This is such a great strategy. I watched a few of the 6-7-8 videos then I set up my crap,table. Buy in was $1100. I played 15 rounds and left with $3365. Just amazing. None of my strategies ever had these results.
When the dont point was 9, if you want to reduce your risk by 100 simply place bet the 9 for 90 and you will either win 5 back (105 - 100) when pt is rolled or 10 (100 - 90 ) when 7 is rolled.
After the third hit the hand would be paid for if you regress to $135 and remove the DP. Everything after that becomes profit with zero risk to bankroll.
Interesting Jacob. I think there is room for some tweaks such as on Vincent's comment below. Besides that, what do you think about maybe after a few hits when the point is 4 or 10, placing for $200 and drop the box numbers down to $189 across and play with zero risk to your bankroll and pressing from there? Just an idea. As always love your content. Keep 'em coming!
When the point is 5, 6, 8 or 9, place the difference on the number that is the point, Example : if the point is 5, keep 400 on the don't and place the 5 for 100.
This is costing you money in the long run because the dont will win more times than it loses after it has survived the come out roll. Stop trying to cover every number. Just let the dont bet play out. You can thank me later
I really can't get behind this play as shown and it could do with a few adjustments. First problem is the use of a large don't bet, it's a 50/50 bet that goes wrong as much as it goes right but it can go wrong many times before it gets a chance to go right on each shooter. Hedging the comeout tries to fix part of the problem with Dont bets. Because 23% of don't bets lose on the comeout it's much worse than it appears as we have to face another comeout with another chance of failure! Because we pay the comeout hedge every single comeout roll, it means we get taxed more than $60 on average. This is kind of a bad deal and our effective don't cover gets whittled away with each losing wager or push on the comeout. Not that I like the comeout hedge but if we must I would think about laying the back wall, that way when a horn rolls which happens as often as the seven we don't pay the hop tax and preserve the effective cover of the don't less the yo hedge. Even with the comeout hedge, the don't comeout failures will still hurt a ton. Now the second issue I have is if one wants to reduce the don't its far better to buy or place against it on the 5,6,8&9 than pick it up, especially after paying the comeout hedge tax. At least get something back for the risk. $204 on the 6 or 8 will give about $36 extra if the don't is hit to help pay that comeout tax. Imagine you layed the back wall for $54 a piece to give you $206 of cover for the seven, you eventually set the point on the 6 and lost a $54 lay and then knock off the don't, your comeout tax for the seven hedge is now effectively just $18. If the seven comes early, then great the comeout tax was a cost of doing business. If you set the point on the 4 or 10 I'd still add a $35 buy to cover the comeout hedge if the point gets hit and on the 5&9 I'd make the buy somewhere around $120 to win $180. This way the more the don't fails your hedge tax is self funding and when the don't wins you still pocket a win less hedge tax.
@@wagermethis let me first say I don't think this play is good because of the large don't bet vs the bankroll. The comeout hedge is trying to fix a fundamentally high risk play. My suggested adjustments are a bit like trying to make a silk purse from a sows ear, the hedge is just too big a tax on profit in the first place and reducing the don't after the point is set is never as good vs placing or buying against it which allows you to at least recover some of the come-out hedge for free (it's a pure win-win) when the don't gets hit. After the don't loses the very next roll you'll again be going back into another comeout without a win and coughing up both a $400 don't and a $60 hedge from your bankroll. When a 12 rolls that's another $60 hedge, or a yo it's another $45 hedge, at least the lay across doesn't lose on those events, and it also doesn't lose on the 2 or 3 either increasing profitability.
@@CrapsDownUnder Laying across nearly guarantees your going to start down. I dont like Laying across, and I know the math says it's good, but a actual game play in the casino with real money has shown me different. It loses far too often, I would rather put my losses based in a dont point, than 6 Lay numbers. Yeah when you lose, it's more, but the Lay across loses nearly every comeout
@@wagermethis I get you don't like the lay, but it's still better than hopping the reds again and again on every single comeout roll. The lay is only intended to be used instead of hopping the reds because it doesn't cost you by losing on the 6 horn numbers and you don't lose $30 on the other two hops when you win on it either. The $45 hopping the reds for $15 a piece pays $225 and loses $30 and overall costs more than the lay. Over 36 rolls your total wins on the seven is (6×15×15) = $1350 and your total losses amount to (30×$45+6×$30) = $1530 for an overall expected loss of $180 over 36 rolls. Where the lay of $54 only costs the vig of (6×10)=$60, same number of win events, very similar payout ($216) but most importantly 6 less losing events which is the key difference. Despite all that I'm not recommending this kind of hedged play, I really don't like it. If the don't bet is too big for your bankroll use a smaller don't and live within the means of the bankroll. My main argument is if you really must hedge then at least try to do it in a way that costs less on average and also place/buy against don't bets if you want less exposure, at least that way you cut the hedge tax when the don't bet invariably fails. You are only motivated to reduce the exposure on the 5,6,8,9 because the bet is too big for the bankroll and you believe it's more likely to hit, resulting in another comeout hedge tax. Ultimately I'd just use a smaller don't bet and add free odds on the desirable numbers and throw all the hedge nonsense in the trash as the math doesn't stack up, it's simply not a sound play.
Really doesn't make a difference, either your reducing the dont to get your exposure where you like or your adding a place bet to reduce the exposure. Still the same risk
Great vid…really…this video is about hedging your Don’t come out roll. I think you typically don’t like to hedge the Don’t come out roll…but that’s alright…if it works on $400 it would also work on a lower amount…albeit you kind of mentioned that in this vid. My change would be that if a 6/8 is rolled on Don’t come out, then I would just place against the 6/8 for a guaranteed winner which would pay relatively nice with a $400 don’t.
If you are the shooter you can't do this. Once you make a DP bet as the shooter, you cannot reduce it or add to it. Also you can't remove it..as the shooter. Essentially it becomes a contract bet because it is your ante to be able to shoot. This would work on any other shooter, but I've seen random shooters hit ten after ten..or five or nine. If you want to do this make a small DP and a large DC after or lay the number.
@@wagermethis Where? Are you saying you can actually continue shooting with no money on the table if you feel like taking it all off? Wow..where is that? May be, but I have never run into a place that allowed that and I've been playing for 50 years.
@@nickboretz1774 not what I said. I said you ha e to place a Pass line bet and then your Dont can be pulled. Not every where allows it but all allow you to reduce
Jacob is correct, you only need to keep the minimum on the don't if you're the shooter or use a put bet (adding a passline after the point). In all other cases where you're not the shooter you can remove the don't bet as it is NOT a contract bet. The casino lets you do this as it's always to their advantage, same as your odds not working on the comeout by default, it increases the house edge and is to your disadvantage and why you have to remember to tell them every damn time to work the odds.
Never, ever reduce your dont bet after it survives the come out. That is literally throwing a guaranteed winner away. If you want to elininate the risk, place bet the same number and you cant lose
Just rolled about 50 spins with a couple of modifications and it worked beautifully. I lowered the don't to $200 (kept the hedge at $60) and, once a 5,6,8,or 9 point was established i dropped $100 onto the pass line to hedge the don't. Only takes a couple of rolls at $70 per win to be in the black and then it's press and pull for as long as the roll lasts. Two number hits and the hundred on the pass line covers any seven, and every number hit after that is pure profit.
@Math Guru- Buddy are you trying to say by taking the don't bet down and 100% of the time you're costing yourself money means you are saying that 100% of the time NOBODY makes their point?????
I really like the idea of regressing the don't pass bet depending upon the point.
I like it. Thanks for showing it.
This is such a great strategy. I watched a few of the 6-7-8 videos then I set up my crap,table. Buy in was $1100. I played 15 rounds and left with $3365. Just amazing. None of my strategies ever had these results.
Thanks Jacob and Seb, I like this variation, it is like putting up your odds before the point is set and the “vig” is the hedge. Cheers. Rob
When the dont point was 9, if you want to reduce your risk by 100 simply place bet the 9 for 90 and you will either win 5 back (105 - 100) when pt is rolled or 10 (100 - 90 ) when 7 is rolled.
Excellent idea for the come out on the 678 strategy. Play with what makes you comfortable after point established. I like it 2 👍’s up
After the third hit the hand would be paid for if you regress to $135 and remove the DP. Everything after that becomes profit with zero risk to bankroll.
Anybody ever think of laying a back wall on the come out except on the 6 and 8? And to take it further you might even have a place bet on the 6 and 8?
Interesting Jacob. I think there is room for some tweaks such as on Vincent's comment below. Besides that, what do you think about maybe after a few hits when the point is 4 or 10, placing for $200 and drop the box numbers down to $189 across and play with zero risk to your bankroll and pressing from there? Just an idea. As always love your content. Keep 'em coming!
I like that alot
Lol..."the only way to win ....". I like that...both the strat and your commentaries
You should rerun the $3203, i love your high limit videos dood :)
Excellent video and even better comments from others. Thanks 🙏 .
Thank you
This is what i was looking for..thanks guys
Would you consider placing a wager on the hard 4 and/or 10 to hedge if the point is on one of these numbers?
This is a very old video of mine. I honestly would have to rewatch this to answer you correctly
Jacob, You already shown this strategy at a lower level. With a $75 Don’t and 110 inside.
I hop 2 sevens instead of 3 works great for me. Nice video
I like that, that is a great move
@@wagermethis if you dice set and throw controlled you can chart which 7's you throw the least, just hop the other two, I agree.
What level do you like to play?
@@samhall2050 not sure what your asking
When the point is 5, 6, 8 or 9, place the difference on the number that is the point, Example : if the point is 5, keep 400 on the don't and place the 5 for 100.
I like that..
What about for the 6 or 8?
@@jaimesalas6940 Place it for 198
Thank you
This is costing you money in the long run because the dont will win more times than it loses after it has survived the come out roll. Stop trying to cover every number. Just let the dont bet play out. You can thank me later
Similar to Vince Armenti's Place the point, Invest the difference strategy
Yeah, I worked with Vince a lot when I was Blue Collar Sports. Hes awesome
I really can't get behind this play as shown and it could do with a few adjustments.
First problem is the use of a large don't bet, it's a 50/50 bet that goes wrong as much as it goes right but it can go wrong many times before it gets a chance to go right on each shooter.
Hedging the comeout tries to fix part of the problem with Dont bets. Because 23% of don't bets lose on the comeout it's much worse than it appears as we have to face another comeout with another chance of failure! Because we pay the comeout hedge every single comeout roll, it means we get taxed more than $60 on average. This is kind of a bad deal and our effective don't cover gets whittled away with each losing wager or push on the comeout.
Not that I like the comeout hedge but if we must I would think about laying the back wall, that way when a horn rolls which happens as often as the seven we don't pay the hop tax and preserve the effective cover of the don't less the yo hedge.
Even with the comeout hedge, the don't comeout failures will still hurt a ton.
Now the second issue I have is if one wants to reduce the don't its far better to buy or place against it on the 5,6,8&9 than pick it up, especially after paying the comeout hedge tax. At least get something back for the risk. $204 on the 6 or 8 will give about $36 extra if the don't is hit to help pay that comeout tax. Imagine you layed the back wall for $54 a piece to give you $206 of cover for the seven, you eventually set the point on the 6 and lost a $54 lay and then knock off the don't, your comeout tax for the seven hedge is now effectively just $18. If the seven comes early, then great the comeout tax was a cost of doing business. If you set the point on the 4 or 10 I'd still add a $35 buy to cover the comeout hedge if the point gets hit and on the 5&9 I'd make the buy somewhere around $120 to win $180.
This way the more the don't fails your hedge tax is self funding and when the don't wins you still pocket a win less hedge tax.
Try what your saying, I bet it doesnt work as well as you think
@@wagermethis let me first say I don't think this play is good because of the large don't bet vs the bankroll. The comeout hedge is trying to fix a fundamentally high risk play.
My suggested adjustments are a bit like trying to make a silk purse from a sows ear, the hedge is just too big a tax on profit in the first place and reducing the don't after the point is set is never as good vs placing or buying against it which allows you to at least recover some of the come-out hedge for free (it's a pure win-win) when the don't gets hit. After the don't loses the very next roll you'll again be going back into another comeout without a win and coughing up both a $400 don't and a $60 hedge from your bankroll. When a 12 rolls that's another $60 hedge, or a yo it's another $45 hedge, at least the lay across doesn't lose on those events, and it also doesn't lose on the 2 or 3 either increasing profitability.
@@CrapsDownUnder Laying across nearly guarantees your going to start down. I dont like Laying across, and I know the math says it's good, but a actual game play in the casino with real money has shown me different. It loses far too often, I would rather put my losses based in a dont point, than 6 Lay numbers. Yeah when you lose, it's more, but the Lay across loses nearly every comeout
@@wagermethis I get you don't like the lay, but it's still better than hopping the reds again and again on every single comeout roll. The lay is only intended to be used instead of hopping the reds because it doesn't cost you by losing on the 6 horn numbers and you don't lose $30 on the other two hops when you win on it either.
The $45 hopping the reds for $15 a piece pays $225 and loses $30 and overall costs more than the lay. Over 36 rolls your total wins on the seven is (6×15×15) = $1350 and your total losses amount to (30×$45+6×$30) = $1530 for an overall expected loss of $180 over 36 rolls. Where the lay of $54 only costs the vig of (6×10)=$60, same number of win events, very similar payout ($216) but most importantly 6 less losing events which is the key difference.
Despite all that I'm not recommending this kind of hedged play, I really don't like it. If the don't bet is too big for your bankroll use a smaller don't and live within the means of the bankroll.
My main argument is if you really must hedge then at least try to do it in a way that costs less on average and also place/buy against don't bets if you want less exposure, at least that way you cut the hedge tax when the don't bet invariably fails. You are only motivated to reduce the exposure on the 5,6,8,9 because the bet is too big for the bankroll and you believe it's more likely to hit, resulting in another comeout hedge tax.
Ultimately I'd just use a smaller don't bet and add free odds on the desirable numbers and throw all the hedge nonsense in the trash as the math doesn't stack up, it's simply not a sound play.
After a couple hits ..place the point so there wont be no risk at all.. All profit.. .. Wat do you think?
Yeah it will work great
What about leaving at $400 but on 5&9 place it for $100 so if it hits you make $140. And on 6&8 place for $180 and if hits you get $210 but lose $400
Really doesn't make a difference, either your reducing the dont to get your exposure where you like or your adding a place bet to reduce the exposure. Still the same risk
Great vid…really…this video is about hedging your Don’t come out roll. I think you typically don’t like to hedge the Don’t come out roll…but that’s alright…if it works on $400 it would also work on a lower amount…albeit you kind of mentioned that in this vid. My change would be that if a 6/8 is rolled on Don’t come out, then I would just place against the 6/8 for a guaranteed winner which would pay relatively nice with a $400 don’t.
I like it. Thanks Jacob and Seb.
like the video, is there a written down version of the rules, I found it hard to follow kinda new to craps
Yes I ha e many 678 videos. They are in my channel videos
I looked in the comments and didn't find the instructions, you said channel section but where thanks
@@interestedplayer4486 Its called... Craps! 6,7,8 In depth Breakdown
Wizardofodds
If you are the shooter you can't do this. Once you make a DP bet as the shooter, you cannot reduce it or add to it. Also you can't remove it..as the shooter. Essentially it becomes a contract bet because it is your ante to be able to shoot. This would work on any other shooter, but I've seen random shooters hit ten after ten..or five or nine. If you want to do this make a small DP and a large DC after or lay the number.
Yes you can. You can reduce it and even take it down some places
@@wagermethis Where? Are you saying you can actually continue shooting with no money on the table if you feel like taking it all off? Wow..where is that? May be, but I have never run into a place that allowed that and I've been playing for 50 years.
@@nickboretz1774 not what I said. I said you ha e to place a Pass line bet and then your Dont can be pulled. Not every where allows it but all allow you to reduce
Jacob is correct, you only need to keep the minimum on the don't if you're the shooter or use a put bet (adding a passline after the point). In all other cases where you're not the shooter you can remove the don't bet as it is NOT a contract bet.
The casino lets you do this as it's always to their advantage, same as your odds not working on the comeout by default, it increases the house edge and is to your disadvantage and why you have to remember to tell them every damn time to work the odds.
Never, ever reduce your dont bet after it survives the come out. That is literally throwing a guaranteed winner away. If you want to elininate the risk, place bet the same number and you cant lose
Just rolled about 50 spins with a couple of modifications and it worked beautifully. I lowered the don't to $200 (kept the hedge at $60) and, once a 5,6,8,or 9 point was established i dropped $100 onto the pass line to hedge the don't. Only takes a couple of rolls at $70 per win to be in the black and then it's press and pull for as long as the roll lasts. Two number hits and the hundred on the pass line covers any seven, and every number hit after that is pure profit.
I like it
Why not take a couple of hits on the box numbers and take him down and play against the four
Taking down the dont pass after point is established is stupid. You are costing yourself money 100% of the time
@Math Guru- Buddy are you trying to say by taking the don't bet down and 100% of the time you're costing yourself money means you are saying that 100% of the time NOBODY makes their point?????
Hop 7 and 11 are two of the worst bets you can make. This strategy is TERRIBLE