MACV SOG in conversation #2
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 8 ก.ย. 2024
- We are pleased to present this historic first - 4 former MACV SOG 1-0s and a crew chief from one of SOG's supporting aviation units, in conversation. Questions were asked by game beta testers helping with Arma 3 Creator DLC: S.O.G. Prairie Fire. Find out more: www.sogpf.com
Participants:
- Major General (Ret.) Ken Bowra, former 1-0 RT Idaho, RT Sidewinder, MACV SOG
- Lt. Col (Ret.) Dick Thompson, former 1-0 RT Virginia & Michigan and 1-1 RT Alabama, MACV SOG
- SFC (Ret.) Jim Shorten, former 1-0 RT Delaware, MACV SOG
- SSG John Stryker Meyer. former 1-0 RT Idaho, MACV SOG
- Spc.5 Don Haase, Crew Chief, 195th Assault Helicopter Company (“Ghost riders”), Opcon MACV SOG
- Hosts: Rob and Sam from Savage Game Design
In depth interviews with each individual are available from our TH-cam channel, including links to many excellent SOG podcasts with Navy SEAL Jocko Willink.
Thank you to all our supporters, and especially to the Special Operations Association and to these outstanding veterans who helped us preserve Special Forces history through our video game.
This DLC is the most immersive and enjoyable experience I have had on the PC in over 5 years! These guys are legendary
glad you're enjoying it!
Agreed. My friend and I got it and played it for 12 hours straight.
After taking a break from ARMA for 5 years I'm back because of Prairie Fire. What an experience it has been. The things these guys did in real life is exceptional and I think the devs did a damn good job trying to give us a snapshot of a moment in time. Also as a side, Cam Lao is the best ARMA map ever, good job fellas, don't tell Bohemia I said that.
Thanks Luke, glad youre enjoying it - feel free to post your comment in our visitor book at community.sogpf.com
I'm back too for Prairie Fire. Theses men are real badass and true heroes !
Thank you SGD for being respectful, thorough, and bringing a very important time in history to the forefront in an immersive, detailed manor that has the ability to teach you something more than just "pew pew". I ordered two of Johns books, got a few friends hooked on the game. Youve made your mark in the most tasteful way. People who otherwise wouldve never cared or understood are taking notice. Keep up the good work!
Thank you - it's great when people really "get it" - enjoy the books they're great!
@@SavageGameDesign You guys are doing great work, thank you! This really helps bridge the generational gap between our youths and our men 👍
5 SOG guys at once is a better podcast. Thank you
They should bring Cowboy, the indig, in this group as well that was on jocko podcast....
@@benyoung552 indeed a phenomenal human being!
awesome dlc i'm addicted worth every cent
remember to get some R&R
It is so cool to see all these guys together.
Amazing DLC; truly set the standard for Arma content going forward.
Thank you for telling the stories of these men in such an engaging way; it helps to bridge the generational gap between the vets and the millennials!
I can't wait for Spike Teams to be implemented 😁
Great interviewer, Mr Graham.... at about 19:00, opening-up to this brotherhood of SOG clearly tabling they were Superheroes who join us w humility.....
Thank you so much, both for this video, the guys, who in my opinion are true heroes. I loved listening to their experiences. The amazing DLC you've created is fantastic. I love ArmA 3, but this DLC is the best I've ever played, not only for the ArmA series, but every Vietnam game I've ever played; (I've purchased most of the for PC over the years).
My formative years growing up through the Vietnam war impacted me a lot and it was the main reason I enlisted in the army; though being British, I was never involved, having served in Germany during the early 70's. Stay safe and keep up the great work on this amazing DLC.
Your comment about S.O.G. having not been portrayed in movies; maybe someone will change that in the future, hopefully.
Thank you guys so much for making these! You're game introduced me to SOG and these stories are absolutely amazing.
Looking forward to this! If its anything like the previous one, it's gonna be amazing
Amazing historical conversation here to listen to. Thank you!
How about getting a kickstarter going, for financing a HBO SERIES or movie about this awsome SOGs.
With enough monney some Hollywood moviemaker will do it;)
Another great video,, Was a real interesting Video too hear the stories , and very interesting as to how those that have taken part in playing the mod how they were smelling and feeling like its real ,, in all the years We've known each other Rob ,how many time's have I recollected on some part of some mission that you've worked on and we've played that has brought a "flashback" for me personally !! lol .. I'd more than honoured to play along side any of these Gentlemen in the mod at some point in the near future !!! Many thanks for all of your work Rob, and Sam ,, and Thank you Ken,Dick,Jim,John,and Don for all your stories and information that you have brought to us in the "Arma world" ,, Respect to you all from an EX-Mil person !!
hey Bill - yeah it's always interesting to see how veterans react to "being there" again as certain memory patterns are activated. Many find it therapeutic, along with the bonds of brotherhood in a gaming team. Always glad to have you in our team mate, sink some beers, and have a chat while waiting for the next target to appear...
I hope you keep uploading content like this I love hearing all these awesome stories
These have been amazing thanks for still doing them!
Really enjoying the DLC. Not from the US, so found out about SOG through this DLC coming out, and my only knowledge of the Vietnam War in any detail was the Ken Burns' documentary. I've since bought Tilt's Across The Fence and SOG Chronicles Vol. 1 which I've just started reading. These conversations have been very entertaining.
these guys are the REAL DEAL ! welcome to Prairie Fire!
43:50 - Rock Apes?! This was something of a Vietnam myth. Would love to hear more on that.
Outstanding keep the story's coming please
thank you for sharing, this is amazing!
Greatness
Sog
Great conversation! Any plans to add more stuff to SOG: Prairie Fire? an M113 APC for ACAV would be awesome!
We have a wishlist thread at community.sogpf.com
SOG didn't use ACAVs.
All these guys are great, but Dick Thompson? When I found out about him and the missions he was part of, I literally fell out of my chair. He is a very special person. I’d be willing to bet, there’s no one that matches up to him, past, present, or in the future. If you want to feel real humble about the “tough” issues in your own life.. learn about Dick Thompson (The one man bright light).
.
Tilt is the man!! He always will be (to me)!
Period. The end!
Ghostrider Don Here; All just an average day in SOG.
@@hughescrewchief836 Hey Don. I have a question about the m60 on the side of your helicopter. When you were in combat at night did the m60 have a light or did you fire at muzzle flashes I've been super curious. By the way your a badass for being in so many combat missions and thank you for your service
@@d-drizzle No light on the M-60. The only bright light was the landing light controlled by the pilots. It was only turned on just as we cleared the trees going into the LZ at night. With the M-60 we would just walk our tracers onto the muzzle flashes or where the tracers were coming from. All just another day in SOG and thank you it was my pleasure to serve.
@@hughescrewchief836 that must have been wild. Anyways thank you for the reply you made my week by answering my question. Take care
I dont know how he didnt get a medal of honour for that mission
That was impressive. Just Dam amazing.
Do you think you guys will do anymore SOG Prairie Fire Stories with Dick Thompson?
yes i hope so. we talk to him every few days, so it's very likely. in the meantime he sent us these links yesterday you might enjoy:
MMH SOG Podcast Dick Thompson Part 1
th-cam.com/video/j5RTL8lBeSg/w-d-xo.html
MMH SOG Podcast Dick Thompson Part 2
th-cam.com/video/rLju-9KkfAM/w-d-xo.html
@@SavageGameDesign thank you I appreciate it! 🙏🏻
I'd hope you do a stories interview with dick Thompson
This is a likelihood, watch this space!
yeah as a solo player i enjoyed it even tho i had a bit of anger per moment but yeah a nice experience the sound and the sountrack it's give all you need even the viet talking ( wish we could understand even tho it's add realism to thewhole campaign) while you are crawling to avoid being spotted the trackers shoot
i just think it shame about mike force that the viet don't use all they asset like tank and helicopter or they more advance AA tech to destroye the player and more objectif hunting AA , mortar and HQ is a bit easy , i wish you could add the tunnels (also is it possible to get the 105mm in mike force i didn't saw it ?) PS2: please don't forgot to check the steam forum you might get some feedback there ( me included) but i pretty much say the same thing here
we only have the staff and time to take feedback posted at community.sogpf.com
re mike force, it's in development, you can talk about it at the community portal
Q: What kind of shenanigans did you pull over there?
A: Silencers are pretty good for killing things quietly!
Everybody: *rubbing their hands* tee-hee
Yet such perfect gentlemen when in a friendly mood 😶
When Tick is looking at you like "holy shit bro" that's how you know you've seen some real shit.
These men look great for their age.
Goodnight Lynne Black, wherever you are...
42:42 That monkey story is just WOW! Huge respect for these crazy guys and also great job on the game, loving it so much! Cant wait for Spike Team
Also, 1:05:39 is that question from Jason from Savage Actual??
Yeah Jason is a fan and came to the Q&A with Patrick
@@b-52eggbeast88 awesome!
Two steppers? BushMaster?
Cool
More dlc when
just boot up Arma 3...
Did you guys know Wisper Hawk. MACV COMPOUND Hue, Tra Bac station, Fort Devens teacher 1967 and disappeared until 1973 and out. Jake Bowditch Marine Ssgt 63 to 73. Naval Security Group spook
Who had Bubba the Tiger cub?
Perhaps the ARMA players may be a different breed than the typical gamers of FPS run and gun, spawn, repeat variety. If so then they might be more open to playing in a more realistic and thoughtful way, incorporating things they learn from these guys and their recounting of the way it was.
I was watching your marathon footage of the first day and Karma, God love him, was doing very well but it was still very obvious that his style is groomed from years of playing games like Squad where speed and covering the map as fast as possible is a higher priority than survival. Ability to respawn not long after getting wacked tends to have that effect on gamers. As I was watching I was thinking "Whoa! Slow down there dude!. You're going to get all these guys killed". If anyone reads the books written by these men or any others from former LRRPS, SEALS, Recondos in general they will learn what the approach was like. One thing that never came up in these conversations was how they had to do all this without the benefit of talking to each other. Rarely could they actually speak more than whispering into the next guys ear. It was hand signals and comms over the radio was very limited as well. Halting just to listen for activity around you was also something you had to do every once in a while as well as waiting for rear security to do a quick reconnoiter of the area behind them to check for signs of being followed. There was one point when I thought for sure someone would have thought of it but they had an enemy arty gun and were talking about taking it out, and how to do it. They already popped off several WP grenades at NVA and those are actually designed specifically for destroying vehicles and equipment. That phosphorous gets hot enough to melt through steel. Standard practice in this case is to drop one down the muzzle of the gun and get away from it. It will burn right through. Maybe the game doesn't support putting something in the muzzle of one of those guns but now they could add that in.
Overall it looks like they thought of a lot of the tactics used by these guys and, of course, players can always incorporate more, such as stay-behind ambushes, etc.. I think most gamers today won't want to adapt this slower and more methodical style, as most of their piers will want to continue playing the way they do every other game. Maybe there will be a movement towards a more realistic experience. If so, I think this is the most likely vehicle to encourage that. Hats off to the devs for all this. I think it would be a blast to play with a bunch of vets or others that want that real simulator experience but I don't have the time to spend playing games to actually "get good" as they say. I may know what I want to do, but doing it in game is another matter entirely, lol. I've heard ARMA has the steepest learning curve and is the most complex. The easier ones to pick up are still tougher than I have had the time to spend with, and I haven't touched my gaming rig in a couple years now. So IDK if I will ever get around to playing this but it does sure look awesome. I hope they continue to add in other things like maybe some A-1 Sandys, O-1 Bird Dogs, other CAS and FAC/CAC, maybe some other unit types for larger scale missions, and just continue expanding on the maps and skins. They have a great selection already to start with.
thanks that's a great post. we have to run in the AO as the trackers are severe in mid-late 1968. The first thing all our SOG advisers said watching us play is - you're going way too fast. So you can play it as slow as you want, but the trackers will be all over you. Best to move fast and change direction often. Karma was a good point guy. The tail guys were a bit heavy (all the mines they had) so we kept stretching the string out too far.
@@SavageGameDesign It seems to me that if the AI is such that you have to alter your tactics from what is realistic then the AI needs adjustment. I'm referring to your comment regarding the trackers and the methods of dealing with them in game VS reality. I'm sure making this stuff work is probably really tough. I don't know if these real world tactics are not effective in game because of the pace of the trackers but whatever the reason I think the answer is to adjust that rather than merely adopting different tactics because of whatever is off. Assuming the players are competent at these tasks like planting traps or positioning for an ambush, etc., then what the real deal men did SHOULD work for the gamer as well. It's certainly faster to plant a mine in game than IRL.
My apologies if I misunderstood your reply. If the volume of enemy, based on what was authentic for that period, is such that some tactics become unsound then those tactics would not be authentic under such circumstances either. So maybe just toe-poppers and changing route is all that remains. If I was playing this I would want to actually experience as many of these tactics as possible. Perhaps in lower difficulty levels (fewer enemy?) some of this would be more feasible.
I do really appreciate that you guys factored in things like time on target and how more enemy become drawn into the AO over time. I don't know if you have made available things like false insertions and extractions, having air crews loiter in other locations to attract the enemy away from you, etc.. These are some of the practices recon teams used to utilize as SOP. Overall you have done a great job on this game. Best thing I've seen intended to recreate this experience.
Sorry for the long winded comments. Thanks for reading.