Mystery SOLVED! When to start the heel for a toe-up sock // Technique Tuesday
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 3 ก.ค. 2024
- This video explains how to calculate the length of a toe up sock heel so you can start it at the right time. How to calculate the length of short row heels, peasant/afterthought heels, and heel flap and gusset constructions are explained.
Playlist of all my sock-related videos: • Socks
Playlist of just sock heel videos: • Sock Heels
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If you have questions about this video, or suggestions for future videos, please let me know down in the comments or on social media.
0:00 Introduction
0:29 Basic Formula
1:04 Short row heels
5:03 Short row heel with gusset
6:57 Peasant/afterthought heels
9:06 Heel flap and gusset
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I'm adhd and I start seeing stars while you're giving your excellent instruction. I therefore appreciate having a worksheet so I can figure it out. Thanks
I literally just Googled when to start the heel in a toe up sock, and this video popped up. I noticed that you posted it less than 20 minutes ago, so I think you read my mind!
Roxy knits and she knows things.
Me too
me too
This is an absolutely important aspect of sock knitting that one needs to learn to get the right fit. Thanks always Roxanne for your very comprehensive teaching methods.
I have been struggling with this subject. You have made it so simple. Thank you so very much.
I cannot thank you enough for this! As much as I love toe up socks, I've always struggled with where to start the heel. You taken a topic that, before watching this video, was a massive struggle for me and explained it perfectly! Much appreciated!
Yey! First to comment. So, when you were knitting the Beloved bonnet, I was sitting there knitting a Beloved bonnet. This week, you are talking about when to start a heel on toe up socks, while I am scratching my head working out how to tell when to start the heels on my toe up socks that I am knitting….spooky
this is how Roxanne does Halloween 👻
Oh my goodness - you are a saint. This is the biggest problem for me. Thank you!!
When I'm knitting socks "on spec" for charity or when I can't do individual fittings, I've had great help of the kind of shoe insoles that you're supposed to cut to size and therefore has the different foot sizes marked out on the surface.
This is a great tip!!!!! Thanks for sharing
My inner math nerd just glowed! Thank you so much!! And now I can't wait to go home and finally break down and knit a pair of socks that I know will fit me properly.
Thanks Roxanne all these calculations surely help to make perfect fitting socks. Even for two feet not exactly the same size. ;-) My friend Denyse has a difference of half an inch betweeen her two feet, she loves my custom fitted socks. ;-)
I am so much more clearer with your methods and just so fascinated to try out all those heels!
This video solves a huge mystery for me - this problem always kept me away from sock knitting. THANK YOU!
I was wondering how to make my short row heels fit better for toe up and I never knew to actually add a few rows of gusset to help with that. Thank you!
Wow! Thank you. Understanding the reason why really clears things up.
Your videos are always so helpful! I am always delighted when I have a question and see you have posted an answer.
Interesting. I will be using these. I haven’t knitted socks in a long time so this is great info
Very interesting stuff Roxanne! I’m sure I’ll be playing this video over and over. Thanks for sharing your vast knowledge with us!🤗
I try the sock on and eyeball it. It works every time.
Thank you for sharing your basic formula. I have been struggling with this and have had trouble getting advice.
Thanks for all the help
Thanks for another helpful video, Roxanne! I was hesitant to start knitting my first pair of toe up socks for this reason and you broke it down so clearly. Definitely makes me more excited and confident : )
Thank you so much for this heel calculation. Just what I needed.
Thank you from Denmark ❤️
Slap my head moment🙀…thank you!
Thank you.♡ i actually understood this.
I love knitting toe ups but they wont fit my high arches. This video is a total game changer for my future socks!
Perfect video for me thank you 😊
I am so thankful for this video! I just started making socks and I am trying to figure this exact thing out. I'll have to look through your videos to see if you have any tips on how to avoid holes in the toes when increasing :)
I pull little tighter when doing increases, just make sure your gauge isn't too loose. Atleast that worked for me I know this is an older comment but thought if others had same question
Danke!
You're welcome! :-)
This is so helpful - it seems so intuitive when you present it this way. One question - how much negative ease do you factor into the length of a sock? So, when you have a 9.75” sock length as described in this tutorial, how long is the actual foot length?
I've found Roxannes answer to this question: "There is a note at the 0:36 mark that mentions the length of the sock is typically the same as the length of the foot. This assumes you are a) knitting to a firm gauge and b) with negative ease in the sock circumference. The yarn ball band usually indicates a gauge that would be recommended for a stockinette sweater, which is too loose for socks. For example, a yarn like Regia would say 30 sts over 4''/10 cm (7.5 sts/in), but for socks, a gauge of 8.5-9 sts/in would be more suitable. A sock yarn that indicates a range (e.g. 7-8 sts/in) should be knit to the gauge at the higher end (or even a bit firmer). The circumference of the foot of the sock should be 10% smaller than the ball of your foot. The firm gauge, combined with negative ease in the circumference should cause the length of the sock to shorten, which in turn will force the sock to have to stretch in the length to fit. You want the sock to have to stretch to fit so that it isn't loose and sloppy on your foot."
I hope this will help you :)
@@lydiah.7016 Thank you for this and the time you spent putting this together. Super helpful.
Whats theattern of the sweater you are wearing now? And where to get a copy? I have been looking for one like it where ever there are knitting patterns. Maybe I was just miss- understood. Thank you aheard of time!!!🎉😊 love your teaching!!!❤😊😊😊
I didn't understand the part about dividing the 32 heel stitches into 3 parts if we are only to consider the heel bottom length. So would there only be one short row length to consider?
How do you knit a toe up gusset and heel flap sock like the one you showed and the one without the heel turn?
Aaaaah!!! Thank you!!!!!! Now I get it!!!! It’s easy when you can try it on (if it’s for you) but to gift a sock when you only know a shoe size? This will definitely help! Thank you thank you!!!
I love sock math.
Love, love, love your videos. So much information! Hoping you can help me with this problem. I have knit several of pairs of top down socks, only to discover that the top ribbing is far too tight. (Lesson learned! Try them on before making a second, third, etc..pair, dofus! LOL!) Is there any way to salvage them without undoing the entire sock?
Have you tried italian cast on?
I really think it helps to have a good basic book on socks that gives all sizes on all types of yarn. My favorite is Ann Budd's Getting Started Knitting Socks. I love it; these are all heel flap and gusset which is my favorite heel. My only complaint is that it is designed for socks to be knit with four DPNs. I prefer to knit with five DPNs. These are all top down socks which I prefer. I have tried toe up and don't like them. MY QUESTION: Do you know of any other such Basic sock book that might address other peoples favorite styles of sock knitting such as toe up, magic loop, other heels etc.? I would be interested to know of other Basic sock instruction books and if you have any. The idea of calculating and spread sheeting every sock does NOT appeal to AT ALL. Thank you so much for all your videos. I find them so interesting and helpful. PLEASE LET US KNOW YOUR FAVORITE SOCK BOOKS IN AN UPCOMING EPISODE. THANK YOU.
Question: What would you do if your heel measurement is over 2 inches? Mine is 2.25" and my husband's is 2.5". On the one had, with my gauge (8st and approx 12rnds/inch), my heel is shorter than what is called for for a heel flap, but longer than what a short row or afterthought heel would make.
For heel flaps and gusset construction, I knit the flap to the length needed for that person. For short row heels and peasant heels, I knit a gusset to increase the number of sts needed based on the heel diagonal. I have many videos on modifying sock heels on my channel, as well as a written tutorial on knitting custom fit socks. Playlist on SR heels/peasant heels here: th-cam.com/play/PL1AZxTfSCe2ffOceDdBApIMUjkwS2sD1P.html
August Sock KAL tutorial here: www.ravelry.com/patterns/library/august-sock-kal
Roxanne, did you knit this cardi for yourself? If so, I'm wondering why it was necessary to roll up the sleeves/cuffs. Unless one is a growing child (with a bit of extra length knitted in for the first year of wear) my thought is that one can achieve the Perfect Fit, right down to fractions of an inch in size....
That's the WWI-era sweater I knit as part of my long term project to knit a sweater from each decade. There's always a link to any knitted thing I'm wearing down in the show notes. If you follow the link, you'll see that the original pattern had turned-back cuffs. Just as I sometimes knit hats that have ribbing long enough to fold back, I sometimes knit my sleeve cuffs with that goal, as well. This was one of those times.
I'm having some anxiety about starting the shadow wrap heel, my husband wears a size 13 shoe. His heel is narrow, but his feet are long. 😅
The information that I have never been able to find is: how long should the entire sock be relative to your foot?
There is a note at the 0:36 mark that mentions the length of the sock is typically the same as the length of the foot. This assumes you are a) knitting to a firm gauge and b) with negative ease in the sock circumference. The yarn ball band usually indicates a gauge that would be recommended for a stockinette sweater, which is too loose for socks. For example, a yarn like Regia would say 30 sts over 4''/10 cm (7.5 sts/in), but for socks, a gauge of 8.5-9 sts/in would be more suitable. A sock yarn that indicates a range (e.g. 7-8 sts/in) should be knit to the gauge at the higher end (or even a bit firmer). The circumference of the foot of the sock should be 10% smaller than the ball of your foot. The firm gauge, combined with negative ease in the circumference should cause the length of the sock to shorten, which in turn will force the sock to have to stretch in the length to fit. You want the sock to have to stretch to fit so that it isn't loose and sloppy on your foot.
I am a new sock knitter Ms. Richardson and I'm trying to understand the math needed for a good fit. After watching this video I am wondering why in your first example of a short row heel with out the gusset stitches, you suggested dividing the number of stiches by approx. 1/3 to get the number of heel rows (36 - 10 center =26 heel rows) but in the example of adding additional rows to allow for a gusset increase, you did not divide your heel rows into thirds to subtract the center stitches from the heel row count. I do not have the brain for sock knitting so I am assuming that the answer is obvious, but I'm stuck and will appreciate your response if you have time. Thank YOU!!
One third of the original number of sts gives you enough width at the base of your heel where the sock turns the corner. The reason for the gusset is to add length to the heel and additional circumference around the heel diagonal, which is needed if you have a high instep/arch. Having a high instep doesn't make your heel wider, so you don't need to change the amount of sts in that center third. In addition, if you increase the width of that center part of the heel, you reduce the number of rows the heel will be worked, and therefore its length.
@@RoxanneRichardson so kind. Many thanks. I may be a sock knitter in spite of myself
Excellent knowledge as always..in your honest sock guru opinion, what is the easiest heel for a toe up..I'm way to confused by so many different styles..thx👍🧶
I'm obviously not Roxanne, but here are my two Eurocents. First, it's all going to depend on the shape of your instep and heel. If you have a high instep, a standard short-row heel might not be the best fit for you. The one that's worked best for me this far, both in terms of fit and level of difficulty is a short-row heel with initial increases. Say that you're using four-ply sock yarn and 2 to 2.5 mm needles. In that case, increase two stitches in the sides of the sole half of the sock every second row. Knitting four increase rows (8 extra stitches) works for me, giving me the extra height I need. Then work the short rows according to the method that you prefer, and once your heel is completed, decrease the number of stitches back to the original count, or the width you need to fit your ankle. There's a sock playlist among the videos Roxanne has uploaded, the video you'll need for this technique is called Improving heel fit with heel increases.
@@elisabethkronqvist3987 thanks but I don't have a high instep.I do have a small foot and am just looking for a simple heel to make..thx for sharing..
@@elisabethkronqvist3987 Thank you SO much! I really appreciate your comment on the higher instep/modifying SR heels. This suggestion could go either way - larger or smaller, depending upon the heel.
I always struggle with getting enough room in the gusset for my high-instep that I didn't even know I had until I began knitting socks! Isn't that funny?
Again - thanks for your tips for the SR heel types.
How do you determine the number of gusset stitches to increase for fit? You used 6 stitches but what if more is needed. What is the calculation?
It depends on a combination of what type of heel you're knitting, and the measurements of the sock recipient. I have quite a few videos that demonstrate how to make these modifications for different types of heels. You can find them in the Sock Heels playlist on my channel. th-cam.com/play/PL1AZxTfSCe2fj0ONuDlcVEz45wHDoldOa.html
Why is it so common for the flap of a heel flap and gusset to be at the back not the bottom of the foot? To me it seems like the extra thick fabric of the slip stitches would make sense to be under the foot where, in my case, I get holes in regular socks. Does it make a difference in how the heel fits the foot if it's done flap on the bottom and gusset on the ankle?
The slip stitch pattern used for sock heels is a recent addition to heel flap and gusset sock construction (WWI). For centuries prior to that, cuff down construction with a large stockinette heel was ubiquitous (as many rows as there were heel sts, which would create a 3'' flap from a 4'' heel/8'' sock). Various methods of turning the heel were used to control number of sts at the start of the gusset to ensure a good fit for people with high arches vs flat feet. Socks were sometimes knit in the round for the leg, with instep and sole knit flat and seamed at the side, to allow knitting a new sole. 3 needle bind off was used to close the toe, which is easier to undo than grafting. In other words, socks were knit in a way that allowed repair/partial reknitting easier to do when the sock was past the darning stage.
If you'd like the slip stitch flap on the sole, you can knit the sock toe up, ending the foot at the point where you want to start your flap, knit the flap, turn the heel (which will appear at the base of the heel on the leg). The gusset will then be worked up the leg, rather than down. So if you normally knit your heel flap for 2.5'', then knit the foot until it's 2.5'' shorter than what you want before starting the flap.
For your existing socks, you can reinforce them to add longevity. I did a video on how to do this a few weeks ago. th-cam.com/video/E9nNkqLxdhE/w-d-xo.html
Using a yarn containing nylon helps with longevity. Knitting to a gauge that is firmer than what the ball band states will all extend the life of your socks as well (e.g. if it says 7.5 sts/in, knit at 8.5-9 sts/in)
@@RoxanneRichardson Thank you! I prefer toe up and recently quit using short row heels because the instep becomes too tight and I can't adjust quite as easily as with the heel flap and gusset. I always to the flap on the bottom but I'm curious, with my modifications, would it fit the same or different depending on the flap at the back or the bottom....hmmmm....maybe I'll have to work on socks this weekend :)
If my Fleegle Heel leaves the sock stretched too tightly in the heel diagonal, do I need to add more increases to the gusset?
I was wondering this also.
On adding the 6 rows of gusset for the 6 stitches of increase, are those 6 rows worked on the instep and heel side?
Typically, yes, the instep is maintained as 50% of the sts knit for the foot and leg, while the gusset and sole change shape to provide more room.
@@RoxanneRichardson thanks. I’m quite new and have many things in my head. I appreciate all your help.
Do you have a more detailed video about adding in a gusset? I made two attempts. One question : when making increases and the decreases, I don’t really know the proper method. Ex. When I increase, Do I do a make one right when on the right side etc. and do I do a SSK when making a decrease on the right side. Also do I start decreasing the 6 stitches when I start the knitting in the round? I prefer the toe up socks but I like your idea of making more room for a better fit.
Will this work for all short row heels? Such as shadow wrap or fish lips kiss heel?
The point is to calculate the number of rows it will take to knit the heel up to the point where it turns the corner. That will work regardless of the type of short row technique.
I have been knitting for a long time but only recently doing custom socks and hats. Will you please advise where I can find the written form you used to calculate the number of rows. I was able to get one for hat calculation. Thank you.
I created it for the purposes of demonstration in the video. I didn't put a copy on google drive. You could create one yourself, using the one in the video as a guideline.
@@RoxanneRichardson
Thank you. One more question, is there a negative ease on the length of the socks? I read somewhere that negative ease is only calculated on the circumference measurement?
@@nazmaramjaun2077 I don't use negative ease for mine. When you have negative ease in the circumference, the socks have to stretch to fit, which naturally shortens the sock lengthwise. In other words, you naturally get negative ease in the length when you provide it in the circumference.
@@RoxanneRichardson Thank you so much. You confirmed what I though too.
In your examples, there's no stated compensation for negative ease. Do you simply subtract 0.5 to 1.0 inches from the total foot length?
I don't subtract any length for negative ease. The combination of a firm gauge and negative ease in the circumference is enough for a good fit.
I like to knit my socks to the actual length of my foot. I do factor in negative ease, but only around 10% for the circumference (that's in the stich gauge not row gauge).
What about the Fleegle heel?
I mentioned that briefly when I discussed heel flap and gusset construction. The gusset increases continue up to the heel. There is no "heel turn" to measure.
I like a short sock (negative ease). I stop 2 inches short of my foot length. Not scientific, butt works for me.
That's a lot of math and thinking and paperwork and stuff. I rather like to eyeball it and take it from there; measure it to the foot or the corresponding body part of what I'm making and just git 'er done.
I am an impatient and intrepid learner, I like to jump right in with the attitude of sink 'r swim, determined to make it to the shore.