I was on that train. It was a shambles. Too many on and we all had to make our way back home as best we could. An elderly man even got into a fight on Exeter St David's station platform, with one of the organizers.
I too was on it and remember the fracas on St Davids Station as we waited for information on what was going to happen!! Inearly froze to death before we were finally told we could use any train to get back to Taunton and then use a bus link to Lydiard and then WSR back to Minehead. The Extra Two Carriages added to the train at Minehead in my opinion caused the fail! - greedy organisers! The awful thing was that there were diesels in the sidings at Exeter that could have helped but did not! As I understand it this incident nearly caused a steam ban on the mainline it caused so much disruption!
The incline between these two stations is 1in37 incline on reverse curves. Overloaded train and lack of use of sanders resulted in the standard 4 loosing its feet. High steam chest pressure made it difficult to shut the regulator to stop the slip, driver opened the regulator further in an effort to slam it shut which resulted in the slip becoming worse. In an effort to reduce the steam chest pressure, cylinder cocks opened and eventually the regulator was shut.
So near and yet so far. The slip occurred on the final curve into the platform right at the top of the bank which was the same place where two 80xxx tanks hit an identical problem in 1994. They just managed to get over the top on the restart. Suggests there is a track irregularity (dip) and/or greasy/oily conditions in that precise location, even though one was up line and the other down line.
I watched the 2 80xxx and could see one section of rail seemed to bow upwards so at the start of that section, it would be even steeper. And as the engine got exactly there, that is where it first slipped. Check the profile of the track on that vid, you'll spot it!
IIRC This tour was disaster thoughout, the FM diesel on the back had been declined as it would spoil the look of the train. So this also meant no heating in the coaches... Tour was canceled after this as by the time they'd gone back down the hill and had another go they'd have lost their slot on the West of England line (mostly single track and would have destroyed SWT's timetable)
The driver of 34067 did well to control the train from further slipping it was at 75% cut off and full regualator, but was hinded as the 4MT slipped again, also the climb started with a 15 mph speed restriction, and it was going up the down line which is slightly steeper, Also it was over loaded as 2 coaches where added, and FM did not have a banker on stand bye, as they didn't think it was needed, the class 47 being based at Minehead.
Passengers were told that the tour was terminating at Exeter St Davids and were asked to leave the train. I believe they were able to use their tickets on trains and return to Taunton. Not sure how they were returned to Minehead though. The 2 locos and carriages were then parked over in Riverside Yard, where the engines were inspected for any damage.
Unless you there its hard to tell what happened. I think its a case of an over loaded train and it just became too much for both loco's to handle on such a steep gradient and without being able to have a run up to the incline. Bad planning by all concerned. The driver of 76079 didn't help matters by not using sand, the loco went into bad slip which is difficult to control with all that pressure in the steam chest. Tangmere driver was using sand hence why it didn't slip!
Plus, if there were any problems then they could reverse down the bank. there are catch points on the 'up' side which would have meant the couldnt reverse back down
no a banking engine was not refused. But thought of being needed by FM as it was still at minehead!! Most proberly if their was one stationed their they would have wanted the help
This video makes it clearer. Looking at the exhaust, Tangmere is still gripping the rails after 76079 starts slipping. th-cam.com/video/n0dCnEJBmdA/w-d-xo.html
Okay wasn't there, can't see how many were on the hook. With approx 60,000lb of tractive effort and close on 3,000 hp at the draw bar available that should have been a walk in the park, even from a standing start. As stated else where could have been very nasty. In fairness 34067 has a steam reverser and even when working well will catch out even the most experianced driver. Great sounds great vid thanks.
Well sorry to disapoint you but my hearing is perfectly ok, and I work with steam, and I know that Bullieds have a particular knack of slipping, with their light axle loading and light box-pox wheels they are verl light-footed. Yes 76079 slipped first, but ive had 1st hand experiance, whilst firing, that 76079 is a very sure footed loco. 7 up the 1in49 in leaf fall and drizzle and not a single slip. If you'd took a Bullied up there, you will have for definate slipped. Just a point.
@mostlyrailways My facts are correct, you can blatently here that 34067 is slipping, and slipping badly from the sounds of it. Yes 76079 goes first but soon after so does Tangmere, so get your facts right before you start slagging off members of the youtube community!
blooody hell wtf were the drivers doing ian rielys locos are always stalling failing and slipping i think that they need better maintinance and also i think that the drivers and crew should be trained properly because they are just trashing there locomotives but gr8t vid 5*
I was on that train. It was a shambles. Too many on and we all had to make our way back home as best we could. An elderly man even got into a fight on Exeter St David's station platform, with one of the organizers.
I too was on it and remember the fracas on St Davids Station as we waited for information on what was going to happen!! Inearly froze to death before we were finally told we could use any train to get back to Taunton and then use a bus link to Lydiard and then WSR back to Minehead. The Extra Two Carriages added to the train at Minehead in my opinion caused the fail! - greedy organisers! The awful thing was that there were diesels in the sidings at Exeter that could have helped but did not! As I understand it this incident nearly caused a steam ban on the mainline it caused so much disruption!
The incline between these two stations is 1in37 incline on reverse curves. Overloaded train and lack of use of sanders resulted in the standard 4 loosing its feet. High steam chest pressure made it difficult to shut the regulator to stop the slip, driver opened the regulator further in an effort to slam it shut which resulted in the slip becoming worse. In an effort to reduce the steam chest pressure, cylinder cocks opened and eventually the regulator was shut.
if i remember correctly... the stretch between Exeter st Davids and Exeter Central is one worse hill's to climb on the UK railway
So near and yet so far. The slip occurred on the final curve into the platform right at the top of the bank which was the same place where two 80xxx tanks hit an identical problem in 1994. They just managed to get over the top on the restart. Suggests there is a track irregularity (dip) and/or greasy/oily conditions in that precise location, even though one was up line and the other down line.
I watched the 2 80xxx and could see one section of rail seemed to bow upwards so at the start of that section, it would be even steeper. And as the engine got exactly there, that is where it first slipped.
Check the profile of the track on that vid, you'll spot it!
IIRC This tour was disaster thoughout, the FM diesel on the back had been declined as it would spoil the look of the train. So this also meant no heating in the coaches...
Tour was canceled after this as by the time they'd gone back down the hill and had another go they'd have lost their slot on the West of England line (mostly single track and would have destroyed SWT's timetable)
The driver of 34067 did well to control the train from further slipping it was at 75% cut off and full regualator, but was hinded as the 4MT slipped again, also the climb started with a 15 mph speed restriction, and it was going up the down line which is slightly steeper, Also it was over loaded as 2 coaches where added, and FM did not have a banker on stand bye, as they didn't think it was needed, the class 47 being based at Minehead.
Whole train returned to bottom of the bank, into Exeter St Davids station. Tour was ended and passengers were removed from train.
Passengers were told that the tour was terminating at Exeter St Davids and were asked to leave the train. I believe they were able to use their tickets on trains and return to Taunton. Not sure how they were returned to Minehead though.
The 2 locos and carriages were then parked over in Riverside Yard, where the engines were inspected for any damage.
Over all the train was overloaded at around 50 tonnes for the bank, the limit for the bank for a Battle of Britain and the 4MT together was 400 tonnes
Unless you there its hard to tell what happened. I think its a case of an over loaded train and it just became too much for both loco's to handle on such a steep gradient and without being able to have a run up to the incline. Bad planning by all concerned. The driver of 76079 didn't help matters by not using sand, the loco went into bad slip which is difficult to control with all that pressure in the steam chest. Tangmere driver was using sand hence why it didn't slip!
Plus, if there were any problems then they could reverse down the bank. there are catch points on the 'up' side which would have meant the couldnt reverse back down
according to another version of this on a dvd, they did reverse down the bank into st david's
First sensible comment
What a place to start slipping.Right under the footbridge!
I strongly suspect the stall was because the driver of the pilot engine NEVER gave it time to fully recover, till it was too late.
Got to love the wheel slip.
Does anyboday remeber what ahppend after this :) ??
broomobi
Very interesting video
no a banking engine was not refused. But thought of being needed by FM as it was still at minehead!!
Most proberly if their was one stationed their they would have wanted the help
And also before u say im not an armchair railway fan, i do a lot of voluntry work at the SVR
I think I would have done too! Was she damaged after this?
does anyone have different video footage of this?
have good picture quality on dvd, but copyright forbids etc. dvd is Steam Video no. 86 for june/july 2006
So how was this incident resolved? Both restarted without incident or was help drafted in to give em both a shove up the incline?
they backed down the hill into st david's and the tour ended there. engines were undamaged
They put it on the wrong line so the train had a better chance climbing on the sharp curves.
Witch one is slipping, the 76079 or 34067?
76
This video makes it clearer. Looking at the exhaust, Tangmere is still gripping the rails after 76079 starts slipping. th-cam.com/video/n0dCnEJBmdA/w-d-xo.html
anyone got a spare Z class banker to give it a shove ??? those were the days!
Gotta agree Ebbystone why didnt he use the effin sanders like any competant engineman would.
Okay wasn't there, can't see how many were on the hook. With approx 60,000lb of tractive effort and close on 3,000 hp at the draw bar available that should have been a walk in the park, even from a standing start. As stated else where could have been very nasty. In fairness 34067 has a steam reverser and even when working well will catch out even the most experianced driver. Great sounds great vid thanks.
Tommy Newbury it’s a 1 in 37 slope in a curve from a standing start. It is a very sharpe bend and also it is very steep like I have said.
@7P46115 Get your facts right before you start slagging off the wrong locomotive; Tangmere didn't slip once on that climb.
I think you'll find the train was about 3 coaches overweight due to bad planning by the tour operator. Think before you speak please.
Well sorry to disapoint you but my hearing is perfectly ok, and I work with steam, and I know that Bullieds have a particular knack of slipping, with their light axle loading and light box-pox wheels they are verl light-footed. Yes 76079 slipped first, but ive had 1st hand experiance, whilst firing, that 76079 is a very sure footed loco. 7 up the 1in49 in leaf fall and drizzle and not a single slip. If you'd took a Bullied up there, you will have for definate slipped. Just a point.
Not bad planning or anything to do with the load or engines just cr*p driving by Kaptain Kirk!!
and yes the loco owner was rather less than happy!!
Dang, close that throttle.
The wholetrain was ended at exter station thats a shame when people paid there money for something like that
@limeyfox I know it was a long time ago but I love this comment! :D I noticed he never had a comeback planned :P
@mostlyrailways My facts are correct, you can blatently here that 34067 is slipping, and slipping badly from the sounds of it. Yes 76079 goes first but soon after so does Tangmere, so get your facts right before you start slagging off members of the youtube community!
or they would've used the banker which I believe wasn't available here. An extra coach, no banker, extremely steep gradient. Disaster.
That could have goe the same way as Blue Peter so easily!:/
blooody hell wtf were the drivers doing ian rielys locos are always stalling failing and slipping i think that they need better maintinance and also i think that the drivers and crew should be trained properly because they are just trashing there locomotives but gr8t vid 5*
mabyso but they could have treated the locos with a little more respect
@omnibus360
Except that "epic fail" is two words.
Epic Fail
See?
Shove a class 40 on it
christ i didnt realise that they slipped that bad, i mean they would of done it if that bloody Tangmere hadnt slipped.
Ah just stick a Castle or a King on it, it would've pulled the overloaded train and the two engines up there by itself!