I’m an oncologist and this is true. One of the biggest jokes in America is our healthcare is tied to employment so when you can’t work you lose what’s healthcare you have….. I’ve had metastatic patients go back to work because otherwise they don’t have healthcare to continue care. It breaks my heart and makes me a card carrying member of nationalized healthcare.
Think about joining PNHP It's a physician organization advocating for single payor. I have seen patients get let go lose their jobs and insurance because of hospitalizations for surgical complications after trauma.
My wife had spinal surgery. We are fortunate to be "well" insured. We had not met our deductible at the time of surgery so a good portion of the procedure was paid out of pocket. My wife's procedure was more expensive than our home. my wife's procedure was MORE EXPENSIVE THAN OUR HOME.
I almost died last year and spent a week in the hospital. So glad I live in Europe and did not have to give it any thought financially. Yes we pay taxes but it covers everything. And there is no limit on sick days. "sick days" are just days where you are sick.
I admire so much that she decided to pause the treatment until she got an answer from the insurance company about the cost, you have to survive at any cost but also have a cool head to think if I am going to leave the family in extreme poverty, Olivia you are a very brave woman.
People in Canada love love love to complain about our "broken health care system" but all we have to do is watch a story like this realize how good we have it. My dad was in the hospital for 7 days due to a COPD crisis and we paid $0. Single payer health care man...
6 หลายเดือนก่อน +28
My father was just diagnosed with brain cancer after he had a sudden seizure. He’s almost done 36 rounds of treatment to see if we can prolong his life. We are still in shock. When we were visiting him at the hospital we kept saying we’re so lucky to be living in Canada and have free healthcare. ♥️ What the U.S. does wrong is privatize everything, everything is about profit.
And my American family asks why I was thrilled to become an Australian citizen. True freedom is not worrying about anyone in your family getting really sick AND being able to change your job at any time without thinking about how that affects your health insurance.
I remember looking at the hospital bill from my nephrectomy in 2018 after kidney cancer diagnosis. The robotic assisted surgery and 3-days in the hospital was about $140,000. The ER visit in which I was diagnosed was over $80k. Out of pocket that cancer cost me about $10k. All of these are numbers that would easily bankrupt someone. This system is a nightmare that this country desperately needs to wake up from.
Fortunately the numbers you get quoted do not show the discounts given to people who arent going through insurance billing. Unforunately, the cost is m still astronomical. I have had 2 bouts with cancer and was accidently billed for a few procedures as if I didnt have insurance. All those bills showed a 50% discount of the initial price for not having insurance.
@@ghostlyMostly1 This game we play with medical pricing should be illegal. No other industry is allowed to just make up their prices after the fact, nor give 2 different prices to 2 different people. The health insurance industry spends billions lobbying to keep it this way. We are being murdered by this criminal organization.
@@ghostlyMostly1 But the initial price is in tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars for things that cost a minuscule fraction of it. Being charged $200 for a sandwich is only better than being charged $500 for it. It's price gouging either way.
I didn't have cancer, but I had 2 rounds of brain surgery, too. What this guest said, spot on. The anesthesiologist that was selected for my procedure wasn't in my network. Tried to charge me almost 10k. Fought it for a year. I had no choice as I was asleep for the surgery. Insurance was like, why didn't you get pre approved??? Me, my doctor, and others jumped through hoops. Our system is ridiculous.
This sounds like a nightmare. I don't live in the US and my mom went through cancer, and paid only for a private second opinion. Even the transportation to the hospital was covered by the government. It's crazy that people in such a wealthy country need to deal with it on top of the illness itself.
It took me 6 years to get diagnosed with a rare form of chronic pancreatitis. I was in and out of hospitals and specialists and nearly died twice. I remember sobbing in my bed in the hospital so badly that they sent psych to come in and talk to me. I wasn't upset about my diagnosis. I was terrified of the debt and the pysch just recommended medical bankruptcy. It took me 10 years to pay off.
Thank you for covering this - chronic illnesses are something that are rarely talked about in terms of finances. I see too many financial professionals/experts frame saving and expenses as a choice and something within your control, when that’s not the case when you have health issues. I’m almost 32 and would be a lot further ahead financially if I didn’t have so many health issues from a young age. My medical bills can cost anywhere from 15-40% of my income.
This is so timely. I recently had a mammogram, and they asked me to come back for further imaging. They advised me the follow-up was $400.00. I have it on my HSA, but I couldn't help but think of people who needed didn't have it. It's stressful enough to need to follow up and now add financial stress. I'm glad your guest is ok.
My wisdom teeth removal cost 900 out of pocket and if I didn’t have my hsa or had I needed to use it in the past year that I’ve started working, I would be struggling.
I live in Europe but work for an international insurance company and process health claims from both the US and the EU… and omg the difference. It breaks my heart on a daily basis….
Thank you for making a video on this . I was in my early 20s when I was diagnosed with breast cancer .The most hurtful thing was having "financial counselors" who I thought were friends reach out or use what happened to me as a reason sign up for their financial counseling . I've seen wealthy couples in the cancer community go broke .not just me and my partner who were both working full time,in college, and had a savings .fuck cancer
I am from Canada and my mom was diagnosed with stage 3 breast cancer in 2021. She had so many scans, chemo, radiation, and surgery for $0. She continues to be on medication that she doesn't pay for. In Canada you don't even see a bill. We have our problems here too, but when it was required to save her life the system moved fast and didn't financially punish her for something out of her control. I will always be thankful for that.
My aunt actually has cancer and it’s bad to the point they forego treatment and she is just going on some fun trips with her family while she still has the time
Honestly, this is the way to go, I think. It's so dire, but it's our reality now. I hope your aunt is able to enjoy what time she has left. She's courageous and brave for meeting her end so gracefully.
Wow, I can't believe there is discussion about this on this channel! I had cancer several years ago in my early 20s, and while I had a lot of support from my family during that time, the financial impact has been immense. Obviously, the physical trauma of the actual illness has totally transformed my life, but I think a lot of people can't begin to imagine how much of a financial toll it takes because of how insanely expensive it is. One thing that is hard to imagine is how much of a long-term drain on your finances it can be. I had it 7 years ago, but the complications of having it, along with the increased preventative maintenance (e.g. copays for specialists, follow up scans, corrective surgeries needing inpatient stays, medications, etc.) are things I still have to deal with to this day. And this is coming from someone who doesn't even currently have medical debt. Depending on the cancer and how the treatment debilitates you physically, mentally, emotionally, and financially, it can become something that you can never fully move on from.
I work in case management and also have a background in medical billing. The reason the staff couldn't tell you the price is because of insurance. Each insurance company has a contract with the hospital and they set the price per insurance contracts. How you find out the price call the billing office at the hospital and ask for the self pay price. Also if you can't pay as for a HCAP application and or Medicaid review. Social worker/ Case Management can help with resources.
My mother got diagnosed at stage 4 of neuroendocrine cancer in June 2022. She had emergency surgery due to an ulcer and had to learn to walk again. She went back to work that November. Due to health she had to stop working February 2024 she lost all of her benefits. She did get Medicaid but due to an error they thought she was still working and canceled her insurance. She fought on the phone with them everyday while she went two months with no treatment. I just got the bill for her ambulance $660. My mother passed last Wednesday June 19th 2024. We’ll never know if her not having insurance to treat the cancer made her decline even faster. The offices and PET scan facilities canceled her appointments due to inactive insurance. Money can’t cure cancer but it can take the stress off of worrying of bills so the sick can focus on health and recovery.
And putting the onus on sick patients to battle against insurance bureaucracy probably causes so much stress to them that it can contribute to their death. Stress does kill. This system is inhumane.
The American healthcare system is such a joke. Not even Olivia and her husband who make a pretty good income could barely afford it. It’s disgusting and I wish someone or something would actually make change.
I have the utmost respect for brain surgery survivors. My father had to have two craniectomies last year due to a brain infection and although he is still recovering, he is almost back to normal. And the bills were astronomical. Thank goodness he lives in California and qualified for Medi-Cal. They covered everything. Otherwise, I don't know how we would have done it. One sub part to an individual going through a major life threatening illness is the impact it has on family as well. A lot of hospitals rely on family to do the caregiving at home if there is additional treatment needed after. Thank God I WFH and was able to look after my father once he was discharged from the hospital, but it was taxing on my mental health to work full time and look after him and administer antibiotics on a strict schedule. Our medical system is extremely flawed and it's shameful that with how much these treatments cost, we get the bare minimum.
Thank you for this episode. I don't think the general population realizes how much cancer costs. I'm a cancer survivor. I was young and on my parent's insurance and got a lot of help from children's cancer organizations, but my mom said she would estimate the pre-insurance cost of the 3 months I was in the hospital (not including the 2 years of outpatient treatment) was a million dollars (in 2006)! I now have dozens of friends in the cancer world, and there are constantly new Go Fund Me's to help cover costs. It's completely unacceptable that people who are going through the most difficult time in their lives have to ask their friends and family to pay for it or else they have to pause treatments or move of their house or skip paying other bills. Our healthcare system is a cruel joke.
Maybe it's my PMS but her recounting all the help from the community had me in tears. I think when faced with such predatory systems the notion of having community and then sharing it is what restores some dignity to this world.
This is the most valuable discussion on TH-cam. Nobody should have to go through this and it’s scary to know that this could happen to any of us. How do we change the system? Let’s all scream in the streets!!! And the community support is excellent too.
I was diagnosed with an orphan lung disease ten years ago. I have spent way too much time since then in the ICU and step-down units. It is expensive (not to mention lonely and depressing). You're supposed to be focused on getting healthy, but then there are the bills and dealing with insurance issues. It gets so stressful.
As an Oncologist , this was super insightful to watch. Olivia was very fortunate, but the reality is more grim for most patients. I see how my financially stable patients and those with social support tend to do relatively better than those without. It’s unfortunate that we’re still lacking in transparency regarding cost, but I’m very well aware of the financial toxicity of cancer treatment, much less healthcare in general.
I resonate with this so much...I've actually had to do bankruptcy due to medical bills. Our medical and insurance systems need an overhaul. Now, I can't afford the insurance plans where I work, so I hope to goodness that nothing happens to me going forward.
She made a good point on life insurance. After my husband's diagnosis with heart failure, it's impossible to now increase it or get another policy. If you are healthy, maximize your life insurance now!
My mom got cancer. We live in Mexico. The process was the same. You can go through the public “free” healthcare system but it is a nightmare because they don’t work with insurance, everything is free but you have to wait MONTHS to get scheduled, they may not have access to the latest technology and some medications are perpetually out of stock. Thankfully we pay for private health insurance but the process is the same because all insurance providers work in the same fashion. It is a headache and my mom also kept a spreadsheet of everything she had to pay for out of pocket to ensure her insurance reimbursed her. Some things were VERY expensive and it was always a little unclear if her insurance would approve the expense. In the end she only spent about 2k from her own money and everything else was reimbursed. The total cost of her treatment ended up around 90k
So my partner is part of the team at his hospital that does the fMRIs for patients with malignant growths on their brain, including brain tumours. Even with the functional mapping that he does, brain surgery can be so risky, especially when the growth is impeding on key areas like Wernecke's area. I can't imagine a neurosurgeon having to do the surgery without the fMRI, and even less a patient having to make the decision based on finances as opposed to medical risk. I refuse to ever consider moving to the States, despite their higher paying jobs for our fields, because of the lack of social safety nets.
I wouldn't even VISIT the states. Knew someone who went on holiday in the states and sprained their ankle. Took X ray and it was like $5000. Luckily she bought comprehensive travel insurance. Can't imagine if she didn't.
Thank you for this! When I was finally able to bring my twins home from the hospital I actually had to use what little money we had to pay a mother’s helper to come in to sit/hold my babies so I could spend hours on the telephone trying to work out payment plans. Same hospital but you know everything is billed differently including when a specialist comes in from a different hospital. Then to also have to pay for delivery of their sibling that had passed.
The real villain here is the American healthcare system, specifically private insurance companies. As a mental healthcare provider, it pains me to end contracts with insurance companies, but we simply can’t earn a living wage (and maintain work/life balance) at the reimbursement rates they provide. While the comment about having a hard time finding a therapist who charges under $150/session was a brief one and really speaks to a barrier in the system many people encounter, it shouldn’t be the provider’s responsibility to sacrifice a living wage-we need systemic support that increases access while still ensuring providers can earn an amount that fairly reflects their education and experience.
My two parents in law are both fighting cancer right now. As this is such a challenging time already, having everyone to give their mental and physical all, I can't imagine worrying about how to finance it all if we would live in the US. Watching the other comments, we would probably have to prioritise treatment, which is unimaginable to me. To everyone who is in such a situation in the US- I hope you find a way and lots of strength to you.
I always used to wonder why in American tv shows/movies that no one ever calls an ambulance when there’s an emergency?!! Know I understand. It’s ridiculous! Here, everything in public hospitals is covered by the government as well as ambulances to both public and private hospitals. I can’t imagine what my life would be without the healthcare we have in Australia.
When my husband quit his job due to being severely ill from long-COVID, we had no health insurance for him because we couldn't afford it. So he never got help, and luckily found a low paying remote job. He had to go to the ER due to kidney issues during that time, and paying $6000 out of pocket for that was cheaper than paying monthly insurance anyway. I hate this country.
it is popular to diss public healthcare in Canada but I totally recommend. yes sometimes we wait but cancer doesn't bankrupt us. do a mass mailing to all your political representatives telling them you want single payer public healthcare. you will have less hospitals than you currently do though. good luck!
Geez, thank you Olivia L. and this channel for showing us subjects like this. Always helpful and eye opening with helpful subjects like this. Take care everyone.
This might sound pessimistic, but I have basically told myself that, if I'm ever diagnosed with a terminal illness, instead of using my life savings to try to survive, I'm just going to accept my fate and give all my money to my family instead. In my mind, at this point, it's better they have it so that they can improve their own chances of surviving this capitalist hellscape than it just going to the medical industrial complex.
Yeah. I was laid off next day I asked my boss for a day off for biopsy. I didn’t want to tell anyone, but my boss was insisting, so I told… next day I ended up without health insurance. What means I did not go for biopsy. Why I need to know diagnosis if I can’t treat it anyway?
Great video. I had some medical bills a few years ago from an out of network ambulance company taking me to an out of network hospital. The lady I spoke with at my insurance company said I could get a list of in network ambulance companies to have on hand to call if needed. Who would know that and who is able to do that in an emergency? She touched on so many important things. One could never imagine dealing with out of network entities at an in network hospital in her case. Gravely messed up medical and behavioral health system. My insurance company also told me to give time for all the bills to get finalized. The first one that came in was for $20,000, which ended up being much lower in the end. Thank God she had so much support and pulled through. I hope she remains stable.
Waiting on my own Brain MRI results. Hoping it’s benign. Definitely a little scary. I “cash paid” for imaging because it was HALF what it would have been with my insurance. What’s the point? I have become a single issue voter when it comes to reforming our healthcare system. People like your guest should never have to navigate the stress of coordinating financials when going through something so challenging health wise. It’s unacceptable and I do feel we all need to be screaming in the streets about it.
I'm currently in eating disorder rehab. I had to take out a personal loan because the pay out for short term disability through the state is looking like 3 months out. Plus the $6k bill I'm likely to get at the end after insurance.
Insurance should not be allowed to deny any medical procedures that have been recommended by a doctor. It blows my mind that they can just say its not a medical necessity or whatever. The health insurance industry is a scam.
So, do we have a consensus here for MEDICARE FOR ALL, or are we still playing the "self-sufficient individualism" game? If we want BETTER, we are going to have to stop voting for the republicrat duopoly.
Yep, those of us who work in healthcare will have no idea ahead of time what you will wind up owing after your insurance. Everyone's insurance varies so wildly that there's really no telling. It's ridiculous and one of the reasons I want a universal healthcare system. Your provider shouldn't have to guess whether or to what extent a recommended treatment might be covered for you (even if something is "covered," it doesn't mean you won't have a prohibitively high copay). And the fact that so much of our insurance is tied to employment just traps people in jobs that they shouldn't be working, especially if they are dealing with a serious illness and physically can't work. I'm aware countries with some form of universal coverage have their issues. None of them are perfect. But you know what? Their citizens don't go bankrupt just because they sought necessary medical care. People facing an illness don't worry about how much it will cost them. Providers know whether something will be covered and don't waste countless hours jumping through hoops to get coverage approved for their patients. AND to top it all off, it costs a whole lot less per capita. There's just no good reason we should continue on this way.
As someone who has had too many ER visits, chronic conditions that require visits (asthma, ADHD, etc), and a host of other medical issues, I appreciate this video more than you know.
The lack of communication is mind numbing. Ive encountered her issue fortunately for a less stressful reason. Still took weeks and a dozen calls to get billing fixed.
I literally have a plan if I get cancer; Im not gonna get treatment and just spend what money I have on the experiences I want to do before I die. It will be cheaper, even with the cheapest estimates of chemo, radiation, etc.
I hate that she had to go through all of that, and most importantly, I hope that she stays healthy. The information that she shared though, was most helpful. Medical bills can rack up quickly but the point she made to help save yourself from overpaying was one that I hadn't really thought of. I have recently dealt with medical issues as well as trying to help with family members. I would definitely enjoy more shows like this because they are really helpful. It's crazy how a medical issue can be such a setback.
Dude...This would've been a much better video if you interviewed a person that actually suffered economically with a healthy issue in the US... However I guess it's important to give visibility to her foundation that hopefully helps people being robbed by your health system.
I used to work for a peak-body Cancer advocacy and support organisation here in Australia. So many private insurance patients were sorry they had private insurance because if they had gone with the public system all the allied health stuff such as dieticians and counselling wouldn't have been extra. That was a few years ago though, not sure if that's still true in the post-Pandemic world
I don´t understand how such a developed country can be so undeveloped in healthcare. I´m so lucky to live in Germany where we have mandatory health insurance but will cover all necessary examinations and hospital costs. And still some things could be improved. And then its always the Americans that think people in Europe are still living in stone age ...
But America has most millionaires and billionaires. This is why. There is no right to healthcare in American constitution. Instead you have easy access to guns. You have to take care of yourself, just personal responsibility. Who wants that collective socialist healthcare? Not America.
In defense of WebMD, some of those symptoms absolutely can be caused by a migraine. BUT if you ever have weird migraine symptoms that you have never had in your life, you need to get that checked out, just to be safe.
Really appreciated the tip to just collect and collate the bills in a folder and calendar system of some sort, but not to pay immediately because many will change final amounts with insurance before they’re due or overdue, and getting back any overpayments is a huge hassle. Wishing her continued health and wishing the odds to be in all of our favor because clearly USA has lost the plot on caring for us and our families
Have you ever read "so much for that" by lionel shriver? Might be a decent suggestion for the book club. I found it really honest about the finances of a cancer diagnosis and all the different feelings that brings up for people. Not sure its appropriate but I read it shortly after a close friend of mine died from Ewings Sarcoma and found it very moving (and honestly hilarious in a very cathartic way.)
My mom is type 1 diabetic. In the US she would be either dead, suffering from massive complications and/or financially completely impoverished. Thankfully we live in a first world country, where she can retire this year in great health after being an incredibly hard working member of society for decades. That's the craziest part of all this even if you don't care about people and make a cold hard financial argument, the tax money that her insulin costs is far less than she paid because she was able to contribute to society. Health care isn't just something that costs money, it's an investment.
It disgusts me how flawed our healthcare system is in the United States. I had ovarian cysts last year (no history of them) and my doctor instantly says "well you could go on birth control, that helps, but there's no real cure for them". ... Well, I'm already on a different form of BC, and really? I asked, "there's no type of diet change or supplementation I can take to combat this?" Of course not; she said they barely get one semester of nutrition in medical school. ONE SEMESTER on the fuel that is literally the building blocks of our bodies. (I did my own research, started taking beet root powder, turmeric, and cherry juice and the cysts went away about a month later - none since!) Between the lack of knowledge and the absurd runaround that insurance always gives me, I'm about as fed up as you can get with this system. Something NEEDS to change soon.
Thankfully the no surprises act that took effect in 2022 stops that out of network cost if you have the care at an in network hospital. We still have a LONG way to go though.
I hate when people expect you to struggle forever when you experience something traumatic. They always seem shocked when they see you’re living a normal life.
A perk of having stage 4 cancer is that I qualify for state insurance (Medicaid). But it's a sad state that you have to be stage 4 before qualifying for substantial assistance. If it weren't for state insurance, I definitely would be paying at least $10k or more per year to stay alive That's the crony capitalistic way of life here.....
This was such helpful information. Unfortunately, it is a lot of work to do when you are sick, and don't always have control over what the hospitals and doctors are doing especially if it is an emergency situation. It is so sad that as Americans we work hard our whole lives and if we get sick, that is it. All our savings is wiped and we can't afford to retire. Something has to be done about this!
I haven't watched this video.. I may watch it, but it's a bit traumatic not gonna lie. Thank you for speaking about this. I was perfectly healthy until I was diagnosed with leukemia at the age of 27. Chemotherapy, radiation, and two stem cell transplants later, I'm in remission but not without side effects from treatment. The last stem cell transplant and the steroids after the transplant caused lung and joint damage. I've gotten both hips replaced, one shoulder replaced, and I'm eventually going to need to get my other shoulder replaced and likely both knees. I'll also likely need a double lung transplant. I was on disability for about five years but the monthly payouts weren't enough and I had to go back to work. I used to be a teacher but am now an oncology social worker. I like what I do but putting my body through full time work is a lot, though I have to work because I hit my out-of-pocket maximum every year. It's tough out here as a young adult cancer survivor! I'm behind financially and am catching up slowly but surely. Sending much love to my fellow cancer survivors.
I work in hematology oncology research and my degree is in public health, the healthcare system is so messed up. Having to deal with costs associated with cancer is so unnecessary. US needs a total reform but it’s so complicated to get there unfortunately
Ain’t happening, insurance companies can’t lose profits. We’ll have reform only after young generations will become so ill that you would not be able to employ them or send to the military. Then things will change, not before that.
I have an autoimmune Tyroid disease, I'm Asperger and have several pyschiatric disfunctions. If I was living in America on my barista wage i would be so FOOOOOOOOCKED
They really bank on you being too injured or grief stricken to try to navigate their system. There is a special place in hell for the people who profit off of the dying.
It is so sad that US is so much ahead on everything. The BEST COUNTRY in the world 😂 but people go to debt on such simple thig as health care. I am from Germany and was hospitalized for 7 days and had surgery last year. I paid €70, for my meals. €10 per day and I was irritated
I think I remember many years ago, there might have been characters in the media who run themselves into credit card debt by spending thousands of dollars on fancy designer clothes and frivolous things. I wonder if that might have been how people in debt might have been portrayed in the media at one point, or maybe a few characters in TV shows were the only portrayals of people in debt that I saw. I might have said something about it to my mom and then she responded telling me that actually, people go into debt because of medical bills and things that they can't control. Is it just me or are there other people who might have seen a few media portrayals that make it look as if people who are in debt are the ones who just carelessly go out and frivolously spend lots of money on fancy clothes when the reality is that for most people in debt, it is things like medical catastrophes and other situations that are not their fault?
We only have one body; it's important to take care of it. But scary things can still come up. I myself have had a few health scares in the past year. It's made me really conscious about how I treat my body.
I have insurance and yet when i got sick with a bad cold i still had to shell out 1k for basic lab tests and medicine. American Health care is a such a scam! Anyways im not going to the doctor for the next two years to make up for that debt, easier to just... not live lol
What a monumental ordeal! Good for you. I'm so sorry for all of you-even those cult Maga dupes. One goes to the Hospital or Doctor, here, because of need, not affordability. I worry for my friends and family in the US, for your lack of a "single payer" health care. What some of you call "socialism" -it sort of is what every modern industrialized country has, but the US doesn't have. Not having to worry about health care is real freedom. All that would've cost zero dollars, up here. She's a very heroic woman. So,fine, I'll pay $6/gallon for gasoline and non-cheep beer, for the freedom of those lack of health costs. Good luck. Cheers from the Pacific West Coast of Canada.
Ridiculous-if the medical team that’s covered by insurance chooses out of network providers for tests or whatever THEY are responsible for the extra costs. PERIOD.
Hospitals can't cater to every patient's insurance. This is why we all need the same plan. We hospital providers have ZERO idea of billing and insurance coverage for every single different case
@Madamchief There's no excuse for that. Patients can check whether providers are in network from AN APP. Any care provider should be able to do the same, just like how they can look up the patient's medical history. The infrastructure is there, it just needs to be required.
@@erima4270 makes sense for outpatient situations but no one is gonna do that on the inpatient side. My patients have no way to know that the radiologist that reads their x-ray isn't a hospital employee and might be considered out of network for their insurance... Or the anesthesiologist, or the lab resulting their tests... There's too many variables to attempt any kind of quote pre-billing
@Madamchief the patient doesn't know but the hospital does. The hospital should be able to check whether the care provider is covered by insurance and provide a quote. It's not rocket science. It's not even medical science. The fact that it can be done patient-side shows it can be done provider-side.
@@erima4270 yea, no one gets paid to do that pre-authorization shit for everything that happens inpatient 😓 can you imagine if your paramedic has to check with your insurance to see if the provider is in-network before they take you to the nearest hospital?
Summer 2021. I could have sworn we were still all supposed to be isolating then due to Covid, or at least on the west coast we were supposed to be. No pool parties for us. I have a friend whose wife died of brain cancer in early 2021, and it took strings being pulled to be allowed to be with her. He said they were glad t be in Canada since they weren’t financially destroyed.
@@SpottedTiger89 I was isolated entirely when I was hospitalized in July 2021, the day after a got our youngest cat, with a UTI that turned into a kidney infection faster than I could get in to see a doctor, and had to go to the ER alone, then be hospitalized, without a chance to see my husband or daughter from the time I walked into the ER to walking out of being discharged. The worst was how isolated our only-child daughter still was for a second summer, and my husband had to do her 24/7 unalive-prevention watch on his own while I was in the hospital that summer, and it was fucking HOT since we had that heat bowl that sent the temps to over 120 in an area where a portable window AC counts as having AC. I wish we could have taken our daughter to swim lessons, but we weren’t even supposed to go to parks or the hiking trails because what if we came too close to other people even in nature. Honestly, someone else taking her kids to swim lessons and such somewhat tempers my feelings since we were fighting to keep our daughter from killing herself from the mental breaking of a second year of isolation. Our insurance wasn’t enough to get her the help she needs, and she’s still recovering from the effects of such extreme isolation. I honestly forgot that there were people living life like normal while everyone around me was still isolating as we were told to. We’re still dealing with medical bills from the way the isolation affected our daughter, still have medical appointment, and more bills. Edit: I don’t know where my other comment is going, so editing to add what I was saying here: @SpottedTiger89 The more I think about it, the madder I’m getting. My child is suffering long-term mental and medical effects of such extensive lockdowns, which we did for people like her. We have ongoing medical bills for our child due to what we were willing to suffer through, and put our child through, for her. We did more for her than she and her own family were willing to do for her. So my sympathy is somewhat tempered right now, and I’m biting back my full thoughts.
@@SpottedTiger89 Honestly, I’m getting madder the more I think about it. We were destroying our children’s mental health for the medical safety of people like her who couldn’t risk getting Covid. My daughter is still dealing with mental and medical health effects (since there were things we couldn’t get appointments for, certain things snowballed) that may be permanent at this point, because apparently we did more for people like her than she and her own family did. Our medical bills now were for people like her in the end. I’m biting back on my full thoughts.
@@SpottedTiger89 The more I think about it, the madder I’m getting. My child is suffering long-term mental and medical effects of such extensive lockdowns, which we did for people like her. We have ongoing medical bills for our child due to what we were willing to suffer through, and put our child through, for her. We did more for her than she and her own family were willing to do for her. So my sympathy is somewhat tempered right now, and I’m biting back my full thoughts.
Went through a similar situation. There definitely has to be a better way. in an unexpected turn of events, I went through cancer right before and during the institution of Obamacare. Prior to Obamacare I would not have been able to get insurance period (Pre-existing condition). President Obama then allowed anyone who could prove the had a pre-existing condition the ability to apply for the same insurance they get in congress. Let me just tell you: low premiums, everything in network, low deductibles. Once UI had to apply to "regular" plans my premium alone was over 400 per month. I was making 9dlls an hour. Things HAVE to change!
Not surprising because couples and single people have gone bankrupt over medical costs for sickness. This right here is why I ALWAYS challenge the single income in 2024 family model. Its outdated, unrealistic and dangerous. I know this isnt the message of the broadcast but i definitely use scenarios like this and people claim dont happen in real life to say that no one person should be handling the burden of life. Whether its a community, husband, wife, family. Have someone with you. This system is so cold and money hungry. It crushes many who are alone. Her story isnt the worst. I had an elderly friend whose husband died of cancer and they were well off and his cancer treatments left them bankrupt. When he died, they had to start from scratch financially.
$20k out of pocket, a battle for coverage for an MRI, and this is "good insurance." Absolutely criminal.
I just googled it - in Germany ist’s around 1,200€ - I don’t know if that’s accurate though.
@@StarletOfDavidYes, that's mostly a universal health care system.
That is SOCIALISM.
That's what we need here.
I’m an oncologist and this is true. One of the biggest jokes in America is our healthcare is tied to employment so when you can’t work you lose what’s healthcare you have….. I’ve had metastatic patients go back to work because otherwise they don’t have healthcare to continue care. It breaks my heart and makes me a card carrying member of nationalized healthcare.
Think about joining PNHP It's a physician organization advocating for single payor. I have seen patients get let go lose their jobs and insurance because of hospitalizations for surgical complications after trauma.
@@bombaychand omg thank you. I didn’t know that and will look into it
America: Bring me your sick & poor, yearning to be free. So they can remain sick & poor, yearning to be free.
My wife had spinal surgery. We are fortunate to be "well" insured. We had not met our deductible at the time of surgery so a good portion of the procedure was paid out of pocket. My wife's procedure was more expensive than our home. my wife's procedure was MORE EXPENSIVE THAN OUR HOME.
Im so sorry you all had to go through that. I pray she is doing much better.
I almost died last year and spent a week in the hospital. So glad I live in Europe and did not have to give it any thought financially. Yes we pay taxes but it covers everything. And there is no limit on sick days. "sick days" are just days where you are sick.
Lohnfortzahlung im Krankheitsfall
This is so on point. I live in fear of getting sick, not because I could potentially pass away but because of how much it’ll cost me.
And THEN you'll pass away, penniless.
But you made those doctors and insurance brokers some nice fat stacks though!
I admire so much that she decided to pause the treatment until she got an answer from the insurance company about the cost, you have to survive at any cost but also have a cool head to think if I am going to leave the family in extreme poverty, Olivia you are a very brave woman.
People in Canada love love love to complain about our "broken health care system" but all we have to do is watch a story like this realize how good we have it. My dad was in the hospital for 7 days due to a COPD crisis and we paid $0. Single payer health care man...
My father was just diagnosed with brain cancer after he had a sudden seizure. He’s almost done 36 rounds of treatment to see if we can prolong his life. We are still in shock. When we were visiting him at the hospital we kept saying we’re so lucky to be living in Canada and have free healthcare. ♥️ What the U.S. does wrong is privatize everything, everything is about profit.
And my American family asks why I was thrilled to become an Australian citizen. True freedom is not worrying about anyone in your family getting really sick AND being able to change your job at any time without thinking about how that affects your health insurance.
This is so true. I always feel like most Americans are just one major medical catastrophe away from homelessness. It's horrible :(
I remember looking at the hospital bill from my nephrectomy in 2018 after kidney cancer diagnosis. The robotic assisted surgery and 3-days in the hospital was about $140,000. The ER visit in which I was diagnosed was over $80k. Out of pocket that cancer cost me about $10k. All of these are numbers that would easily bankrupt someone. This system is a nightmare that this country desperately needs to wake up from.
Fortunately the numbers you get quoted do not show the discounts given to people who arent going through insurance billing. Unforunately, the cost is m still astronomical.
I have had 2 bouts with cancer and was accidently billed for a few procedures as if I didnt have insurance. All those bills showed a 50% discount of the initial price for not having insurance.
@@ghostlyMostly1 This game we play with medical pricing should be illegal. No other industry is allowed to just make up their prices after the fact, nor give 2 different prices to 2 different people. The health insurance industry spends billions lobbying to keep it this way. We are being murdered by this criminal organization.
Did you end up paying that?
@@ghostlyMostly1 But the initial price is in tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars for things that cost a minuscule fraction of it. Being charged $200 for a sandwich is only better than being charged $500 for it. It's price gouging either way.
@@matthewcaldwell8100 Did you even read my comment? I said the cost was still astronomical.
I didn't have cancer, but I had 2 rounds of brain surgery, too. What this guest said, spot on. The anesthesiologist that was selected for my procedure wasn't in my network. Tried to charge me almost 10k. Fought it for a year. I had no choice as I was asleep for the surgery. Insurance was like, why didn't you get pre approved??? Me, my doctor, and others jumped through hoops. Our system is ridiculous.
This sounds like a nightmare. I don't live in the US and my mom went through cancer, and paid only for a private second opinion. Even the transportation to the hospital was covered by the government.
It's crazy that people in such a wealthy country need to deal with it on top of the illness itself.
It took me 6 years to get diagnosed with a rare form of chronic pancreatitis. I was in and out of hospitals and specialists and nearly died twice. I remember sobbing in my bed in the hospital so badly that they sent psych to come in and talk to me. I wasn't upset about my diagnosis. I was terrified of the debt and the pysch just recommended medical bankruptcy. It took me 10 years to pay off.
My daughter was hospitalized in the cardiac icu for 5 months and our initial pre-insurance bill was over 4 million, it’s so wild
wtf!!! absolutely wild!
At that point, they can go f$%@ themselves. What the hell do they expect you to do?
What?! How is that even possible?! That is criminal.
Thank you for covering this - chronic illnesses are something that are rarely talked about in terms of finances. I see too many financial professionals/experts frame saving and expenses as a choice and something within your control, when that’s not the case when you have health issues. I’m almost 32 and would be a lot further ahead financially if I didn’t have so many health issues from a young age. My medical bills can cost anywhere from 15-40% of my income.
This is so timely. I recently had a mammogram, and they asked me to come back for further imaging. They advised me the follow-up was $400.00. I have it on my HSA, but I couldn't help but think of people who needed didn't have it. It's stressful enough to need to follow up and now add financial stress. I'm glad your guest is ok.
My wisdom teeth removal cost 900 out of pocket and if I didn’t have my hsa or had I needed to use it in the past year that I’ve started working, I would be struggling.
@@aimemaggieAnd they make it clear that payment is due before service.
I live in Europe but work for an international insurance company and process health claims from both the US and the EU… and omg the difference. It breaks my heart on a daily basis….
Thank you for making a video on this . I was in my early 20s when I was diagnosed with breast cancer .The most hurtful thing was having "financial counselors" who I thought were friends reach out or use what happened to me as a reason sign up for their financial counseling . I've seen wealthy couples in the cancer community go broke .not just me and my partner who were both working full time,in college, and had a savings .fuck cancer
I am from Canada and my mom was diagnosed with stage 3 breast cancer in 2021. She had so many scans, chemo, radiation, and surgery for $0. She continues to be on medication that she doesn't pay for. In Canada you don't even see a bill. We have our problems here too, but when it was required to save her life the system moved fast and didn't financially punish her for something out of her control. I will always be thankful for that.
My aunt actually has cancer and it’s bad to the point they forego treatment and she is just going on some fun trips with her family while she still has the time
Honestly, this is the way to go, I think. It's so dire, but it's our reality now. I hope your aunt is able to enjoy what time she has left. She's courageous and brave for meeting her end so gracefully.
Wow, I can't believe there is discussion about this on this channel! I had cancer several years ago in my early 20s, and while I had a lot of support from my family during that time, the financial impact has been immense. Obviously, the physical trauma of the actual illness has totally transformed my life, but I think a lot of people can't begin to imagine how much of a financial toll it takes because of how insanely expensive it is. One thing that is hard to imagine is how much of a long-term drain on your finances it can be. I had it 7 years ago, but the complications of having it, along with the increased preventative maintenance (e.g. copays for specialists, follow up scans, corrective surgeries needing inpatient stays, medications, etc.) are things I still have to deal with to this day. And this is coming from someone who doesn't even currently have medical debt.
Depending on the cancer and how the treatment debilitates you physically, mentally, emotionally, and financially, it can become something that you can never fully move on from.
As someone who lives in the UK, this is wild to me.. through all of the NHS’ problems, I wouldn’t trade it for the world!
I work in case management and also have a background in medical billing. The reason the staff couldn't tell you the price is because of insurance. Each insurance company has a contract with the hospital and they set the price per insurance contracts. How you find out the price call the billing office at the hospital and ask for the self pay price. Also if you can't pay as for a HCAP application and or Medicaid review. Social worker/ Case Management can help with resources.
Thank you for clarifying!
Every time I hear stories like this I think of how much cost is in the administration of all these different costs.
It’s sad and criminal that the price for the same procedure would be different depending on the insurance company.
My mother got diagnosed at stage 4 of neuroendocrine cancer in June 2022. She had emergency surgery due to an ulcer and had to learn to walk again.
She went back to work that November. Due to health she had to stop working February 2024 she lost all of her benefits. She did get Medicaid but due to an error they thought she was still working and canceled her insurance. She fought on the phone with them everyday while she went two months with no treatment. I just got the bill for her ambulance $660.
My mother passed last Wednesday June 19th 2024. We’ll never know if her not having insurance to treat the cancer made her decline even faster. The offices and PET scan facilities canceled her appointments due to inactive insurance.
Money can’t cure cancer but it can take the stress off of worrying of bills so the sick can focus on health and recovery.
And putting the onus on sick patients to battle against insurance bureaucracy probably causes so much stress to them that it can contribute to their death. Stress does kill. This system is inhumane.
I am so sorry for your loss.
The American healthcare system is such a joke. Not even Olivia and her husband who make a pretty good income could barely afford it. It’s disgusting and I wish someone or something would actually make change.
Nothing encapsulates the fetishization of individual responsibility quite so much as our tendency to frame illness as some kind of choice.
lol. I was just told that cataract on my eye is because of my diet choices. Now I have to shell $10k as punishment.
I have the utmost respect for brain surgery survivors. My father had to have two craniectomies last year due to a brain infection and although he is still recovering, he is almost back to normal. And the bills were astronomical. Thank goodness he lives in California and qualified for Medi-Cal. They covered everything. Otherwise, I don't know how we would have done it. One sub part to an individual going through a major life threatening illness is the impact it has on family as well. A lot of hospitals rely on family to do the caregiving at home if there is additional treatment needed after. Thank God I WFH and was able to look after my father once he was discharged from the hospital, but it was taxing on my mental health to work full time and look after him and administer antibiotics on a strict schedule. Our medical system is extremely flawed and it's shameful that with how much these treatments cost, we get the bare minimum.
Thank you for this episode. I don't think the general population realizes how much cancer costs. I'm a cancer survivor. I was young and on my parent's insurance and got a lot of help from children's cancer organizations, but my mom said she would estimate the pre-insurance cost of the 3 months I was in the hospital (not including the 2 years of outpatient treatment) was a million dollars (in 2006)! I now have dozens of friends in the cancer world, and there are constantly new Go Fund Me's to help cover costs. It's completely unacceptable that people who are going through the most difficult time in their lives have to ask their friends and family to pay for it or else they have to pause treatments or move of their house or skip paying other bills. Our healthcare system is a cruel joke.
Maybe it's my PMS but her recounting all the help from the community had me in tears. I think when faced with such predatory systems the notion of having community and then sharing it is what restores some dignity to this world.
This is the most valuable discussion on TH-cam. Nobody should have to go through this and it’s scary to know that this could happen to any of us. How do we change the system? Let’s all scream in the streets!!! And the community support is excellent too.
I was diagnosed with an orphan lung disease ten years ago. I have spent way too much time since then in the ICU and step-down units. It is expensive (not to mention lonely and depressing). You're supposed to be focused on getting healthy, but then there are the bills and dealing with insurance issues. It gets so stressful.
24:27 Absolute kudos to your doctor, sounds like an amazing man to go to bat for you!
As an Oncologist , this was super insightful to watch. Olivia was very fortunate, but the reality is more grim for most patients. I see how my financially stable patients and those with social support tend to do relatively better than those without. It’s unfortunate that we’re still lacking in transparency regarding cost, but I’m very well aware of the financial toxicity of cancer treatment, much less healthcare in general.
I resonate with this so much...I've actually had to do bankruptcy due to medical bills. Our medical and insurance systems need an overhaul. Now, I can't afford the insurance plans where I work, so I hope to goodness that nothing happens to me going forward.
She made a good point on life insurance. After my husband's diagnosis with heart failure, it's impossible to now increase it or get another policy. If you are healthy, maximize your life insurance now!
My mom got cancer. We live in Mexico. The process was the same. You can go through the public “free” healthcare system but it is a nightmare because they don’t work with insurance, everything is free but you have to wait MONTHS to get scheduled, they may not have access to the latest technology and some medications are perpetually out of stock. Thankfully we pay for private health insurance but the process is the same because all insurance providers work in the same fashion. It is a headache and my mom also kept a spreadsheet of everything she had to pay for out of pocket to ensure her insurance reimbursed her. Some things were VERY expensive and it was always a little unclear if her insurance would approve the expense. In the end she only spent about 2k from her own money and everything else was reimbursed. The total cost of her treatment ended up around 90k
So my partner is part of the team at his hospital that does the fMRIs for patients with malignant growths on their brain, including brain tumours. Even with the functional mapping that he does, brain surgery can be so risky, especially when the growth is impeding on key areas like Wernecke's area. I can't imagine a neurosurgeon having to do the surgery without the fMRI, and even less a patient having to make the decision based on finances as opposed to medical risk. I refuse to ever consider moving to the States, despite their higher paying jobs for our fields, because of the lack of social safety nets.
I wouldn't even VISIT the states. Knew someone who went on holiday in the states and sprained their ankle. Took X ray and it was like $5000. Luckily she bought comprehensive travel insurance. Can't imagine if she didn't.
Thank you for this! When I was finally able to bring my twins home from the hospital I actually had to use what little money we had to pay a mother’s helper to come in to sit/hold my babies so I could spend hours on the telephone trying to work out payment plans. Same hospital but you know everything is billed differently including when a specialist comes in from a different hospital. Then to also have to pay for delivery of their sibling that had passed.
Great episode her personality is so amazing!
The real villain here is the American healthcare system, specifically private insurance companies. As a mental healthcare provider, it pains me to end contracts with insurance companies, but we simply can’t earn a living wage (and maintain work/life balance) at the reimbursement rates they provide. While the comment about having a hard time finding a therapist who charges under $150/session was a brief one and really speaks to a barrier in the system many people encounter, it shouldn’t be the provider’s responsibility to sacrifice a living wage-we need systemic support that increases access while still ensuring providers can earn an amount that fairly reflects their education and experience.
My two parents in law are both fighting cancer right now.
As this is such a challenging time already, having everyone to give their mental and physical all, I can't imagine worrying about how to finance it all if we would live in the US. Watching the other comments, we would probably have to prioritise treatment, which is unimaginable to me.
To everyone who is in such a situation in the US- I hope you find a way and lots of strength to you.
I wish so badly life in the US was a given right not something you’re required to pay to participate in.
I always used to wonder why in American tv shows/movies that no one ever calls an ambulance when there’s an emergency?!! Know I understand. It’s ridiculous!
Here, everything in public hospitals is covered by the government as well as ambulances to both public and private hospitals. I can’t imagine what my life would be without the healthcare we have in Australia.
When my husband quit his job due to being severely ill from long-COVID, we had no health insurance for him because we couldn't afford it. So he never got help, and luckily found a low paying remote job. He had to go to the ER due to kidney issues during that time, and paying $6000 out of pocket for that was cheaper than paying monthly insurance anyway. I hate this country.
it is popular to diss public healthcare in Canada but I totally recommend. yes sometimes we wait but cancer doesn't bankrupt us. do a mass mailing to all your political representatives telling them you want single payer public healthcare. you will have less hospitals than you currently do though. good luck!
Here's the thing. Every problem the Canadian system has the American system has. And then you get charged for the privilege.
Geez, thank you Olivia L. and this channel for showing us subjects like this. Always helpful and eye opening with helpful subjects like this. Take care everyone.
Hey thank you for your work! Just wanted to let you know that you did not put the link to Hank Green's video 😊
This might sound pessimistic, but I have basically told myself that, if I'm ever diagnosed with a terminal illness, instead of using my life savings to try to survive, I'm just going to accept my fate and give all my money to my family instead. In my mind, at this point, it's better they have it so that they can improve their own chances of surviving this capitalist hellscape than it just going to the medical industrial complex.
Yeah. I was laid off next day I asked my boss for a day off for biopsy. I didn’t want to tell anyone, but my boss was insisting, so I told… next day I ended up without health insurance. What means I did not go for biopsy. Why I need to know diagnosis if I can’t treat it anyway?
Great video. I had some medical bills a few years ago from an out of network ambulance company taking me to an out of network hospital. The lady I spoke with at my insurance company said I could get a list of in network ambulance companies to have on hand to call if needed. Who would know that and who is able to do that in an emergency? She touched on so many important things. One could never imagine dealing with out of network entities at an in network hospital in her case. Gravely messed up medical and behavioral health system. My insurance company also told me to give time for all the bills to get finalized. The first one that came in was for $20,000, which ended up being much lower in the end. Thank God she had so much support and pulled through. I hope she remains stable.
Waiting on my own Brain MRI results. Hoping it’s benign. Definitely a little scary. I “cash paid” for imaging because it was HALF what it would have been with my insurance. What’s the point?
I have become a single issue voter when it comes to reforming our healthcare system. People like your guest should never have to navigate the stress of coordinating financials when going through something so challenging health wise. It’s unacceptable and I do feel we all need to be screaming in the streets about it.
I really appreciate how open this woman was, she's extremely strong I really hope she stays cancer free for the rest of her long life ❤
We go to Colombia to all our medical needs. Tickets cost more than most of the procedures (150 dollars round trip).
Needed this today.
I'm currently in eating disorder rehab. I had to take out a personal loan because the pay out for short term disability through the state is looking like 3 months out. Plus the $6k bill I'm likely to get at the end after insurance.
Insurance should not be allowed to deny any medical procedures that have been recommended by a doctor. It blows my mind that they can just say its not a medical necessity or whatever. The health insurance industry is a scam.
So, do we have a consensus here for MEDICARE FOR ALL,
or are we still playing the "self-sufficient individualism" game?
If we want BETTER, we are going to have to stop voting for
the republicrat duopoly.
Yep, those of us who work in healthcare will have no idea ahead of time what you will wind up owing after your insurance. Everyone's insurance varies so wildly that there's really no telling. It's ridiculous and one of the reasons I want a universal healthcare system. Your provider shouldn't have to guess whether or to what extent a recommended treatment might be covered for you (even if something is "covered," it doesn't mean you won't have a prohibitively high copay). And the fact that so much of our insurance is tied to employment just traps people in jobs that they shouldn't be working, especially if they are dealing with a serious illness and physically can't work. I'm aware countries with some form of universal coverage have their issues. None of them are perfect. But you know what? Their citizens don't go bankrupt just because they sought necessary medical care. People facing an illness don't worry about how much it will cost them. Providers know whether something will be covered and don't waste countless hours jumping through hoops to get coverage approved for their patients. AND to top it all off, it costs a whole lot less per capita. There's just no good reason we should continue on this way.
As someone who has had too many ER visits, chronic conditions that require visits (asthma, ADHD, etc), and a host of other medical issues, I appreciate this video more than you know.
The lack of communication is mind numbing. Ive encountered her issue fortunately for a less stressful reason. Still took weeks and a dozen calls to get billing fixed.
I literally have a plan if I get cancer; Im not gonna get treatment and just spend what money I have on the experiences I want to do before I die. It will be cheaper, even with the cheapest estimates of chemo, radiation, etc.
Worse case, try Keto diet
Recommendations:
Dr. Berg, Dr. Ken Berry, Dr. Boz on TH-cam
Dr Berg is a Scientologist and believes in the pseudo-scientific Putification Rundown.
I hate that she had to go through all of that, and most importantly, I hope that she stays healthy. The information that she shared though, was most helpful. Medical bills can rack up quickly but the point she made to help save yourself from overpaying was one that I hadn't really thought of. I have recently dealt with medical issues as well as trying to help with family members. I would definitely enjoy more shows like this because they are really helpful. It's crazy how a medical issue can be such a setback.
Dude...This would've been a much better video if you interviewed a person that actually suffered economically with a healthy issue in the US... However I guess it's important to give visibility to her foundation that hopefully helps people being robbed by your health system.
I used to work for a peak-body Cancer advocacy and support organisation here in Australia. So many private insurance patients were sorry they had private insurance because if they had gone with the public system all the allied health stuff such as dieticians and counselling wouldn't have been extra. That was a few years ago though, not sure if that's still true in the post-Pandemic world
Thank you!
Amazing story!
I don´t understand how such a developed country can be so undeveloped in healthcare. I´m so lucky to live in Germany where we have mandatory health insurance but will cover all necessary examinations and hospital costs. And still some things could be improved. And then its always the Americans that think people in Europe are still living in stone age ...
But America has most millionaires and billionaires. This is why. There is no right to healthcare in American constitution. Instead you have easy access to guns. You have to take care of yourself, just personal responsibility. Who wants that collective socialist healthcare? Not America.
In defense of WebMD, some of those symptoms absolutely can be caused by a migraine. BUT if you ever have weird migraine symptoms that you have never had in your life, you need to get that checked out, just to be safe.
Really appreciated the tip to just collect and collate the bills in a folder and calendar system of some sort, but not to pay immediately because many will change final amounts with insurance before they’re due or overdue, and getting back any overpayments is a huge hassle.
Wishing her continued health and wishing the odds to be in all of our favor because clearly USA has lost the plot on caring for us and our families
Have you ever read "so much for that" by lionel shriver? Might be a decent suggestion for the book club. I found it really honest about the finances of a cancer diagnosis and all the different feelings that brings up for people. Not sure its appropriate but I read it shortly after a close friend of mine died from Ewings Sarcoma and found it very moving (and honestly hilarious in a very cathartic way.)
My mom is type 1 diabetic. In the US she would be either dead, suffering from massive complications and/or financially completely impoverished. Thankfully we live in a first world country, where she can retire this year in great health after being an incredibly hard working member of society for decades. That's the craziest part of all this even if you don't care about people and make a cold hard financial argument, the tax money that her insulin costs is far less than she paid because she was able to contribute to society. Health care isn't just something that costs money, it's an investment.
My aunt overpaid 1200 and it took 3 years for her to get reimbursed.
It disgusts me how flawed our healthcare system is in the United States. I had ovarian cysts last year (no history of them) and my doctor instantly says "well you could go on birth control, that helps, but there's no real cure for them". ... Well, I'm already on a different form of BC, and really? I asked, "there's no type of diet change or supplementation I can take to combat this?" Of course not; she said they barely get one semester of nutrition in medical school. ONE SEMESTER on the fuel that is literally the building blocks of our bodies. (I did my own research, started taking beet root powder, turmeric, and cherry juice and the cysts went away about a month later - none since!) Between the lack of knowledge and the absurd runaround that insurance always gives me, I'm about as fed up as you can get with this system. Something NEEDS to change soon.
Thankfully the no surprises act that took effect in 2022 stops that out of network cost if you have the care at an in network hospital. We still have a LONG way to go though.
I hate when people expect you to struggle forever when you experience something traumatic. They always seem shocked when they see you’re living a normal life.
A perk of having stage 4 cancer is that I qualify for state insurance (Medicaid). But it's a sad state that you have to be stage 4 before qualifying for substantial assistance. If it weren't for state insurance, I definitely would be paying at least $10k or more per year to stay alive
That's the crony capitalistic way of life here.....
I have no words . ❤thank you for sharing
What state? I don’t think we can get Medicaid in my red state until hospice care starts.
This was such helpful information. Unfortunately, it is a lot of work to do when you are sick, and don't always have control over what the hospitals and doctors are doing especially if it is an emergency situation. It is so sad that as Americans we work hard our whole lives and if we get sick, that is it. All our savings is wiped and we can't afford to retire. Something has to be done about this!
Anyone have a link to the Hank Green video she mentioned? 🙏
Came here to ask the same thing!
I haven't watched this video.. I may watch it, but it's a bit traumatic not gonna lie. Thank you for speaking about this. I was perfectly healthy until I was diagnosed with leukemia at the age of 27. Chemotherapy, radiation, and two stem cell transplants later, I'm in remission but not without side effects from treatment. The last stem cell transplant and the steroids after the transplant caused lung and joint damage. I've gotten both hips replaced, one shoulder replaced, and I'm eventually going to need to get my other shoulder replaced and likely both knees. I'll also likely need a double lung transplant. I was on disability for about five years but the monthly payouts weren't enough and I had to go back to work. I used to be a teacher but am now an oncology social worker. I like what I do but putting my body through full time work is a lot, though I have to work because I hit my out-of-pocket maximum every year. It's tough out here as a young adult cancer survivor! I'm behind financially and am catching up slowly but surely. Sending much love to my fellow cancer survivors.
Thank you for this episode! I paid $14k out of pocket for surgery. It was a major financial setback.
Unfortunately the cost of freedom also means debt till the end of
I work in hematology oncology research and my degree is in public health, the healthcare system is so messed up. Having to deal with costs associated with cancer is so unnecessary. US needs a total reform but it’s so complicated to get there unfortunately
exactly. it's like.... we need this unified reform so bad.... but how and where do we start?
Ain’t happening, insurance companies can’t lose profits. We’ll have reform only after young generations will become so ill that you would not be able to employ them or send to the military. Then things will change, not before that.
we are all a stroke of bad luck away from a life-changing health emergency
I have an autoimmune Tyroid disease, I'm Asperger and have several pyschiatric disfunctions. If I was living in America on my barista wage i would be so FOOOOOOOOCKED
24:39 omg … what a fantastic doctor and what a terrible position to put doctors and patients in this position
God bless not living in USA
They really bank on you being too injured or grief stricken to try to navigate their system. There is a special place in hell for the people who profit off of the dying.
It is so sad that US is so much ahead on everything. The BEST COUNTRY in the world 😂 but people go to debt on such simple thig as health care. I am from Germany and was hospitalized for 7 days and had surgery last year. I paid €70, for my meals. €10 per day and I was irritated
I think I remember many years ago, there might have been characters in the media who run themselves into credit card debt by spending thousands of dollars on fancy designer clothes and frivolous things. I wonder if that might have been how people in debt might have been portrayed in the media at one point, or maybe a few characters in TV shows were the only portrayals of people in debt that I saw. I might have said something about it to my mom and then she responded telling me that actually, people go into debt because of medical bills and things that they can't control. Is it just me or are there other people who might have seen a few media portrayals that make it look as if people who are in debt are the ones who just carelessly go out and frivolously spend lots of money on fancy clothes when the reality is that for most people in debt, it is things like medical catastrophes and other situations that are not their fault?
The better way is in every other developed country ❤
We only have one body; it's important to take care of it. But scary things can still come up. I myself have had a few health scares in the past year. It's made me really conscious about how I treat my body.
This is not a problem of individual regimen. It's a systemic failure to provide medical care without destroying the lives of the people who need it.
@@matthewcaldwell8100 oh, absolutely, I totally agree. I am not arguing that.
I have insurance and yet when i got sick with a bad cold i still had to shell out 1k for basic lab tests and medicine. American Health care is a such a scam! Anyways im not going to the doctor for the next two years to make up for that debt, easier to just... not live lol
All healthcare in the US is catastrophic healthcare. It only helps when you need a surgery or a very expensive treatment. Maybe. It’s a scam
Hail Luigi.
What a monumental ordeal! Good for you. I'm so sorry for all of you-even those cult Maga dupes. One goes to the Hospital or Doctor, here, because of need, not affordability.
I worry for my friends and family in the US, for your lack of a "single payer" health care. What some of you call "socialism" -it sort of is what every modern industrialized country has, but the US doesn't have.
Not having to worry about health care is real freedom. All that would've cost zero dollars, up here. She's a very heroic woman.
So,fine, I'll pay $6/gallon for gasoline and non-cheep beer, for the freedom of those lack of health costs. Good luck.
Cheers from the Pacific West Coast of Canada.
Ridiculous-if the medical team that’s covered by insurance chooses out of network providers for tests or whatever THEY are responsible for the extra costs. PERIOD.
Hospitals can't cater to every patient's insurance. This is why we all need the same plan. We hospital providers have ZERO idea of billing and insurance coverage for every single different case
@Madamchief There's no excuse for that. Patients can check whether providers are in network from AN APP. Any care provider should be able to do the same, just like how they can look up the patient's medical history. The infrastructure is there, it just needs to be required.
@@erima4270 makes sense for outpatient situations but no one is gonna do that on the inpatient side. My patients have no way to know that the radiologist that reads their x-ray isn't a hospital employee and might be considered out of network for their insurance... Or the anesthesiologist, or the lab resulting their tests... There's too many variables to attempt any kind of quote pre-billing
@Madamchief the patient doesn't know but the hospital does. The hospital should be able to check whether the care provider is covered by insurance and provide a quote. It's not rocket science. It's not even medical science. The fact that it can be done patient-side shows it can be done provider-side.
@@erima4270 yea, no one gets paid to do that pre-authorization shit for everything that happens inpatient 😓 can you imagine if your paramedic has to check with your insurance to see if the provider is in-network before they take you to the nearest hospital?
Summer 2021. I could have sworn we were still all supposed to be isolating then due to Covid, or at least on the west coast we were supposed to be. No pool parties for us.
I have a friend whose wife died of brain cancer in early 2021, and it took strings being pulled to be allowed to be with her. He said they were glad t be in Canada since they weren’t financially destroyed.
I hadn't caught that... yes, that was odd. I remember still heavily isolating at that time.
@@SpottedTiger89 I was isolated entirely when I was hospitalized in July 2021, the day after a got our youngest cat, with a UTI that turned into a kidney infection faster than I could get in to see a doctor, and had to go to the ER alone, then be hospitalized, without a chance to see my husband or daughter from the time I walked into the ER to walking out of being discharged.
The worst was how isolated our only-child daughter still was for a second summer, and my husband had to do her 24/7 unalive-prevention watch on his own while I was in the hospital that summer, and it was fucking HOT since we had that heat bowl that sent the temps to over 120 in an area where a portable window AC counts as having AC. I wish we could have taken our daughter to swim lessons, but we weren’t even supposed to go to parks or the hiking trails because what if we came too close to other people even in nature.
Honestly, someone else taking her kids to swim lessons and such somewhat tempers my feelings since we were fighting to keep our daughter from killing herself from the mental breaking of a second year of isolation. Our insurance wasn’t enough to get her the help she needs, and she’s still recovering from the effects of such extreme isolation. I honestly forgot that there were people living life like normal while everyone around me was still isolating as we were told to. We’re still dealing with medical bills from the way the isolation affected our daughter, still have medical appointment, and more bills.
Edit: I don’t know where my other comment is going, so editing to add what I was saying here:
@SpottedTiger89 The more I think about it, the madder I’m getting. My child is suffering long-term mental and medical effects of such extensive lockdowns, which we did for people like her. We have ongoing medical bills for our child due to what we were willing to suffer through, and put our child through, for her. We did more for her than she and her own family were willing to do for her. So my sympathy is somewhat tempered right now, and I’m biting back my full thoughts.
@@SpottedTiger89 Honestly, I’m getting madder the more I think about it. We were destroying our children’s mental health for the medical safety of people like her who couldn’t risk getting Covid. My daughter is still dealing with mental and medical health effects (since there were things we couldn’t get appointments for, certain things snowballed) that may be permanent at this point, because apparently we did more for people like her than she and her own family did. Our medical bills now were for people like her in the end. I’m biting back on my full thoughts.
@@SpottedTiger89 The more I think about it, the madder I’m getting. My child is suffering long-term mental and medical effects of such extensive lockdowns, which we did for people like her. We have ongoing medical bills for our child due to what we were willing to suffer through, and put our child through, for her. We did more for her than she and her own family were willing to do for her. So my sympathy is somewhat tempered right now, and I’m biting back my full thoughts.
Well, the American South never had a true lock-down, which is why a lot of their Covid numbers were/are horrendous.
Pretty sure if I get cancer, I'm gonna try to go get treated in another country 🙃
Went through a similar situation. There definitely has to be a better way. in an unexpected turn of events, I went through cancer right before and during the institution of Obamacare. Prior to Obamacare I would not have been able to get insurance period (Pre-existing condition). President Obama then allowed anyone who could prove the had a pre-existing condition the ability to apply for the same insurance they get in congress. Let me just tell you: low premiums, everything in network, low deductibles. Once UI had to apply to "regular" plans my premium alone was over 400 per month. I was making 9dlls an hour. Things HAVE to change!
Not surprising because couples and single people have gone bankrupt over medical costs for sickness. This right here is why I ALWAYS challenge the single income in 2024 family model. Its outdated, unrealistic and dangerous. I know this isnt the message of the broadcast but i definitely use scenarios like this and people claim dont happen in real life to say that no one person should be handling the burden of life. Whether its a community, husband, wife, family. Have someone with you. This system is so cold and money hungry. It crushes many who are alone. Her story isnt the worst. I had an elderly friend whose husband died of cancer and they were well off and his cancer treatments left them bankrupt. When he died, they had to start from scratch financially.