Great video, the r/c cars really make it easy to show them. I would have to add that there is a lot of more complicated designs, my porsche 944 has trailing arms but there is a lot of adjustments on them (baffling number of them, lol) and there are multilink designs that do all kind of stuff, my RX8/Miata has I think 6 links in it. I'm building a big 1/4 scale onroad race car and think I will just use trailing arms, even though they are not used much if at all anymore, but that is what my 914 and 944 have. And since I will 3dprint them, fabricating them is all on the computer and the robot printer will make them.
Awesome video man, pretty much stumbled upon it because I heard the term "A-Arm" in another video for the thousands time and this time I wondered what it actually means. You've made it very easy to understand and clear to see where the challenges and advantages are in each design. Good on ya!
Hi Bud, I had work on my buggy, i was changing the A-arrms on the front, design new, new Schock Absorbers front and back, now it's stiffer, i like it. On the back i had A-arms, but i have switch to Trailling arms like Pollaris or Can Am, with the rodds. It's working much much easy on the bumps. For me this is the most important, to resist on bumps. Wish you all the best😊
There are a couple other designs that are pretty interesting, too. DeDion suspension and Chapman Strut suspension. The first one tries to mimic what a solid axle does while reducing unsprung mass by taking the diff and axles out and mounting the former to the body like an independent setup. Chapman Strut instead uses a non-plunging axle as the upper link of an SLA/double wishbone design. An example of that is the Lotus Elan.
cool stuff! I know you had touched on this point before in one of your videos, but if you are really concerned with track width changes, you can change the relative lengths of the arms(short arm, long arm), so the upper arm is shorter and cambers the wheel and tire out, if done correctly, this can effectively compensate for the change in track width, at the cost of camber change. I dont recall if you mentioned, but the trailing arms also dont have camber change, so when articulating, the contact patch wont be ideal. also for the trailing arm the anti dive characteristics are a simple function of the length of the arm, its more complicated and potentially adjustable for an a arm setup.
Man this is a good video! Wish you made this like 8 months ago lol. I'm more familiar with A-Arms and their geometry/fabricating, but I'm going to try and keep my Baja Bug trailing arms. For a few reasons... I flat tow my bug, I want to learn something new and I want to build it for 500 unlimited class specs. After talking and learning about other peoples build I think it will be enough for what I want to do with it. I do have a trailer, but it's kinda overkill I built the trailer for my 1450 class race truck lol. I want to make it a 500 unlimited specs just incase I want to race or prerun. Right now it's just a toy, but I want the option to race it if I want.
I don't know with respect to the VW chassis but you can absolutely change camber and toe in trailing arms on a mini. I think it's restricted on VWs because the torsion springs and possibly anti-roll bar run parallel and are integrated with the pivots.
I agree with the straight pivot, but what I was really referencing was how on A Arms you can change camber at any time by changing the upper link length. Where as with trailing arms once you build the trailing arms the camber is pretty much locked in.
@@DougBugBuilder not really, there's a bracket that changes the location of the outer pivot of the trailing arm, move the pivot up / down to change camber, move it back or forwards for toe out or toe in. The arm itself is still a solid single piece. It could be the inner or outer pivot that moves but ease of adjustment means it's generally the outer. Here's an example of the adjustment bracket for minis, they can also be adjusted using shims and were from factory to allow manufacturing tolerances and make sure they didn't have any toe out.
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Great information, it’s always been my dream was to build and own a Baja bug. Your channel snd craftsman ship is tremendous!
Thanks, appreciate the support!
Great video, the r/c cars really make it easy to show them.
I would have to add that there is a lot of more complicated designs, my porsche 944 has trailing arms but there is a lot of adjustments on them (baffling number of them, lol)
and there are multilink designs that do all kind of stuff, my RX8/Miata has I think 6 links in it. I'm building a big 1/4 scale onroad race car and think I will just use trailing arms, even though they are not used much if at all anymore, but that is what my 914 and 944 have.
And since I will 3dprint them, fabricating them is all on the computer and the robot printer will make them.
Thanks so much for your clear explanation! Really helps me understand the differences and benefits of each.
You are so welcome! Thanks for the comment.
Awesome video man, pretty much stumbled upon it because I heard the term "A-Arm" in another video for the thousands time and this time I wondered what it actually means. You've made it very easy to understand and clear to see where the challenges and advantages are in each design. Good on ya!
Thanks, appreciate the kind words.
Hi Bud, I had work on my buggy, i was changing the A-arrms on the front, design new, new Schock Absorbers front and back, now it's stiffer, i like it.
On the back i had A-arms, but i have switch to Trailling arms like Pollaris or Can Am, with the rodds.
It's working much much easy on the bumps.
For me this is the most important, to resist on bumps.
Wish you all the best😊
So would you call that a 3 link setup? Like a hybrid between trailing arms and A arms.
@@DougBugBuilder I don't know how it's named, but it's working great for the bumps.
There are a couple other designs that are pretty interesting, too. DeDion suspension and Chapman Strut suspension. The first one tries to mimic what a solid axle does while reducing unsprung mass by taking the diff and axles out and mounting the former to the body like an independent setup. Chapman Strut instead uses a non-plunging axle as the upper link of an SLA/double wishbone design. An example of that is the Lotus Elan.
cool stuff! I know you had touched on this point before in one of your videos, but if you are really concerned with track width changes, you can change the relative lengths of the arms(short arm, long arm), so the upper arm is shorter and cambers the wheel and tire out, if done correctly, this can effectively compensate for the change in track width, at the cost of camber change.
I dont recall if you mentioned, but the trailing arms also dont have camber change, so when articulating, the contact patch wont be ideal. also for the trailing arm the anti dive characteristics are a simple function of the length of the arm, its more complicated and potentially adjustable for an a arm setup.
I didn't want to talk about the anti dive because honestly, although I understand it, I don't think I do enough to comment on it. 🤷♂️😁
Man this is a good video! Wish you made this like 8 months ago lol. I'm more familiar with A-Arms and their geometry/fabricating, but I'm going to try and keep my Baja Bug trailing arms. For a few reasons... I flat tow my bug, I want to learn something new and I want to build it for 500 unlimited class specs. After talking and learning about other peoples build I think it will be enough for what I want to do with it. I do have a trailer, but it's kinda overkill I built the trailer for my 1450 class race truck lol. I want to make it a 500 unlimited specs just incase I want to race or prerun. Right now it's just a toy, but I want the option to race it if I want.
Build it right with trailing arms and it will be more than capable. I have faith in you. 😁
👋👋👋great explanation boy 👋👋💯💯
Thanks buddy!
I don't know with respect to the VW chassis but you can absolutely change camber and toe in trailing arms on a mini. I think it's restricted on VWs because the torsion springs and possibly anti-roll bar run parallel and are integrated with the pivots.
I agree with the straight pivot, but what I was really referencing was how on A Arms you can change camber at any time by changing the upper link length. Where as with trailing arms once you build the trailing arms the camber is pretty much locked in.
@@DougBugBuilder not really, there's a bracket that changes the location of the outer pivot of the trailing arm, move the pivot up / down to change camber, move it back or forwards for toe out or toe in. The arm itself is still a solid single piece. It could be the inner or outer pivot that moves but ease of adjustment means it's generally the outer.
Here's an example of the adjustment bracket for minis, they can also be adjusted using shims and were from factory to allow manufacturing tolerances and make sure they didn't have any toe out.
Theres a 3rd type.. a mix of both, with 2 lateral links, and a trailing link... think late 90s subaru.
Yeah, it would work well on this chassis too.
Good job
Thanks!
allot of sxs have trailing arms with control arms
Yeah, that's an interesting design, mixes pros and cons from both systems.
But I like it, I've thought about how to convert it to a Baja Bug before.
I was on A arms, I have switch to sxs kind of trailling arms with tie roods