Anecdote: my football lifting class has an AMRAP policy. As a 16 year old I was going through rapid growth and on my last set I had 315lbs for a squat, my previous max. It was set for 3+ reps. I was feeling real strong and got 4 easy. Kept going. By the time I got 6 my form was not looking great. On the 7th my back twisted in a weird way and I was immediately in pain. A herniated disk that was pressed up against my sciatic nerve. Nine months of PT, chiropractors, and epidural shots later, I needed surgery to fix it. Ended my somewhat promising football career and has caused me trouble ten years later. My rule now is, any high risk lift does not need to go to failure. That’s mostly squats, cleans, and dead lifts and overhead presses. Just not worth it.
Agree with your rule, except for barbell overhead presses. Even if you fail to push the weight above your head, it's still very easy to keep up the bar at chin level because in that position it's not just your shoulders doing the work. I have been taking my OHPs to literal failure on every set for over 3 years and that never caused me any issues.
I absolutely love training to failure on everything, it keeps me motivated to go to the gym. If my form starts to struggle then I stop it then. Never got injured from it and I’ve been consistently in the gym for about a year. Just take a few rest days in the week and unless you have any pain or discomfort, you should be fine
It works because you’ve only been in the gym a year. Trust me I did the exact same thing. Progress will stall from recovery and won’t progress as fast as if you left RIR
@@alejandrocortes3341 to be honest most people nowadays dont train hard enough. What they think is 1-2 reps from failure is actually 4-5. Like If you got paid a million dollars for every additional rep you do from the point where you think its your failure, i'm sure most gym goers would hit way more reps then they thought would be possible.
@@Jeffdachefz yeah 100%. Also I think lots of people underestimate how much volume they can do in general. I see guys all the time obviously bigger than me doing my weight. Maybe they have different goals but still..
If you don't train the same muscle group within 48h it seems to make sense. I do every group twice a week, so the 72h is no problem. I like the feeling of knowing how far I went. I think I even need this to keep myself from slacking. Who likes to "finish before the end" ?
I agree. I always feel the need to train to failure, twice a week. Then Pyramids even if no gym bro handy for last set.. I do smash myself up but that tells me I've worked hard. I rest and eat lots.
Same ! I do a modified 8 day PPL (ppl with 2 rest days ) and I can easily push to extreme failure for 2 muscles per day (push 1 is triceps and delts ,push 2 is chest + side delts. And I do this by gong to fail on 3 myo rep match sets and then 2 dropsets) while I go to regular fail on the other excersizes . The only u don't go to fail on are lower back excersizes. And I can't do Dropsets for abs,lower back,forearms and calfs either . They just hurt too much to do 😅. And all the excersizes in not doing Dropsets for ,are put into supersets with other excersizes ,like planks ,wrist curls,shrugs,extra calf raises ,etc 😅
Recently a new meta analysis with a meta regression came out that used all studies of previous meta analysis and shows a clear favour of training to failure. Science changed its mind.
Thank you Picturefit for always providing useful fitness information. Can you please make a video on gym safety and proper form? I want to learn how to be safe when working out alone, and how to use proper form to avoid injuries. Thanks!
@@johngriller4997 May 2023 - Exploring the Dose-Response Relationship Between Estimated Resistance Training Proximity to Failure, Strength Gain, and Muscle Hypertrophy: A Series of Meta-Regressions
It all depends on the person. Look at Mike Mentzer, he trained 3 to 4 days a week 1 hr all out. And he could have won Mr Olympia in 1980. So, aside from steroids and meth. I think there is no way to say training to failure is a blanket policy. People find what works best for you, and make sure you rest and get sleep because that's when you grow.
Training to failure gets more and more viable, the more juice you're taking. So obviously all the bodybuilders say that going to failure is necessary and good
@@TheCooPeer other way around actually. Juiced bodybuilders train only for pump with lighter weights. They already got the stimulus for muscle growth from the roids and there's no need to stimulate it with failure. For naturals, failure is the only way you can stimulate muscle growth.
@@kaspershauptoh I'm sure, that's why he only trained 3 or 4 days a week. I disagree with CT Fletcher in "over training is a myth" unless your training arms, calves and abs he's wrong imo.
Training to failure having a worse stimulus-to-fatigue ratio is not a reason to avoid it. You gaining more muscle while needing to spend less time in the gym/being 'locked out' from the gym for a longer period is a positive thing. If there is no significant difference in muscle growth over a longer period of time then the training approach where you spend less time in the gym i.e. more days in between workouts is a win.
What about the study: Relationship Between Estimated Resistance Training Proximity to Failure, Strength Gain, and Muscle Hypertrophy: A Series of Meta-Regressions
Depends. When I do a week of high volume training I go hard as I can, then after that’s complete I move on to low volume training to keep up with the endurance and controlling the weight.
if u do 3 days split (chest-triceps/ back -biceps / legs-shoulders) u train 1 muscle group a week . so u have 124 hours to recover. more than enough. train to failure
I train for almost 2yrs now, and at the beginning i was doing high volume, with little to no benefits. I then tried to decrease the number of sets a bit, and it didn't changed anything. For almost half a year I do one set per exercise, and i push myself to failure every time (the only exception is deadlift since I'm afraid I might hurt myself) and that gives me the best results. There are people, who respond better to certain training routines - there are no strict rules on how you need to train. You just need to discover what's best for you by yourself
Everybody does it a little different, it's about finding what works for you. Personally, I do an upper lower split, and I go to exhaustion every set. This does leave me with like 48 hours of jelly muscles on whatever I exercised, but since I won't be hitting upper again for 4 days anyway... it doesn't matter.
Anecdote : i have never made more gains (both strength and size) as doing two reps to failure. When i reach +10 reps on first rep, i increase the weight by 2,5kg.
I always train close to failure. What I mean by that is in the last 12 months, there have been exactly 2 instances where I failed on a bench press and had to roll it down my body, and only once time in a squat where I couldn't get out of the hole and had to (gently) drop the bar on the safety spotter arms. This keeps me mostly injury-free - I regularly deal with DOMS or occasional hip/back pain from trying very heavy deadlifts but otherwise, yeah, I got too much going on in my life to add visits to the ER to the mix. The last time training (close) to failure caused me pain was the Leg Press machine, tried to really go hard and something in my right knee just felt weird for almost 8-10 days, every time I would need to bend the knee would feel something unpleasant. So yeah, I stop short of reaching that level of stress on my aging body and I think it's fine, I'm not a competitor. If I hurt myself, I have to take the bus and sit in an ER for 8 hours before someone will see me.
I don't know if it's the passage of time (developing more muscle over the months), but since I set targets for endurance and reps rather than training to failure I've moved on to another level. Training to failure was having some impact of course, but my arms, chest, shoulders, back and legs etc were at the point where nothing much was changing. I put it down to over-fatiguing the muscles so I stopped pushing myself so hard. It seems to have worked, giving me more endurance and better results. A couple of reps close to failure are how I'm mostly doing it now. I'm also finding supersets have been beneficial.
Training until failure can help with muscle growth by boosting muscle recruitment and metabolic stress. However, it's crucial to find a balance, as always pushing to failure might lead to overtraining and higher injury risks. To promote optimal muscle growth, include a variety of training intensities, prioritize overall volume, and progressively increase your workload. Pay attention to your body's signals, diversify your workouts, and prioritize maintaining proper form to reduce the risk of injury.
For strength training I feel the critique of the information was a bit off. For years I've been training to failure 5 sets of 5 reps full body 2 times a week and it has better results then anything else I've tried and it's still on par with the data you presented, again specifically for a more strength approach. I have 72 hours sometimes more between gym days and I'm getting the most out of my lifts as that very data suggests This information only seems potentially useful to bodybuilders or other gym goers who go to the gym more frequently.
please read this - Exploring the Dose-Response Relationship Between Estimated Resistance Training Proximity to Failure, Strength Gain, and Muscle Hypertrophy: A Series of Meta-Regressions
Been training to failure past 9 months every set every workout and im bigger and stronger than i have ever been. 🤷 Full body workouts, 1 set per exercise / muscle to failure with drop set. 3 times per week. ( and yes, if you want to be powerlifter, then this is terrible way to workout)
Exactly. I've done the same, albeit only twice a week, and gotten the same results. This video is dumb because it completely misses the point of training to failure. When you train to failure one set should be enough. You don't have to do 20 sets per muscle group, and you don't have to train every day. Your muscles grow while you're recovering anyway, and you've given them the maximum amount of stimulus possible. More stimulus + more recovery time = better results.
As a home gym enthusiast (high upfront cost, but worth it in longevity) I would say that testing out failure is better done with some exercises and equipment and others. I have not trained to failure with my barbell press, for example, but have with my dumbells, simply because in the worst case scenario dropping it to the side rather than my chest is preferable.
this is a problem with fitness on the internet, you have videos like this saying training to failure is unnecessarily increasing recovery time, then you have bodybuilders like Mike Mentzer and Tom Platz who trained the failure always and took many rest days, and they were huge. Everything here is inconsistent and extremely overwhelming and discouraging to beginners.
That"s what i do i train to failure on every last set of my workouts and see alot of progress faster, and also those exercises are just bodyweight exercises
Circumstances. If you are pushing weight everyday I suggest against failure but if you are doing multiple activities or only pushing weight 1-3 days a weeek, I suggest failure
Training to failure is different for everyone depending on how much experience you have. For beginners, absolutely. They're weak and need to learn to lift safely before attempting any heavy weight that can injure them. Also because of the inexperience they don't need to lift heavy. And everyone who is confident enough to claim they are past that point, Nope. Train close to failure, but leave enough energy to walk home, sit down, use the restroom, go to work, and defend yourself. Even if you could get wheeled home on a stretcher training to failure, are you REALLY stronger than everyone else if there are moments in your life when you are incapacitated like that? Experience gained from lifting is far more valuable than your effort. There are always going to be times where your energy and strength is low, but form and execution of said practice will help you even when your weak.
@@guacamolebolt I personally think no, it's only for true beginners. Beginners are the only group where, I don't expect you to show up tomorrow. Everyone else, suck it up and use 50-60 percent of your max effort. Pros, 60-70-percent.
Training to failure is absolutely the way to go for isolations because 1. They are single joint movements with high SFRs and hence don’t affect recovery 2. Failure is a sure shot indicator for maximal motor unit recruitment whereas there’s guess work involved with rir/rpe 3. It trains you mentally to push hard 4. It’s morally superior 5. Most scientific researches are on beginners who are not that mentally strong, so not only do they have newbie gains but also, they probably weren’t truly failing to begin with .
Unfortunately, this video equates RIR 0 and failure. They are NOT the same. RIR 0 is the sweet spot and can be safely used for any movement except dead lifting. Maybe Saturday squatting also.
Hey, may be a dumb question. but how long is a 48 hour rest day? is that 2 whole days of rest then exercise the next day, or 48 hours exactly to the next exercise? Just as an example, I work out at 10pm, 24 hours will be tomorrow 10pm and 48 hours will be 10pm the next day. can I exercise that one day? which would mean 1 full day rest and the time until the next gym training session? just since my workout routine is consistant and I go to the gym at the same time every time I go
I think 3-4 exercises each with 3 working sets with the final one being to technical failure is best. Warmup sets, the stuff sets to get you primed for the heavy work, dont count because they are nowhere near failure and if anything shouldnt be counted as effective volume.
Don't be like me and train to failure every training. It has its returns. I now deal with 2x disc protrusions and an annular tear from ignoring my body's pain signals and keeping on training to failure over a couple of months. I've now been in pain for over a year, and I hardly are able to move. I repeat, don't be like me, and listen to your body!..
@@JaziahZ34 Narh. Had symptoms of increased tightness around my right glute for months. It went away whenever I got warmed up, so I always just ignored it and kept lifting heavier and heavier. In the end my body just said "no" after all these months, and it fucked me real hard.
Look... Ive done the "Mike Metzger HIT training" for a few months now, and I've gotta say that ive had a huge jump in mass and strength in my muscles... js
I do 4 sets of 10 with progressive overload. So my sets could look like 10,10,8,7.until I get 4x10. I train to failure on the sets where I am not hitting 10. How would I be able to to progressive overload if I didn't train to failure because instead of hitting 8 or 7 reps I only hit maybe 6 and it would take a lot longer to overload. I am still learning so don't beat me up 😁
Hi, I love your informative videos; please keep up the excellent work. Just an idea have you thought of doing a video on WHAT IS RPE-BASED TRAINING & HOW CAN YOU USE IT? I would love to know the positives and negatives of RPE training
I never saw the need to go to actual absolute failure. If your program is designed with progressive overload in it, you'll eventually get close to it anyways as the reps/weight increases
In my gym there was a guy preaching that training to failure is a must. Period. And God forbid he saw you leaving some reps in reserve. We gladly helped paramedics loading him into an ambulance after one of his deadlift days...
well I am doing a full body routine now, going back to gym after 8 years. For example when I m doing pull exercises for the back, I plan ahead and I think "oh I need to do some biceps afterwards" then I don push myself to limit. I know I should push to failure but damn biceps need some training too!
It sounds like training to failure is not the issue. It is recovery that’s the issue. Proper programming and training to failure is better than training near failure.
Coincidentally, AthleanX released a vid on this topic this week. The key is to understanding what failure means. Also, TTF isn't intended for strength improvement but for hypertrophy.
I train my back very hard every time reaching failure in every set. I also do with partial reps when i can't do more full reps(every set) and also a dropset on the last set. The next day though I hardly feel my back at all and it's as i didn't almost die reaching failure so frequently the previous day. Same goes for my biceps. Does anyone know why that is? I do the movement correctly on every exercise and most of them are isolation ones.
The way I see it training to complete muscle failure yelds the most gains per sessions because while true that you will be going to the gym less due to longer recovery period that longer recovery period will also add to your muscles. Meaning if you're a wage slave like myself with a loaded schedule and only 2 to 3 occasions to workout per week then training to failure is far more benefitial than having to build your whole life around your gym schedule. Sure this is all mostly bro science as there are millions of studies that say GO and millions that say NO GO so ultimatly each person needs to experiment and figure out the routine that brings the most optimal results based on goals and expectations
I always go to failure on my last few sets, however on my first 2-4 sets (excluding the warmup set) I almost never reach failure unless u have just added some weight for better progression
The only way training to failure would work is if you traing 3 times a week or something like that where youre recovery would still be fine after 72 hours but if you train like me which ppl 6 times a week you are out of your mind if you think training to failure is a good idea.
Lumber Jacks what I did for a while we never went to collapsing failure and have arms better than the failure bull.The only person who can use all out intensity is the Superior Genetic on the Juice .
The only thing stupid in this video is advocating to train less intensely to cause less damage to the body to therefore have to train more days to cause the same level of damage/stimulus you could have caused if you did one day of all out failure. Why would I do more if less yields the same results and lets me enjoy life more? How devolved have we become in the fitness industry to neglect the basic principle that our muscles grow while resting not lifting. FYI (Do not train free weights to failure lol)
More like short answer is yes, but long answer is get close to it. A large majority of lifters actually don't train anywhere near to failure, so using the cue of training until you can't do any more reps is helpful for those cases
By this description then actually even 0 RIR is not failure if I get it right, or am I wrong here? I understand that training to failure is not really beneficial except or rarest of cases (like last week before deload, for example) but would 0 RIR/RPE 10 be considered training to failure in this context?
While I understand thus argument, I go twice A week, mostly upper lower spilt but my back isn’t healed yet so mostly upper, if I’m not training to failure I feel like I wasted my time, I did cable tricep push downs until I could only pull it around halfway down, while cheating with my form
Generally, for iso like pushdowns it should be fine but a bit more weary about doing it for compounds. Also, be cautious with back pain and trying to push your limits.
I think this is the first video I disagree on. While it may be best to go close to failure, I personally have had the best results when actually going till failure. Although the viewers probably like it more when you take a notable stand instead of “it depends”😂
Hey picture fit I've recently seen dr.rhonda patrick and peter attia talk about protein and he was pushing for 2.2g per pounds of protein I would love your rhoughts on it😊
the bodybuilding crew are so massive on training to failure. But they're also massive on fat stacks of PEDs so they're not taking recovery into the equation as much I guess.
PictureFit: "The science is quite consistent in showing that training to failure provides little to no additional gains in both muscle and strength." Gymbros here in the comments: "iT dEpEndS!!11" or "i TrAiN to fAIlure evErYTimE!111".
What I do is my first 2 sets I do 8 rpe so leave 2 reps and then last set go to failure. The last set sets the benchmark for my reps the next session if my last set goes up the first 2 will go up my next sessio
I usually try to make sure that I'm training hard enough that at least one of my sets on each exercise is to failure. If I'm failing on the first or second set I roll back the weight. Gotta make sure you're trying hard enough.
Anecdote: my football lifting class has an AMRAP policy. As a 16 year old I was going through rapid growth and on my last set I had 315lbs for a squat, my previous max. It was set for 3+ reps. I was feeling real strong and got 4 easy. Kept going. By the time I got 6 my form was not looking great. On the 7th my back twisted in a weird way and I was immediately in pain. A herniated disk that was pressed up against my sciatic nerve.
Nine months of PT, chiropractors, and epidural shots later, I needed surgery to fix it. Ended my somewhat promising football career and has caused me trouble ten years later.
My rule now is, any high risk lift does not need to go to failure. That’s mostly squats, cleans, and dead lifts and overhead presses. Just not worth it.
That sucks. I herniated a disc lifting like 100lb.... With good form. Fucking hip dysplasia 😢
Thanks for sharing your experience. I'm officially taking training to failure off my new routine plan
The difference is you went well beyond failure. Always stop when you risk your form breaking down.
Agree with your rule, except for barbell overhead presses. Even if you fail to push the weight above your head, it's still very easy to keep up the bar at chin level because in that position it's not just your shoulders doing the work. I have been taking my OHPs to literal failure on every set for over 3 years and that never caused me any issues.
The video says training to failure not training like a moron.
I absolutely love training to failure on everything, it keeps me motivated to go to the gym. If my form starts to struggle then I stop it then. Never got injured from it and I’ve been consistently in the gym for about a year. Just take a few rest days in the week and unless you have any pain or discomfort, you should be fine
It works because you’ve only been in the gym a year. Trust me I did the exact same thing. Progress will stall from recovery and won’t progress as fast as if you left RIR
thats form failure, not absolute failure which is totally fine.
@@alejandrocortes3341 to be honest most people nowadays dont train hard enough. What they think is 1-2 reps from failure is actually 4-5. Like If you got paid a million dollars for every additional rep you do from the point where you think its your failure, i'm sure most gym goers would hit way more reps then they thought would be possible.
Facts! 💪
@@Jeffdachefz yeah 100%. Also I think lots of people underestimate how much volume they can do in general. I see guys all the time obviously bigger than me doing my weight. Maybe they have different goals but still..
If you don't train the same muscle group within 48h it seems to make sense. I do every group twice a week, so the 72h is no problem. I like the feeling of knowing how far I went. I think I even need this to keep myself from slacking.
Who likes to "finish before the end" ?
75hours is a rough number some time it is more or less no one knows but you won't missing out much training less or more.
I feel good actually you get a good rush from going to failure
I agree. I always feel the need to train to failure, twice a week. Then Pyramids even if no gym bro handy for last set.. I do smash myself up but that tells me I've worked hard. I rest and eat lots.
Same ! I do a modified 8 day PPL (ppl with 2 rest days ) and I can easily push to extreme failure for 2 muscles per day
(push 1 is triceps and delts ,push 2 is chest + side delts. And I do this by gong to fail on 3 myo rep match sets and then 2 dropsets) while I go to regular fail on the other excersizes .
The only u don't go to fail on are lower back excersizes. And I can't do Dropsets for abs,lower back,forearms and calfs either . They just hurt too much to do 😅.
And all the excersizes in not doing Dropsets for ,are put into supersets with other excersizes ,like planks ,wrist curls,shrugs,extra calf raises ,etc 😅
It's the only way I see any results. The other methods don't work for me.
I'm training for less than 1 year. From my own experience training to failure each set gave me visibly more muscle gain
Recently a new meta analysis with a meta regression came out that used all studies of previous meta analysis and shows a clear favour of training to failure. Science changed its mind.
Thank you Picturefit for always providing useful fitness information. Can you please make a video on gym safety and proper form?
I want to learn how to be safe when working out alone, and how to use proper form to avoid injuries. Thanks!
A giant meta-analysis just came out saying failure IS better.
Are you talking about the March 2023 study?
@@johngriller4997 May 2023 - Exploring the Dose-Response Relationship Between Estimated Resistance Training Proximity to Failure, Strength Gain, and Muscle Hypertrophy: A Series of Meta-Regressions
@@MrYokyScape oh i see, ty
Training to failure can be productive and safe! It’s how you train to failure that matters (form, repetition speed, turnarounds etch).
@@MyMEDFITNESS Totally agree. Someone should have their form, tempo, etc. dialed in.
I always train to failure except on Heavy Compounds in which case I try to come as close as I can.
Cause u dont want to hurt yourself?
@@MMACenter-DM I train by myself. It would suck if I fail and there was no one to spot me 😂😂
It all depends on the person. Look at Mike Mentzer, he trained 3 to 4 days a week 1 hr all out. And he could have won Mr Olympia in 1980. So, aside from steroids and meth. I think there is no way to say training to failure is a blanket policy. People find what works best for you, and make sure you rest and get sleep because that's when you grow.
Training to failure gets more and more viable, the more juice you're taking. So obviously all the bodybuilders say that going to failure is necessary and good
Mike was doing 100% every set. You have to take a few days off after that
@@TheCooPeer other way around actually. Juiced bodybuilders train only for pump with lighter weights. They already got the stimulus for muscle growth from the roids and there's no need to stimulate it with failure. For naturals, failure is the only way you can stimulate muscle growth.
@@kaspershauptoh I'm sure, that's why he only trained 3 or 4 days a week. I disagree with CT Fletcher in "over training is a myth" unless your training arms, calves and abs he's wrong imo.
Training to failure having a worse stimulus-to-fatigue ratio is not a reason to avoid it. You gaining more muscle while needing to spend less time in the gym/being 'locked out' from the gym for a longer period is a positive thing. If there is no significant difference in muscle growth over a longer period of time then the training approach where you spend less time in the gym i.e. more days in between workouts is a win.
What about the study: Relationship Between
Estimated Resistance
Training Proximity to
Failure, Strength Gain, and Muscle Hypertrophy: A Series of Meta-Regressions
I commented about this too. I'm guessing this video was finished just before the study came out.
saw this one from tiktok and was confused from about this video
Up
Depends. When I do a week of high volume training I go hard as I can, then after that’s complete I move on to low volume training to keep up with the endurance and controlling the weight.
that just a deload.
if u do 3 days split (chest-triceps/ back -biceps / legs-shoulders) u train 1 muscle group a week . so u have 124 hours to recover. more than enough. train to failure
I train for almost 2yrs now, and at the beginning i was doing high volume, with little to no benefits. I then tried to decrease the number of sets a bit, and it didn't changed anything. For almost half a year I do one set per exercise, and i push myself to failure every time (the only exception is deadlift since I'm afraid I might hurt myself) and that gives me the best results. There are people, who respond better to certain training routines - there are no strict rules on how you need to train. You just need to discover what's best for you by yourself
Everybody does it a little different, it's about finding what works for you. Personally, I do an upper lower split, and I go to exhaustion every set. This does leave me with like 48 hours of jelly muscles on whatever I exercised, but since I won't be hitting upper again for 4 days anyway... it doesn't matter.
Anecdote : i have never made more gains (both strength and size) as doing two reps to failure. When i reach +10 reps on first rep, i increase the weight by 2,5kg.
First set*
Just tren until (heart) failure for maximum gains.
I always train close to failure. What I mean by that is in the last 12 months, there have been exactly 2 instances where I failed on a bench press and had to roll it down my body, and only once time in a squat where I couldn't get out of the hole and had to (gently) drop the bar on the safety spotter arms. This keeps me mostly injury-free - I regularly deal with DOMS or occasional hip/back pain from trying very heavy deadlifts but otherwise, yeah, I got too much going on in my life to add visits to the ER to the mix.
The last time training (close) to failure caused me pain was the Leg Press machine, tried to really go hard and something in my right knee just felt weird for almost 8-10 days, every time I would need to bend the knee would feel something unpleasant. So yeah, I stop short of reaching that level of stress on my aging body and I think it's fine, I'm not a competitor. If I hurt myself, I have to take the bus and sit in an ER for 8 hours before someone will see me.
I don't know if it's the passage of time (developing more muscle over the months), but since I set targets for endurance and reps rather than training to failure I've moved on to another level. Training to failure was having some impact of course, but my arms, chest, shoulders, back and legs etc were at the point where nothing much was changing. I put it down to over-fatiguing the muscles so I stopped pushing myself so hard. It seems to have worked, giving me more endurance and better results. A couple of reps close to failure are how I'm mostly doing it now. I'm also finding supersets have been beneficial.
what research are you talking about ? literally every study concludes that training to failure is the best thing for hyperthrophy
Training until failure can help with muscle growth by boosting muscle recruitment and metabolic stress. However, it's crucial to find a balance, as always pushing to failure might lead to overtraining and higher injury risks. To promote optimal muscle growth, include a variety of training intensities, prioritize overall volume, and progressively increase your workload. Pay attention to your body's signals, diversify your workouts, and prioritize maintaining proper form to reduce the risk of injury.
For strength training I feel the critique of the information was a bit off. For years I've been training to failure 5 sets of 5 reps full body 2 times a week and it has better results then anything else I've tried and it's still on par with the data you presented, again specifically for a more strength approach. I have 72 hours sometimes more between gym days and I'm getting the most out of my lifts as that very data suggests
This information only seems potentially useful to bodybuilders or other gym goers who go to the gym more frequently.
When it comes to deadlifts "no pain no gain" definently applies unless you replace your tibia with a robotic tibia.
If it concerns my neck or back, I never train to failure.
If it doesn't, then I always train to failure.
I refuse to fuck my spine up AGAIN.
please read this - Exploring the Dose-Response Relationship Between Estimated Resistance Training Proximity to Failure, Strength Gain, and Muscle Hypertrophy: A Series of Meta-Regressions
Been training to failure past 9 months every set every workout and im bigger and stronger than i have ever been. 🤷 Full body workouts, 1 set per exercise / muscle to failure with drop set. 3 times per week.
( and yes, if you want to be powerlifter, then this is terrible way to workout)
So great. That's basically my exact routine! I just really solidified it this morning! Finally feel like I found I well rounded variety of excercises
Hell ya
Exactly. I've done the same, albeit only twice a week, and gotten the same results. This video is dumb because it completely misses the point of training to failure. When you train to failure one set should be enough. You don't have to do 20 sets per muscle group, and you don't have to train every day. Your muscles grow while you're recovering anyway, and you've given them the maximum amount of stimulus possible. More stimulus + more recovery time = better results.
@@nix5942he didn't say you have to 20 sets per exercise...what video have you been watching?
As a home gym enthusiast (high upfront cost, but worth it in longevity) I would say that testing out failure is better done with some exercises and equipment and others. I have not trained to failure with my barbell press, for example, but have with my dumbells, simply because in the worst case scenario dropping it to the side rather than my chest is preferable.
Don't train to failure when you're a powerlifter. But i do bodybuilding. I train almost everything with 0 RIR.
this is a problem with fitness on the internet, you have videos like this saying training to failure is unnecessarily increasing recovery time, then you have bodybuilders like Mike Mentzer and Tom Platz who trained the failure always and took many rest days, and they were huge. Everything here is inconsistent and extremely overwhelming and discouraging to beginners.
That"s what i do i train to failure on every last set of my workouts and see alot of progress faster, and also those exercises are just bodyweight exercises
Circumstances. If you are pushing weight everyday I suggest against failure but if you are doing multiple activities or only pushing weight 1-3 days a weeek, I suggest failure
Did you see the recent meta analysis on failure training for hypertrophy vs strength
If one doesn´t train to failure how does one know when to up the volume ?
I agree.
Your body talk to you so you better listen 💪🏽🧘🏽♂️
Training to failure is different for everyone depending on how much experience you have.
For beginners, absolutely. They're weak and need to learn to lift safely before attempting any heavy weight that can injure them. Also because of the inexperience they don't need to lift heavy.
And everyone who is confident enough to claim they are past that point, Nope.
Train close to failure, but leave enough energy to walk home, sit down, use the restroom, go to work, and defend yourself.
Even if you could get wheeled home on a stretcher training to failure, are you REALLY stronger than everyone else if there are moments in your life when you are incapacitated like that?
Experience gained from lifting is far more valuable than your effort.
There are always going to be times where your energy and strength is low, but form and execution of said practice will help you even when your weak.
@@guacamolebolt I personally think no, it's only for true beginners. Beginners are the only group where, I don't expect you to show up tomorrow. Everyone else, suck it up and use 50-60 percent of your max effort. Pros, 60-70-percent.
In anime term, "you push yourself above the limit and gets stronger"
Similar concept in DBZ no?
Huh, really. Good to know! Love this channel.
Training to failure is absolutely the way to go for isolations because
1. They are single joint movements with high SFRs and hence don’t affect recovery
2. Failure is a sure shot indicator for maximal motor unit recruitment whereas there’s guess work involved with rir/rpe
3. It trains you mentally to push hard
4. It’s morally superior
5. Most scientific researches are on beginners who are not that mentally strong, so not only do they have newbie gains but also, they probably weren’t truly failing to begin with .
Maybe not mentally but mostly physically weak since they are beginners ofc hah
Agree with this ♾️
Unfortunately, this video equates RIR 0 and failure. They are NOT the same. RIR 0 is the sweet spot and can be safely used for any movement except dead lifting. Maybe Saturday squatting also.
Lifting close to your 1RM over and over again will also increase your chances of injury.
Hey, may be a dumb question. but how long is a 48 hour rest day? is that 2 whole days of rest then exercise the next day, or 48 hours exactly to the next exercise?
Just as an example, I work out at 10pm, 24 hours will be tomorrow 10pm and 48 hours will be 10pm the next day. can I exercise that one day? which would mean 1 full day rest and the time until the next gym training session? just since my workout routine is consistant and I go to the gym at the same time every time I go
Another great video ❤🔥❤🔥
I think 3-4 exercises each with 3 working sets with the final one being to technical failure is best. Warmup sets, the stuff sets to get you primed for the heavy work, dont count because they are nowhere near failure and if anything shouldnt be counted as effective volume.
Don't be like me and train to failure every training. It has its returns. I now deal with 2x disc protrusions and an annular tear from ignoring my body's pain signals and keeping on training to failure over a couple of months. I've now been in pain for over a year, and I hardly are able to move. I repeat, don't be like me, and listen to your body!..
Sounds like ego lifting, not training til failure.
@@JaziahZ34 Narh. Had symptoms of increased tightness around my right glute for months. It went away whenever I got warmed up, so I always just ignored it and kept lifting heavier and heavier. In the end my body just said "no" after all these months, and it fucked me real hard.
Training to failure doesn't mean ignore technique and form.
we need sam's talk on this right now.
Look... Ive done the "Mike Metzger HIT training" for a few months now, and I've gotta say that ive had a huge jump in mass and strength in my muscles... js
Just remember to _stretch!_
(My poor legs… 😵💫)
I absolutely hate stretching 😅 Atleast I do warm up sets tho..
I do 4 sets of 10 with progressive overload. So my sets could look like 10,10,8,7.until I get 4x10. I train to failure on the sets where I am not hitting 10. How would I be able to to progressive overload if I didn't train to failure because instead of hitting 8 or 7 reps I only hit maybe 6 and it would take a lot longer to overload.
I am still learning so don't beat me up 😁
Great question! This is exactly what i was thinking. Someone more knowledgeable than us beginners, please help!!
Volume wins! Volume always wins!
Hi, I love your informative videos; please keep up the excellent work. Just an idea have you thought of doing a video on WHAT IS RPE-BASED TRAINING & HOW CAN YOU USE IT? I would love to know the positives and negatives of RPE training
well training in the range of 7 to 9 rpe is optimal for muscle growth
I never saw the need to go to actual absolute failure. If your program is designed with progressive overload in it, you'll eventually get close to it anyways as the reps/weight increases
In my gym there was a guy preaching that training to failure is a must. Period. And God forbid he saw you leaving some reps in reserve.
We gladly helped paramedics loading him into an ambulance after one of his deadlift days...
Yeah deadlift maybe don’t go to failure..😅 hope he’s okay
That's not how you should train to failure though.
@@nix5942 Indeed. But explain it to some people...
I been saying train harder then last time for twenty five years
well I am doing a full body routine now, going back to gym after 8 years. For example when I m doing pull exercises for the back, I plan ahead and I think "oh I need to do some biceps afterwards" then I don push myself to limit. I know I should push to failure but damn biceps need some training too!
It sounds like training to failure is not the issue. It is recovery that’s the issue. Proper programming and training to failure is better than training near failure.
shit man I'm addicted to training to failure
You want that Hit!
So why is he the only person saying that training to failure is bad comparing to 99%of other youtubers??
Coincidentally, AthleanX released a vid on this topic this week. The key is to understanding what failure means.
Also, TTF isn't intended for strength improvement but for hypertrophy.
I train my back very hard every time reaching failure in every set. I also do with partial reps when i can't do more full reps(every set) and also a dropset on the last set. The next day though I hardly feel my back at all and it's as i didn't almost die reaching failure so frequently the previous day. Same goes for my biceps. Does anyone know why that is? I do the movement correctly on every exercise and most of them are isolation ones.
The way I see it training to complete muscle failure yelds the most gains per sessions because while true that you will be going to the gym less due to longer recovery period that longer recovery period will also add to your muscles.
Meaning if you're a wage slave like myself with a loaded schedule and only 2 to 3 occasions to workout per week then training to failure is far more benefitial than having to build your whole life around your gym schedule.
Sure this is all mostly bro science as there are millions of studies that say GO and millions that say NO GO so ultimatly each person needs to experiment and figure out the routine that brings the most optimal results based on goals and expectations
I always go to failure on my last few sets, however on my first 2-4 sets (excluding the warmup set) I almost never reach failure unless u have just added some weight for better progression
The only way training to failure would work is if you traing 3 times a week or something like that where youre recovery would still be fine after 72 hours but if you train like me which ppl 6 times a week you are out of your mind if you think training to failure is a good idea.
Haha, AthleanX just posted a video on training to failure a couple of days ago. Coincidence?
Just got injured on the last set 1 hour ago.
Why did I go for f ing failure.
@@guacamolebolt nah. I got taught the hard way
Lumber Jacks what I did for a while we never went to collapsing failure and have arms better than the failure bull.The only person who can use all out intensity is the Superior Genetic on the Juice .
I do less volume and take all set to faillure and partials and i recover very good between 5 days or 4, doing 4 day split rest and repeat.
Train to failure on your last workout before a deload/holiday!
The only thing stupid in this video is advocating to train less intensely to cause less damage to the body to therefore have to train more days to cause the same level of damage/stimulus you could have caused if you did one day of all out failure. Why would I do more if less yields the same results and lets me enjoy life more? How devolved have we become in the fitness industry to neglect the basic principle that our muscles grow while resting not lifting. FYI (Do not train free weights to failure lol)
Except heavy compond moments training to failure is better
Short answer: no
Long answer: get close but not quite there
More like short answer is yes, but long answer is get close to it. A large majority of lifters actually don't train anywhere near to failure, so using the cue of training until you can't do any more reps is helpful for those cases
@@grimgamer24 facts!! 🙏
Mentzer would like to have a chat.
By this description then actually even 0 RIR is not failure if I get it right, or am I wrong here? I understand that training to failure is not really beneficial except or rarest of cases (like last week before deload, for example) but would 0 RIR/RPE 10 be considered training to failure in this context?
While I understand thus argument, I go twice A week, mostly upper lower spilt but my back isn’t healed yet so mostly upper, if I’m not training to failure I feel like I wasted my time, I did cable tricep push downs until I could only pull it around halfway down, while cheating with my form
Generally, for iso like pushdowns it should be fine but a bit more weary about doing it for compounds. Also, be cautious with back pain and trying to push your limits.
Just train hard
Harder than last time
Sleep more, eat more, increase weight, increase volume if you can't increase weight = guaranteed progress
Unfortunately, only training to failure will make me feel like I'm working hard enough 😪
I swear Everytime you put that girl crying example I burst laughing and rewatch it multiple times 😂😂😂
I think this is the first video I disagree on. While it may be best to go close to failure, I personally have had the best results when actually going till failure. Although the viewers probably like it more when you take a notable stand instead of “it depends”😂
If i don't i feel bad. I'm a glutton for punishment.
Training to failure = No Bueno 👎
Training to Concentric Failure = Bueno 👍
TLDR: train smart aka listen to your body ❤
Hey picture fit I've recently seen dr.rhonda patrick and peter attia talk about protein and he was pushing for 2.2g per pounds of protein I would love your rhoughts on it😊
Trailing one muscle to failure once a week works best for me
Progressive overload is the key.
the bodybuilding crew are so massive on training to failure. But they're also massive on fat stacks of PEDs so they're not taking recovery into the equation as much I guess.
This video sounds like it’s for normal people not fitness people!
PictureFit: "The science is quite consistent in showing that training to failure provides little to no additional gains in both muscle and strength."
Gymbros here in the comments: "iT dEpEndS!!11" or "i TrAiN to fAIlure evErYTimE!111".
Maybe just train to failure once a week?
Idk man... it works so far for me.
What I do is my first 2 sets I do 8 rpe so leave 2 reps and then last set go to failure. The last set sets the benchmark for my reps the next session if my last set goes up the first 2 will go up my next sessio
You're crazy if you think that works like that.
@@GForceIntel work well for my 500+ deadlift and squat and 250 bench 🤷🏽♂️
But if i do push pull legs anyway ehats the problem with needing 72hours to recover?
Yeah I get 24hr of rest 1-2 times a week on ppl and I feel fine
I never train legs to failure... for practical and safety reasons
he just killed jay cutter lmao
0:52 pfft 😂
I usually try to make sure that I'm training hard enough that at least one of my sets on each exercise is to failure. If I'm failing on the first or second set I roll back the weight. Gotta make sure you're trying hard enough.
Yes, but are you bigger than Sam Sulek by not training to failure
When are you going to switch the main character in your videos to me another color other than white?
Training to get my anime physique. Training to go super sayian 😆
Me too
training until injured 😂
He might got good reasons but has he posted his own experience?
Short answer: YES