The Dangerous Future for HVAC Techs
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 6 ก.พ. 2025
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It’s all for money. The idea it helps the atmosphere is just to make it look good but at the end of the day it’s for money
Exactly Planed obsolescence
R22 best freon period.
R32 is best Freon ever
You are right on point. Leaking is the issue and yet they are producing micro channel coils and or low quality brazing.
Just look at the huge push by the refrigerant producers such as Honeywell, Chemours and others..spending millions lobbying for newer expensive refrigerants and you see a major reason for the mandates. Like generic drugs there is little money to be made with older refrigerants even if they are not banned
Good talk. It is good to ask who will use these new refrigerants in the field and who will be held responsible. The government is more concerned with talking to large companies and planning how they will look good internationally.
Im right there with ya. The government should stay out of our trades.
I’m 70 I remember when one of the major requirements of a refrigerant was that it was NonfFammable.
I was pushing efficient equipment long before others
I believe that a portion of the new requirements is profit driven. The overall “global warming” from R-410a would be negligible because of the relative small amounts in use.
They should use service valves with a longer copper tail not a coupling on the condenser, so that you can use a pro press instead of soldering. Or even a flare connection. I don't like brazing next to a closed service valve full of propane.
Why not use air to water heat pump outdoor unit and use cold water as the heat transfer medium? That way all the refrigerant is outside the building and its no problem using low cost flammable refrigerant like propane? Can also be reversed to run in heat mode easily?
R-410-A was known to have a higher GWP than R-22 from the very beginning.
Funny it only became an issue until after the patent ran out.
As always, it's always about the money.
The reasoning behind the change to R-410A was to eliminate ODP. The first refrigerants to be eliminated were CFCs. They did not break down in the atmosphere for very long periods. R-22 is an HCFC. It was left in place longer as it did not last as long in the atmosphere as the CFCs. It was all about ODP.
R-410A has no Chlorine, so no ODP.
When R-410A came in, I was worried about leaks due to the high pressure. However, the increased leak problems really did not appear. Not thrilled about R-410A due to moisture problems and fractionation, but it was always a changeover refrigerant.
My father was in refrigeration from the 1930s. What I learned from his and my experience is everything gets more complicated. If you don't want to change, get out of the business.
Not trying to tear you down, just putting in my 2 cents.
GFM
I got out of the business.
Why did the leak problems never happen?
Planned obsolescence probably helps the leak problem. Can have as many leaks if you change the unit every 10 years
@@Zacksshoptalk There were some mandates from the feds that helped (and some that did not). I am not familiar with the exact engineering, but the increase did not happen.
As for the planned obsolescence issue, one of my major gripes about manufacturers is their tendency to replace equipment long before necessary.
The 10 year issue is wildly too often. I have see many situations where the reason the equipment was replaced was the inability of the tech to understand how the equipment works.
In a personal case, there is a furnace in my basement just turned 30 with one repair and I am considering replacing it.
GFM
@@Zacksshoptalk mixing copper and aluminum. For the most part, I see a lot of 410 ADP coils between 2 and 8 years old that are low on charge and have oil in the evap pan. Installers and techs not brazing with nitrogen and not pulling a proper vacuum causes A LOT of system 410A failures
Problem is with the statement of HCFC destroy ozone molecules. Ozone molecules have a natural process of being created, destroyed and recreated over 100,000 times a day. And the small amount of refrigerant leaked into the atmosphere does little damage.
Just starting to learn and apply the meager skills I am developing. Thanks for being there as one of the resources I can turn to and learn.
My believes are in the future they’ll add a software key that locks out all techs that are not on the manufacture’s payroll. In other words you have to be employed with that manufacture or you can’t diagnose the system.
They do that now on larger systems. Hell some heat pumps are locked out.
@@Summitperry wow! It’s already started. I only work on my own HVAC therefore I don’t know what all is out there.
I like the idea of Jackson’s system & sitting in the beach
Zach: The Tradesmen's Alex Jones. I mean who doesn't love random disingenuous anti-government spiel with their morning coffee.
I recently had to go to an A2L training put on by our local supplier, he said that the problem with the hole in the ozone layer and R22 was not caused by the HVAC industry, but the fact that large roofing companies would spray hundreds of pounds of R22 when they were doing hot tar roofing. They would use it to cool down the tar after they applied it.
That is patently ridiculous. Maybe water?
GFM
Never heard that one, but CFCs, HCFCs, and HFCs definitely have/had a lot of uses outside of HVACR. They have been used as solvents, fire suppressants, aerosol propellants, freeze sprays, blowing agents for expanding foams, etc for many decades.
That person is spreading completely BS misinformation.
There is no way a company would waste that much money when there are cheaper options to do the same thing. But I've never heard of companies even trying to cool freshly tarred roofs.
Governments all over the world accounted for every major use of HCFCs and there is no reports I've seen with roofing as a contributor beyond spraying foam roof insulation.
R-22 was a great refrigerant until we discovered what it did to the ozone. Now we have equally good options with different tradeoffs.
HVAC dinosaurs who refuse to move on from this R-22 was better government conspiracy trope and spread lies either accidentally or purposefully need to move on.
Nope, it was Final Net hair spray which did the ozone lay in.
@@johnd4348 R12 was used as a propellant for lots of aerosol products, not just hair spray. Environmental issues aside, it was actually a great propellant because it was cheap, non toxic, non flammable, very chemically stable, and has a relatively stable vapor pressure compared to many other chemicals.
Thanks for saying what those of us that stay up with the DOE/ EPA regs see what really is occurring. Unintended consequences always seems to occur with gov't mandates.
its not the government. its the corporations that lobby for self profiting reasons. same reasoning in almost all industries. dont get lost in the blue or red koolaid. its all about who makes and pays the most money
Equipment that can be sold around the world enables them to cut costs. Many consumer products sell more in China than here. Ten years ago somebody who travels to China for Hewlett-Packard told me they sell more Buicks in China than here. That’s why they don’t make a nice car. people in China like the crossover design which is what we used to call a station wagon. In Europe their energy is so much more expensive and they are taxed based on the horsepower of the vehicle. I am sure it’s the same for HVAC equipment. Maybe with the upcoming changes in Washington we can go back to refrigerators with heating elements to keep condensation from forming instead of just insulating them adequately. And I have missed the butter warmer inside the refrigerator. The washing machines that used 50 gallons and dishwashers that used 12 gallons were great too. My last 300 watt light bulb died a few weeks ago. All the 1950s ranch houses were comfortable with one large AC unit in the wall. I never remember it being hot. Back then the high temp was about 88° and 93° was considered unbearable. I was in my 30s before I ever saw the temp over 100. The sign at the bank only had two digits so it read 10°. It is now 98 or 100 every day, although the “official temp” which I guess they record at the airport is lower. I only hope we still have the luxury of feeling we must have our comfort and maintaining our humidity at 40% when the dew point is 78° and the temp is 100° not counting the intense sun that makes the car feel like an oven. One thing that is never mentioned and it’s a fact is that the humidity is higher throughout the south, and consequently the low temps over the summer are much warmer than even a decade ago.
Interesting things happening with the trade.. but also we have some way cool tools that we didn’t haven when I got started!!
The way i see it is that helps the industry overall. Companies can now sell at same margins and make more cash.
I'm currently side job bobby 😢trying to get my own thing started
Just don’t be lowball Bobby.
@@USA-GreedyMenOfNoIntegrity😂😂😂 and if ain’t licensed shouldn’t be doing side jobs
I’m thinking there should be an ignition source available if there is a leak.. when she leaks it will auto ignite and cauterize the leak.
In all honesty I was use to mint chocolate chip, then I switched to strawberry and apparently I will be enjoying rocky road next
That is the purpose of bureaucracy. People who know nothing about something telling those who do on how to do it.
Great thoughts … reality is big corporations steer if not control government decisions.
I work on r290 all the time this a2l bullshit is just another pressure in my gauges. Resi guys will treat it like r22 when the phased it out and use 410 phase down as a selling point like 410a is illegal now, like they say for 22 now.
I agree. Good take. ✌️
It’s a money hack I believe. I’ve been around for quite a few phase outs and my father as well. Who knows we will never know for sure.
I wish to be excluded from the giveaway. I'm just an average homeowner with my two cents. A few years ago I saw a video where a refrigerator exploded in someone's home. My guess is it had a combustible refrigerant. What if, say, a pin blows out on a unit's compressor that has combustible refrigerant? Could that mean I need to call 911 instead of a repairman?
The refrigerator was probably using propane as a refrigerant. R32 and r454b aren't anywhere near that flammable. Precautions need to be taken for us service techs but the industry is setting it up where the home owners will be safe. I'm seeing where systems will have built in leak detection and such.
I’ve gotten blocked from several different things from saying what I thought about the new refrigerant changes. They’ve blocked my comments, deleted my comments, etc. on mini especially Esco on TH-cam and TikTok.
I honestly think if they really care about the planet they’ll build a good quality equipment like before period and they won’t switch to this shity alum or micro channel coil
Great point! We also put gasoline in our cars.. that is so much more flammable. And a lot of old campers with ac had r600
Don't be afraid of this sh%#. Just laugh all the way to the bank. The customer will be the one paying for this.
R32 is hard to ignite and has been used in Europe and Asian countries for decades.
Rest of the world went straight to R32 decades ago, we went the 410A route instead.
Though I get the concern of more explosive kind of refrigerants.
Yup, hydrocarbons have been used globally for a very long time too. In many cases, HC's are even sold and used as a drop in replacement for R12, R22, R134a, etc. Of course unlicensed customers are the ones most often buying those products. But if equipment was catching fire and exploding left and right, I'd think we would know by now and it probably would have been banned in more countries by now.
I love the smell of R22 in the morning. Smells like money.
Don’t worry we’re the government we are here to help . Hahaha
Appearances and money is all it’s about.
I think government should stay out of our trade. They need to consult the technician in the field before changing refrigerate.
Your right, field techs are waaay more educated compared to engineers……
Am I mistaken but wasn't it the US Air Force using R-12 as a cleaner on engines that caused a lot of the issues
Why are the new regulations enforced by geographical location and not for everyone why enforced in the areas of a more hotter region where air conditioners are sold more and not a all in for everyone if it is that important it seems kind of biased to me
Government: making new libertarians each day.
Who is John Gault?
They’re not gonna be lower they say they’re the same pressure. Similar pressures they said?😳🧐🧐🧐🧐
Their going to put flammable refrigerants in equipment. No problem. I have natural gas lines running to all the appliances in my house. I drive a vehicle with high pressure explosive cylinders on it. I drive a vehicle with a huge tank of gasoline strapped to the underside. . Explosive refrigerants. Might just make the job a little more exciting. Cant wait to hear the stores from other techs how they lost most of their eye brows and beards.
I really hope Diakin steps up with theses fit systems and what they trying to do installed a few. Idk what’s going to happen I’m gonna adapt and overcome. Buy new stuff whatever it takes. It’s the revolution of how the universe is adjusting to newer technologies I believe.
There's a bunch of videos of refrigerators exploding.
Unfortunately, there's more truth to what you're saying, that what we're being told.
Follow the money trail. Right?
It's a money grabber this new refr8gerant sadly they were gonna stop brazing period and make every technician but 2grand propress tool I won't do it I don't have the money to get it then they said just make sure your flowing nitrogen when you are brazing idk anymore 😐
Environments one thing yes for sure us now & the next generation our kids what about we the people the end Coustomer that pays for all this is My main grip no one but us techs installer give 2 c about the Coustomer but Us surely not the government and all these regulations save the planet but taxes or break the payor
Whose the winner gonna be? I hope it's me
No it's me Susan
We're disposable.
Its all about money. No doubt.
Zack, I like you I hope I can still call you a friend but you’re wrong. The chemical company’s can make the same amount of money with old refrigerants. It’s a hassle to everyone changing refrigerants. Your video just encourages people not to use good recovery practices. I think you should ask a chemical engineer to come in, I don’t think you’re an expert in the speed of a leak. No higher pressure than what we’re using now, and there the flame is almost identical we use now. Please stay out of politics. ❤️
You are a friend and I will not run for any office guaranteed
Looks like you have drank the cool aid the government and big industry have given you very foolish of you
NOT IN THE TRADE BUT JUST AS A HOMEOWNER THAT HAS HAD MULTIPLE LEAKING EVAPORATOR COILS INSIDE MY HOME I AM NOT HAPPY ABOUT HVAC PERIOD. I HAVE SINCE MOVED TO WINDOW UNITS AND A GAS FURNACE. AT LEAST THESE ARE RELIABLE AND LESS LIKELY TO EXPLODE I FEEL. THANKS FOR YOUR VIDEO ZACK.
Watching out for the small guy!! 😲😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣😆😆Riiiiiigggghhhtt! Lol
TRUMP 2024
We have been using flammable and natural refrigerants for some time. If we do our jobs correctly, no problem. Just like all trades, take pride in your work, and you'll have no issues.
I feel like you should have critically thought about your argument regarding the government not concerned about the technicians safety. If only there was a branch of the government that regulated occupational safeties and hazards, and it was like an administration or something?
Techs were crying about systems were going to blow up in their face because of the insane operating pressures of 410. Perhaps you should have mentioned the fact that the vast majority of companies will convert to some form of RLS because insurance is going to skyrocket for having torches on the van. The insurance companies are the most freaked out about it. A2L’s are new to the US. Euro-Asia has used them with great success and lack of units exploding for more than 20 years………
Rotten Mango The Sewol Ferry Tragedy - Coward Captain Left 350 Students To Die In A Sinking Ship
incompetence, korean goverment not wanting help from other surrounding countries, US Marines experienced in these situation and fully equipped, it's a very good 2 hour story, i love to listen as background vs music sometime *that's how i listened to this story* DIYer here, fixed my brothers AC Unit by always learning and listening to videos
*edit* US Navy not Marines
*cerveza for you* 🍺