Sonic 3 / Sonic Mania - Hydrocity Zone | Reacting To Video Game Music!
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 26 เม.ย. 2024
- Thanks to HuskyByTheGeek for the request!
If you'd like to make a priority request or support the channel, check out the links below!
/ jessesauditorium
www.paypal.com/paypalme/JAreq...
linktr.ee/Unclejesse
/ heyunclejesse
#Sonic3 #SonicMania #Reaction - เกม
Hydrocity is iconic, thanks for the react !
Tee Lopes is a legend, he elevated the track in Sonic Mania.
Oh hey, welcome to the Auditorium community, Husky!
Hydrocity Act 1 he did a good job
Act 2 he messed up imo, it's too pretty and the lead melody especially just doesn't pierce you the same way the original does
But it's impossible to improve the original Hydrocity Act 2, the GOAT VG track
0:20 "Is it Hydro-city or Hydrocity?"
Little did Jesse know that this is one of the oldest but most fiercest arguments of the Sonic community to this day lol.
I don't understand how it's even an argument - everyone knows it's pronounced Hid-rocket-ee
Funny thing is I remember Megamind doing this to with Metrocity.
It literally is a ruined city underwater. Why wouldn't it be Hydro-city?
@@ShritistrangIt's not a city at all, there's nothing about it that even resembles one, it just looks like an abandoned temple.
It's a water zone (Hydro) with the gimmick being boosters and slides making you go fast unlike other water zones (Velocity).
Hence Hydro + Velocity = Hydrocity.
Due to how the other zones are titled, I’m positive it is Hydro-City. There are other zones in which their title, akin to Hydrocity, that aren’t visually separated like Sandopolis and Doomsday, but everyone pronounces the latter as Dooms-Day and with the former a Polis is a city state in Greece and the Sand part speaks for itself. Funnily enough it’s a sand city similar to how Hydrocity is a water city. That being said if anyone genuinely prefers to pronounce it (Hi-Draw-Si-Tee) you’re fine in doing so.
Hydrocity really feels so essential to Sonic as a whole. Being one of the only water levels people like in this franchise makes it carry the weight of water levels as a whole and It's one of the first tracks I think of in this game.
One of the best zones in the franchise
Aquarium Park is up there as an actually fun water level with stellar music too
Exactly! As good as Frontiers metalcore music is, to me Sonic's musical identity as a whole recides in syncopated rhythms, complex chords and new jack swing grooves and instruments.
@@BHox01 that's the next one I think of when water levels get brought up
Mostly because Hydrocity's mandatory water sections are very short while the rest can be skipped outright by running over the water. It's kinda similar to Chemical Plant in that it's essentially a boost park with very few notable water sections if any. Kind of understandable as water slows down momentum so it's usually counter productive to Sonic's gameplay to include it at all. They're good water levels because they go out of their way to not really include a lot of water
To answer your question about the composers, the guy from the first two games had his own band and after splitting his time between it and Sonic 1 and 2, when it came to 3, he asked for more money, Sega declined, and they went their separate ways on good terms.
And yes, Sonic 3 was when they gave each act its own track, which is funny since the acts flow into each other and never have a fade to black transition like before.
til
Hydrocity 2 is a certified top 5 BANGER of all TIME
About the MJ rumors. I think it was ultimately decided that Brad Buxer wrote a lot of Sonic 3's music uncredited. Also, the song you're thinking of is indeed Angel Island zone from Sonic 3. So the other thing is, the story behind Sonic Mania is that these people made fan-games for Sonic for years. Eventually, they get discovered by Sega and Sega's like "ok do it for real"
MJ did kinda work on the game but it was actually Brad Buxer who worked with MJ. Only problem with that is the rights for the tracks he worked on is a mess and SEGA doesnt wanna deal with that so thats why Origins uses different music for certain zones which are actually the original versions before they got replaced, however they sound worse because Jun Senoue doesnt really know how to make genesis music properly anymore .
It’s why I didn’t get Origins. The music that was replaced like Icecap Zone is some of the best music from those games, half the reason I replay them. It’s so stupid long term to ruin these osts.
To be honest, Jun Senoue was never that good at Genesis music. Fans overcredit him for Sonic 3 and Sonic 3D Blast but on 3 he only did the Bonus Stage music and the Continue music and for Sonic 3D Blast he did less than half of the soundtrack and his tracks aren't the ones people usually pick as their favorites (Though he did Green Grove and that's pretty good). His Genesis music has always been overly reliant on drums and cat synths. Jun is at his best when he has a guitar.
The Origins replacement tracks sound like that because they are from a prototype that predates the November 1993 one, so they are probaly in a very early production state in relation to how they sound. The "Jun Senoue was working on them" claim is likely a miscommunication from Katie.
@@BoredSquidward I know, still sounds like dog shit imo
@@Argorox Jun's melodies are on point, if you take his synths away and redo the music with modern soundfonts, they sound fantastic. He just has such a weird preference for that awful chunky soundfont he's been using since Sonic 4 and it makes what would otherwise be banger tracks sound awful. A few youtubers have done remakes with different instruments and they're mostly fire.
Sonic 3 and sonic and knuckles were kind of developed in tandem, that's why you could "plug" sonic 3 into sonic and knuckles. And it'd let you play the span of the levels of both and play as knuckles if you wanted.
The treatment of 2 different songs for the acts started here. Normally act 1 and 2 you'd just pass a check point and then you'd be in the next level but starting in this game they give you a little more context. The first level of sonic 3 is that beachy theme you know, but after you beat the boss of act 1, it sets fire to the stage and you hear a different track. Act 1 of hydro city you fall from the beach into it, and if you work hard you can stay out of the drink for a pretty long time, but in act 2 after you beat the boss, knuckles just flushes you into the water and you're gonna deal with it no matter what, so it probably sounds more aquatic because of that.
I like the tradition of acts having different music, especially something lava reef where act 1 is on absolute fire and act 2 the lava cools and it mellows out and turns crystalline, it's great
I just looked it up and it's only the 2nd level lmao.
Guess I didn't experience S3 at all really.
@@JessesAuditorium3&Knuckles and Mania are the two best Sonic games (3 and Knuckles are the same game split into two cartridges). You should play one someday, they're hella fun, Mania especially is very accessible
Actually, the zone gets set on fire halfway through act 1 in terms of act cards, but after Fire Breath flees before that 255 HP can be reduced to 0, it technically becomes act 2, hence why entering a special or bonus stage in certain releases after that cutscene changes the music to fit the new background. Beating Fire Breath by landing the 6 HP it has at the end of "act 1.5" does take you into act 2 proper, however.
Hydrocity act 1 music may not sound like a typical water level, but it sure sounds like a song from a level where you're having fun at waterslides
Hydrocity Zone Act 2 is probably my top song from the classic Sonic trilogy, but that's not easy to say when it's surrounded by so many other outstanding tracks. Act 1 is also good, but something about Act 2 just hits in all the right ways. I watched Tee Lopes play Sonic Mania at some point after it's release, and it was really cool to hear him comment on his work for the game, creating the new tracks and remixing the old ones. His approach for the game in regards to the remixes of old stages was keep Act 1 extremely faithful, and remix the Act 2 songs a bit more. When it came to Hydrocity Zone, he mentioned he believed Act 2 was already so perfect that there wasn't really much he could do to it to make it better in his eyes, so it ended up similar to the Act 1 versions- extremely faithful, with a cleaner, updated sound.
I had no idea you didn't play all of Sonic 3 and Sonic and Knuckles, Jesse. Had I known I probably would've requested almost every song from these games already lol. Oh, and in regards to how Hydrocity is pronounced, it's offically pronounced as "Hydro City", even though it's written as one word. But the debate will probably never end, even with official confirmation 😆
Where can I find the Tee Lopes playthrough you mentioned? That sounds really cool!
@@graysongdl Sadly he doesn't seem to have the playthrough up on his channel anymore. I did a search for it a couple days ago, as I was hoping to rewatch it myself.
16:40 Tee Lopes was in fact hired by Sonic Team because he *is* a huge Sonic fan. In fact, before he was hired by SEGA he was the leas music composer for a fan project called Sonic 2 HD.
Oh yeah, Sonic 3 introduced the elemental shields that provided immunities to specific hazards and also gave Sonic specifically special abilities. Without them, he just had the insta-shield which was basically a second attack that could hit through hazards that the regular ball form would take damage from.
Sonic 3 was the first one I remember having different versions for different acts.
Also Brad Buxxer was credited in Sonic 3
The stage that goes on fire in act 1 is Angel Island Zone. It's the first stage in the game. Sonic 3 & Knuckles is one game that was released in two pieces you need to connect together fully play, and it's in the Sonic 3 half of that game. (Both halves, Sonic 3 & Sonic & Knuckles, can be played separately, but it's more of a complete game when they're combined.) Hydrocity Zone is the next zone after that one.
There's music in Sonic 3 & Knuckles from Michael Jackson and other artists. MJ was identified first because of a sound in one of the tracks that sounds similar to one of his common verbal things he does in his music. They didn't like how the music sounded on the Sega Genesis so they pulled out of the project, but had created music for it, so that music was used. The artists that created that music later reused some of it in several songs they released later, making it easier to find those similar segments later on.
For Hydrocity Zone, people have identified overlaps with Michael Jackson's "Work That Body" and Mike Mareen's "Heavy Water".
There's no space between "Hydro-" & "-city" in Hydrocity Zone's name, so I pronounce it "Hydrocity", but both pronunciations are officially correct according to Sega.
Somic 3 introduced two major things. Knuckles as a playable character and elemental shields. Instead of the normal shield you get lightning that gives you a double jump, fire that gives you a horizontal burst you can trigger while in air and bubble that allows you breath underwater and you can trigger a bounce.
As for the water thing, in Sonic 3 when playing as Knuckles or Tails you can almost entirely avoid water while still being just above the surface as each character has different routes through the level available to them. Act 2 flips that and is far more underwater and forced to be in the water.
I’ve probably spent more time in this level than any other Sonic level, and this song is burned into my mind in the best way. As far as sounding like water, the “horn” falls that pop up in the melody feel like water cascading, to me any way.
Got a certain C&C vid coming tomorrow nudge.
Hydrocity Act 2 is so... Damn GOOD.
The first level in Sonic 3 is Angel Island and is the steel pan you are thinking of with the burning stage.
ALSO! Icecap Zone's theme is a flat out cover of "Hard Times" by The Jetzons
Hearing you listen to Dire Dire Docks and Aquatic Ambience, two of my favorite tracks from their respective games, for the first time and then going to these songs really made me realize how incredible water level music is in games, especially platformer games. Very excited for the VGM vibes video you’re compiling, loved the last two.
I've never clicked so fast in a video before
Regarding what you were asking about Tee Lopes, he's been doing sonic covers and recreations for years prior to sonic mania, actually sonic mania was made almost purely by the fans. Main programmer Christian Whitehead has been doing sonic fan games a long time before sonic mania even was a thought, he helped sega port Sonic 1, CD and 2 to IOS and android at the start of the 2010's, to this day most people praise those as the best versions to play those games officially. Sonic mania was a passion project made with love, even the opening movie was led by Tyson Hesse, one of the main people behing the sonic Archie comics.
I don't know off the top of my head who composed the Hydrocity Zone theme, but I'm pretty sure the arranger of Act 2 was Masayuki Nagao, who was also a composer for Shinobi III, another amazing Sega soundtrack
The situation with Sonic 3&K's music is very messy. MJ and his team(MJ, Bobby Brooks, Scirocco, Brad Buxer, Doug Gribsy III(died a few years ago) etc.) originally composed 41 tracks(you can check this on an article by hufftingtonpost, one of the composers even says the music was composed high-profile and he still has all the demo tapes) and mailed them to Sega in August 1993. It's very unclear what happened after that but because of a McDonalds tie-in Sega had to split Sonic 3 in 2 parts(Sonic 3 and Sonic & Knuckles) and ultimately only 10 of those 41 tracks made it to Sonic 3(Part 1) and none of them to Sonic & Knuckles which came out 8 months later. These 10 tracks were as follows: Knuckles theme(Sonic 3 ver),Miniboss(Sonic 3 ver), Carnival Night 1, Carnival Night 2(both tracks sample MJ's song Jam), Ice Cap 1, Ice Cap 2(Brad Buxer based it on ''Hard Times'' an unreleased song he composed in 1982 when he was the keyboard player of The Jetzons), Launch Base 1, Launch Base 2, Competition Select and the Sonic 3 Credits theme(prototype for ''Stranger in Moscow'', Brad Buxer claims to have done everything for this song but I have some doubts on his story... whatever).
Some of these songs would get overwritten when locked on to Sonic & Knuckles with lock-on technology.
Nowadays because of legal reasons Sega can no longer use these tracks in Sonic 3 remasters so they replaced them with inferior beta tracks.
The Insta-Shield also slightly extends Sonics range of attack when used, not just a an "oh shit!" protection. It can make the final boss in Sonic 3 a lot more safer because you can hit him while being further back.
Big Arm killed me so much until i started using that, beating him at last as a kid felt amazing, especially with the music still playing as the Death Egg fell in the background.
3:50 By the time Sonic 2 started development, Masato Nakumara started a band called Dreams Come True. Sonic Team wanted to bring him back for 3, but Masato wanted some sort of royalties contract? Either way, Sonic Team and Masato parted ways and that's why Sonic 3 & Knuckles has such a huge list of composers.
Also, the first stage of Sonic 3 is called Angel Island Zone.
The Sonic 3 Ice Cap Zone music is more or less the song Hard Times (Happiest Days of My Life.) MJ and Brad Buxer did a lot of work without credit and at the time Hard Times went unused as his record label would not print it so the man more or less slipped it into Sonic 3. So if you ever give Ice Cap Zone music a try also sample a bit of Hard Times and you can easily hear that he used his own music.
The water in Sonic 1 and 2 was so hated, it was *really* impressive that Sonic 3 has _even more water_ in it and it's *never* as frustrating as the first two games.
Funny you should mention the sense of speed in Act 2, since Sonic goes through the level so fast that he ends up running on the surface of the water. This was the first time we saw him do this. Then when this level comes back in Sonic Mania, he runs on water so fast that even the camera can't keep up with him😅
Act 1 is KINDA slow and spooky because you get dumped down here by knuckles so the level starts really slow, and it feels like Act 2 is a WATER SLIDE or park or something (Which you mentioned right after I posted this ARRGHHH) rather than a level underwater. You spend MOST of it running on top of the water if you can keep your speed up and it feels SO GOOD because the hook happens right as you get out of the water and start running across it for the first time.
It was MAGICAL at the time. Just WOWO and Sonic Mania made it even more ridiculous!
I just wish they had remixed Toxic Caves and Ice Cap for Mania, but Tee absolutely blew that entire soundtrack out of the water.
Next up, compare Chemical Plant remixes..!!
This absolutely one of my favorite themes for Sonic games. I literally have zone 2 of this as my ringtone right now lol 😂 There’s actually A LOT of lore to dig into when it comes to the Sonic 3 OST. Apparently Michael Jackson worked on quite a bit if not the whole OST but because of the allegations he cut ties but if you listen to the ending credits for Sonic 3 it’s actually Michael Jackson’s Stranger In Moscow song. I can recommend videos if you’re interested.
Hahaha Sonic drowning music is really something you won't forget LOL
There actually is no debate, anymore. Micheal Jackson absolutely did contribute sections of the soundtrack, and members of his band and musical composers that assisted him on his albums and played with him during concerts like Brad Buxler wrote other songs on it. It's long since been confirmed these days.
The act 2 theme is so good I kinda forget that most of the level is just mindless speed sections
I was sleeping duing this one, but Husky gave you a REAL good choice. This one is actually insanely good. When I get a chance we've got to do a deep dive into some of the past ones. To see your growth over the last little while is insane but the vibes are as immaculate as the day you began.
You want some suggestions for aquatic level themes for that upcoming video. While this is probably the most beloved water level in classic Sonic, Tidal Tempest Present from the JAPANESE Sonic CD soundtrack is considered by many to be the best water level music track in Sonic history. In my opinion, it's the greatest water level music in gaming history.
Michael Jackson *_DID_* work on the Sonic 3 OST. That's confirmed fact. He even went on to use certain rhythms, drum lines and bass lines - or entire melodies - in songs of his.
Oh yeah sorry for enthusiastically posting like 5 comments but: One thing I found interesting is I think all of the music for Sonic 1 and 2 is technically still owned by Nakamura, which is why they so rarely use any of it in newer games. They do like to use Green Hill and Chemical Plant, but that's really kind of it.
The first stage is called Angel Island Zone, both acts are iconic bangers
The bridge for Hydrocity Act 2 is the single most Michael Jackson-sounding part of the soundtrack, IMO. Like, if you close your eyes, you can easily imagine him singing something to that exact tune. It just sounds right.
What about Launch Base? That song is MJ as fuck.
I highly recommend playing Sonic Mania. I was always a Nintendo and Mario guy, and I even enjoyed playing the old Sonic games on emulators, but when Sonic Mania released (on the Switch) and I played through it, I fell in love with Sonic (and Sonic music). It honestly was my game of the year. SUCH a good platformer, and it feels old school yet perfectly modern. I preferred it over Super Mario Odyssey and Zelda: Breath of the Wild, which both came out in 2017 and are among the best games on the console. It's just so fun to play, well-designed, and the music slaps throughout. Tee Lopes is up there with Toby Fox in terms of modern game composers with incredible skill.
8:57 The term is "New Jack Swing". I'd never heard that term growing up but it perfectly describes that late 80s early 90s style of Hip Hop/R&B with the syncopation and funky basslines, e.g. "Motownphilly" "I Love Your Smile" "Nasty Boyz"
The funny thing is, this is the second stage in Sonic 3 so if you had more time to play you could've heard this as a kid
Some other Sonic themes u should listen to:
Planet Wisp - Sonic Colors
Windmill Isle Day - Sonic Unleashed
Dragon Dance - Sonic Lost World
Chaos Angel zone act 2 not spotted...
Oh yeah, Dragon Dance! Had that as a ringtone for a time.
Nakamura is the lead guitarist of the band Dreams Come True and composed Sonic 1 and 2. Michael Jackson's sound team worked on Sonic 3 but they did not create Hydrocity. Nobody knows who specifically composed Hydrocity. It wasn't Jun Senoue since the only music he composed for Sonic 3 were the bonus stage themes and the continue music.
dang, requested by HuskyByTheGeek? he's awesome!
Act 2 is still one of my favourite game tracks even 30 years later. Sonic 3 has some stiff competition on the Mega Drive (Thunderforce IV, Gauntlet IV etc) but it's still a top 5 OST.
One thing I will say is the the bass in act 1 has got a very bouncy vibe (maybe because of the swing) which reminds me of the bubble shield in-game, which as you may have guessed... bounces. A stretch? Yeah man, probably.
Yeah hydrocity in mania is moreso like a remastered version compared to the other remixes. Metallic madness feels like they had so much freedom to do what they want
I believe that was originally and still is meant to be Hydro City
Sonic 3 has quite a bit of iconic music. As much as Green Hill Zone plays everywhere and Chemical Plant Zone is so recognizable, I think Sonic 3 might have the most favorites. I see Hydrocity here, and there's also Sky Sanctuary, the Genesis version of Ice Cap, and even a song you've reacted to before, Lava Reef Zone.
(Specifically, you've only listened to Lava Reef Zone Act 2 from Sonic Mania. I'd imagine acts 1 and 2 are loved for completely different reasons, as they hit different vibes.)
To answer your question about new mechanics, Sonic 3 & Knuckles added quite a few! Sonic, Tails, and Knuckles each gained unique abilities - Sonic could create an insta-shield when jumping that let him hit spiky enemies without getting hurt, Tails could fly, giving him unique routes through each level, and Knuckles could glide and climb walls, giving him his own routes too.
This game also introduced elemental shields to alongside the normal one. You had fire shield that made you invincible to fire/lava and gave you a mid-air dash attack, an electric shield that gave you a double jump and magnetically attracted rings to you, and a bubble shield that gave you a bounce attack and let you breathe underwater.
Finally, off the top of my head, this game introduced the idea of mini bosses at the end of each zone's first act, rather than just fighting Robotnik at the end of Act 2/3
and zone transitions!! Little cutscenes between each act and zone that made some attempt towards explaining how the characters get from one zone to the next were one of my favorite additions
The Insta-shield also slightly extends Sonics range of attack, cant tell ya how much i abused that on Big Arms as a kid, saved my arse a lot.
I forget exactly when all the different games came out, but I think Tails might have been able to fly before Sonic 3... I think maybe Sonic Chaos for the game gear/ Master System... The air lift for a Sonic and Tails team was first manually usable in Sonic 3 I think though...
I think Knuckles could also break certain walls that the others couldn't... Maybe he could just walk into some and break them, without the need to spin dash... I forget... That said, if we were only talking base Sonic 3, when knuckles was only in the competitive 2-player mode, I don't think he had any extra abilities and mostly felt like a worse Sonic lol. I expect there was something good about how he handled differently, but I'm not sure what... I don't think adding Sonic & Knuckles updated him in that mode either... Then again, maybe he was meant as a handicap character... I dunno...
Probably should add that only Sonic got the bonus attacks from the elemental shields, like the fire dash, the bubble bounce and the little spark jump thing... Although they all get the passive traits... This is pretty fair though, given that Tails and knuckles have arguably better secondary abilities anyway... Then there's more to the shields that were cool... Like I think bubble shields reflected some small projectiles... I think the fire shield could melt certain ice projectiles... There was a downside to fire and electric shields, I think, where they would disappear if you went in water...
But yeah, there's loads there.
Sonic 3 was my first video game ever and is a massive influence for my love of VGM. It'd be cool to see you revisit this game and get further than the beginning, it's such a classic!
If Michael Jackison didnt have anything to do with the music in this game, i would be shocked. Also, to answer your question; Sonic 3 is the game that starts out in the jungle with that steel pan sound, not Sonic and Knuckles. 👍
Tee Lopes is pronounced like Tropes or Soaps. You can pronounce Hyrdocity either way. I think it's INTENDED to be City, but I personally use both pronunciations. All Sonic music is classic. A lot of Sonic 1 borrows from SO much stuff it would surprise you. Spring Yard samples Bobby Brown, Scrap Brain samples the ending theme of Blade Runner, and Marble Zone samples The Boys Chase the Girls.
As for Sonic 3, it's a well established fact at this point Micheal Jackson participated in composing some of the music, namely Ice Cap Zone (has similarities to Smooth Criminal), Carnival Night Zone (Slam), The Launch Base Zone, and the Ending Credits (Stranger in Moscow). You can find videos that compare the tracks together. If you play the Sonic Origins Plus collection, ALL of these tracks were removed. He was unhappy with the sound of the Genesis and he had his first scandal (you know what I'm talking about) around this time, so it was mutually agreed to NOT credit him. It's also why Sonic 3 is rarely in a lot of the collections. There are rights issues, so they replaced those tracks with the PC alternate/place holder tracks in Origins Plus. Personally, I prefer the ORIGINAL OST.
Also, Hydrocity Zone is more Sewer than anything. There is water, but through most of the stage, you're trying to stay above the water line. It is a labyrinth though. The Mania version is very different from the original Sonic 3 version. But... If you need a quick stream of about 1-2 hours to finish, I do recommend Sonic Mania. It's a good one to enjoy for the OST.
*with poorly-composed covers of the prototype tracks
You really need to listen to the rest of Sonic Mania’s Soundtrack. It’s so unbelievably good.
Probably one of my favourite Sonic 3 songs. And that says a lot because the soundtrack is damn good.
I think Sonic 3 is the 1st game with a different song per act, but I think CD had different tracks depending on what era you were in (past, present or future). Sonic Advance 3 has 3 acts and a different song per act. Quite amazing really.
My "Genesis Friend" down the street didn't have Sonic 3 so I rarely got to touch it, but yeah, the sound font (and funk) is pretty recognizable.
Privately I made a list of "aquatic themes" but I didn't see anything on it on the poll, so the theme video should be interesting.
Sonic 3 and Sonic & Knuckles are actually two parts of the same game, but the first part was released early to meet a deadline for a McDonald's promotion (anything unfinished, like Flying Battery Zone, was shifted to the Sonic & Knuckles half). SEGA created the 'Lock-On' cartridge so that you could connect Sonic & Knuckles (as a part 2 of sorts), for the full Sonic 3 experience as one game (commonly referred to as Sonic 3& Knuckles), where you could now play as Knuckles and Tails through both games' stages and story.
As a extra bonus, you could lock-on Sonic 2 onto Sonic & Knuckles to play as Knuckles in Sonic 2. By locking on Sonic 1, you can't play as Knuckles in Sonic 1 due to technical issues at the time, but it will allow you to play over 200K variations of the "Blue Sphere" special stage from Sonic 3&K. Any other Genesis game locked on would give you a random blue sphere stage, based on the serial number of the game.
Interestingly, some themes from the Sonic 3 cartridge were replaced in the full game, including the original Sonic 3 Alone ending theme (which was recently confirmed to be the basis for the eventual MJ hit, Stranger in Moscow).
You'd be surprised how much discourse there is over how to pronounce "Hydrocity". My argument is that if they wanted you to say "city" they'd have pressed that space bar :P
Anyway, this is a banger from Sonic 3, it never ceases to amaze me how good the sound they got out of the Mega Drive is for Sonic 3 and Knuckles, has to be the best on the system.
I assume there was no space left on the title card. That, and they pressed the space bar in sonic generations' sound test
There were text space limitations back then.
You’re right about Tee. He was just a fan doing Sonic remixes on TH-cam until the Mania development team hired him to do the soundtrack. The developers were also a bunch of fans lead by Christian Whitehead. He did Sonic fangames in the mid 2000s before making a proof-of-concept Sonic CD port for the iPhone that Sega eventually let him make officially before doing updated ports of the other classic games.
You can tell which tracks were made by MJ's team because they were all removed from some later releases of the game (the original PC port as well as Sonic Origins). This includes the knuckles theme and midboss theme, carnival night, ice cap and launch base. The knuckles theme and midboss theme were redone for Sonic & Knuckles as well, and the only reason the Sonic 3 stages were kept is that you needed the Sonic 3 cartridge to hear them.
Sonic Mania's whole soundtrack is SO good, the new versions of Stardust Speedway and Metallic Madness are my personal favorites
If you hear music from this game, please, always do act 1 and 2, it enhances the experience TENFOLD
The version on Project Chaos is pretty great, too! Walk on Water is the song. The version of The Doomsday on there is mind-exploding amounts of awesome
To go into composers, S3k has around 20+ people confirmed to work on it, including MJ and his team at the time, game is mirred with right's controversy and lawsuits so nothing is properly credited, except when composers confirm it personally. Just recently sonic 3 finally got rereleased after 10 years via Sonic Origins, as they removed the MJ associated tracks and replaced them with music from a prototype, a really old prototype that sounded pretty bad (better versions of the replacements exist in a later prototype)
Not the version in Origins, but I actually like proto Carnival Night a lot better than the final. Too bad Origins really botched it. Ice Cap, I like the final version better, and I go back and forth on Launch Base.
I'm so glad you included Sonic Mania in this. The Michael Jackson thing is like an urban legend. The story I've seen most was MJ was supposed to assist on the soundtrack but didn't like the low quality audio of the Genesis and there are just some leftovers the composers built off of for some songs. But who knows what is true
I don't wanna overhype it but Sonic Mania is one of my favorite soundtracks in games. I listen to songs from this game all the time.
We do have an official connection to Brad Buxer at the very least through Ice Cap Zone/Hard Times which is basically exact, and there are of course photos of Jackson at the SEGA offices, along with other songs from Sonic 3 (and not Sonic & Knuckles, which MJ would have had no involvement with) that have similarities to a lot of his own music. Pair this with the fact that we only have the original "beta" versions of the Sonic 3 tracks being used in Sonic Origins, seemingly for copyright reasons, it seems pretty likely.
We actually do know, Yuji Naka himself confirmed that MJ worked on the Sonic 3 soundtrack. He and his team made Carnival Night, Ice Cap, and Launch Base
This is further proven by Sonic Origins replacing those exact songs
Brad Buxer is in the credits and was a collaborator of MJ. He also confirmed it, there's also the Hard Times song, the credits song sounding like Stranger in Moscow, etc. The sonic 3 prototype leaked some years ago contains the songs in Origins and the pc port(they sound really good on the genesis as opposed to Origins), so the 'MJ songs' were probably included after the fact as a sort of guest collaboration.
Sonic 3 (& Knuckles) has such an awesome soundtrack!! Love your videos! Lava Reef Zone from Knuckles is my fave :D
You know, I feel like you'd probably really enjoy sonic mania, it's a faithful interpretation of the classic era, but for modern platforms, remixing old levels and introducing some new ones
The random realization on Sonic Characters designs lol
14:51 everybody likes act 2!
it's Hydro City btw, fight me or whatever, i dont give a damn
Sonic 1 and 2 were composted by Nakamura who was the bassist for the band Dreams Come True. Sonic 3 and Sonic & Knuckles music were made by a hodgepodge of people: Six people from Sega Sound Team, two contractors from Cube, Howard Drossin from Sega Technical Institute, as well as members of Michael Jackson's team notably Brad Buxer.
Tatsuyuki Maeda is probably the person I would credit first as he seems to be the one most involved with composing the soundtrack in both games. He also went on to score Sonic 3D Blast on the Genesis together with Jun Senoue. Their styles kind of clash on that game, you can clearly hear which tracks are Maeda and which are Senoue.
Senoue, incidentally, did work on Sonic 3 and is credited with the now-iconic act complete fanfare. He did not do any of the regular stage themes from what I understand.
This song makes it so painfully obvious how inspired Sonic's music is by New Jack Swing. Sonic CD's Japanese soundtrack is full of actual New Jack Swing songs, and future games like this one basically always featured music inspired by it.
This wasn't a music track done by Michael Jackson's team though, even if it sounds like it could have been.
The main theme from Black Knight 2000 is a pretty good track. You'd be surprised how many pinball games have really good music.
No longer a debate Jessie! MJ's sound team definitely worked on this game. Listen to Ice Cap Zone and then Hard Times by The Jetzons. Brad Buxer worked on both....
Enjoy!
Thanks!
Been playing Sonic since '93, 3&K still being my personal favorite.
For anyone interested, here on TH-cam, GaMetal did an awesome cover of this. Highly recommended.
Fun fact, Sonic 3 was Juns first time working with Sonic, and he has been since, which I think makes him the longest Sonic conposuer.
Thankfully, Hydrocity zone isn't one of the songs that had MJs or someone else's involvement, since only a few tracks had to be changed for Sonic Oigins, and the rest stayed the same which I'd assume are the tracks Sega fully owns.
Have a feeling Sega was able to use the tracks pretty easily cause they always seemed to have a good working relationship with him, then the moment he passes those few tracks suddenly become none usable and they had to change em otherwise they wouldn't been able to re release Sonic 3 (that's my theory at least). I know that back in the 90s, they had the PC version of Sonic 3, which was the first instance of using what's known as the beta songs, so not too sure if they had issues back then or not.
Tomoya Ohtani was also in S3.
Regarding MJ's supposed involvement, go listen to a few seconds of the Sonic 3 minor boss theme (note: not the Sonic 3 and Knuckles one, that's different) and see if you think MJ might have been involved in some way.
Hydrocity is such an iconic soundtrack it always sticks to me. thx for the reaction!
idk if i can request in the comments but if i can then i'd request Crisis City from Sonic 06.it is kind of fire/lava stage and it has one of my fav soundtracks of all time and i really want to see if its nostalgia or if the actual music is impressive. this would mean a lot hopefully it is possible to do a video on
Masato Nakamura was not part of Sonic 3.
And I _think_ Hydrocity was composed by Jun Senoue, but don't quote me on that.
And yes, there was a debate about Michael Jackson and Brad Buxer being part of creating the Sonic 3 OST.
In the recent (not emulated) port of Sonic 3 in the "Sonic Origins" collection they replaced a few stage themes, which fueled the MJ rumors and saddened a bunch of people who are nostalgic for the game, but Hydrocity was not replaced.
To answer your question, really Sega's rivalry with Nintendo basically ended after they stopped making consoles. The Saturn flopped hard outside Japan, and the Dreamcast, while ambitious, underperformed compared to the absolutely dominating PlayStation. So stuff like Sonic Adventure eventually coming to the GameCube and Sonic appearing in Smash Bros. was more or less a win-win since Sega was no longer competing in the console market.
Hydrocity act 2 is a fantastic song that goes beyond that genesis twang. It’s just great. Immaculate vibes. MJ did not work on this song btw lol.
As for “Aqua theme” songs, for sonic I would say “Sea Bottom Surge” and for Kirby (cuz it’s his Bday) I’d say “Abandoned Beach” as it’s just a good feeling sunny beach vibe
You likely didn't play much Sonic 3 at all if you didn't notice any additions lol... Or this music... Even in the base version of Sonic 3 you could discover a bunch of things, even in the first zone, which it seems you didn't beat lol... Although maybe you forgot... Who knows? It was a while ago... But yeah, with the ability to combine it with Sonic & Knuckles, it's been my favourite Sonic game for a long time... With Sonic or Sonic + Tails it's 14 Zones, Tails 13 and 12 for Knuckles... 4 character options (including Sonic + Tails as different to just Sonic)... While the three options for Sonic three seem the same as Sonic 2, Sonic has his little flash attack thing if you jump in mid-air, but also his bonus elemental shield attacks and Tails can now manually fly... Technically I think he first did it in Sonic Chaos, but I doubt you played that.. Pretty cool game though... But you know what's also totally knew to Sonic 3? Tails can give Sonic an air lift if you control him alongside Sonic... If you play the single-player game with two people (or two controllers for specific moments), this is a pretty handy addition, allowing tails to lift sonic to areas he couldn't get to or back to after falling... And Sonic & Knuckles adds Knuckles who can glide and climb... I think he can also break some walls without needing to spin dash... And you know what's useful in such a big game? A game save feature... I think it might have been in Sonic CD first, unless that was added for the rereleases, but if you didn't play that, this is a game-changing new feature for the franchise... I mean, I think there is still a level select cheat, but still...
... But yeah... I'm not sure much water level music in Sonic games sounds very aquatic... Maybe one of the Knuckles stages in Sonic Adventure 2?... The music is still really cool though and still seems to fit the stage regardless... Oh well ^_^;; Maybe there's some I've forgotten that might be better... Typically in Sonic games you want to avoid the water though lol.
Years ago I had a very strong opinion on weather it was called Hydrocity or Hydro City. Now i dont remember which side of that i was on 😅
For the Michael Jackson rumour, as far as I know, it's been confirmed that he had involvement, and it's believed that the songs he helped composed are the ones they had to replace in the most recent release in sonic origins, because the legal situation with sonic 3 and knuckles has been murky for a while
The michael jackson rumors were fact checked. Turns out they were true! He aided in many tracks from Sonic 3.
Genuinely one of, if not my #1 favorite, sonic stages of all time
Goddamn, the war flashbacks i got to the hydrocity/hydrossity debates…
The "four fingers" thing, to my knowledge, is mostly a Western cartoon convention. Most Japanese characters have the full five, Sonic and Mario included, even with the Mickey gloves.
Just one more suggestion for your aquatic theme video: Pulstar for the NeoGeo: Stage 2 (two versions: OST (AES/MVS) and Arranged Soundtrack (NeoGeo CD)) - really unique and atmospheric soundtrack for a Shoot 'Em Up!
the music acts in classic series changed in sonic and knuckles where act 2 was a remix of act 1 basically
Sonic 2, 3, 3& Knuckles, and Mania are some of my favorite OSTs.
Never heard the sonic 3 version of these before now. Pretty good but the up in quality from Lopes is great
How about Back 2 Back from Sonic Rush? It's from a water level, and it's super funky.
Sonic Mania has my favourite soundtrack in videogame history, I sincerely hope you listen to more of it
If you're doing a bunch of water themes right now you should totally check out all the Pokémon surfing themes from the different generations.
2:34 The correct term would be soundchip or soundset, but I don't blame you for that. There are a lot of confusing terms used for the sound programming of consoles, haha.
My favorite theme
i don't know how Sonic Mania managed to have even more New Jack than the Genesis games, but by god they did it
MJ was confirmed to have worked on the Sonic 3 OST
That's the beauty of mania, it was made by a bunch of fans who modded the older games and got hired for this one. It IS just people who grew up with the games and love these games
When you said it sounds like "someone who grew up with it", Sonic Mania was made by a team of sonic fans who started off porting old Sonic games to mobile. This is essentially a SEGA funded fan game and same goes for the music. Tee Lopes was making remixes of Sonic music before being hired for this game. That's why everything seems authentic and full of love.
Also, the first new sonic game released for other consoles (including Nintendo Gamecube) was Sonic Heroes in 2003/2004. This was right after the death of the Dreamcast and SEGA left the console market. Since then, SEGA and Nintendo have given up their rivalry... until the Mario and Sonic movies came out and battled in the box office.
Yessss, sonic!
Micheal Jackson did work on Sonic 3, but it was changed due to controversy at the time. This song is a bop, but it doesn't really sound like a water level. It does fit the stage as a whole though, because as the name implies, it's not really oceanic at all. Sonic Mania (2017) is basically a gigantic homage to classic sonic, with half classic levels (from sonic 1-3 and CD) and half new levels. Of the classic levels, the first act is generally akin to the first two acts of the original games, and the 2nd act generally adds a newer more modern spin to it. Fun fact, Sonic Mania was developed by a fan studio, lead by Christain Whitehead, who had done some modern ports of sonic for sega in the past. Pretty nuts that you picked up on that without knowing it. Because of the passion poured into Mania, and the lack of developmental issues that have plagued sega for decades, Sonic Mania is often considered the best of sonic, at least since the classics.
Breath of Fire 2 had an ok water theme, but it's short and repetitive.
..I just remembered that I uploaded it like 15 years ago because I couldn't find it.