Making a song using only the Moog Grandmother synth

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ความคิดเห็น • 388

  • @andrewhuang
    @andrewhuang 6 ปีที่แล้ว +580

    lovely sounds and great idea for a really nice setup/workflow between an analog monosynth and daw

    • @granteubanks
      @granteubanks 6 ปีที่แล้ว +18

      Please tell me you're gonna make a video on the grandmother eventually. I would die of happiness.

    • @alexanderhuliakov6012
      @alexanderhuliakov6012 6 ปีที่แล้ว

      Hello Andrew!

    • @onceuponasynth
      @onceuponasynth  6 ปีที่แล้ว +35

      thanks dude! means a lot coming from you.

    • @JazzyWaveOfficial
      @JazzyWaveOfficial 6 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      @@granteubanks I don't think Andrew owns a Grandmother.. yet!

    • @chillnoqq
      @chillnoqq 6 ปีที่แล้ว

      @@granteubanks YESSS

  • @jakobsdigitalerpalast
    @jakobsdigitalerpalast 6 ปีที่แล้ว +544

    the vocals should've been from your real grandmother

    • @TundrahSounds
      @TundrahSounds 6 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      jakob 🤣

    • @dwilz1183
      @dwilz1183 6 ปีที่แล้ว

      Damn that's funny!!

    • @zawotto3206
      @zawotto3206 6 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      lmao

    • @krzemian
      @krzemian 3 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      or from a grandmother from another drummer

    • @RadicalCaveman
      @RadicalCaveman 2 ปีที่แล้ว

      "I don't want to tell you what to do, young man!"

  • @sdrozo
    @sdrozo 6 ปีที่แล้ว +124

    All the sounds except the voice of your grandmother's grandson

  • @EngoneEndong
    @EngoneEndong 6 ปีที่แล้ว +106

    Just received my Grandmother. Words can't properly express how I feel. This synth is a MONSTER!!
    My first Moog ever.

    • @Evolvermn
      @Evolvermn 6 ปีที่แล้ว +3

      Congratulations!!

    • @Ekebis
      @Ekebis 6 ปีที่แล้ว +3

      I wanted to have one to but it's takes more $1.013,41 cents to deliver where I live

    • @EngoneEndong
      @EngoneEndong 6 ปีที่แล้ว

      Evolverman Thank you!

    • @anyvideo8876
      @anyvideo8876 6 ปีที่แล้ว

      I feel you...

    • @HotStrange
      @HotStrange 6 ปีที่แล้ว +2

      LB music sucks man :( save up hard if you want it bad enough!

  • @TundrahSounds
    @TundrahSounds 6 ปีที่แล้ว +42

    I almost forgot to leave a comment. This video deserves an applause. I love this! This was a very good demonstration of what you can get out of just one synth!

    • @onceuponasynth
      @onceuponasynth  6 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      Thanks!

    • @zibbezabba2491
      @zibbezabba2491 6 ปีที่แล้ว +3

      You're right, it's amazing what you can get out of 1 synth. I opened mine up and found 3 slices of pepperoni, a scratched 'kings of leon' cd and a hamster that went missing 3 years ago.

    • @TundrahSounds
      @TundrahSounds 6 ปีที่แล้ว

      Zibbe Zabba 😂

  • @Protegit
    @Protegit 5 ปีที่แล้ว +6

    2:45 My heart stopped there for a second when I heard dembow and thought you were gonna go with it xD

  • @_EightySix
    @_EightySix 6 ปีที่แล้ว +6

    Wow, that is really impressive! The percussion sounds and then the vocal, never would've thought that'd come out of that synth.

  • @CayroproductionsAdan
    @CayroproductionsAdan 5 ปีที่แล้ว +3

    Man this synth takes you to a whole different world!!! And imagine all possibilities you could make this synth do!

  • @brandondalton113
    @brandondalton113 2 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    Oh my God those sounds are so beautiful. Definitely buying right now

  • @seancraig5373
    @seancraig5373 5 ปีที่แล้ว

    FANTASTIC tune-LOVE it!! The sounds of the grandmother are truly wonderful, and you've put together something really unique and special here. Well done! Truly a showcase for the Moog Grandmother

  •  6 ปีที่แล้ว +6

    That is a very nice song, with very nice sounds. And sweet moves at the end! :)

  • @stephenkloppenburg6259
    @stephenkloppenburg6259 6 ปีที่แล้ว

    Number 1 synth jam of 2018!!!
    No lie this video was probably the biggesr factor for me deciding to save and buy a Grandmother rather than a minilogue as my first hardware synth.
    Would love to see a video going into greater depth on how you made some of the patches in this video. Particularly the 1st pad and 1st lead patches.
    Or honestly any grandmother videos. You’re a huge inspiration keep it up.

  • @justinraymund
    @justinraymund 6 ปีที่แล้ว +3

    This was really cool to watch. I appreciate you sharing your process. Looks fun! Inspires me to do the same with my synths.

  • @Dogboy73
    @Dogboy73 ปีที่แล้ว

    Great video of a Great synth. Keep coming back to the Grandmother. Fantastic synth.

  • @gorillabraudcast474
    @gorillabraudcast474 5 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Im amazed by the percussive sounds you came up with. I also got the grandmother and use it on every track now . The bass lines are so fat . And the endless mid and higher ranged sounds are what ive always been after but didn't know what machine could produce it. The grandmother is awesome. All moogs are but this one imparticurly dope sounding

  • @BAHTY3_228
    @BAHTY3_228 5 ปีที่แล้ว

    This is freakin awesome! The grandmother sounds dope, also these melodies is very beautiful too, i love it.

  • @Berzrk-Z
    @Berzrk-Z 3 ปีที่แล้ว

    This was so awesome man! Thanks for describing what you were doing for each sound and whatnot

  • @sirmidi5144
    @sirmidi5144 6 ปีที่แล้ว

    I really appreciated the way you showed the evolution of your creative process.

  • @dreambreeder079
    @dreambreeder079 6 ปีที่แล้ว

    Another great video and track! Also I actually think the vocals are pretty cool. Definitely different but in a good way.

  • @grandhustle8711
    @grandhustle8711 6 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Incredibly creative! Also very impressive how much you know about sound design.

  • @michaelbennett8981
    @michaelbennett8981 5 ปีที่แล้ว

    This is unique! The trouble with synths, is that is easy to make unusable/silly sounds, as showcased in many demonstrations. Thank you for your creativity, knowledge and and inspiring process that you so kindly shared :-)

  • @seanchristophersynthesizer6999
    @seanchristophersynthesizer6999 6 ปีที่แล้ว

    Great job! :) I also love making full tracks using just one of my synths. It's always a fun challenge and often helps me learn that particular synth even better in the process.

  • @theTerribleFamiliar
    @theTerribleFamiliar 6 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Your videos are the best. Thanks for sharing so much of your process with us. This particular video is as informative as it is inspiring.

  • @dandykaufman2
    @dandykaufman2 6 ปีที่แล้ว

    really nice. vocals are really good. that's a good practice as I find myself playing a lot of leads that I sometimes think are just where a rap verse should go.

  • @johnpaton9587
    @johnpaton9587 6 ปีที่แล้ว

    Bloody awesome!! Very inspiring :) I have had my eye on this synth for a while, totally sold. Hopefully I can be as creative as yourself. Thanks for sharing ;)

  • @0zymanndias773
    @0zymanndias773 5 ปีที่แล้ว

    WHATEVER YOU DID AT 3:50 WAS GORGEOUS! LIKE COME ON DUDE A1

  • @bwest6275
    @bwest6275 6 ปีที่แล้ว +45

    This taught me that a proper drum machine is needed 😁

    • @zuberimusic8844
      @zuberimusic8844 6 ปีที่แล้ว

      True😂😂👌

    • @AzulBeats
      @AzulBeats 6 ปีที่แล้ว +3

      And all them bends are uglyyy 😂

    • @zibbezabba2491
      @zibbezabba2491 6 ปีที่แล้ว +7

      The whole point is using only one synth for all the parts. Dems are de rules.

    • @trollingisasport
      @trollingisasport 6 ปีที่แล้ว

      @@zibbezabba2491 one synth everyone knows the rules

    • @willywilson9683
      @willywilson9683 5 ปีที่แล้ว

      Or just proper knowledge on how to synthesize drums.. this guy is just half assing it

  • @elecsoul8309
    @elecsoul8309 6 ปีที่แล้ว +5

    Really love your work! Thanks for putting so much heart into everything you do!

  • @VCVRackIdeas
    @VCVRackIdeas 6 ปีที่แล้ว

    great experience you have! When I bought my Bass Station 2 this is first thing what I did

  • @greytyson7995
    @greytyson7995 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    Fantastically inspirational! Sorry people are shitting on your voice, this song is absolutely funky. Sounds great. Helped me a lot.

  • @antoinelabbe9580
    @antoinelabbe9580 5 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    you could have processed the vocals threw the grandmother by using the instrument input. a little touch from the filter and envelope would have been lovely! awesome demo though, i really like the way moog is maintaining analog gear alive threw digital mainframe ! subscribed

  • @YMaster77
    @YMaster77 5 ปีที่แล้ว

    I love your videos, I bought my Moog Grandmother today I'm can't wait to do this challenge.

  • @almostwhere
    @almostwhere 6 ปีที่แล้ว

    really loving these videos man, absolutely incredible work and they help me out a tonnn

  • @umonox
    @umonox 6 ปีที่แล้ว

    Cool stuff mate! The track is actually not my style - but somehow, i really like it because it has such a nice vibe to it. Really well done! Thumbs up!

    • @onceuponasynth
      @onceuponasynth  6 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      thanks man! yeah it's not really my style either tbh lol, but somehow it's what came out here. Sometimes the sounds I use drive me towards specific styles.

    • @umonox
      @umonox 6 ปีที่แล้ว

      Actually, i've been thinking bout doing the same for a while now. I have to use the Peak though. The Grandmother was too expensive for my taste :-) Keep going mate. I like these Videos. The Angles from your Cameras are close to perfect and i really like your Color Grading! Have to dive deeper into this in the future as well :-) All the best from Germany

  • @BigDee0903
    @BigDee0903 6 ปีที่แล้ว

    Nice Nice Nice.....I love that vintage sound, it reminds of something Kraftwerk or the Art Of Noise would record back in the day, and the video of Grandma dancing, made the song that much more special! Really artistic bro!

  • @Allekrym
    @Allekrym 6 ปีที่แล้ว +8

    this sounds like if radiohead was formed in the 2010’s I love it

  • @Phractal
    @Phractal 2 ปีที่แล้ว

    A slam dunk case of elder abuse. But sacrifices must be made. Bravo.

  • @BlackenedNL
    @BlackenedNL 6 ปีที่แล้ว +206

    Wtf were those vocals?

    • @brentvalleywhag3477
      @brentvalleywhag3477 6 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      Blackened 😂

    • @Utubesuxmycock
      @Utubesuxmycock 6 ปีที่แล้ว +7

      you clearly havent heard Thom Yorke noob

    • @MatthewMouras
      @MatthewMouras 5 ปีที่แล้ว +2

      They were "amazing"

    • @j_c_93
      @j_c_93 5 ปีที่แล้ว +4

      They were awesome. Go back to your radio pop music bro

    • @finnp.7170
      @finnp.7170 4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      J. Cruise he literally has a death metal pfp. Gojira

  • @jimkraan4202
    @jimkraan4202 6 ปีที่แล้ว

    I use all my synths and drum machines in a DAW-based environment and I was wondering whether the Moog would be worth it in that situation.
    You showed me that is definitely is worth it. Thanks for this video!

    • @onceuponasynth
      @onceuponasynth  6 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      The GM is cool cause it has USB MIDI so it doubles as a MIDI controller too. But using hardware synths is definitely more time consuming. I spent a lot of time making new tracks, routing MIDI and tracking audio (which I edited out of the video). I work much faster with soft synths. But hardware synths are nice to add occasional layers here and there.

  • @elvergalarga4461
    @elvergalarga4461 5 ปีที่แล้ว +12

    Sounds like "lick my flappy foldy folds" from Rick and Morty.

  • @ManCalledMif
    @ManCalledMif 4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Inspiring video. Very full sound from grandmother

  • @CHMgamemedic777
    @CHMgamemedic777 6 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    The grandmother is so godly that it can make a shitty song idea sound good

  • @TomAndreen
    @TomAndreen 6 ปีที่แล้ว

    I love your style, man! These videos are really cool and inspirational to watch. 🌲

  • @JOnnbob
    @JOnnbob 6 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    Make a video like this for every synth you've got! The tutorial aspect of it makes it that much better but the on the fly composition is so cool to see!

    • @onceuponasynth
      @onceuponasynth  6 ปีที่แล้ว

      hehe I'll try. I might do one with SH-101 next.

    • @JOnnbob
      @JOnnbob 6 ปีที่แล้ว

      @@onceuponasynth sweet! Looking forward to it man. I started my synth journey with
      the deepmind 12 a few months ago and owe a lot of what I've learned to you. Keep creating

  • @MrRoskoPeko
    @MrRoskoPeko 6 ปีที่แล้ว +4

    That Grand mother has some juicy character. Nice.

  • @Massy012
    @Massy012 6 ปีที่แล้ว +11

    No wayy.. you're Citizen Park? I remember coming across your channel years ago when you were mainly just showing off gear and sounds. You're channel has developed indefinitely!

    • @Massy012
      @Massy012 6 ปีที่แล้ว

      BTW Elena and Billy, love that tune

    • @onceuponasynth
      @onceuponasynth  6 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      Yeah that's me lol! Thanks man, yeah a couple of year ago I decided to change the name of the channel and start taking it more seriously.

  • @MrValZombi
    @MrValZombi 5 ปีที่แล้ว

    Love your vids. Lots of humility and talents. Keep going. And don’t forget to make your app available on Mac !!!

  • @djtheman9
    @djtheman9 6 ปีที่แล้ว

    Awesome video dawg! Cool workflow!

  • @BAHTY3_228
    @BAHTY3_228 5 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    Still rewatching this sometimes.
    This video are forced me to buy the grandmother.

  • @whocares8735
    @whocares8735 6 ปีที่แล้ว +168

    Weirdest vocals ever

  • @MakingMadBeats
    @MakingMadBeats 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    Amazing man! That brass bass sound 💨🙏

  • @kyleplatz6295
    @kyleplatz6295 3 ปีที่แล้ว

    Hey man! It would be awesome to see you just do a video on synth maintenance- how you keep the Grandmother clean, recalibrating things, all that kinda stuff. Can barely find any synth maintenance vids out there. Would be MUCH appreciated. Peace! ✌🏻

  • @MarnixMohrmannPiano
    @MarnixMohrmannPiano 6 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    7:02 - 7:05 This is perfect for a netflix series intro, that suspension in only three seconds!

  • @varkonyiguitar
    @varkonyiguitar 6 ปีที่แล้ว

    This is soooo cool! 😊

  • @djalexia
    @djalexia 5 ปีที่แล้ว

    Awesome! You’re fierce! Loved it!

  • @devangagogoi6627
    @devangagogoi6627 3 ปีที่แล้ว

    Love the dreamy and lush sounds

  • @PLA.net-DANTE
    @PLA.net-DANTE 3 ปีที่แล้ว

    In this short video I've learned so many stuff , especially about making drums on my xd... thank you so much!

  • @JaapV12
    @JaapV12 3 ปีที่แล้ว

    Great and lovely sounds. I'm hoping to make some songs like yours on my Monologue soon. Working hard and getting better every day.

  • @greenvelvet
    @greenvelvet 3 ปีที่แล้ว

    Great way to way your instrument, to learn synthesis and get the most out of it. Very cool challenge. Restrictions breed Creativity. Make the most with what you got and make it sing.

  • @ztkspace5885
    @ztkspace5885 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    Yo, you are one very inspirational dude. Cool as blue, cool as.

  • @giannipetrocelli472
    @giannipetrocelli472 3 ปีที่แล้ว

    Wow that's awesome. Would be nice to have the patches of those sounds. It would help to learn. You're a master. Thank you

  • @PabloDeModeOfficial
    @PabloDeModeOfficial 5 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    This is insanely good!

  • @BOB_T
    @BOB_T 6 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Genious fantastic love the video. Wow what a synth

  • @probabyjesus
    @probabyjesus 2 ปีที่แล้ว

    Setup is so clean

  • @zibbezabba2491
    @zibbezabba2491 6 ปีที่แล้ว

    The closest thing I have to a classic vintage keyboard is a casio CZ1000. I might give it a go myself. I love seeing how the song turns out in the end. Very interesting concept.

  • @thanasimaletsidis8924
    @thanasimaletsidis8924 6 ปีที่แล้ว

    So sick and informing! I personally could do without the vox but great job!

  • @diegofotuche
    @diegofotuche 6 ปีที่แล้ว

    I love the grand mothers dancing hahaha
    cool song!

  • @axelrigaud
    @axelrigaud 6 ปีที่แล้ว +12

    Great ! You could make a complete EP like Todd Terje did witht the ARP2600

    • @topofthemornintoya
      @topofthemornintoya 6 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      I bet you a wet kipper Todd used various other bits for the drums/percussion on that EP

    • @HotStrange
      @HotStrange 6 ปีที่แล้ว

      hsoj hsquh still impressive either way.

  • @alexandresaba573
    @alexandresaba573 6 ปีที่แล้ว

    Powerful OUAS! Great video!

  • @juncorcino
    @juncorcino 6 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Unique! Great job, 👍🏼

  • @CPtheCreator
    @CPtheCreator ปีที่แล้ว

    Very cool.

  • @andressaldivar6669
    @andressaldivar6669 5 ปีที่แล้ว

    Your intro was all I needed to subscribe

  • @jdlcmusic
    @jdlcmusic 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    I could honestly hear the instrumental be used in a sci-fi film. Very spacey. Might have to add the moog grandmother to the list

  • @devaprasanna80
    @devaprasanna80 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    beautiful synth sound

  • @rickiraton
    @rickiraton 6 ปีที่แล้ว

    This song= me chilling on a Sunday afternoon in my couch with no pants and just staring at the TVs black screen

  • @vr4ever645
    @vr4ever645 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    You Sir, are amazing!!!

  • @romainbossoutrot9376
    @romainbossoutrot9376 3 ปีที่แล้ว +3

    Really great work ! I absolutely loved it 💃🏼
    Though, how do you get that “vintage electric piano” sound at 05:07 ? It sounds so perfect

  • @retsamtih
    @retsamtih 6 ปีที่แล้ว +16

    I love your content. I wish you were my older brother or cool uncle :,(

    • @onceuponasynth
      @onceuponasynth  6 ปีที่แล้ว +8

      lol, I can be your virtual uncle. that kinda sounds weird..

    • @zibbezabba2491
      @zibbezabba2491 6 ปีที่แล้ว

      @@onceuponasynth could have wrote a verse about a creepy uncle 'fiddle about...fiddle about' oh wait... it's already been done.

    • @berniesanders5419
      @berniesanders5419 6 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      He's your grandmother

  • @JumpingTurtle77
    @JumpingTurtle77 6 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    Lol I thought the thumb nail said “tackling grandma”😂

    • @onceuponasynth
      @onceuponasynth  6 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      maybe an idea for my next video 🤔

  • @jthorpe4droid
    @jthorpe4droid 6 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Cool video, i do this from time to time e with my BSII and 8 multitrack. I do the drums using the built-in sequencer for each part.

  • @piotr803
    @piotr803 6 ปีที่แล้ว

    Grandmother ...what a classy act!

  • @max-poficial1582
    @max-poficial1582 5 ปีที่แล้ว

    your channel is amazing

  • @LouisSerieusement
    @LouisSerieusement 6 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    really cool exercice ! awesome tutorial and awesome song at the same time !! Thank you really much :) :) :)

    • @LouisSerieusement
      @LouisSerieusement 6 ปีที่แล้ว

      the sound design and the composition are really unique

    • @onceuponasynth
      @onceuponasynth  6 ปีที่แล้ว

      thanks orange! (can I call you orange?)

    • @LouisSerieusement
      @LouisSerieusement 6 ปีที่แล้ว

      @@onceuponasynth lol yes if you want otherwise my name is Louis :) "the orange peak" was the name of my former stoner rock band XD but in the mean time orange is my favourite color, and I don't mind beeing called by different name :)
      I repeat myself but the sound design (!!), and the composition astonished me !! People are craving the GM but I hope they realized you use it at full potential and you have an enormous experience with soundesign ang huge skills...and so cool to hear someone use classic harmonic knowledge in such a good way ! that was really inspiring to watch !

  • @userAnonymous90123
    @userAnonymous90123 6 ปีที่แล้ว +52

    I want this synth so hard!

    • @umonox
      @umonox 6 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      All you need are a thousand bucks and a knowing girlfriend 😀

    • @ohstirfry
      @ohstirfry 6 ปีที่แล้ว +1

      iggyfuntime666 me to so hard

    • @anyvideo8876
      @anyvideo8876 6 ปีที่แล้ว

      Same!

    • @ModularLanding
      @ModularLanding 6 ปีที่แล้ว

      It’s not that expensive for what it is. Start saving and hope you can get it soon :-)

    • @ohstirfry
      @ohstirfry 6 ปีที่แล้ว

      Modular Landing paying off other synths I will have it next year probab

  • @jaysunluna
    @jaysunluna 4 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    That synth at 5:06 gave me chills

  • @Rjohns1414
    @Rjohns1414 5 ปีที่แล้ว

    Pretty Cool :-) Very Creative

  • @Gi_Zero
    @Gi_Zero ปีที่แล้ว

    Omg, it's magic!

  • @TROGULAR10000
    @TROGULAR10000 6 ปีที่แล้ว

    Never mind the GM textures and techniques, the tune is the nicest bit even though it's presented as a random wacky thing for demonstration purposes. Nice use of video as usual.

    • @onceuponasynth
      @onceuponasynth  6 ปีที่แล้ว

      thanks trogular, appreciate it dude

  • @Anteaterman23
    @Anteaterman23 6 ปีที่แล้ว +3

    "Tracking my Grandma for a day! WHAT HAPPENS NEXT WILL SHOCK YOU! #NOTCLICKBAIT"

  • @absence7445
    @absence7445 5 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Anyone have any tips on making a bass tone similar to this on something along the lines of a Korg Monologue? Stellar sounds in this video.

  • @martinofenzi858
    @martinofenzi858 4 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    it’s usually hard to get bad drum-synth sounds with moog gear, however, you did it.

  • @sunloveone
    @sunloveone 6 ปีที่แล้ว

    Bravo! Great Video and Song!

  • @crashedcreativity5287
    @crashedcreativity5287 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    Great Video! Thanks.

  • @dannywamuya
    @dannywamuya 6 ปีที่แล้ว

    This is beautiful

  • @peezyy3
    @peezyy3 6 ปีที่แล้ว

    Loved it man keep these videos coming👌✌️

  • @WONDERMALT
    @WONDERMALT 4 ปีที่แล้ว

    had to favourite this video for later ref

  • @wesrains2543
    @wesrains2543 6 ปีที่แล้ว +6

    6:28 got me melting.

  • @AlsRides
    @AlsRides 6 ปีที่แล้ว

    And why was I not subscribed to your channel!? I'm sure I've seen your vids before. Great content man, keep it up!

    • @onceuponasynth
      @onceuponasynth  6 ปีที่แล้ว

      heh thanks man! welcome aboard, thanks for the sub!

  • @piewars12345
    @piewars12345 6 ปีที่แล้ว

    Awesome stuff 🎹😎🎹 I've sat down to make drum kits with my microbrute a few times and it can get so annoying early on when you just cant figure out how to get the sound you want...but the finished kit is always so satisfying to use

  • @ollyyahweh9603
    @ollyyahweh9603 2 ปีที่แล้ว

    I like where it started at first.