hello. ok, i'm in the states, and we call 'em turnouts, and I would absolutely used the curved ones in this situation. I would also encourage you to use code 100 everything. track, turnouts diamonds and all. because, code 100 automatically has fewer issues compared to code 75, 83, or whatever. what happens, at least over here, is not all wheel flanges are created equal. code 75 rail is more likely to allow large flange wheels to "bottom out" in which case, the wheel is now no longer on the rail head, but riding on the ties, or ballast, on the flange itself. a car riding on it's flanges is more likely to derail in a curved turnout, than on a straight one. simply because it's got to make a turn rather than just keep going straight. refer to sir Issac about objects staying in motion..... I most cases, a car that derails (at any given point where the other cars do not) is the fault of the car, not the track regardless of rail code. if all the cars derail at a certain spot, then it's the track, or turnout or whatever. remember this, at arms length, once installed, ballasted, scenery applied, car on track etc, you'll be hard pressed to tell the difference between track code anyhow. I've been enjoying your posts quite a bit. please keep 'em coming.
As you know from our recent discussion, it's definitely a YES from me with regards to the curved points. I have code 100 large radius points on the fiddle yard and the code 75 equivalent on the scenic part of the layout. I've had no issues whatsoever. Your plan is very similar to my 11 road fiddle yard and I'm so pleased with mine and how well it operates. Best of luck Jamie
Hi Jamie many thanks, I am watching your progress with keen interest, and following closely in your wake, and that of Richards too.Many thanks for your kind imput, Paul
When i first used curved points on my layout i had problems with some trains derailing, it was where a flexitrack curve joined the curved point. I think the problem was that there was a bit of sudden radius change at the join (a bit of a dog-leg). To prevent this happening now i use a track setta curve (if possible) to ease the join between the flexitrack &the curve of the point, basically, trying to maintain the same radius out of the point a little way past the join. I hope that explanation makes sense! I mostly run diesel but having read the other comments, i can also see how steam loco's may be more intolerant of badly laid track.
The biggest issue is using two code 100 settrack curved points to make a crossover from a second radius curve to third radius. In this setup The angles are very tight and this leads to derailment.
I model in N gauge so bearing that in mind I would go for the curved points. You have long radius points giving those locos with long wheelbases and longer bogies a much better chance of successful crossing. I have used many of the set track curved points which use 2nd and third radius curves. Those did cause a few issues, but... I do have loads on Piccadilly now and 95% are fine. I do keep them clean, and I also brush them with alcohol and a toothbrush from time to time. I honestly think they will be fine. However if you are in doubt, you could try one, set up a trial stretch ( ie the point and and few bits of flexy or straights) and just test all your locos, especially the bigger ones, at high speed and slowly. Both ways. Remember those curves are really shallow. You will need to power every point and each frog or you will encounter power issues.
I have used curved code 75 in my layout without any problems. How about using 3 way points after the curved ones as you'll get 3 lines in half the space of using 2 curved or straight points. Works really well for me on a short upper fiddle yard. Mark.
The problems people have with curved points are usually Hornby ones, or those with Hornby geometry in the Setrack range. I cannot recall reading of problems with Streamline range, either code 75 or code 100. I have Streamline code 100 (including curved points, but not three-way points), some of it (I am sad to say) not laid all that well and I have no trouble at all, even with very old insulfrog versions. I will state two provisos. Firstly, ensure back-to-back wheel dimensions are correct at 14.3 - 14.6mm. Various gauges are available. Mine is a Markits 14.5mm, and I even get away with running British Trix from the 70's. Secondly, especially if you use insulfrog points, keep loco wheels (including wheel backs) and pick-up contacts clean, but I feel you already do that.
I have used curved points on my layout. BUT for your information, check out what Richard has done on the fiddle yard for the new Everard Junction. I am certain that he has used curved points on that fiddle yard.
Hi Paul, Further to our conversation, it appears that you have no real choice.I believe that de-railing is more likely to occur on facing curved points than a trailing ones. On our club layout it was the leading bogie on steam engines such as 4-6-0 or 2-10-0 that was the main cause of the problem. It would be useful to hear from anyone else whether the problems are limited to steam. Regards Charlie
curved turnout would just mean slower track speeds. they must work or they would not still be on the market. I do have one curved turnout.. but i use code 83. but i have had no problems with it
The number of roads is (primarily) limited by the width of the area between the main line and the wall behind your layout in that area. You might already realise this. The length of the area is a secondary consideration. Putting three or four Peco curved points together (geometrically correctly) end to end heel to toe will lead you into a geometry where some of the (flextrack) roads will need to be laid to (optionally first continue to wind left then) wind right to ultimately align straight and parallel to each other. I am probably giving my opinion too late... If you look at aerial photographs of full size marshalling yards, I do not think you will see curved points used in the ladder.
Hi Paul. Those points should be perfect. It's by far better to use the large radius turnouts than the set track type - though that said both work perfectly fine as I run both types on my layout with out any issues. Jamie over at Pennyhill has the same set up you're going for with his fiddle yard except his track and points in that area are code 100.
Hi , not used code 75 but have both Hornby and Peco curved points on my layout and no problems with them, think it is more important tp make sure the track is level. Glynn
From what I know if you have a curved turnout you must slow your speed down I know I have one curved turnout on my layout and I am actually using code 100 Atlas put all my turn out for number 6 I hope this helps you and I did enjoy the video look forward to seeing you next one
I only use Peco code 100 large radius points [except for a couple of small sidings] I have curved points on my mainline and I have no problem whatsoever irrespective of which direction the trains are travelling.
Hi, I use Code 100 large radius curved points on my layout and i have had no problems with derailments at whatever speed the trains run, although my fiddle yard did have straight points i'm now changing this to curved points. I also toyed with the idea of changing to Code 75 track but with a layout as big as mine the cost was horrendous. Cheers Ian
I have used code 75 curved turnouts on my layout with no problems encountered. Just make sure your track is level and wired correctly and you should have no problems
In Peco code 75 the curved points have the same size as the large radius straight points. Don't see there can be a problem. I have 24 points on my layout. Most of them are curved points. No problems with them.
Hi Paul Sorry I can't say about code 75. But I use code 55 on my n gauge and I have no problem. Can you put a 3 way point in to gain number 12 line. Colin
Look up "Chadwick Jnctn" that fella is having the same problem! My thoughts are and this comes from someone who has built more little layouts than hot dinners, if they were such a liability would PECO still manufacture them? Nope! Just don't loose the radius! All I can say is Sandling Junction is going to be one hell of a layout, I for one cannot wait to see it finished
I dont get all this dont use curved points. OK, I probably wouldnt use Hornby curved points but Peco are generally better built. I think some people have issues with curved points because they dont install them properly ie level or, have faulty back to backs on their wheels.
I have mixture, don't have a problem using code100. Only one straight point is issue due to not being perfectly flat. That goes for any point intersections , No humps or bumps.
hello. ok, i'm in the states, and we call 'em turnouts, and I would absolutely used the curved ones in this situation.
I would also encourage you to use code 100 everything. track, turnouts diamonds and all. because, code 100 automatically has fewer issues compared to code 75, 83, or whatever.
what happens, at least over here, is not all wheel flanges are created equal.
code 75 rail is more likely to allow large flange wheels to "bottom out" in which case, the wheel is now no longer on the rail head, but riding on the ties, or ballast, on the flange itself.
a car riding on it's flanges is more likely to derail in a curved turnout, than on a straight one.
simply because it's got to make a turn rather than just keep going straight.
refer to sir Issac about objects staying in motion.....
I most cases, a car that derails (at any given point where the other cars do not) is the fault of the car, not the track regardless of rail code.
if all the cars derail at a certain spot, then it's the track, or turnout or whatever.
remember this, at arms length, once installed, ballasted, scenery applied, car on track etc, you'll be hard pressed to tell the difference between track code anyhow.
I've been enjoying your posts quite a bit.
please keep 'em coming.
As you know from our recent discussion, it's definitely a YES from me with regards to the curved points. I have code 100 large radius points on the fiddle yard and the code 75 equivalent on the scenic part of the layout. I've had no issues whatsoever.
Your plan is very similar to my 11 road fiddle yard and I'm so pleased with mine and how well it operates.
Best of luck
Jamie
Hi Jamie many thanks, I am watching your progress with keen interest, and following closely in your wake, and that of Richards too.Many thanks for your kind imput, Paul
When i first used curved points on my layout i had problems with some trains derailing, it was where a flexitrack curve joined the curved point. I think the problem was that there was a bit of sudden radius change at the join (a bit of a dog-leg). To prevent this happening now i use a track setta curve (if possible) to ease the join between the flexitrack &the curve of the point, basically, trying to maintain the same radius out of the point a little way past the join. I hope that explanation makes sense!
I mostly run diesel but having read the other comments, i can also see how steam loco's may be more intolerant of badly laid track.
Grant Williams hi grant that is worth noting a valid point excuse the pun, regards paul
The biggest issue is using two code 100 settrack curved points to make a crossover from a second radius curve to third radius. In this setup The angles are very tight and this leads to derailment.
1971merlin that shall have to watch and smooth wherever I can, thank you, regards Paul
I model in N gauge so bearing that in mind I would go for the curved points. You have long radius points giving those locos with long wheelbases and longer bogies a much better chance of successful crossing. I have used many of the set track curved points which use 2nd and third radius curves. Those did cause a few issues, but... I do have loads on Piccadilly now and 95% are fine. I do keep them clean, and I also brush them with alcohol and a toothbrush from time to time.
I honestly think they will be fine. However if you are in doubt, you could try one, set up a trial stretch ( ie the point and and few bits of flexy or straights) and just test all your locos, especially the bigger ones, at high speed and slowly. Both ways. Remember those curves are really shallow. You will need to power every point and each frog or you will encounter power issues.
Hi John, many thanks for that reply, I think most are in favour, cheers Paul
Never thought of using tooth brush, great idea....
Hi Paul, Curved, it's a relatively shallow curve and will maximize your fiddle yard storage space!
Loving the progress
Hi Sam , many thanks, and agree with that statement, glad you're enjoying the buils so far, best, Paul
I have used curved code 75 in my layout without any problems. How about using 3 way points after the curved ones as you'll get 3 lines in half the space of using 2 curved or straight points. Works really well for me on a short upper fiddle yard. Mark.
Hi Mark i have tried threes way, but the third runs into the others need to play with templates thanks , Paul
The problems people have with curved points are usually Hornby ones, or those with Hornby geometry in the Setrack range. I cannot recall reading of problems with Streamline range, either code 75 or code 100. I have Streamline code 100 (including curved points, but not three-way points), some of it (I am sad to say) not laid all that well and I have no trouble at all, even with very old insulfrog versions. I will state two provisos. Firstly, ensure back-to-back wheel dimensions are correct at 14.3 - 14.6mm. Various gauges are available. Mine is a Markits 14.5mm, and I even get away with running British Trix from the 70's. Secondly, especially if you use insulfrog points, keep loco wheels (including wheel backs) and pick-up contacts clean, but I feel you already do that.
Allan all great advice think overall I shall go for the 75 curved point thank you so much, Paul
You're welcome. Good luck with the project.
I have used curved points on my layout.
BUT for your information, check out what Richard has done on the fiddle yard for the new Everard Junction.
I am certain that he has used curved points on that fiddle yard.
Hi there indeed he has as have Jamie form Pennyhill, so think ill be in good company. many thanks, Paul
Hi Paul, Further to our conversation, it appears that you have no real choice.I believe that de-railing is more likely to occur on facing curved points than a trailing ones. On our club layout it was the leading bogie on steam engines such as 4-6-0 or 2-10-0 that was the main cause of the problem. It would be useful to hear from anyone else whether the problems are limited to steam. Regards Charlie
Hi Charlie, I hung that washing out as described, Best wishes Paul, I hope no issue as 90 percent of my stock are steamers
curved turnout would just mean slower track speeds. they must work or they would not still be on the market. I do have one curved turnout.. but i use code 83. but i have had no problems with it
Hi Sparky, yes they were my thoughts interesting about speeds going in, cheers Paul
The number of roads is (primarily) limited by the width of the area between the main line and the wall behind your layout in that area. You might already realise this. The length of the area is a secondary consideration.
Putting three or four Peco curved points together (geometrically correctly) end to end heel to toe will lead you into a geometry where some of the (flextrack) roads will need to be laid to (optionally first continue to wind left then) wind right to ultimately align straight and parallel to each other.
I am probably giving my opinion too late...
If you look at aerial photographs of full size marshalling yards, I do not think you will see curved points used in the ladder.
if you are going into a fiddle yard cant see why not use curved,doubt you would travel full chat through yards would you ?
The two main through will be at typicalspeed, never thrash locos as unrealistic, so yes agree with your point, regards Paul
Hi Paul. Those points should be perfect. It's by far better to use the large radius turnouts than the set track type - though that said both work perfectly fine as I run both types on my layout with out any issues.
Jamie over at Pennyhill has the same set up you're going for with his fiddle yard except his track and points in that area are code 100.
Hi Tim, cheers chum, yeah I am following Jamies progress closely, he is a few steps ahead of me which is good. Best wishes to you , Paul
Hi , not used code 75 but have both Hornby and Peco curved points on my layout and no problems with them, think it is more important tp make sure the track is level. Glynn
Thank you for that reply , regards Paul
From what I know if you have a curved turnout you must slow your speed down I know I have one curved turnout on my layout and I am actually using code 100 Atlas put all my turn out for number 6 I hope this helps you and I did enjoy the video look forward to seeing you next one
BALD8BIL many thanks to you, yes will keep speeds appropriate and glad you like things do far, regards. Paul
I only use Peco code 100 large radius points [except for a couple of small sidings] I have curved points on my mainline and I have no problem whatsoever irrespective of which direction the trains are travelling.
Greg Hale that's good to know Greg and thank you fingers crossed ill have no issues, regards Paul
Hi, I use Code 100 large radius curved points on my layout and i have had no problems with derailments at whatever speed the trains run, although my fiddle yard did have straight points i'm now changing this to curved points. I also toyed with the idea of changing to Code 75 track but with a layout as big as mine the cost was horrendous.
Cheers
Ian
Thank Ian, I get the cost thing totally, as mine is my first major construction finescale was an easy choice, regards Paul
I think go for curved points because of the lighter curve on the ones you bought
Thanks Luke , seems most agree with you, cheers Paul
I have used code 75 curved turnouts on my layout with no problems encountered. Just make sure your track is level and wired correctly and you should have no problems
Many thanks Peter I have noted your points and will make sure, thank you , Paul
Streamline (Code75 or Code100) are much bigger radius than curved SetTrack points, you should have no issues at all as long as everything is level.
I use curve points on the main line with no trouble, so in a fill yard, it should not cause a problem.
SF-RATON-NZ thank you, yes it's seems the majority in favour, regards Paul
In Peco code 75 the curved points have the same size as the large radius straight points. Don't see there can be a problem. I have 24 points on my layout. Most of them are curved points. No problems with them.
Hi Paul Sorry I can't say about code 75. But I use code 55 on my n gauge and I have no problem. Can you put a 3 way point in to gain number 12 line. Colin
Hi Coilin, many thanks, and will look intio using a threeway, cheers Paul
Look up "Chadwick Jnctn" that fella is having the same problem! My thoughts are and this comes from someone who has built more little layouts than hot dinners, if they were such a liability would PECO still manufacture them? Nope! Just don't loose the radius! All I can say is Sandling Junction is going to be one hell of a layout, I for one cannot wait to see it finished
Never had a problem
Very kind and thanks for that, seems that way to go. Paul
I dont get all this dont use curved points. OK, I probably wouldnt use Hornby curved points but Peco are generally better built. I think some people have issues with curved points because they dont install them properly ie level or, have faulty back to backs on their wheels.
I have mixture, don't have a problem using code100. Only one straight point is issue due to not being perfectly flat. That goes for any point intersections , No humps or bumps.
Richard Swallow Richard thanks makes perfect sense regards Paul
No issues whatsoever with Code 75 curved points. Barry
I am only commenting to say I can't comment. 😁
Lol, Anthony,good to hear from you anyway, best, Paul
Go with curved code 100
Three way turnouts fot the bill