My experience with several different slipons with the M8, is that particular motor requires more restriction than previous motors to make torque. I have found that once again, your torque inserts are a great compromise to loud/torque on the butt dyno. Huge fan of those things!!
Thank you for these videos that you upload. I just found you today and I'm glad I did! I'm one of the rarer guys who actually prefers quieter exhaust. Perhaps there's a video for you to make on that. Or, maybe you can spell it out. Thank you again, I'm a subscriber NOW!
Thank you, glad you're enjoying the videos. The best quiet performance exhaust is the disc style that Super Trapp came up with many years ago. It is a VERY good exhaust, and close to stock in sound levels.
SuperTrapp disc style exhaust provides the same benefit as the TTI's, but they are a quiet exhaust. The key is no reversion....this gives the power increase and helps them run cooler. Only two ways we know to do that, TTI's (which are louder) or disc style (which is quieter).
Great video! I’ve been told that the M8 in particular loses a lot of bottom end with no restrictions, more so then the twin cam. I’ve ran 103 and now have a 107 but always left them stock.
M8's see about a 10-15% increase in bottom end (low & mid range torque) when the muffler is completely open and TTI's are installed. Here is a report that explains How & Why. www.dkcustomproducts.com/harley-exhaust-myths-and-facts.htm Here are a couple of videos showing M8's with TTI's installed- th-cam.com/video/tOMI3yBz_9w/w-d-xo.html th-cam.com/video/DKaagGXxUzg/w-d-xo.html
Excellent, thanks for being so on point and responding to me, I will definitely be removing baffles and installing your inserts. Did you cut about 1 inch or so? And after the end is cut do the baffles just pull right out?
@@justinsteinley4093 Thanks! I believe you will be pleased with the result. Don't know what bike you have, but if it is not one with saddlebags or a Trike, take a look at the following video for step-by-step. If it is one with bags or a Trike, you can either drill it out, or if you cut off the end, you will want to get some sort of a tip that will extend it out. Non-bagger video- th-cam.com/video/uSC1PBAgZmE/w-d-xo.html In this video of a bagger, you can see a hole saw was used to cut the baffle out- th-cam.com/video/DKaagGXxUzg/w-d-xo.html
I was expecting and looking for some info about the Cat and Catless mods and comments and impressions and facts in this video. Since I like to fiddle and work on my own bike, I made some torque inserts for both my bikes, seems to help both (less on my M8 with after market slip-ons) slightly more on my Road Star aftermarket exhaust (catless) and sound is subjective, but helped with the sound on both.. I also had to make my own a tank lift (only 2cm I could go) since your lowest lift was 1 inch. I put it on my Street Glide.. about the same time I install a fan on my oil cooler.. DId I save some money?..yes, some, but I was able make to my specs and had them completed for next day install.. they turned out nice to.. worth the effort and was stress release and fun to do.
Good deal on your mods! Removing the cat has no significant effect on heat of the engine or power felt. It DOES reduce the amount of felt heat for the rider and passenger.
Say I have a non-OEM set of slip-on mufflers, are you suggesting removing the baffles in an open-baffle aftermarket exhaust prior to installing the TTI’s? Or order them for the diameter of, and install them in, the aftermarket baffle opening? A lot of your products make a lot of sense!
Thanks, glad you're liking them. You can go either way...if you want loud and the most power, remove the baffle and get TTI to match size of the slip-on...probably a 258 unless the inner diameter of your slipon is less than 3". If you want more power, but not so loud, then leave the baffle in and get a TTI to match the inner diameter of the baffle. Here is a link to a cheat sheet chart- www.dkcustomproducts.com/choosing-the-right-size-thunder-torque-inserts.htm
Hey guys I still have stock exhaust on my 2017 triglide question 1 if I pull the baffles out can I use a thunder torque baffles? Question 2 my left side pipe is black in the end tip of the muffler the right looks brand new it looked like that when I bought it with 10,000 miles on it. Love your vids and thanks guys for what y'all do.
Thanks, glad you're enjoying. The factory mufflers do very well when the baffles are removed and replaced by the 258 TTI's. Below are a couple of videos of that being done. th-cam.com/video/cOs1-bTPycU/w-d-xo.html th-cam.com/video/uSC1PBAgZmE/w-d-xo.html
You failed to discuss 2 into 1 exhaust systems and how they effect engine temps and/or Inversion - Have you researched that type of system related to this issue? Or was this all about selling your Thunder torque Inserts?
OR, it was about how a person can cool down their STOCK/OEM set up...also focusing more on the slip-on's than the headers. A good 2 into 1 header will also scavenge better, which will result in a better intake charge, which will help the engine run cooler. They will also produce a bit more power. Then, depending on the slip-on's, if they are straight thru, there is still going to be reversion and the TTI's will help that. We have quite a few Customers that are running the 2-1 Thunderheaders and have gained even more power by using a TTI in them. We have many videos that discuss the entire exhaust system, just one of them is at this link- th-cam.com/video/H681dl2X_f4/w-d-xo.html And we have a playlist with over 100 videos on exhaust in it- th-cam.com/play/PLb3bvZgbH92-y9LGItkUD9O2fFo3-gtVl.html KP
Depending on what stock slip-on's you have, you may be able to drill the plug out in the middle of the baffle so you have a straight thru view from one end of the slip-on to the other. This will give you less restriction, which in theory would reduce heat, but you will now have reversion slowing down the intake charge, which will make the engine work as hard, or harder. The fix for that is some TTI's to stop the reversion. In addition to the explanation in the video you just watched, here is another video, with dyno charts, showing how getting rid of the reversion will help the engine run cooler, and not work as hard. th-cam.com/video/IZWdyax0_9c/w-d-xo.html Here is a written report on Exhaust that you may find useful/interesting - www.dkcustomproducts.com/harley-exhaust-myths-and-facts.htm Thank you for commenting! KP
Yeah, it's a crazy big subject, with 10's of thousands of man-hours spent every year by racing teams to achieve the best combination of zero restriction and zero reversion for maximum charge.
Hi, just found this video, do torque cones at the cylinder head work as good as your TTI's, I'm running a Jekyll & hide 2 into 1 with electronic valve for noise (Project 21) and don't want to drill the pipe to install TTI's, also does a Cat affect power
All the seat of the pants testing and dyno testing of torque cones, installed at the top of the header, provide little to no benefit. The whole principle of the Thunder Torque Inserts™ is to Increase Exhaust Gas Velocity by reducing reversion. The only place that can happen is at the end of the pipes, where the exhaust gasses exit into the atmosphere. Here are a couple of links that you may find useful/interesting www.dkcustomproducts.com/harley-exhaust-myths-and-facts.htm th-cam.com/video/nB0XDQVjH9Y/w-d-xo.html Here is a video on Cat's you may find useful - th-cam.com/video/ks39Gwb3NdI/w-d-xo.html Please feel free to reach out to us with any questions you might have: Support@DKCustomProducts.com 662-252-8828
You do not. The M8 is not too lean, it can adjust for the short shots and still not be too lean. You would get a power increase if you put some Thunder Torque Inserts in the short shots. Here is a video on that subject- th-cam.com/video/oLORhshZcDc/w-d-xo.html Here is a video showing how the ECM works and how it adapts- th-cam.com/video/0vbTkRvFa80/w-d-xo.html
Hey guys! Been buying your sportster parts for over a year now. My bike wouldn’t be the beauty she is today without you guys, we really appreciate y’all. Speaking of the sporty, I just switched over to slip ons to get that Harley sound, and I’m experiencing the low end torque loss right off the bat. Instead of doing the inserts, can I leave her wide open and change out the stock air cleaner? I was looking at your heavy breather system with a filter style catch can. Im thinkin if I opened the air flow as much as I opened the exhaust I should be good, right? Thanks guys
Man, we appreciate your business and are very happy to hear that you are enjoying the mods you've gotten from us. Thank you! 👍 Regarding that drop in power, it is due to the reversion. Having an open air cleaner will not help that. An open air cleaner is good, and getting one will definitely help your bike breathe better, and the 636v is a good choice (that is what I run on my personal Sporty). However, with open exhaust there is no getting around the physics of that exhaust pulse reversing direction when it hits the exit of the slip on. That energy pulse is going to travel back up the pipe and slow down the exhaust gasses exiting the combustion chamber. The only way to stop that is with a TTI. You will be amazed how much of a gain you will get in the low and mid range power when installing that $25 part. Plus you will run a bit cooler AND get better MPG. The only other ways to get rid of that dead spot (lack of low rpm torque) is to use restrictive exhaust (it stops reversion) or use the disc style end cap, (it also stops reversion), but with both of those options one loses the "Harley Sound".
@@Fishfirefoodz I have not measured those slip ons, but if they have a 2" opening, and there are no baffles in them, or they are wide open baffles, then the 158's are the ones for them. Check out this image- www.dkcustomproducts.com/image/Links_2/right%20size%20TTi.jpg And this sizing page- www.dkcustomproducts.com/choosing-the-right-size-thunder-torque-inserts.htm
Another great video! I got a 17 107 freewheeler with the 22x and have done the external jagg oil cooler, air wings, tank lift, mighty mites, and PV tune, but per my PV I’m still running a rear cylinder temp of around 350 at 70 mph and an ET temp of 320 on a 90 degree day (oil temp is great at 210-215 max). I’d do the external breather but I don’t see how with my Arlen Nes big sucker. SO, after seeing this video I’m thinking maybe doing the thunder torques on my CFR’s but have a lots of questions before I start drilling holes. 1) any idea what I MIGHT expect on heat reduction? 2) have you had any experience with thunder torques on CFR’s or similar? 3) My CFR’s are a newer version made after 2006? ... they are straight through but at the small end there is some type of a restricting ‘baffle’ that has an opening of 1.3 inches and has a bunch of curved petal like extrusions all the way around the wall. This seems small to me and was wondering if these new ones are not as ‘free flowing’ as most people think CFRs are. This restriction is probably only about 5 or so inches long and sets back about 20 inches from the opening... then after that it’s just all perforated wall that opens to an inside diameter of 2.7 inches. 4) I would like to use the end cap rivet hole to mount the TTI’s. The rivets are 2 3/4 inches from the opening, will this be set back far enough for the TTI’s? 5) What size TTI’s should I get for an inside dia of 2.7 inches. I guess you can tell that I’m kind of ‘attached’ to the CFR sound and have invested a big chunk of change to just toss them. The bike runs and sounds awesome (25k miles), but I know the heat is robing me of more. Thoughts? Ron
Glad you are enjoying the videos., If your oil temp is still 210-215 after an hour of riding, that is good. We do not use the CHT readout on the PV, that is an algorithm derived number and it can bounce all over the place. We use the ET read out on the PV, that is the actual temperature of the heat sensor embedded in the head and is very stable. I am surprised that the ET is reading 320. Something is not right there...especially if your oil is reading 210-215 after an hour of sustained riding. We make External Breather Systems to work with the AN BS, you can see them at this link- www.dkcustomproducts.com/diy-external-breather-systems-325.htm The EBS will give you a 8-15 degree drop with your AN BS, also give you a stable tune. For the TTI's, use the 158's, and putting them in at the rivets (2.75" from end) is fine
Well I might be the odd one of the bunch but, does anyone make a freeing flowing exhaust that is not overly loud? At 75 years of age I like to hear the sound of my engine and not the headache producing sound of LOUD pipes. Is it possible to get a better running engine and somewhat quite exhaust? Have the M8 114 on my trike and the M8 107 on my lo-rider. Guess I am looking for the best of both worlds.
Great question! 👍 There are a couple of choices. There are a couple of ways to have quieter exhaust and not have it be very loud or have reversion. One way is a disc style muffler. While it works on a different principle than the TTI's, it is the only other style that does not increase restriction a lot, and it does a good job on cutting down reversion. These can be very quiet. I have a friend who runs them on his Street Glide and he always gets teased about riding a Honda...They work well, but are pretty quiet. It is important when you use the disc style end cap (diffuser) that it is not in addition to restrictive baffles. Some manufacturers are doing that, and it makes a good product work much less beneficially. The other is to some mufflers like the High Rollers and use them with TTI's. This is a very deep, mellow sounding muffler, and not too loud and not too much restriction. When using them with the TTI's you get the benefits of reduced reversion, and still have relatively quiet exhaust...NOT as much as the disc style, but here is a video, give it a listen. If it is too loud, then about the only choice is a good disc style. th-cam.com/video/4Iee4zg77KQ/w-d-xo.html
How from the muffler( slip on ) at the end before the end cap but at the end of the baffle do you put something in like torque inserts in at to stop reversion is there a set distance or what’s the optimal distance for this, to achieve optimal performance and all including optimal flow from the exhaust?
Give this a read, I believe it will answer your questions. www.dkcustomproducts.com/media/wysiwyg/exhaust/tti/11-6-19_Thunder_Torque_installation_instructions.pdf 1/2” - 2” from the end.
Good question. The exhaust that has the least restriction and the least reversion will work best. As a general rule that would be a 2-1 pipe. Again, as general rules, the 2-2 would be the worst and the 2-1-2 (which is what most Harley's are) is right in between. But, it all depends on how restrictive the baffles are, and if they are less restrictive, then how much reversion there is.
Yes, they work well in Fishtails, providing a nice bump in low and mid range torque. I am running them in my Softail that has fishtails...you can see/hear them at this link- th-cam.com/video/GuIgK-rc2s4/w-d-xo.html
Thank you for watching and commenting! Yes, that is the purpose of the TTI's. Here is a video you may find interesting- th-cam.com/video/pr6z00gL5Yg/w-d-xo.html
Yes, the will slightly deepen the tone, they will reduce reversion giving you a fuller charge. This will result in a little cooler engine and an increase in low & mid range torque.
@@erikmundell6056 Yes, depending on which ventilator, we have different systems that will work. Write or call us to let us know which you have. Support@DKCustomProducts.com or 662-420-4891
It does not. While it is better than a round opening, reversion of the energy pulse can still travel up the end of a fishtail. I have fishtails on my Softail and did dyno runs with and without baffles and with and without TTI's. Best result was no baffles and 158's. How TTI's work outlined in this report- www.dkcustomproducts.com/harley-exhaust-myths-and-facts.htm
Good question. If you are not going to run any mufflers, then, yes, they can be installed at the tail end of the header. If you are going to run mufflers after the header, the TTI's should be installed near the tail end of the mufflers. The purpose of the TTI's are to reduce reversion, and they should be installed near the point where the exhaust is going to exit into the atmosphere. If they are installed in the end of the header, and then you put mufflers on, the reversion will begin at the end of the muffler and travel all the way up the muffler before hitting the TTI's. Reversion robs power, and while having the TTI's at the end of the header will help, they will not be near as effective.
I have the SE street cannons on my 2020 Harley heritage 114 as I do not like loud pipes anymore. I know this is somewhat restrictive compared to aftermarket pipes, do you think that these are creating a lot of heat compared to the stock exhaust?
Great Question. I have actually been considering the same slip-ons for one of my bikes. They are creating far less heat than the stock exhaust. If you want them to be even a bit deeper sound, and create even less heat, use some TTI's in them. www.dkcustomproducts.com/thunder-torque-inserts-c57-229.htm
Which 2-1, running a baffle or not? A good 2-1, coupled with no baffle and with a TTI, should run a few degrees cooler than a 2-1-2 or a 2-2 that are outfitted the same.
Slip ons Especially on M8's Softails are Better than Most the Full Systems due to No Cat thus breathe/ Cool better and are lighter plus up to %5 more Power,,Sound is Last.. I Strongly Refute Reversion on Long Systems or Stock with Slip ons Due to Consistency of Combustions and Exhaust..When you put your hand on back you Feel the Pressure Exhaust ,, Air Doesn't have Sufficient Power Nor Time to be pulled back into Exhaust ports.. SLIP ONS ALSO PROVIDE SUFFICIENT Back pressure in M8 Softails..
I am not following what you are saying. Are you referring to stock slip-ons or aftermarket slip-ons? If aftermarket, which ones? Regarding reversion, any length exhaust that fits on a Harley is going to have power robbing reversion if it is an open exhaust (no plugs). This is irrefutably shown on a dyno, AND most can feel it in the seat of their pants when riding. As explained in the written report linked below, there is NO scenario where the M8 engine needs back pressure. This is a myth perpetuated by a misunderstanding of what is going on in the exhaust. Back pressure, by its' very definition, is working Against the engine delivering power to the rear wheel. (exhaust does not have to be actually pulled back into the exhaust ports for there to be a degradation in power. The reversion of the exhaust pulse slowing down the exiting exhaust gases is enough to cause a drop in low and mid range power) www.dkcustomproducts.com/harley-exhaust-myths-and-facts.htm
My experience with several different slipons with the M8, is that particular motor requires more restriction than previous motors to make torque. I have found that once again, your torque inserts are a great compromise to loud/torque on the butt dyno. Huge fan of those things!!
Good to read that your liking them! 👍
Thank you for these videos that you upload. I just found you today and I'm glad I did!
I'm one of the rarer guys who actually prefers quieter exhaust. Perhaps there's a video for you to make on that.
Or, maybe you can spell it out. Thank you again, I'm a subscriber NOW!
Thank you, glad you're enjoying the videos.
The best quiet performance exhaust is the disc style that Super Trapp came up with many years ago. It is a VERY good exhaust, and close to stock in sound levels.
Thank you for the InFo
I don't like loud pipes, what can I do?
SuperTrapp disc style exhaust provides the same benefit as the TTI's, but they are a quiet exhaust. The key is no reversion....this gives the power increase and helps them run cooler. Only two ways we know to do that, TTI's (which are louder) or disc style (which is quieter).
Great video! I’ve been told that the M8 in particular loses a lot of bottom end with no restrictions, more so then the twin cam. I’ve ran 103 and now have a 107 but always left them stock.
M8's see about a 10-15% increase in bottom end (low & mid range torque) when the muffler is completely open and TTI's are installed. Here is a report that explains How & Why.
www.dkcustomproducts.com/harley-exhaust-myths-and-facts.htm
Here are a couple of videos showing M8's with TTI's installed-
th-cam.com/video/tOMI3yBz_9w/w-d-xo.html
th-cam.com/video/DKaagGXxUzg/w-d-xo.html
Excellent, thanks for being so on point and responding to me, I will definitely be removing baffles and installing your inserts. Did you cut about 1 inch or so? And after the end is cut do the baffles just pull right out?
@@justinsteinley4093 Thanks! I believe you will be pleased with the result. Don't know what bike you have, but if it is not one with saddlebags or a Trike, take a look at the following video for step-by-step. If it is one with bags or a Trike, you can either drill it out, or if you cut off the end, you will want to get some sort of a tip that will extend it out.
Non-bagger video- th-cam.com/video/uSC1PBAgZmE/w-d-xo.html
In this video of a bagger, you can see a hole saw was used to cut the baffle out- th-cam.com/video/DKaagGXxUzg/w-d-xo.html
I was expecting and looking for some info about the Cat and Catless mods and comments and impressions and facts in this video. Since I like to fiddle and work on my own bike, I made some torque inserts for both my bikes, seems to help both (less on my M8 with after market slip-ons) slightly more on my Road Star aftermarket exhaust (catless) and sound is subjective, but helped with the sound on both.. I also had to make my own a tank lift (only 2cm I could go) since your lowest lift was 1 inch. I put it on my Street Glide.. about the same time I install a fan on my oil cooler.. DId I save some money?..yes, some, but I was able make to my specs and had them completed for next day install.. they turned out nice to.. worth the effort and was stress release and fun to do.
Good deal on your mods!
Removing the cat has no significant effect on heat of the engine or power felt. It DOES reduce the amount of felt heat for the rider and passenger.
Say I have a non-OEM set of slip-on mufflers, are you suggesting removing the baffles in an open-baffle aftermarket exhaust prior to installing the TTI’s? Or order them for the diameter of, and install them in, the aftermarket baffle opening?
A lot of your products make a lot of sense!
Thanks, glad you're liking them.
You can go either way...if you want loud and the most power, remove the baffle and get TTI to match size of the slip-on...probably a 258 unless the inner diameter of your slipon is less than 3".
If you want more power, but not so loud, then leave the baffle in and get a TTI to match the inner diameter of the baffle. Here is a link to a cheat sheet chart-
www.dkcustomproducts.com/choosing-the-right-size-thunder-torque-inserts.htm
Hey guys I still have stock exhaust on my 2017 triglide question 1 if I pull the baffles out can I use a thunder torque baffles? Question 2 my left side pipe is black in the end tip of the muffler the right looks brand new it looked like that when I bought it with 10,000 miles on it. Love your vids and thanks guys for what y'all do.
Thanks, glad you're enjoying.
The factory mufflers do very well when the baffles are removed and replaced by the 258 TTI's. Below are a couple of videos of that being done.
th-cam.com/video/cOs1-bTPycU/w-d-xo.html
th-cam.com/video/uSC1PBAgZmE/w-d-xo.html
@Steve Cohick Good to hear....amazing how those little things do such a great job.
You failed to discuss 2 into 1 exhaust systems and how they effect engine temps and/or Inversion - Have you researched that type of system related to this issue? Or was this all about selling your Thunder torque Inserts?
OR, it was about how a person can cool down their STOCK/OEM set up...also focusing more on the slip-on's than the headers.
A good 2 into 1 header will also scavenge better, which will result in a better intake charge, which will help the engine run cooler. They will also produce a bit more power.
Then, depending on the slip-on's, if they are straight thru, there is still going to be reversion and the TTI's will help that.
We have quite a few Customers that are running the 2-1 Thunderheaders and have gained even more power by using a TTI in them.
We have many videos that discuss the entire exhaust system, just one of them is at this link- th-cam.com/video/H681dl2X_f4/w-d-xo.html
And we have a playlist with over 100 videos on exhaust in it- th-cam.com/play/PLb3bvZgbH92-y9LGItkUD9O2fFo3-gtVl.html
KP
Just pulled danmoto baffle and installed a 258 with a bassani end cap...
Very cool. 👍
Can I drill holes in my stock slip on baffles to help make my motor run cooler and to make my motor not run harder
Depending on what stock slip-on's you have, you may be able to drill the plug out in the middle of the baffle so you have a straight thru view from one end of the slip-on to the other.
This will give you less restriction, which in theory would reduce heat, but you will now have reversion slowing down the intake charge, which will make the engine work as hard, or harder.
The fix for that is some TTI's to stop the reversion.
In addition to the explanation in the video you just watched, here is another video, with dyno charts, showing how getting rid of the reversion will help the engine run cooler, and not work as hard.
th-cam.com/video/IZWdyax0_9c/w-d-xo.html
Here is a written report on Exhaust that you may find useful/interesting - www.dkcustomproducts.com/harley-exhaust-myths-and-facts.htm
Thank you for commenting! KP
Very interesting, thank you.
Yeah, it's a crazy big subject, with 10's of thousands of man-hours spent every year by racing teams to achieve the best combination of zero restriction and zero reversion for maximum charge.
Hi, just found this video, do torque cones at the cylinder head work as good as your TTI's, I'm running a Jekyll & hide 2 into 1 with electronic valve for noise (Project 21) and don't want to drill the pipe to install TTI's, also does a Cat affect power
All the seat of the pants testing and dyno testing of torque cones, installed at the top of the header, provide little to no benefit.
The whole principle of the Thunder Torque Inserts™ is to Increase Exhaust Gas Velocity by reducing reversion. The only place that can happen is at the end of the pipes, where the exhaust gasses exit into the atmosphere.
Here are a couple of links that you may find useful/interesting
www.dkcustomproducts.com/harley-exhaust-myths-and-facts.htm
th-cam.com/video/nB0XDQVjH9Y/w-d-xo.html
Here is a video on Cat's you may find useful - th-cam.com/video/ks39Gwb3NdI/w-d-xo.html
Please feel free to reach out to us with any questions you might have:
Support@DKCustomProducts.com
662-252-8828
Awesome vid! Quick question: I just bought a 2019 street bob (M8) and ordered some v&h short shots. Do I need a tune and an air cleaner? Thank you
You do not. The M8 is not too lean, it can adjust for the short shots and still not be too lean. You would get a power increase if you put some Thunder Torque Inserts in the short shots. Here is a video on that subject- th-cam.com/video/oLORhshZcDc/w-d-xo.html
Here is a video showing how the ECM works and how it adapts- th-cam.com/video/0vbTkRvFa80/w-d-xo.html
@@DKCustomProducts wow! Thanks so much. Definitely gonna check out those thunder torque inserts 💯
@@vaughn6sl697 Good deal man, I'm confident you'll be pleased with the improved torque & tone. Thanks for watching, ride safe!
Hey guys! Been buying your sportster parts for over a year now. My bike wouldn’t be the beauty she is today without you guys, we really appreciate y’all. Speaking of the sporty, I just switched over to slip ons to get that Harley sound, and I’m experiencing the low end torque loss right off the bat. Instead of doing the inserts, can I leave her wide open and change out the stock air cleaner? I was looking at your heavy breather system with a filter style catch can. Im thinkin if I opened the air flow as much as I opened the exhaust I should be good, right? Thanks guys
Man, we appreciate your business and are very happy to hear that you are enjoying the mods you've gotten from us. Thank you! 👍
Regarding that drop in power, it is due to the reversion. Having an open air cleaner will not help that. An open air cleaner is good, and getting one will definitely help your bike breathe better, and the 636v is a good choice (that is what I run on my personal Sporty).
However, with open exhaust there is no getting around the physics of that exhaust pulse reversing direction when it hits the exit of the slip on. That energy pulse is going to travel back up the pipe and slow down the exhaust gasses exiting the combustion chamber. The only way to stop that is with a TTI. You will be amazed how much of a gain you will get in the low and mid range power when installing that $25 part. Plus you will run a bit cooler AND get better MPG.
The only other ways to get rid of that dead spot (lack of low rpm torque) is to use restrictive exhaust (it stops reversion) or use the disc style end cap, (it also stops reversion), but with both of those options one loses the "Harley Sound".
DKCustomProducts after checking out your options for the tti inserts, would you recommend the 158 for 2” Wyatt Gatling slip ons?
@@Fishfirefoodz I have not measured those slip ons, but if they have a 2" opening, and there are no baffles in them, or they are wide open baffles, then the 158's are the ones for them. Check out this image- www.dkcustomproducts.com/image/Links_2/right%20size%20TTi.jpg
And this sizing page- www.dkcustomproducts.com/choosing-the-right-size-thunder-torque-inserts.htm
Another great video! I got a 17 107 freewheeler with the 22x and have done the external jagg oil cooler, air wings, tank lift, mighty mites, and PV tune, but per my PV I’m still running a rear cylinder temp of around 350 at 70 mph and an ET temp of 320 on a 90 degree day (oil temp is great at 210-215 max). I’d do the external breather but I don’t see how with my Arlen Nes big sucker. SO, after seeing this video I’m thinking maybe doing the thunder torques on my CFR’s but have a lots of questions before I start drilling holes. 1) any idea what I MIGHT expect on heat reduction? 2) have you had any experience with thunder torques on CFR’s or similar? 3) My CFR’s are a newer version made after 2006? ... they are straight through but at the small end there is some type of a restricting ‘baffle’ that has an opening of 1.3 inches and has a bunch of curved petal like extrusions all the way around the wall.
This seems small to me and was wondering if these new ones are not as ‘free flowing’ as most people think CFRs are. This restriction is probably only about 5 or so inches long and sets back about 20 inches from the opening... then after that it’s just all perforated wall that opens to an inside diameter of 2.7 inches. 4) I would like to use the end cap rivet hole to mount the TTI’s. The rivets are 2 3/4 inches from the opening, will this be set back far enough for the TTI’s? 5) What size TTI’s should I get for an inside dia of 2.7 inches. I guess you can tell that I’m kind of ‘attached’ to the CFR sound and have invested a big chunk of change to just toss them. The bike runs and sounds awesome (25k miles), but I know the heat is robing me of more. Thoughts? Ron
Glad you are enjoying the videos.,
If your oil temp is still 210-215 after an hour of riding, that is good.
We do not use the CHT readout on the PV, that is an algorithm derived number and it can bounce all over the place. We use the ET read out on the PV, that is the actual temperature of the heat sensor embedded in the head and is very stable. I am surprised that the ET is reading 320. Something is not right there...especially if your oil is reading 210-215 after an hour of sustained riding.
We make External Breather Systems to work with the AN BS, you can see them at this link- www.dkcustomproducts.com/diy-external-breather-systems-325.htm
The EBS will give you a 8-15 degree drop with your AN BS, also give you a stable tune.
For the TTI's, use the 158's, and putting them in at the rivets (2.75" from end) is fine
Alright TTI it is!
👍
Well I might be the odd one of the bunch but, does anyone make a freeing flowing exhaust that is not overly loud? At 75 years of age I like to hear the sound of my engine and not the headache producing sound of LOUD pipes. Is it possible to get a better running engine and somewhat quite exhaust? Have the M8 114 on my trike and the M8 107 on my lo-rider. Guess I am looking for the best of both worlds.
Great question! 👍 There are a couple of choices. There are a couple of ways to have quieter exhaust and not have it be very loud or have reversion.
One way is a disc style muffler. While it works on a different principle than the TTI's, it is the only other style that does not increase restriction a lot, and it does a good job on cutting down reversion. These can be very quiet. I have a friend who runs them on his Street Glide and he always gets teased about riding a Honda...They work well, but are pretty quiet. It is important when you use the disc style end cap (diffuser) that it is not in addition to restrictive baffles. Some manufacturers are doing that, and it makes a good product work much less beneficially.
The other is to some mufflers like the High Rollers and use them with TTI's. This is a very deep, mellow sounding muffler, and not too loud and not too much restriction. When using them with the TTI's you get the benefits of reduced reversion, and still have relatively quiet exhaust...NOT as much as the disc style, but here is a video, give it a listen. If it is too loud, then about the only choice is a good disc style.
th-cam.com/video/4Iee4zg77KQ/w-d-xo.html
Can u add torque inserts in fish fin exhaust??
Thunder Torque Inserts can be used on Fishtail exhaust. I have them in mine, you can hear them in this video- th-cam.com/video/GuIgK-rc2s4/w-d-xo.html
How from the muffler( slip on ) at the end before the end cap but at the end of the baffle do you put something in like torque inserts in at to stop reversion is there a set distance or what’s the optimal distance for this, to achieve optimal performance and all including optimal flow from the exhaust?
Give this a read, I believe it will answer your questions. www.dkcustomproducts.com/media/wysiwyg/exhaust/tti/11-6-19_Thunder_Torque_installation_instructions.pdf
1/2” - 2” from the end.
2 into 2 vs 2 into 1 does one cool down the motor better then the other?
Good question. The exhaust that has the least restriction and the least reversion will work best. As a general rule that would be a 2-1 pipe. Again, as general rules, the 2-2 would be the worst and the 2-1-2 (which is what most Harley's are) is right in between. But, it all depends on how restrictive the baffles are, and if they are less restrictive, then how much reversion there is.
Well the thunder torque inserts work, and or needed for fishtail exhaust?
Yes, they work well in Fishtails, providing a nice bump in low and mid range torque. I am running them in my Softail that has fishtails...you can see/hear them at this link- th-cam.com/video/GuIgK-rc2s4/w-d-xo.html
What would happen if I remove my baffle and add TTI? Would that eliminate reversion?
Thank you for watching and commenting!
Yes, that is the purpose of the TTI's.
Here is a video you may find interesting-
th-cam.com/video/pr6z00gL5Yg/w-d-xo.html
So. A blower, like a Detroit Diesel, is the answer?
These are the answers- www.dkcustomproducts.com/why-how-to-cool-down-the-twin-cam-engine-part-i-dk-cl-tc-dn-1.htm
Love the way the TTI's Made my 07 flhrs sound!
Good to hear you're enjoying. 👍
I have 17 road glide with billet cat 2 into 1 exhaust with big bore baffle. Will torque inserts help with this exhaust
Yes, the will slightly deepen the tone, they will reduce reversion giving you a fuller charge. This will result in a little cooler engine and an increase in low & mid range torque.
@@DKCustomProducts also. I have the screaming eagle ventilator. Will I be able to put your external breather system on this
@@erikmundell6056 Yes, depending on which ventilator, we have different systems that will work. Write or call us to let us know which you have. Support@DKCustomProducts.com or 662-420-4891
I have a set of V&H fishtails that appear to have the quiet baffle in them. Does this capped style baffle work in the same way as your TTI's ?
It does not. While it is better than a round opening, reversion of the energy pulse can still travel up the end of a fishtail. I have fishtails on my Softail and did dyno runs with and without baffles and with and without TTI's. Best result was no baffles and 158's.
How TTI's work outlined in this report- www.dkcustomproducts.com/harley-exhaust-myths-and-facts.htm
@@DKCustomProducts Thanks
Can the insert be installed at the end of the factory header after the header has been De-Cat?
Good question. If you are not going to run any mufflers, then, yes, they can be installed at the tail end of the header.
If you are going to run mufflers after the header, the TTI's should be installed near the tail end of the mufflers.
The purpose of the TTI's are to reduce reversion, and they should be installed near the point where the exhaust is going to exit into the atmosphere.
If they are installed in the end of the header, and then you put mufflers on, the reversion will begin at the end of the muffler and travel all the way up the muffler before hitting the TTI's. Reversion robs power, and while having the TTI's at the end of the header will help, they will not be near as effective.
I have the SE street cannons on my 2020 Harley heritage 114 as I do not like loud pipes anymore. I know this is somewhat restrictive compared to aftermarket pipes, do you think that these are creating a lot of heat compared to the stock exhaust?
Great Question. I have actually been considering the same slip-ons for one of my bikes. They are creating far less heat than the stock exhaust. If you want them to be even a bit deeper sound, and create even less heat, use some TTI's in them.
www.dkcustomproducts.com/thunder-torque-inserts-c57-229.htm
Thunderheader rules
A ton of folks like the Thunderheader. They respond really well to the TTI's also.
will a 2 into 1 exhaust cool a 96 down?
Which 2-1, running a baffle or not?
A good 2-1, coupled with no baffle and with a TTI, should run a few degrees cooler than a 2-1-2 or a 2-2 that are outfitted the same.
@@DKCustomProducts Rinehart
@@DKCustomProducts ever since I put xied on my bike the right pipe is turning yellow
Slip ons Especially on M8's Softails are Better than Most the Full Systems due to No Cat thus breathe/ Cool better and are lighter plus up to %5 more Power,,Sound is Last.. I Strongly Refute Reversion on Long Systems or Stock with Slip ons Due to Consistency of Combustions and Exhaust..When you put your hand on back you Feel the Pressure Exhaust ,, Air Doesn't have Sufficient Power Nor Time to be pulled back into Exhaust ports.. SLIP ONS ALSO PROVIDE SUFFICIENT Back pressure in M8 Softails..
I am not following what you are saying. Are you referring to stock slip-ons or aftermarket slip-ons? If aftermarket, which ones?
Regarding reversion, any length exhaust that fits on a Harley is going to have power robbing reversion if it is an open exhaust (no plugs). This is irrefutably shown on a dyno, AND most can feel it in the seat of their pants when riding. As explained in the written report linked below, there is NO scenario where the M8 engine needs back pressure. This is a myth perpetuated by a misunderstanding of what is going on in the exhaust. Back pressure, by its' very definition, is working Against the engine delivering power to the rear wheel.
(exhaust does not have to be actually pulled back into the exhaust ports for there to be a degradation in power. The reversion of the exhaust pulse slowing down the exiting exhaust gases is enough to cause a drop in low and mid range power)
www.dkcustomproducts.com/harley-exhaust-myths-and-facts.htm
Do you still get reversion on a 2-1-2 exhaust
Absolutely. reversion occurs at the very end of the muffler, whether 2-1-2, 2 into 1, or straight pipes.