sources by which we can identify them. The Pechenegs are one such group, who emerge into the historical record, and in particular Byzantine Imperial documents, from the conveyor belt of the Eurasian steppe.
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0:00 Intro
1:43 The Rise of the Pechenegs
5:12 Language
6:06 Society
9:07 Byzantine Diplomacy
10:51 Origins
16:40 Decline and Fall
![Fc ครับ ขอแนะนำให้รู้จักกับ "น้องเปียโน" l [Nickynachat]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/HQU6Q_IYTLo/mqdefault.jpg)
My apologies for any mispronunciations - Tocharian in particular! I also wanted to point out that at the 9:54 mark I use the word 'Russians' to refer to the Kievan Rus - I was quoting from a rather antiquated copy of Constantine's 'De Administrando Imperio'. Instead, the word I should have used is simply 'Rus'.
There is/was no such thing as "Kievan-Rus'" just Rus'/ Русь , just as there was no such thing as "Byzantine Empire" .. it was simply the Roman Empire, and after Old Rome fell to the invading Germanic tribes it was called Eastern Roman Empire.. (The Roman Emperor, Constantine the Great called his new capital on the Bosporus Nova Roma / Νεα Ρώμη / New Rome).. the Hellenic people there called themselves Ρωμαίοι/Romaioi... and the Ottoman Turks called/call them Rum till today.. (Kievan-Rus and Byzantine Empire are recent titles made up by Western European academic historians). When the Rus'/Русь accepted Christianity from Constantinople they started calling themselves what the Hellenistic Eastern Roman Empire (Constantinople) called them, IE Ρώσσοι / Rossoi, and their territories Ρωσσία/Rossia.. down to these days they now call themselves Русский [Русы] / Russkii and their lands Россия /Rossiya/Russia.... thus you were correct to call them Russians and no need to apologize and "correct" what you said in this excellent video👍🙂.
Rus' was refered to by that name, by the Greek Rossiya, and by the Latin Ruthenia.
In ages since the people of Rus' were divided between themselves and outside empires, Ruthenia came to refer to the part of what was once Rus' that came under Polish and Lithuanian domination, what we know today as the Ukraine. While Peter the Great renamed what was known as the Russian Tsardom; or Russkoe Tsarstvo (which arose from the Grand Duchy of Moscowy and some surviving principalities from the Rus' days), to the Greek Rossiya, which came to be anglicized in the English language as Russia.
Wonder if the pacheneg descendants became the Cossacks?
@@tinahs8269
Good question!
Accepted. Also: "Levounion" is pronounced like /levoonion/ rather than /levoyoonion/.
The Hungarians (Magyars) refer to the Pechenegs as Besenyők (plural), which sounds very close to "Be-ca-nag" at 11:45. There are several villages in Hungary incorporating their name, which would indicate where fleeing Pechenegs may have settled when their empire was destroyed - one such village being Besenyőtelek, translated as Pecheneg site/settlement.
Great video!
This is fascinating!!
Yes, exactly! There were areas/villages named after & recognized as Pecheneg, Cuman, & Jasic (Iranic, but Asiatic; indicating they were formed after Turkic advances West & from groups that left AIania/DNA shows this too) settlements w/n Hungary (& what now incIudes other C. European nations).
Here are some examples of names & the extent of Pecheneg settlement:
Besenyőtelek, Hungary
Bešeňov, Slovakia
Ládbesenyő, Hungary
Beščeně, Czechia (now part of Kunovice)
Biçənək, Azeribajan
Pečenjevce, Serbia
Pechenihy, Ukraine
Pecineaga, Romania (N. Dobruja)
Szirmabesenyő, Hungary
Pieczonogi, Poland
Pöttsching, Austria
That is interesting but not significant. "Besenyők" is clearly just the Hungarian form of the word "Pecheneg", there's nothing surprising about that. And nothing to indicate that the Hungarians got the name from the Uyghurs.
@@SporeMurph Nobody before you has indicated that the Magyars (Hungarians) got the name for the Pechenegs from the Uyghurs. Academics and other interested people are just trying to put together more information about the Pechenegs based on the little info that is available (more like detective work) and it's all probabilistic. For example, if I look at your TH-cam handle of "SporeMurph", I would assign a low probability that you have an interest in mushrooms, maybe even Psilocybans, based on "Spore". But there is a higher chance that I would be wrong. 🤣🤣🤣
Oddly, the name of this people may have survived in some family names common in eastern Europe. There are several variants like 'Petschenig', 'Petschnig', 'Petschnigg', 'Pecnik' etc. still to be found in the telephone books of many countries.
This is fascinating, the way the traces of these 'lost' peoples remain to this day
Yes and in croatia serbia under pađen / pađenovic and besen in hungary
Печенег или бажанак..
Печенеги они бажанак
It’s crazy to think that had the Pechenegs not pushed us Hungarians West, then we would have likely suffered the same fate that other Uralic or Turkic speakers experienced in Russia: colonization and extermination. We might owe our continued existence to them in a strange way.
Igen ez érdekes, én is erre gondoltam.
How interesting to understand that I am according your words is exterminated.
You will be, if the empire decides to send you to the frontline
@@logarithm2672 overly dramatic edge lord, as usual believe in his delusional thoughts. Oh well.
@@PairFreebirdwell you are very russified now
The city of Kharkov (near the Donets river) has a suburb called "Pechenegi" ... This does not mean that Pechenegs live there anymore, but who knows. Peoples never disappeared fully, in the case of the Pechenegs some ended up joining the Magyars to form Hungary and a large group was absorbed into Romania
Kharkiv, not kharkov. Kharkov is a word for spitting in past perfect. For example: "I spat on putler" will be "Ya kharkov na khuila ".
@@cabramontes take your pills, mate
@@cabramontes putler living rent free in idiot mind
@@cabramontesНекогда негде не називают тем боле унизителним сходством . Украинский многие слова одинакова с Каракалпакский . Но я негде не прочитал об этом толко слишал Киев Куйеу означает Зят Харьков Кар коп означает много снег . Там ест раен Бессарапия а это точно род Каракалпаков по Каракалпакском род Бессары . Род Бессары есть только у Каракалпаков . Саратов на русском тоже нечего не означает на Каракалпакском Сары тау означает Жёлтый гори . Примеров полно . Например в Украине есть район Токмак это Каракалпакском означает дубинка оружие древний Каракалпаков
Tonuzoba ("Hog Father") was a Pecheneg chief of the Tolmac tribe who settled in Hungary with his people about 950 AD.
He was given lands from the grand prince Taksony in the county of Heves. He was related to the grand prince, because Taksony's wife was Tonuzobas daughter or sister. According to the legend Tonuzoba was buried alive at Abádszalók because he refused to convert to Christianity.
Fascinating. Int Turkish "Domuz opa" would mean "Hog Granddad"
ezt a legendát már elvetették
@@szubudaj Pontosan mit is?
Wasn’t he buried alive because he assassinated Prince Imre? Doesn’t the Gesta Hungarorum say that when Tonuzoba heard the news of Imre’s death “he buried himself alive along with his family”.
Tonuz Donuz Domuz : Swine ; Oba means ⛺️ Tent House or Tent Village in modern Turkish ; ata : Father
Probably the only detailed video on this obscure Turkic group available on TH-cam. Thank you very much for your efforts!
They are not obscure at all......they are a part of our nation and have been for over a 1000 years, just as Hungarians still live side by side with Kazakhs in today's Kazakhstan and with mongols in today's Mongolia, Kazakhs live with us in Hungary also for over a 1000 years. We are all a part of the once mighty tribal/cultural organization called Scythians and later the Huns. We are them! An area stretching from Siberia to Carpathian basin. The trade super-highway called the silk road was controlled by us.
@szubudaj not any of you have any connection to Scythians they were Iranic people
@@extremistterrorist that is just a theory we don't have any proof to confirm. there is no any record in Scythian language or about them to call them Iranic or Turkic. on the other hand their nomadic life and metalworking crafty are two things reflecting Turkic characters about them.
@@mda990 Scythian, member of a nomadic people, originally of Iranian stock, known from as early as the 9th century bce who migrated westward from Central Asia to southern Russia and Ukraine in the 8th and 7th centuries bce
@mda990 I'm talking about facts not theory. Give one evidence that Scythians are tork
Magyars were pushed by Pechenegs and Bulgarians (medivial ones).'' The Magyars cross the Danube in 895, and are victorious over the Bulgarians twice. So Simeon withdraws to Durostorum, which he successfully defends, while during 896 he finds some assistance for his side, persuading the usually Byzantine-friendly Pechenegs to help him out. Then, while the Pechenegs began to combat the Magyars on their eastern frontier, Simeon and his father Boris I, the former tsar who left his monastery retreat to assist his heir in the occasion, gather an enormous army and march to the north to defend their empire ''.The Battle of Southern Buh occurred near the banks of the eponymous river (today in Ukraine). The result was a great Bulgarian victory which forced the Magyars of the Etelköz realm to abandon the steppes of southern Ukraine'' .
best content on these pechenegs i have seen... i remember them referenced in john julius norwich's books on the byzantine empire that i read around 2001 and 2002... your video adds interesting ideas, even that they may have had a tocharian element
I personally doubt the Tocharian element on a few grounds:
1. The Tocharians were mostly settled whereas the pechenegs are a nomadic group
2. I understand the tocharian connection comes from the similar names, with the pechenegs having three tribes of “Kangars” which is similar to the name for the region around Tashkent which was referred to as “kang” or “kangju” but the evidence is lacking in that respect
3. The kangars were said to have stemmed themselves from the turkic tiele which were more easterly in those days.
I was reading them then too, and that's where I first heard about them.
We could talk about tribes of ancient American.. hmmmm.. before the British domination and evolve to American ambitions.. hmmmm.
@@peaceleader7315you make it sound delicious hmmm.
@stevenkarner6872 righteous of freedom and democracy hmmmm some time I wonder 🤔.
Stumbled across this channel and was surprised that it only had ~4,000 subscribers. Your content is genuinely well formatted and well researched, much better than some more prominent and bigger channels out there. Looking forward to seeing more videos from you. Subscribed.
There isnt an English equivalent of the Turkic word Bacanak. It isnt exactly brother-in-law but rather used in reference to the husband of the sister of ones wife (hope I put that right) but despite 46 years of being a Turk, I never even considered how the origin of Bacanak can have anything to do with Pecenek's until you mentioned it. Thanks for a brilliant video.
@@sever8351 heh how Öztürk Serengil would've said it 👍
"Pecheneg" comes from the Turkic word "Bajanak" which means sister's husband, brother-in-law
Sanmiyorum
The husbands of sisters are Badjanak to each other. In some Turkic tongues this is pronounced as Becheneg.
@@salihdalgin1573He’s right. The Peçenek=Bacanak relation is historically agreed on.
“8. yüzyıla ait Hor (Uygurlar’ın Tibetçe adı) elçilerinin raporlarında da Becanag adıyla kendilerinden bahsedilmiştir.[3] Bilinmeyen bir yazar tarafından 982 yılında yazımı biten ve daha sonra Gurluların hükümdarı Abu ul-Harith Muhammad ibn Ahmad’a sunulan Hudûd el-âlem adlı kitapta Peçenekler, Bachanāk-i Turk ve Turkān-i Bachanākī olarak adlandırılmıştır.[4] Dede Korkut destanlarında, Oğuzlar'ın Salur boyuyla çarpışan Peçenekler için "Beçenek" adı kullanılmıştır. Burada bahsi geçen Peçenekler, batıya göç eden ana Peçenek kitlesinden ayrı olarak Oğuzlar'a tabi olmuş kitledir. Ebu'l Gazi Bahadır Han'ın, Şecere-i Terakime adlı eserinde Peçenekler'den "Becene" adıyla bahsedilmiştir.”
@@user-nt9gy4ry5k In Balkans, we used terms Badžanak, Badžo and Pašenog. Same etymology.
Peçeneks are Turks. A branch of Oghuz Clans.
Iam Turkish and my name is also "Oghuz Attila TOPRAK."
I know my nations deep history of thousands years, better then any...
Additionally, Turks and Magyars(in Turkish we say - Madjars) are related in somehow, someway. They are ours distant relatives.
Theres way to little Turkic history on TH-cam so thanks for this!
there is way too much. I want none
@nToKnow Nobody asked for your biased opinion tho. Stay in your hole.
I was genuinely shocked when I saw how few subscribers this channel had, but I'm sure it'll blow up soon. I loved the production quality and design, very fitting for a topic as unique and interesting as this. Thank you for the work!
I only remember the Pechenegs because I read them in a loooong list of peoples who invaded the Byzantines. Sadly for them, they did it back when we were still strong enough to repel them.
1) I just found this, and subscribed. Good work. Your graphics are good overall, with a great sense of reserve when it comes to text usage. I love your smooth repetition of key points, though it would have been even better if you opened your discussions of competing theories with a checklist. "Tell 'em what you're going to tell them, tell them, and then tell them what you told them," I think that was originally a Marine Corps saying, but I heard it in Toastmasters.
2) This would make an epic generational strategy game, and parts of the Pecheneg story would also make for an awesome low-fantasy TTRPG. That whole, "we can't defend our territory and now we must flee to the west: what will we become of us?" bit is just great fodder for TTRPG.
Great documentary, i was curious about my ethnic background, my grandma claims that we are descented of Pecheneg Crimean Tatars, as a history enthusiastic whichs knowledges about Pontic Steppe's Turkic nomads is kinda terra incognita, i was in search of documents or anything that would feed my "Pecheneg curiosity" and what a luck for me that this video got recomended to me.
This video helped me a lot, there are literally very few source about Pechenegs among other Pontic Steppe Turkic nomads.Well at least shortened my "Pecheneg curiosity" and de-facto helped my "Eastern Roman-Rus Relations Across Centuries" presentation, so thank you Mr. JustAnotherHistoryChannel.
(Just got bored in intern, thats why this comment is this "longified", lmao.)
Conclusion: found an another great channel to feed my history hunger.
This was articulately done, love it.
Absolutely top quality content. You deserve many more subscribers.
The algorithm put your latest video on my home page. I’m truly surprised in a good way. Your video is about a people I hadn’t heard of before and is also entertaining and gives a great deal of insight into their history. I must say that your channel is a fresh breeze blowing through the murky jungle of TH-cam. Of course I subscribed and I will be watching your other videos.
I’m shocked you don’t have more views. You’re next up my guy. Excellent video.
very informative. good balance between understandably simple and getting at the relevant informational .
incredibly thorough, love it!
Fantastic video. I love it when historic creators dig into these obscure peoples that are so often overlooked or relegated to mere footnotes in the shadow of more "prestigious" empires and cultures. Thank you!
this is the type of history i crave, liked & subbed
This was incredible fascinating. I've already sent this video on to all my steppe-history-curious friends. Besides the story being interesting, your presentstion, voiceover, and structuring really made it an easy listen in the best way.
Thank you! I'm very glad you enjoyed the video, and I really appreciate the feedback!
Great narration, sweet editing, nicely done. More images would be wonderful :)
Your channel is criminally underrated, mate.
Agreed with the praise, also subscribed.
Also, my wife said you have an interesting voice and it does not put her to sleep unlike most of the other folks I listen to - very high praise coming from her 😅.
Successfully ambitious coverage of a genuinely obscure slice of history. Really well done, The mists of time have veiled the complexity of the steppe and its peoples. This was fascinating. The comments generated by your video contain some interesting nuggets in pursuit of where the Pechenegs dispersed.
Thank you! I'm very glad to hear you enjoyed the video, I really appreciate your feedback too.
Immediately subscribed to the Patreon, looking forward to more fantastic work like this!
Thank you so much! I'm very glad you enjoyed the video
I love my Pecheneggas!!!!
there are 2 teory in Turkish ; 1 "bacanak" brother in law and "Beyneg or Begneg" as Beg means not just lord but also rich and noble this could be refer to both Pechenegs as noble rich aristocrats of Oguz and remnants of Turkic Kaganate that didnt became muslim or their noble blood horses
u deserve more views and subscribers, amazing videos
This is a wonderful video! I really love the editing style. The dark colors, film grain and typography are quite pleasing. The subject matter is also great as there aren't many good videos about Eurasian steppe peoples, if you wish to continue with this topic a video about the Magyars or Tocharians would be really cool. Tocharian groups are rarely talked about on TH-cam. Or maybe even a video about the Cumans or other Turkic peoples, it is up to you :)
However I do have a minor correction, perhaps you mentioned this yourself and I missed it, but the Cuman language is usually classified as a Kipchak language while the Pechenegs are believed to have spoken an Oghuz language, but a Kipchak classification is also argued. Al-Kashgari perhaps meant variant as in similar but another branch, I am not sure, he was from Kashgar and probably spoke Qara-Khanid Turkic (of the Karluk branch) and Arabic. Mahmud actually published a relatively famous dictionary of the Turkic languages, the name of the text is a pain to spell in English.
Anyway, your bit about Turkification is spot on (it would also make an awesome video!), the Eurasian steppe and forest steppe during most of Antiquity was mostly Indo-European and "Siberian" (Uralic, Yeniseian) linguistically, it was only after the Hunnic migrations that the earliest Turkic peoples and confederations appear. Keep up the great work!
Great job, subscribed!
Fun fact. A couple of years ago the Pechenegs turned into a crazy Internet meme in the Russian media when Putin has gone on TV to provide some comfort to his citizens in time of pandemic. He said: “Everything passes and this too will pass. Our country has been through serious tests more than once: when tormented by the Pechenegs and the Cumans, Russia coped with everything." The remark instantly sparked bewilderment and lots of memes.
Не помню такого
@@kindlingking было.
@@shamiltambiev8387 ну раз было, значит так оно и есть
"Russia coped with everything"
Indeed, and so they continue to cope hard to this day XD
How did that resonate with the other Turkic people of Russia?
We still have Qanğli-Arabachy within Turkmens and Qang'li=Qanly within Uzbek, Kazakh, and Karakalpak nations.
Excellent video, thanks i learning alot
Very interesting and enjoyable. Subscribed.
Such a well done video.
In various Byzantine-Seljuk wars in Anatolia during the 11th and 12th centuries, Pecheneg and Uz mercenaries in the Byzantine army changed sides upon hearing the Seljuks speaking Turkish and realizing that they were their relatives.
fantastic video, thank you!
This is FANTASTIC
Byzantine had some mercenaries called türkopol consist of pechenegs, Cumans, bolgars, uzes….
Thanks a lot for briefly explained video👍👏🤟🤘✊️
Great video.
A brilliant video on one of recent history’s most enigmatic and obscure peoples…
Amazing content.
Pecheneg's Kazakhs Khazar's Kazakh's according to Russian historians. I think so as a Kazakh we have so many tribes Naimans, Kereis, Adais so on. Hope you can make video about Kereis and Naimans. So curious about Kazakh tribes.
By the way the ruling Dynastie of Wallachia the Romanian principallity originated from the Kipchaks,
Basarab the first was the Descendants from the Kipchaks.
,,Bas or Basar" comes from the verb to rule
,,Aba" is respectful term for father or the head.
Vlad Dracul was also a member of the House of Basarab. Though Basarab was a Cuman dynasty, not Kipchak.
@@precursors
it is just another name for the same People
@@precursors
Yes Cuman-Kipchak Federation,
today Ukraine Russia Kazakhstan.
The Christian Byzantine called them cuman.
The Russ called them polovsty
The Chinese called them Qangli
The Muslim World called them Kipchak
@@MarlonESolo No, Cumans were western and Kipchaks were eastern part of the Cuman-Kipchak confederation. Cumans did speak a Kipchak Turkic, however.
And now his name lives as a region colloquially called "Bessarabia" (despite being part of Moldavia instead of Wallachia for some reason)
Great video! love finding something new and it not being AI slop! keep up the good work
Oghuz Turks and Pecheneg Turks had a last battle long after their clashes in Central Asia. As it is told in the video, in 11th century Pechenegs were losing territory and becoming mercenaries of other states. Pecheneg mercenaries who were hired by Eastern Rome were sent to the Eastern Anatolia. There they faced the rivals of their grandfathers, the Oghuz Turks. Seljuk Army were mostly Oghuz and some historians say that Pechenegs recognised the similarity between themselves and their Oghuz cousins. And even some of them changed sides...
Great video
Magyars next 🤩?
Pecheneg sounds like a Russian pronunciation of Bajanag, the Turkic word used in Persian too. It means men married to sisters of each other or husbands of two (or more) sisters. Comes from Baji (sister) in Turkic languages. This might explain the tradition when cousins inherited the chiefdom instead of the firstborn sons.
Good job!
Great video. New to your channel and subscribed.
There still some villages in Turkey with the becenek, peçenek names.. ba-ca-nak means husband of sister- in law
top tier content
Finally some good content on the Pechenegs. Do you mind sharing your sources?
Funny how a lot of people say in the comments "Excellent video explanation", yet you have not even mentioned how the magyars were reffering to the Land of Făgăraș as the "Silve Vlachorum et Bissenorum" and how even Romanian probably have more connections with the pechenegs than the hungarians (but which are now not shown because at that time Romanians didn't have a kingdom like hungarians and instead mingled with them and assimilated them into our culture), lastly mentioning we have villages and *even a last-name* in Romanian called "Peceneaga".
I love the turkic culture, man...
I also gotta give it to you, the æsthetic of those steppe shepherd photos is just so good...
Love to the central asian and european Türks from Romania🇷🇴❤️
Edit: Ohhh the Pechenegs from Greek Macedonia!! I know they mingled with the southern vlachs and at the 18th century, part of them migrated to the south of Bessarabia and became the today-gagauz. I've been confirmed this by a gagauz woman herself.
Also, the Aromanians who live in Dobruja and Meglenia (Southern Macedonia and eastern Thessaly) tend to have asian facial features. And that *most* probably relates to the assimilation of the Pechenegs who migrated at South of Danube. Look at Simona Halep for example. Or Gigi Becali.
Cool video. 🇷🇴🤝
You mean look at Neagu or Ostase, to give you some handball examples, of former Pechenegs and those very dark people from Oltenia, featuring a strong build of a turco - iranian mix. They are also very different from the Neolithic farmers, who look like Anatolians today. So faces like Halep or Becali have nothing to do with the Pechenegs.
I absolutely love chit like this even though I’m American and have never left the western hemisphere.
Thank you!
7:04 kara or as you westerners write it qara also means north (which is where Black Sea's name came from)
Debatable
@@easytiger6570 No, not debatable. In Turkic black (Qara) represents north, red (Qizil) represents south, green (yeshil) represents east, white (Aq) represents west, and yellow (sari) represents center (think Golden Horde, Aq Qoyunlu, Qara Koyunlu, Karakhanid etc)
@@precursors Yea but the first mention of black sea is from Magyars who lived North of it
@@easytiger6570 I am a Turk plus it can't be Greeks as they give completely different name with different meaning to Black Sea
@@muratonuryilmaz5385 Magyars are not greek
pechenek/ is derivative for bachanaq/ brother in law/ some Turkic tribes alter b to p, we do that with some words starting with B- , chor/choru is member of ruling class, bey- is head of a tribe/prince, bay- is rich man, QARA - when used for man it would mean naturally strong, for mountains kara-tau/kara dağ solid mountain/awe inspiring mountain, for society qara/kara katman - commoners, for colours it would mean black
Kara means the Northern or Biggest one from the Hunnic tradition.
The patzinak (which to me rhymed with "partisan") feature in the first novel I ever read: a Hungarian translation of Frans G. Bengtsson's "Röde Orm". Now that, was a terrific introduction for a little boy, to literature and history! Highly recommended, *sniff*.
Wow you have made fantastic visuals and animations.. how did you do it? Is there a service that you use? I would like to do it here in California
You know your horde was badass when a machine gun is named after your group
At last ! A real history appears.
Thank you. I really enjoyed this, due to my two semester courses of History of Russia. I wonder if the Pechenegs were the same people as the Polovtsi, who inhabited the area north of the Black Sea, perhaps at a different time.
They weren't. Polovtsy are another turkick tribe that replaced Pechenegs after the fall of the latter. Certainly some pechenegs probably joined them but overall it was different people.
P.S. the word Polovtsy isn't used in English, and the people are called either Cumans or Kipchaks.
Thank you for covering obscure euro-asian ethnic groups. I have some knowledge of them since I lived near their historic areas in hungary etc. but even we often understand amercian history better than our own... pet alone the obsvure people of the past.
Thanks
9:54 perhaps that is silly, but I cannot help but feel at odds with the way English historiographic tradition-and maybe Western European tradition overall-decided to equate the inhabitants of Rus with Russians. I understand why it did happen that way, after all the name of Russia is derivative of Rus, and ultimately this word did describe the whole of the territories of Rus and not what is now just the Russian Federation, but I am afraid that this tradition will continue to propagate the idea that Russia is the true inheritor of the legacy of the Rus (whatever this means) and the other East Slavic countries are just its younger cousins.
You are quite right, my use of 'Russians' here is not correct, and thank you for pointing out. I was using a rather antiquated translation of Constantine's 'De Administrando Imperio', in which the Rus were at times referred to as 'Russians'. This should of course be Rus, as calling them Russians really isn't correct!
@@JustAnotherHistoryChannel I have no problem with you using it, as for what I understand it is a direct quote from a translation that was done at the time when translating the Greek word for Rus as strictly “Russia” was customary. It’s just that I don’t expect a lot of people to be versed in these historiographical intricacies, so I have decided to vent how annoying it can be that this confusion persists.
so who are the true Ruses?
But that's exactly the case? Russian ruling dynasty up until Ivan IV and The Time of Troubles was part of Rurikovichi, who ruled Rus since it's inception. Russian state was built upon the idea of reunification of old Rus lands, some of which by that point were taken over by Poland-Lithuania (Belarus and historical Ukraine), but many still remained under legal rule of great knyaz (who's symbolic residence moved from Kiev first to Vladimir, then to Moscow). What is the reason NO to consider Russia a direct succesor of Rus?
@@JustAnotherHistoryChannelcalling them how they called themselves and how adjacent powers called them is incorrect? Political correctness is the plague of historical analysis.
I had not heard of the defeated remnants of the tribe being settled in Macedonia. I’m very interested as a descendent of Croatians who looked rather Asian.
Your haplogroup could be Q1b, at the island of Hırvatistan relict Turkic Genome lived. Nearly %5 of croat men
The Ottomans also settled many Tatar (Kara Tatar) tribes in the Balkans, beginning from the 14th century to 17th century, the remnants of Ilkhans and Timur's army in Anatolia. The Turkic dialect of Northern Macedonia and Kosova is a blend of Tatar (Kipchak) and southern Oghuz Turkish.
Avars
Finally something about the Besenyők
my ancestor thanks to video..
Did Constantine write that treatise or was it ghost written do you think?
I have a theory about the origin of the name of my town in Serbia Bechkerek (old name). When town was founded in 1326 it was the territory of Hungary. Bech part comes from the Hungarian word for Pechenegs (Besenyők). In 15th-century Hungary, some people adopted the surname Besenyö (Hungarian for "Pecheneg"). Pechenegs of Hungary togheter with Cumans or Kuns were assimilated with Magyars. In the southeast of Serbia, there is a village called Pechenjevce founded by Pechenegs. After war with Byzantium, the remnants of the tribes found refuge in the area, where they established their settlements, Bešenovo, Bešenovački Prnjavor.
More obscure history plz :3
spelled tocharian, verbalized as tokarian
I cringed so many times.
It’s a shame as it’s such a detailed and well made video and hearing that makes me stop. Wondering if it’s a narrator doing the best they can.
The Pechenegs were mostly enemies of the Magyars. But not all of them. At least one Pecheneg tribe joined the Hungarian tribal alliance. The Hungarian name of this Peshen tribe is Berény. This could be the tribe named Boru in the video. This Peshen tribe migrated further west together with the Hungarians and took part in the founding of Hungary in 895. There are currently 18 settlements in Hungary, Slovakia and Romania that contain the name Berény. These were probably founded by Pechenegs between 895-900. The steppes are poor in the east. Therefore, the peoples who kept many large animals, horses and cattle had to migrate from time to time in search of new pastures. Grass grows three times faster in Hungary than in the eastern steppes. It was no longer necessary for people to migrate to keep many big animals.
Every tribe was somebody's enemy, as were the Pechenegs to Magyars and Kumans and Uz in the search for new pastures. The Roman Empire played this belligerent tendencies very well, in destroying some of those tribes, successfully staging cock fights amongst them. No different than today's world, almost nothing has changed.
I have pecheneg origin. Name came from bacanak, means brother in love in Turkish. After settling in balkans most pecheneges join the byzantine army along with kumans. In return Byzantine emperor give them land in anatolia, mostly taurus mountains near the mediterrean sea. Today yörüks lives here mostly have pecheneges and kuman origin. There for they have mostly have green eyes and blonde hair comtemperary to other oghuz Türks in anatolia.
@@sever8351 Yes it’s kipchak actualy. I translated it todays Turkish.
Viking halhall dizisindeki peceneklerin konuşmasinin yarisini anladim ben türküm.
Two Pecheneg archeogenetic samples found from the Romania one him belongs Y haplogroup N-M178 and second one Y haplogroup G2a1
N-M178 is mostly Finnic, while G2a1 was main Hg of indigenous Gumelnitsa and Cucuteni cultures. West Pechenegs were mostly Vlachs.
Pretty good
We have many villages established by Pechenegs in the South.
how closely related are the pechnegs and the seljuks who spoke that same orguz language.
Yes, they are both of Oghuz origin. We modern day Turks of Anatolia descended from Oghuz tribes and lots of settlements across Anatolia today bear the names of various Oghuz tribes like: Bayındır, Bozok, Kayı, Yapar, Döğerlü...etc.
I first heard of them in an Anton Checkhov short story: "The Pecheneg", which did portray them in a very postive light, or rather as a term for an uneducated barbarian.
This is very interesting, I suppose it would tally with Chekhov writing during a period of Russian Imperialism. Is the book worth a read?
@@JustAnotherHistoryChannel It is just a short story about a young man visiting a village in the Steppes. The Pechenegs also come up in the historical drama series "The Vikings: Valhalla" when the protagonist is travelling down the Dnipro to Constantinople.
Gj bro
Definitely our people. We just need a wider population genetic sequencing at least for autosomal comparing with existing archeogenetic samples and future discovering ones.
By the time they reached east Europe mostly assimilated former Indo European people.
They are good to play in ck2
Nice!
The namesake of the overpowered PKP Pecheneg machine gun in Battlefield.
Hey I’ve been watching your channel for awhile now, I was wondering if you’d like to do some sort of collaboration. Perhaps in the form of a shoutout in each others video or even a community post
Cool.
Idk why i find central Asian nomads and their empires (other than the mongol empire, kings and generals covers them waaaaay too much) so interesting but I do. Also I didn’t know about the pechenegs till I started playing voltaires nightmare (an eu4 mod) and by that point I hadn’t played an fps in a long time so I totally forgot the pkp’s full name was pecheneg (and while I know more about guns than they average person, I’m not really a gun guy) so I never made that connection. Also, I always wonder if horses never went extinct in the americas, would there have been Native American steppe empires in the Great Plains?
@@doorller358 I don’t speak Russian
Constantine sounds like a dessert. "Bangers and mash for tea with hot Constantine for afters."
As things goes with nomadic people coming from the Eurasian steppe, we could have a country nowadays named Pechenegia somewhere between the Balkans and the Crimean Peninsula and nobody would bat an eye. Like the Bulgars made it after all but they were also hardly pressed and nearly whipped out. But alas the poor Pechenegs just banished from history... I find this notion interesting to say the least
Edit to say Im a new sub, hope your channel grows as it deserves. This was a really nice presentation