Yep - with Class-1 bikes anyway... Constantly focusing on power (and by inference speed) already confuses people who don't understand how these bikes actually work, and in turn those who then make the rules as to where we can ride them. If we want Class-1 bikes to remain accepted on bicycle trails, then we [or the manufacturers at least] need to start focussing on range and reliability now.
More power would probably result in trail restrictions. My Bosch takes my up anything I think I can do without losing traction. More power would just result in more spin outs and more from wheel float.
Id say the full power bikes have enough power it will be more about the tech that comes with it. Esp for fitness like specialized started with the smart assist. Connectivity and safety features like gps tracking incase of an emergency, theft, etc... I see the light weight category in the mid power still being moving towards something a good majority of mountain bikers will want. For example the fazua ride 60 system with some upgraded parts like bluetooth remote, and LCD touch screen like the TQ and DJI systems.. paired with long travel enduro or even future DH bikes where they are more shuttle machines than they are trail climbers and all mountain rigs. That's where I see the full power being king... An updated fazua bike like my heckler sl but in a V10... (with fazua upgrading all its stuff to match competition).
Missing a BIG thing I really want to see!! Longer warranties as standard for emtbs!!!! When you are buying a bike north or 4k with it’s electrics etc then the warranty should be 3/4 years minimum! a 2 year warranty is just not enough for a bike so expensive we should be demanding that these bikes last for a decent amount of time considering how much they cost! Then hopefully bike manufacturers and motor manufacturers start putting more priority into durability and reliability etc Currently it’s very easy for manufacturers to boast numbers such as NM, weight, and wattage etc etc when a motor only has to last 2 years (then it’s your problem) that’s actually easy to do! But making a motor last 4 years under warranty is far more impressive than a new powerful motor with a touchscreen….
Agreed. Some of us dealing with long cold winters can’t get out enough, especially if the purchase is late in the season… so the warranty can work against us.
Agree. My Ride just got a new motor under warranty but I had to pay labor for the swap. I can't think of any other $6,000 item that requires you to pay labor during warranty period.
@@IdrisFashanit’s difficult to justify it by the time of year you buy the bike tbf on the manufacturer etc but these bikes in my opinion should have a different warranty compared to analog bikes in my opinion as they generally cost a lot more and I do think these bikes should be expected to last longer and manufacturers really should be increasing the warranty and putting pressure on motor manufacturers to prioritise reliability and durability for the customers who are spending big money! Right now both bike manufacturers and motor manufacturers are more interested in boasting numbers as they only really need to make them last 2 years which tbf for most motors is nothing really!
@@draftwoodthat’s a crap warranty (no offence) you shouldn’t have to pay for labour for a warranty job! Was this by any chance a direct sales bike? If it’s a shop and there a main dealer etc id expect them to reclaim the labour cost from the manufacturer tbh
specially now with the Canyon Battery situation. We need to push for more coverage from those providers, this is not your regular off the mill bicycle, this is an investment. EMTB has been silent on the whole situation, I wonder what their position is about Canyon Spectrals and Torque right now
Hi lads I’m John been riding for quite a few years on mtb I live in Yorkshire and love it unfortunately I’ve had to have both knees replaced and struggled with the hills now I have a emtb and got a new lease off life and absolutely love it the battery helps me up the hills and I ride a lot further ps 66 years old
No more headset cable routing! Hey designers at: canyon, orbea, focus, mondraker (some models) and others! You know what to do, make headset bearing free!
I want to see frame set options for new ebikes Often times brands lock consumers into build spec kits that don’t match what we ultimately want, and thus we often overpay for a bike only to remove and swap out parts for our preferences. Why not just sell a frame set / motor / battery option and let us spec our bikes as we see fit? I know some brands doing fact do this (ie: specialized w/ s works levo), but they are few and far between. More brands should jump on this imo.
I chipped my PinionMGU, because as soon as you go over 25kmh it feels like braking way more than a BoschCX. This completely spoils the fun on flow tracks; couldn’t wait for the warranty end.
I’ve made the switch to emtb because skiing holidays are now prohibitively expensive and I get the same rush down hill on a bike, but with an emtb I can get more down hills in.
@@DX-tk6fy do it now don’t even worry about warranty. I don’t see the point riding a bike that is slower than an analog mtb. Volspeed chip is a game changer do it you’ll won’t regret it
I had a heart attack a few years back and emtb has made a huge difference. I’ve had other health struggles but I was always able to get back to having fun with a low heart rate that protects my heart.
I had exactly the same problem as you. Ebikes are absolutely brilliant and essential for me to keep riding, hopefully I will continue to ride regularly for years to come!
I ride for the downhill trails, and as many as I can get in on one ride...BIGGEST reason for riding an ebike. I raced XC, DH and Enduro....Now I'm retired from work I just dig and ride. Im 65 and thanks to my ebikes I'm still loving it as much as I did in 1989. Loving the channel boys...Big thanks Kev Baines
Here in Australia our Ebikes are limited to 25km/h, I bought a aventon ramblas which is based on US class 1 (20mph) and once converted over I get limited to 32kph which was a nice bonus.
Power output it fine, but speed restricts do need reconsidered. however, that said, the UK speed restrctions on Pedal Assist Bikes is what it is because bikes can and do get ridden on pavements and shared paths with pedestrians and it's limited for that reason alone.
Spped restriction for cars are everywhere, in the city, overland, highway. Why should ebike be hardware limited for the slowest possible scenario. For example in germany there are „play roads“ „spielstrasse“ where the limit is 7kmh. Since i can think every bike has to slow down to 7kmh
Been riding emtbs since 2023 after suffering two cardiac arrests, gets me out and about and loving every minute of riding, completing the Sandstone Way with friends last year.
Looking forward to the weekend show , the reason I ride an ebike is simply because my first one was the gen 1 levo and loved the look of the big fat tyres and tractor look , now on my 3rd bike which is another levo , a 2022 model , it gives me so much pleasure when I go up to the Yorksire dales from Oxfordshire, and do a 36 miler ride covering 4-4500 feet of climbing and getting back with about 10 % battery as a safety net , ot gives me so much freedom up on them empty moors and byways , I get to see so much stunning countryside , also having a lot of titanium and other metal parts in my right leg after a mx crass , that little switch on the bars is nice to have as a back up .
Schwalbe tires finally ! They are THE bike tires! Great show guys, YES, we need those things! 25km/h speed limit is stupid, 30 or 32 is reasonable value. What I'm waiting for is internal 1000wh battery in combination with let's say 300wh range extenders for bottle holder. They would be compact and not so heavy to put in the backpack. You could take 1 or 2 extenders easily, if needed, instead of huge and heavy internal battery. For us who love to do long distance XC rides, this would be amazing.
On the subject of why I ride e-bikes. Back in 2019 I was hospitalised for three weeks with exercise induced rhabdomyolysis. The same thing rich had on gmbn last year in Arizona. mine is due to a genetic issue and was going to keep happening. I couldn’t risk it happening again and didn’t want to give up riding so started riding eeb’s. It’s allowed me to keep going and no more hospital visits.
I started riding an emtb at age 64 after 60 years of bio biking. Reasons: 1. pain in hips after a big mtb ride was keeping me up at night - emtb on tuned down turbo Levo (eco = 25% assist 35power) eliminated hip pain even after 45 mile emtb rides. 2. Uphill is the new downhill. So much fun climbing really techy rooty rocky stuff, railing uphill berms and getting 3 or 4x more downhill runs. 3. My full sus emtb is an amazing gravel bike on the mountainous dirt roads in Northern Vermont.
2nd hand bikes - yes, yes and yes! I got into your channel years ago when I lusted for an eMTB but just couldn't make the numbers ever work, and things have only got worse, as you say in this video. Last year I finally purchased a 2nd hand Gen 1 Kenevo. It was a trade-in, it needed some small work but it had just had a new motor under warranty and the battery only had about 15 cycles on it. £2k - absolute no brainer, and got me back out on the trails. Had to put about £400 into it with new tyres, cassette, chain and derailleur but I honestly think if people are handy enough to do some work themselves, there is no reason to spend the silly money on new bikes... we need to send a message to the manufacturers. I'm quite mechanically and electrically minded/skilled, so have no fear of stripping down and repairing a battery or a motor anyway. Why spend the big bucks on a new bike - find a solid 2nd hand frame, the bits hanging off it can be fixed/replaced if the price is right. Got me back out there with money still in my pocket ;)
The 85-90NM motors are plenty powerful enough. The bulk of my riding is in the "ECO" mode both from a range and an effort mindset. Currently living in Switzerland, the 25km/h limit is a pain. I would be happy with the 32km/h limit for the flat sections, dirt roads and transits having owned E-bikes in Canada and South Africa.
I ride an emtb because it gives me that extra assistance and allows me to ride further. Hills are not a problem anymore. I love exploring the South Downs near where I live which was a challenge on my hard tail analogue mtb. At 66 years now this e-bike has put a big smile on my face 😊
Welcome to the E2 club, Neil! Bought mine in July 2023 and haven't looked back. Still love the bike. No issues so far, realiability-wise, after 2,000 miles on the 801. Sounds like you got a great deal on yours. Enjoy!
The Schwalbe radials are game changing, it’s like getting new top end suspension, even the sound of the tyres on the ground is different, I’m running the Magic Mary Radial on the front and the Albert on the rear on my eMTB, fantastic.
I have just created a uk government petition to increase the ebike limit to 20mph, I received an email saying 5 people need to sign it to activate the petition. I have the link for people to sign but it won’t allow me to post it here. Does embn have an email address I can send it too? We need 10,000 signatures.
Transferred over to a EMTB in the last 18 months, same age as Don, I do have some issues with my left knee and it has got progressively worse as I have got older. For me although I do other things to keep me in shape such as a bit of running and circuit training my bike time is my fun time and when I get an opportunity to ride between my busy family schedule I want to cram in as much as I can whether that be at the bike park, trail centre of XC, When I get to ride not only do I have a smile on my face on the downs but also on the up's which was never the case on my Analogue bike, I have no regrets this sport is incredibly fun and I find myself riding more with the power hours I love to do. I can only see this sector increasing and continue to put pressure on the analogue sector and will predict in another 5 years or so you will barely see a analogue bike apart from professional events. Great chemistry between Don and Steve this will take the channel to new heights!
I have used Schwalbe on all (12ish) bikes for at least the last 10 years - really great tires Most recently running the Eddy Currents on my Giant Trance X E+ and they are next level !
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I think, from now on, the DJI motor system is going to be the golden standard in terms of power to weight ratio, and that Forbidden e Dreadnaught with the DJI is a serious contender for my next ebike
It still does 15.5 mph and once you have had it a few months the novelty wears off, its a reason i would never buy another e bike until they up it to at least 20mph
I just got my first e-bike 2024 Pivot Shuttle LT. I was getting tired of only getting 1 Lap in 5 mile or so. 3rd ride in I did a 26 mile pedal with over 3,000 ft elevation gain on my Pivot and had a blast. One last thing I get to choose my ride level hard or chill what ever my body is telling me.
Regarding power adjustability, I wish Bosch had a separate setting for overrun. Or better yet, a way to quickly toggle it off or on from the handlebar controller. I love it for technical climbs, but it can be tricky on tight switchbacks.
After Owning e-bikes for over 9 years and at one time 2 e-bikes I have recently purchased a Ragley Big Ali and love it definitely the lighter weight and nimble ride put a smile on my on my face . Yes loads slower going up but it’s not a race it’s all about the ride what ever your on 👌 still love the ebike as well just different .
The reason I started riding an EMTB; After 10 years I started mountain biking again and there were 3 things important; having fun, having fun and having fun 😀. When I started I was 43 and overweight, so more exercise was a necessity. I wanted to try and experience the latest technology. So since 6 months it became a Cube Hybrid action team 140 750 because of the bosch smart 4, the big battery and I later expanded the Cube with a SRAM XX1 wireless shifting. I ride an average of 2 to 4 times a week for rides of 2 hours. Clear your head and discover new places. Ride alone, ride with super fit friends and get to know new people like the neighbor who also has an EMTB. I have lost 5kg in the past months. If I were to choose a new EMTB now, I would go for a motor that has around 50/60nm, that is more than enough, but I would still like a large battery for the range and weight under 20kg.
The next step in reducing weight for ebike systems will be non-removal batteries like we've seen in phones. This enables them to ditch the hard case on the battery and rely on the frame for protection as the battery doesn't need protection outside the frame in terms of storage and transport. While the case doesn't seem that heave on its own, also consider the frame needs to be bigger, mounting hardware, etc. next step after that is more exotic (and more expensive) metals for the motor casing, and then continuing the same trends for more lightweight mtb components overall
Got the new Yukon e+. Nice to tune motor output, torque and response to adjust the bike to the grip in loose snow. Need super smooth control to start on snow with low friction. The walk mode should have been avtivated on off, not with a button you have to push all the time. Useless in rugged terrain.
I want the option to have low down power without having to pedal at a cadence of 120rpm. I want 95nm. I want an excellent warranty but it should at least last as long as the 4 year credit deals they use to sell these bikes. I want the manufacturers to concentrate on reliability over weight savings. I want to be able to run a minimum of 180mm dropper on the smallest size.
I got board exploring my local area on a hard tail and alll but stopped riding for a few years. A mate gave me a quick ride on his emtb and now I have a gaint stance e+ which is plenty for me and all I want to do is go exploring now as hills don't scare me anymore. I like the toughnes of the alloy frame as only go bush and very rarely ride a bike park.
I would LOVE to see motors with less drag for when the motor is off. My Shimano is a TANK when the battery runs dry. However the TQ is great when it is turned off.
I have a 1000 w befang hub motor 1600 peak. That's enough for me. But what I really want is gearbox and belt drive !! mgu with belt drive Will be on my next bike
I say that what we need is standardization for motors and batteries. If I want to upgrade my battery and motor or change from Shimano to Yamaha for example, right now is impossible
That's like asking for the same engine in every car... manufacturers want you to purchase THEIR product based on its specification and performance over any other.
Pinion Gear Box/Engine has a new stead coming, looks amazing. What's a strong Trail/Enduro/DH Pinion Gear Box Brand from Rotorua, NZ. That ZEROED out the options. Right Up There!
I'm 55 years old and currently ride an HT, Banshee Paradox V3. It is a great bike to ride. I would love to pick an FS/emtb, but I don't want to deal with the potential cost of maintenance. The reason I sold my FS frame. Maybe some time in the future I can afford to buy an emtb. I'm still having fun on my HT.
Give me a big heavy full fat ebike any day , have you seen how many sl e-bikes there are for sale already, I’m hanging on for the next gen full fat levo , congrats on the new partnership, schalwbe are freaking aswome tyres .
I don’t know how you guys ride e-bikes over there with the speed restrictions. That would drive me crazy. Here in So. Cal. I’m riding my EXe at the 20mph speed limit at least 75% of the time.
Congratulations on the Schwarble support. Myself and my mate both bought the Albert radial 29x2.6 Gravity as Nobby Nic replacements. We have debated the rim width they mount on, 30, 33 or 37 internal width. With severe lack of information on tyre and rim width use in general we have gone for 37mm internal using Enduro rims. What do you think ? Any support on rim width for tyres would be useful for others. Time will tell if we made a good choice. We ride trails mainly in the Uk and we’re both over 69 so we’re none aggressive riders. Cheers
I would like to see all motor manufacturers use a speed sensor like the DJI so the power comes on quicker when you are starting part way up a hill. I don't need more power. I need the power to come on the instant I mash the pedals and not wait for the sensor to rotate sometimes, almost a full revolution.
Making them do 20mph in the uk would make a massive difference to uk sales, having motors that can push above 600 watts then making them disengage at 15mph really limits the buyer pool, it also pushes buyers to add tuning devices to their bikes which cause a world of headaches for dealers
I'm interested in traveling with an e-bike. What's the best way to get a bike abroad? It's currently -24°C here in Sweden with lots of snow, so a trip south would be fantastic. However, it's around a 30-hour drive from where I am to Italy, so flying would be the most beneficial option. Unfortunately, no airlines allow taking a battery on the plane! What are my options? I really don't want to take my analog bike! 😀
I think e-bikes have more than enough power. I ride a Orbea rise with 60nm’s and I’ve never really felt I need more power. If there is a hill that steep and gnarly your ebike can’t get you up then it’s not something that’s achievable anyway. The only time the extra power would have been nice is when I’m out with mates who are on full fat motors. I have made the change to the Merida e160 cf that I’m waiting on. I have my Orbea rise up for sale h15 at £2600 it had fox 36 factory grip 2, fox float x2 grip 2, renthal cockpit, pinnd cranks, upgraded brakes the lot and so far I’ve had an offers of 2k for it. The used market is horrific which is weird as my bike has been ridden hard but well looked after and has had a fortune doesn’t on it. I must say the bike has just shy of 1000 miles on it. Crazy!
Hows abput some kind of regen system, maybe a permanent drive from the rear wheel/axle turning the motor (now as a generator) when the pedals are not turning? Maybe even have a super compact front hub generator, woth both regens having regen options! Freewheeling downhill on a trail, it could be used to control your speed as per ab EV, great when its just a little too steep and you are riding the brakes! Smaller batteries also = slight drop in weight! Prices down, possibly even a couple of motor & battery standards which means you can change motor brands! brands....... Great show from someone who wants (but cannot afford) an eMBT! Saving hard, but its still a year or three away!
I live in NZ and have a Whyte whilst my daughter rides a Trek. I do find the 7km speed difference between our bikes a little annoying when we are on fire roads and she has to hold back so her old man can keep up. Not a deal breaker, but it would be great if there was a worldwide speed standard.
Full power, mullet compatible (not 27.5 straight) 180 travel front and back with dual crown capability. MGU + 700 wh battery (would be awesome to have up to 900wh option). Due this, and win the eMTB market
It is my opinion that manufacturers are “throttling” the technology and advancements they’ve given us and they’ll continue to do so for years. They want us to keep buying bikes. Tell me it’s not possible in this day and age to have internal transmissions with powerful motors and long range batteries. And for much less than what they charge us. I’d like to see frame and motor sets offered as well. Some of us like to build/spec our own bikes. The Chinese brands offer this already. Last, I’d like to hear EMBN’s opinion of the CYKE Falcon models, if you’ve even seen these bikes. I purchased one for the motor and battery and the low cost and customized it to make it a more proper emtb. Does anyone else out there ever ask you to review off brands-good or bad? I’d love to see your team build an ultra light and capable “china-direct” emtb and put it to the test. While I can afford a more expensive bike, I enjoy having 3 ebikes that didn’t cost me as much as a Trek, Specialized, etc. Thanks and cheers fellas. I love this channel.
I bought my E-bike just over a year ago because I have many injuries and wanted to continue enjoy riding my MTB'S. I have just fractured my wrist again for the third time, could you recommend a wrist support/protection that I could use comfortably riding the E-MTB.
Speedrestriction are for cars since the beginning even if they have a max speed of 200kmh. I am for speed limiting on trails, or tarmac in da wood. But it should be possible to drive an ebike like a regular roadbike on roads. While more and more cities have a speed limit of 30kmh here in germany, ebikes should have the ability of the same speed for security
Urtopia Quark DM1.2 motor and solid state battery Credit: hahahaha who knows what's next but the developments will never stop, enjoy what you have just ride 🤛
I'm not bothered about the weight. I do like the idea of the gearbox, does away with a lot of maintenance i.e. 2 cassettes and 4 chains etc. Also the speed restriction is ridiculous. If it was a reasonable speed like 35kpm I wouldn't bother with a chip , if I had to ride without it chiped I'd go back to a peddle bike ! Just my experience
What Ergon saddle do you guys ride on on your ebikes? Biggest thing the industry could do to increase sales is lower prices. No way they should cost as much as a "good" used car in the USA.
well there is probably only one natural way for the future of e-bikes (not just for EMTBs). More motor development will probably continue to something similar to the dji's system. That being more power and torque in a light package. Battery energy density will trickle down from automotive batteries since those current batteries are more advanced then what are currently in EMTBs. For example current densities on bike top out at around 220wh/kg, while the newest EV cells range from 250-500wh/kg. I just hope that prices also go down as spending 7k+ on a bike with mid-level parts is crazy IMO.
People are tired of paying thousands of dollars for overpriced bikes at ripoff prices which don’t last and break down easily that are made for pennies in south east Asia.
I like the weight of an ebike 18 to 20kg would preferable. I have a cube action team and it a great bike. Would love a bike that has more power, 1500watts with great torque and power curve when peddling limited to 30mph. Normal mtbs do way more than 30mph when flying down the trails let’s not kid our selfs. With the extra weight you need all the speed you can get to clear jumps have fun etc on a Emtb. I feel like it’s a stigma to want to go fast. That’s why we ride bikes 😂
I don't understand why when you are talking or reviewing emtbs 99.9% you show full suspension bikes. I believe there are people like myself who enjoys a good hardtail more than a full suspension bike. I would love to see you review more affordable hardtail emtbs.
I've now got my Amflow pro in Australia I am going to frame mount a manual change 14speed Rohloff directly above the brilliant motor. Will have a lower swing arm high pivoting around the Rohloff axle with belt drive to light rear wheel with no tensioner necessary. It's a MGU that's near silent with a proven Rohloff mid mounted. Probably add a kg to centre of the frame. I want more weight as I am nearly back to my birth weight at 60kg. E=mtb² or is the Amflow (Amway as my mate called it) E=mtb³ Watch this space.🤫⚡️🙄
My average speed on the road is 23-5km/h unpowered. Easy to hit 32 without much effort. Crazy that an e-bike isn’t allowed to match what I can do on my own 🤷
The fact that its exactly 20mph in the US and 25km/h in the uk just shows that the limits are stupid and arbitrary. There is still nothing stopping you from going as fast as you like downhill under your own power so it's not a safety concern.
+85nm of torque, +700 watt REMOVABLE battery, 170mm travel, enduro casing tires, MGU debatable…when they can get that package sub 43lbs I’ll replace my 5yr old Levo. Right now not worth it to save 2-3lbs.
Am I the only one who likes a heavy bike? My Kenevo weighs a good 25-26kg and it's just so much more planted and gets deflected and bounced around far less than my previous bike (regular MTB) I used to have to ride clipped in due to my left foot constantly coming off the pedal (I'm dead from the knee down on my left leg) but that never happens on my Kenevo.
I think you nailed it with the "lightweight full power" ebikes needing to be trail bikes, and that's okay. I don't need to be pedaling around a 25kg 180mm travel bike on my mostly flat trails just because I need more range for a longer ride or need more power for a super steep section. The Amflow and Orbea Rise seem to be the only good long range, full power trail bikes out there.
I think e-Bikes have enough power. I think they are making a mistake with batteries and chargers. I think they should have a universal charger like they have made USB-C for mobile phones. 🚴♂😀
Bosch can not pair with Garmin ,even if you import gps file it will not work cos Bosch like to push their products... Brose works like a charm, all data with Garmin!
Do you think eBike have enough power at the moment? Share your thoughts below!
Yep - with Class-1 bikes anyway... Constantly focusing on power (and by inference speed) already confuses people who don't understand how these bikes actually work, and in turn those who then make the rules as to where we can ride them. If we want Class-1 bikes to remain accepted on bicycle trails, then we [or the manufacturers at least] need to start focussing on range and reliability now.
Yep. Too much eats cogs
More power would probably result in trail restrictions. My Bosch takes my up anything I think I can do without losing traction. More power would just result in more spin outs and more from wheel float.
Id say the full power bikes have enough power it will be more about the tech that comes with it. Esp for fitness like specialized started with the smart assist. Connectivity and safety features like gps tracking incase of an emergency, theft, etc... I see the light weight category in the mid power still being moving towards something a good majority of mountain bikers will want. For example the fazua ride 60 system with some upgraded parts like bluetooth remote, and LCD touch screen like the TQ and DJI systems.. paired with long travel enduro or even future DH bikes where they are more shuttle machines than they are trail climbers and all mountain rigs. That's where I see the full power being king... An updated fazua bike like my heckler sl but in a V10... (with fazua upgrading all its stuff to match competition).
I think the speed limiter is fine. I wouldn't want to see ebikes requiring number plates and insurance or whatever.
Missing a BIG thing I really want to see!! Longer warranties as standard for emtbs!!!! When you are buying a bike north or 4k with it’s electrics etc then the warranty should be 3/4 years minimum! a 2 year warranty is just not enough for a bike so expensive we should be demanding that these bikes last for a decent amount of time considering how much they cost! Then hopefully bike manufacturers and motor manufacturers start putting more priority into durability and reliability etc
Currently it’s very easy for manufacturers to boast numbers such as NM, weight, and wattage etc etc when a motor only has to last 2 years (then it’s your problem) that’s actually easy to do! But making a motor last 4 years under warranty is far more impressive than a new powerful motor with a touchscreen….
Agreed.
Some of us dealing with long cold winters can’t get out enough, especially if the purchase is late in the season… so the warranty can work against us.
Agree. My Ride just got a new motor under warranty but I had to pay labor for the swap. I can't think of any other $6,000 item that requires you to pay labor during warranty period.
@@IdrisFashanit’s difficult to justify it by the time of year you buy the bike tbf on the manufacturer etc but these bikes in my opinion should have a different warranty compared to analog bikes in my opinion as they generally cost a lot more and I do think these bikes should be expected to last longer and manufacturers really should be increasing the warranty and putting pressure on motor manufacturers to prioritise reliability and durability for the customers who are spending big money! Right now both bike manufacturers and motor manufacturers are more interested in boasting numbers as they only really need to make them last 2 years which tbf for most motors is nothing really!
@@draftwoodthat’s a crap warranty (no offence) you shouldn’t have to pay for labour for a warranty job! Was this by any chance a direct sales bike? If it’s a shop and there a main dealer etc id expect them to reclaim the labour cost from the manufacturer tbh
specially now with the Canyon Battery situation. We need to push for more coverage from those providers, this is not your regular off the mill bicycle, this is an investment. EMTB has been silent on the whole situation, I wonder what their position is about Canyon Spectrals and Torque right now
Hi lads
I’m John been riding for quite a few years on mtb I live in Yorkshire and love it unfortunately I’ve had to have both knees replaced and struggled with the hills now I have a emtb and got a new lease off life and absolutely love it the battery helps me up the hills and I ride a lot further ps 66 years old
No more headset cable routing!
Hey designers at: canyon, orbea, focus, mondraker (some models) and others! You know what to do, make headset bearing free!
100% agree!
I want to see frame set options for new ebikes
Often times brands lock consumers into build spec kits that don’t match what we ultimately want, and thus we often overpay for a bike only to remove and swap out parts for our preferences.
Why not just sell a frame set / motor / battery option and let us spec our bikes as we see fit?
I know some brands doing fact do this (ie: specialized w/ s works levo), but they are few and far between. More brands should jump on this imo.
I chipped my PinionMGU, because as soon as you go over 25kmh it feels like braking way more than a BoschCX. This completely spoils the fun on flow tracks; couldn’t wait for the warranty end.
Made the switch to emtb five years ago and Im loving it. Not because of injury but just because I wanted to try something new. I'll never go back now,
I’ve made the switch to emtb because skiing holidays are now prohibitively expensive and I get the same rush down hill on a bike, but with an emtb I can get more down hills in.
15mph is pathetic and really hampers the experience. The second my warranty is up I'll be bypassing that restriction
@@DX-tk6fy do it now don’t even worry about warranty. I don’t see the point riding a bike that is slower than an analog mtb. Volspeed chip is a game changer do it you’ll won’t regret it
DO IT NOW YOU WONT REGRET IT. SPEEDBOX OR STUNLOCKER
@@wenlambotomy6231I've got a bosch smart system plus rim magnet. €400 for a speed box is insane for what you're purchasing
Chip it don’t worry
Pedal harder😂
I had a heart attack a few years back and emtb has made a huge difference. I’ve had other health struggles but I was always able to get back to having fun with a low heart rate that protects my heart.
I had exactly the same problem as you. Ebikes are absolutely brilliant and essential for me to keep riding, hopefully I will continue to ride regularly for years to come!
I ride for the downhill trails, and as many as I can get in on one ride...BIGGEST reason for riding an ebike. I raced XC, DH and Enduro....Now I'm retired from work I just dig and ride. Im 65 and thanks to my ebikes I'm still loving it as much as I did in 1989. Loving the channel boys...Big thanks Kev Baines
Here in Australia our Ebikes are limited to 25km/h, I bought a aventon ramblas which is based on US class 1 (20mph) and once converted over I get limited to 32kph which was a nice bonus.
Power output it fine, but speed restricts do need reconsidered. however, that said, the UK speed restrctions on Pedal Assist Bikes is what it is because bikes can and do get ridden on pavements and shared paths with pedestrians and it's limited for that reason alone.
Spped restriction for cars are everywhere, in the city, overland, highway. Why should ebike be hardware limited for the slowest possible scenario. For example in germany there are „play roads“ „spielstrasse“ where the limit is 7kmh. Since i can think every bike has to slow down to 7kmh
Been riding emtbs since 2023 after suffering two cardiac arrests, gets me out and about and loving every minute of riding, completing the Sandstone Way with friends last year.
Looking forward to the weekend show , the reason I ride an ebike is simply because my first one was the gen 1 levo and loved the look of the big fat tyres and tractor look , now on my 3rd bike which is another levo , a 2022 model , it gives me so much pleasure when I go up to the Yorksire dales from Oxfordshire, and do a 36 miler ride covering 4-4500 feet of climbing and getting back with about 10 % battery as a safety net , ot gives me so much freedom up on them empty moors and byways , I get to see so much stunning countryside , also having a lot of titanium and other metal parts in my right leg after a mx crass , that little switch on the bars is nice to have as a back up .
Schwalbe tires finally ! They are THE bike tires! Great show guys, YES, we need those things! 25km/h speed limit is stupid, 30 or 32 is reasonable value. What I'm waiting for is internal 1000wh battery in combination with let's say 300wh range extenders for bottle holder. They would be compact and not so heavy to put in the backpack. You could take 1 or 2 extenders easily, if needed, instead of huge and heavy internal battery. For us who love to do long distance XC rides, this would be amazing.
On the subject of why I ride e-bikes. Back in 2019 I was hospitalised for three weeks with exercise induced rhabdomyolysis. The same thing rich had on gmbn last year in Arizona. mine is due to a genetic issue and was going to keep happening. I couldn’t risk it happening again and didn’t want to give up riding so started riding eeb’s. It’s allowed me to keep going and no more hospital visits.
I know what eb's are, ebikes are, emtbs are, but what are eeb's?
I started riding an emtb at age 64 after 60 years of bio biking. Reasons: 1. pain in hips after a big mtb ride was keeping me up at night - emtb on tuned down turbo Levo (eco = 25% assist 35power) eliminated hip pain even after 45 mile emtb rides. 2. Uphill is the new downhill. So much fun climbing really techy rooty rocky stuff, railing uphill berms and getting 3 or 4x more downhill runs. 3. My full sus emtb is an amazing gravel bike on the mountainous dirt roads in Northern Vermont.
2nd hand bikes - yes, yes and yes! I got into your channel years ago when I lusted for an eMTB but just couldn't make the numbers ever work, and things have only got worse, as you say in this video. Last year I finally purchased a 2nd hand Gen 1 Kenevo. It was a trade-in, it needed some small work but it had just had a new motor under warranty and the battery only had about 15 cycles on it. £2k - absolute no brainer, and got me back out on the trails. Had to put about £400 into it with new tyres, cassette, chain and derailleur but I honestly think if people are handy enough to do some work themselves, there is no reason to spend the silly money on new bikes... we need to send a message to the manufacturers. I'm quite mechanically and electrically minded/skilled, so have no fear of stripping down and repairing a battery or a motor anyway. Why spend the big bucks on a new bike - find a solid 2nd hand frame, the bits hanging off it can be fixed/replaced if the price is right. Got me back out there with money still in my pocket ;)
The 85-90NM motors are plenty powerful enough. The bulk of my riding is in the "ECO" mode both from a range and an effort mindset. Currently living in Switzerland, the 25km/h limit is a pain. I would be happy with the 32km/h limit for the flat sections, dirt roads and transits having owned E-bikes in Canada and South Africa.
Yes with Turbo, you ruin Your Drive Train in notime
I ride an emtb because it gives me that extra assistance and allows me to ride further. Hills are not a problem anymore.
I love exploring the South Downs near where I live which was a challenge on my hard tail analogue mtb.
At 66 years now this e-bike has put a big smile on my face 😊
Welcome to the E2 club, Neil! Bought mine in July 2023 and haven't looked back. Still love the bike. No issues so far, realiability-wise, after 2,000 miles on the 801. Sounds like you got a great deal on yours. Enjoy!
Thanks for having my bike on again! =)
The Schwalbe radials are game changing, it’s like getting new top end suspension, even the sound of the tyres on the ground is different, I’m running the Magic Mary Radial on the front and the Albert on the rear on my eMTB, fantastic.
Good to hear! We're looking forward to giving them a go
I have just created a uk government petition to increase the ebike limit to 20mph, I received an email saying 5 people need to sign it to activate the petition.
I have the link for people to sign but it won’t allow me to post it here. Does embn have an email address I can send it too? We need 10,000 signatures.
It's been done before. Not enough people signed
@ I saw that but thought it might be worth another try?
Transferred over to a EMTB in the last 18 months, same age as Don, I do have some issues with my left knee and it has got progressively worse as I have got older. For me although I do other things to keep me in shape such as a bit of running and circuit training my bike time is my fun time and when I get an opportunity to ride between my busy family schedule I want to cram in as much as I can whether that be at the bike park, trail centre of XC, When I get to ride not only do I have a smile on my face on the downs but also on the up's which was never the case on my Analogue bike, I have no regrets this sport is incredibly fun and I find myself riding more with the power hours I love to do. I can only see this sector increasing and continue to put pressure on the analogue sector and will predict in another 5 years or so you will barely see a analogue bike apart from professional events. Great chemistry between Don and Steve this will take the channel to new heights!
Thanks for sharing! 😁
I have used Schwalbe on all (12ish) bikes for at least the last 10 years - really great tires
Most recently running the Eddy Currents on my Giant Trance X E+ and they are next level !
I think, from now on, the DJI motor system is going to be the golden standard in terms of power to weight ratio, and that Forbidden e Dreadnaught with the DJI is a serious contender for my next ebike
It still does 15.5 mph and once you have had it a few months the novelty wears off, its a reason i would never buy another e bike until they up it to at least 20mph
Riding E bikes has Changed my Life, plenty of Cardio less pressure on the Joints, I have Metal knees and Elbows..
I just got my first e-bike 2024 Pivot Shuttle LT. I was getting tired of only getting 1 Lap in 5 mile or so. 3rd ride in I did a 26 mile pedal with over 3,000 ft elevation gain on my Pivot and had a blast. One last thing I get to choose my ride level hard or chill what ever my body is telling me.
Good watch
Regarding power adjustability, I wish Bosch had a separate setting for overrun. Or better yet, a way to quickly toggle it off or on from the handlebar controller. I love it for technical climbs, but it can be tricky on tight switchbacks.
After Owning e-bikes for over 9 years and at one time 2 e-bikes I have recently purchased a Ragley Big Ali and love it definitely the lighter weight and nimble ride put a smile on my on my face . Yes loads slower going up but it’s not a race it’s all about the ride what ever your on 👌 still love the ebike as well just different .
The reason I started riding an EMTB;
After 10 years I started mountain biking again and there were 3 things important; having fun, having fun and having fun 😀.
When I started I was 43 and overweight, so more exercise was a necessity. I wanted to try and experience the latest technology. So since 6 months it became a Cube Hybrid action team 140 750 because of the bosch smart 4, the big battery and I later expanded the Cube with a SRAM XX1 wireless shifting.
I ride an average of 2 to 4 times a week for rides of 2 hours.
Clear your head and discover new places. Ride alone, ride with super fit friends and get to know new people like the neighbor who also has an EMTB. I have lost 5kg in the past months.
If I were to choose a new EMTB now, I would go for a motor that has around 50/60nm, that is more than enough, but I would still like a large battery for the range and weight under 20kg.
The next step in reducing weight for ebike systems will be non-removal batteries like we've seen in phones. This enables them to ditch the hard case on the battery and rely on the frame for protection as the battery doesn't need protection outside the frame in terms of storage and transport. While the case doesn't seem that heave on its own, also consider the frame needs to be bigger, mounting hardware, etc. next step after that is more exotic (and more expensive) metals for the motor casing, and then continuing the same trends for more lightweight mtb components overall
Got the new Yukon e+. Nice to tune motor output, torque and response to adjust the bike to the grip in loose snow. Need super smooth control to start on snow with low friction. The walk mode should have been avtivated on off, not with a button you have to push all the time. Useless in rugged terrain.
I think we are in the Golden Age of eMTB but don't realise that. Access is good, prices are not totally insane and innovation is everywhere.
I want the option to have low down power without having to pedal at a cadence of 120rpm. I want 95nm. I want an excellent warranty but it should at least last as long as the 4 year credit deals they use to sell these bikes. I want the manufacturers to concentrate on reliability over weight savings.
I want to be able to run a minimum of 180mm dropper on the smallest size.
You can’t keep up with analog riders on group rides with the stupid speed restriction.. 70% of e-bikes are chipped…
@9:50 Lets go!!! Marin all day 💪🏽 only respectable bike my humble salary could afford
I got board exploring my local area on a hard tail and alll but stopped riding for a few years. A mate gave me a quick ride on his emtb and now I have a gaint stance e+ which is plenty for me and all I want to do is go exploring now as hills don't scare me anymore. I like the toughnes of the alloy frame as only go bush and very rarely ride a bike park.
Awesome! Glad it's gotten you back out there
I would LOVE to see motors with less drag for when the motor is off. My Shimano is a TANK when the battery runs dry. However the TQ is great when it is turned off.
Can’t agree enough 👍🏻
I have a 1000 w befang hub motor 1600 peak.
That's enough for me.
But what I really want is gearbox and belt drive !!
mgu with belt drive Will be on my next bike
I say that what we need is standardization for motors and batteries. If I want to upgrade my battery and motor or change from Shimano to Yamaha for example, right now is impossible
That's like asking for the same engine in every car... manufacturers want you to purchase THEIR product based on its specification and performance over any other.
Pinion Gear Box/Engine has a new stead coming, looks amazing. What's a strong Trail/Enduro/DH Pinion Gear Box Brand from Rotorua, NZ. That ZEROED out the options. Right Up There!
Heated grips or bars off the main battery would be a amazing for the winter riding in the UK.
Too right!
I'm 55 years old and currently ride an HT, Banshee Paradox V3. It is a great bike to ride. I would love to pick an FS/emtb, but I don't want to deal with the potential cost of maintenance. The reason I sold my FS frame. Maybe some time in the future I can afford to buy an emtb. I'm still having fun on my HT.
Give me a big heavy full fat ebike any day , have you seen how many sl e-bikes there are for sale already, I’m hanging on for the next gen full fat levo , congrats on the new partnership, schalwbe are freaking aswome tyres .
The ability to lock out the motor making stealing them pointless
I don’t know how you guys ride e-bikes over there with the speed restrictions. That would drive me crazy. Here in So. Cal. I’m riding my EXe at the 20mph speed limit at least 75% of the time.
Congratulations on the Schwarble support. Myself and my mate both bought the Albert radial 29x2.6 Gravity as Nobby Nic replacements. We have debated the rim width they mount on, 30, 33 or 37 internal width. With severe lack of information on tyre and rim width use in general we have gone for 37mm internal using Enduro rims. What do you think ? Any support on rim width for tyres would be useful for others. Time will tell if we made a good choice. We ride trails mainly in the Uk and we’re both over 69 so we’re none aggressive riders. Cheers
I would like to see all motor manufacturers use a speed sensor like the DJI so the power comes on quicker when you are starting part way up a hill. I don't need more power. I need the power to come on the instant I mash the pedals and not wait for the sensor to rotate sometimes, almost a full revolution.
Making them do 20mph in the uk would make a massive difference to uk sales, having motors that can push above 600 watts then making them disengage at 15mph really limits the buyer pool, it also pushes buyers to add tuning devices to their bikes which cause a world of headaches for dealers
Exactly! MGU's but ZF quality / AMFlow Quality and power please!
hope everyone is safe!
The first thing I do on a tuner app is turn everything all the way up and never use any other mode.
Fair enough!
I'm interested in traveling with an e-bike. What's the best way to get a bike abroad? It's currently -24°C here in Sweden with lots of snow, so a trip south would be fantastic. However, it's around a 30-hour drive from where I am to Italy, so flying would be the most beneficial option. Unfortunately, no airlines allow taking a battery on the plane! What are my options? I really don't want to take my analog bike!
😀
Maybe they should talk about how the price of second hand e-bikes has dropped like a stone not just SL.
Depreciation is shocking! Highlights everything is overpriced new 🤷🏻♂️
I think e-bikes have more than enough power. I ride a Orbea rise with 60nm’s and I’ve never really felt I need more power. If there is a hill that steep and gnarly your ebike can’t get you up then it’s not something that’s achievable anyway. The only time the extra power would have been nice is when I’m out with mates who are on full fat motors. I have made the change to the Merida e160 cf that I’m waiting on. I have my Orbea rise up for sale h15 at £2600 it had fox 36 factory grip 2, fox float x2 grip 2, renthal cockpit, pinnd cranks, upgraded brakes the lot and so far I’ve had an offers of 2k for it. The used market is horrific which is weird as my bike has been ridden hard but well looked after and has had a fortune doesn’t on it. I must say the bike has just shy of 1000 miles on it. Crazy!
Hows abput some kind of regen system, maybe a permanent drive from the rear wheel/axle turning the motor (now as a generator) when the pedals are not turning? Maybe even have a super compact front hub generator, woth both regens having regen options!
Freewheeling downhill on a trail, it could be used to control your speed as per ab EV, great when its just a little too steep and you are riding the brakes! Smaller batteries also = slight drop in weight!
Prices down, possibly even a couple of motor & battery standards which means you can change motor brands! brands.......
Great show from someone who wants (but cannot afford) an eMBT! Saving hard, but its still a year or three away!
I live in NZ and have a Whyte whilst my daughter rides a Trek. I do find the 7km speed difference between our bikes a little annoying when we are on fire roads and she has to hold back so her old man can keep up. Not a deal breaker, but it would be great if there was a worldwide speed standard.
Full power, mullet compatible (not 27.5 straight) 180 travel front and back with dual crown capability. MGU + 700 wh battery (would be awesome to have up to 900wh option). Due this, and win the eMTB market
I have enough power in the Bosch CX.
I would like my Rail to be built to be able to take the Bosch PowerMore 250Wh batteries for range flexibility
MGU. Integrated front light/ rear braking light. Ashtray.
You had us at the start 😅
It is my opinion that manufacturers are “throttling” the technology and advancements they’ve given us and they’ll continue to do so for years. They want us to keep buying bikes. Tell me it’s not possible in this day and age to have internal transmissions with powerful motors and long range batteries. And for much less than what they charge us. I’d like to see frame and motor sets offered as well. Some of us like to build/spec our own bikes. The Chinese brands offer this already. Last, I’d like to hear EMBN’s opinion of the CYKE Falcon models, if you’ve even seen these bikes. I purchased one for the motor and battery and the low cost and customized it to make it a more proper emtb. Does anyone else out there ever ask you to review off brands-good or bad? I’d love to see your team build an ultra light and capable “china-direct” emtb and put it to the test. While I can afford a more expensive bike, I enjoy having 3 ebikes that didn’t cost me as much as a Trek, Specialized, etc.
Thanks and cheers fellas. I love this channel.
We need 800wh batteries split into two, run one for lightweight or both for full fat, one bike would do it all 👍
I bought my E-bike just over a year ago because I have many injuries and wanted to continue enjoy riding my MTB'S. I have just fractured my wrist again for the third time, could you recommend a wrist support/protection that I could use comfortably riding the E-MTB.
Speedrestriction are for cars since the beginning even if they have a max speed of 200kmh. I am for speed limiting on trails, or tarmac in da wood. But it should be possible to drive an ebike like a regular roadbike on roads. While more and more cities have a speed limit of 30kmh here in germany, ebikes should have the ability of the same speed for security
What we (I) would like to see is universal motor mounts and battery interfaces.
You're not alone! That seems a popular want from many but we're not sure it'll happen
Urtopia Quark DM1.2 motor and solid state battery Credit: hahahaha who knows what's next but the developments will never stop, enjoy what you have just ride 🤛
I'm not bothered about the weight. I do like the idea of the gearbox, does away with a lot of maintenance i.e. 2 cassettes and 4 chains etc. Also the speed restriction is ridiculous. If it was a reasonable speed like 35kpm I wouldn't bother with a chip , if I had to ride without it chiped I'd go back to a peddle bike ! Just my experience
Sounds like last nights pinkbike podcast with specialized inspired todays show! (They said they listen to consumers in developing next gen)
What Ergon saddle do you guys ride on on your ebikes? Biggest thing the industry could do to increase sales is lower prices. No way they should cost as much as a "good" used car in the USA.
We ride variants of the SM-E range depending on which channel bike we have that day. The kick up on the tail is genuinely so beneficial when climbing
The radials are gonna take over
well there is probably only one natural way for the future of e-bikes (not just for EMTBs). More motor development will probably continue to something similar to the dji's system. That being more power and torque in a light package. Battery energy density will trickle down from automotive batteries since those current batteries are more advanced then what are currently in EMTBs. For example current densities on bike top out at around 220wh/kg, while the newest EV cells range from 250-500wh/kg. I just hope that prices also go down as spending 7k+ on a bike with mid-level parts is crazy IMO.
Guys I’ve just bought a Whyte E180 works v2 but haven’t had much opportunity to get out on it and test it, are they any good?
We love ours! Super reliable and enjoyable bike to ride
People are tired of paying thousands of dollars for overpriced bikes at ripoff prices which don’t last and break down easily that are made for pennies in south east Asia.
I would like to see the Pinion MGU bikes sold in the USA.
I like the weight of an ebike 18 to 20kg would preferable. I have a cube action team and it a great bike. Would love a bike that has more power, 1500watts with great torque and power curve when peddling limited to 30mph. Normal mtbs do way more than 30mph when flying down the trails let’s not kid our selfs. With the extra weight you need all the speed you can get to clear jumps have fun etc on a Emtb. I feel like it’s a stigma to want to go fast. That’s why we ride bikes 😂
I have riden zerode trail bikes and they are very good 👍
Glad to hear!
Are we going to see more solid state batteries in eMTBs?
Full 29er 180mm DH weaponry!
Love long travel, so would love to see something light weight, long travel, but with a removable 500w battery.
Not interested in range extenders.
I don't understand why when you are talking or reviewing emtbs 99.9% you show full suspension bikes. I believe there are people like myself who enjoys a good hardtail more than a full suspension bike. I would love to see you review more affordable hardtail emtbs.
@jim,,,,, 👍👏
MGU with belt drive on Santa Cruz or Specialized build 🎉🎉
Why not power brakes🤔 a small servo would help loads on big downs. .
I've now got my Amflow pro in Australia I am going to frame mount a manual change 14speed Rohloff directly above the brilliant motor. Will have a lower swing arm high pivoting around the Rohloff axle with belt drive to light rear wheel with no tensioner necessary. It's a MGU that's near silent with a proven Rohloff mid mounted. Probably add a kg to centre of the frame. I want more weight as I am nearly back to my birth weight at 60kg. E=mtb² or is the Amflow (Amway as my mate called it) E=mtb³
Watch this space.🤫⚡️🙄
A standard battery which works on all bike brands
More belt drive e-bikes.
My average speed on the road is 23-5km/h unpowered. Easy to hit 32 without much effort. Crazy that an e-bike isn’t allowed to match what I can do on my own 🤷
The fact that its exactly 20mph in the US and 25km/h in the uk just shows that the limits are stupid and arbitrary. There is still nothing stopping you from going as fast as you like downhill under your own power so it's not a safety concern.
+85nm of torque, +700 watt REMOVABLE battery, 170mm travel, enduro casing tires, MGU debatable…when they can get that package sub 43lbs I’ll replace my 5yr old Levo. Right now not worth it to save 2-3lbs.
Am I the only one who likes a heavy bike? My Kenevo weighs a good 25-26kg and it's just so much more planted and gets deflected and bounced around far less than my previous bike (regular MTB) I used to have to ride clipped in due to my left foot constantly coming off the pedal (I'm dead from the knee down on my left leg) but that never happens on my Kenevo.
I think you nailed it with the "lightweight full power" ebikes needing to be trail bikes, and that's okay. I don't need to be pedaling around a 25kg 180mm travel bike on my mostly flat trails just because I need more range for a longer ride or need more power for a super steep section. The Amflow and Orbea Rise seem to be the only good long range, full power trail bikes out there.
When I do 100 push ups every day, my E-bike seems to be lighter. My E-bike can be pushed to 35 MPH. I'm 84.
Is Amflow coming to America?
0:21 we could tell the industry what we want today, and if they listen to us, we might see some of it by say 2027.
I think e-Bikes have enough power. I think they are making a mistake with batteries and chargers. I think they should have a universal charger like they have made USB-C for mobile phones. 🚴♂😀
Bosch can not pair with Garmin ,even if you import gps file it will not work cos Bosch like to push their products... Brose works like a charm, all data with Garmin!