RAW Artists (is a scam) | ARTISTS BEWARE
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 9 ก.ค. 2024
- In this installment of Artists Beware we are talking all about RAW: Natural Born Artists. I try to answer the question: Are they just a giant scam? without saying anything potentially incriminating if they come for me. It's a fun game! Lets hope I don't lose! Support me on Patreon~ / catgraffam
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Chapters:
0:00 Introduction
2:49 Part 1: What is RAW?
8:55 Part 2: How it Works
23:36 Part 3: The Triangle
30:40 Scam??? - บันเทิง
RAW made me realize that I don't have 20 friends :(
Honestly I don’t either
god same
Dang, me too.
This! Not even 20 friends of friends.
Yes I thought the same 😂
Getting total MLM vibes from this business model. Except the artists don't even get commission for the tickets they sell/buy.
You said it not me :)
@@CatherineGraffam "triangle".... you nailed it.
RAW reached out to me too! the ticket schtick made no sense to me... RAW was touted to me as "for emerging artists." artists without audiences... so who am i selling my tickets to? at best, friends and family who aren't interested in anyone else's art. if i sell 0 tickets, my "booth price" would be similar to getting a booth at COMIC CON. you know, the 3-day comic con with TENS OF THOUSANDS of people in attendance who might actually want to buy from my booth. there's no way anyone's getting a return on their investment. some kinda weird artist party sounds fun, but not for $400+, and not if 90% of attendees are just friends/family members of artists who are only there to support their one artist friend. hard pass!
Wow that triangle shape almost looks like a Pyramid. Crazy coincidence.
That’s so crazy I had no idea!
remember, it's not a pyramid. I have it on good authority from someone with a similar *legal* business modal, they are a dimaryp. THEY ARE IN A DIM-A-RYP! >D Every one of them, a potential millionaire.
I've lived in Portland, Seattle, San Francisco and now Toronto, and Raw has contacted me in all 4 cities exactly the same way. Thank you for making this video, its about time someone dragged them and their "triangular" "business" "model". Enjoying this series a lot!
ALSO: Anyone who has ever been to an art show knows that not only does it not cost money, but often the gallery/hosts will try to ply YOU with free booze. Trying to convince your friends to buy tickets to what is basically a pop-up market with a cover band where they also have to pay for their own drinks sounds like a good way to lose friends.
ALSO ALSO: You can generally hawk your art, wares or performance to drunk people in dimly lit bars *FOR FREE* by just asking around. Yes I've done it. Yes it sucks. But, you know, sometimes it's what you gotta do. There's just no reason to be on the hook $450 to do it. :)
An event called Pancakes and Booze also comes through, charging artists a fee per piece. I didnt get it. A tabling fee is one thing, but people are coming for free pancakes (and not-free booze), it doesnt seem like they'd be there to buy art.
Have you participated? I have and it was great. So much so I'm now a Showcase Director.
Oh yeah, it’s definitely a scam. They’ve hit me up at least three times. Always last minute, which as a rule, I don’t book my shows like that. No other show have I done where I have to sell tickets. The attendance was pathetic for the booth price they were charging. If the pandemic hoses this group, it’ll be a blessing.
I would listen to you talk about anything. You reek of honesty and that’s refreshing. Make anything that moves you. I’m not going anywhere.
That is so sweet thank you!!
Many of the artists I know are complete introverts. They aren't going to sell any amount of tickets to an event.
I shot for RAW once as a freelance videographer in Florida.
It was basically pay-to-play the same way a lot of music venues treated local bands, where the artist sells tickets to people they know to come see them in a rented space. The idea is they will "see other artist's work" but they won't, the attendees came to support their friends and likely will not purchase anything from anyone but that person.
I shot interviews and B roll with every artist. It was pretty underpaid but I needed the money. They also asked me to do some extra work for extra pay, I did, they stiffed me on the rest and claimed they never asked me to do it, even though I had emails where they communicated about it but not the extra pay. The company itself pretended to have nothing to do with the goings on at the local events.
I did a RAW event. I guess I'm in the 1% of people who had a great experience. Selling the tickets was easy and im a loner. I made some sales during the show but what I gained after the show was better. I recieved calls from people who attended for commissions. It actually helped me launch my business because of the networking aspect. Did I sell thousands of dollars that day? No but after the event. A gained a ton of future business.
I think you have to go into the event with a certain mindset. I came there with business cards ready to hand out to anyone who showed interest in my work. No matter how small. I went into it as if it was a trade show. A lot of those you have to pay a "booth rent". I have been apart of may similar events since the Raw event and each one required a booth rental fee. Some more expensive than others. Some super cheap. Each event is an opportunity to network and sell yourself as an artist. To me, being someone who at the time didn't have much money, the idea of selling tickets to pay for my booth was ideal. Mainly because I knew I couldn't afford to pay it. So I asked friends and family. They asked thier friends and their family. Within a day I had the tickets sold.
If you go into the event expecting to hit it big then you will most assuredly fail. It is merely an opportunity for you to put your art and yourself infront of people. It is up to you to sell yourself and your passion. A year after doing that showcase I started my business and did art fulltime because I started getting calls from people who got my business card from that event. Commissions started coming in left and right.
I'm not going to say that I didn't have my feelings of unease when they first contacted me. And even on the day I was still skeptical. But after I presented my work in the way that I did. And the commissions that I gained after. I can't say that it wasn't worth it.
If you do decide to do a RAW event. You need to do these things.
Have business cards ready! Present yourself as a brand.
Have a professional setup or display. I came prepared with a branded tablecloth as well as a clear vision for displaying my work in the most inviting and professional way possible.
Network! Network with people who are both shopping and other artists as well. You never know what can develop from that.
Go in with a business mindset. Don't just think like an artist who is trying to sell their work. Think like a business owner. You have a product how do you sell said product to the audience.
Put your best foot forward! Do just take any art pieces, or sing any song, or bring any old piece of clothing. Take your best. Atleast a few of your best pieces. People look at artist like what makes you so great. So you have to show them. I had a huge crowd constantly around my booth because of my presentation and the pieces I brought. And there were way better artists there that didn't have as big a night because of poor presentation.
I know most people will still look at this event as a negative. But I hope that my personal experience helps to show that there can be opportunities in he darkness. I wasn't expecting to get famous or make tons of cash. I went in simply looking at it as an opportunity to network and make an impact in hopes that in the future it would pay off and it did. I did the RAW event in 2016. I started my business in 2017 and been going strong since. Not everyone's experience will be the same but my personal experience was great.
I totally agree! I don't think it's a scam, they tell you exactly what needs to be done from the begging. They don't try to trick you or scam you if you don't think you can sell the tickets then don't do it. Ive got myself noticed by a lot of people thanks the shows which led to lots of sales after the show and I always made a good amount of skates at the shows which really paid off. Ive done it 4 times, I've sold all my tickets each time. And even if you don't sell them all it's work paying even $100 because at galleries they take 50% of your art sales at least with Raw you get to keep 100% of it. And many markets and popup show require about $200 payment for a spot. So just not sure what the scam is lol I think people are just hating on the fact that some can't sell their tickets but I genuinely don't see this as anything wrong in the organizers part.
@@Ettigirb123I’m doing a raw event July 26th in Canada. I’m honestly doing it because my dream has always been to showcase my art in a gallery setting, and that’s what I plan to do! So to that, I’m really looking forward to the event. And if I have to sell a few tickets to get there, then so be it!
Love the hair! I got contacted by RAW when I was a newbie and almost fell for it. I'm glad you are talking about them!
Found out abt you because of your arm injury tweet- as a artist who has been dealing with a RSI/Tendonitis for about half a year now its very hopefully to see how other artists are dealing with their injuries while still creating. I wish you a speedy recovery! I'll be binging all your vids :)
This is so crazy to watch, so glad I did more research before putting any money or effort into this. They contacted me last week about showcasing near me (in Toronto, Canada) and I assume they found me through instagram hashtags (they liked and commented on one of my illustrations before emailing me) and started the email with 'Love what you're doing creatively! Your illustrations are highly imaginative, and I appreciate the direction of your pieces and designs' before going into the whole pitch. I actually did call with someone who was a curator for the event and directly asked about the whole 'having to sell 20 tickets or pay $500' which is why I was hesitant to go through with it as someone who just graduated university and doesn't have $500 to drop for an event I am not sure I will get that back. Thanks for this video, now I know not to continue with them.
I gave up marketing my art because of this kind of situation. I just don't stop making art because it's my therapy.
You have a very analytical mind and good at investigating and presenting information to the public. You should be an investigative journalist. Keep doing this series, it’s really good. Can’t wait for your next topic.
thank you so much!!!
thank you!! just saved me $500 ! trying to hold events in Toronto where you sell your own tixs to the event and if yo don't then its $500 out of pocket.
They just contacted me like an hour ago, I figured "Hey this might not be so bad"... until I read the whole pay to play thing. No thanks. Won't be doing that any time soon. Your video further solidified that.
Thank you.
so glad you are covering them, I almost did one of these until I was told aboutthe ticket thing and discussed it with family members who knew better.
How did you cancel with Raw? I luckily haven’t done anything yet but I said I’d be an artist. I sent an email to tell them I won’t make it
@@aarspi hi! Did they get back to you? I signed up too but now realizing it’s a totally bad idea, about to cancel just wasn’t sure if they’d charge me a cancelation fee.. did they come after you?
@@ldimar8884 No they didn't come after me, however I hadn't paid yet so they just removed me from the list :( I hope you got your money back if you already sent some in :/
@@ldimar8884 Honestly, I'd send an email and just say youre no longer interested or something like a Wedding came up and you won't be able to make it. As long as you haven't paid anything they'll just remove you. If they give any fight, just ignore them.
@@aarspi yea I emailed and said I found negative reviews online so I don’t think it’s best for me to continue. They replied right away very polite (theyre probably aware of these issues hence they corrected most of the things mentioned in this video) they even offered to give me free tix to check out the event just to see if it’s legit. I guess they’re trying to get rid of the bad image that has spread. Still not a good fit for me though.. thanks for replying!!
Wow I had no idea. I'm a member of RAW artists , they recruited me from Boston aswell. I did one show. That was on 2015. I had no idea they had the right to my art work. And didn't secure venues before selling tickets.. and ultimately have no experience working with artists. What a scam. Thanks for digging in to these topics . I'm loving your videos .
I can't believe these assholes are still around. They've been randomly contacting me for over 10 years. How have they survived for so long? So many gullible artists I suppose that they are able to hook. I get it, making a living is rough for artists, but we as artists have to stop allowing companies like this to exist and call out their bs. They are predators. They've contacted me in every city I've lived in and every response I've ever given them is "I would be happy to participate for a hefty appearance fee" . They usually f* off after that. This company is an parasite ecosystem for marketing interns still in college testing the waters for how they can throw bs events on someone else's dime (artists) . Thank you for doing this "artist beware" series. 🖤
My sister and I get approached by RAW all the time, I think it goes straight to my spam folder now haha. But in either 2015 or 2016 my sister decided to do it and I helped her, but we still couldn't sell enough tickets. Our family is very supportive of our art and we could have sold to them, but we could tell this wouldn't be a good event for 50-60 year old and boy were we right. It was terrible. too crowded, nothing to focus on. I don't think my sister made any sales (an objectively speaking she is very good) and she was hidden in the back in an overly crowded balcony area. Weird atmosphere with the music and and fashion shows. There was even a strip tease performance that was very awkward.
It was also very clear that most if not all the attendees did not come to buy anything. They paid $20 to get in and support with ever artist sold them the ticket. They did not come to be patrons (Though of course sales were made, it just wasn't what people were coming to do)
So yes kids, avoid this at all cost.
I am relieved to hear that this org isn't affiliated with WWE's RAW-- I would be crushed if that turned out to be some sort of scam *air horn sound effect*
LMFAAAOOO
Thank you for making this video! I was a part of a RAW show 5 or 6 years ago here in portland! I was pretty excited about it since it was my first time being approached with something like that, and I was so gullible, being taken advantage of for my art never really crossed my mind. But over the years, I always think back about having to beg my friends and family to buy tickets so I didn’t have to front that huge bill, it feels awful. Bleh..
I still have so many prints that never sold from that night 😩
I got this email today! I’m in Toronto Canada…After my investigation of RAW and THIS video I am so glad I didn’t fall for it. You’re the real MVP for posting this! You saved me!!! 🙏🏾 and saved me a lot of money
I am also in Toronto and also got approached a couple weeks ago. I guess our city is the next target.
@@Deivid_C Fellow Torontonian and yeap.
When I was younger I applied to be one of their "curators" and the work environment was basically the vibes of "minimum wage but Friday we get catered lunches!!!." After doing more digging and going through the group interview it was big scam vibes.
This is a great series. Wish I had seen stuff like this back in my first years of art school when the mindset was "any opportunity is a good opportunity".
Given that they operate out of LA, the pay-to-play ticket sale model is deeply unsurprising. That's basically how the entire live music industry works here. The scam works because there's so much competition that venue owners know there'll always be another band, so they can treat the ones they're currently working with as poorly as they want. It sucks, and I'm sorry (although, again, unsurprised) that it's managed to spread to the art world too.
Oh shit, hey 12tone funny seeing you here
Ya know I had an experience with these people actually- I saw a link for their event in San Diego on a Facebook group so I sent em a message asking for more info and specifically asked what the cost of a booth would be (never seen a group show with booths that didn’t cost something…) and they laid out the ‘ticket plan’ for me. I flat out told them they sound like a big ol’ scam and they can kindly eat dirt. I got a response reciting something about how they aren’t and it’s lucrative and blah blah but I deleted It and moved on. 👏🏻
I recently stumbled upon this video and I can say from experience, when I was still focusing on an art career, that they say they reach out to local artists when they'll suggest shows in states that are a good day or so drive. I did a show back in 2018, I was a small artist, had done a handful of commissions and was building my audience at the time, and they initially asked me to do a show in Connecticut. I'm based in Jersey, it's not exactly local. I managed to get a slightly closer show in New York. I luckily have a sibling that works in event planning and she was the one that really helped me. I don't necessarily think the phone number is an odd request, they didn't call me at all. They focused more on emails when I did the show. They did have some live streams for the artists to get an idea of what to expect, but I wasn't able to make it to any of them due to work at the time and I told them that. They did have a pdf to go along with tit though, so I could at least sort of see what I missed. As for the show, the one I took part in was over booked. I was told selling wasn't a necessity. I was told it was definitely more of a show rather than a market, and I know I wasn't alone in being a little blind-sighted by that at the time, especially as a mostly digital artist when they contacted me. I was also pretty much blocked from even getting to my booth because it was so crowded. It definitely taught me a lot. I wouldn't necessarily recommend it for a new artist. Not to mention, some of the other artists were a little rude. I remember there was a musician at the one I went to and him and his dancers tried to used my booth as a seat at one point and almost destroyed my setup. Most of the other artist were nice and respectful, but some definitely had an ego considering it was a show in NY. While I do wish I knew more about it at the time, it did teach me a lot. I was lucky that I had family that was willing to buy tickets even if they couldn't come, but even the few I couldn't sell were still pricy for me as a small artist with a basic retail job then. The thing that turned me off from them after and considering doing more shows is that you also can't do another show in the same city you've done a show in already. So you have to travel if you want to do more events. You'd think they'd want returning artists for certain cities. I wouldn't do another show with them based on my own experience. After seeing this, I wish I knew more back then.
Glad I did a little digging first and saw this video. I got emailed by one of the curators for an upcoming event in Calgary. Looking at their local page and past events, it really is just parties sprinkled with artists on the side. Not much engagements on their local page as well.
The "We don't make any profit" shtick is also very... flexible. If the top folks are just paying themselves wages that equate to whatever the surplus income is, then the company is not technically in profit.
See also any big tech company, most of which either still aren't making profit, or had years/decades of not making profit, while making their founders and C-suites multi millionaires and even billionaires during these periods of extended loss.
"We don't make any profit" - yes I had exactly that response, that paying for Google SEO to hide bad reviews is not cheap but is an expense, as is 80 people's salaries, etc.
Telling that Cat couldn't find any recent community work either....so that bit sounds shady.
I got caught up in that scam as well in Los Angeles. I lost tons of money and never made one penny!! The venue attracts grunge people that have no money to buy art. The music is at a deafening level to where no art collector would ever attend!
Thanks for making this video! And yes for the "interesting moments in art history" series 😍 although I love these longer videos as well!
Oh I’m so glad I found this video. I was just contacted and was excited for exactly 3 seconds when I saw the small print of having to sell tickets myself. Fuck no.
I did a show with RAW Artists in San Diego back in late 2013 (I was actually the one who contacted them first). It wasn't really that negative an experience for me, but I don't know if it was really worth it, either. All it really gave me was a fleeting moment of exposure to anyone who attended. And you raise a good point about them placing the onus of selling tickets on the artists. So, yeah, it's a scam.
What? That is not an invite... Do I look like a girl scout? That is a "buy in" made on the artist part... F-that!
I've received general Call To Artists emails from them over the years for shows in Toronto and Kitchener, Ontario (which is closer to my location,) but never a "personal" invite. I've always ignored them as these events did not seem like a good fit for me. I've always stuck with shows organized by local artists/arts organizations. However this video was really interesting and just shows how artists can be conned and exploited by unscrupulous people. The fine print on their website policies really shocked me. Thanks for this.
This ticket thing is so common in music. Sad to see they've branched out.
I love people like you. You've got guts and will take risk to help complete strangers. The fact that you did this all with a sense of humor and great research was icing on the cake. I especially liked the comments at the end about other ways to support the local artist/maker community. Will definitely watch more of your videos!
In 2018, I did my show in Phoenix with Raw. I had to purchase most of the tickets cause all 3 of my friends were back in my home state and don't have the kind of money to drop on an event they wouldn't be able to attend. I paid the money because they told me that if we did, we would be able to do another show in a different city for free. The show went well. It was a small venue, probably not even 30 artists. I was able to sell about $200 in prints of my watercolor paintings, which was way more than I expected. They told me they would reach out to me when the next show for the 2 options of cities I chose were going to have the events. I kept my eye out for an email for about a year before I forgot. Then in late February of 2020, I contacted the person I was talking to for the Phoenix show and set up a phone appointment for March 28th to discuss my next showing after apologizing profusely. Unfortunately, we all know what happened and now I'm still waiting for my second show 5 years later... Imma get it. They're not gonna do that to me 😂. Nu uh! I don't have enough time or money for anyone to waste a single bit of it.
Did RAW once, couldn’t sell those stinking tickets and I sold 2 things which didn’t even cover the cost of paying the fee. They have contacted me again and after watching this and after my experience, never doing it again. 😂
Thank you!!! I got one of their emails a few years ago and was VERY confused what this seemingly loud, gaudily-lit, performance-oriented event would want with my tiny sculpey figurines.
And the catch-22 of the ticket selling system didnt seem like it was geared toward helping me at all.
And every point they strive to make about their organization does not seem enlightening so much as merely technically true, with zero actual precedent or anecdotes that I could find. It's smoke and mirrors.
The answer is your money 😊
I was just approached by them, found this video, and just subscribed because of this great series. I think as a photographer, I am in the crowd that is hesitant to call what I do art, and because of that I miss videos like this.
Thanks for this series. I'm doing the call Monday night but have no intention of following through.
This sounds like every live music scam ever. Musicians, artists, if you are capable of bringing out 10-20 people to a show for $15 a pop, do NOT do it for a company that offers to pay you nothing or would make you pay for people who don't show up. You can rent out literally any venue in a city yourself and some venues will even let you play for free if you can guarantee people will be there. If you're working with a middleman, they should be bringing people to the show for you. If they aren't doing that, they're doing nothing for you. Don't let them take your money.
They're back at it! I received an email from them this week. What an absolutely outrageous exploitation of artists. Thank you so much for this information Cat
Camera quality is great! Love the new hair too, fits you perfectly.
im glad somebody noticed the new lens!!
My MLM-senses are tingling...
Tbh I’ve almost fallen for this kind of shit before, not just the email type thing but I’ve been in shows similar to this (luckily I didn’t pay anything to be featured) but yeah definitely these types of events are a huge waste of time! Loved this video too! Love how in depth you get and love your humor!
Thank you so much for making this video, I was reached out to by RAW and they were convincing as hell, complimenting me about the specifics of a few of my pieces and stuff like that. I was over the moon about the whole thing until I read about being on the hook for 400$ worth of ticket sales. This video made me realize I’m not just paranoid lmao
Thank you for this video. I was contacted by them in a very complimentary e-mail (I make jewellery), but it reeked from the get-go. Some light googling turned up your video and I'm so glad it did! Awesome video, thank you so much. And side note- your skin is gorgeous! Cheers!
At 6:56 in the video, I was completely in shock over how RAW brazenly screws over artists contractually in relation to usage rights of an artist's image. It saddens and disgusts me that this business was started by an artist.
One of my jokes about the art world is an artist support group is like an AA meeting where they serve alcohol.
Thank the stars for people like you who look out for other artists. Thank you, Cat!
you have an underrated channel! im excited to watch it grow
I would love to see a video on the many scam emails targeted to artists. I've gotten some real doozies. I love what you're doing! ❤🙌
Def. got RAW cold emailed. At that point I was already cynical of 99% of legit galleries, so they didn't stand much of a chance.
P.S. I was all about your vid's airhorns! 🎉🎉🎉
first, I love the Dole and O'Keefe story, so would love to hear more like that.
second, have you heard of RAW doing solo events? another artist I know has a RAW event listed as a solo show on their CV. very confused
your videos are SO GOOD and so necessary!!! thank you for warning us!
thank youuuuuu!!
Wow that is really shocking! 😳 I just discovered your channel, appreciate it 🙏❤️🙂
I'm a musician playing with a band for a solo artist and we're booked this sunday for RAW.
I will be updating my experience after the event, to help anyone that comes to this video for info on RAW
Tell us about your experience
@@Deivid_C So update, the experience as a band or musical artist was actually pretty nice! the ambiance was unique but I would recommand for any music acts!
I was contacted back in 2019 and signed on for a showcase here in Melbourne Australia. I then went to an in venue meeting they had and the organisers to me didn’t leave me with a good feeling. After the meeting that really could have been in an email and what I felt was a complete waste of time they called out everyone’s name and Announced how many tickets they sold publicly. A comment was made after everyone’s name and number either Gaslighting Shaming Praising didn’t have much of a filter. Those who had no tickets sales were asked to stay behind to be spoken to. I was one of them but refused to stick around to be scolded. Deciding that this was not the vibe or the event that I wanted to be a part of I tried to begin the process of pulling out of the show. I was met with a completely vicious and bully like response demanding me to sell my tickets and that pulling out wasn’t an option. I blocked all the numbers. They were calling me on and emails. They were contacting me with and I never heard anything again thankfully but it really was something that left a mark and has stuck with me for quite awhile.
Thank you for this video cat. It’s oddly given me closure from something that really halted and disrupted my artistic journey
These jerks contacted me back in 2014. Thinking from the email that it might be legit, I spoke with them on the phone, but as soon as the person on the call explained that 20 ticket sales bs, I wasn't interested. All I could imagine was this big, shitty event where almost all the attendees are friends and family of people who got roped into coming to this thing because they wanted to be supportive.
Two of my coworkers got sucked in by it. Got absolutely nothing out of it. A lot of work and expense for absolutely jack shit.
I was waiting for this topic. Thanks for posting about it.
thank you for making this. i just submitted an application and only did research and found this video afterwards. the unfortunate part is i already posted my art onto their website :( i went back and deleted it, thank you again this makes sense and is v informative
Thank you for making this, I don't know how many artists don't realize when they get contacted what a bad "investment" their events are, and after you read that terms of service section, I REALLY don't want artists to have to find out the hard way that they've effectively given away the rights to their work!
You're right, they're back at it. Just got an email from them. Thanks for putting this breakdown together - I wouldn't have known otherwise.
I got it too
Great to see someone talking about this! Makes me glad I trusted my gut and declined their offer years ago.
Oh my god thank you for this video. I was contacted by them and I was going to do it. It wasn’t until I had a phone call scheduled that I looked up the person I would be speaking to and found this video. I’m so glad I did. I cancelled the appointment and told them that something came up and wouldn’t be able to make it.
Honestly I felt like such a fool for falling for it. I was so happy that someone liked my photos enough to include me in a show but it was all a bust. (Also the language in their FAQ is so so predatory and sounds like a mlm) I’m so dejected that I ended up uploading images on to their site. I deleted them but it sounds like it doesn’t matter now. Ugh.
Never been contacted by RAW--thank goodness. But I do keep getting emails from a "PAKS Gallery". Anything not calling me by name and not mentioning specific pieces always strikes me as scammy, so I just stay away unless I'm expecting an email.
Would love the Art History talks too!
Ooh, first comment! As someone who almost did one of these RAW exhibitions, I'm so excited for this one! love the mullet, btw!
Thanks for doing what you do. Your videos and thoughts are some of the best on the platform!
Thats so kind!! thank youuuu
Yes Cat! The art community needs your videos. Thank you for making them.
I'd like to know more about those 'Instagram galleries' that constantly spam me there. What IS the deal with those?
And also - I will never ever use something that spams me in a comment like that with throwaway accounts. Nothing says 'avoid' more than shady stuff like that.
I was wondering if there was an MLM for the arts and indeed there is
They are back at it in NYC. Just received two emails from them this month. It was a newsletter with visuals this time with an unsubscribe option.
just got one of these emails for a vancouver show this year :o this video showed up first when i googled SO THANK YOU
I totally fell for this a few years ago when I first started painting! 😩
I went to the cleveland institute of art and they 100% just emailed all the students. I went to one of these shows in cleveland at the house of blues, and it was a mix of levels of art students and what was obviously still novice artists, so i felt like they were taken advantage of for not knowing better. It was dimmly lit, being a concert venue, it was also crowded and close quarters. people didnt sell much because most people were there just to support the person they bought tickets from, like myself to support a friend. -- Also I would love for you to look into voyage magazine, I did an interview with them after I graduated but it was also sus lol
I did a RAW show back in 2016, was promised to have another show anywhere in the country. They ghosted me after the first show. Then they contacted me thru instagram again a year later, like they never had record of my participation. I mentioned I did a show to the person who contacted me, and they confirmed I did that show, and they'll look into getting me another show in Los Angeles. Heard nothing back from them. 2 months later, same thing. Fuck RAW lol
So, basically they are aware they are running a scam and don't want to deal with or work with any of their previous 'collaborators' who are probably aware of what is going on and might take further precautions and do careful documentation this time around for evidence in a court...? Is this what I'm hearing?
They just emailed me recently. Thank you for this video. The fee was really sketchy so seeing what you have had to say about the organization solidified my suspicions.
Ohhhh they’re back! They just emailed me the EXACT phrasing that you used 😅
So RAW's artists aren't just fine artists. I guess there are fashion designers and makeup artists and film makers and musicians and all sorts of people. Fine artists actually seem to get the best deal out of all the artists because they can actually sell prints and merch the night of the event. So at least they can make SOME money selling their art.
But how can a musician make money? Especially because RAW is playing loud music over speakers. Maybe they have one DJ who is playing that music? But still, how would that DJ make money? How do the fashion designers make money? Do they sell their clothing? How do the film makers sell their art? How does anyone without physical and tangible art make money that night?
Of course, I'm not saying that fine artists get a good deal. They don't, and I wouldn't recommend any artist of any medium to participate. But at least they have tangible art to sell.
i was just contacted by this org last night and got really excited bc i'm a fairly new artist and i'm trying to break into the art community in my area. i was put off by the cost which is what discouraged me from replying. i posted about it on my ig story and was directed to this video! their email specifically complimented my art as being unique and detailed but the account they would've found (i have 2) has less on it as i am starting the newer one as a tattoo focused art account aka... doesn't really showcase my actual art range. the cost is $500 and they still ask you to sell 20 tickets for $25... i thought this was odd but i felt guilty for being a small artist and passing on an opportunity. this made me feel a lot better! thanks for the well made vid!
I was about to submit my work to a RAW event tomorrow, but thanks for the warning about their contract. Even I don't make such demands on my contract when I'm approaching a client. It's worth mentioning that they hide their details of their contract until you reach the submission part of the process rather than mentioning it up front. I was totally unaware of the selling of tickets part because again it's not mentioned anywhere until you submit your work.
The whole: you have to sign up this amount of people before you can even start trying to make a profit sounds very MLMy to me.
Thank you so much for making this video. I too received an email and follow up email from them to participate an upcoming event. While reading their invitation document, I realized I have to sell 20 tickets for $20 each and I am responsible for purchasing any leftover tickets... I sensed the scam and googled it and reached your video. It's a shady business... and you confirmed it for me. Thank you again!
I also got a mullet recently
RAW contacted me multiple times in 2010 or 2011 and I did a phone interview in Los Angeles. I knew what "pay-to-play" meant from the live music industry so I went into the interview with more information than other people. I allowed the caller to try to convince me of their business model. Learning about them made me crusade openly against these types of shows, in favor of other independent curators putting on popup shows. It was LA art critic Mat Gleason of Coagula Art Journal who also helped spread information about these practices. You can find one of his videos here on youtube, "Never Pay To Show Your Art".
In LA there were also other individual grifter-orgs like "Pancakes & Booze" and its copycat "Chocolate & Art". 2010-2015 were embarrassingly full of these wannabe influencer/art careerist shows. Savvy artists spread the information about which curators or groups were good to show with through facebook groups which were effective at the time.
It didn't stop everyone from participating. One artist I knew spoke highly of their experience with RAW but to be honest it came off to me as a sad attempt to #hustleharder or some rise-n-grind self-made-legend mentality.
Even after I politely declined they continued to contact me until I became less polite in my emails.
And incidentally, the popup-show-culture in Los Angeles had damn near dried up even before covid. Whether it was bars and event spaces no longer seeing the value of these mixed shows, or whether it was audiences no longer interested in these events -- perhaps even prohibitive LA zoning laws going into effect -- popup art & music shows were effectively gone by 2018.
You see, if these practices weren't pyramidal in their schemes, we would want them.
*edit: I CAN TALK ALL DAY ABOUT THIS SHIT, I can bring them footnotes my friends.
It's pretty much hiring salesmen with $0/hour pay plus getting free decorations for the walls. I'm maybe a good artist, but terrible salesman, I'll sell 0 tickets.
Was contacted by RAW 2018, it was a postive experience for me. I sold all my tickets and a few extra. I showed up to the event and i even sold a few pieces. They even paid me the money i earned by selling extra tickets. Not saying they cant be scammy but imo ive found that alot of artists have low self esteem and cant sell the tickets nor afford the booth price so they kinda hate on the organization. They just reached out to me about getting into their licenseing program that would allow me to host my own art events. Ima see what they are talking about before pulling the trigger on them but for me personally ive had a decent experience.
Honestly when I saw 900 anteendees I already thought it was too small. I've gone to other events here in brazil with more atendees, and they were small local events. They usually have around 2000 to 3000 atendees on most things I've been invited to and I'm not super known or anything. Also some of them didn't charge me anything to participate and let me sell my products.
RAW has been hitting me up for years and I'm not that good, so... thank you for this video.
Edit: who is the dislike...
a dislike from John Raw himself
The minute I saw the fee schedule I would turn away. They make so many mistakes when it comes to putting together a show. First appealing to artists who a have large well-off friend, and family base for the tickets or forcing the artist to pay. This leaves out all the talented but poor introverts. When I was a younger artist I was lucky to scrape together bus fare. As you pointed out it is silly to mix arts disciplines. This is like taking a meal including desert and coffee putting it in a blender before you eat it. You all know what that looks like. I am sure buyers won't be eating that up. Then you put it in a venue that screams out party! People are supposed to spend time with the artworks and think about what the artist is trying to say more like a church goer than a party goer. You need to think before making a big investment. Artists do not give these scams a chan ge to exist!
Just to be clear, if they've done over 1,500 shows with this business model that means that even if they only "recruit" 5 local artists each show, by now they've made over three and a half million dollars off the backs of starving artists. This is so sad. Imagine what the numbers look like if they recruit 10 people per show. 7 million.
I so glad you did a video on RAW. What you said made a lot of sense about them. Years ago when I was just started out, I was approached by RAW but I declined. Selling the tickets is what got me. I was told that I had to sell 20 tickets and if I don't I had to compensate for the ones I did not sell. I don't know of 20 people who would go to these events. Plus I would lose a couple of hundred of dollars. It just didn't make sense for me to do it. Again, thanks for a great overview of their business practice...it's a scam.
They have contacted me quite a few times but it didn't seem very well put together and it kind of had an everyman and his dog should apply. Which usually means it's more about profits than anything else. I didn't get the sense they had a good understanding of the arts personally.
Your videos are gold! So helpful
Charging musicians to participate in concerts has long been the scam. Sad to see it boiling over to the physical medium.
Can you talk about this online art program called Evolve artist? 🧐
"Carly Rae Jepson and Tim Rogers" actually appealing
Rawtten to the core