The simplest way to say this is that 80/20, or zone 2/all higher effort workouts (including your HIIT, Hill efforts, AT or LT efforts, or even VO2 max workouts for those shorter races) is a training principle that plays out over YEARS, not just one training cycle. Yes, you can see bigger short term gains from a greater frequency of harder efforts, but you will plateau and get hurt and have a hard time moving beyond if that’s all you focus on. Similarly, ONLY zone 2 efforts is also not a magic bullet. You need both kinds of stimuli, with the vast majority being that aerobic/endurance work, to achieve the greatest success in the long term. Don’t lose the forest for the trees.
also 80/20 is interesting if you run 100km+ per weeks because you'll have 22-30km/week of intensity. But for someone with less than 50km/week, doing 10k for all your intensity is not huge. I think someone with less than 100km should also emphasis run between lt1 and lt2 (basically a bit slower than half pace but faster than marathon), and it would be more like 60 easy, 20 semi unconfortable and 20 hard
@@gauthierperrod4958 80/20 isn't meant to be a static calculation applied to a specific range or block of periodization though, it's a general principle throughout a season, or longer.
@@gauthierperrod4958 I'd also generally say that if we're talking the marathon, you'll see less intensity in general in your endurance block, and even when you start moving into more threshold training, you'll start by inserting more small bursts rather than dedicated HIIT workouts, like hill sprints or 100m accelerations in your medium-long runs, and that kind of thing. If your training is going great and you're into your final race prep phase, 80/20 doesn't even apply with all the speed work you're likely to do 😅
Appreciate the human element you bring to your content. Some days are good, some days are sh*t, some days you know you took it too easy. Luckily, we have the opportunity to try again tomorrow. Keep showing up 🙌🏼
Great message! This was my experience in a recent half marathon. I didn’t feel my best on race day and felt like I was running in sand but my solid bank of training carried me through to a great finishing time (for me). Even if I wasn’t feeling my best it truly was “Just another Sunday”. Thanks for posting.
Pretty cool that your lower zones are so durable that getting to Z2 means pushing the pace. Most people I talk to have trouble staying below Z3 at any effort because their lower zones are completely undeveloped. After a year of Z2 training and seeing less HR volatility while paces come down, I can attest that there is hope for us mere mortals!
learning about zone 2 is what got me not only into running, but whats make me able to stick with it. started bit over half a year ago where i was struggeling running 5km at 10:30min/km pace. today i did a 11.5km run at about 06:50min/km at same low maf HR, so a rather insane improvement in my opinion, and its so motivating to actually see and feel the improvement. There is no way i would believe half a year ago, that i today not only would be able to run for 11,5km straight, but do it in a way that feels easi, and where when im done with the run almost feel like i can do it all over agein, and best of all, not have my legs hurt for next 2 days. zone 2 is king:)
Race day doesn’t need to be perfect. Thank you for the reminder to put in the work. The real marathon is the training and the race is the celebration. Love your commentary.
I went from a 26 min 5K to a 19 min 5K in less than a year doing only steady runs (by time, not distance). I've added speed now, but you need a good 6 months minimum IMO to build a sufficient "base." Friends of mine are barely a week into their running journeys and are already buying fancy trainers and doing sprint sessions. I tried to tell them it's not the optimal way but I think you have to let people make their own mistakes.
@@SHVideografie Currently I just aim to run 5-6 times a week. And at least one of them needs to be a tempo session and one long run. I do strides whenever I'm feeling stron. Typical tempo for me is 3 x 8 mins at 4:30 pace. But on my easy runs I'll just randomly do a 4:00 min K if I feel strong.
The problem with this approach and the problem that you'll run into as you start to get faster is that you need to be doing short neuromuscular sprints/ strides during these zone 2 efforts. Because running fast is just as much of a skill as it is in adaptation. I hate to break it to you by just running at zone 2. You will never develop the leg speed and turnover in order to run the speeds required to get close to like 15 or 16-minute 5K. By introducing strides, and even very short VO2 max intervals such as 30/30s or 200s and 400s you will continue to develop your base with zone 2 but also start developing the skills in order to run at higher velocities.
@@alilovic1 Mate, don't focus on Zones, it's just a fad. Use your own gut feeling as to your perceived exertion rate (PER). If you can chat comfortable, maintain strict form and fell you can go on for a long time, you're in the right energy system for "base" running. For me, that is 5:50 mins per k.
Thank you!!! An extra layer of fitness!!! I'm feeling just like this 5 weeks behind in my hm training missing runs because of a niggle that had me out. I cross training did my rehab and today I finally did ' just another Sunday ' where my fitness was good!!!
Sometimes, it’s really worth the extra time to drive to a different location, especially for long runs. Running the same route every weekend for 90 to 120 minutes can get boring over time.
With Scully's physique, I feel like if he'd gone into weightlifting instead of running, he'd be an absolute monster. The dude is more jacked then half the gym bros I see around without any substantial upper body training. Genetics goldmine
@@gankhammer9926 You're right , he does have good muscle tone and some runners have less. But to call him jacked is a stretch for me. His definition is due to his low body fat and middle of the pack genetics.
the t-shirt is bang on, been using mine last few weeks...been too mild for the Anorak but used it for walks and I know that i'll love it this winter. Stryd app I sometimes just set it for 60mins on a wide range so get no pace/split data on the run and then look at it afterwards to see if my PE matched reality
You actually made me laugh with coffee in my mouth then, that moment you said when you're doing the run and you start asking yourself 'am I okay' lol been there a few times, but in this very kind of run...... I have been doing it to get my fitness back after injury and thought to myself its got me so fit why didnt I do this in a normal block - they are here to stay - these are soooooo important (Y)
Would you be able do a video on warmup? Notice you drove to get there and I drive to get to the trails, be good to know what to stretch and warmup after driving.
@@ryanrobbie I didn't take it into consideration, I live where it is normally 30 to 34 degrees, but due to humidity it can feel anywhere from 35 to 39 on a hot day
I can only make time for around 30km running per week. I do 3 workouts, one interval, one tempo and one long run. I feel like in my case zone 2 isnt that useful per time investment?
I'm no expert but you could also trade one interval session for another longer run, and add strides to every easy run for a bit of compensation. You could also look at a different type of schedule. Most schedules are 7 days cycles, that's mostly out of convenience. You could also do a 10day cycle to relatively put more Z2 in your schedule
I’m not sure what he defines zone 2 as, depending on what your are training for certain sessions are crucial, in general for building a base an intensity that is metabolically not stressful and maximizes your body’s rate of fat use is what most of training should be done at. Without this the other sessions can only help so much, there are many pieces to the pie.
@@JoshNishitaniI think this is what gets every TH-cam runner sprouting the benifits of zone 2. They are putting in huge mpw, way more than your average hubby runner (myself included, I average 40km/w, but I also work 50hrs a week, have a family and household to look after, and everything else that comes with life). I'm no expert at all, but my take on zone 2/MAF/80-20, is it's great for those putting in massive mpw (daily, sometimes double daily runs) to reduce injury/fatigue/over use etc, to be able to run those huge weekly numbers and also run a meaningful number at higher intensity. But for your hobby runner maybe running 3-4 days a week and not huge mpw, its benefits are over sold. 80% of a relatively low starting number, is at zone 2, is still a very low number. You will hardly have mpw left to get the benifits from your tempo/intervals Vo2max runs. Also 25-30km a week in zone 2 probably isn't enough to really build a high (or low hr) zone 2 floor. You are just shuffling around for a few KMs each day, at a crazy low pace getting frustrated that you have to walk/jog or mess with your natural stride to keep the HR down. But hey, no one wants to watch a TH-cam channel of some hobby runner plodding around for 1/2hr each run, sprouting the benifits of zone 2. So all you hear is how EVERYBODY should be doing zone 2 and if you aren't, shame on you
No PRO here or anything close but ~30 yrs ago I started using a HR monitor and it totally changed my finishing times ... So I think I have a clue on all these ~zones many preach here on the web get totally wrong... -- And I'm not saying you do not know what you are talking about but in this specific video, your words make no sense.... Telling someone to go run with a purpose and not know your effort is just gonna have most of us run too hard on this day and for what gains?
He's saying to not just run at an easy effort all the time. His definition of zone 2 is the zone up to LT1 (first threshold), so his advice is to do some runs at this effort (~3 hour race pace). Simple.
@@matthanna1980 race pace is not below LT1, even if it's a 3 hour race such as a marathon, it's beneath LT2 and above LT1. If the pace had been subLT1, he wouldn't have felt "bad" towards the end. So most likely the pace of this run was above LT1.
@@jcsk8 Any kind of work is an effort, there is no such thing as a recovery run: recovery is recovery, not a light run. The reason why you can't keep an effort in Z2 for ever isn't because of the effort itself (Z2 you are not accumulating lactate), it's because after some time you can not replenish the calories (energy) you have consumed...
There is plenty of runners that distinguish recovery and zone 2. A lot seem to believe it below 70% of mhr. Try it, if you don’t see a distinction from some 2 idk what to tell ya mate.
I think its because elite runners in zone 2 are still going at such a fast pace it puts biomechanical strain on the body, so although HR for them is low, there is a need to slow down to prevent injury. I don't have this problem 😂
@@patrickschulze3787 I wouldn´t say there´s no recovery run as I´m not a pro, but most of the pro´s does this. I walk for a running recovery and feels better than if I just rest. In clycling lowpace/low miles does wonders for your recovery. The blood flows really helps.
I enjoy my runs without listening to a watch as well. Push yourself to the point you and your body agree on, and then later use the watch to quantify how hard it actually might be something. We are not machines. If you go after the watch you might leave a gallon in the tank on some days. On others, you keep grinding broken gears.
I think the difficulty is that for typical hobby runners, zone 2 is a very easy effort but for elite athletes, zone 2 is actually quite a hard pace. I run uktras and reasonably well but I still can't run at any pace below zone 2 so there's no difference between easy and zone 2
Yes. It’s the pace just faster than true recovery pace imo. But not the dreaded zone between easy(obviously) and sub threshold. If you just avoid that zone you should be good although there are times where that zone is beneficial as well.
@@antoniovitor643what do you mean it’s not comfortable? It should be very comfortable. Stephen seems very confused about z2.. telling people to “run z2 with intent” or “get stuck in”.. very confusing messages. Z2 is conversation pace and nothing more. Use the MAFF 180 formula, it’s easy. No need to overcomplicate
For normal people zone 2 equates to 'easy pace', but for proper elite athletes they can run at a z2 HR range at a pace for a normal person would be hard to sustain for a short period of time. So although HR is not high, that pace puts strain on the body if doing every day so elite athletes have to go down to Z1 (and would still be running)
From how the run effort is described, I think Scully is talking about Zone2 of a three zone model. In other words just below LT2, ie threshold run. It's as confusing as all hell because most people assume Zone 2 to be that of the five zone model which is the LT1. Needs clarification from Scully. What is he describing?
I will have to post again, but a few things.. for me this is below LT1, it’s just a very very long career that’s now enabled me to run at faster speeds with a decent heart rate 145-50 and stay well below LT1. LT1 is 160-64 hr or thereabouts, and LT2, 164-72 I’d imagine. Unless I’m going longer, then heart rate would drift. The purpose of a good steady run, isn’t always ZONE 2 malarkey.. it’s just coincidence that I’d be right at zone 2, but this is just an effort for me that I have to work a bit, ie it’s not easy.. it’s true that for most people to nail down zone 2 work in a 5-7 model system, ie below LT1, then you’d have to operate at a very low speed and it wouldn’t feel hard at all.. that’s not what I’m encouraging you do. There may well be benefits to that, but I didn’t get good by doing that. I believe physiology can be persuaded to shift when we push it, and so you might benefit from runs that progress in effort and it’s possible zone 2 might play a role in some of that run, but likely to get a stimulus like I did today, including psychology, then you’ll have to push, and ignore zone this or that. I finish a run like today, and sure enough my stupid lactate is 1.0 or 1.1, and sure enough I’d be zone 2, below LT1, but it’s NOT an easy day, or a basic jog, I’m working and therefore at the end I’m happy to be done.
Proud to be wearing my 26.2 Vest and representing this mindset, in a world full of half-assed “training”. Most people have no clue what it’s like to WORK. Keep it up Scully🙏🏼 I banked 34km today with 15km at MP 💪🏼
@@stephenscullion262 mate, I don’t mean it in a hateful way, maybe just take it as a bit of constructive criticism? For 3/4 of the video, I wasn’t even sure what type of run you were doing and talking about, cause you kept saying things like „such a run is not easy“, „putting in a good effort“ without actually naming the type of run you mean. For a normal runner like me that was quite confusing as zone 2 runs for me normally mean the very opposite of what you said. In combination with the title it seemed you were talking about some other type of run (that’s maybe more important than zone 2) but were purposefully delaying actually naming it. Again, not meant to hate at all, you are obviously a great runner and very knowledgeable. And I actually like this training log with some wisdom sprinkled in video style, but maybe give them more fitting titles?
@@chrismoyse2308 yes, but as I said he also talks about how it‘s not easy and about putting in some effort. Sounds a lot more like zone 3 or threshold to me, which still falls under „steady pace“
just because it looks z2 doesn't mean it is,as his hr is different than everyone else's... it also might be on the edge between z2/z3, perhaps he is also fatigued so it's not going up that much. On top of all of this and most importantly, even though his hr is saying one thing, his lactate might be saying another. He actually might be above LT1, therefore it can not be easy. I do not know if he is above LT1...so I agree there are a lot of unclear things...
@@patrickschulze3787 yea I just want to know what it means for my runs? Does that mean I should be doing more z3 type work? Just under lactate or just leaving z2?
@@rz9wb Z3 based on 5 model HR is above LT1 (it might not necessarily begin exactly at that threshold, but it will be around it by very little). If you wish to have the same adaptations with Z3 that you would have with Z4, you would have to do 2-3h+ long workouts. So you either have less benefits or very high strain. Z2 is under LT1, even if you are at high Z2 you are not accumulating lactate (kinda). If you can do a lot of volume you can afford to do Z1, otherwise I recommend pushing Z2 to its limit to have more adaptations. If work below lactate means below LT1, then of course you should do (and a lot) of it, if you instead meant below LT2, as I've said before, I recommend pushing towards LT2 for shorter times over a lot of work closer to LT1
@@rz9wb but at the end of the day, I recommend an experienced coach who can guide you through your workouts monthly to achieve your personal goals in the best way. It's cool to know the science and it's easy to find it nowadays, but it's difficult to apply it in the real world with 1000 variables, which a coach can do in person.
I built my entire success around this and since I’ve gone to high school and had a different coach he’s very set on no zone 2, I’m convinced that zone two and double build insane fitness
I would like to know if the run in the video was above LT1. If it was below LT1, it's not in the grey zone. The problem with runs in the grey zone is that to have sufficient benefit from it, you would have to do a LOT of work in it...by a lot, I mean 2-3 hours of total accumulated work per session, which obviously is very strenuous, so it can be quite clear why it is avoided.
This dude is allergic to getting to the point. Talks in circles with endless b-roll and inane yapping. Gotta get that 10 minute runtime somehow I guess LOL
That zone 2 shit is for base building. If its race season and your ass is still following that instagram 80/20 rule you might as well set those PRs aside.
it's not an instagram rule...I kindly ask you to go do some research about 80/20 and polarized vs pyramidal training. (not saying one is inherently better than the other...but it can be based on variables that depend on each athlete)
@@patrickschulze3787 you missed the point homie. It has become the most overused and misunderstood advice given by "Instagram runners" . I know a thing or two about running. Been at for over 30 years. I was poking fun and those who don't know their ass from a hole in the ground.
@therangersinger it's become so overused because it's one of the most fundamental concepts. Now I don't know about misunderstanding... perhaps if some people watch a video including a concept and it doesn't dive deeper into it, and they don't try to understand more about it later, I wouldn't call it misunderstanding, rather misinterpretation or misinformation.
Make the best of what you have in this life because once you are biologically dead you will face an eternity of nothingness. Don't waste your time talking to the god that you have chosen out of a thousand previous gods 🎉
Scullys Zone 2 is me running with eyeballs out of my head
Literally me at “running for my life pace” this guy makes 3.30 look like he’s running 6.00
"eyeballs out of my head" pics or it didn't happen.😁
@@morrisg5060🤣
So true
😂😂😂
After getting my first pretty bad running injury I'm mainly going to focus on zone 2 runs. My focus is health and longevity.
You look relaxed and happy.
The simplest way to say this is that 80/20, or zone 2/all higher effort workouts (including your HIIT, Hill efforts, AT or LT efforts, or even VO2 max workouts for those shorter races) is a training principle that plays out over YEARS, not just one training cycle. Yes, you can see bigger short term gains from a greater frequency of harder efforts, but you will plateau and get hurt and have a hard time moving beyond if that’s all you focus on. Similarly, ONLY zone 2 efforts is also not a magic bullet. You need both kinds of stimuli, with the vast majority being that aerobic/endurance work, to achieve the greatest success in the long term. Don’t lose the forest for the trees.
also 80/20 is interesting if you run 100km+ per weeks because you'll have 22-30km/week of intensity. But for someone with less than 50km/week, doing 10k for all your intensity is not huge. I think someone with less than 100km should also emphasis run between lt1 and lt2 (basically a bit slower than half pace but faster than marathon), and it would be more like 60 easy, 20 semi unconfortable and 20 hard
@@gauthierperrod4958 80/20 isn't meant to be a static calculation applied to a specific range or block of periodization though, it's a general principle throughout a season, or longer.
@@gauthierperrod4958 I'd also generally say that if we're talking the marathon, you'll see less intensity in general in your endurance block, and even when you start moving into more threshold training, you'll start by inserting more small bursts rather than dedicated HIIT workouts, like hill sprints or 100m accelerations in your medium-long runs, and that kind of thing. If your training is going great and you're into your final race prep phase, 80/20 doesn't even apply with all the speed work you're likely to do 😅
Appreciate the human element you bring to your content. Some days are good, some days are sh*t, some days you know you took it too easy. Luckily, we have the opportunity to try again tomorrow. Keep showing up 🙌🏼
Great message! This was my experience in a recent half marathon. I didn’t feel my best on race day and felt like I was running in sand but my solid bank of training carried me through to a great finishing time (for me). Even if I wasn’t feeling my best it truly was “Just another Sunday”. Thanks for posting.
Pretty cool that your lower zones are so durable that getting to Z2 means pushing the pace. Most people I talk to have trouble staying below Z3 at any effort because their lower zones are completely undeveloped. After a year of Z2 training and seeing less HR volatility while paces come down, I can attest that there is hope for us mere mortals!
I say it every video, but this is one of my favourites. Proper advice from a proper runner.
“Just another Sunday” is a pretty good tagline, but “work your tits off” might sell more shirts 😂
🤣
Good one mate
I would buy that one LOL...
learning about zone 2 is what got me not only into running, but whats make me able to stick with it. started bit over half a year ago where i was struggeling running 5km at 10:30min/km pace. today i did a 11.5km run at about 06:50min/km at same low maf HR, so a rather insane improvement in my opinion, and its so motivating to actually see and feel the improvement. There is no way i would believe half a year ago, that i today not only would be able to run for 11,5km straight, but do it in a way that feels easi, and where when im done with the run almost feel like i can do it all over agein, and best of all, not have my legs hurt for next 2 days. zone 2 is king:)
Race day doesn’t need to be perfect. Thank you for the reminder to put in the work. The real marathon is the training and the race is the celebration. Love your commentary.
I went from a 26 min 5K to a 19 min 5K in less than a year doing only steady runs (by time, not distance). I've added speed now, but you need a good 6 months minimum IMO to build a sufficient "base." Friends of mine are barely a week into their running journeys and are already buying fancy trainers and doing sprint sessions. I tried to tell them it's not the optimal way but I think you have to let people make their own mistakes.
That's amazing progress! How many of those runs do you incorporate in your weekly schedule and how do you structure them?
@@SHVideografie Currently I just aim to run 5-6 times a week. And at least one of them needs to be a tempo session and one long run. I do strides whenever I'm feeling stron. Typical tempo for me is 3 x 8 mins at 4:30 pace. But on my easy runs I'll just randomly do a 4:00 min K if I feel strong.
The problem with this approach and the problem that you'll run into as you start to get faster is that you need to be doing short neuromuscular sprints/ strides during these zone 2 efforts. Because running fast is just as much of a skill as it is in adaptation. I hate to break it to you by just running at zone 2. You will never develop the leg speed and turnover in order to run the speeds required to get close to like 15 or 16-minute 5K. By introducing strides, and even very short VO2 max intervals such as 30/30s or 200s and 400s you will continue to develop your base with zone 2 but also start developing the skills in order to run at higher velocities.
I'm unable to run at Zone-2 😔
It goes up no until I start to walk which takes another 2 mins to go down 😩
@@alilovic1 Mate, don't focus on Zones, it's just a fad. Use your own gut feeling as to your perceived exertion rate (PER). If you can chat comfortable, maintain strict form and fell you can go on for a long time, you're in the right energy system for "base" running. For me, that is 5:50 mins per k.
Thank you!!! An extra layer of fitness!!! I'm feeling just like this 5 weeks behind in my hm training missing runs because of a niggle that had me out. I cross training did my rehab and today I finally did ' just another Sunday ' where my fitness was good!!!
You’re an inspiration. Thank you!
Sometimes, it’s really worth the extra time to drive to a different location, especially for long runs. Running the same route every weekend for 90 to 120 minutes can get boring over time.
I needed this today… coming off the back of a very long run Sunday I have a Z2 10k today and couldn’t face it…
With Scully's physique, I feel like if he'd gone into weightlifting instead of running, he'd be an absolute monster. The dude is more jacked then half the gym bros I see around without any substantial upper body training. Genetics goldmine
He's just got a low body fat %
Dude is a twig lol
Yeah bc every distance runner looks muscled with low body fat percentage…
It’s clear he has good muscle tone my guy
@@gankhammer9926 You're right , he does have good muscle tone and some runners have less. But to call him jacked is a stretch for me. His definition is due to his low body fat and middle of the pack genetics.
the t-shirt is bang on, been using mine last few weeks...been too mild for the Anorak but used it for walks and I know that i'll love it this winter. Stryd app I sometimes just set it for 60mins on a wide range so get no pace/split data on the run and then look at it afterwards to see if my PE matched reality
Great stuff Stephen. Lots of good advice. Stickin out!
Thank you for this advice!!!
One of your best videos. Hell yeah
Great video Stephen! Keep up the inspiring work 💪🏽
Great video - love the content
You actually made me laugh with coffee in my mouth then, that moment you said when you're doing the run and you start asking yourself 'am I okay' lol been there a few times, but in this very kind of run...... I have been doing it to get my fitness back after injury and thought to myself its got me so fit why didnt I do this in a normal block - they are here to stay - these are soooooo important (Y)
Haha that’s it
Scully at his best. Fckn great video.
You need to create a short covering the “Just Another Sunday” part!
Agreed!
Would you be able do a video on warmup?
Notice you drove to get there and I drive to get to the trails, be good to know what to stretch and warmup after driving.
Your videos are the best. Inspiring and insightful. Good luck with your training.
Scully’s zone 2 run is my LT2… insane
I love when Stephen swears 😂 great advice!
Always great advice.... ❤
The bigger your base the higher your peak. Well said
Thank you for sharing!!!!!!
✨🙏🏼✨
🖤
143bpm 3:34/Km
I haven't even touched 5:00/km ....
I haven't even touched 5:00/km ....
@TreikoNimph you may be running in warmer conditions
@@ryanrobbie I didn't take it into consideration, I live where it is normally 30 to 34 degrees, but due to humidity it can feel anywhere from 35 to 39 on a hot day
@@TreikoNimph there you go. If you were running in 0 - 10 degrees, your HR would be much lower.
Great video Steve, do you classify zone 2 as the zone immediately below LT1 or is that zone 3 for you? A lot of different info out there
Yes...LT monitoring has disrupted the HR monitoring zones..to be sure ...
Zone 2 is above Lt 1, but it’s definitely below LT2
Looking good.
I can only make time for around 30km running per week. I do 3 workouts, one interval, one tempo and one long run. I feel like in my case zone 2 isnt that useful per time investment?
I'm no expert but you could also trade one interval session for another longer run, and add strides to every easy run for a bit of compensation. You could also look at a different type of schedule. Most schedules are 7 days cycles, that's mostly out of convenience. You could also do a 10day cycle to relatively put more Z2 in your schedule
I’m not sure what he defines zone 2 as, depending on what your are training for certain sessions are crucial, in general for building a base an intensity that is metabolically not stressful and maximizes your body’s rate of fat use is what most of training should be done at. Without this the other sessions can only help so much, there are many pieces to the pie.
Honestly if I only had 30km a week I’d be doing 3 hard sessions
@@JoshNishitaniI think this is what gets every TH-cam runner sprouting the benifits of zone 2. They are putting in huge mpw, way more than your average hubby runner (myself included, I average 40km/w, but I also work 50hrs a week, have a family and household to look after, and everything else that comes with life).
I'm no expert at all, but my take on zone 2/MAF/80-20, is it's great for those putting in massive mpw (daily, sometimes double daily runs) to reduce injury/fatigue/over use etc, to be able to run those huge weekly numbers and also run a meaningful number at higher intensity.
But for your hobby runner maybe running 3-4 days a week and not huge mpw, its benefits are over sold. 80% of a relatively low starting number, is at zone 2, is still a very low number. You will hardly have mpw left to get the benifits from your tempo/intervals Vo2max runs.
Also 25-30km a week in zone 2 probably isn't enough to really build a high (or low hr) zone 2 floor. You are just shuffling around for a few KMs each day, at a crazy low pace getting frustrated that you have to walk/jog or mess with your natural stride to keep the HR down.
But hey, no one wants to watch a TH-cam channel of some hobby runner plodding around for 1/2hr each run, sprouting the benifits of zone 2. So all you hear is how EVERYBODY should be doing zone 2 and if you aren't, shame on you
awesome video
the eazy breezy is most definitely crucial.
Zone 2 is very different for an elite runner compared with everyone else. Nothing says it more than Scully calling them "a joke".
Lmao, this guy has a HR of 142 on a 3:30 tempo😂 Nice video Stephen!
Would you not consider pushing it out to Seville?
Epic video
No PRO here or anything close but ~30 yrs ago I started using a HR monitor and it totally changed my finishing times ... So I think I have a clue on all these ~zones many preach here on the web get totally wrong...
--
And I'm not saying you do not know what you are talking about but in this specific video, your words make no sense.... Telling someone to go run with a purpose and not know your effort is just gonna have most of us run too hard on this day and for what gains?
In fairness, I'd say my man Scully knows a thing or two about running.......
I agree, the video makes no sense. What is he saying?
He's saying to not just run at an easy effort all the time. His definition of zone 2 is the zone up to LT1 (first threshold), so his advice is to do some runs at this effort (~3 hour race pace). Simple.
@@matthanna1980 Exatly this
@@matthanna1980 race pace is not below LT1, even if it's a 3 hour race such as a marathon, it's beneath LT2 and above LT1. If the pace had been subLT1, he wouldn't have felt "bad" towards the end. So most likely the pace of this run was above LT1.
Excluding the Olympics what other opportunities are there to represent Ireland in the marathon distance?
I thought zone 2 was 'easy' running, in a 5 zone model, zone 1 is recovery ?!
Z1 is recovery (for pros) and super easy (maybe walking for untrained). Z2 it´s some effort, but very long sustainable.
@@jcsk8 Any kind of work is an effort, there is no such thing as a recovery run: recovery is recovery, not a light run. The reason why you can't keep an effort in Z2 for ever isn't because of the effort itself (Z2 you are not accumulating lactate), it's because after some time you can not replenish the calories (energy) you have consumed...
There is plenty of runners that distinguish recovery and zone 2. A lot seem to believe it below 70% of mhr. Try it, if you don’t see a distinction from some 2 idk what to tell ya mate.
I think its because elite runners in zone 2 are still going at such a fast pace it puts biomechanical strain on the body, so although HR for them is low, there is a need to slow down to prevent injury. I don't have this problem 😂
@@patrickschulze3787 I wouldn´t say there´s no recovery run as I´m not a pro, but most of the pro´s does this. I walk for a running recovery and feels better than if I just rest. In clycling lowpace/low miles does wonders for your recovery. The blood flows really helps.
Thank you sir so much.............
I enjoy my runs without listening to a watch as well. Push yourself to the point you and your body agree on, and then later use the watch to quantify how hard it actually might be something. We are not machines. If you go after the watch you might leave a gallon in the tank on some days. On others, you keep grinding broken gears.
I think the difficulty is that for typical hobby runners, zone 2 is a very easy effort but for elite athletes, zone 2 is actually quite a hard pace. I run uktras and reasonably well but I still can't run at any pace below zone 2 so there's no difference between easy and zone 2
It doesn't make sense, by definition Z2 isn't a comfortable pace zone?
Yes. It’s the pace just faster than true recovery pace imo. But not the dreaded zone between easy(obviously) and sub threshold. If you just avoid that zone you should be good although there are times where that zone is beneficial as well.
@@antoniovitor643what do you mean it’s not comfortable? It should be very comfortable. Stephen seems very confused about z2.. telling people to “run z2 with intent” or “get stuck in”.. very confusing messages. Z2 is conversation pace and nothing more. Use the MAFF 180 formula, it’s easy. No need to overcomplicate
Z2 isn’t hard for elite runners.. it’s exactly the same effort as for hobby joggers.. elites just go faster. Stephens z2 advice is very misleading.
For normal people zone 2 equates to 'easy pace', but for proper elite athletes they can run at a z2 HR range at a pace for a normal person would be hard to sustain for a short period of time. So although HR is not high, that pace puts strain on the body if doing every day so elite athletes have to go down to Z1 (and would still be running)
Reminds of the medium long runs by Kelvin Kiptum
Zone 2 is more important than any other type of running imo
Champion 💪
Coach : I’m in you marathon training , what race distance should I do for week 11 of the training 16 weeks
Is that oversize tee for sale? Don't see it on the website
You can't be upset about the conditions if you weren't prepared and, if you were prepared, you wouldn't be upset. Do the work and get paid on Friday.
Sent an email to your merch store and never got a response. Everything looks awesome, but just want to confirm, you don't ship to Japan?
I always thought Z2 was easy jogging - are you saying it should be a bit more of an effort? 😊
You should come do the Karachi Marathon in January
What foot pod are you using that works with Garmin Scully ?
What would you tell one of your athletes if they were in the same situation ? Enjoy the process man
From how the run effort is described, I think Scully is talking about Zone2 of a three zone model. In other words just below LT2, ie threshold run. It's as confusing as all hell because most people assume Zone 2 to be that of the five zone model which is the LT1. Needs clarification from Scully. What is he describing?
I will have to post again, but a few things.. for me this is below LT1, it’s just a very very long career that’s now enabled me to run at faster speeds with a decent heart rate 145-50 and stay well below LT1. LT1 is 160-64 hr or thereabouts, and LT2, 164-72 I’d imagine. Unless I’m going longer, then heart rate would drift. The purpose of a good steady run, isn’t always ZONE 2 malarkey.. it’s just coincidence that I’d be right at zone 2, but this is just an effort for me that I have to work a bit, ie it’s not easy.. it’s true that for most people to nail down zone 2 work in a 5-7 model system, ie below LT1, then you’d have to operate at a very low speed and it wouldn’t feel hard at all.. that’s not what I’m encouraging you do. There may well be benefits to that, but I didn’t get good by doing that. I believe physiology can be persuaded to shift when we push it, and so you might benefit from runs that progress in effort and it’s possible zone 2 might play a role in some of that run, but likely to get a stimulus like I did today, including psychology, then you’ll have to push, and ignore zone this or that. I finish a run like today, and sure enough my stupid lactate is 1.0 or 1.1, and sure enough I’d be zone 2, below LT1, but it’s NOT an easy day, or a basic jog, I’m working and therefore at the end I’m happy to be done.
At what percentage of max heart rate or threshold do you run them?
Do you think this type of work is important for milers? I'm looking to break 4 in the mile (currently at 4:05) and self-coaching.
I tried zone 2, still on 150/160 heart rate. I was so slow, can't get it why the high bpm.
Will zone 2 runs be beneficial for an 800 meter competitor?
Not as much. A lot depends on 4/8 v. 8/15. It is worth doing a higher volume cycle or two to delineate your capacity.
What HR effort is zone 2? I thought that was easy according to my garmen
I read somewhere on google that zone 3 (aerobe) on garmin watch hr monitor is actually zone 2.
Proud to be wearing my 26.2 Vest and representing this mindset, in a world full of half-assed “training”. Most people have no clue what it’s like to WORK. Keep it up Scully🙏🏼 I banked 34km today with 15km at MP 💪🏼
Increased happiness is always good =D! Love doing Z2 runs.
So you are doing tempo running.... Why are we changing the terminology here?
I wish 3.30/km pace looked like that for me. Instead I’m on the ground after 5k 😂
Continuous 350W+ running power...
I'm dead at 200W.
Nah cmon dude… 😮.. 240w is an easy jog 200w would feel like walking
@@davidm8394 I wish
I don't really understand because when I think zone 2,it means easy jog to me. You're saying to be intentional and get stuck in.
Yeah be intentional get stuck in, don’t worry about a label or zone
@@stephenscullion262 so just "get stuck in" and run at some arbitrary pace/effort?
🤷🏼♂️ video title was just for shits and giggles
ye so whats his tempo pace then.. wtf
I love Scully but I was confused about zone 2 before I found his channel and since finding it I have literally no idea what it means anymore.
10 minutes of talking and not one word actually adressing the title...
Awful video
@@stephenscullion262😂 terrible... 😜 great video m8 to hell with bullshitters doin great m8.
@@stephenscullion262 mate, I don’t mean it in a hateful way, maybe just take it as a bit of constructive criticism?
For 3/4 of the video, I wasn’t even sure what type of run you were doing and talking about, cause you kept saying things like „such a run is not easy“, „putting in a good effort“ without actually naming the type of run you mean.
For a normal runner like me that was quite confusing as zone 2 runs for me normally mean the very opposite of what you said.
In combination with the title it seemed you were talking about some other type of run (that’s maybe more important than zone 2) but were purposefully delaying actually naming it.
Again, not meant to hate at all, you are obviously a great runner and very knowledgeable. And I actually like this training log with some wisdom sprinkled in video style, but maybe give them more fitting titles?
@@nothingEvil101he says steady from the get go. Zone 2 = steady. He’s not gonna do a zone breakdown on every video.
@@chrismoyse2308 yes, but as I said he also talks about how it‘s not easy and about putting in some effort. Sounds a lot more like zone 3 or threshold to me, which still falls under „steady pace“
3,30 m/km 143 HR ,this Is fuckin insane
Subbed
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I don’t understand the difference. Your HR looks z2 but you are saying it’s not an “easy” or z2 run? Huh? Hmmmm?
just because it looks z2 doesn't mean it is,as his hr is different than everyone else's... it also might be on the edge between z2/z3, perhaps he is also fatigued so it's not going up that much. On top of all of this and most importantly, even though his hr is saying one thing, his lactate might be saying another. He actually might be above LT1, therefore it can not be easy. I do not know if he is above LT1...so I agree there are a lot of unclear things...
@@patrickschulze3787 yea I just want to know what it means for my runs? Does that mean I should be doing more z3 type work? Just under lactate or just leaving z2?
@@rz9wb Z3 based on 5 model HR is above LT1 (it might not necessarily begin exactly at that threshold, but it will be around it by very little). If you wish to have the same adaptations with Z3 that you would have with Z4, you would have to do 2-3h+ long workouts. So you either have less benefits or very high strain. Z2 is under LT1, even if you are at high Z2 you are not accumulating lactate (kinda). If you can do a lot of volume you can afford to do Z1, otherwise I recommend pushing Z2 to its limit to have more adaptations. If work below lactate means below LT1, then of course you should do (and a lot) of it, if you instead meant below LT2, as I've said before, I recommend pushing towards LT2 for shorter times over a lot of work closer to LT1
@@rz9wb but at the end of the day, I recommend an experienced coach who can guide you through your workouts monthly to achieve your personal goals in the best way. It's cool to know the science and it's easy to find it nowadays, but it's difficult to apply it in the real world with 1000 variables, which a coach can do in person.
Note zone 2 for a pro or a fast runner is not an easy run unlike 95% of hobbyjoggers
Yes I need to explain this
I built my entire success around this and since I’ve gone to high school and had a different coach he’s very set on no zone 2, I’m convinced that zone two and double build insane fitness
Many non-elite runners avoid what they consider to be this “gray zone.”
I would like to know if the run in the video was above LT1. If it was below LT1, it's not in the grey zone. The problem with runs in the grey zone is that to have sufficient benefit from it, you would have to do a LOT of work in it...by a lot, I mean 2-3 hours of total accumulated work per session, which obviously is very strenuous, so it can be quite clear why it is avoided.
@@patrickschulze3787he said steady so maybe yes but you can ask him 🤣
And why the swearing?
Running is not about the time, but about the distance.
This dude is allergic to getting to the point. Talks in circles with endless b-roll and inane yapping. Gotta get that 10 minute runtime somehow I guess LOL
That zone 2 shit is for base building. If its race season and your ass is still following that instagram 80/20 rule you might as well set those PRs aside.
it's not an instagram rule...I kindly ask you to go do some research about 80/20 and polarized vs pyramidal training. (not saying one is inherently better than the other...but it can be based on variables that depend on each athlete)
@@patrickschulze3787 you missed the point homie. It has become the most overused and misunderstood advice given by "Instagram runners" . I know a thing or two about running. Been at for over 30 years. I was poking fun and those who don't know their ass from a hole in the ground.
@therangersinger it's become so overused because it's one of the most fundamental concepts. Now I don't know about misunderstanding... perhaps if some people watch a video including a concept and it doesn't dive deeper into it, and they don't try to understand more about it later, I wouldn't call it misunderstanding, rather misinterpretation or misinformation.
First
I love running but We must find time for Christ as well!..If Sundays are just to benefit your body which won’t mean much when we die
😂😂😂
GTFO with that nonsense
Such a sad way to live the only life you’ve got
No we don't
Make the best of what you have in this life because once you are biologically dead you will face an eternity of nothingness. Don't waste your time talking to the god that you have chosen out of a thousand previous gods 🎉
stephen i wonder how old you was when you started?
Always great advice.... ❤