Hey Drach, nice simple question, have there ever been any battles between hugely mismatched opponents, for example age of sail vs pre Dreadnoughts. Many thanks and stay safe during the WuFlu
Hi Drachinifel! My Grandfather is a U.S Navy veteran who served aboard the USS Galveston (CLG 3) during the Cuban Missile Crisis. He is turning 80 this year and I want to do something special for his birthday. I know he watches your videos so could you, during a drydock episode, give a quick run through of the USS Galveston including its: specifications, history, and how it was converted into a guided missile cruiser. (My Grandfather’s name is Al by the way.)
What I also love, is that the Thunderchild's success against technologically superior opponents would almost certainly mean that her design would continue on in naval circles for at least another design cycle. So there would absolutely be Superthunderchilds in World War I.
@@mirandalockey7334 the problem is that modern adaptations cheat by having the aliens have some sort of invisible shield that can just tank anything cuz alien tech
@@shp27493 not in the same way it happened but humans are kinda drawn to war. Ww1 probably wouldn't happen but thered most certainly still be wars, and alien technology appearing as a potential resource would just incentives more fighting because everyone would want a piece of it, or Britain would continue to research it to us against everyone else. Massacre of mankind actually has an interesting look at how the world might look after the invasion if you're ever interested
Martian Commander: one of these primitive things destroyed three of my War Machines...and allowed a fleet of survivors to escape....what can go wrong next... Martian Subordinate:
"I say, our last invastion came a cropper in the _most_ disgusting manner. What chance might we have for a future endevour?" "Well, Your Supreme Squidliness, the humans of their 20th century appear to be undergoing a revolution in antibiotics. We estimate they will have effectively exterminated disease organisms sufficiently for Round Two by, say, 2020?"
The _Thunderchild_ is a message to all proponents of energy weapons everywhere. The lesson is simple: your lasers will never trump our high-velocity rocks.
Don't get me wrong, beams are great in the right sort of a battle, but beams have one huge weakness that rocks don't. Every particle a beam passes through weakens it a tiny bit because a tiny piece of energy the size of 1 particle is absorbed by each particle a beam passes through. Beams, great for space and high stratosphere combat, not so much for planet-surface combat.
Ways to beat beams: Thick Smoke. Heavy Mist. Dust Clouds. Smoke launchers are already a defensive tech we possess, and would be extremely effective against laser weapons.
Pretty much the final battle of Space Battleship Yamato 2199. The Yamato and Dessler's vastly superior flagship find themselves face-to-face in an environment where the performance of energy weapons are severely degraded. So the Yamato crew break out the WW2 surplus 46-cm shells and lets her rip.
This is amazing! You've manged to develop the entire history and even the budgetary problems from just a few lines from a novel, and al the parts fit! H. G. Wells would be so proud!
@Joel Smith Year of the Angry Rabbit, by Russell Braddon. Rabbits the size of Alsatians (a breed of dog with which I am not familiar, but maybe German Shepherd sized?) and all being infected with a super-myxomatosis that, alas, does not kill the rabbits, just makes them means and vicious.
*Tripod:* _"Surrender, Terran vessel! We have you outnumbered three to one!"_ *HMS Thunderchild:* _"Then it is a fair fight. Prepare for ramming speed!"_
I might sound like a heretic here but when I think of someone shouting "PREPARE FOR RAMMING SPEED", I immediately think of when Worf shouts it in First Contact
What is not widely known is that many of the Tripods were later Re-Purposed and mounted on British Dreadnought battleships. Unfortunate, they never figured out how to get the Heat Rays working again, despite admiral Fisher's best efforts.
As an ex navy man who served on real steam powered ships the position of the shafting places the engine room more forward than the position of the funnel traditionally allows, unless the boiler room was aft of the engine room feeding steam forwards! This design would further protect the bridge from a boiler room explosion additionally if she was using turbines and superheated steam she would be able to use the decay heat after the boiler explosion to maintain way. An excellent video.
@@hmshood319the Akiras having _fifteen_ torpedo launchers and lack of secondary hull seems like it was designed with the HMS Thunderchild’s description in mind.
@@hmshood319 Built at Mars specifically to act as part of an anti-invasion defense force, at that. Someone at Utopia Planitia knew what they were doing.
I refuse to believe that this ship wasn’t blasting Rule Brittania as it went out on its blaze of glory using microphones powered by its sheer manliness.
Thunderchild was based on the Turbinia -- a famous enough Parsons steam turbine demonstrator. Wells clearly knew of it. In his work, he's describing an incredibly fast warship that could whip around to face the Martian tripods, fast enough to even ram one. Wells also threw in a super-performance large calibre turreted gun. In substance, Wells was foretelling of Dreadnought. (1906) Any secondary battery guns were no part of Well's story.
It was in the Pendragon's film version... But the film itself looks like amateur project with CGI made in Garry's Mod 9. Also, Jeff Wayne's rock-opera.
There's a lego fan adaptation which is set in the sort-of future and turns the Thunderchild into a battleship armed with MACS a shame it only took out 1 tripod, it had shields on tho so yeah
It was in Jeff Wayne's musical version, which I beleive to the the best and most accurate adaption of H.G. Wells story. th-cam.com/video/4RRe40O6QKU/w-d-xo.html
Probably a combination of HMS Thunderchild having no clear RL counterpart to base a design off of for a live action adaptation to use, and the fact that she only gains a Pyrrhic victory win over the Martian tripods at best...there are other scenes from the book that show how badly we're outclassed technology-wise, so it's a top choice to cut. Personally, I agree with you...having an adaptation with the Thunderchild vs. 3 Martian Tripods duel left in would be epic. Especially if the right amount of effort was made to make the audience care about the ship and crew ahead of time, so its sacrifice gained extra heft from the viewer rooting for them to win.
@@generalilbisI mean, it’s already got the advantage of being the first effective resistance demonstrated by Earth forces against the Martians. The sheer hope from the ships that maybe, just maybe they might be able to win, squashed by her loss.
@@stevef01 No. This wasn't the April Fools video. That would be the Emperor Class- guide 40,000 which is here- th-cam.com/video/iC1o_9sGqkA/w-d-xo.html This was taken with much seriousness.
According to H. G. Wells HMS Thunderchild was a “Torpedo Ram”: basically a very fast gunboat with a ram built into it’s bow and one or two torpedo tubes built into it’s hull but facing forward.
More like tier 2 I think even an Nassau would tear a thunderchild apart. A Arkansas or Wyoming would stomp it into the dirt. Or sea this case. Or gaming needs to do some more class two and some class 1 ships that are older maybe some predreadnoughts and armored cruisers.
Then after WG finish releasing the submarines they will start developing the Martians ... and you thought aircraft carriers and submarines were bad ...
@UCwbx-vhNVv0erbQGSHKN8ug because the thunderchild fictional ship if it was real wouldn't stand a chance against a full-fledged dreadnought even if it is Nassau. You act like they didn't build real coastal battleships like they didn't exist at all. The whole point of this video was fleshing out a fictional ship and saying what it would be like if it was real. A coastal defense ram stands no chance in a tier 3 world of warships match.
@@4C0-q7h is it Mikasa the only pre dreadnought on world of warships? It's still faster and out guns the coastal defense ram that is the fictional thunderchild. I don't know if they can make a tear low enough for it
My favorite part of the book. Thunderchild did her duty for King, and country, and brought great honour to the Royal Navy. Thanks so much for putting this together, and mad respect to the Baron for his amazing artwork. This old Yank redleg will give you a salute from my 8" howitzer just before we go into battle with the Martian Walkers here in the States.
For King, yes. The book mentions an opposition within 40 million miles, placing the Martian launch in 1907. Definitely Edwardian! Wells was writing a near-future sf story, ten years before the imaginary events described.
My thoughts on this: Bear in mind that the the War of the Worlds was published in 1896. Two years earlier, in 1894, saw the launch of Turbinia, the first ever turbine powered ship with the (at the time) unprecedented top speed of 35kts. Now, OK, Turbinia was a small experimental ship not a warship but my guess is that Welles viewed it as a tech demonstrator and extrapolated about what a very fast ship might do, and applied it to the WOTW.
Its honestly suprising that in over 100 years the Royal Navy has never commissioned a ship named Thunderchild. Super odd seeing Baron Engel pop up here, but having seen his work on Roam he's cerainly qualified. Maybe sell a print of Thunderchild? Edit apparently Drac is way ahead of me
It’s probably because Thunderchild is a horrendous name for a warship. Why in heavens name would anyone want to name a Warship anything containing the word child? Doesn’t sound very grand to me.
@@otakunthevegan4206 If her two sisters were completed they coulld have eliminated 9 or 10 martians based on Thunderchild's performance. The Martians would be like: " Thunderchilds, run away, run away!"
@@ONECOUNT - Other ships would be very unlikely to have the same success, because the Martians in the story adapted quickly to new challenges from human military units, and did not tend to fall victim to any type of ambush again. The reason the Thunderchild did so well was that the Martians had no idea what it was or whether it was even a threat until it was on top of them. Other ships would not have had such an advantage after that....as the Martians would have used their heat ray on them at long range. Unlike a gun, the heat ray fires in a straight line of sight over any distance, like a laser, so it cannot miss once sighted on the target....and to do that only takes a couple of seconds....but ships have to fire ranging shots and they very seldom score hits at longer ranges with their first volley.
@@georgecoventry8441 I was thinking of the Thunderchild and her half sisters as a unit of three ships that fatefull day. I doubt that the Martians would have adapted as they had not with the Thunderchild alone. Had three ships and not just one been there to defend the evacuation fleet perhaps the Martians would have been unable to concentrate their fire on just one ship and all three Vessels might have survived. The next encounter might be different as you say, with the Martians adapting.
@@ONECOUNT - Yes, that would have helped, having more naval vessels on hand to bring fire on the Martians, but the only thing that really worked on them (on a handful of occasions) was to surprise them with a brand new situation that they had no knowledge of. The army's artillery units managed to do that on one occasion, destroyed one tripod and disabled another before the Martians wiped them out. After that the Martians took no chances and saturated any area that provided cover for camouflaged artillery with the poisonous "black smoke". This was 100% effective, and the land-based artillery units never again brought down a Martian machine, but the Thunderchild was a brand new factor, one that the Martians did not recognize or understand until it was too late...just a few seconds too late as it turned out, and that was all it took. The drama of those few moments is unforgettable.
There were ships of shapes and sizes, scattered out along the bay, And I thought I heard her calling, as the steamer pulled away, The invaders must have seen them, as across the coast the filed, Standing firm between them, There Lay Thunder Child. Moving swiftly through the waters, Cannons Blazing as she came, Brought a mighty metal Warlord, Crashing down in sheets of flame, Sensing victory was nearing, thinking fortune must have smiled, People started cheering, Come On Thunder Child, Come On Thunder Child. Lashing ropes and smashing Timbers, Flashing Heat-Rays pierced the deck, Dashing Hopes for our deliverance, as we watched the sinking wreck, With the smoke of battle clearing, over graves and waves they filed, Slowly disappearing, Farewell Thunder Child, Slowly disappearing, Farewell Thunder Child...
"When the smoke cleared, the little steamer had reached the misty horizon, and Carrie was safe. But the Thunder Child had vanished forever, taking with her man's last hope of victory. The leaden sky was lit by green flashes, cylinder following cylinder, and no one and nothing was left now to fight them. The Earth belonged to the Martians."
If Forever Autumn didn't move you to tears already, Thunderchild from this musical would have you blubbering like a toddler. I still tear up years later just reading that. It's the perfect depiction of defensive Western warfare - the precursor of separation and chaos at home with Forever Autumn, followed by this anthem to men who fight bravely and die by the hundreds to defend and secure men and women they've probably never met amongst their countrymen. It reminds me of the stories my parents told of World War II. They say fiction is often more true than history because history tells one story, but fiction tells all stories. One can see Royal Navy sailors for generations inspiring the story to be written longhand in the first place. One can also see sailors in not only the UK but the US and other navies no doubt thinking of Thunderchild during their most harrowing engagements. Jeff Wayne certainly did the subject justice.
Between them, lay the silent, grey ironclad, Thunder Child. Slowly, it moved towards shore. Then with a deafening roar and whoosh of spray, it swung about and drove at full speed towards the waiting Martians.
It would be two fingers as that has historical significance going back to the battle with the French at Ashincore (sorry for the miss spelling), were the French announced before the battle that they would cut the two fingers used to draw a bowstring off every English Bowman, as the French came second the two fingers were held up to any French prisoners as a mocking gesture, "we won you lost and we still have them ya ya ya" or that sort of thing.
I feel the need to point out that a vessel's wake has as much, if not more, to do with its hull design than total displacement. Most harbor tugs are a few hundred tons at most, but when they're moving around without a load, they kick out a truly *astounding* wake for their size, easily more than many of the vessels they service. This is, of course, because they aren't designed to move through the water efficiently, so their designers didn't worry about what their wake would be like. Similarly, the notional designers of the Thunder child may have decided that some efficiency tradeoffs were worth making if it meant improving some of the ship's other characteristics, like survivability, efficacy as a ram, ability to extract the ram from a target and use it again, etc.
After seeing this video, I was a little inspired. I booted up my copy of Springsharp and worked out the statistics for your interpretation of Thunder Child. There were three differences I had to do in order to make her fit: 1) Increase her waterline length from the 100 meters of the Victoria-class to 125 meters (and a 10-meter ram gives her an overall length of 135 meters), 2) Increase her displacement to 9000 tons, and 3) Set her top speed at 22 knots. The results are as follows: HMS Thunder Child, British Empire Ironclad Ram Battleship laid down 1895 Displacement: 7,727 t light; 8,041 t standard; 9,000 t normal; 9,767 t full load Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep) (442.91 ft / 410.11 ft) x 65.62 ft x (28.87 / 30.43 ft) (135.00 m / 125.00 m) x 20.00 m x (8.80 / 9.27 m) Armament: 2 - 12.01" / 305 mm 25.3 cal guns - 714.01lbs / 323.87kg shells, 100 per gun Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mount, 1895 Model 1 x Single mount on centreline, forward deck centre 1 - 9.21" / 234 mm 31.5 cal gun - 380.08lbs / 172.40kg shells, 100 per gun Breech loading gun in deck mount, 1895 Model 1 x Single mount on centreline, aft deck aft 6 - 5.98" / 152 mm 26.0 cal guns - 100.00lbs / 45.36kg shells, 100 per gun Quick firing guns in casemate mounts, 1895 Model 6 x Single mounts on sides, forward evenly spread Weight of broadside 2,408 lbs / 1,092 kg Main Torpedoes 5 - 14.2" / 360 mm, 15.09 ft / 4.60 m torpedoes - 0.295 t each, 1.474 t total submerged bow tubes Armour: - Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg) Main: 12.0" / 305 mm 348.59 ft / 106.25 m 9.71 ft / 2.96 m Ends: 7.99" / 203 mm 61.48 ft / 18.74 m 9.71 ft / 2.96 m Upper: 5.98" / 152 mm 348.59 ft / 106.25 m 8.01 ft / 2.44 m Main Belt covers 131 % of normal length - Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max) Main: 12.0" / 305 mm - 12.0" / 305 mm 2nd: 0.98" / 25 mm - - 3rd: 0.98" / 25 mm - - - Conning towers: Forward 12.01" / 305 mm, Aft 0.00" / 0 mm Machinery: Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines, Hydraulic drive, 2 shafts, 19,302 ihp / 14,399 Kw = 22.00 kts Range 6,000nm at 10.00 kts Bunker at max displacement = 1,727 tons (100% coal) Complement: 461 - 600 Cost: £0.839 million / $3.355 million Distribution of weights at normal displacement: Armament: 290 tons, 3.2 % - Guns: 287 tons, 3.2 % - Weapons: 3 tons, 0.0 % Armour: 2,850 tons, 31.7 % - Belts: 2,501 tons, 27.8 % - Armament: 238 tons, 2.6 % - Conning Tower: 112 tons, 1.2 % Machinery: 3,271 tons, 36.3 % Hull, fittings & equipment: 1,315 tons, 14.6 % Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1,273 tons, 14.1 % Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0.0 % Overall survivability and seakeeping ability: Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship): 2,526 lbs / 1,146 Kg = 2.9 x 12.0 " / 305 mm shells or 4.1 torpedoes Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.42 Metacentric height 4.9 ft / 1.5 m Roll period: 12.5 seconds Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 52 % - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.16 Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.04 Hull form characteristics: Hull has a flush deck, a ram bow and large transom stern Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.405 / 0.417 Length to Beam Ratio: 6.25 : 1 'Natural speed' for length: 24.46 kts Power going to wave formation at top speed: 49 % Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50 Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length): Fore end, Aft end - Forecastle: 10.00 %, 9.84 ft / 3.00 m, 9.84 ft / 3.00 m - Forward deck: 40.00 %, 9.84 ft / 3.00 m, 9.84 ft / 3.00 m - Aft deck: 45.00 %, 9.84 ft / 3.00 m, 9.84 ft / 3.00 m - Quarter deck: 5.00 %, 9.84 ft / 3.00 m, 9.84 ft / 3.00 m - Average freeboard: 9.84 ft / 3.00 m Ship tends to be wet forward Ship space, strength and comments: Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 130.5 % - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 70.1 % Waterplane Area: 17,247 Square feet or 1,602 Square metres Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 86 % Structure weight / hull surface area: 58 lbs/sq ft or 285 Kg/sq metre Hull strength (Relative): - Cross-sectional: 0.48 - Longitudinal: 1.04 - Overall: 0.52 Caution: Hull subject to strain in open-sea Cramped machinery, storage, compartmentation space Cramped accommodation and workspace room She... isn't all that good, actually.
Keep in mind, for her likely missions(short range fleet engagement against France, or a Crimean War-esque coastal war) her weakness aren't crippling. Plus the Ram, Armor and compact size would make her a fantastic small craft and coastal attack flagship. Yes, from a modern perspective (and since her design would have been approved before Yalu River), she has some serious limitations, but she would STILL be more flexible then the Monitors used in WW1. And if her class had led the charge at Galipoli, with her long reinforced bow eating the Turkish mines instead of the more vital Battleships... She might just make history yet again.
She looks a bit like someone lopped of the front two turrets of the Nelson class, but damn does so look good she also looks like she'd fit into a bit of a steampunk universe i love it :)
Nobody is really in the mood for April Fool's jokes. It's bloody grim out there. We're going though a slow motion version of what the Martians experienced.
I was going to make a joke here about the Martian cry of "Alloo!" being translated to "Do you see torpedo rams?", but then the video was too nifty for it. I love your analysis, and that design - it's truly fantastic. This is now my canonical _Thunderchild._ Side note: Is there by any chance a deck plan? I'd like to see if I could make a 3d model of the ship.
"Moving swiftly through the waters Cannons blazing as she came Brought a mighty metal warlord Crashing down in sheets of flame Sensing victory was nearing Thinking fortune must have smiled People started cheering Come on Thunder Child!" - Jeff Wayne's War of the Worlds
Drach I know you probably won’t see this. But there’s an additional book based entirely around HMS Thunderchild, called The Last Days of Thunderchild. It gives an excellent and extremely detailed account of the ship and her design.
The beauty of H.G. Wells was his ability to see what wasn't in existence but could, and in many cases eventually would be, and placing it into his contemporary setting. He was an amazing writer.
Wells was also very humble in his predictions. He never stated them with absolute certainty. He wrote The World Set Free in 1914 where he predicted a world war and nuclear energy by the 1930s. In an addendum after WWI he wrote in later versions, he claimed that though he was right about the world war, he doubted that nuclear energy would be feasible within the 20th century, not knowing that he'd be proven wrong on that count almost within his own lifetime
I had always imagined an enlarged and armed version of Turbinia, that would give the low profile, the speed described and a brand new ship around the time HG Wells was writing, the way Thunderchild sets off from the pack is just like Turbinia at The Spithead Naval review 1897.
couldn't agree more!! I always thought (in my own mind) that Thunderchild was supposed to be turbine powered. H G Wells was writing it at the same time Parsons was testing Turbinia and Wells was very aware of new technology and would likely have known about Turbinia's trials. How about Thunderchild also being a test vessel for turbines as well? Would Certainly make sense to equip a relatively cheap ship that relied on high speed with a new technology that is all about speed.
This is exactly the kind of shenanigans that the designers of HMS Nelson and FS Dunkerque would have got up to if they had been designing ships in the late 1800's, and the kind of shenanigans I like.
*HMS Thunder child:* "You see, there's three of you and only one of me, so this clearly isn't a fair fight For you" *Tripod*: ULA **while sweating profusely**
Goodness, your collaborative effort rendering of HMS Thunderchild is quite breath taking. Baron Engel has done himself and the ship proud. I can envisage her churning through the water on the attack to ramming speed with guns blazing. Bravo go sirs, bravo... ^_^
The Martians: "We have a heat ray capable of heating a target area to 5,000 degrees, melting steel and turning flesh to fire. Fear my physics!" HMS _Thunder child:_ "I am well in excess of 10,000 tonnes moving at 24 knots. Fear MY physics!"
Splendid stuff, sir. And I have ever found the tale of the Thunderchild to be in the traditions of the Royal Navy. It never fails to give rise to a proud tear whenever I listen to the wonderful namesake song.
It's because the mast is IN FRONT OF THE FUNNEL!!!! 😳😨😱 WITCHCRAFT!!!! 🤯😵 Whereas "proper" Royal Navy placement is behind the funnel, ensuring that the mast is cleverly hidden (and roasted) by the ship's smoke most of the time. 😋
Bollocks, I happened to spot a tripod just a week ago, the murderous "Mother in Law"-type Luckily, I was able to leave the area just as she opened her casemate to fire her deathray, for no man can stand such levels of denigration
Love watching your videos. As a Navy man I enjoy getting into the history and thought processes of ships and their designs. Your take on the Thunderchild runs parallel to what I came up with back in the early '70s as a school project. Though there are some differences … I had a twin mounted 6pdr in a turret at the rear for one and I think my bow turret had 14" guns instead of the 12" that you mounted. I also had 2 torpedo tubes mounted either side of the ram just below the waterline. Take a look at the Russian WW2 river monitor Udarnyy. If it was a sea going vessel and had the speed it could almost fit the bill. Thanks again for the quality videos.
Thank you! Now, I want another WOTW movie just so they can showcase your design. I spent a total of six weeks in the crew of the Trireme Olympias, including on the Thames, and cannot help but note the similarity of the prows of Olympias and your version of Thunderchild.
I just read War of the Worlds and I must say it's still one of the best sci-fi books of all time. Parts about main character's brother are a little bit boring and unnecessary. But still it's a great book and I strongly recommend it for everybody.
When I read it for the first time I was shocked that it didn't take place in the US in the 20th century (because of the movie). I thought it was really neat that it took place in the 1890's. My dad lived in England growing up (my grandfather being in the Air Force) so I started asking him all these cities were real. :) A great book for the time period.
@@badgers1975 Thank you, the surrounding pavement as well as the effigy is well worth a view or photo/audio presentation, namely as an art form. I can remember with humour the ack-ack gun emplacement (cleared)the other(N) side military gravel road off the Horsell Sandpits(film location for Sean Connery "On the Fiddle" 1961) and the Six Xroads.
When the smoke cleared, the little steamer had reached the misty horizon, and Carrie was safe. But the Thunder Child had vanished forever, taking with her man's last hope of victory.
"The leaden sky was lit by green flashes, cylinder following cylinder, and nothing and no one was left to fight them. The Earth belonged to the Martians."
Gorgeous design! I had read a side story from C.A. Powell titled "Last Days of the Thunder Child" which goes into the ship and crew some more. In that book, the ship is described as another member of (or closely related to) HMS Devastation. Of course, that makes her a more traditional pre-dreadnought ironclad. The design you and Engel have made, though, now that's brilliant.
You know. When you started to list all the things that Thunderchild had to possess, I immediately thought it had to be a variant of HMS Victoria. Always nice to see when people think the same way. :-)
Somehow the Thunderchild still looks small. Probably on account of that massive main gun. Would it be unreasonable to hope for more of these videos? Perhaps the HMS Polychrest next?
Pronounced keh-TAH-din. Named after Mt. Katahdin, the highest mountain in the state of Maine at just over a mile high. I like Baron's design. Love HG Wells. Did the rams knowingly realize any of the advantages of having a bulbous bow? Or did that wait until Taylor created the first tow tank?
Yeah, I’ve climbed that overgrown hill several times and every time he said the word I cringed. Of course listening to Maine-ites (?) try to speak regular American English is cringe inducing too.
@@glennberry4829 I'm originally from New York. Once my now ex-wife and I went just over the border into Maine for an afternoon when we were staying in New Hampsha. I drove her batshit saying ayuh all the time after that. Like I said before, ayuh, been to Maine. I'm easily amused.
I should never have doubted you. I saw this thumbnail and mentally assigned it a low priority thinking it was stuff you've covered before. But I was dead wrong. And I love the work to meet the description, but considering design ethos of the RN at the time, plausible tactics, and even the procurement process. In hindsight this is exactly the amount of thought you'd put into a task like this. So thanks to you and Baron Engel for the work on this. It was great.
All these pictures show the Martian war machines rising high... The book states that they had waded out and their upper works were close to the water... I envisioned her as something like HMS Hotspur but with a few torpedoes...
I'd guess they were wading in from deeper water, thus rising up higher as they came in closer to shore. That and, as said, artistic license to make them appear more formidable. Considering that each was constructed from materials contained within a single cylinder, and the size of those is pretty well described, the massive machines often shown aren't likely. Something akin to a small armoured car on stilts is more probable.
@@Delgen1951 Hmmm... Pretty glad they were not as capable as a Timber Wolf then! That thing would be terrifying, twin LRM 20s and twin ERLL's compared to a single Heat Ray (probably something close to an Extended Range Large Laser)? Would have blown Thunderchild out of the water before she managed a few ship lengths! A single MadCat would devastate the Martian Walkers....
Wow. Just wow. A very well thought out design of her. Kudos, kudos. The artwork is very spectacular. I think as a "what if" she'd be a nice addition to the modeling fleet.
@@nitehawk86 well there are some, armoured frigate which were the predecessor to armoured cruiser were a type of ironclad, most early armoured cruiser (e.g general admiral and the Shannon class) could be considered ironclad. From it's introduction till at least late 19th century, iron armouring is somewhat of a novelty restricted only to large fleet battleships and coastal monitors, as armouring became more common in the late 1890s the term ironclad fell out of use.
@@poisonousteapot2394 Interesting. I have a book which is a photographic record of the construction of WW I era. Dreadnoughts and Super Dreadnoughts. It shows the layers of teak planking coating the underside of the armour steel plating, intended to absorb the shock of incoming shell fire. Are they wood clad, or rather wooden underwear wearers?
Most assuredly. However, this is addressed in War of the Worlds: Goliath. You will ultimately lose a purely defensive war. At some point, you'll have to go to Mars...
@@archiescriven6178 more so that they were post-vaxers, they lived as a civilization so long that they outlived and eradicated disease as a type of organism on their planet. As such they never needed vaccines afterwards, as to continue to do so was a waste of resources, time, and effort.
I am so glad you did this. So many people assumed that since the Thunderchild is classified as a torpedo ram it should be some light vessel from decades past. It did disservice both to the legendary ship and also the Martians. While I wouldn't be hasty to claim this is the "definitive" look of the Thunderchild you're assuredly the closest to what HG Wells had in mind. HMS Thunderchild was meant to be a large and powerful vessel that empathized humanity's ingenuity against that of the Martians. Again, thank you!
The Thunderchild was engaging a Borg cube at Sector 001 when Enterprise appeared. Yamato was unfortunately lost with all hands about 8 years earlier at Iconia.
When I saw what I thought was the final drawing at 13:36, I thought to myself “that’s not too impressive, I could draw that”. But seeing the real final drawing at the end of the video... just wow. That truly is impressive!
Pagoda legs would have been whatever the Martian language was for the Battle of Samar, and the HMS Thunderchild would have been aided by the USS Johnston (because of course it would!)
I love being on the part of youtube where we seriously discuss how boiler placement on turn-of-the-20th-century warships affects their ability to survive a direct hit from a heat lance.
![[Live สด] การออกรางวัลสลากกินแบ่งรัฐบาล งวดวันที่ 16 พฤศจิกายน 2567](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/wPd7VFfWHIA/mqdefault.jpg)
Pinned post for Q&A :)
Hey Drach, nice simple question, have there ever been any battles between hugely mismatched opponents, for example age of sail vs pre Dreadnoughts. Many thanks and stay safe during the WuFlu
Hi Drachinifel!
My Grandfather is a U.S Navy veteran who served aboard the USS Galveston (CLG 3) during the Cuban Missile Crisis.
He is turning 80 this year and I want to do something special for his birthday.
I know he watches your videos so could you, during a drydock episode, give a quick run through of the USS Galveston including its: specifications, history, and how it was converted into a guided missile cruiser.
(My Grandfather’s name is Al by the way.)
Could have a dynamite cruiser concept been efective in ww1/ww2 if it had all of the problems ironed out ?
What would you name the other two ships of your Thunderchild class?
How much wood was on warship of ww1, ww2 era?
Thunderchild's armour composition:
25% Harvey armour
75% Pure sheer hatred and anger
Local torpedo ram literally too angry to die!
You forgot 10% tea and 30% Stiff Upper Lip
Rip and tear, until it is done
Is that you Grenville?
Hate the alien. Kill the alien.
What I also love, is that the Thunderchild's success against technologically superior opponents would almost certainly mean that her design would continue on in naval circles for at least another design cycle. So there would absolutely be Superthunderchilds in World War I.
The appearance of aliens might put a bit of a barrier against world war preparations.
If the thunderchild did that, imagine the hms dreadnought, or the uss Iowa, or a modern missile cruiser!
Or the yamato
@@mirandalockey7334 the problem is that modern adaptations cheat by having the aliens have some sort of invisible shield that can just tank anything cuz alien tech
@@shp27493 not in the same way it happened but humans are kinda drawn to war. Ww1 probably wouldn't happen but thered most certainly still be wars, and alien technology appearing as a potential resource would just incentives more fighting because everyone would want a piece of it, or Britain would continue to research it to us against everyone else.
Massacre of mankind actually has an interesting look at how the world might look after the invasion if you're ever interested
Martian Commander: one of these primitive things destroyed three of my War Machines...and allowed a fleet of survivors to escape....what can go wrong next...
Martian Subordinate:
Hilarious! Help us, Corona Chan, you're our only hope...against Mars.
"I say, our last invastion came a cropper in the _most_ disgusting manner. What chance might we have for a future endevour?"
"Well, Your Supreme Squidliness, the humans of their 20th century appear to be undergoing a revolution in antibiotics. We estimate they will have effectively exterminated disease organisms sufficiently for Round Two by, say, 2020?"
To funny, and apt.
Never, EVER ask, "What can go wrong next?" You'll always find out.
@@epiendless1128 'Your Supreme Squidliness' made me chuckle far more than it should have.
The _Thunderchild_ is a message to all proponents of energy weapons everywhere. The lesson is simple: your lasers will never trump our high-velocity rocks.
Think fast, chucklenuts! *builds Ironclad equipped with laser cannons that can tear through modern ships like a hot knife through paper*
The aliens from Turtledove’s Worldwar saga learned it the hard way when their spaceship was smashed to pieces by a railway gun shell.
Don't get me wrong, beams are great in the right sort of a battle, but beams have one huge weakness that rocks don't. Every particle a beam passes through weakens it a tiny bit because a tiny piece of energy the size of 1 particle is absorbed by each particle a beam passes through. Beams, great for space and high stratosphere combat, not so much for planet-surface combat.
Ways to beat beams: Thick Smoke. Heavy Mist. Dust Clouds.
Smoke launchers are already a defensive tech we possess, and would be extremely effective against laser weapons.
Pretty much the final battle of Space Battleship Yamato 2199. The Yamato and Dessler's vastly superior flagship find themselves face-to-face in an environment where the performance of energy weapons are severely degraded. So the Yamato crew break out the WW2 surplus 46-cm shells and lets her rip.
This is amazing! You've manged to develop the entire history and even the budgetary problems from just a few lines from a novel, and al the parts fit! H. G. Wells would be so proud!
She may be a fictional ship,
But she sure acted like a real ship in the RN .
Because she exploded?
@@m0nkEz Ah yes, nothing says glorious ship of the Royal Navy like *M A G A Z I N E D E T O N A T I O N*
There are 2 types of people in this comment thread lmao
Yes, did for three tripods and completed her mission successfully much was to screen the escape of the merchant shipping.
She had more courage than Beatty at Jutland
Drach: So, I got to thinking.
[somewhere on Mars]: Oh no.
:D
Rabbits!!!!
HMS Thunderchild: Finally! A worthy opponent! Our battle will be LEGENDARY!!!
The second I came across this comment he said that
@Joel Smith Year of the Angry Rabbit, by Russell Braddon. Rabbits the size of Alsatians (a breed of dog with which I am not familiar, but maybe German Shepherd sized?) and all being infected with a super-myxomatosis that, alas, does not kill the rabbits, just makes them means and vicious.
*Tripod:* _"Surrender, Terran vessel! We have you outnumbered three to one!"_
*HMS Thunderchild:* _"Then it is a fair fight. Prepare for ramming speed!"_
Very 40k
_Drive me closer!_
@@TheOneLichemperor I WANNA HIT EM WITH MA SWORD!
@@TheOneLichemperor Life is the Emperor's currency. Spend it well. ;)
I might sound like a heretic here but when I think of someone shouting "PREPARE FOR RAMMING SPEED", I immediately think of when Worf shouts it in First Contact
What is not widely known is that many of the Tripods were later Re-Purposed and mounted on British Dreadnought battleships. Unfortunate, they never figured out how to get the Heat Rays working again, despite admiral Fisher's best efforts.
damn...
th-cam.com/video/A-mQLspdfdA/w-d-xo.html
I was working on an RTS based on that idea over lockdown
Well, except for the one on Warspite, which allowed her to destroy everything in her path!
@@dupplinmuir113 pitty she wasn’t sent with repulse and Prince of wales
Ha Ha aircraft go boom boom boom- **alternate universe warspite probably**
IIRC each attempt to reactivate the Heat-Ray resulted in self destruction with loss of life.
As an ex navy man who served on real steam powered ships the position of the shafting places the engine room more forward than the position of the funnel traditionally allows, unless the boiler room was aft of the engine room feeding steam forwards! This design would further protect the bridge from a boiler room explosion additionally if she was using turbines and superheated steam she would be able to use the decay heat after the boiler explosion to maintain way. An excellent video.
I guess you were on a Iowa class
Drach: makes a actually useful torpedo ram.
British Admiralty: you were not supposed to do that.
HMS Enterprise: "Tough little ship."
HMS Thunderchild: "Little?"
Strange thing is, there was a HMS (USS) Thunderchild in that battle, it was just an Akira class, not the Defiant
IJN Yamato: "Hold my beer"
@@hmshood319the Akiras having _fifteen_ torpedo launchers and lack of secondary hull seems like it was designed with the HMS Thunderchild’s description in mind.
@@hmshood319RIP the fallen at Sector 001.
o7
@@hmshood319 Built at Mars specifically to act as part of an anti-invasion defense force, at that. Someone at Utopia Planitia knew what they were doing.
I refuse to believe that this ship wasn’t blasting Rule Brittania as it went out on its blaze of glory using microphones powered by its sheer manliness.
Or 'Hearts of Oak', of course...
Thunderchild was based on the Turbinia -- a famous enough Parsons steam turbine demonstrator. Wells clearly knew of it. In his work, he's describing an incredibly fast warship that could whip around to face the Martian tripods, fast enough to even ram one. Wells also threw in a super-performance large calibre turreted gun. In substance, Wells was foretelling of Dreadnought. (1906) Any secondary battery guns were no part of Well's story.
this was the best moment from the book and yet it's never included in any adaptation. WHY!?!?!?
THEY ALWAYS CUT OUT THE BEST PART
It was in the Pendragon's film version... But the film itself looks like amateur project with CGI made in Garry's Mod 9.
Also, Jeff Wayne's rock-opera.
There's a lego fan adaptation which is set in the sort-of future and turns the Thunderchild into a battleship armed with MACS
a shame it only took out 1 tripod, it had shields on tho so yeah
It was in Jeff Wayne's musical version, which I beleive to the the best and most accurate adaption of H.G. Wells story. th-cam.com/video/4RRe40O6QKU/w-d-xo.html
Probably a combination of HMS Thunderchild having no clear RL counterpart to base a design off of for a live action adaptation to use, and the fact that she only gains a Pyrrhic victory win over the Martian tripods at best...there are other scenes from the book that show how badly we're outclassed technology-wise, so it's a top choice to cut.
Personally, I agree with you...having an adaptation with the Thunderchild vs. 3 Martian Tripods duel left in would be epic. Especially if the right amount of effort was made to make the audience care about the ship and crew ahead of time, so its sacrifice gained extra heft from the viewer rooting for them to win.
@@generalilbisI mean, it’s already got the advantage of being the first effective resistance demonstrated by Earth forces against the Martians. The sheer hope from the ships that maybe, just maybe they might be able to win, squashed by her loss.
Martians: HAHA! WE BLEW UP ITS ENGINE! IT'S DEAD IN THE WATER!
Thunder Child: I didn't hear no bell.
Drach: "What exactly was HMS Thunderchild?"
H.G. Wells: *Yes*
April Fool Ship MK1 ?
@@stevef01 MK2 - MK 1 was the HMS By Jove
@@stevef01 No. This wasn't the April Fools video. That would be the Emperor Class- guide 40,000 which is here- th-cam.com/video/iC1o_9sGqkA/w-d-xo.html
This was taken with much seriousness.
Where's the rest of your fragments? They must be really lonely...
According to H. G. Wells HMS Thunderchild was a “Torpedo Ram”: basically a very fast gunboat with a ram built into it’s bow and one or two torpedo tubes built into it’s hull but facing forward.
Shortly to be released by wargaming as a Premium UK , tier 3 Cruiser
More like tier 2 I think even an Nassau would tear a thunderchild apart. A Arkansas or Wyoming would stomp it into the dirt. Or sea this case. Or gaming needs to do some more class two and some class 1 ships that are older maybe some predreadnoughts and armored cruisers.
Then after WG finish releasing the submarines they will start developing the Martians ... and you thought aircraft carriers and submarines were bad ...
I always thought it would be like a Mikasa and in the same teir
@UCwbx-vhNVv0erbQGSHKN8ug because the thunderchild fictional ship if it was real wouldn't stand a chance against a full-fledged dreadnought even if it is Nassau. You act like they didn't build real coastal battleships like they didn't exist at all. The whole point of this video was fleshing out a fictional ship and saying what it would be like if it was real. A coastal defense ram stands no chance in a tier 3 world of warships match.
@@4C0-q7h is it Mikasa the only pre dreadnought on world of warships? It's still faster and out guns the coastal defense ram that is the fictional thunderchild. I don't know if they can make a tear low enough for it
03:10 Always thought it was a missed opportunity with this image that the flags are not signalling ENGLAND EXPECTS THAT EVERY MAN WILL DO HIS DUTY.
Who would win:
A highly advanced alien war machine armed with lasers and potent chemical weapons
OR
One very angry tea kettle
What tea kettle?
@@Schwerer_Panzerspähwagen7.5cm The HMS Thunderchild is an Ironclad Steamship which is powered by boiling water or essentially a big tea kettle.
@@nguyenten6877 this is a secret -this is my alt account-
@@nguyenten6877 ok
@@nguyenten6877 THE BIG TEA KETTLE
The way you tied the descriptions from the book up into a plausible ship design and cohesive doctrine is perfect.
The art is great.
Edit: I can't believe he actually went and added something after the outro. One of the eternal constants has been shattered.
I half-listened to the by rote outro and already tabbed to something else, and actually JUMPED when Drach spoke up again!
It scared the piss out of me. Now I need to clean.
My favorite part of the book. Thunderchild did her duty for King, and country, and brought great honour to the Royal Navy. Thanks so much for putting this together, and mad respect to the Baron for his amazing artwork. This old Yank redleg will give you a salute from my 8" howitzer just before we go into battle with the Martian Walkers here in the States.
For King, yes. The book mentions an opposition within 40 million miles, placing the Martian launch in 1907. Definitely Edwardian!
Wells was writing a near-future sf story, ten years before the imaginary events described.
A twenty minute dissertation on a imaginary ship that was totally believable! Excellent!
My thoughts on this: Bear in mind that the the War of the Worlds was published in 1896. Two years earlier, in 1894, saw the launch of Turbinia, the first ever turbine powered ship with the (at the time) unprecedented top speed of 35kts. Now, OK, Turbinia was a small experimental ship not a warship but my guess is that Welles viewed it as a tech demonstrator and extrapolated about what a very fast ship might do, and applied it to the WOTW.
The brave crew of HMS Thunderchild must never be forgotten.
They were a crew of Her Majesty's Royal Navy, they had a duty to do and they went down fighting
You want real bravery look up USS Cumberland
@@Thunderchild-gz4gc that was nothing
LET HISTORY NEVER FORGET THE NAME THUNDERCHILD.
Let’s not forget the brave crew of the star destroyers that gave their life in service of the empire while fighting the rebel scum
MOVING SWIFTLY THROUGH THE WATERS
CANNONS BLAZING AS SHE CAME
Brought a Mighty Metal Warlord
Crashing Down In Sheets Of Flame
Sensing Victory was nearing, thought that fortune must've spun
...thinking fortune must have smiled, people started cheering: come on Thunderchild! Cooooome on Thunderchiihiiihihihiiiiiiild!
Martian: Humanity are insects to us and their weapons are weak.
Also Martian: Why do I hear boss music?
Martians to the right of them, Martians to the left of them,
Martians to the front of them
Onwards charged the Thunderchild!
Oops , wrong story🤓
Its honestly suprising that in over 100 years the Royal Navy has never commissioned a ship named Thunderchild.
Super odd seeing Baron Engel pop up here, but having seen his work on Roam he's cerainly qualified.
Maybe sell a print of Thunderchild?
Edit apparently Drac is way ahead of me
try listening to the last few seconds of the video
Watch the video to the very end.
Where is the petition to sign?
It’s probably because Thunderchild is a horrendous name for a warship. Why in heavens name would anyone want to name a Warship anything containing the word child? Doesn’t sound very grand to me.
@@Olumin37 “Thunderchild" seems to imply "the child of thunder" to me. That is, it's more about parentage than about age.
"Moving swiftly through the waters, cannons blazing as she came"
My absolute favorite concept album, and you and Baron absolutely nailed the design.
I immediately thought of it when I saw the video, listened to it and returned, that album makes you feel
@@philismenko What are you guys talking about? A band?
@@Tsar_NicholasIII Thunder Child (official audio) th-cam.com/video/4RRe40O6QKU/w-d-xo.html
@@Tsar_NicholasIII Jeff Wayne's 'War of the Worlds' concept album from the seventies.
Brought a mighty metal warlord crashing down in sheets of flame
Magnificent re-creation of the ship! The heroic attack of the Thunderchild on the Martian tripods is THE most moving passage in that great story.
Not about how many martians she killed, it's about how many people on the paddle steamer she saved.
@@otakunthevegan4206 If her two sisters were completed they coulld have eliminated 9 or 10 martians based on Thunderchild's performance. The Martians would be like: " Thunderchilds, run away, run away!"
@@ONECOUNT - Other ships would be very unlikely to have the same success, because the Martians in the story adapted quickly to new challenges from human military units, and did not tend to fall victim to any type of ambush again. The reason the Thunderchild did so well was that the Martians had no idea what it was or whether it was even a threat until it was on top of them. Other ships would not have had such an advantage after that....as the Martians would have used their heat ray on them at long range. Unlike a gun, the heat ray fires in a straight line of sight over any distance, like a laser, so it cannot miss once sighted on the target....and to do that only takes a couple of seconds....but ships have to fire ranging shots and they very seldom score hits at longer ranges with their first volley.
@@georgecoventry8441 I was thinking of the Thunderchild and her half sisters as a unit of three ships that fatefull day. I doubt that the Martians would have adapted as they had not with the Thunderchild alone. Had three ships and not just one been there to defend the evacuation fleet perhaps the Martians would have been unable to concentrate their fire on just one ship and all three Vessels might have survived. The next encounter might be different as you say, with the Martians adapting.
@@ONECOUNT - Yes, that would have helped, having more naval vessels on hand to bring fire on the Martians, but the only thing that really worked on them (on a handful of occasions) was to surprise them with a brand new situation that they had no knowledge of. The army's artillery units managed to do that on one occasion, destroyed one tripod and disabled another before the Martians wiped them out. After that the Martians took no chances and saturated any area that provided cover for camouflaged artillery with the poisonous "black smoke". This was 100% effective, and the land-based artillery units never again brought down a Martian machine, but the Thunderchild was a brand new factor, one that the Martians did not recognize or understand until it was too late...just a few seconds too late as it turned out, and that was all it took. The drama of those few moments is unforgettable.
There were ships of shapes and sizes, scattered out along the bay,
And I thought I heard her calling, as the steamer pulled away,
The invaders must have seen them, as across the coast the filed,
Standing firm between them, There Lay Thunder Child.
Moving swiftly through the waters, Cannons Blazing as she came,
Brought a mighty metal Warlord, Crashing down in sheets of flame,
Sensing victory was nearing, thinking fortune must have smiled,
People started cheering, Come On Thunder Child,
Come On Thunder Child.
Lashing ropes and smashing Timbers, Flashing Heat-Rays pierced the deck,
Dashing Hopes for our deliverance, as we watched the sinking wreck,
With the smoke of battle clearing, over graves and waves they filed,
Slowly disappearing, Farewell Thunder Child,
Slowly disappearing, Farewell Thunder Child...
"When the smoke cleared, the little steamer had reached the misty horizon, and Carrie was safe. But the Thunder Child had vanished forever, taking with her man's last hope of victory. The leaden sky was lit by green flashes, cylinder following cylinder, and no one and nothing was left now to fight them.
The Earth belonged to the Martians."
oh i love Jeff Waynes version of War of the worlds
Ulla!!!!
If Forever Autumn didn't move you to tears already, Thunderchild from this musical would have you blubbering like a toddler. I still tear up years later just reading that.
It's the perfect depiction of defensive Western warfare - the precursor of separation and chaos at home with Forever Autumn, followed by this anthem to men who fight bravely and die by the hundreds to defend and secure men and women they've probably never met amongst their countrymen. It reminds me of the stories my parents told of World War II.
They say fiction is often more true than history because history tells one story, but fiction tells all stories. One can see Royal Navy sailors for generations inspiring the story to be written longhand in the first place. One can also see sailors in not only the UK but the US and other navies no doubt thinking of Thunderchild during their most harrowing engagements. Jeff Wayne certainly did the subject justice.
Between them, lay the silent, grey ironclad, Thunder Child. Slowly, it moved towards shore. Then with a deafening roar and whoosh of spray, it swung about and drove at full speed towards the waiting Martians.
Q: What *was* HMS Thunderchild?
A: Mankind's middle finger to the Martians.
EDIT: Baron-Engel?! Holy carp! I love his stuff!
@@stuartpenketh8141 ok British boomer
Likewise, though more for his risque art.
It would be two fingers as that has historical significance going back to the battle with the French at Ashincore (sorry for the miss spelling), were the French announced before the battle that they would cut the two fingers used to draw a bowstring off every English Bowman, as the French came second the two fingers were held up to any French prisoners as a mocking gesture, "we won you lost and we still have them ya ya ya" or that sort of thing.
@@bluefoxy6478 actually a millennial old chap
@@CrusaderSports250 That is apparently a myth or legend, but the symbol definitely goes back several centuries.
Everyone asks “what is thunderchild?”
Never “How is thunderchild?”
I'll do you one better: Why is Thunderchild?
@@longboweod who?
Of course unfortunately, The easy one to answer is "where is thunderchild?"
Judging by what happens to her in the book, not too good.
@@longboweod Drach did a great job answering that question in the video- including why her sister ships had not been completed yet.
I feel the need to point out that a vessel's wake has as much, if not more, to do with its hull design than total displacement. Most harbor tugs are a few hundred tons at most, but when they're moving around without a load, they kick out a truly *astounding* wake for their size, easily more than many of the vessels they service. This is, of course, because they aren't designed to move through the water efficiently, so their designers didn't worry about what their wake would be like.
Similarly, the notional designers of the Thunder child may have decided that some efficiency tradeoffs were worth making if it meant improving some of the ship's other characteristics, like survivability, efficacy as a ram, ability to extract the ram from a target and use it again, etc.
After seeing this video, I was a little inspired. I booted up my copy of Springsharp and worked out the statistics for your interpretation of Thunder Child. There were three differences I had to do in order to make her fit: 1) Increase her waterline length from the 100 meters of the Victoria-class to 125 meters (and a 10-meter ram gives her an overall length of 135 meters), 2) Increase her displacement to 9000 tons, and 3) Set her top speed at 22 knots. The results are as follows:
HMS Thunder Child, British Empire Ironclad Ram Battleship laid down 1895
Displacement:
7,727 t light; 8,041 t standard; 9,000 t normal; 9,767 t full load
Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
(442.91 ft / 410.11 ft) x 65.62 ft x (28.87 / 30.43 ft)
(135.00 m / 125.00 m) x 20.00 m x (8.80 / 9.27 m)
Armament:
2 - 12.01" / 305 mm 25.3 cal guns - 714.01lbs / 323.87kg shells, 100 per gun
Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mount, 1895 Model
1 x Single mount on centreline, forward deck centre
1 - 9.21" / 234 mm 31.5 cal gun - 380.08lbs / 172.40kg shells, 100 per gun
Breech loading gun in deck mount, 1895 Model
1 x Single mount on centreline, aft deck aft
6 - 5.98" / 152 mm 26.0 cal guns - 100.00lbs / 45.36kg shells, 100 per gun
Quick firing guns in casemate mounts, 1895 Model
6 x Single mounts on sides, forward evenly spread
Weight of broadside 2,408 lbs / 1,092 kg
Main Torpedoes
5 - 14.2" / 360 mm, 15.09 ft / 4.60 m torpedoes - 0.295 t each, 1.474 t total
submerged bow tubes
Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 12.0" / 305 mm 348.59 ft / 106.25 m 9.71 ft / 2.96 m
Ends: 7.99" / 203 mm 61.48 ft / 18.74 m 9.71 ft / 2.96 m
Upper: 5.98" / 152 mm 348.59 ft / 106.25 m 8.01 ft / 2.44 m
Main Belt covers 131 % of normal length
- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 12.0" / 305 mm - 12.0" / 305 mm
2nd: 0.98" / 25 mm - -
3rd: 0.98" / 25 mm - -
- Conning towers: Forward 12.01" / 305 mm, Aft 0.00" / 0 mm
Machinery:
Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines,
Hydraulic drive, 2 shafts, 19,302 ihp / 14,399 Kw = 22.00 kts
Range 6,000nm at 10.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 1,727 tons (100% coal)
Complement:
461 - 600
Cost:
£0.839 million / $3.355 million
Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 290 tons, 3.2 %
- Guns: 287 tons, 3.2 %
- Weapons: 3 tons, 0.0 %
Armour: 2,850 tons, 31.7 %
- Belts: 2,501 tons, 27.8 %
- Armament: 238 tons, 2.6 %
- Conning Tower: 112 tons, 1.2 %
Machinery: 3,271 tons, 36.3 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 1,315 tons, 14.6 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1,273 tons, 14.1 %
Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0.0 %
Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
2,526 lbs / 1,146 Kg = 2.9 x 12.0 " / 305 mm shells or 4.1 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.42
Metacentric height 4.9 ft / 1.5 m
Roll period: 12.5 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 52 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.16
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.04
Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck,
a ram bow and large transom stern
Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.405 / 0.417
Length to Beam Ratio: 6.25 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 24.46 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 49 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
Fore end, Aft end
- Forecastle: 10.00 %, 9.84 ft / 3.00 m, 9.84 ft / 3.00 m
- Forward deck: 40.00 %, 9.84 ft / 3.00 m, 9.84 ft / 3.00 m
- Aft deck: 45.00 %, 9.84 ft / 3.00 m, 9.84 ft / 3.00 m
- Quarter deck: 5.00 %, 9.84 ft / 3.00 m, 9.84 ft / 3.00 m
- Average freeboard: 9.84 ft / 3.00 m
Ship tends to be wet forward
Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 130.5 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 70.1 %
Waterplane Area: 17,247 Square feet or 1,602 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 86 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 58 lbs/sq ft or 285 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.48
- Longitudinal: 1.04
- Overall: 0.52
Caution: Hull subject to strain in open-sea
Cramped machinery, storage, compartmentation space
Cramped accommodation and workspace room
She... isn't all that good, actually.
Keep in mind, for her likely missions(short range fleet engagement against France, or a Crimean War-esque coastal war) her weakness aren't crippling. Plus the Ram, Armor and compact size would make her a fantastic small craft and coastal attack flagship.
Yes, from a modern perspective (and since her design would have been approved before Yalu River), she has some serious limitations, but she would STILL be more flexible then the Monitors used in WW1.
And if her class had led the charge at Galipoli, with her long reinforced bow eating the Turkish mines instead of the more vital Battleships... She might just make history yet again.
She looks a bit like someone lopped of the front two turrets of the Nelson class, but damn does so look good she also looks like she'd fit into a bit of a steampunk universe i love it :)
Check out the monitor Cheyenne
... wink
It's like a battleship sawed in half modified as a fireship. Just a suicidal rush of every method possible to wreck the enemy in front of you.
I was actually expecting something different for April Fool's Day.
But this is also pleasant.
Nobody is really in the mood for April Fool's jokes. It's bloody grim out there. We're going though a slow motion version of what the Martians experienced.
So the other video on the Emperor class.
@@Easy-Eight cough cough
@@Easy-Eight not all of us want to sit in our homes moping, a little humor is more than welcome amid the doom and gloom.
@@Easy-Eight Me: **looks at Drach's **_other_** upload for 01/04/2020**
Me: **looks awkward**
Me: It vaguely looks like something out of WH40K.
Drach: uploads Emperor-class video on the same day
Me: oh...
Good; I wasn't the only one thinking I'd seen that 'all-forward arms, engines at the rear' form factor somewhere else...
@@empath69 Well, the ship designs for Battlefleet Gothic were heavily inspired by Pre-Dread and Dreadnought era battleship designs
I was going to make a joke here about the Martian cry of "Alloo!" being translated to "Do you see torpedo rams?", but then the video was too nifty for it. I love your analysis, and that design - it's truly fantastic. This is now my canonical _Thunderchild._ Side note: Is there by any chance a deck plan? I'd like to see if I could make a 3d model of the ship.
"Moving swiftly through the waters
Cannons blazing as she came
Brought a mighty metal warlord
Crashing down in sheets of flame
Sensing victory was nearing
Thinking fortune must have smiled
People started cheering
Come on Thunder Child!"
- Jeff Wayne's War of the Worlds
Drach I know you probably won’t see this. But there’s an additional book based entirely around HMS Thunderchild, called The Last Days of Thunderchild. It gives an excellent and extremely detailed account of the ship and her design.
The beauty of H.G. Wells was his ability to see what wasn't in existence but could, and in many cases eventually would be, and placing it into his contemporary setting.
He was an amazing writer.
Both he and Jules Verne were much alike in that respect.
Wells was also very humble in his predictions. He never stated them with absolute certainty. He wrote The World Set Free in 1914 where he predicted a world war and nuclear energy by the 1930s. In an addendum after WWI he wrote in later versions, he claimed that though he was right about the world war, he doubted that nuclear energy would be feasible within the 20th century, not knowing that he'd be proven wrong on that count almost within his own lifetime
Land ironclads is a good example of that. Tank warfare long before it existed and infantry riding bicycles to the front line.
I had always imagined an enlarged and armed version of Turbinia, that would give the low profile, the speed described and a brand new ship around the time HG Wells was writing, the way Thunderchild sets off from the pack is just like Turbinia at The Spithead Naval review 1897.
couldn't agree more!! I always thought (in my own mind) that Thunderchild was supposed to be turbine powered. H G Wells was writing it at the same time Parsons was testing Turbinia and Wells was very aware of new technology and would likely have known about Turbinia's trials. How about Thunderchild also being a test vessel for turbines as well? Would Certainly make sense to equip a relatively cheap ship that relied on high speed with a new technology that is all about speed.
This guy knows!
Whatever she 'really' was, her engines spooled up really quickly, for sure. Maybe she *was* turbine-propelled after all?
This is exactly the kind of shenanigans that the designers of HMS Nelson and FS Dunkerque would have got up to if they had been designing ships in the late 1800's, and the kind of shenanigans I like.
*HMS Thunder child:* "You see, there's three of you and only one of me, so this clearly isn't a fair fight
For you"
*Tripod*: ULA **while sweating profusely**
A Goblin Slayer abridged reference!
You sir are a Tech priest of culture!
@@duneydan7993 Ey my man 😎🤝😎
*Blasting phonk music as it charges guns blazing*
Goodness, your collaborative effort rendering of HMS Thunderchild is quite breath taking. Baron Engel has done himself and the ship proud. I can envisage her churning through the water on the attack to ramming speed with guns blazing. Bravo go sirs, bravo... ^_^
Martians: We're gonna invade Earth.
HMS Thunderchild: *YOU UTTER FOOL! BRITISH SCIENCE IS THE FINEST IN THE WORLD!*
HMS Thunderchild prepares to commit a hate crime
Martians: We're gonna invade Earth.
HMS Thunderchild: I'm gonna end this species' whole career
*Fully Automatic 16" Gun appears from belt armor*
You mean, the finest in TWO worlds (Earth and Mars).
JoJo fans: Superior German Engineering!!!
HMS Thunderchild sounds like a super-monitor: a monitor but heavily advanced tech.
The Martians: "We have a heat ray capable of heating a target area to 5,000 degrees, melting steel and turning flesh to fire. Fear my physics!"
HMS _Thunder child:_ "I am well in excess of 10,000 tonnes moving at 24 knots. Fear MY physics!"
And I am equipped with a Ram Bow!
HMS Thunderchild: *Alright! You alien a-holes! The words of my generation! Up yours!*
*Iowa class floats onto the scene*
"Fear what?🤨"
Splendid stuff, sir.
And I have ever found the tale of the Thunderchild to be in the traditions of the Royal Navy. It never fails to give rise to a proud tear whenever I listen to the wonderful namesake song.
now THIS is how you make an April Fools video. Still entertaining and on topic, while discussing a less serious idea that's still super interesting
Easily my favourite April Fools video ever.
Wait a minute... something tells me this ship is not real. Not sure why... just a hunch.
She’s real in our hearts
It will be the new USSR tier 10 BB after a line split in WOWS.
It's because the mast is IN FRONT OF THE FUNNEL!!!! 😳😨😱 WITCHCRAFT!!!! 🤯😵 Whereas "proper" Royal Navy placement is behind the funnel, ensuring that the mast is cleverly hidden (and roasted) by the ship's smoke most of the time. 😋
Bollocks, I happened to spot a tripod just a week ago, the murderous "Mother in Law"-type
Luckily, I was able to leave the area just as she opened her casemate to fire her deathray, for no man can stand such levels of denigration
SHE'S REAL TO ME!!
I hope this is made into a model someday. I'd love to own it.
Yes please!
Love watching your videos. As a Navy man I enjoy getting into the history and thought processes of ships and their designs. Your take on the Thunderchild runs parallel to what I came up with back in the early '70s as a school project. Though there are some differences … I had a twin mounted 6pdr in a turret at the rear for one and I think my bow turret had 14" guns instead of the 12" that you mounted. I also had 2 torpedo tubes mounted either side of the ram just below the waterline. Take a look at the Russian WW2 river monitor Udarnyy. If it was a sea going vessel and had the speed it could almost fit the bill. Thanks again for the quality videos.
Thank you! Now, I want another WOTW movie just so they can showcase your design.
I spent a total of six weeks in the crew of the Trireme Olympias, including on the Thames, and cannot help but note the similarity of the prows of Olympias and your version of Thunderchild.
Last time I was this early, the Martians hadn't sent any Cylinders.
Martians? Haven't you heard? The chances of *anything* coming from Mars have to be, why, a million to one!
Indeed, how could one expect anything to be launched from that planet! Perish the thought!
@@Mirageknight2133 "Excuse Me, But have seem my Xq-49 Space Modulator?"
"Excuse Me, But have seem my Xq-49 Space Modulator?"
Is Earth obscuring your view of Venus again- ha ha...
I just read War of the Worlds and I must say it's still one of the best sci-fi books of all time. Parts about main character's brother are a little bit boring and unnecessary. But still it's a great book and I strongly recommend it for everybody.
When I read it for the first time I was shocked that it didn't take place in the US in the 20th century (because of the movie). I thought it was really neat that it took place in the 1890's. My dad lived in England growing up (my grandfather being in the Air Force) so I started asking him all these cities were real. :) A great book for the time period.
Ground Zero "Horsell Common, (six X-roads) 2kms N. E. Of Woking, Surrey, G.B.
It's the version which tells the complete story the best of any version, *funnily enough*
@@johnpotter4750 i love the fact they have a statue of a fighting machine in Woking high street
@@badgers1975 Thank you, the surrounding pavement as well as the effigy is well worth a view or photo/audio presentation, namely as an art form. I can remember with humour the ack-ack gun emplacement (cleared)the
other(N) side military gravel road off the Horsell Sandpits(film location for Sean Connery "On the Fiddle" 1961) and the Six Xroads.
Thank you, you just made my 9 year old self very happy. After the BBC broke my heart.
18:55
That is a BEAUTIFUL ship!!
Looks like a Victorian Star Destroyer or the grandfather of the HMS Nelson (ww2 warship).
I had to RE VISIT Thunderchild!
It's still as fun as the first time I watched it!
When the smoke cleared, the little steamer had reached the misty horizon, and Carrie was safe. But the Thunder Child had vanished forever, taking with her man's last hope of victory.
That always gives me chills
"The leaden sky was lit by green flashes, cylinder following cylinder, and nothing and no one was left to fight them. The Earth belonged to the Martians."
@@KAKADOUJACK UULLAAHHH!!!!!!
Ha ha but the martians forgot Coronavirus...
So we only had one ship then, i think not.
The one person who downvoted this is likely Martian.
@Sjwaria Law 6 now!!! A whole herd/pod/flock/clutch of 'em!!!
Well if we issued Marvin the Martian his pu-38 -space modulator, he'd be a happy little earth destroying lil bugger.......
To be fair, theses videos would be pretty dry if you aren't a naval nerd
@@lrminer2024 Ah, you've met my wife.
@Chris we all agreee....we area one....join us.....no thought required
Your notional design makes me think of a high-speed monitor.
Wyom, Cheyenne ...
Or a faster Victoria or Royal Sovereign? They were low and bristled with guns.
I figured he would do Thunderchild for an April 1st video eventually. Really satisfied with the result and can't wait to see what next year holds.
Baron Engel drew this ship? Wonderful. I'm a big, BIG fan of his works. He's a great artist.
Martian Tripod : Walks out into the bay.
Thunderchild: Laughs in Royal Navy.
Laughs in tea
Laughs in rum ration
Laughs in Rule Britannia
Yes, this design makes sense. She clearly looks like a Royal Navy ship of the era.
Applause to Baron Engel. Nicely done, Sir.
Hands down some of the best theory crafting I have ever witnessed.
And I used to be part of a WoW lore group so that's saying something.
H.G.WELLS be pleased with your detailed work - we imagine.
I'm so happy you made this. I've literally just started rereading the war of the worlds and have just passed the Thunderchild chapter
Q: What exactly was HMS Thunderchild?
A: Awesome!
The last thing three War Machines ever saw.
Gorgeous design! I had read a side story from C.A. Powell titled "Last Days of the Thunder Child" which goes into the ship and crew some more. In that book, the ship is described as another member of (or closely related to) HMS Devastation. Of course, that makes her a more traditional pre-dreadnought ironclad. The design you and Engel have made, though, now that's brilliant.
You know. When you started to list all the things that Thunderchild had to possess, I immediately thought it had to be a variant of HMS Victoria. Always nice to see when people think the same way. :-)
Somehow the Thunderchild still looks small. Probably on account of that massive main gun.
Would it be unreasonable to hope for more of these videos? Perhaps the HMS Polychrest next?
Oh, yes please.
"so what is the thunderchild, really?"
Drachinifel: "Hold my cup of tea"
My god, you’ve created the 18th century wet-Navy equivalent of the Defiant class from Star Trek.
Late 19th century, actually. ^_^
The 18th century was from 1700 to 1799
Nerdgasm
@@zerotheprotogen2420 1701 to 1800, actually. (If a vote is taken I 'll most likely be in the minority, but I don't mind).
69 likes, I can’t ruin it......
Or can I 😈
Pronounced keh-TAH-din. Named after Mt. Katahdin, the highest mountain in the state of Maine at just over a mile high. I like Baron's design. Love HG Wells. Did the rams knowingly realize any of the advantages of having a bulbous bow? Or did that wait until Taylor created the first tow tank?
Yeah, I’ve climbed that overgrown hill several times and every time he said the word I cringed. Of course listening to Maine-ites (?) try to speak regular American English is cringe inducing too.
@@benjaminlecrone9122 Mainers
@@mnovick11 Ayuh. Been to Maine.
Mainiacs: Those who like Maine enough to live there for more than one winter. Guilty as charged.
@@glennberry4829 I'm originally from New York. Once my now ex-wife and I went just over the border into Maine for an afternoon when we were staying in New Hampsha. I drove her batshit saying ayuh all the time after that. Like I said before, ayuh, been to Maine. I'm easily amused.
I should never have doubted you.
I saw this thumbnail and mentally assigned it a low priority thinking it was stuff you've covered before. But I was dead wrong. And I love the work to meet the description, but considering design ethos of the RN at the time, plausible tactics, and even the procurement process. In hindsight this is exactly the amount of thought you'd put into a task like this.
So thanks to you and Baron Engel for the work on this. It was great.
I’ve watch this three times due to the amount of information you have to absorb throughout. It is an excellent video.
All these pictures show the Martian war machines rising high...
The book states that they had waded out and their upper works were close to the water...
I envisioned her as something like HMS Hotspur but with a few torpedoes...
That's another artistic fail, the fighting machines are always portrayed much larger than HG probably envisaged.
I'd guess they were wading in from deeper water, thus rising up higher as they came in closer to shore.
That and, as said, artistic license to make them appear more formidable.
Considering that each was constructed from materials contained within a single cylinder, and the size of those is pretty well described, the massive machines often shown aren't likely.
Something akin to a small armoured car on stilts is more probable.
@@jwenting Wells described them as beaning as tall as a church steeple, or about 35 to 50 feet tall or the size of a Battle tech Madcat.
@@Delgen1951 Hmmm... Pretty glad they were not as capable as a Timber Wolf then! That thing would be terrifying, twin LRM 20s and twin ERLL's compared to a single Heat Ray (probably something close to an Extended Range Large Laser)? Would have blown Thunderchild out of the water before she managed a few ship lengths! A single MadCat would devastate the Martian Walkers....
@@alganhar1 now I want to see a Steiner scout lance curb stomping the martians
If I happened to be chosen as the First Space Lord of Her Majesty's Space Force,
I would name our first Space Dreadnought
*HMS Thunderchild*
Second one should be HMSS (Her Majesty's Space Ship) Victory
*driving over mars* *microbes on mars* OH GOD NO
I can only assume that name is reserved for the first void warship that humanity produces.
I think it would have to be HMSS Thunderchild - Her Majesty's Space Ship.
i SAY!!!
Brilliant analysis and spot-on rendering. Attack of the Thunderchild is my favorite part of the book.
Wow. Just wow. A very well thought out design of her. Kudos, kudos. The artwork is very spectacular. I think as a "what if" she'd be a nice addition to the modeling fleet.
super cool - you have me convinced. I absolutely can picture that thing, full flank right at them and pounding away with that single big turret.
Might the term 'Ironclad' at the time the book was published be a generic term for any kind of capital/armored looking warships?
Maybe, similar to how people nowadays call any warship larger than a destroyer that isn't a carrier (E.g heavy cruiser) battleship
How much of an overlap was there between ironclads and armored cruisers?
@@nitehawk86 well there are some, armoured frigate which were the predecessor to armoured cruiser were a type of ironclad, most early armoured cruiser (e.g general admiral and the Shannon class) could be considered ironclad.
From it's introduction till at least late 19th century, iron armouring is somewhat of a novelty restricted only to large fleet battleships and coastal monitors, as armouring became more common in the late 1890s the term ironclad fell out of use.
@@poisonousteapot2394 Interesting. I have a book which is a photographic record of the construction of WW I era. Dreadnoughts and Super Dreadnoughts. It shows the layers of teak planking coating the underside of the armour steel plating, intended to absorb the shock of incoming shell fire. Are they wood clad, or rather wooden underwear wearers?
@@TheArgieH
Widely speculated to be the inspiration for thunderchild:
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Polyphemus_(1881)
You do realize that the Martians are taking notes on this to prevent any future issues, right?
Say hello to my little virus
Well, at this point they'd have to worry more about being nuked...
Most assuredly. However, this is addressed in War of the Worlds: Goliath. You will ultimately lose a purely defensive war. At some point, you'll have to go to Mars...
Then corvid 1897 hit and all the Martins died. The end.
Heh!
That was actually the plain old flu. I wonder what coronavirus would have done to them. Maybe turned them thermonuclear?
Does this mean the tripods are technically all AntiVaxers? If so that would explain quite a lot of the american population.
@@archiescriven6178 more so that they were post-vaxers, they lived as a civilization so long that they outlived and eradicated disease as a type of organism on their planet. As such they never needed vaccines afterwards, as to continue to do so was a waste of resources, time, and effort.
Were they all pecked to death by a plague of crows then?
Saw Thunderchild in the title and knew exactly what it meant. Great story, I read it regularly. Fascinating analysis of the design, thanks.
I am so glad you did this. So many people assumed that since the Thunderchild is classified as a torpedo ram it should be some light vessel from decades past. It did disservice both to the legendary ship and also the Martians. While I wouldn't be hasty to claim this is the "definitive" look of the Thunderchild you're assuredly the closest to what HG Wells had in mind. HMS Thunderchild was meant to be a large and powerful vessel that empathized humanity's ingenuity against that of the Martians. Again, thank you!
Imagine at the battle between Thunderchild and Tripod suddenly the Yamato and Enterprise appears in the sky
Or hell the HMS dreadnought
The Thunderchild was engaging a Borg cube at Sector 001 when Enterprise appeared. Yamato was unfortunately lost with all hands about 8 years earlier at Iconia.
@@Ozraptor4 If that was the Yamato in question. I immediately pictured the Space Battleship Yamato and the Enterprise.
Taffy 3 welcomes their sister in spirit
I take it you refer to the two Galaxy class starships?
When I saw what I thought was the final drawing at 13:36, I thought to myself “that’s not too impressive, I could draw that”. But seeing the real final drawing at the end of the video... just wow. That truly is impressive!
I'm glad the final art was worth the wait.
ah yes, of course the tripod makes it bad for the martians.
i recommended using pagoda legs.
Not cage legs?
@@McSkumm brilliant ! All the swinging from the wind makes it hard for the Royal Navy to shoot at martians.
It’d be like the inflatable noodle guys at used car sales parks, but with laser beams and poison gas.
Pagoda legs would have been whatever the Martian language was for the Battle of Samar, and the HMS Thunderchild would have been aided by the USS Johnston (because of course it would!)
The bit at the end moved me to shout “Huzzah for the Thunderchild!”
Beautifully researched and a very believable rendition. I'm tempted to scratch-build a model of her.
What was HMS Thunderchild?
The answer is obviously a worthy opponent.
Man, I haven't heard the name 'Baron Engel' in quite a while. That's some top tier artwork.
The greatest ship ever to counter the "Red Menace" to go head to head. May we all pay gratitude and respect 😢😢😢
I love being on the part of youtube where we seriously discuss how boiler placement on turn-of-the-20th-century warships affects their ability to survive a direct hit from a heat lance.