It's a shame how many principles in this country don't get their day in court because it is so much more expensive to get justice than to continue allowing someone to steal from you/wrong you/whatever.
I'm pretty sure I could figure out how to cost them every penny of that $300k; some legal and some they just cannot prove. Once they slander me once or twice, I think punitive damages might just get my money back.
The bigger question is WHY did it coast $300,000+? I understand lawyers have to eat, but that amount does seem pretty steep. If the lawyer is being paid $200,000 /yr, that is the equivalence of a full 1 1/2 years spent on just this case.
I paid my attorney $550.00 to represent me on a $150.00 fee I was contesting from my HOA. My attorney told me, "I admire the fact you are a man of principle but most people would just pay the fee". On court day, the HOA representative and/or attorney was a no show and I prevailed by default. I guess justice is for sale after all.
HOA members should use this as a reason to remove the HOA board members, or better, dissolve the HOA entirely. I had one Realtor (tm) try to convince me that a HOA property only insures added value. I asked how, unless this HOA requires constant upgrades to the houses. They also tried to defend a $450 / month HOA dues on a sub $500k house for a HOA that only provided a "lake" that looked maintained by a gopher. I left this realtor for a real one that wasn't a developer's lapdog.
Jason W that’s funny. In California with some of the highest housing costs, the only places that are (relatively) affordable are houses in HOAs. Nobody wants them!
@@danielschein6845 fiduciary duty comes to mind. If they had like costs, it would be really hard to justify spending that much to recover $200 / mo payments from one or even several properties.
@@JasonW. The realtor was right. actual sales prove that homes controlled by an HOA command a higher price than comparable homes without one. HOAs obviously have a huge downside for those of us who don't want to live by somebody else's rules, but they also have the advantage of preventing people from doing a lot of things that can reduce your property's value (I'm way out on a limb here, but maybe that's related to the increased value). FWIW, there's a road a bit north of me that has had an unusual mix of properties for as long as I've been aware of it. Some are relatively new and expensive houses, many of which were likely owned by IBM employees before IBM downsized in the 90's. Others were crappy little houses on property that had been in the family for years, allowing people to own property they could never have paid for. Besides many of those houses being worth far less than neighboring houses, a few of them were owned by the sport of people who still have every car and appliance they ever acquired. Plenty of them saw a lawn mower just a few times through the summer, and got (poorly) painted every 15 or 20 years. People who don't want to have that sort of thing in their neighborhood are why HOAs exist. People who want to decide how the world should work and people who don't want to be active in their HOA are why so many HOAs become the organizations that so many people hate.
If they don't pay, I wonder if there are any assets he can have a helpful sheriff's deputy help him seize? (My guess is not much.) The board will likely resign/get kicked out, leaving their mess for others to handle. Maybe they'll declare bankruptcy. I wonder if there's any liability on the part of the HOA's members? In theory, they ultimately control the board and could have stopped this?? If a clear majority of the HOA's members get angry with the board, how quickly could they force the offending members out or force some sort of change?
True, but the HOA must have spent a similar amount. If I was a resident there I would sack the whole HOA board for malfeasance. Spending that kind of money for $200 a month by either side is crazy, but at least the guy who won did it because he was a principled person. The HOA board can't even claim that.
@@cruelabduhl That's not how it works. People get really defensive about any group/community they are a part of. And they would undoubtedly get one way communication on the matter. I expect Jonathan Friedrich to be the subject of a lot of harassment in the future,
He actually made all the property in his development zone 1 WORTH that much more, As this means all the people in that zone now dont have to pay the HOA and can demand return of the fees they had collected from them. Plus he can sue the title company that did not do their job.
*and the fact that if he doesn't have to follow the asinine rules of the HOA no one else does either meaning he basically broke the spine of the HOA leadership*
My situation is very close to his.....my property is the only one in my development that doesn't say anything about an HOA or any restrictive covenants at the time of closing.....6 years later they filed an amended instrument that included my property.....to make matters worse the developer didn't follow state law as set forth under the planned communities act of North Carolina and had to incorporate as a nonprofit organization.....meaning that anyone who doesn't want to be a member doesn't have to join because you can't become an automatic member of a nonprofit organization.....talk about screwed up.....thankfully I only had to spend 300 dollars for a cease and desist letter
There`s a video of this on TH-cam with the banners and pink flamingoes ...his house looks fantastic and must have cost him a lot and its kinda fricking huge,ive a feeling that though to me $300,000 is a hell of a lot of money to him its not...
About 20 years ago my brother lived in a condo that had a HOA. The people on the board were the power hungry type and did something stupid and petty to him. Being a charismatic guy who all of the neighbors loved, he ran for the board along with a couple of the neighbors who were friends of his and they all won including voting him the president. Although they didn't have every seat, he had enough seats that were favorable to his cause, so he made a motion to dissolve the HOA and they approved it. lolz.
Was this really a condo? Meaning there are shared walls between neighbors and common spaces owned/maintained by the association? You can't dissolve it if that's the case because then who would own and maintain those things? Also I'm pretty sure that dissolving it would require a unanimous vote by everyone, not just the board.
@@joshuahudson2170 If it really is a condo, that is shared walls, shared facilities, certain shared utilities, etc. Then the trash compounds will be overflowing after a week. The outside lighting will be dark shortly after the association stops paying the electricity bill. The landscaping will be dead about a month into summer once the HOA stops paying the water bill. The city will shut down and lock the pool gates shortly after the pool guy stops turning up. The value of your unit will tank when everyone in the next building moves out because the roof leaks, and you are eyeing your building every time it rains.
But that also works in reverse. We have a 1 lot 1 vote neighborhood. The developer has all of his undeveloped lots as voting lots. He just put all of his friends on the board and now he dictates every rule. Glad for your brother, but sucks for me.
@@slightlyevolved Condo HoA boards typically do hire management companies that manage shared services and handle the billing, and in theory have no "say on things." I say 'in theory' because the management company personnel are usually more knowledgeable than board members so their advice generally is followed. Also, I think, but I don't know for sure, that there is no getting round the requirement for a homeowners association because 'common interest developments' are complex and are heavily regulated. If you tried to disband you'd be breaking the law. However, let's say you were able to do it. How would you pick your management company? By a vote of all the members? Who will approach the various management companies to get bids and proposals? A couple of volunteers, yes? Would you perhaps have to vote on who these volunteers should be? A bit like HoA board members, eh. So then the management company that the volunteers have chosen and you've all voted on asks you what are the rules and regulations that the management company should use to manage the property. Who will sign the checks on behalf of the owners? The company will ask what the dues should be. They can probably come up with a reasonable budget estimate for ongoing operating expenses, but then they'll ask what you'd like for your reserve allocation to pay for future replacement or repair of capital items. When you shrug your shoulders they will probably suggest that you should follow the requirements laid out in the various statutes that govern the administration of common interest developments, i.e. HoAs. I suppose the point of all this is simply - it ain't as easy as it sounds. Really, the only way to make a HoA work is to vote in board members you trust, and hold them accountable.
I’m thinking it will weigh less on his mind that he is out $300k than the fact that he would be governed by an HOA, and having peace of mind is priceless.
300k is a lot of money. I would rather buy a rental that makes more than 200. However, this could be an entertainment expense. You can invest 50 bucks or go out to dinner for 2
HOA are insane, my friend received a letter from his HOA telling him his son could not live with him. He was polite and informed them his son has lived there since the age of nine when he built the house and his son's name is on the title. So piss off !
On what authority would the HOA even have saying that a family member isn't allowed to live on the property? Even if the son's name wasn't on the title or the deed, the HOA wouldn't have any authority to enforce that.
Dang, that's nuts. It just shows that given any opportunity, there are plenty of people who will do bad things just to attempt to exercise control over others.
@@ericwilson956 IF the HOA is marketed as an "OVER 55" community they can force him to move. At least in ARIZONA that is the law thanks to "DELL WEBB CORPORATION"! 😡😡😡😡😡😡😡😡😡😡
HOAs are literally my only No Go with regard to buying a house. I will not deal with an organization that's effectively a government, but one that doesn't have to play by a set of rules.
Once I bought a building lot in a small sub-division with an HOA. Since the private owner of that sub-division had to pay HOA fees for all unsold lots, he got a court permission to dissolve the HOA. I didn't pay a dime. Since then, I avoided HOA properties like a plaque.
Actually, they do have to play by several sets of rules including local laws and regulations plus the CC&R's. If you are too stupid and lazy to read the CC&R's prior to purchase, if you are too dumb to request the financials, board minutes, reserve study, and talk to other owners prior, your too stupid anyway. It's called due diligence and a smart person would do this in a non-HOA as well...make sure your neighbors are not nitwits (like you), make sure the city code compliance is not a fascist, etc. BTW, unlike an HOA who can only foreclose for non-payment of dues, a city can take your house for non-payment of their fines / violations. Also, whereas an HOA will fine you $50 or $100, the cities typically start at $500 - $1,000 and give you 10 days to cure.
Quasi-HOA (more of a deed-restriction enforcement org) in my neighborhood sued itself out of existence. (Side note...Deed restrictions aren't too bad; mainly to ensure setbacks are enforced and only single family or duplexes are part of the neighborhood. No nonsense about paint colors/gardening/stuff in the backyard, etc. I actually liked the setup.) Tried to cite someone for building a 2nd garage, but owner contested it due to selective enforcement. Local court agreed it was a violation, but the selective enforcement of the deed restrictions made it unenforceable. HOA appealed to state supreme court. State supreme court concurred with the courts ruling, and also said the HOA formation was not legal. 2nd court case in 5 years lost in state supreme court after initial loss and stupidly appealed. At the end of it all, lawyers/board pushed the HOA into Chapter 7 bankruptcy! Only people who won were the lawyers and the people that didn't want a deed-restriction enforcement.
Not the personal property of the HOA president or the board. What would happen is that the HOA could be required (by a court order) to pay. Then, the HOA member will be on the hook most likely via a special assessment.
Why the hell would anyone want to pay others to just make up rules that they have to abide by? People need to stop buying houses in HOAs and they'll go away.
If you live outside city limits, you might not be able to rely on the county to enforce things like noise ordinances and other quality of life issues. What if your neighbor decides to start a cabinet making business in his garage and run power tools until the legal cut-off of 10pm 5 nights a week, and he sprays varnish in his front driveway making an awful stink. The county won't do anything so without an HOA you have to move or live with it, or maybe spend a bunch of money to see if you can sue him for violating zoning laws. There are many things a neighbor could do that would reduce the value of your land.
contentioushackery oh you mean the neighbor that bought and paid for his property doing things he wants with it. You’re right, that’s terrible. Some people believe in live and let live, even if it’s not always perfect. Those people love it in the county where no one has their thumb on them. Others want the illusion of perfection and need to be told what to do. HOA’s and city zoning is for them. There is always something for everyone.
There's good and bad things about HOA's. But perhaps any HOA community should have their rules and regulations easy to access for new perspective owners to look through. Also realtors should really give that information upfront to clients looking into buying the property instead of trying to make a buck. Should allow home owners the ability to sue those realtors if they don't fully disclose the rules and regulations.
The core reason for having an HOA is that your property's value depends on the appearance of your neighbors' properties. An HOA is an agreement wherein everyone agrees to maintain their properties to a certain standard, or else. Some careless people don't like the "or else, some money-hungry people love it, and some power-hungry people can't resist it. The latter join the HOA board.
@@jordancobb509 Youve missed a big part! Rental properties. Imagine a world where you own multiple homes in an HOA, I dont have to monitor them. The HOA babysits them for me. HOA absolutely stabilizes property values. HOA also substantiate eviction processes through violation documents. Eliminates a ton of hassel.
nick T No, if you own multiple properties with tenants renting them, and you’re too lazy to manage them yourself, then hire a property management firm or start your own management company.
@@preachers4135 It isnt only my properties that the hoa babysits. they babysit all of the properties around mine as well as mine. Thus stabilizing the value of the entire neighborhood, not simply my properties. Also this particular hoa provides a water park, 3 pools..a restaurant.. dog park...a game area, multiple tennis courts basketball courts... These things are all hoa maintained for my tenants which helps ensure the homes are rented by families with kids.. All of these things stabilize the values of all of the properties. Conversely all of the prices rise and fall together.
Now his neighbors in that section of the development should follow suit and sue for return of any fees they have paid ti this HOA? Wouldn't they all be exempt from the HOA as well?
That depends on how stupid they were when they bought their houses, and whether they agreed voluntarily to be in it. I'm familiar with that neighborhood (I'm from Vegas originally) and that's about a 40-50 year old million dollar home neighborhood, so there are a lot of wealthy but not very real-estate savvy people living there.
He was the only exception, he was between the two development The second development was built approximately 10 years after the first his land wasn’t included in either Hué development
I just got an HOA letter today. The violation was for having a trash can at the curb on trash day. The funny part is it was next to my neighbors driveway and about 20ft from my driveway. It was obviously my neighbors trash can and yet they wrote me a violation. HOAs should be illegal.
It should be illegal to make excessive rules. Just limit HOA to basic rules like no loud noise, no rainbow colored houses of houses painted with a middle finger, and no parking your car in front of other people’s houses. And no mosquito 🦟 swamps.
*add a clause in any agreement that IF a HOA is formed at any time after you house or property is purchased you have the right to tell them to get stuffed if they tell you you are obligated to join*
Usually the declaration give each owner a vote. Homeowners association and Condominium association have different rules and power with the later been able to control your dreams. Most of the time they can be dissolved with 75% to 100% of members vote required. Older Hoa required less votes vs new Hoa. Also some states, I am in Florida, world capital of HOAs and COAs they had to create laws to protect owner since some investors would buy a majority of the units to be able to dissolve the Hoa and buy the other units and a fraction of the cost. Now this tactic is mostly illegal.
Same thing happened to my dad. He bought a house in a development that was built in two stages. The first 20 homes were HOA free, the next 100 were in the HOA. They tried to tell my Dad he was in the HOA. He asked them to show him any paperwork he signed stating he was a part of the HOA. They couldn’t produce anything. This upset the actual HOA members. Since they couldn’t force my Dad or the other 19 homeowners in the development to pay HOA fees or abide by HOA rules, they voted to disband the HOA all together.
My ex-landlord owned quite a bit of farmland he sold to builder, it was adjacent to the property he kept for himself and he had already built a home. A few years after the neighborhood was built around his home, the HOA tried to start make him pay dues and tried to gig him for non-conformance. Fortunately it never had to make it to court, he disagreed and the HOA stopped pursuing after a consult with the HOA attorneys. Apparently HOAs cannot annex peoples homes involuntarily in Indiana.
What is disgusting is how much it costs to do anything in the legal system. The USA has laws, but from what I have seen, the US legal system is only for the rich when one hopes to pursue a legal case even if you have been wronged and are 110% in the right. Groups like HOA's know that the average person can not afford to hire a lawyer and they prey on that fact.
Being able to put pink flamingos in your yard, in the middle of a guarded & gated HOA community with no consequences is Priceless!!! I'd park a rusty, I mean well patina'd street legal rat-rod in the driveway too 🤣
@@erica1957 Are you implying there are other countries with strictly "justice" systems? Otherwise I'm not sure what the hell "In America" has to do with it.
My brother in law lived in a HOA. They allowed a certain sized shed in the backyard, but it has to match house colors. His friend down the street wanted to paint his red like a barn. So next election cycle, his friend was the HOA President, and changed the restriction.
Ow God I live in a little naiborhood with no hoa....a few years ago a new development was built next to us...our privet road was re routed to the hoa road....a very nice paved two lane compared to out old dirt road... Same easement to the state road..... They have been telling us for years that we are part of the h HOA bacauae our easement runs thure their development.... Nope. I have the right to drive thure their roads to reach the state road ... We injore their letters. The sheriff where call so many time for trespassing completea they they told the hoa president that they would arrest him if they where called again.... They have even tryed chaining the road. We cut it with the sheriff blessing .... The cause. We are about 20 property with small houses or trailers whial they are 500,000$ home.....offer me enough money and I will be happy to sell my land to the hoa
Robert Z if I were in your situation I would install a device called a header dump on my truck that with a flick of a switch bypasses the exhaust system while traveling through that neighborhood.
@@sirstephen9825 90 % of the residents are okay. If a few members of the board that can't stand us driving thure their naiborhood..... They think since we use their road then we should pay the up keep too......they know this when they built the development..... But I can't complain. I get payed to store two rv on my property
If you can document this, you should sue them for harassment. I would start at $750k. If you can unify your neighborhood, you can enter into a class action.
@@sirstephen9825 No; there was nothing wrong with his title. The wrong was with the HOA telling him he owed money when the easement is right there in their ( the HOA's ) deed clear as day and says they have to provide access to the road.
Greetings Steve, This story bring a tear to my eyes. You probably are too busy to read my story but it's a good one and it would do me much good to get a reaction from you. My name is Joseph Emery. I will promise on my honor, not to create or exaggerate any claims here. I am a 100% disabled veteran from the 82nd Airborne division. I moved into a nice house in an HOA in Oregon. The president of the HOA was also a popular police officer in the same city. I had come to Oregon to study Medical Marijuana. As such, I obtained an instructor and the proper legal paperwork and permits to grow my plants as it was insisted on by my instructed as that same officer was my neighbor. I believed this to be a good move as his location would discourage thief's and force me to follow the letter of the law. Thing went well for about a year until there was an election. My neighbor was so popular that he had political parties at his house while I had 50 pot plants in my back yard. I was aware that he was anti pot but I just ignored that and kept up to date on the rules. Then something happened,....I was evicted for no reason other than that the homeowner needed to move back into their home. I was disappointed but accepted it and moved out. About a month later I was informed that my landlord did not move back into the house. My cop neighbors daughter did. I was furious and decided to try to get a lawyer on principal even if I had to pay. I spoke to every lawyer in town about it and got the same answer. Thew believed he broke the law however, thew would not take on the police department or the HOA from fear. As a result I have been homeless ever since. Thanks for your time.
I'd rather live in a cardboard box under an overpass than live under an HOA. I have never heard one resident, who was not an insider on the board, who liked living under them.
@@suzanh7777 I've never had any problem with the HOA in either of my houses that were in them. The first one was very simple and just maintained the entrance to the neighborhood so the fees were only like $25/month. My current house has lots of community parks, pools, buildings and gyms so it's more expensive. I think you have selection bias where you are only hearing from people that complain; most people never have to think about their HOA. One of the houses I grew up in also had a community pool and another one was in a gated community and my parents never had a problem with them.
What a great story. I live in a neighborhood with an HOA but am one of 8 out of 500 homes that were grandfathered and are not a part of the association. They call us the chartered members. Every stinking year I have to fight with the HOA because I have not payed the dues. 17 years and counting.
Former HOA president here. This type of dispute is incredibly common, but it's one that - if the parties at either end were remotely rational - would've been resolved immediately upon discovery that the property wasn't under the HOA's jurisdiction. 1. The homeowner is at fault for not conducting adequate due diligence when buying the property. 2. The homeowner's real estate agent and closing attorney are at fault for not conducting adequate due diligence prior to closing. 3. The HOA is at fault for not understanding its plats, and knowing the boundaries of its jurisdiction. With rational people involved, this gets settled simply with a settlement: the HOA kicks back all dues paid to the homeowner, perhaps plus reasonable interest, dating back to the day he purchased the property, in exchange for dropping the suit and indemnifying the HOA going forward. The fact that this went to the Nevada Supreme Court merely tells you that the people involved decided they'd rather trade "**** you's" than resolve their dispute reasonably. I wouldn't want to be this guy's next door neighbor nor part of this HOA; in fact if I were a member of it, I'd consider suing its board members for malfeasance, for letting this get this far out of hand.
@R Cruz? None of the houses I have bought were in a HOA. The only land I even considered buying with a HOA was a very simple one that had a shared well as the only paragraph in the agreement.
Hardly... They will offset the cost to the rest of the homeowners of their community by increasing the dues. The only way to kick them out, is to turn the community against them.
@@stephen3164 Depends on the HOA. I'm renting in an HOA. I'd wager half of the units in here are rentals. If half of the home owners are land lords, of course the HOA is going to allow rentals. Mind you, I wouldn't be surprised if 1/3-1/2 of the houses within 2 miles of the university campus are rentals.
Does qualified immunity pertain to HOA board members? If not, perhaps they're personally held liable? Or can you get a judgement to put some kind of hold or garnishment on incoming fees to pay the legal costs?
Ju M An HOA is basically a corporation, to go often the individuals directly you would need to find cause that would permit piercing the corporate veil (a corporate officer’s version of individual qualified immunity). Piercing the veil to get at an officer individually isn’t a trivial thing to achieve but it can be done if certain conditions are, or are not, met.
@@ethanpoole3443 I am thinking that Fraud might be cause to pierce that corporate veil. They did commit a fraudulent foreclosure hear by trying to foreclose on his house when he was not part of the HOA. if the people on the board of the HOA knew he was not part of the HOA, and for all account it sounds like they did, then they would be personally liable. to me this also seems like malpractice on the part of the HOA attorneys. they would have seen the documents about him not being part of the HOA during the discovery process, and they should have informed their client that they were in the wrong, and maybe they did and the HOA pushed it anyway.
Kudos to the man!! Now, how about all the rest of the homeowners in section #1? are they entitled to stop paying the fees? and can they sue the HOA for their money back as well?
I get suggestions from Quora and get ones about HOAs. Usually the question is " I moved into a house next to an HOA. They send me letters about X, what should I do." Everyone including the lawyers that post say if you didn't get a notice at closing that there was an HOA "ignore them" :)
I spent 350 dollars back in the 80’s for a 35.00 traffic ticket. Two days before court the ticket was dismissed. I later ended up working with the a-hole and was there when he was fired. I had never forgotten him or the ticket so it was sweet watching him walk out the door.
I've represented myself in Lawsuit against an HOA for 13 years. HOA side has expended approximately $400,000 in fees & costs. They had 3 Attorneys at a 2-wk jury trial. I had no law school, not even jury experience. I won, although I got only a fraction of what the jury wanted to award because I missed a discovery deadline. I am now suing them for malicious prosecution. Wish me luck! I do not recommend this for everyone. As an attorney told me, "you need deep pockets and the stomach of a goat." Representing myself has taken 1000s of hours vs. their $100,000s. They started it. I intend to finish it. BTW, seek legal advice. Good Luck!
my friend lives in one and they told her that since her car was not operable that she needed to have it removed or they would tow it .. now her car is operable ,registered, insured the problem they had is she just doesnt drive that car in the winter she drives her truck instead so she wrote back to them and asked who their mechanic was and why they would be snooping around on her private property they never replied go figure
$320k might actually be worth it in the long haul when you start adding in the petty fines and stuff they can levy up to and including making you tear down things you've built on your property or repainting your house because you didn't buy the paint from the right vendor...
@@BrianDaleNeeley what's really screwed up about the United States is that even when you fight something like the homeowners association and win, they don't have to cover your legal fees. And what's worse if you're actually still part of the HOA, you'll be paying increased fees for what they spent fighting you in court!!!
Steve you say the homeowner won but at a cost of $320K. What I’m curious about is what did the HOA have to pay for this litigation which seems like it should be a bankrupting amount of $$$! I wonder how all the members of this HOA feel about sharing towards this costly defeat?! I think this homeowner is reveling in his costly revenge!!! Rich
$200 per month adds up quickly when you're assessing it against dozens of properties. $200 x 12 mon = $2400 x 100 properties = $240,000 per year. That's an impressive legal fund, and that's just one year. Of course, that's before the HOA Board Members compensation.
I don't know about there, but my mom's HOA for a bunch of condo buildings decided that a million dollars worth of repairs need to be done to some of the buildings. First, they won't say which ones. It's all hush hush. But what they have done is assessed and an additional fee of about $8000 per unit to the owners for the year. On the one hand if there is structural damage that needs to be repaired due to water run off, which is what they are claiming, then I guess you can't just let those buildings collapse. On the other hand there are a lot of older people in the association and I'm sure most of them don't have an extra $8000 just sitting around. The point is, depending on their HOA rules and Nevada law the HOA may be able to assess each member a share of the legal costs. Which may really tick off the additional people that weren't supposed to be in the HOA to begin with.
gatesmw50 It’s possible liability insurance might cover the HOA for being sued for damages by the homeowner, but I suspect it was the HOA that initiated this harassment litigation against this homeowner to bully the homeowner into compliance on what they mistakenly thought was their correctness of their position. Rich
There was a case you spoke about last year where a Mr.Andy Lipka in Missouri was being threatened with foreclosure by his HOA because he parked his 1965 Ford pickup on his drive. The matter was going to court, but there doesn't seem to have been a resolution. Does anyone know what the outcome (if there has been one) is?
Being a Licensed Amateur Radio Operator living in an HOA I am glade there was a new law passed that the HOA has to provide reasonable accommodation for my radio equipment (meaning my antenna) because before I was not allowed to put up an antenna because some of them are quite big and some will say unsightly. Btw love the mics in the background especially the D104
Hooray for him! I live in a huge condo community that consists of numerous HOAs, depending on the unit you live in. Every HOA pays the same amount of money to the same trash service, no matter where they live. The nearest dumpster to me is just across the street from my unit, but it is owned by a different HOA. Our dumpster is a rather lengthy walk down the street. I have owned my condo for three years. On two separate occasions, I was approached by condo commandos telling me that I was using the wrong dumpster. One was from the other HOA, and a couple of years later, a representative from my HOA approached me. I never got any formal reprimand in writing, but I was told that I really needed to use the dumpster that my HOA was paying for. I told my HOA rep that the whole issue was petty since everyone used the same trash company anyway, and that I was not going to walk all the way down the street to dump my trash when a dumpster near me was much closer. IT'S JUST TRASH and it GOES TO THE SAME PLACE! He wasn't too happy, so now I just take my trash to the dumpster at night, when no one can see me. Don't you just love condo commandos?
It stinks the man can't get the 300k back but I would think he could put a lien against the HOA for the 15k.Nobody in the HOA would be allowed to sell until he got his money.
Once on a HOA board, our management company replied verbally to a homeowner with a complaint who threatened legal action: "Our pockets are deeper than yours!"
I might be in the minority, but I've lived in 2 HOA run neighborhoods, and had pretty good experiences. The most I've ever been asked to do is paint a mailbox, and I know other neighbors who had horrible looking yards were required to fix them. There definitely are power hungry people who try to influence the HOA though. Recently a lady reported a neighbor who was having food trucks in her driveway during the pandemic when restaurants were closed. At least that person didn't have any power, and the food trucks are still bringing delicious food.
The HOA where I currently live in Virginia, a former board member decided to raise everyone's rates, but then secretly pocketed the funds from those rate increases over a period of several years, until the missing funds were noticed by an outside auditor. The HOA filed a criminal complaint on behalf of the members, but as far as that missing money, we as members aren't going to be reimbursed. Instead, whatever money that is recovered, will simply be given to the HOA for them to spend on whatever they wish. Still, better than the Condo Owners Association that my sister has (she has both an HOA and COA), which drags its feet on everything. The HOA is open about what it spends the funds from members on, while the COA says that such matters are private and not available to the members. But yeah, there was a spigot outside her condo that burst, and flooded her condo. COA was responsible as it was an outside spigot of theirs, and they took almost 7 months to get a contractor to come in and repair her condo because they kept arguing about what damages they would pay for, and then when my sister said that the old insulation for the outside wall in the spare room had not been replaced (so the room gets hot in the summer and cold in the winter), the COA said "If you want new insulation, you buy and install it yourself." That was back in 2014. Last September however, the a/c unit for her upstairs neighbor, had an electrical fire at the fuse, to which the fire department had to break into my sister's condo in order to ensure that the fire hadn't entered her condo, and damaged the door frame in the process. One COA member told her that the association would cover the damages, while another board member than told her that they would not be paying for the damages. Only to then have a 3rd member of the board tell her that they would pay for the damages. So a few weeks later, the door frame was replaced at cost to the association. However, all they have done to where the fire had burned the siding and such, is put a tarp over the wall. That was last September, with nothing having been done since then.
@@floydlooney6837 Usually insurance isn't brought in unless it's 100% catastrophic. They will attempt to use their own funding pool. Using the insurance company raises rates and if they get so many claims, the insurance company can drop them as a client when the term of the policy comes due. Plus they figure they can play 'drag ass' and draw the claim out to the point they hope the home owner simply gives up and pays for it themselves.
I remember discussing with someone once how I never want to be in an HOA, he asked me how else I would stop the neighbors from starting a pig farm next door? Well, I don't think the pigs and chickens in my own backyard would mind!
Where I live in NJ you can have chickens but no roosters (noise levels). A man in my neighboorhood had 3 chickens. They stayed in his backyard, and I couldn't smell them while my window was open. More power too him. Id love to pet a 🐖
I'm currently a resident of a HOA governed community in the Panhandle of Florida, and have been for 8 years. Slowly the regulations and HOA fees have increased year by year, and now they are approaching the point to which I consider the fees and rules unreasonable. Example: We are force to use only one type of grass for our lawns. The grass that someone has chosen does not grow well in the shade. About 10% of my lawn is shaded by tall pine trees and in the shaded areas the grass will not grow very well. We've had multiple lawn professionals attempt to improve the lawn, I've tried my best, no success. We started getting letters from the HOA threatening $100/day fines if we do not fix the barren spots of our lawn. 90 % of the lawn is emaculant and it's obvious the shade is hindering the growth. There are no limbs that can be trimmed (longleaf pines) and guess what, it's a violation to cutt down trees. With any and evey violation (lawn or other) is met with a warning letter giving 30days to resolve. If unresolved, you receive a $100/day threatening letter I started investigation the structure of the HOA and to my surprise I have discovered that we, as residents dont even have an HOA board or any representation for that matter. We are managed by a company made up of 3 people all of which do not live in the community. The management chooses what company gets lawns service contract of the general areas, which happens to be manager 1 brothers company. The pool cleaning contract was awarded to manager 3's husband's company and so on. Do we have any right to representation, whether it be a board of voting residents or other? Thanks
You ought to visit some of the non-HOA communities in Las Vegas. I was looking to purchase investment properties. One community was the home to a contractor who parked 10 F-250 work trucks on every available parking space in the small neighborhood. For every bad HOA, there are those that are pleasant to live in.
Fair enough argument. But you have no idea how bad an HOA is until you've invested hundreds of thousands of dollars into the property. God forbid if the HOA puts a lien on your house, you can't even sell it without the lien holder's approval. What happens if they say, "No," and keep screwing you. Your alternative to get out is walk away and ruin your credit for 7 years. And maybe end up living in a really subpar apartment and/or neighborhood all because a HOA ruined your credit and now your life. BTW: ruined credit can sometimes cost you a job. It depends on the job and company. There is that to think about.
We don't have an HOA, just a covenant and boy we were happy for that when one of our idiot neighbors who moved into new construction so they knew the covenant decided to park their huge pull behind camper in the main road right at the entrance from a 45mph road. People were almost hit walking around it. If a car was leaving no one could enter causing a back up on the other road. They were pissed when someone dropped a copy of the covenant on their doorstep and wrote threatening letters to everyone pointing out all the infractions... infractions no one cares about because it puts no one in danger and does not cause property value to decrease. They started parking it on the edge of a drainage ditch and everytime it rains I secretly wish it would topple over into the ditch. ETA: the road into is a 1 lane for each direction with no turning lane. The subdivision is slight bigger than 2 cars.
@@Uberragen21 Complaining about a lien from the HOA is a bit like complaining about how high your bail is. Maybe you're innocent and are getting screwed, but there's a good chance you violated a rule you should have known about. The difference is that the HOA will let you fix the problem.
I'm in an HOA, but the dues are less than $250 per year and they are pretty hands off. I probably got lucky there You do have to get prior approval for big changes like fences or sheds, but they don't give flip if you cut down a dead tree, put stone around the flower beds or other minor changes.
I don't know about NV, but some (many?) States award the winner the legal fees on top of the original amount sought. That's how it is in my State. That sould put that $320k burden onto the HOA on top of the $15k original amount.
Legal fees and cost s are not the default in America. they're generally has to be something above and beyond or a specific enabling statute to get fee shifting.
Hi We have a similar system in Australia called "strata title" - similar concept, common house a levy for repairs and all exterior works / repairs is paid by the strata. Actually i just read this , it is a very long story there are rules and regulation, luckily when these are sold, a copy of the by-laws MUST be lodged with the selling agent as the title is Strata ( as opposed to freehold or torrens ), all solicitors or conveyance agents are required to notify and have sign off or reading the by-laws Anyway, i was in a complex for 4 years and was a treasure for say 3.5 years, we have a widow or single mother who was a nice lady and everyone felt sorry for her and helped her out with domestic chores, and assist in child keeping, she did not pay the monthly fees - bu tit was agreed that it would be settled if she ever sold. A totally different example was another person who decided he was not paying because some mate in a pub told him not to as "he owned it ", anyway a few letters and notices, solicitors letter and follow up then a fine for overdue. then for next 3 or 4 months it was just a extra fine for overdue He did not care, however 2 years later ( while i was still there ) he placed the building up for sale, so there is a form that solicitors lodge to the president and treasurer - see link So as treasurer it was given to me and i filled out the form on current levy amounts and also filled out the whatever it was 8 or 18 months unpaid levy and fees, took it to work and faxed it to the solicitors. 2 days later this guy is basically aggressive and pounding on my door demanding to know why i cost him the sale of his unit - i had no idea what he was on about, i told him to calm down go home as my wife had picked up the home as she was hysterical and was going to call the police, i explained to him calm down, dont make a bad situation worse and i am not here to ruin his life, but if he carries on , irregardless of what happened he will end up with police Somehow the little cogs were turning in his head and the light bulb came on, he stopped, said sorry and walked to his unit. He came a hour later and apologized and said he had a phone call from agent and solicitor and one of them dropped of a letter that stated the negative strata report. I then realized what happened, "i told him it is not me" - that i wanted no part in this but had been served documents by his solicitor, they wanted it done ASAP and i had to answer his solicitors questions truthfully - i said if i lie then i can go to jail He was happy with it. ** i was nervous he would erupt again ** so after about 15 seconds of silence, i said, look this is easy i can give you some friendly advise, if you dont have the month to pay what you avoided in the past plus all the letters and solicitors letters you ignored it is really easy, ell your solicitor and agent that all they have to do is when the sale goes through they pay the unpaid installments and i will just delete all of the fines - its easy, you wont be out of pocket now and basically ended up with a interest free loan, and you can still sell the unit. He was happy with that, called me his new best friend and left Next day he gave my wife flowers and apologized ( she never forgave him anyways she was really scared ) So a few weeks later he is gone and a courier from the buyers solicitor delivers a bank cheque for the fees and a pre written copy of the form that i previously sent that they altered to show no outstanding and they were asking me to sign and date and hand back to the courier - as i had the cheque in my hand i signed it and handed it back. I took the cheque to work, photocopied it for my records and banked the cheque into the strata account, i gave the copy to the president that night, then 20 mins later the president , vice president and 2 members are banging on my door demanding to know what i done, why and they want all of the fees. I very clearly and not so politely told them that all of them were behind locked door and hiding behind their curtains and not one of those 6 people came to assist myself when this unit owner was basing on my door and screaming his head off for 15 minutes ( about 7pm at night everyone was home ) They told me i had no right to accept less and waive fees or penalties, then i took the bylaws book and wherever it was page 2 or 3 , showed them any committee member or person in a official role can charge fees / alter fees / or dismiss fees - levy changes have to be voted and passed by majority So i said, its late leave it to tomorrow, they all said OK and stormed off - not happy. So i rang the strata solicitor, told him who i was and from where - he remembered me as he need to have annual meetings and he has to attend and take minutes and sign them off, i explained everything and he agreed to represent me. Next night 4 of the 6 committee are waiting for me to come home, the are furious as they called there strata solicitor and he said he cannot take the case as he represents me now and none of the other partners or anyone in the company can take them as it can be a conflict of interest. They asked me why i called him and i replied " he is the only solicitor i know why not " So he sent each of them a letter saying he reviewed the information that i gave him on the chain of events, his opinion is i acted within my role, i was able tor achieve all back dated dues ( which is actually a rare thing to happen ) and according to the by-laws as treasurer i had the authority to waive the fees. He also mentioned if they proceed with anything, then he will add the fact none of the other elected officers and committee members who were home at the time and did not come and assist myself as "they failed in there duty of care " and done nothing to assist and help diffuse a hostile situation About 4 months later i placed my unit for sale and resigned from the position the day before i moved out ( as treasurer i was able to sign my own statutory report on dues and levy as no problem ) ( i think this is the form www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwjawJC8wLnvAhWHzjgGHWhVD5IQFjACegQICBAD&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.fairtrading.nsw.gov.au%2F__data%2Fassets%2Fpdf_file%2F0005%2F367880%2FSection_184_certificate.pdf&usg=AOvVaw2xrmWnM7HxTVQJOI9SPngu )
Interesting aside from the article posted by Mr. Dixon, an earlier poster. The HOA tried to appeal based on the fact that the fine print from when he purchases the house that is did disclose the status as a non-HOA property. The HOA wanted the Statute of Limitations to extend from 2003, versus the 2012 date when they informed the owners from UNIT 1 (the first portion of the development, evidently) they weren't covered by the HOA, and that they needed to "voluntarily" agree to their incorporation into the HOA. When we closed on a house right around the same time, we had just over 60 pages, single spaced, of a contract to sign. We spent over 3 hours reading through it, and I caught two, and my wife caught one, errors that just "coincidentally" had just shy of $3,000 in extra money we would have paid. Everything was corrected and initialed. I asked the mortgage broker how often people read through the entire contract, and he said maybe three times a month. ALWAYS read the contract. Please. When we made the offer on the house, because they wanted the commission, we got them to make a pen and ink change to "mutually agreeable" for the selection of an arbitrator if it came to that. Never had to exercise it, but Steve can explain some time why that's significant. BTW Car Dealers get REALLY PISSED if you walk away because of extra "fees" they didn't disclose. :)
I lived in a community with an HOA, it sucked. The first people to buy in to the neighborhood all worked at the same place (a national level investment company). The HOA started out as a builder HOA, but the transferred it to an actual owners association after all the lots were sold. The people who worked at the investment company controlled the board, and nobody else was even allowed to run for a position unless you worked there, which was a rule added after the builder left (by the people in the investment company). My wife and were glad to leave and move out to the "country" where our problems are real weasels and rats, not the human kind.
I was in an HOA once. They sent me a letter saying it was against the rules to have a doormat at my front door. Also I was sent a letter because I had a bucket in front of my car. You talk about some weird people.
I've been renting in a HOA for about 10 years now. They don't like renters and try all kinds of things to pee you off. When I first moved in, I was unaware it was a HOA... until I got a complaint about weeds in yard (was next door neighbors yard). I moved 2 blocks over an they kept getting on me about my vehicles parked on the street, in front of my house. In the middle of the night they towed my truck. Bad choice, I told them to keep it and sued them. Then the fire department and ambulance company told them they had to remove ALL of the illegal speed bumps they had installed. AND, even better, they found out that because they didn't replace missing and damaged gates; didn't place security at the entrances; the streets came back under the control of North Las Vegas. Amazing how fast the gates went back up. Yes, the same city of the old mans lawsuit. BTW: I have to laugh every time our local HOA drunk rams the gate or the kids do burn outs in the intersections. They ask for it and in return.. get it.
It will only take about 120 years to recoup his legal expenses. His neighbors on his side of the line need to sue the HOA as well, and then throw this guy a parade or something.
It was more than just the dues. It was the right to do with your property what you want without permission. All his neighbors in the first development also don’t have to pay now either. Not all hero’s wear capes. Developer #1 (where he moved into) built the homes and left. Developer #2 builds homes around the first development. It was not the same developer, company anything. Puts up a fence and then tells everyone that they are now part of an HOA. From what I can understand the man moved in during construction of development from the 2nd company. When he got the letter he was upset that his title company did not tell him it was an HOA community. I guess when told that they didn’t know either that’s when he looked into the zone lines. That’s when he found out that the 2nd developer basically abducted the first zone that he had nothing to do with and just thought he could since he built around them and put up a fence. The only good thing about an HOA is that they can keep your property taxes low. The HOA takes over maintaining and repair of the streets and sidewalks but, if developer #2 did not have that agreement with the city then what he did was also hijack city property. The man in zone 1 got stuck with HOA fees and Higher taxes.
They didn't hijack city property, they hijacked the HOA's property. They are the ones that maintain the gatehouse and private roads that this guy is using and refusing to pay for.
In Florida they call them "Deed Restricted" my sister found out the hard way. Been in the house 3 years and been threw hell. She just sold and will be leaving in 15 days.
Had a similarly crazy situation here at the HOA where my home is located. The situation was that there was a property that was previously individually subdivided by the original developer. His deed restrictions don't require him to be a member of the HOA, and the area around his home was not subject to development (and thus a subdivision plan) for almost 20 years following his lot being separately divided. It took a trip to the recorder of deeds and copies of maps and subdivision plans to convince the Board of Directors that he is outside the HOA. It's a shame that the guy in the case had to spend $300k to prove he wasn't in the HOA, because the guy in my story only spent $5 for some photocopies.
My son is just selling his house and the homeowners association wanted him to submit a new lot survey showing a small 15 block retaining wall he put around a tree in the front yard 7 years ago or they would block the house sale. The lot survey would cost about $500 and would not guarantee the wall would be approved. He had the relator remove the blocks and put them in the garage, since the buyers offer had no conditions.
I drove down a main road in Riverside, RI and happened upon a field on the side of the road, There in the field were 22 plastic flamingos wearing little football helmets lined up 11 per side with a football between them. It cracked me up. One of the funniest things I have ever seen, My sister ( who lived there) said who ever does that changes the play weekly. She also said the game changes with the season too. I can attest as on another trip I witnessed flamingos playing soccer and again later baseball. Including little baseball hats , a bat and ball. Never forget the good things in life www.flickr.com/photos/marirn/3933173212 www.flickr.com/photos/marirn/3885751770/
I had a client a few years ago who lived in a HOA community with a monthly fee over $500 (these were not million dollar homes either). After seeing some of the other shenanigans that other HOA's pulled in California I will never purchase a home in one.
I hope his fellow Unit One members and him all SUE the HOA for fraud to reclaim the moneys paid. In the mean time those in unit one should all stop paying and help him with his leagle funds
My favorite things about watching these videos are hearing about interesting stories, how the law applies to them, and most of all hearing Steve laugh when talking about them.
I rented a condo in California a long time ago and the HOA sent out a letter to clear the back patio (deck) so they could do some repairs on day "X." Well day "X" came and went with no repairs done, so we gave it another week before we put our patio furniture back out on the deck. Two weeks after that, I get a knock on the door at 7 AM on a Saturday by some random woman sternly telling me to get the stuff off my deck like I was told to do so by the letter. I told her that the date was 3 weeks ago and that if she wanted the stuff to be moved, that she can do it herself, but if anything is broken, I would sue her....Later that day, a nice worker came to my door and asked if they could move the stuff off my deck so they could do repairs....lol They were very gentle with my stuff.
It's a shame how many principles in this country don't get their day in court because it is so much more expensive to get justice than to continue allowing someone to steal from you/wrong you/whatever.
Can we sue the "justice" system for false advertising?
@@donovanhill7367 That sounds good, but if he lost he might have been "the hook" for $600,000! (His fees and theirs)
I'm pretty sure I could figure out how to cost them every penny of that $300k; some legal and some they just cannot prove. Once they slander me once or twice, I think punitive damages might just get my money back.
The bigger question is WHY did it coast $300,000+? I understand lawyers have to eat, but that amount does seem pretty steep.
If the lawyer is being paid $200,000 /yr, that is the equivalence of a full 1 1/2 years spent on just this case.
Your ability to pay will determine access to your rights and to justice.
I paid my attorney $550.00 to represent me on a $150.00 fee I was contesting from my HOA. My attorney told me, "I admire the fact you are a man of principle but most people would just pay the fee". On court day, the HOA representative and/or attorney was a no show and I prevailed by default. I guess justice is for sale after all.
You’re my true admirer and had guts for what you did to uphold your principle 👍
If an HOA has enough money for appealing a lawsuit, the dues might be too high.
HOA members should use this as a reason to remove the HOA board members, or better, dissolve the HOA entirely.
I had one Realtor (tm) try to convince me that a HOA property only insures added value. I asked how, unless this HOA requires constant upgrades to the houses. They also tried to defend a $450 / month HOA dues on a sub $500k house for a HOA that only provided a "lake" that looked maintained by a gopher.
I left this realtor for a real one that wasn't a developer's lapdog.
Jason W that’s funny. In California with some of the highest housing costs, the only places that are (relatively) affordable are houses in HOAs. Nobody wants them!
More likely they raised a special assessment specifically to cover the cost of litigation.
@@danielschein6845 fiduciary duty comes to mind. If they had like costs, it would be really hard to justify spending that much to recover $200 / mo payments from one or even several properties.
@@JasonW. The realtor was right. actual sales prove that homes controlled by an HOA command a higher price than comparable homes without one. HOAs obviously have a huge downside for those of us who don't want to live by somebody else's rules, but they also have the advantage of preventing people from doing a lot of things that can reduce your property's value (I'm way out on a limb here, but maybe that's related to the increased value).
FWIW, there's a road a bit north of me that has had an unusual mix of properties for as long as I've been aware of it. Some are relatively new and expensive houses, many of which were likely owned by IBM employees before IBM downsized in the 90's. Others were crappy little houses on property that had been in the family for years, allowing people to own property they could never have paid for. Besides many of those houses being worth far less than neighboring houses, a few of them were owned by the sport of people who still have every car and appliance they ever acquired. Plenty of them saw a lawn mower just a few times through the summer, and got (poorly) painted every 15 or 20 years. People who don't want to have that sort of thing in their neighborhood are why HOAs exist. People who want to decide how the world should work and people who don't want to be active in their HOA are why so many HOAs become the organizations that so many people hate.
Since the Supreme Court ruled in his favor, & the HOA refuses to pay, he should follow their suit & place a lien on all of their property.
If they don't pay, I wonder if there are any assets he can have a helpful sheriff's deputy help him seize? (My guess is not much.)
The board will likely resign/get kicked out, leaving their mess for others to handle. Maybe they'll declare bankruptcy. I wonder if there's any liability on the part of the HOA's members? In theory, they ultimately control the board and could have stopped this?? If a clear majority of the HOA's members get angry with the board, how quickly could they force the offending members out or force some sort of change?
For $300k you could place some Lions on their properties - maybe more effective !
What if those lions injure or kill somebody? Who would be responsible for that?
@@carbon60unit The HOA members all own their own homes & vehicles, which I am guessing combined, is worth a lot more that 300K.
The real question is, if he wins a judgement against them, could he own and foreclose on all the "common areas" of the HOA?
"No one would bet $300,000.00 on principal" And that is exactly what all HOAs are counting on!!
True, but the HOA must have spent a similar amount. If I was a resident there I would sack the whole HOA board for malfeasance. Spending that kind of money for $200 a month by either side is crazy, but at least the guy who won did it because he was a principled person. The HOA board can't even claim that.
@@cruelabduhl That's not how it works. People get really defensive about any group/community they are a part of. And they would undoubtedly get one way communication on the matter. I expect Jonathan Friedrich to be the subject of a lot of harassment in the future,
@@LordZordid And, there is the likelihood that the HOA will have to pay attorney's fees for everything after the initial trial.
@@aCycloneSteve What HOA board do you serve on again?
This is why we NEED loser pays.
He also won the right not to have to follow any of the HOA rules. This might have been worth it.
He actually made all the property in his development zone 1 WORTH that much more, As this means all the people in that zone now dont have to pay the HOA and can demand return of the fees they had collected from them. Plus he can sue the title company that did not do their job.
*and the fact that if he doesn't have to follow the asinine rules of the HOA no one else does either meaning he basically broke the spine of the HOA leadership*
Brad DL I smell a class action lawsuit brewing .
He didn’t win the right, he fought for what he already had. He was never a part of the HOA.
JediOfTheRepublic : Precisely
My situation is very close to his.....my property is the only one in my development that doesn't say anything about an HOA or any restrictive covenants at the time of closing.....6 years later they filed an amended instrument that included my property.....to make matters worse the developer didn't follow state law as set forth under the planned communities act of North Carolina and had to incorporate as a nonprofit organization.....meaning that anyone who doesn't want to be a member doesn't have to join because you can't become an automatic member of a nonprofit organization.....talk about screwed up.....thankfully I only had to spend 300 dollars for a cease and desist letter
If anyone is curious, the court is now making the HOA pay out 188k in court fees to our hero in this story. JUSTIICCCEEE
Good!
He's also won bragging rights for when he walks past these thug rulers on the sidewalk. Maybe it's worth even more than $300,000.
There`s a video of this on TH-cam with the banners and pink flamingoes ...his house looks fantastic and must have cost him a lot and its kinda fricking huge,ive a feeling that though to me $300,000 is a hell of a lot of money to him its not...
About 20 years ago my brother lived in a condo that had a HOA. The people on the board were the power hungry type and did something stupid and petty to him. Being a charismatic guy who all of the neighbors loved, he ran for the board along with a couple of the neighbors who were friends of his and they all won including voting him the president. Although they didn't have every seat, he had enough seats that were favorable to his cause, so he made a motion to dissolve the HOA and they approved it. lolz.
Was this really a condo? Meaning there are shared walls between neighbors and common spaces owned/maintained by the association? You can't dissolve it if that's the case because then who would own and maintain those things? Also I'm pretty sure that dissolving it would require a unanimous vote by everyone, not just the board.
@@phillipsusi1791 On the other hand, if he and his backers occupy half the board and set the dues to zero long enough it's coming down anyway.
@@joshuahudson2170 If it really is a condo, that is shared walls, shared facilities, certain shared utilities, etc. Then the trash compounds will be overflowing after a week. The outside lighting will be dark shortly after the association stops paying the electricity bill. The landscaping will be dead about a month into summer once the HOA stops paying the water bill. The city will shut down and lock the pool gates shortly after the pool guy stops turning up. The value of your unit will tank when everyone in the next building moves out because the roof leaks, and you are eyeing your building every time it rains.
But that also works in reverse. We have a 1 lot 1 vote neighborhood. The developer has all of his undeveloped lots as voting lots. He just put all of his friends on the board and now he dictates every rule. Glad for your brother, but sucks for me.
@@slightlyevolved Condo HoA boards typically do hire management companies that manage shared services and handle the billing, and in theory have no "say on things." I say 'in theory' because the management company personnel are usually more knowledgeable than board members so their advice generally is followed.
Also, I think, but I don't know for sure, that there is no getting round the requirement for a homeowners association because 'common interest developments' are complex and are heavily regulated. If you tried to disband you'd be breaking the law.
However, let's say you were able to do it. How would you pick your management company? By a vote of all the members? Who will approach the various management companies to get bids and proposals? A couple of volunteers, yes? Would you perhaps have to vote on who these volunteers should be? A bit like HoA board members, eh.
So then the management company that the volunteers have chosen and you've all voted on asks you what are the rules and regulations that the management company should use to manage the property. Who will sign the checks on behalf of the owners? The company will ask what the dues should be. They can probably come up with a reasonable budget estimate for ongoing operating expenses, but then they'll ask what you'd like for your reserve allocation to pay for future replacement or repair of capital items. When you shrug your shoulders they will probably suggest that you should follow the requirements laid out in the various statutes that govern the administration of common interest developments, i.e. HoAs.
I suppose the point of all this is simply - it ain't as easy as it sounds.
Really, the only way to make a HoA work is to vote in board members you trust, and hold them accountable.
I’m thinking it will weigh less on his mind that he is out $300k than the fact that he would be governed by an HOA, and having peace of mind is priceless.
So true
300k is a lot of money. I would rather buy a rental that makes more than 200. However, this could be an entertainment expense. You can invest 50 bucks or go out to dinner for 2
HOA are insane, my friend received a letter from his HOA telling him his son could not live with him. He was polite and informed them his son has lived there since the age of nine when he built the house and his son's name is on the title. So piss off !
On what authority would the HOA even have saying that a family member isn't allowed to live on the property? Even if the son's name wasn't on the title or the deed, the HOA wouldn't have any authority to enforce that.
Whatt thats crazy. Unbelievable
There is a whole reddit threads on HOAs.
Some TH-cam channels read them out .
Dang, that's nuts. It just shows that given any opportunity, there are plenty of people who will do bad things just to attempt to exercise control over others.
@@ericwilson956
IF the HOA is marketed as an "OVER 55" community they can force him to move.
At least in ARIZONA that is the law thanks to "DELL WEBB CORPORATION"!
😡😡😡😡😡😡😡😡😡😡
Doesn't this all add up to, you get justice if you can afford it. Otherwise you you get screwed
Hey, we got the best rights money can buy! Just ask any lawyer about his hourly rate! Right, Steve?
I wonder if the guy borrowed the $320,000? Would a lender even lend someone money for legal fees?
It's not clear if he got justice or not when he had to spend more than he gained.
That's why dealing with it on your own is more satisfying and cheaper.
@@3sierra15 Not everything to everyone is money.
HOAs are literally my only No Go with regard to buying a house. I will not deal with an organization that's effectively a government, but one that doesn't have to play by a set of rules.
Once I bought a building lot in a small sub-division with an HOA. Since the private owner of that sub-division had to pay HOA fees for all unsold lots, he got a court permission to dissolve the HOA. I didn't pay a dime. Since then, I avoided HOA properties like a plaque.
Even if an HOA is awesome, it's subject to change at any time, and whatever you liked about it can reverse in an instant.
Actually, they do have to play by several sets of rules including local laws and regulations plus the CC&R's. If you are too stupid and lazy to read the CC&R's prior to purchase, if you are too dumb to request the financials, board minutes, reserve study, and talk to other owners prior, your too stupid anyway. It's called due diligence and a smart person would do this in a non-HOA as well...make sure your neighbors are not nitwits (like you), make sure the city code compliance is not a fascist, etc. BTW, unlike an HOA who can only foreclose for non-payment of dues, a city can take your house for non-payment of their fines / violations. Also, whereas an HOA will fine you $50 or $100, the cities typically start at $500 - $1,000 and give you 10 days to cure.
I specifically told my real estate agent that I would not even consider a property with an HOA.
Quasi-HOA (more of a deed-restriction enforcement org) in my neighborhood sued itself out of existence. (Side note...Deed restrictions aren't too bad; mainly to ensure setbacks are enforced and only single family or duplexes are part of the neighborhood. No nonsense about paint colors/gardening/stuff in the backyard, etc. I actually liked the setup.) Tried to cite someone for building a 2nd garage, but owner contested it due to selective enforcement. Local court agreed it was a violation, but the selective enforcement of the deed restrictions made it unenforceable. HOA appealed to state supreme court. State supreme court concurred with the courts ruling, and also said the HOA formation was not legal. 2nd court case in 5 years lost in state supreme court after initial loss and stupidly appealed. At the end of it all, lawyers/board pushed the HOA into Chapter 7 bankruptcy! Only people who won were the lawyers and the people that didn't want a deed-restriction enforcement.
Can he place a lien on the HOA President's house to pay his legal fee's? That would be true sweet justice.
Should be the entire sitting board at the time of the lawsuit
Not the personal property of the HOA president or the board. What would happen is that the HOA could be required (by a court order) to pay. Then, the HOA member will be on the hook most likely via a special assessment.
Some states require HOA’s to carry insurance for its board members in case of situations like this.
There's a form he can file a form with court about loser pays.
The HOA is nothing more than a cult
Why the hell would anyone want to pay others to just make up rules that they have to abide by?
People need to stop buying houses in HOAs and they'll go away.
If you live outside city limits, you might not be able to rely on the county to enforce things like noise ordinances and other quality of life issues. What if your neighbor decides to start a cabinet making business in his garage and run power tools until the legal cut-off of 10pm 5 nights a week, and he sprays varnish in his front driveway making an awful stink. The county won't do anything so without an HOA you have to move or live with it, or maybe spend a bunch of money to see if you can sue him for violating zoning laws. There are many things a neighbor could do that would reduce the value of your land.
contentioushackery oh you mean the neighbor that bought and paid for his property doing things he wants with it. You’re right, that’s terrible. Some people believe in live and let live, even if it’s not always perfect. Those people love it in the county where no one has their thumb on them. Others want the illusion of perfection and need to be told what to do. HOA’s and city zoning is for them. There is always something for everyone.
There's good and bad things about HOA's. But perhaps any HOA community should have their rules and regulations easy to access for new perspective owners to look through. Also realtors should really give that information upfront to clients looking into buying the property instead of trying to make a buck. Should allow home owners the ability to sue those realtors if they don't fully disclose the rules and regulations.
The core reason for having an HOA is that your property's value depends on the appearance of your neighbors' properties. An HOA is an agreement wherein everyone agrees to maintain their properties to a certain standard, or else. Some careless people don't like the "or else, some money-hungry people love it, and some power-hungry people can't resist it. The latter join the HOA board.
@@contentioushackery Why live outside the city if you want to enforce rules? Live in a nice golf community.
Justice from oppression such as home owners associations shouldn’t costs $320,000. That just means there is only justice for the rich at that point.
HOA is all about power & control, and fees.
Fees, then used of said fees to exert control over the members.
I’d say it’s all about fees , power and control are addendums
It depends on the HOA.
I like rules that protect me from the neighbors.
Just like government it attracts all the busy bodies who did nothing but get B's in school.
The fact that people think HOA's INCREASE value is mind boggling.
so... An hoa absolutely stabilizes property values. Raising them is another thought. Very likely raises them upon initial construction.
@@jordancobb509 Youve missed a big part! Rental properties. Imagine a world where you own multiple homes in an HOA, I dont have to monitor them. The HOA babysits them for me. HOA absolutely stabilizes property values. HOA also substantiate eviction processes through violation documents. Eliminates a ton of hassel.
nick T No, if you own multiple properties with tenants renting them, and you’re too lazy to manage them yourself, then hire a property management firm or start your own management company.
@@preachers4135 It isnt only my properties that the hoa babysits. they babysit all of the properties around mine as well as mine. Thus stabilizing the value of the entire neighborhood, not simply my properties. Also this particular hoa provides a water park, 3 pools..a restaurant.. dog park...a game area, multiple tennis courts basketball courts... These things are all hoa maintained for my tenants which helps ensure the homes are rented by families with kids.. All of these things stabilize the values of all of the properties. Conversely all of the prices rise and fall together.
They don't
Now his neighbors in that section of the development should follow suit and sue for return of any fees they have paid ti this HOA? Wouldn't they all be exempt from the HOA as well?
That depends on how stupid they were when they bought their houses, and whether they agreed voluntarily to be in it. I'm familiar with that neighborhood (I'm from Vegas originally) and that's about a 40-50 year old million dollar home neighborhood, so there are a lot of wealthy but not very real-estate savvy people living there.
He was the only exception, he was between the two development
The second development was built approximately 10 years after the first his land wasn’t included in either Hué development
I just got an HOA letter today. The violation was for having a trash can at the curb on trash day. The funny part is it was next to my neighbors driveway and about 20ft from my driveway. It was obviously my neighbors trash can and yet they wrote me a violation. HOAs should be illegal.
So you are not allowed to put your trash out?
It should be illegal to make excessive rules. Just limit HOA to basic rules like no loud noise, no rainbow colored houses of houses painted with a middle finger, and no parking your car in front of other people’s houses. And no mosquito 🦟 swamps.
We agree with you Steve, never live in a neighborhood with an HOA!!!!, and do your research before you BUY!!!
*add a clause in any agreement that IF a HOA is formed at any time after you house or property is purchased you have the right to tell them to get stuffed if they tell you you are obligated to join*
What happens is the HOA is sold to a private company who runs the community like a collection agency and a payday loan sham.
@Picolas Cage yes
Usually the declaration give each owner a vote. Homeowners association and Condominium association have different rules and power with the later been able to control your dreams. Most of the time they can be dissolved with 75% to 100% of members vote required. Older Hoa required less votes vs new Hoa. Also some states, I am in Florida, world capital of HOAs and COAs they had to create laws to protect owner since some investors would buy a majority of the units to be able to dissolve the Hoa and buy the other units and a fraction of the cost. Now this tactic is mostly illegal.
He should plant a victory garden in his front yard. Maybe get a few chickens named after the HOA board members.
I'd be buying sign licensing and placeing billboards on my lawn haha everyone will know my victory.
Same thing happened to my dad. He bought a house in a development that was built in two stages. The first 20 homes were HOA free, the next 100 were in the HOA. They tried to tell my Dad he was in the HOA. He asked them to show him any paperwork he signed stating he was a part of the HOA. They couldn’t produce anything. This upset the actual HOA members. Since they couldn’t force my Dad or the other 19 homeowners in the development to pay HOA fees or abide by HOA rules, they voted to disband the HOA all together.
Now that he's established the precedent, watch what happens with the rest of the homeowners in Unit 1. :)
My ex-landlord owned quite a bit of farmland he sold to builder, it was adjacent to the property he kept for himself and he had already built a home.
A few years after the neighborhood was built around his home, the HOA tried to start make him pay dues and tried to gig him for non-conformance.
Fortunately it never had to make it to court, he disagreed and the HOA stopped pursuing after a consult with the HOA attorneys. Apparently HOAs cannot annex peoples homes involuntarily in Indiana.
They should not be able to annex involuntarily anywhere.
What is disgusting is how much it costs to do anything
in the legal system. The USA has laws, but from what I have
seen, the US legal system is only for the rich when one
hopes to pursue a legal case even if you have been wronged and
are 110% in the right. Groups like HOA's know that the
average person can not afford to hire a lawyer and they
prey on that fact.
There are plans to automate the legal system. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DoNotPay www.donotpay.com
Being able to put pink flamingos in your yard, in the middle of a guarded & gated HOA community with no consequences is Priceless!!!
I'd park a rusty, I mean well patina'd street legal rat-rod in the driveway too 🤣
He should also get time and legal fees for the $300,000.oo he has spent as well as the $15,000.oo judgement.
That's the lawsuit after the lawsuit.
Should it come from the hoa or the board nembers themselves?
In America, we have a "legal" system, not a "justice" system. That's why he's not getting hie $300K back without ANOTHER fight.
@@erica1957 Are you implying there are other countries with strictly "justice" systems? Otherwise I'm not sure what the hell "In America" has to do with it.
We need to automate the legal system to get the costs down so that everyone can access the law.
My brother in law lived in a HOA. They allowed a certain sized shed in the backyard, but it has to match house colors. His friend down the street wanted to paint his red like a barn. So next election cycle, his friend was the HOA President, and changed the restriction.
Ow God I live in a little naiborhood with no hoa....a few years ago a new development was built next to us...our privet road was re routed to the hoa road....a very nice paved two lane compared to out old dirt road... Same easement to the state road..... They have been telling us for years that we are part of the h
HOA bacauae our easement runs thure their development.... Nope. I have the right to drive thure their roads to reach the state road ... We injore their letters. The sheriff where call so many time for trespassing completea they they told the hoa president that they would arrest him if they where called again.... They have even tryed chaining the road. We cut it with the sheriff blessing .... The cause. We are about 20 property with small houses or trailers whial they are 500,000$ home.....offer me enough money and I will be happy to sell my land to the hoa
Robert Z if I were in your situation I would install a device called a header dump on my truck that with a flick of a switch bypasses the exhaust system while traveling through that neighborhood.
Would the closing attorney and title insurance company be liable for any of this?
@@sirstephen9825 90 % of the residents are okay. If a few members of the board that can't stand us driving thure their naiborhood..... They think since we use their road then we should pay the up keep too......they know this when they built the development..... But I can't complain. I get payed to store two rv on my property
If you can document this, you should sue them for harassment. I would start at $750k. If you can unify your neighborhood, you can enter into a class action.
@@sirstephen9825 No; there was nothing wrong with his title. The wrong was with the HOA telling him he owed money when the easement is right there in their ( the HOA's ) deed clear as day and says they have to provide access to the road.
Greetings Steve,
This story bring a tear to my eyes.
You probably are too busy to read my story but it's a good one and it would do me much good to get a reaction from you. My name is Joseph Emery. I will promise on my honor, not to create or exaggerate any claims here.
I am a 100% disabled veteran from the 82nd Airborne division. I moved into a nice house in an HOA in Oregon. The president of the HOA was also a popular police officer in the same city. I had come to Oregon to study Medical Marijuana. As such, I obtained an instructor and the proper legal paperwork and permits to grow my plants as it was insisted on by my instructed as that same officer was my neighbor. I believed this to be a good move as his location would discourage thief's and force me to follow the letter of the law.
Thing went well for about a year until there was an election. My neighbor was so popular that he had political parties at his house while I had 50 pot plants in my back yard. I was aware that he was anti pot but I just ignored that and kept up to date on the rules. Then something happened,....I was evicted for no reason other than that the homeowner needed to move back into their home. I was disappointed but accepted it and moved out. About a month later I was informed that my landlord did not move back into the house. My cop neighbors daughter did. I was furious and decided to try to get a lawyer on principal even if I had to pay. I spoke to every lawyer in town about it and got the same answer. Thew believed he broke the law however, thew would not take on the police department or the HOA from fear.
As a result I have been homeless ever since. Thanks for your time.
I'd rather live in a cardboard box under an overpass than live under an HOA. I have never heard one resident, who was not an insider on the board, who liked living under them.
@@suzanh7777 I've never had any problem with the HOA in either of my houses that were in them. The first one was very simple and just maintained the entrance to the neighborhood so the fees were only like $25/month. My current house has lots of community parks, pools, buildings and gyms so it's more expensive. I think you have selection bias where you are only hearing from people that complain; most people never have to think about their HOA. One of the houses I grew up in also had a community pool and another one was in a gated community and my parents never had a problem with them.
If so, why don't the members all attend the meeting at once and shut it down permanently?
What a great story. I live in a neighborhood with an HOA but am one of 8 out of 500 homes that were grandfathered and are not a part of the association. They call us the chartered members. Every stinking year I have to fight with the HOA because I have not payed the dues. 17 years and counting.
Presumably that fight would be much easier since the second time. Just show the same paperwork and decision by the HOA from the previous year.
*next time threaten them with a very expensive harassment law suit*
@@wallykramer7566 never said it was hard, just I have to go through it every year.
@@toddgardner8449 Rid yourself of the burden and you'll see just how much lighter you are on your feet.
@@havenbastion ??? What burden do I have? That comment makes no sense.
Somebody get this man a bud light cause he's a real american hero
Why would you give a hero dog piss?
Former HOA president here. This type of dispute is incredibly common, but it's one that - if the parties at either end were remotely rational - would've been resolved immediately upon discovery that the property wasn't under the HOA's jurisdiction.
1. The homeowner is at fault for not conducting adequate due diligence when buying the property.
2. The homeowner's real estate agent and closing attorney are at fault for not conducting adequate due diligence prior to closing.
3. The HOA is at fault for not understanding its plats, and knowing the boundaries of its jurisdiction.
With rational people involved, this gets settled simply with a settlement: the HOA kicks back all dues paid to the homeowner, perhaps plus reasonable interest, dating back to the day he purchased the property, in exchange for dropping the suit and indemnifying the HOA going forward. The fact that this went to the Nevada Supreme Court merely tells you that the people involved decided they'd rather trade "**** you's" than resolve their dispute reasonably. I wouldn't want to be this guy's next door neighbor nor part of this HOA; in fact if I were a member of it, I'd consider suing its board members for malfeasance, for letting this get this far out of hand.
I'm not upset about living in a HOA. I have no problems with HOA at all.
I intentionally bought a house NOT in a HOA.
@R Cruz?
None of the houses I have bought were in a HOA.
The only land I even considered buying with a HOA was a very simple one that had a shared well as the only paragraph in the agreement.
@R Cruz No, I said I am not upset about living in a HOA and have no problems with a HOA. This is because I do not live in a HOA.
Now that the HOA is broke, all the other members can quit the HOA.
I am thinking this could also open the door for many other lawsuits against HOA's and people being able to get out of them
Only way to quit is to sell the house.
Hardly... They will offset the cost to the rest of the homeowners of their community by increasing the dues. The only way to kick them out, is to turn the community against them.
@@HankScorpio64 I don't think it needs to be unanimous in most places, 2/3rds or 3/4ths I think
It's typically baked into the property records. Mutual covenants and easements.
We rented a house that was in a hoa neighborhood we lived there for about 5 months before moving. The hoa board were power Hungary nazi
Hungarian Nazis? 🤣
Hungry like driven by the need for sustanance/food or Hungary like the country?
@@adriandenson8855 Maybe they were Hungry Hungarian Nazis!
Surprised the home owner was allowed to rent out their house!
@@stephen3164 Depends on the HOA. I'm renting in an HOA. I'd wager half of the units in here are rentals. If half of the home owners are land lords, of course the HOA is going to allow rentals. Mind you, I wouldn't be surprised if 1/3-1/2 of the houses within 2 miles of the university campus are rentals.
I have herd allot of the stories you read about but I enjoyed this one the most I think...........Thank you Steve...
If only the HOA had to pay legal fees for loosing the appeal.
The problem is they're still refusing to, after they were ordered they had to.
Does qualified immunity pertain to HOA board members? If not, perhaps they're personally held liable? Or can you get a judgement to put some kind of hold or garnishment on incoming fees to pay the legal costs?
Ju M An HOA is basically a corporation, to go often the individuals directly you would need to find cause that would permit piercing the corporate veil (a corporate officer’s version of individual qualified immunity). Piercing the veil to get at an officer individually isn’t a trivial thing to achieve but it can be done if certain conditions are, or are not, met.
@@ethanpoole3443 I am thinking that Fraud might be cause to pierce that corporate veil. They did commit a fraudulent foreclosure hear by trying to foreclose on his house when he was not part of the HOA. if the people on the board of the HOA knew he was not part of the HOA, and for all account it sounds like they did, then they would be personally liable. to me this also seems like malpractice on the part of the HOA attorneys. they would have seen the documents about him not being part of the HOA during the discovery process, and they should have informed their client that they were in the wrong, and maybe they did and the HOA pushed it anyway.
*honestly they should but i'd not hold my breath on that one*
Kudos to the man!! Now, how about all the rest of the homeowners in section #1? are they entitled to stop paying the fees? and can they sue the HOA for their money back as well?
Those suits have to be filled separately from this one, but they could be a class action.
I get suggestions from Quora and get ones about HOAs. Usually the question is " I moved into a house next to an HOA. They send me letters about X, what should I do." Everyone including the lawyers that post say if you didn't get a notice at closing that there was an HOA "ignore them" :)
*send a reply back saying "thanks for the toilet paper*
$300k and he can put big steel pink flamingos on his lawn, I'd count that as a win.
I spent 350 dollars back in the 80’s for a 35.00 traffic ticket. Two days before court the ticket was dismissed. I later ended up working with the a-hole and was there when he was fired. I had never forgotten him or the ticket so it was sweet watching him walk out the door.
I've represented myself in Lawsuit against an HOA for 13 years. HOA side has expended approximately $400,000 in fees & costs. They had 3 Attorneys at a 2-wk jury trial. I had no law school, not even jury experience. I won, although I got only a fraction of what the jury wanted to award because I missed a discovery deadline. I am now suing them for malicious prosecution. Wish me luck! I do not recommend this for everyone. As an attorney told me, "you need deep pockets and the stomach of a goat." Representing myself has taken 1000s of hours vs. their $100,000s. They started it. I intend to finish it. BTW, seek legal advice. Good Luck!
So we can assume the HOA spent an equivalent amount of money? Meaning they wasted over $320,000 of HOA money!
my friend lives in one and they told her that since her car was not operable that she needed to have it removed or they would tow it .. now her car is operable ,registered, insured the problem they had is she just doesnt drive that car in the winter she drives her truck instead so she wrote back to them and asked who their mechanic was and why they would be snooping around on her private property they never replied go figure
Guessing that HOAs fees about to increase 😂
If they were on the hook for the 320,000 the members would probably rip it to shreds instead.
*Just imagine if on the final appeal & judgement he is awarded costs.*
The cherry on top.
$320k might actually be worth it in the long haul when you start adding in the petty fines and stuff they can levy up to and including making you tear down things you've built on your property or repainting your house because you didn't buy the paint from the right vendor...
In March, a judge ordered the HOA to pay the homeowner $188K to compensate him for his legal fees.
Principles are expensive and only the well-off can afford them.
It's not just him that won. But everyone in the first development that can now stop paying fees.
Everyone should also demand a REFUND of all fraudulent fees paid.
@@garyreed2206 Refund WITH INTEREST!
@@BrianDaleNeeley what's really screwed up about the United States is that even when you fight something like the homeowners association and win, they don't have to cover your legal fees. And what's worse if you're actually still part of the HOA, you'll be paying increased fees for what they spent fighting you in court!!!
Steve you say the homeowner won but at a cost of $320K. What I’m curious about is what did the HOA have to pay for this litigation which seems like it should be a bankrupting amount of $$$! I wonder how all the members of this HOA feel about sharing towards this costly defeat?! I think this homeowner is reveling in his costly revenge!!! Rich
$200 per month adds up quickly when you're assessing it against dozens of properties. $200 x 12 mon = $2400 x 100 properties = $240,000 per year. That's an impressive legal fund, and that's just one year. Of course, that's before the HOA Board Members compensation.
He won the case and should sue for both his legal expenses and the emotional toll, that these bureaucrats inflicted upon his well-being
I don't know about there, but my mom's HOA for a bunch of condo buildings decided that a million dollars worth of repairs need to be done to some of the buildings. First, they won't say which ones. It's all hush hush. But what they have done is assessed and an additional fee of about $8000 per unit to the owners for the year.
On the one hand if there is structural damage that needs to be repaired due to water run off, which is what they are claiming, then I guess you can't just let those buildings collapse. On the other hand there are a lot of older people in the association and I'm sure most of them don't have an extra $8000 just sitting around.
The point is, depending on their HOA rules and Nevada law the HOA may be able to assess each member a share of the legal costs. Which may really tick off the additional people that weren't supposed to be in the HOA to begin with.
Beau Bo They (the HOA) Probably have liability insurance. HOWEVER does it cover the appeals ?
gatesmw50 It’s possible liability insurance might cover the HOA for being sued for damages by the homeowner, but I suspect it was the HOA that initiated this harassment litigation against this homeowner to bully the homeowner into compliance on what they mistakenly thought was their correctness of their position. Rich
There was a case you spoke about last year where a Mr.Andy Lipka in Missouri was being threatened with foreclosure by his HOA because he parked his 1965 Ford pickup on his drive. The matter was going to court, but there doesn't seem to have been a resolution.
Does anyone know what the outcome (if there has been one) is?
This reminds me; what ever happened to the guy with the patina pick-up truck that the HOA said was body-damaged and needed to leave?
@@suzanh7777 that's pick-up truckist?
Johnathan Fredrick, you are a hero; well done Sir!
I bet the 1 dislike is from some one that is on the board of a HOA
Being a Licensed Amateur Radio Operator living in an HOA I am glade there was a new law passed that the HOA has to provide reasonable accommodation for my radio equipment (meaning my antenna) because before I was not allowed to put up an antenna because some of them are quite big and some will say unsightly. Btw love the mics in the background especially the D104
I don't want to spend all that Money to have People telling me what to do !!. Thanks Steve..
Hooray for him! I live in a huge condo community that consists of numerous HOAs, depending on the unit you live in. Every HOA pays the same amount of money to the same trash service, no matter where they live. The nearest dumpster to me is just across the street from my unit, but it is owned by a different HOA. Our dumpster is a rather lengthy walk down the street. I have owned my condo for three years. On two separate occasions, I was approached by condo commandos telling me that I was using the wrong dumpster. One was from the other HOA, and a couple of years later, a representative from my HOA approached me. I never got any formal reprimand in writing, but I was told that I really needed to use the dumpster that my HOA was paying for. I told my HOA rep that the whole issue was petty since everyone used the same trash company anyway, and that I was not going to walk all the way down the street to dump my trash when a dumpster near me was much closer. IT'S JUST TRASH and it GOES TO THE SAME PLACE! He wasn't too happy, so now I just take my trash to the dumpster at night, when no one can see me. Don't you just love condo commandos?
It stinks the man can't get the 300k back but I would think he could put a lien against the HOA for the 15k.Nobody in the HOA would be allowed to sell until he got his money.
The whole idea that you can only access justice by shelling out more than your homes worth of cash is ridiculous.
The HOA appealed in the hopes of preventing others with the same situation from rebelling.
*not gonna work...that HOA is doomed*
Once on a HOA board, our management company replied verbally to a homeowner with a complaint who threatened legal action: "Our pockets are deeper than yours!"
I might be in the minority, but I've lived in 2 HOA run neighborhoods, and had pretty good experiences. The most I've ever been asked to do is paint a mailbox, and I know other neighbors who had horrible looking yards were required to fix them. There definitely are power hungry people who try to influence the HOA though. Recently a lady reported a neighbor who was having food trucks in her driveway during the pandemic when restaurants were closed. At least that person didn't have any power, and the food trucks are still bringing delicious food.
My friend lived in a HOA. Her dues started at $150 p/mo. Within a year they were $500 p/mo.
Holy f***
Fruit that
The HOA where I currently live in Virginia, a former board member decided to raise everyone's rates, but then secretly pocketed the funds from those rate increases over a period of several years, until the missing funds were noticed by an outside auditor. The HOA filed a criminal complaint on behalf of the members, but as far as that missing money, we as members aren't going to be reimbursed. Instead, whatever money that is recovered, will simply be given to the HOA for them to spend on whatever they wish.
Still, better than the Condo Owners Association that my sister has (she has both an HOA and COA), which drags its feet on everything. The HOA is open about what it spends the funds from members on, while the COA says that such matters are private and not available to the members. But yeah, there was a spigot outside her condo that burst, and flooded her condo. COA was responsible as it was an outside spigot of theirs, and they took almost 7 months to get a contractor to come in and repair her condo because they kept arguing about what damages they would pay for, and then when my sister said that the old insulation for the outside wall in the spare room had not been replaced (so the room gets hot in the summer and cold in the winter), the COA said "If you want new insulation, you buy and install it yourself."
That was back in 2014. Last September however, the a/c unit for her upstairs neighbor, had an electrical fire at the fuse, to which the fire department had to break into my sister's condo in order to ensure that the fire hadn't entered her condo, and damaged the door frame in the process. One COA member told her that the association would cover the damages, while another board member than told her that they would not be paying for the damages. Only to then have a 3rd member of the board tell her that they would pay for the damages. So a few weeks later, the door frame was replaced at cost to the association.
However, all they have done to where the fire had burned the siding and such, is put a tarp over the wall. That was last September, with nothing having been done since then.
Wait... the COA doesn't even buy insurance??
@@floydlooney6837 Usually insurance isn't brought in unless it's 100% catastrophic. They will attempt to use their own funding pool. Using the insurance company raises rates and if they get so many claims, the insurance company can drop them as a client when the term of the policy comes due. Plus they figure they can play 'drag ass' and draw the claim out to the point they hope the home owner simply gives up and pays for it themselves.
I remember discussing with someone once how I never want to be in an HOA, he asked me how else I would stop the neighbors from starting a pig farm next door? Well, I don't think the pigs and chickens in my own backyard would mind!
Zoning regs usually take care of those things.
Where I live in NJ you can have chickens but no roosters (noise levels). A man in my neighboorhood had 3 chickens. They stayed in his backyard, and I couldn't smell them while my window was open. More power too him. Id love to pet a 🐖
I'll take pigs over Karen next door any day of the week.
You drive into a HOA neighborhood, you just crossed the border from the US into a foreign country. Kudos to the guy who fought them!
I'm currently a resident of a HOA governed community in the Panhandle of Florida, and have been for 8 years. Slowly the regulations and HOA fees have increased year by year, and now they are approaching the point to which I consider the fees and rules unreasonable. Example: We are force to use only one type of grass for our lawns. The grass that someone has chosen does not grow well in the shade. About 10% of my lawn is shaded by tall pine trees and in the shaded areas the grass will not grow very well. We've had multiple lawn professionals attempt to improve the lawn, I've tried my best, no success. We started getting letters from the HOA threatening $100/day fines if we do not fix the barren spots of our lawn. 90 % of the lawn is emaculant and it's obvious the shade is hindering the growth. There are no limbs that can be trimmed (longleaf pines) and guess what, it's a violation to cutt down trees. With any and evey violation (lawn or other) is met with a warning letter giving 30days to resolve. If unresolved, you receive a $100/day threatening letter I started investigation the structure of the HOA and to my surprise I have discovered that we, as residents dont even have an HOA board or any representation for that matter. We are managed by a company made up of 3 people all of which do not live in the community. The management chooses what company gets lawns service contract of the general areas, which happens to be manager 1 brothers company. The pool cleaning contract was awarded to manager 3's husband's company and so on. Do we have any right to representation, whether it be a board of voting residents or other? Thanks
You ought to visit some of the non-HOA communities in Las Vegas. I was looking to purchase investment properties. One community was the home to a contractor who parked 10 F-250 work trucks on every available parking space in the small neighborhood. For every bad HOA, there are those that are pleasant to live in.
My friend parks his weekend car in front of his house to avoid that situation.
Fair enough argument. But you have no idea how bad an HOA is until you've invested hundreds of thousands of dollars into the property. God forbid if the HOA puts a lien on your house, you can't even sell it without the lien holder's approval.
What happens if they say, "No," and keep screwing you. Your alternative to get out is walk away and ruin your credit for 7 years. And maybe end up living in a really subpar apartment and/or neighborhood all because a HOA ruined your credit and now your life.
BTW: ruined credit can sometimes cost you a job. It depends on the job and company. There is that to think about.
We don't have an HOA, just a covenant and boy we were happy for that when one of our idiot neighbors who moved into new construction so they knew the covenant decided to park their huge pull behind camper in the main road right at the entrance from a 45mph road. People were almost hit walking around it. If a car was leaving no one could enter causing a back up on the other road. They were pissed when someone dropped a copy of the covenant on their doorstep and wrote threatening letters to everyone pointing out all the infractions... infractions no one cares about because it puts no one in danger and does not cause property value to decrease. They started parking it on the edge of a drainage ditch and everytime it rains I secretly wish it would topple over into the ditch.
ETA: the road into is a 1 lane for each direction with no turning lane. The subdivision is slight bigger than 2 cars.
@@Uberragen21 Complaining about a lien from the HOA is a bit like complaining about how high your bail is. Maybe you're innocent and are getting screwed, but there's a good chance you violated a rule you should have known about. The difference is that the HOA will let you fix the problem.
@@NYpaddler wrong on all points
I'm in an HOA, but the dues are less than $250 per year and they are pretty hands off. I probably got lucky there
You do have to get prior approval for big changes like fences or sheds, but they don't give flip if you cut down a dead tree, put stone around the flower beds or other minor changes.
I don't know about NV, but some (many?) States award the winner the legal fees on top of the original amount sought. That's how it is in my State. That sould put that $320k burden onto the HOA on top of the $15k original amount.
Nevada is kind of a strange state, law wise. But, I think, it’s a union state, which is good.
Legal fees and cost s are not the default in America. they're generally has to be something above and beyond or a specific enabling statute to get fee shifting.
Hi
We have a similar system in Australia called "strata title" - similar concept, common house a levy for repairs and all exterior works / repairs is paid by the strata.
Actually i just read this , it is a very long story
there are rules and regulation, luckily when these are sold, a copy of the by-laws MUST be lodged with the selling agent as the title is Strata ( as opposed to freehold or torrens ), all solicitors or conveyance agents are required to notify and have sign off or reading the by-laws
Anyway, i was in a complex for 4 years and was a treasure for say 3.5 years, we have a widow or single mother who was a nice lady and everyone felt sorry for her and helped her out with domestic chores, and assist in child keeping, she did not pay the monthly fees - bu tit was agreed that it would be settled if she ever sold.
A totally different example was another person who decided he was not paying because some mate in a pub told him not to as "he owned it ", anyway a few letters and notices, solicitors letter and follow up then a fine for overdue. then for next 3 or 4 months it was just a extra fine for overdue
He did not care, however 2 years later ( while i was still there ) he placed the building up for sale, so there is a form that solicitors lodge to the president and treasurer - see link
So as treasurer it was given to me and i filled out the form on current levy amounts and also filled out the whatever it was 8 or 18 months unpaid levy and fees, took it to work and faxed it to the solicitors.
2 days later this guy is basically aggressive and pounding on my door demanding to know why i cost him the sale of his unit - i had no idea what he was on about, i told him to calm down go home as my wife had picked up the home as she was hysterical and was going to call the police, i explained to him calm down, dont make a bad situation worse and i am not here to ruin his life, but if he carries on , irregardless of what happened he will end up with police
Somehow the little cogs were turning in his head and the light bulb came on, he stopped, said sorry and walked to his unit.
He came a hour later and apologized and said he had a phone call from agent and solicitor and one of them dropped of a letter that stated the negative strata report.
I then realized what happened, "i told him it is not me" - that i wanted no part in this but had been served documents by his solicitor, they wanted it done ASAP and i had to answer his solicitors questions truthfully - i said if i lie then i can go to jail
He was happy with it. ** i was nervous he would erupt again **
so after about 15 seconds of silence, i said, look this is easy i can give you some friendly advise, if you dont have the month to pay what you avoided in the past plus all the letters and solicitors letters you ignored it is really easy, ell your solicitor and agent that all they have to do is when the sale goes through they pay the unpaid installments and i will just delete all of the fines - its easy, you wont be out of pocket now and basically ended up with a interest free loan, and you can still sell the unit.
He was happy with that, called me his new best friend and left
Next day he gave my wife flowers and apologized ( she never forgave him anyways she was really scared )
So a few weeks later he is gone and a courier from the buyers solicitor delivers a bank cheque for the fees and a pre written copy of the form that i previously sent that they altered to show no outstanding and they were asking me to sign and date and hand back to the courier - as i had the cheque in my hand i signed it and handed it back.
I took the cheque to work, photocopied it for my records and banked the cheque into the strata account, i gave the copy to the president that night, then 20 mins later the president , vice president and 2 members are banging on my door demanding to know what i done, why and they want all of the fees.
I very clearly and not so politely told them that all of them were behind locked door and hiding behind their curtains and not one of those 6 people came to assist myself when this unit owner was basing on my door and screaming his head off for 15 minutes ( about 7pm at night everyone was home )
They told me i had no right to accept less and waive fees or penalties, then i took the bylaws book and wherever it was page 2 or 3 , showed them any committee member or person in a official role can charge fees / alter fees / or dismiss fees - levy changes have to be voted and passed by majority
So i said, its late leave it to tomorrow, they all said OK and stormed off - not happy. So i rang the strata solicitor, told him who i was and from where - he remembered me as he need to have annual meetings and he has to attend and take minutes and sign them off, i explained everything and he agreed to represent me.
Next night 4 of the 6 committee are waiting for me to come home, the are furious as they called there strata solicitor and he said he cannot take the case as he represents me now and none of the other partners or anyone in the company can take them as it can be a conflict of interest.
They asked me why i called him and i replied " he is the only solicitor i know why not "
So he sent each of them a letter saying he reviewed the information that i gave him on the chain of events, his opinion is i acted within my role, i was able tor achieve all back dated dues ( which is actually a rare thing to happen ) and according to the by-laws as treasurer i had the authority to waive the fees.
He also mentioned if they proceed with anything, then he will add the fact none of the other elected officers and committee members who were home at the time and did not come and assist myself as "they failed in there duty of care " and done nothing to assist and help diffuse a hostile situation
About 4 months later i placed my unit for sale and resigned from the position the day before i moved out ( as treasurer i was able to sign my own statutory report on dues and levy as no problem )
( i think this is the form www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwjawJC8wLnvAhWHzjgGHWhVD5IQFjACegQICBAD&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.fairtrading.nsw.gov.au%2F__data%2Fassets%2Fpdf_file%2F0005%2F367880%2FSection_184_certificate.pdf&usg=AOvVaw2xrmWnM7HxTVQJOI9SPngu )
Thank You!
Thank You!
Thank You!
Aren't you going to post this on Facebook?
I never want to live in a place with an HOA if there is any way I can possibly avoid it.
Karen is president of the HOA
Or could be Cynthia from Geico HOA lol.
Of every HOA.
HOAs are a coven of Karen's. 🤣
Interesting aside from the article posted by Mr. Dixon, an earlier poster. The HOA tried to appeal based on the fact that the fine print from when he purchases the house that is did disclose the status as a non-HOA property. The HOA wanted the Statute of Limitations to extend from 2003, versus the 2012 date when they informed the owners from UNIT 1 (the first portion of the development, evidently) they weren't covered by the HOA, and that they needed to "voluntarily" agree to their incorporation into the HOA.
When we closed on a house right around the same time, we had just over 60 pages, single spaced, of a contract to sign. We spent over 3 hours reading through it, and I caught two, and my wife caught one, errors that just "coincidentally" had just shy of $3,000 in extra money we would have paid. Everything was corrected and initialed. I asked the mortgage broker how often people read through the entire contract, and he said maybe three times a month.
ALWAYS read the contract. Please. When we made the offer on the house, because they wanted the commission, we got them to make a pen and ink change to "mutually agreeable" for the selection of an arbitrator if it came to that. Never had to exercise it, but Steve can explain some time why that's significant. BTW Car Dealers get REALLY PISSED if you walk away because of extra "fees" they didn't disclose. :)
So does that mean that everyone living in unit 1 is exempt from the HOA?
I lived in a community with an HOA, it sucked. The first people to buy in to the neighborhood all worked at the same place (a national level investment company). The HOA started out as a builder HOA, but the transferred it to an actual owners association after all the lots were sold. The people who worked at the investment company controlled the board, and nobody else was even allowed to run for a position unless you worked there, which was a rule added after the builder left (by the people in the investment company). My wife and were glad to leave and move out to the "country" where our problems are real weasels and rats, not the human kind.
I was in an HOA once. They sent me a letter saying it was against the rules to have a doormat at my front door. Also I was sent a letter because I had a bucket in front of my car. You talk about some weird people.
I've been renting in a HOA for about 10 years now. They don't like renters and try all kinds of things to pee you off. When I first moved in, I was unaware it was a HOA... until I got a complaint about weeds in yard (was next door neighbors yard). I moved 2 blocks over an they kept getting on me about my vehicles parked on the street, in front of my house. In the middle of the night they towed my truck. Bad choice, I told them to keep it and sued them. Then the fire department and ambulance company told them they had to remove ALL of the illegal speed bumps they had installed. AND, even better, they found out that because they didn't replace missing and damaged gates; didn't place security at the entrances; the streets came back under the control of North Las Vegas. Amazing how fast the gates went back up. Yes, the same city of the old mans lawsuit. BTW: I have to laugh every time our local HOA drunk rams the gate or the kids do burn outs in the intersections. They ask for it and in return.. get it.
It will only take about 120 years to recoup his legal expenses. His neighbors on his side of the line need to sue the HOA as well, and then throw this guy a parade or something.
*good luck getting a permit from the HOA for that one :)*
It was more than just the dues. It was the right to do with your property what you want without permission.
All his neighbors in the first development also don’t have to pay now either. Not all hero’s wear capes.
Developer #1 (where he moved into) built the homes and left.
Developer #2 builds homes around the first development.
It was not the same developer, company anything.
Puts up a fence and then tells everyone that they are now part of an HOA.
From what I can understand the man moved in during construction of development from the 2nd company.
When he got the letter he was upset that his title company did not tell him it was an HOA community. I guess when told that they didn’t know either that’s when he looked into the zone lines. That’s when he found out that the 2nd developer basically abducted the first zone that he had nothing to do with and just thought he could since he built around them and put up a fence.
The only good thing about an HOA is that they can keep your property taxes low. The HOA takes over maintaining and repair of the streets and sidewalks but, if developer #2 did not have that agreement with the city then what he did was also hijack city property.
The man in zone 1 got stuck with HOA fees and Higher taxes.
They didn't hijack city property, they hijacked the HOA's property. They are the ones that maintain the gatehouse and private roads that this guy is using and refusing to pay for.
I wonder if the other residents in his section will continue to pay The HOA dues??... As usual, a great video... 🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
*no more dues = no more HOA*
In Florida they call them "Deed Restricted" my sister found out the hard way. Been in the house 3 years and been threw hell. She just sold and will be leaving in 15 days.
Good for him! I'm glad he had the resources to fight this!
Had a similarly crazy situation here at the HOA where my home is located. The situation was that there was a property that was previously individually subdivided by the original developer. His deed restrictions don't require him to be a member of the HOA, and the area around his home was not subject to development (and thus a subdivision plan) for almost 20 years following his lot being separately divided. It took a trip to the recorder of deeds and copies of maps and subdivision plans to convince the Board of Directors that he is outside the HOA. It's a shame that the guy in the case had to spend $300k to prove he wasn't in the HOA, because the guy in my story only spent $5 for some photocopies.
I am glad that he took his case to court, but most of us simply cannot afford that amount of money to fight to be right.
My son is just selling his house and the homeowners association wanted him to submit a new lot survey showing a small 15 block retaining wall he put around a tree in the front yard 7 years ago or they would block the house sale. The lot survey would cost about $500 and would not guarantee the wall would be approved. He had the relator remove the blocks and put them in the garage, since the buyers offer had no conditions.
I drove down a main road in Riverside, RI and happened upon a field on the side of the road, There in the field were 22 plastic flamingos wearing little football helmets lined up 11 per side with a football between them. It cracked me up. One of the funniest things I have ever seen, My sister ( who lived there) said who ever does that changes the play weekly.
She also said the game changes with the season too. I can attest as on another trip I witnessed flamingos playing soccer and again later baseball. Including little baseball hats , a bat and ball. Never forget the good things in life
www.flickr.com/photos/marirn/3933173212
www.flickr.com/photos/marirn/3885751770/
Whoever is doing that is s menaical genius
I had a client a few years ago who lived in a HOA community with a monthly fee over $500 (these were not million dollar homes either). After seeing some of the other shenanigans that other HOA's pulled in California I will never purchase a home in one.
I hope his fellow Unit One members and him all SUE the HOA for fraud to reclaim the moneys paid. In the mean time those in unit one should all stop paying and help him with his leagle funds
My favorite things about watching these videos are hearing about interesting stories, how the law applies to them, and most of all hearing Steve laugh when talking about them.
I rented a condo in California a long time ago and the HOA sent out a letter to clear the back patio (deck) so they could do some repairs on day "X." Well day "X" came and went with no repairs done, so we gave it another week before we put our patio furniture back out on the deck. Two weeks after that, I get a knock on the door at 7 AM on a Saturday by some random woman sternly telling me to get the stuff off my deck like I was told to do so by the letter. I told her that the date was 3 weeks ago and that if she wanted the stuff to be moved, that she can do it herself, but if anything is broken, I would sue her....Later that day, a nice worker came to my door and asked if they could move the stuff off my deck so they could do repairs....lol They were very gentle with my stuff.
Standing on principle is very, very powerful motivation to see whatever through to the end.